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Bookit
04-12-2005, 01:50 PM
Interesting how the Spurs and Suns make the top 2.i/expressions/anim_roller.gif

Link (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylc=X3oDMTBpYTg2ZTBwBF9TAzk1ODYxOTQ4BHNlYwN0 bQ--?slug=sk-rankings041205&prov=yhoo&type=lgns)

Evilmav2
04-12-2005, 01:57 PM
Now, according to Kerr, weren't our Mavs and the #5 seeded Kings supposed to miss the playoffs this year? At least as far as I'm concerned, any NBA rankings Steve Kerr happens to pull out of his posterior possess less credibililty than a Kirk Snyder claim that he didn't get his ass kicked up, down, and sideways, last Saturday night...

EricaLubarsky
04-12-2005, 02:35 PM
http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/us/sp/v/nba/teams/1/50x50c/uth_2.gif
Charlotte Bobcats

oops

Windmill360
04-12-2005, 02:56 PM
Originally posted by: EricaLubarsky
http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/us/sp/v/nba/teams/1/50x50c/uth_2.gif
Charlotte Bobcats

oops

Probably not Kerrs fault but 'nuff said.

TVI
04-12-2005, 07:09 PM
Originally posted by: EricaLubarsky
http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/us/sp/v/nba/teams/1/50x50c/uth_2.gif
Charlotte Bobcats

oopsY'know, the Kerr bashing is getting really old. No one in here has the guts to admint that they didn't have a clue either. Not one person in here pegged the preseason predictions with any real accuracy.

Everyone's so sensitive that Kerr didn't pick the Mavs to make the playoffs. So now, the guy's a basketball moron? Give me a break!

Erica, you yourself thought Utah and New Orleans would make the playoffs. And just about EVERYONE was picking Minnesota to kick some tail. No one...NOBODY...thought that Seattle or Phoenix would make the noise they've made.

So fess up, everyone. Admit it...none of you were any closer to picking the season breakout any better than Kerr.

The Thread (http://dallas-mavs.com/forums/messageview.cfm?catid=2&threadid=18740)

capitalcity
04-12-2005, 07:35 PM
Y'know, the Kerr bashing is getting really old. No one in here has the guts to admint that they didn't have a clue either. Not one person in here pegged the preseason predictions with any real accuracy.

Everyone's so sensitive that Kerr didn't pick the Mavs to make the playoffs. So now, the guy's a basketball moron? Give me a break! ... but see I don't get PAID to make preason predictions or regular season rankings - Stevie does. The negative feedback isn't undeserving - he brings it upon himself with him flaming spurs bias.

Unlike a Sean Elliott, who is under the employ of the club, a "national" basketball correspondant for TNT and CNNSI is supposed to be OBJECTIVE.

So nobody picked Seattle to be up and Minny to be down - big f'n deal. Show me the other paid columnist/reporter/analyst who picked the Mavs to miss the playoffs alltogether. Seriously TVI - find the other guy who labeled the mavs a lottery team.

Screw Steve Kerr. Let the bashing continue...

Bookit
04-12-2005, 09:20 PM
Steve Kerr worked the Mavs-Spurs game and the Mavs absolutely wiped out the Spurs. Yet, in his opinion, the Spurs and Suns are BOTH hotter than the Mavs? Come on now. The only explanation is that he is part owner of the Suns and hangs out with his old mates in San Antonio. Actually, it appears he worships the Spurs but he doesn't want to diss the Sun organizion.

EricaLubarsky
04-12-2005, 09:46 PM
who said I was Kerr bashing. If you call me out, you should get your facts straight.

And how did what I said say anything about pre-season predictions?

I personally think its just delicious to prove Kerr wrong, and I hate Kerr as an announcer because he adds nothing, but to say that I am hypocritical for also being wrong about Utah (which was a 5-8 seed playoff seed until the freakish injury to Kirilenko....no one could have predicted that), is just plain wrong.

Evilmav2
04-12-2005, 10:07 PM
but to say that I am hypocritical for also being wrong about Utah (which was a 5-8 seed playoff seed until the freakish injury to Kirilenko....no one could have predicted that), is just plain wrong.

You weren't alone in making that prediction, EL. In his infinite wisdom, the good Mr. Kerr predicted Utah would finish #4 in the West (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=sk-powerwest0929&prov=yhoo&type=lgns), right behind (guess who) #1 San Antonio, #2 Minnesota, and #3 Denver (while placing our Mavs at the #9 spot)...

Bookit
04-12-2005, 10:18 PM
Originally posted by: Evilmav2

but to say that I am hypocritical for also being wrong about Utah (which was a 5-8 seed playoff seed until the freakish injury to Kirilenko....no one could have predicted that), is just plain wrong.

You weren't alone in making that prediction, EL. In his infinite wisdom, the good Mr. Kerr predicted Utah would finish #4 in the West (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=sk-powerwest0929&prov=yhoo&type=lgns), right behind (guess who) #1 San Antonio, #2 Minnesota, and #3 Denver (while placing our Mavs at the #9 spot)...


And he picked Seattle 15th in the West!!
i/expressions/anim_laugh.gif

This is what he said about Seattle:

It's tough to envision this club doing much of anything this season. Ray Allen is probably the best shooter in the NBA, and Rashard Lewis is one of the better offensive small forwards in the game. But the Sonics have no post presence, and are underwhelming on defense.
Nick Collison returns after missing his entire rookie season, but it's unrealistic to think he will make a huge difference in his first year of action The Sonics are on the bottom looking up at the rest of the Western Conference. i/expressions/anim_laugh.gif

Thespiralgoeson
04-12-2005, 10:38 PM
I've never thought Kerr was a bad analyst. I mean, he's always sort of stated the obvious, but that's pretty much what all analysts do anyway. I never appreciated his Mav-bashing, but there are certainly worse offenders in this category than Kerr (of course I'm just talking about commentary, not what he did to us on the court.) As far as preseason predictions go, I was one of the few people I knew of that thought we would make a significant improvement this year, even after we lost Nash, because I knew that no team we put together would be worse than last season's disaster. However, like everyone else, I also thought that Minnesota would set the world on fire again, and never predicted that Seattle and Phoenix would do what they did.

TVI
04-12-2005, 10:42 PM
Originally posted by: capitalcity
... but see I don't get PAID to make preason predictions or regular season rankings - Stevie does. Wrong. He doesn't get paid to predict the future, he gets paid to give commentary.

The negative feedback isn't undeserving - he brings it upon himself with him flaming spurs bias. Yea, that's gotta be it. It's Spurs bias. It has nothing to do with the Spurs being the best team in the league. Before Duncan went down, they were the obvious favorite, all freakin' year. Take a look at some of the other basketball minds. Everyone was jocking the Spurs. And For good reason.

NBA GMs (http://www.nba.com/preview2004/gmsurvey_west.html) Hmm, no mention of the Mavs. Must be Spurs bias...
TNT Analysts (http://www.nba.com/preview2004/predictions_TNT_0405.html) Hmm, no mention of the Mavs. Must be Spurs bias...
Sports Illustrated (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/basketball/nba/11/02/preseason.picks/) Chris Ballard said the Mavs would be the flop of the year.
Hoopsworld (http://www.hoopsworld.com/article_10070.shtml) Blah. Nothing special
Sporting News (http://www.sportingnews.com/exclusives/20041011/572823.html) Okay, did better with the Mavs. Screwed up a bunch of others (Minnesota, Phoenix, Miami, Lakers, Jazz, Sonics, et. al)

Unlike a Sean Elliott, who is under the employ of the club, a "national" basketball correspondant for TNT and CNNSI is supposed to be OBJECTIVE.Meaning if he doesn't jock the Mavs, he's a shithead. Big deal, so he's high on the Spurs...which expert wasn't?

So nobody picked Seattle to be up and Minny to be down - big f'n deal. Show me the other paid columnist/reporter/analyst who picked the Mavs to miss the playoffs alltogether. Seriously TVI - find the other guy who labeled the mavs a lottery team.]He gave a lot of credit to Nash. At the time, there didn't seem to be anyone who could pick up the slack. Again, so did a lot of people in here.

Screw Steve Kerr. Let the bashing continue...At the expense of the value of this board...

Bookit
04-12-2005, 11:04 PM
tvi, this thread started as Kerr stated his Top Five. Which is basically who is the best right now. He picked the Spurs and the Suns. The Mavs blew the Spurs off the floor the other night and the Suns have been losing lately. The Mavs have been winning consistently as have the Nuggets. So why the Spurs and the Suns on top of his Top Five? This is an ever changing List based on recent play isn't it?. No bias??

TVI
04-12-2005, 11:31 PM
Originally posted by: EricaLubarsky
who said I was Kerr bashing. If you call me out, you should get your facts straight. Why do you think I'm calling you out? You're a top poster on this board, and I'm simply "borrowing you" as one example that even the best posters in this forum were just as wrong as Kerr was.

And how did what I said say anything about pre-season predictions?Oh come on, don't be coy:

And what about Memphis?
What about Utah?
What about New Orleans?You said that in response to a WC top 8 prediction. It's reasonable to infer that you felt those three teams should have earned a spot in that list.

I personally think its just delicious to prove Kerr wrong, and I hate Kerr as an announcer because he adds nothing, but to say that I am hypocritical for also being wrong about Utah (which was a 5-8 seed playoff seed until the freakish injury to Kirilenko....no one could have predicted that), is just plain wrong.I never called you, or anyone a hypocrite. You're being hyper-sensitive. Go back and re-read what I wrote.

And as far as Utah is concerned, We all got it wrong. With the additions of Boozer and Okur, I thought Utah would be really competittive. But Boozer hasn't lived up to expectations, and AK47 has been up and down with injuries.

The comments I keep reading about Kerr are ridiculous, and immature. He's a stand-up guy, who never said anything bad about the Mavs. He's always complimented their organization from top to bottom. Overestimating the effect of losing Nash doesn't make him a "Mavs-basher."

capitalcity
04-12-2005, 11:43 PM
Nice try TVI - you've cited 5 different articles none of which claimed the mavericks were lottery bound.

Perhaps he wasn't the only one who thought the mavs would drop off - but as the evidence shows - your boy Kerr was the only ass to put it down on paper.

Just embrace his Spur bias like the rest of your comrades. (http://www.spursreport.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30548)

TVI
04-12-2005, 11:55 PM
Originally posted by: Bookit
tvi, this thread started as Kerr stated his Top Five. Which is basically who is the best right now. He picked the Spurs and the Suns. The Mavs blew the Spurs off the floor the other night and the Suns have been losing lately. The Mavs have been winning consistently as have the Nuggets. So why the Spurs and the Suns on top of his Top Five? This is an ever changing List based on recent play isn't it?. No bias??Yea, it's based on recent play. It's also based on past performance. Extenuating circumstances play into it as well. For example, Shaq's sat three straight games, and the Heat have lost a couple in his absense, but they're still the Heat, and in the grand scheme, they're still one of the NBA's best. The Spurs have done an admirable job of fighting for the top spot despite losing Duncan for a dozen games. They're 8-2 in their last 10 (just like the Mavs) and Duncan hasn't seen a minute of action. Yea, they laid an egg against the Mavs, but the Mavs laid their own egg against the slumping Cavs.

"5. Dallas Mavericks (53-24) Ė The Mavericks' defense has improved dramatically under Avery Johnson. They are more suited to defend on the perimeter this season, with long-armed athletes like Josh Howard, Marquis Daniels and Jerry Stackhouse providing pressure on the ball. Their 36-point pounding of the Spurs last week sent a message to the league that they're going to be tough in the playoffs. "

If this is Mavs-bashing, I think some people need to get thicker skins.

dirno2000
04-12-2005, 11:56 PM
At the expense of the value of this board...It wouldnít kill you to lose that holier than thou attitude. I can go to any Spurs board on the net and half the posters there will rip any analyst that says something less than complimentary about the Spurs...same goes for the Kings and the Suns and the Rockets...see a trend here. Message board fans tend to be fanatical and don't like to see their team disrespected.

Now, youíre right in that nobody could predict what was going to happen in the West, but to suggest that the Mavs werenít one of the top eight teams in the West made him look uninformed. You provided links to show that everyone liked the Spurs, how about the links to all of the analysts who felt the Mavs wouldnít make the playoffs.

I didnít even bother to click this link because with the playoffs a couple of weeks away, I canít thing of anything more useless then NBA rankings. Still itís funny to see you come here and act like posters ripping analysts is a phenomenon thatís unique to this board.

TVI
04-13-2005, 12:30 AM
Originally posted by: dirno2000

At the expense of the value of this board...It wouldnít kill you to lose that holier than thou attitude. I can go to any Spurs board on the net and half the posters there will rip any analyst that says something less than complimentary about the Spurs...same goes for the Kings and the Suns and the Rockets...see a trend here. Message board fans tend to be fanatical and don't like to see their team disrespected.I don't see it as disrespect. He had an opinion that losing Nash would significantly hurt their chances. To be honest, I had the same thoughts. Show me one article where Kerr "bashed" the Mavs. If I think team X is going to lose 60 games, is that "bashing" them, or stating an opinion about what I think of their chances to win games?

You wan't to talk about disrespect? Imagine being a Spurs fan, and having to withstand a dozen years of comments from the "experts" about how "soft" David Robinson was, or how the Spurs could never win a championship with AJ at the point, and the grandaddy of them all...ASTERISK! Believe me, you learn to develop a thick skin.

Now, youíre right in that nobody could predict what was going to happen in the West, but to suggest that the Mavs werenít one of the top eight teams in the West made him look uninformed. You provided links to show that everyone liked the Spurs, how about the links to all of the analysts who felt the Mavs wouldnít make the playoffs.I didn't look that hard. And many of the experts only named their top choices (division/conference/league) winners, so I don't know how they felt all the way down the line. My personal belief (back last summer) was that they'd be the #6 or #7 seed this year. But they made some moves that have strengthened them since Nash's departure, not the least of which was turning the reigns over to AJ.

I didnít even bother to click this link because with the playoffs a couple of weeks away, I canít think of anything more useless then NBA rankings. Still itís funny to see you come here and act like posters ripping analysts is a phenomenon thatís unique to this board.I never said it was unique to this board, and I don't think I'm acting that way. And that's exactly why I'm making this point Dirno. I read and post to this board regularly because I feel there is a lot of quality here. I have a high amount of respect for the overall content and knowledge of the board. But I think it drives down the quality to make ridiculous comments like "Kerr's a Mavs basher." It's simply not true, and it lowers the quality of the content.

kg_veteran
04-13-2005, 12:46 AM
It might be semantics, but whether you agree that Kerr "disrespects" the Mavs or not, he definitely hasn't had a whole lot of positive things to say about them. That said, I could care less what Kerr or any of the other talking heads thinks. They don't hand out the championship trophy, and they don't have a say in who wins it.

I don't want "respect". I want a title, baby.

EricaLubarsky
04-13-2005, 02:13 AM
Originally posted by: kg_veteran
I don't want "respect". I want a title, baby.

My next signature.

pending permission.
i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif

Thespiralgoeson
04-13-2005, 02:30 AM
I didn't bother to check out when it was that Kerr said he thought to Mavs wouldn't make the playoffs. It was obviously after we lost Nash, but was it before or after we got Damp? What about Terry? If it was before we made those moves, then he wasn't far off. I don't think we would be in the playoffs without Damp and Terry. However, if it was after we made those moves, then it was just plain stupid of him to think that the Mavericks weren't in the top 8 in the west. It's certainly reasonable to assume that the loss of Nash would hurt us, but there's no way it was going to hurt us that bad as long as we had Terry, and especially after we got Damp.

EricaLubarsky
04-13-2005, 02:35 AM
here (http://dallas-mavs.com/forums/messageview.cfm?catid=2&threadid=19755&FTVAR_MSGDBTABLE=)

"9) Dallas Mavericks Southwest Division Last season's record: 52-30
Dallas
Roster
News Dirk Nowitzki remains the star for Dallas, but the roster turnover the past couple of seasons has been alarming. Erik Dampier is the latest newcomer after the failed experiments with Antoine Walker and Antawn Jamison a year ago.

Don Nelson will be glad to have Dampier's defense and rebounding, but he'll have to figure out a way to fit him into the up-tempo offensive style Nellie enjoys.

The Mavs sustained a huge loss when Steve Nash decided to sign with Phoenix, but Mark Cuban's club quickly replaced him by trading for Jason Terry and drafting Devin Harris from Wisconsin."

Thespiralgoeson
04-13-2005, 03:11 AM
Ah, well then he's just stupid. Thanks for clearing that one up, Erica.

Usually Lurkin
04-13-2005, 07:07 AM
Originally posted by: EricaLubarsky
here (http://dallas-mavs.com/forums/messageview.cfm?catid=2&threadid=19755&FTVAR_MSGDBTABLE=)
The Mavs sustained a huge loss when Steve Nash decided to sign with Phoenix, but Mark Cuban's club quickly replaced him by trading for Jason Terry and drafting Devin Harris from Wisconsin."

I thought they picked up Devin before Steve Nash left. Did he ever write about the possibility that Nash leaving would be good for Dirk? or for the Dallas defense? That would've been good commentary.

All year long, Kerr's criteria for top 5 (playing well right now, played well last month, might play better if superstar comes back) has been in constant adjustment to keep Suns and Spurs right at the top. He doesn't adjust that criteria to interpret other teams performance as great.

Evilmav2
04-13-2005, 07:56 AM
9) Dallas Mavericks Southwest Division Last season's record: 52-30
Dallas
Roster
News Dirk Nowitzki remains the star for Dallas, but the roster turnover the past couple of seasons has been alarming. Erik Dampier is the latest newcomer after the failed experiments with Antoine Walker and Antawn Jamison a year ago.

Did nobody else notice that Stevie misspelled Erick Dampier's name here? The lack of professionalism on Kerr's part is blatant and pervasive enough to be comedic...

I'm actually surprised he didn't write:


Dirk Nowitzki remains the only remaining star for Dallas, as the roster turnover the past couple of seasons has been alarming. Erik (sic) Dampier is only the latest failure to follow the failed experiments with Antoine Walker and Antawn Jamison a year ago.

Kerr just can't hide his bias, and unlike many other pundits, I've always gotten the feeling that he doesn't do much research, scouting, or talking to league sources to inform his articles and television work- it just seems to me that Kerr probably pops off his articles less time than your average bulletin board poster spends replying on a forum thread, and that all of his haphazardly executed work is always direly informed by his likes and dislikes of certain franchises (and I'm not even going to talk about his generally poor television work).

Apologists like TVI can whine and lament the 'bashing' of Steve Kerr on this forum all they want (if you think it's bad here, you should see what the folks over on K-F.com think of the man), but that doesn't change the fact that most of his articles are largely composed of simplistic, ill-informed pap that really does little but let his readers discover over, and over again that he still has strong feelings about Greg Popovich and all of his old San Antonio teammates, and that yes, he believes that San Antonio is certainly going to win the championship this year, and probably will next year too...

4cwebb
04-13-2005, 08:00 AM
Just to weigh in, the only thing I find offensive about Kerr is his consistent reliance on the Spurs as fodder for his "national" column. It's not the fact that he disrespected the Mavs (or the Kings), or that he jocked the Spurs as the best team in the league; as someone else pointed out above, it's the fact that he's writing for yahoo sports, and he seems to constantly figure out a way to work the Spurs into his columns.

I at first found it curious that he could put the Spurs back at the top after their two "clutch" double OT wins over two teams that aren't going to the playoffs (and yes, GS has been on fire lately, but overall they are still not a playoff bound basketball team), but looking over what some of the other "top teams" did in the last week or so, he didn't have much choice...unless he was going to move the Mavs ahead of the Spurs, or put Denver up there (Nuggets probably more deserving with the run that they are on lately).

jthig32
04-13-2005, 08:51 AM
Little off topic, but I found the combination of these two predictions to be hilarious. I know a lot of people thought the same thing about these two teams, but still, it's funny.




What team will be this season's biggest surprise?

Ballard: Utah Jazz. It shouldn't be surprising that a Jerry Sloan-coached team is good. With new additions Carlos Boozer and Mehmet Okur, this Jazz team is a significant upgrade from the squad that almost made the playoffs last year. Could finish as a 4 or 5 seed in the West.


What team will be this season's biggest flop?

Ballard: Dallas Mavericks. They'll miss Nash a lot more than they think. Dirk Nowitzki needs a point guard who knows how to get him the ball; I don't buy that Jason Terry or Marquis Daniels is that guy.