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LAM0015
03-14-2001, 09:45 PM
just wanted to see if anyone had come up with any statistical proof that finfin is the better offensive player this year compared to dirk

Big Boy Laroux
03-15-2001, 10:08 AM
dude, just drop it.

but, ok, here goes. (keep in mind that dirk is possibly my favorite NBA player).

Offensive categories... Points + off. rebounds + assists - turnovers...

Dirk - 21.9 PPG, 1.5 ORPG, 2.1 APG, 2.0 TPG TOTAL = 23.5

Finley - 20.9 PPG, 1.3 ORPG, 4.4 APG, 2.4 TPG TOTAL = 24.2

pretty crude, I know, but the proof is in the pudding. oh, and dirk shoots 47.9% and Fin shoots 45.5%

LAM0015
03-15-2001, 10:44 AM
you're not taking into account that dirk shoots around 40% from three point range where finley shoots aroun 30%
dirk shoots around 50% from two point ranger, finley shoots around 46%
dirk shoots around 84.5% from free throw land, where finley shoots around 77%
hmmmm....i guess it was convenient for you to leave those figures out

03-15-2001, 10:46 AM
he's right man, dirk's stats are slightly better than finley's. and finley probably won't improve much for the rest of his career whereas dirk will improve greatly.
yeah, fin is my favorite player but dirk is as valuable or more valuable than fin is ...and dirk will only become better

Big Boy Laroux
03-15-2001, 11:48 AM
i'm just being fair. i'm not trying to be biased. right now, fin does some things better than dirk, while dirk does some things better than fin. it's that simple.

ok, so here are the totals

Dirk - 47.9% FG, 38.8% 3P, 51.8% 2P, 84.1% FT, 1.43 Points per shot (PTS/FGA)

Fin - 45.5% FG, 29.8% 3P, 48.3% 2P, 77.9% FT, 1.11 PPS


We all know fin takes too many shots.

I know Dirk is an offensive threat. he's amazing. i just think you are belittling Fin. they both bring so much to the table...

oh, both nash and howard have a higher PPS than Fin, too.

i am definitely willing to say dirk is a better shooter. we all know that. but there's othe relements to an offensive game (assists, for example) that make someone a complete player.

Big Boy Laroux
03-15-2001, 11:59 AM
oh, and if we're going by percentages alone, Nash is by far our best offensive weapon.


man, why can't we just agree that the mavs team is a tremendous offensive weapon?

LAM0015
03-15-2001, 12:24 PM
man, i completely agree..the mavs are a tremendous offensive threat to the NBA....my main point is simple. this is all i've been trying to say. Dirk is as potent of an offensive threat as fin is. fin is a great player but so is dirk. but, dirk has tremendous rome to improve his game where as finley is close to his peak.
Yes, i probably did get a bit defensive at times...but, that's all i'm trying to say. finley is a good player and he deserves his props...but give dirk his too. and realize, dirk's only 21...just think about how great of a player he'll probably turn into.
and nash..the mavs would be sunk without his contributions...not to mention Bradley (especially recently).

just realize, dirk is going to be the offensive leader of this team for years to come....finley will be an awesome #2 or #3 scorer (depending on how much Howard averages).
anyway you look at it, it's looking awesome for the Mavs future

Big Boy Laroux
03-15-2001, 12:29 PM
ok, cool. I will be the first to sing dirk's praises. i absolutely love that guy.

i just thought you were putting down finley. that's how it seemed. if not, guess i took it the wrong way.

LAM0015
03-15-2001, 12:44 PM
finley's a quality player...look, i know he's an all-star. everyone gets so pissed off when you mention that Dirk will probably be a better player than Finley. Why? Isn't that a good thing? Don't we want that? Finley's great, why not want other players on our team to be better? Finley brings alot to the table.
When I started the post, it was about Dirk taking over as the main offensive scoring threat. heck, just look at his average points...just look at his shooting percentages. I wasn't saying that Dirk is the better all around player. He's not quite there yet...not quite, it won't be long. I don't want finley to go anywhere...i just want him to be more consistent about taking good shots...he does most of the time, sometimes he forgets that he has alot of offensive help around him, it seems. I LOVE THE NUCLEUS OF THIS TEAM. AND IT'S LOOKING MORE AND MORE LIKE IT'S AT LEAST A 5 PLAYER NUCLEUS. WITH DIRK, FINLEY, NASH AND HOWARD DEFINITELY PART OF IT...AND BRADLEY IS LOOKING MORE AND MORE VALUABLE. Eisley is a good piece of this current team, and harvey may develop into an important piece. Look, we're loaded for the future.

mackdaddy
03-15-2001, 07:50 PM
I have $10 that says the anonymous user is LAM0015. Who the hell starts a thread and then tries to create fake users to make it seem they are the God of basketball?

-mack

djb
03-15-2001, 07:59 PM
I don't say this often..in fact I don't think I've EVER said this..but mackdaddy's right! i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif

mackdaddy
03-15-2001, 08:01 PM
do I get my $10?

-mack

TheKid
03-16-2001, 10:59 AM
Lam, I think you're the one who takes great offense if someone doesn't agree with you. While you think Dirk is the only one who is going to improve greatly I disagree. I personally think Finley will still improve also. Now if you say Dirk's upside is greater then maybe, however a lot of that has to do with age and I say to you I don't agree with that statement either. I'm saying this and this is all I'll say, take Mike out of the mix, would this team still be where they are? NO! Now take Dirk out of the picture would this team be where they are? NO! However my point is, individually would Dirk be able to put the numbers up that he has statistically I question that. That's ALL I was saying, we know Mike can because he's done it for two year before Dirk has emerged on this scene this year. That's my point, you can tell me how much better Dirk is doing statistically than Mike, fine and dandy. However I want to see what happens when (as you claim it will happen) the focal point changes to Dirk, how will he handle it? As a Mavericks fan, I HOPE you're right let me just say that, but I personally don't think it will. JUST MY OPINION!

IZZO
03-16-2001, 12:22 PM
you're opiniion isn't valid...that's probably why he didn't value your opinion TheKid
can't say i blame him. Finley isn't going to improve much. actually, he's regressing, so get over it

TheKid
03-16-2001, 12:43 PM
Actually I think you should get over it, bottom line with out him, Mavericks aren't in the playoffs.

djb
03-16-2001, 12:46 PM
Without Mike, Mavs wouldn't be in the playoffs.
Without Dirk, Mavs wouldn't be in the playoffs.
Without Nash, Mavs wouldn't be in the playoffs.

Let's just be happy for the team's success and enjoy the postseason ride!

LonestarROB
03-16-2001, 12:52 PM
'cmon....All ya'll know the reason we're in the playoffs is because of Mark Bryant. Now everybody get over it i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif .

djb
03-16-2001, 12:54 PM
Actually Rob, the Mavs would be lost now had it not been the veteran leadership and play of the one..the only..LOY VAUGHT! Don't even bother arguing with me b/c I'm right i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif

P1
03-16-2001, 03:51 PM
Finley's unselfishness has alot to do with Dirks success, he does kick to him alot after the D collapses for the open three.

IZZO
03-17-2001, 11:09 PM
teams worry more about the German than they do Finley. Yeah, Finley's greatness, but he doesn't scare a team like dirk

LAM0015
03-19-2001, 04:19 PM
yes, everyone feeds off of each other's skills, that's a known fact in sports. of course, don't state the obvious and then think you're a genius. Yes, dirk is a better player because of finley and finley is a better player because of dirk, that is obvious and tiresome to state such. I would assume that all know that before it was stated on the message board a few messages up. hopefully, we do all know this. anyone that knows anything about sports does. Yes, statistics can be misleading, but they "usually" are not. statistics almost always have a huge amount of truth in them. so if you sole basis is what you think, then you are probably wrong. if you think something without some type of statistics to back them up, your post is useless. no, statistics aren't the #1 indicator to how good a player is all of the time, but they usually don't lie.