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Poindexter Einstein
01-23-2004, 12:59 PM
Reports out of LA say that Melvin Ely is on the trade block again. Clippers seem to think they have too many big men and he is expendable.

At one time this season, speculation linked him with Dallas in a trade for Travis Best.

Wonder if he is worth chasing, and if Delk and CASH would land him. There might be benefit to a big man that doesnt break up the core of what is being developed.

Has anyone seen him play? Does he have any potential to add something positive in Dallas?

ddh33
01-23-2004, 01:06 PM
Coming out of Fresno State, he was pretty highly thought of. I liked him...
He can score in the post a little, though he won't dominate on this level. He does rebound well and can block shots. Best of all, he's young and athletic. But I've always liked players that came out of Tark's system. They are usually solid pros who contribute in several ways - mostly on D and with leadership (Anthony, Augmon, LJ). But they usually all play with intensity and effort.
I think he could be a good fit on this team.

Jamisonite
01-23-2004, 01:46 PM
I dont want to loose travis best....Delk for ely works for me

LRB
01-23-2004, 02:00 PM
Originally posted by: Jamisonite
I dont want to loose travis best....Delk for ely works for me

I agree. With Best's recent play I'd much rather lose Delk than Best. And I don't think the gamble on Ely would be justified in losing Best while Nash is still hurt.

kg_veteran
01-23-2004, 02:15 PM
Do the Clippers have any interest in Delk? If so, why?

jayC
01-23-2004, 02:16 PM
To me it depends on how good you think Ely is. In the sense of trade logic you trade a small for a big any day of the week. With Walker's improved ball control I wouldn't feel that bad trading best. Walker has led the team in assists 3 of the last five games.

LRB
01-23-2004, 02:22 PM
Originally posted by: jayC
To me it depends on how good you think Ely is. In the sense of trade logic you trade a small for a big any day of the week. With Walker's improved ball control I wouldn't feel that bad trading best. Walker has led the team in assists 3 of the last five games.


Walker is much less effective without a PG. Ely is riding the bench on the Clippers. Best is finally starting to play very well for us and helped us win a very tough game in Portland with Nash out. Big for small is good. Value for what's behind door number 3 when your team has finally started clicking is an entirely different matter.

Poindexter Einstein
01-23-2004, 02:22 PM
Dont know what LAC would want. Gotta send them SOMETHING though, due to cap rules.

Based on their owner's history, I suspect the CASH would be what they want the most ...lol

If you send Delk plus the max cash ($3M), their owner comes out way ahead cash-wise.

Dirkenstien
01-23-2004, 02:32 PM
Originally posted by: jayC
To me it depends on how good you think Ely is. In the sense of trade logic you trade a small for a big any day of the week. With Walker's improved ball control I wouldn't feel that bad trading best. Walker has led the team in assists 3 of the last five games.


However, you must take into consideration the fact that Best's defense has been extraordinary recently. That specifially, Walker cannot help regardless how improved his handling skills have become.

If Ely does not get much playing time there then they should not mind a trade for Delk whom hardly gets any playing time here. Now are they even interested in Delk? I have no idea, but in the philosophical logic of always trading small for big I'd have to disagree on the mitigating circumstance that in some cases small may infact be more valuable than a big depending on the team's current situation and the needs that situation yields.

MikeB
01-23-2004, 03:37 PM
Trading for Ely would IMHO be a good thing(now would Nellie play him? thats another story). I don't know if they would be interested in Delk or Best. Both guys have a role on this team(Delk's has been much less defined than Best's has recently). Both guys play good to very good perimeter D. Delk can score off the bench when given a chance...but that is Jamison's job...so I would send Delk. However the salaries don't match up...so I went to RealGM and I think the trade could go down like this.

Dallas trades: PG Tony Delk (6.6 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 0.8 apg in 16.3 minutes)
Dallas receives: C Olden Polynice (0.0 ppg, 1.0 rpg, 0.5 apg in 6.0 minutes)
PF Melvin Ely (4.0 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 0.6 apg in 14.8 minutes)
Change in team outlook: -2.6 ppg, +2.0 rpg, and +0.3 apg.

L.A. Clippers trades: C Olden Polynice (0.0 ppg, 1.0 rpg, 0.5 apg in 6.0 minutes)
PF Melvin Ely (4.0 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 0.6 apg in 14.8 minutes)
L.A. Clippers receives: PG Tony Delk (6.6 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 0.8 apg in 29 games)
Change in team outlook: +2.6 ppg, -2.0 rpg, and -0.3 apg.

TRADE ACCEPTED

After the trade we can cut Polynice loose. In order to do this we would have to cut a player so N'diaye would probably go(though I still don't get keeping Stefansson on the roster). We could then add another player to fill Delk's spot from the CBA or NBDL where 2-3 or 1-2 are easier to find than big men.

Cybertx
01-23-2004, 04:13 PM
vhe would love najera in LA he will improve the team market , tickets, etc. in considerable amount and with the only mexican in the nba in the second biggest mexican population in the world it would increase a lot of stuff for clippers

Max Power
01-23-2004, 04:21 PM
Originally posted by: Cybertx
vhe would love najera in LA he will improve the team market , tickets, etc. in considerable amount and with the only mexican in the nba in the second biggest mexican population in the world it would increase a lot of stuff for clippers

I was thinking about Najera in LA too. He would be bigger than life there.

Cybertx
01-23-2004, 04:23 PM
we probably could get someone better for najera who would be better from ths clippers that fits the same salary range

MikeB
01-23-2004, 04:27 PM
For that to work they would have to throw in another guy.

Dallas trades: PG Travis Best (3.4 ppg, 1.1 rpg, 2.1 apg in 14.9 minutes)
SF Eduardo Najera (3.3 ppg, 3.1 rpg, 0.4 apg in 13.7 minutes)
Dallas receives: SG Marko Jaric (8.3 ppg, 2.6 rpg, 4.3 apg in 28.4 minutes)
PF Melvin Ely (4.0 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 0.6 apg in 14.8 minutes)
C Olden Polynice (0.0 ppg, 1.0 rpg, 0.5 apg in 6.0 minutes)
Change in team outlook: +5.6 ppg, +2.4 rpg, and +2.9 apg.

L.A. Clippers trades: SG Marko Jaric (8.3 ppg, 2.6 rpg, 4.3 apg in 28.4 minutes)
PF Melvin Ely (4.0 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 0.6 apg in 14.8 minutes)
C Olden Polynice (0.0 ppg, 1.0 rpg, 0.5 apg in 6.0 minutes)
L.A. Clippers receives: PG Travis Best (3.4 ppg, 1.1 rpg, 2.1 apg in 36 games)
SF Eduardo Najera (3.3 ppg, 3.1 rpg, 0.4 apg in 28 games)
Change in team outlook: -5.6 ppg, -2.4 rpg, and -2.9 apg.

TRADE ACCEPTED

or

Dallas trades: SF Eduardo Najera (3.3 ppg, 3.1 rpg, 0.4 apg in 13.7 minutes)
Dallas receives: SF Bobby Simmons (6.8 ppg, 4.3 rpg, 1.6 apg in 22.8 minutes)
C Olden Polynice (0.0 ppg, 1.0 rpg, 0.5 apg in 6.0 minutes)
PF Melvin Ely (4.0 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 0.6 apg in 14.8 minutes)
Change in team outlook: +7.5 ppg, +5.2 rpg, and +2.3 apg.

L.A. Clippers trades: SF Bobby Simmons (6.8 ppg, 4.3 rpg, 1.6 apg in 22.8 minutes)
C Olden Polynice (0.0 ppg, 1.0 rpg, 0.5 apg in 6.0 minutes)
PF Melvin Ely (4.0 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 0.6 apg in 14.8 minutes)
L.A. Clippers receives: SF Eduardo Najera (3.3 ppg, 3.1 rpg, 0.4 apg in 28 games)
Change in team outlook: -7.5 ppg, -5.2 rpg, and -2.3 apg.

TRADE ACCEPTED

That is a lot to give up for Najera. Simmons gets minutes and Jaric starts often. I don't see how it would be that beneficial to the Clipps.

Poindexter Einstein
01-23-2004, 04:53 PM
You guys are making the trade scenario too complicated.

Delk-for-Ely works as a one-for-one, if the Clippers and Mavs are both willing. Because of the Clippers aversion to spending, the best "sweetener" to the deal would be cash, not Najera (who has a long term contract).

MikeB
01-23-2004, 05:34 PM
I thought it wouldn't work straight up...but it does...my bad

Dallas trades: PG Tony Delk (6.6 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 0.8 apg in 16.3 minutes)
Dallas receives: PF Melvin Ely (4.0 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 0.6 apg in 14.8 minutes)
Change in team outlook: -2.6 ppg, +1.0 rpg, and -0.2 apg.

L.A. Clippers trades: PF Melvin Ely (4.0 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 0.6 apg in 14.8 minutes)
L.A. Clippers receives: PG Tony Delk (6.6 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 0.8 apg in 29 games)
Change in team outlook: +2.6 ppg, -1.0 rpg, and +0.2 apg.

TRADE ACCEPTED

EricaLubarsky
01-23-2004, 06:04 PM
Originally posted by: Poindexter Einstein
You guys are making the trade scenario too complicated.

Delk-for-Ely works as a one-for-one, if the Clippers and Mavs are both willing. Because of the Clippers aversion to spending, the best "sweetener" to the deal would be cash, not Najera (who has a long term contract).

Ely would be alright. The only thing is that it would take a few months fo get him trained (remember Fortson at the beginning of the season and did you see Mamadou last night?). Do we really want to train him? Unless he has a lot of potential then I dont think so but we wouldnt be giving up much.

Max Power
01-23-2004, 06:29 PM
I don't care what kind of project we get for Delk - he would help the club the most by leaving.

LRB
01-23-2004, 07:27 PM
Delk for Ely, I'd do it in a heartbeat.

Quetzalcoatl
01-23-2004, 09:02 PM
All you say it's great, I would like to have here Ely, but... would they trade him for Delk?

Jeremiah
01-24-2004, 09:03 PM
Originally posted by: ddh33
But I've always liked players that came out of Tark's system. They are usually solid pros who contribute in several ways - mostly on D and with leadership (Anthony, Augmon, LJ). But they usually all play with intensity and effort.
.

what about courtney alexander?

ddh33
01-25-2004, 12:03 AM
Originally posted by: Jeremiah

Originally posted by: ddh33
But I've always liked players that came out of Tark's system. They are usually solid pros who contribute in several ways - mostly on D and with leadership (Anthony, Augmon, LJ). But they usually all play with intensity and effort.
.

what about courtney alexander?

Point taken i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif Glad I said "usually...

I always thought he would be a really solid pro. Even after he was traded, I thought he would be great in Washington. Then, I thought he would do something in New Orleans. Maybe injuries have had something to do with it. He has shown glimpses. I am still rooting for him. I've heard that the work-ethic may not quite be there, and that he thinks he's better than he is...

jayC
01-25-2004, 01:04 AM
Listen, this guy can't even crack the Clippers rotation so why do we want him. There is no way he could crack ours.

V
01-25-2004, 01:11 AM
Check the history.

Ely came to camp in shape and played great defensively. He was slated to be the starter... (his coach noted that he was their best defender period) ... Then he got hurt. Wilcox came on & has played great... Kaman deserves PT since he's viewed as the future center... Brand will get 40 minutes...

Where does Ely fit in LA? He doesn't... and the Clips desperately need a PG.

.... That's why we want him.

uberfan
01-26-2004, 10:33 AM
Originally posted by: Cybertx
vhe would love najera in LA he will improve the team market , tickets, etc. in considerable amount and with the only mexican in the nba in the second biggest mexican population in the world it would increase a lot of stuff for clippers

Read on Hoopshype that LAC want to move both Ely and Marko because Clipps want to clear some more cap space next year. Chicago tribune is speculating that Fizer could be traded for that combo. This deal works on RealGM, though I am not sure the marketing angle is enough of an incentive. The didn't keep Wang even though there is a large Chinese community. But you never know. I think it is more than good value from the Mavs perspective for Najera. Mamadou would have to go today to clear roster space.

Dallas trades: SF Eduardo Najera (3.3 ppg, 3.1 rpg, 0.4 apg in 13.7 minutes)
Dallas receives: SG Marko Jaric (8.2 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 4.3 apg in 28.6 minutes)
PF Melvin Ely (4.0 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 0.6 apg in 14.8 minutes)
Change in team outlook: +8.9 ppg, +2.6 rpg, and +4.5 apg.

L.A. Clippers trades: SG Marko Jaric (8.2 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 4.3 apg in 28.6 minutes)
PF Melvin Ely (4.0 ppg, 3.0 rpg, 0.6 apg in 14.8 minutes)
L.A. Clippers receives: SF Eduardo Najera (3.3 ppg, 3.1 rpg, 0.4 apg in 28 games)
Change in team outlook: -8.9 ppg, -2.6 rpg, and -4.5 apg.

TRADE ACCEPTED

Poindexter Einstein
01-26-2004, 11:07 AM
UBERFAN - How would Najera's long-term contract fit the Clipps supposed desire to clear cap space for next year? It wouldnt.

Delk (plus part of the Mavs trade exception) would be better financially for LA for that pair. Though I still dont see that the approx 600,000 savings would be much of an enticement.

Maybe Delk + $3M (or some lesser amount) cash ....for Marko + Ely ???

uberfan
01-26-2004, 12:42 PM
Although I agree that Najera's contract terms would not give LAC cap space next year, I was replying to the discussion about Najera being a "draw" in LA because he was Hispanic.

Implied but admitedly not full developed in my comment "This deal works on RealGM, though I am not sure the marketing angle is enough of an incentive" was the fact that the marketing angle is not likely enough of an incentive to overcome the goal of more cap space.

According to the article I read, LAC wants to clear more cap space to make a run at Kobe next year.

Of course, Delk even with cash does not clear cap space either.

I think the reason Chicago Tribune was suggesting Fizer is that he is a FA after the season and clears space. There reasoning is that Ely gives them another 5 who is also a local kid. Ely and Curry are from the same town near Chicago.

kingrex
01-26-2004, 01:01 PM
I know that the Clippers management are nuts, but will they really take Najera for Ely. I'm not saying that Ely is so great, but he is atleast athletic and big. I love Najera as a role player, but he is not big and is not really that athletic. He is all hustle, but that is about it.

As for Delk, he is still injured and to trade a bigman for an injured, undersized 2-guard is certifiable.

Moreover, do the Mavs really need to add another power forward to this team?

If we trade for a big man, then let's get a center and not a 3rd string power forward.

ddh33
01-26-2004, 01:18 PM
Ely can play power forward, but he's as good a candidate at center as most guys. Remember, he is 6'10, 260. If I'm not mistaken, that makes him just as big as Alonzo Mourning. He was a pretty good center back in the day.

I really think Ely is just caught in a numbers game in LA. I think he can be a really solid contributer on some team. I would really like him here. However, I don't know if we can really get him because I don't know what the Clippers are more interested in. Do they want to make more money through marketing? Or would one of our contracts cost them a chance at Kobe? Either way, if you can really get a young, talented, developing big guy on the cheap, you do it.

kingrex
01-26-2004, 01:26 PM
I suppose he would be good addition to this team, but my main point of contention is would the Clippers in their right mind really want to trade with the Mavs, if all the Mavs are offering are Najera or Delk?

Poindexter Einstein
01-26-2004, 01:47 PM
Other options to get Ely ...

You could trade Best (whose contract is expiring) for Ely ....but the Mavs need a backup PG, and Best is adequate in that role. So I wouldnt do this.

You could trade Daniels ... but I think he is more valuable long-term than Ely. If I am the Mavs, I would only do this if Ely seemed like a longer term solution here rather than a wild project. If the Mavs think Ely could possibly help long term, I might offer Daniels for Ely plus a #2. That saves LA about 1.2M off the cap next year - not a big amount, but something, and they arent losing anyone they have a use for.

I cant see LA wanting Najera or Delk.

And now that I look closer, I cant see them wanting to get rid of Marko - last i saw, he was their starting PG, and on a cheap contract. That idea came out of a quote above: "Read on Hoopshype that LAC want to move both Ely and Marko because Clipps want to clear some more cap space next year. Chicago tribune is speculating that Fizer could be traded for that combo" ...I would bet that "specualtion" is more of the lunacy being spewed by Sam Smith, or whatever his name is. The same guy who has the Mavs desperate to make stupid trades for no reason except that they might help the Bulls.

uberfan
01-26-2004, 02:34 PM
And now that I look closer, I cant see them wanting to get rid of Marko - last i saw, he was their starting PG, and on a cheap contract. That idea came out of a quote above: "Read on Hoopshype that LAC want to move both Ely and Marko because Clipps want to clear some more cap space next year. Chicago tribune is speculating that Fizer could be traded for that combo" ...I would bet that "specualtion" is more of the lunacy being spewed by Sam Smith, or whatever his name is. The same guy who has the Mavs desperate to make stupid trades for no reason except that they might help the Bulls.

OK. You made me go and signup on the Tribune site just so I could get the entire quotes that were excerpted on HoopsHype.

Here it is:

One player the Clippers are trying to deal is 6-foot-11-inch Melvin Ely, who has fallen out of the rotation and has played in only one of the last five games. "Right now, Mel's not a guy who is in the top of the rotation," coach Mike Dunleavy said. "We have [Elton] Brand, [Chris] Kaman, [Chris] Wilcox and [Peja] Drobnjak."

Said Ely: "A change of venue for me wouldn't matter. I'm not going to just accept that I'm in the league and I get paid a whole lot of money and be fine with that. I'm trying to be the best at my position."

You've got to like an NBA guy who says "change of venue." The Harvey native could be a good tandem with Eddy Curry, also of Harvey. The Clippers also are said to be willing to part with combo guard Marko Jaric, who has another year on his deal. The Clippers also have been talking to the Hornets about taking on the expiring contracts of Bryce Drew and Stacey Augmon.