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MFFL
12-10-2005, 10:47 PM
10:12 PM December 10, 2005
Exclusive interview
Artest to Pacers: Trade me
By Mike Wells
mike.wells@indystar.com

Injured forward Ron Artest wants to return to the court, but not to the Indiana Pacers.

In a 20-minute interview Saturday, Artest for the first time publicly said he wants to be traded. He calmly described the issues he has with his role on the team, his head coach and his past, and said the team would be better off without him.

"I still think my past haunts me here," Artest said. "I think somewhere else I'm starting fresh. I'm coming in with baggage but people already know about it and how I'm going to be. Either they're going to be for me or they're not going to trade for me. Here I think my past haunts me.

"I think they will be a better team without me."

Coach Rick Carlisle called his forward "one of the elite talents in the league."

"You never want to lose someone like that," Carlisle said Saturday.

The Pacers lost Artest for 73 games after the Nov. 19 brawl last season. They stuck with him even though he said his suspension essentially ruined their season. Now the Pacers might be forced to trade him in order to salvage an already trying season.

"I think I cause a lot of problems here," said Artest, who has missed the past two games with a wrist injury. "If the trade rumors, if there is any truth -- maybe it won't be a bad thing. They probably could win more games without me."

Team President Larry Bird was scouting in Europe and could not be reached for comment. Pacers CEO Donnie Walsh was surprised by Artest's request and said the franchise would decide the next step.

"I've never heard him say anything before," said Walsh, who acquired Artest in a trade in 2002. "He hasn't talked to me, and I see him every day."

Walsh called this latest development a distraction and chided Artest's handling of the situation.

"He can always come up and talk to me or Larry Bird," Walsh said. "From here on out, I expect Ronnie to be a professional. . . . (This) isn't the best way to get a trade done."
Until Saturday, Artest's season had been relatively stress-free. He remains one of the team's hardest workers. He hasn't irritated game officials and has reached out more to teammates off the court.

It's on the court that he's had problems fitting in with Carlisle's system.

Artest is second on the team in shot attempts and scoring at 19.4 points, but he thinks his style disrupts the offense.

"I'm so demanding of the ball. It's not my fault," he said. "Every time somebody is on me it's a mismatch. It messes up the offense. I like Coach (Carlisle) as a person, but I don't like playing for Coach. I like my team, though."

The Pacers run a structured offense in which Carlisle calls out most plays. That frustrates Artest, who has complained about the system in the past. Artest also took issue with practices. He thinks they're too soft.

"Don't get it twisted. He's a very good coach," Artest said. "He knows what he's doing. I personally don't like playing for him. I would not want to see him get fired for me after all the immaturity I've been through with this organization."

Getting offers for Artest won't be difficult -- Artest is a former All-Star and Defensive Player of the Year. But getting equal value in return could be. Artest makes $6.5 million this season, paltry by All-Star standards. Because of the salary cap, NBA trades are as much about matching salaries as swapping talent. Most players of Artest's ability make much more money, meaning the Pacers won't get a player of his caliber unless they include other Pacers in the deal.

What teams interest Artest?

His hometown New York Knicks.

"If I go to the West Coast, I would come back to New York after my contract is up," Artest said. "I would go to Cleveland. I wouldn't mind coming off the bench behind LeBron James. There's a lot of players I wouldn't mind coming off the bench behind. If it was a perfect world, I would be going to New York."

Artest seeks a system in which he can score more, which would lead to a bigger contract when his expires in 2008. He has a player option for $8.5 million for the 2008-09 season.
"Here I don't think I'm going to have a chance to maximize my opportunity for my potential," he said. "When I first got here, all I wanted to do was play defense. I never really cared about offense, but what I see is players like Kobe (Bryant), Tracy (McGrady), (Gilbert) Arenas and Jermaine (O'Neal) getting the opportunity to maximize their potential on the court and to get paid. I'm out of my character a little bit here.

"I don't think I'm going to maximize my opportunity just playing defense. I have to show I'm one of the premier players on offense on the wing. So when it's that time, there's no question what type of player I am."

Artest said he will take a few more days to decide when he is ready to return from his wrist injury.

But the question is: Will he be a Pacer when he returns?

Nash13
12-10-2005, 10:51 PM
"If I go to the West Coast, I would come back to New York after my contract is up,"

This quote makes me not want him.

EricaLubarsky
12-10-2005, 11:00 PM
last year made me not want him,

saying that he will ditch any western team after his contract is up makes him virtually untradable to the Western Conference. I don't know if he's just publicly whining to get his way with the Pacers or if he's trying to get traded, but he's making it really tough for his team. At this point Artest's trade value is extremely low, and he hurts the Pacers even more by limiting the number of teams that they can trade him to, which limits what they can get back.

And I guess I havent said this in a while so I will here: why is this in the Mavs forum rather than the NBA or trade forum?

MavsFanFinley
12-10-2005, 11:11 PM
And I guess I havent said this in a while so I will here: why is this in the Mavs forum rather than the NBA or trade forum?

Sorry, I arrived late to the board and I'm still trying to figure some things out.

Say no to Artest.

Dirkenstien
12-10-2005, 11:21 PM
Artest' issue is that he wants to get paid and he feels he cannot get a very lucrative contract just playing defense for Indiana. If we could bring him here I really think he would be happy in the system playing for Avery. He would become our second best scoring threat behind Dirk and our best defender playing beside Howard.

Right now we have a lot to offer Indiana and not many teams would be willing to take a chance on him. Cuban is a risk taker...the bigger the risk, the bigger the reward.

With that being said; I am all about making a trade for him that does not include Dirk or Howard...everyone else is expendable. A plausible trade scenario would be Daniels, Terry, and Damp for Artest, Croshere, and Pollard.

Let's get him here and win a championship

MikeB
12-10-2005, 11:42 PM
I seriously doubt Indiana wants Terry. He doesn't seem to be the type of defensive player that Carlisle likes and they already have 4 PGs on the team.
I think Bird really likes Croshere. His big contract came after the way he played for Larry Legend in the playoffs so I doubt they would want to send him plus with KVH here Croshere would be a duplicate talent wise and too much tied up in the PF position.
Pollard is a complete spare.
If we could package Stack/KVH for Artest/? or Stack and draft picks straight up since the salaries are reasonably close then maybe.
That would move Daniels back to the bench and Josh or Artest to the SG spot.

The Crippler
12-11-2005, 12:19 AM
man, he's wacky dude, no doubt. I just can't make up my mind if I would want him here or not.

MavKikiNYC
12-11-2005, 07:21 AM
No. No, no, no, no, no, no, no.

Too much risk, not that much of an upgrade over what they already have in Howard. Plus Artest isn't looking to do what the Mavericks would most need from him. Artest is going to maximize his talent playing second fiddle to Dirk? Hardly.

He doesn't like playing for Carlisle, but he'd like playing for Brown? Hardly.

Artest's issues are: 1) cognitive disability; and 2) mental illness. Would be curious to know exactly what medicines he's supposed to be taking.

Those same issues will end up destroying whatever team he winds up on.

It's a shame that teams like the Pacers can't sue a player like Artest for damaging his trade value by making statements like this.

kriD
12-11-2005, 08:12 AM
Bob Kravitz / The Indianapolis Star

Tick-tock: Time's up for Artest

Ron Artest can't come back now, not after this, not after saying he wants to get away from coach Rick Carlisle and go someplace where he can get bigger numbers and a fresh start.

He must be traded.

Now.

Artest, an incorrigible bum who should have been set free long ago, should not be allowed to spend another night soiling the uniform of the Indiana Pacers.

If he wants out -- and he made that abundantly clear when he spoke with The Star's Mike Wells -- then the Pacers must accommodate him, and accommodate him immediately.

Before he destroys a second straight season.

Before he further poisons what has often been a toxic locker room.

If Larry Bird and Donnie Walsh don't do something dramatic and immediate, they are completely asleep at the wheel -- something they've long been guilty of when it involves Teflon Ron.

If Artest is allowed back in that locker room, what would management be telling Carlisle? That it backs Artest? That Artest can say or do just about anything and be forgiven? If Artest is still here one week from now, Carlisle needs to give management an ultimatum:

It's him or me.

And it needs to be Carlisle.

The Pacers head coach rubs some people the wrong way -- former and current players have chafed under his micromanaging, run-the-play style -- but he wins every place he coaches and he wins under all kinds of circumstances. When Artest was gone last season, running a daddy day care and promoting his CD, Carlisle was doing one of the most remarkable coaching jobs in recent memory, taking the shell of a team to the second round of the playoffs.

If Artest is allowed to return, what would that say to the other players in the locker room? The ones who presumably care more about winning a title than getting their statistics? The ones who spent all last season fighting through suspensions and injuries and playing some of the most inspiring, unselfish basketball this team has played in years?

If it wasn't obvious to Pacers' management long ago, it should be now: The guy is a hopeless case. He's a wonderful basketball player who possesses great passion for the game, but, ultimately, he is a team-killer, a selfish lout who says one thing and does another.

Anybody remember how, during the whole contrived Ron Across America Tour, he made a point of committing himself to the team, insisting he would happily sacrifice his numbers for the greater good?

That lasted, what, three months?

Now, he's saying he wants to play the role of Kobe, or LeBron, or maybe Gilbert Arenas, "to maximize my opportunity of my potential."

The "Real Ron,'' indeed.

Anybody remember how, during that same tour, he made a point of thanking the Pacers for all their patience and understanding, and how, in return, he owed them nothing less than a championship?

Now he's saying (and please don't snicker as you read this one), "I don't think everybody is treated the same way around here,'' and "I think they will be a better team without me."

After all this organization has done for him -- supported (enabled) him, counseled him, even lied for him -- this was his way of showing gratitude.

Thanks, Ron.

And good riddance.

If ever there was a time to pull the trigger on an Artest-for-Peja Stojakovic deal, this is it. The question, though, is whether the Sacramento Kings are now willing to make it happen. In the past, they've been reticent to part with the popular Stojakovic, but the Kings are struggling and look like a team in desperate need of a change.

Somehow, some way, Bird and Walsh have to make a deal, or do whatever it takes to get Artest out of here. Even if they can't get equal value for him -- and if it's not a deal for Stojakovic, it's unlikely they'll get good value -- it doesn't matter. Get a bent rim. And a slug to be named later. Anything. Cut the franchise's losses.

In the end, Artest didn't make this mess, even if he's the one with dirt on his hands. It's like the Chris Rock routine when the comic says the tiger who attacked Roy Horn of Siegfried and Roy didn't go crazy.

"That tiger went tiger," Rock said.

In this case, Artest went Artest.

The Pacers knew what they were getting when they dealt for him. And they've been front-row spectators to the running psychodrama ever since. So how could they have failed to see that it would eventually come to this? They knew -- knew -- he was a ticking time bomb and would eventually take the entire franchise with him. But still, three of the best basketball men in the league -- Bird, Walsh and Carlisle -- sat by idly and let it happen. They believed their own fiction because they wanted to believe it, because when Artest is right, he's a great player and an even greater bargain.

Now they are going to pay again for placing their faith in him, forced to deal him at a time when it will be next-to-impossible to get any kind of value for him.

The Pacers cannot complain, though. They lost that right a long time ago. This is their mess, and now, it's time to clean it up.

alby
12-11-2005, 09:01 AM
It is sad that Ron Artest the person isn't nearly as good as Ron Artest the player. I've always been pro-Artest if it meant that the Mavercisks were going to acquire an allstar without giving that much up, but lately Artest has made me lost all faith in him. I viewed him as somewhat similar to a T.O., and thus I really wanted the Mavericks to go after the guy. Now, there are just too many questions surrounding the nutcase that you would be taking risks that are just plain unnecessary to your team. Ron Artest, please just quit basketball and flop on your rap album so we will never hear anything about you ever again.

dude1394
12-11-2005, 09:40 AM
No..He's a nut.

And I certainly wouldn't give up jason/marquis for him. The pacers won't get anywhere near his worth on the market. At some point in time they will have a firesale with him. If I were they, I'd go straight for projects and draft picks. O'Neal is the core of that team. They would be better off without artest. Against the mavs you could tell that there is something awry with them mentally.

I'm sure the coach is history unless artest goes soon.

MavKikiNYC
12-11-2005, 09:45 AM
Edit. Never Mind.

Dirkenstien
12-11-2005, 12:54 PM
Artest and Pollard for Marquis and Terry works. I say pull the trigger and enjoy a player with Defensive Player of the Year capabilities along with the ability to take the pressure off of Dirk offensively.

EricaLubarsky
12-11-2005, 12:59 PM
ugh. NO!!

dude1394
12-11-2005, 01:17 PM
Good grief pollard can't even get off the bench...Artest is barely ranked above Josh for goodness sakes.. Jet/Marquis for Artest? Hopefully someone would be fired for that move.

I wouldn't give up Marquis straight up for the idiot.

jthig32
12-11-2005, 01:28 PM
Good grief pollard can't even get off the bench...Artest is barely ranked above Josh for goodness sakes.. Jet/Marquis for Artest? Hopefully someone would be fired for that move.

I wouldn't give up Marquis straight up for the idiot.

While I agree that this would be a bad trade based on Artest's history, I think you'd be hard pressed to find many fans or basketball people outside of Dallas that would put Howard anywhere near Artest's level. I mean it's not even close, really. Artest might just be the premier defender in all of basketball, and he has a complimentary offensive game to go with it.

If Artest was not a head case, no team would ever trade him, and a package of Terry and Quis would be laughed at by the Pacers.

How sad is it that his problems are so bad, that deal would probably be laughed at the other way by Dallas?

kg_veteran
12-11-2005, 03:42 PM
I think you'd be hard pressed to find many fans or basketball people outside of Dallas that would put Howard anywhere near Artest's level. I mean it's not even close, really. Artest might just be the premier defender in all of basketball, and he has a complimentary offensive game to go with it.

How is Artest's offensive game any better than Howard's offensive game? In the past 3 seasons, their PSA (points per shots attempt) numbers are 1.04 for Artest and 1.03 for Howard. This year it's 1.06 for each of them. Artest thinks he's a lot better than he actually is offensively, which makes him (in my mind at least) less valuable on offense than Howard. Plus, I think Howard still has room for growth in his offensive game, whereas I think Artest pretty much is what he is. Either way, I don't think there's any way that Artest should be considered superior to Howard offensively.

On the defensive end, Artest is clearly better when and if he's focused, but how often does that happen? This year, Howard's "counterpart PER" as tracked by 82games.com is 3 points lower than Artest's similar stat. Based on what you can count on from the two players on a nightly basis, I'll take Howard every time.

As for how they're ranked, dude is right. In fact, Howard's PER ranking is higher than Artest's ranking.

If Artest has his head screwed on straight, I agree that the Pacers wouldn't deal him. Then again, he doesn't, and that means that any team that wants to trade for him should and will take his "mental status" into account.

Say no to Artest.

AxdemxO
12-11-2005, 03:59 PM
Sorry but who in their right mind would give up Daniels and Terry for Artest.

The guy is overrated and talk about a cancer and he is got a lot of mental issues.
I would not do a Daniels for Artest trade.

Dirkenstien
12-11-2005, 04:00 PM
While Howard is a good player, I believe what puts Artest above Howard both offensively and defensively is his brute strength. Obviously both players have their own advantages...Howard is a little more wirey enabling him to slash between the cracks for those easy baskets and sweet rebounds...Artest is heavier and stronger allowing him to bang around more and gain position but is just as quick as Howard.

These are two players who would absolutely wreak havoc on opposing offenses if given the chance to play beside one another.

Dirkenstien
12-11-2005, 04:05 PM
Sorry but who in their right mind would give up Daniels and Terry for Artest.

The guy is overrated and talk about a cancer and he is got a lot of mental issues.
I would not do a Daniels for Artest trade.

I would.

Call me crazy but a lineup featuring:
Damp / Diop / Pollard
Dirk / KVH
Artest / Stackhouse
Howard / Griffin
Harris / Armstrong

is as solid as they come and much better than what we currently have. All in all, the potential is too much to be overlooked and I would pull the trigger.

jthig32
12-11-2005, 04:56 PM
How is Artest's offensive game any better than Howard's offensive game? In the past 3 seasons, their PSA (points per shots attempt) numbers are 1.04 for Artest and 1.03 for Howard. This year it's 1.06 for each of them. Artest thinks he's a lot better than he actually is offensively, which makes him (in my mind at least) less valuable on offense than Howard. Plus, I think Howard still has room for growth in his offensive game, whereas I think Artest pretty much is what he is. Either way, I don't think there's any way that Artest should be considered superior to Howard offensively.

On the defensive end, Artest is clearly better when and if he's focused, but how often does that happen? This year, Howard's "counterpart PER" as tracked by 82games.com is 3 points lower than Artest's similar stat. Based on what you can count on from the two players on a nightly basis, I'll take Howard every time.

As for how they're ranked, dude is right. In fact, Howard's PER ranking is higher than Artest's ranking.

If Artest has his head screwed on straight, I agree that the Pacers wouldn't deal him. Then again, he doesn't, and that means that any team that wants to trade for him should and will take his "mental status" into account.

Say no to Artest.

I never said Artest was better on offense. I don't think he is and I never said it.

I do, however, believe he is a FAR superior defender, when things are right with him, which is in fact essentially what you said.

My whole point was that, if Artest was right, he was clearly a superior player to Howard, and I would take him in a heartbeat. I also said I don't believe he is right, so I would not do the deal....so I don't really see where we disagree here, except for you misunderstanding what I meant on his offense.

I guess I was mainly playing devil's advocate. I wouldn't even think of doing that deal right now, but let's not kid ourselves. If Artest wasn't freaking crazy, he'd be considered one of the best 10 players in basketball, and Howard wouldn't touch him.

EDIT: And btw, even if Artest was right, there's no way he and Howard could start on the same team. They're too much of the same animal.

DirkGoesNuclear
12-11-2005, 05:18 PM
Not only is Artest crazy/immature, but he is truly a selfish individual. Remember when he asked for a month off in the midst of the season to promote his rap album? Now instead of bringing up this trade issue within the organization (according to the report) who does he speak to instead? First he talks about bringing a championship to Indiana, now with 2 years left of his contract he is thinking beyond this season at the expense of this team on how he can secure a 10-12 mil/year contract? I dont care how wonderful he is as a basketball player, just say no to this scumbag.

dude1394
12-11-2005, 05:24 PM
Realgm ratings are almost identical between Josh/Artest...54/51 respectively.

Marquis is at 93 and coming lower and lower.

Josh outrebounds Artest which is what we need. Who needs the headcase.

Dtownsfinest
12-12-2005, 01:13 PM
If we brought Artest into Dallas he'd put us over the top. That's how good he is. He's exactly what we need at the 2/3 spot. He's what Josh Howard wants to be. The problem and huge risk here is his attitude. Same thing we said about Nick Van Exel who had a very similiar situation to the one Artest had last year. Pistons took the same risk with an unhappy Rasheed Wallace and received a championship title in return. These guys are unhappy because they play for bad teams. What is there for Artest to be unhappy about here? He's going to start. He's going to recieve however minutes he deserves. He has a chance at a title and he has a head coach who's played the game just like he has. Being that Artest wants out he's going to be given away in a bargain deal. Mavs maybe could get him in a steal. I'd trade him for anyone not named Josh, Dirk, Marquis or Harris. You trade any players on this team not named those guys it will not hurt your team. This team doesn't live or die with KVH or Stackhouse and with the way Harris is playing as of late I may do a Terry for Artest deal.

DevinHarriswillstart
12-12-2005, 02:09 PM
At least he admits he is a problem lol.

Now if only Walker would do the same.

EricaLubarsky
12-12-2005, 02:27 PM
unfortunately there are another 11 steps after admitting you have a problem.

kriD
12-12-2005, 02:46 PM
Walsh say Pacers will seek Artest trade

By Mike Wells and Mark Montieth
mike.wells@indystar.com

The Indiana Pacers aren't wasting time in responding to Ron Artest's request to be traded.

CEO Donnie Walsh said today that the Pacers will put Artest on the inactive list for the rest of the week as they pursue a trade.

Artest did not attend Monday's practice. He missed the past two games with a wrist injury.

Artest told The Star on Saturday morning that he didn't like playing for coach Rick Carlisle and that he wanted a fresh start.

Walsh has met with Artest twice, including once after Saturday's announcement.

"At that point, I would have wanted Ronnie to come to practice, because the fact a player says he wants to be traded really has no consequence to the franchise," Walsh said. "But since that time, he's stepped up and (repeated his trade request) a few times. I've changed my thoughts on that.

"He'll remain on the active list through this week, and I've told him he doesn't have to come to practice. The reason for that is we will pursue trades. And I'm not going to know for a while exactly what the situation is going to be.

"I don't want the team to be distracted."

Artest, who is averaging 19.4 points a game, said he wants to play for a team on which he can excel offensively. He watched the past two games from the bench as the Pacers picked up impressive victories. He said he thinks he disrupts the offense with his one-on-one style. The Pacers are 2-1 this season without Artest in the lineup.

DirkGoesNuclear
12-12-2005, 04:53 PM
If we brought Artest into Dallas he'd put us over the top. That's how good he is. He's exactly what we need at the 2/3 spot. He's what Josh Howard wants to be. The problem and huge risk here is his attitude. Same thing we said about Nick Van Exel who had a very similiar situation to the one Artest had last year. Pistons took the same risk with an unhappy Rasheed Wallace and received a championship title in return. These guys are unhappy because they play for bad teams. What is there for Artest to be unhappy about here? He's going to start. He's going to recieve however minutes he deserves. He has a chance at a title and he has a head coach who's played the game just like he has. Being that Artest wants out he's going to be given away in a bargain deal. Mavs maybe could get him in a steal. I'd trade him for anyone not named Josh, Dirk, Marquis or Harris. You trade any players on this team not named those guys it will not hurt your team. This team doesn't live or die with KVH or Stackhouse and with the way Harris is playing as of late I may do a Terry for Artest deal.

For the case of Nick and Rasheed, they have already been paid and were not looking for money. Nick was even willing to renegotiate the last couple of years in his contract to make it easy for the Mavs to keep him. They are on the downward slope of their careers and just want a ring. Artest wants to go to a team to rack up the stats for a big payday in a couple of years. So I guess he wouldn't mind going to New York or any leastern teams for that matter. With a bad team his stats would look great. Indiana is not a shabby team to begin with, and if he does not want to go west, he has maybe 2 options to win a title this year - Miami and Detroit. So what does that say of his interest in a title?

Dirkenstien
12-12-2005, 05:32 PM
Rasheed "CTC" (Cuth The Check) Wallace was not concerned about a ring at the time he was being shopped.

If we can get Artest for a bargain, then do it. Let's bring some more defense in here.

AxdemxO
12-12-2005, 05:48 PM
Wallace is a much better player then Artest..IMO.

Artest is not what we need.

Dtownsfinest
12-12-2005, 10:53 PM
For the case of Nick and Rasheed, they have already been paid and were not looking for money. Nick was even willing to renegotiate the last couple of years in his contract to make it easy for the Mavs to keep him. They are on the downward slope of their careers and just want a ring. Artest wants to go to a team to rack up the stats for a big payday in a couple of years. So I guess he wouldn't mind going to New York or any leastern teams for that matter. With a bad team his stats would look great. Indiana is not a shabby team to begin with, and if he does not want to go west, he has maybe 2 options to win a title this year - Miami and Detroit. So what does that say of his interest in a title?



Dirkenstein replied before I could. Sheed's nickname was "CTC" that's tells you what his interests were. I actually remember him being interviewed and saying all he wanted was a check. Artest is the type of player we need in here. I'm not saying trade our youth or our all stars for him. Just make an offer. Offer KVH, Stack or JET. If they don't want to except fine. But atleast make an attempt at one of the best defenders in the league.

EricaLubarsky
12-12-2005, 11:33 PM
Wow, I agree with Charles Barkley...

Indiana supported the guy when many other teams would have tried to sever connections. They not only didnt say anything negative, they came out as an outspoken advocate for the guy. Artest is a punk.

DirkGoesNuclear
12-13-2005, 12:15 AM
Dirkenstein replied before I could. Sheed's nickname was "CTC" that's tells you what his interests were. I actually remember him being interviewed and saying all he wanted was a check. Artest is the type of player we need in here. I'm not saying trade our youth or our all stars for him. Just make an offer. Offer KVH, Stack or JET. If they don't want to except fine. But atleast make an attempt at one of the best defenders in the league.

If I remember correctly, the situation with Rasheed is a little different. He was discontent with the team for whatever reason and wanted out. There was a lot of trade rumors flying around. So when ask which team he'd rather go to, he said it didn't matter as long as they "cut the check". It wasn't like he was trying to secure a bigger contract or anything. He just wanted out of Portland and provide his services to whichever team that is payrolling him. Artest on the other hand wants to be a primma donna and boost his offensive stats so that he can have a huge payday in a couple of years.

DirkGoesNuclear
12-13-2005, 12:19 AM
Latest from DMN:

Don't wait on Artest: If you think Ron Artest, who has requested a trade from Indiana, would be good in Dallas, you might want to reassess your thoughts.

Owner Mark Cuban and Johnson both said the Mavericks are not headed in that direction.

"We like our team," Cuban said.

Artest has said Dallas is one team he'd consider playing for.

twelli
12-13-2005, 12:51 AM
Nick and Rasheed have much more pleasant personalities than Artest IMO. I think he could easily destroy the chemistry of the team. We are are doing well right now, and we will become even better as the season progresses. No major tinkering with the team now, please!!!

Dirkenstien
12-13-2005, 01:17 AM
Latest from DMN:

Don't wait on Artest: If you think Ron Artest, who has requested a trade from Indiana, would be good in Dallas, you might want to reassess your thoughts.

Owner Mark Cuban and Johnson both said the Mavericks are not headed in that direction.

"We like our team," Cuban said.

Artest has said Dallas is one team he'd consider playing for.

Cuban has never been one to tip his hand but if this how they feel there is nothing wrong with that. Either way we will have a chance at competing and either way there are risks involved.

Five-ofan
12-13-2005, 10:17 AM
Artest would never take a backseat to dirk and honestly after seriously watching him the this year and the little he played last year, he hasnt been anything near what he is cracked up to be defensively. He had a qoute that whoever is guarding him its a mismatch. What???? If Dirk says that fine. If Garnett says that fine. If shaq says that or kobe or tmac or lebron or.... you get my point. Also Bucher said today that by and large he is considered a top 10 player in the nba. Did I miss something??? When he said that I just started naming people that I think are better in my head and I came up with(in no order just numbered to know how many i have.)
1. Duncan
2. Dirk
3. Kg
4. Jo
5. Shaq
6. Kobe
7. Tmac
8. Lebron
9. Wade( though i think he is overrated)
10. AI
11. Pierce
12. Brand
13. Arenas
14. Nash
15. Marion (as good a defender if not better for the time being, better rebounder, not a nut)

That is 15 guys off the top of my head. I mean do the guys on espn even think about stuff before they say it? I can come up with 10 more who are equivalents of artest. If you get him for KVHs contract some how, (though they dont match) then do it. Otherwise nope. Just let him go.

Bookit
12-13-2005, 10:53 AM
"We like our team" sounds like code for "were looking seriously how we can get Artest without giving up key parts of our team" . If they aren't looking a the possibilities then they would have been a little more concrete with their quotes imo. Are there any more descript quotes from Cuban out there?

Cuban should take a chance and get Artest for Stackhouse if possible. Detroit took a risk on the troubled Rasheed and it panned out fine for them. Maybe a risk will work out for the Mavs too.

Five-ofan
12-13-2005, 11:01 AM
Getting him for stack isnt a risk. Detroit didnt really take a risk getting sheed either btw.

Bookit
12-13-2005, 11:08 AM
Getting him for stack isnt a risk. Detroit didnt really take a risk getting sheed either btw.

Bringing a player with issues into a good team without issues is certainly a risk.

Dtownsfinest
12-13-2005, 12:17 PM
Nick and Rasheed have much more pleasant personalities than Artest IMO. I think he could easily destroy the chemistry of the team. We are are doing well right now, and we will become even better as the season progresses. No major tinkering with the team now, please!!!


Do you know Artest personally or is this just pure assumption on your part?

Dtownsfinest
12-13-2005, 12:21 PM
Artest would never take a backseat to dirk and honestly after seriously watching him the this year and the little he played last year, he hasnt been anything near what he is cracked up to be defensively. He had a qoute that whoever is guarding him its a mismatch. What???? If Dirk says that fine. If Garnett says that fine. If shaq says that or kobe or tmac or lebron or.... you get my point. Also Bucher said today that by and large he is considered a top 10 player in the nba. Did I miss something??? When he said that I just started naming people that I think are better in my head and I came up with(in no order just numbered to know how many i have.)
1. Duncan
2. Dirk
3. Kg
4. Jo
5. Shaq
6. Kobe
7. Tmac
8. Lebron
9. Wade( though i think he is overrated)
10. AI
11. Pierce
12. Brand
13. Arenas
14. Nash
15. Marion (as good a defender if not better for the time being, better rebounder, not a nut)

That is 15 guys off the top of my head. I mean do the guys on espn even think about stuff before they say it? I can come up with 10 more who are equivalents of artest. If you get him for KVHs contract some how, (though they dont match) then do it. Otherwise nope. Just let him go.


Only guys on that list that bring the same thing Artest does are Duncan, Garnett, Marion, JO and Kobe. Artest plays both sides of the ball very well. And no way in hell is Marion a better defender than Artest. He can defend Dirk pretty well but as far as other 2's and 3's in this league go? He has nothing on Artest.

Five-ofan
12-13-2005, 04:03 PM
The other guys may not do exactly what he does but they are still better.

twelli
12-13-2005, 07:52 PM
Do you know Artest personally or is this just pure assumption on your part?


pure assumption

EricaLubarsky
12-13-2005, 07:58 PM
whoops

Dtownsfinest
12-14-2005, 10:00 AM
pure assumption

The reason I ask is because I never hear bad things about Artest from the Pacers. It seems the only thing they have a problem with are his on court tactics. AJ CAN handle Artest. I know he can. If one man can disrupt a team's chemistry then the chemistry wasn't there to begin with.

u2sarajevo
12-14-2005, 10:02 AM
Bad things from the Pacers about Artest?

What about wanting to take a break to promote his CD?

And on your point about Chemistry..... in Dallas with the 3 J's it only took one Woman.

Five-ofan
12-14-2005, 10:05 AM
I just dont think he is that overwhelming of a talent. There are at least 10 more guys to go with the above list that arent worse than artest. He is top 25 or so. Better than anyone but dirk but not good enough to screw up the team. If you can get him for some combo of stack and kvhs contract or either one then hey go for it. If not oh well.

Dtownsfinest
12-14-2005, 10:57 AM
Bad things from the Pacers about Artest?

What about wanting to take a break to promote his CD?

And on your point about Chemistry..... in Dallas with the 3 J's it only took one Woman.

Okay i'll admit I forgot about that little stint. But I was referring to things being caught with drugs or getting in bar fights etc. But your're right. Things like wanting time off to promote rap cd's are the things to worry about with Artest. But this season I haven't heard any bad things from. Maybe he's gotten his head on straight? A season out the league should do that to you. And the 3 J's didn't have any chemistry. That's why they let Toni get to them.

kriD
12-15-2005, 08:06 AM
Bitter situation

O'Neal says Artest let teammates down

By Mike Wells
mike.wells@indystar.com

BOSTON -- Jermaine O'Neal and Ron Artest don't hate each other.

The Pacers' All-Star forwards have had their problems, but both say this season is the closest they've ever been.

That's what made Artest's recent trade request so painful, O'Neal said Wednesday.

He thinks Artest turned his back on the same teammates who were suspended, had their images tarnished and lost millions of dollars for coming to his defense during last season's brawl at the Palace of Auburn Hills (Mich.).

"I've been through a lot with him," O'Neal said. "I was one of the guys that went to bat for him. For him to talk about another team and other players while he's still on this team, it was disrespectful not only to me, but to the rest of the guys. I don't wish any bad things on Ron. I wish Ron still goes out and accomplishes his goals. It's just a painful thing when you went through what we went through. The money I lost while I was out was extremely high. Now it's like, what was it for?"

O'Neal was suspended for 15 games and lost $2.7 million for his part in the brawl. Stephen Jackson missed 30 games and lost $1.9 million. O'Neal also was charged with two counts of misdemeanor assault and battery. Jackson, Artest and two other Pacers were charged with one count. All five Pacers received probation, community service and a fine.

O'Neal criticized Artest's timing and the manner in which he asked out.

"We felt betrayed, a little disrespected," O'Neal said. "It caught me off-guard because our relationship was at an all-time high. I just wish it was handled differently because as a player, you're always for the players. It's a team sport."

As for their basketball relationship, O'Neal said: "The business relationship is over. That's fact."

O'Neal also said Artest had not contacted any of the Pacers since his trade demand became public.

Artest, who is on the inactive list for at least two more games, said in a phone interview Wednesday he understands O'Neal's frustration. He again said his decision was based on his dislike of playing for coach Rick Carlisle, not on his relationship with O'Neal.

"Jermaine has the right to be mad at me," Artest said. "I don't have a right to be mad at him. What I'm doing is a little selfish, but I still think this will help the team by me leaving. This has nothing to do with Jermaine. Me and Jermaine are cool. I've always said from the beginning that it's Jermaine's team. He's the most qualified for the job to lead this team."

O'Neal backed Artest's comments by saying, "In the off time, when we're in the streets, when I see him and he's with another team, we can talk."

Artest had more to say, however, about his relationship with Carlisle. Artest told The Star on Saturday that his role in Carlisle's offense led to his trade request.

Wednesday, Artest questioned whether Carlisle wanted him on the team.

"I believe coach didn't want me there," Artest said. "I think he did things to make me tick. Why keep fighting coach, when I have enough problems, when I can go elsewhere and play?"

Said Carlisle: "Ron Artest is a great player. He was leading the team in minutes played and was on track to have his best statistical year as a pro. Why would I not want to have a guy like that on my team?"

While Artest leads the team in minutes played and is second in scoring average, he felt stifled in Carlisle's structured system.

"Coach's offense is a distraction," Artest said. "I'm one of the best players in the league, and he won't call a play for me for most of the quarter. That's why I feel like I messed up the offense because I can take my man any time I want. He would call plays for me at the wrong time. He's always constantly switching things up and it's confusing."

MavKikiNYC
12-17-2005, 12:12 PM
It's a shame that teams like the Pacers can't sue a player like Artest for damaging his trade value by making statements like this.
So the league IS fining him. Good. But it should be something like $250,000 or $500,000. Enough to at least begin to deter a punk like Artest from tying to force a team's hand so that he can negotiate a better contract later on. It's like a sabotage...a breach of contract. As if another team were tampering with him.

December 17, 2005
Union Challenges N.B.A. Over Its Fining of Artest

By LIZ ROBBINS
The National Basketball Players Association is preparing to file a grievance to protest the $10,000 fine that Ron Artest received Thursday from the N.B.A. over his public request for a trade from the Indiana Pacers.
Artest made his request during an interview published last weekend in The Indianapolis Star. The Pacers' chief executive, Donnie Walsh, said yesterday that he had received interest from many teams but that the Pacers were "not in a hurry to do a trade."


Union officials say they want to protect Artest's rights. During collective-bargaining talks last summer, the N.B.A. discussed with the union its stance against a player making trade demands to further a personal and premeditated agenda. The talks did not include specific punitive guidelines.

But the union argues that even if there were an understanding during bargaining, Artest's statements were spontaneous and did not warrant a fine.

"It certainly wasn't premeditated; he did not have an agenda," Ron Klempner, a lawyer for the union, said in a telephone interview yesterday. "The league is just piling it on right now. It's a bad precedent to set."

The union's plan to file a grievance is an example of its increasingly contentious relationship with the league over its authority. The union contends that the league has become more autocratic in its crackdown on behavior and has overemphasized image.

This week, the N.B.A. fined the Houston Rockets organization $100,000 for taking its players to Las Vegas for a day between games in Sacramento and Portland on a six-game Western Conference trip. The N.B.A. said it was a circumvention of salary-cap rules, because teams cannot provide benefits or compensation not covered by the players' salaries.

But Klempner said that the league had not followed policy before fining the team. To prove there was a circumvention of salary-cap rules, he said, the league first had to put the matter before an arbitrator.

kriD
12-18-2005, 10:53 AM
On 2nd thought, Artest wants to stay in Indy

Week after trade request, Pacer says, 'I should have been a man'

By Mark Montieth and Mike Wells
mark.montieth@indystar.com

NEW YORK -- The Ron Artest saga has taken yet another turn.

Artest, who announced a week ago that he wanted a trade from the Indiana Pacers, said Saturday in a phone interview that he would like to return to the team.

"I should have been a man and spoken with coach (Rick Carlisle) about my differences with him," Artest said. "Yes, I would like to return to the team."

Artest has been the talk of the NBA the past week after making his trade demand through The Star. He cited a dislike for coach Rick Carlisle's offensive system and the feeling that his past controversies continue to haunt him.

Artest's agent, Mark Stevens, has told several media outlets in the past couple of days that he hopes the All-Star forward is not traded. Stevens has not returned phone messages left by The Star.

Pacers CEO Donnie Walsh declined comment when reached at home Saturday night. Walsh said Friday that he would leave Artest on the inactive list if he cannot trade him.

Even if management would allow Artest back, it appears he would have difficulty regaining the trust of his teammates. Most of the Pacers approached following Saturday's 102-96 victory over New York at Madison Square Garden -- their fourth win in five games without Artest -- did not want to discuss the issue.

"I don't want to comment on that," forward Austin Croshere said. "And you can say I said it (in a disgusted tone of voice)."

Jermaine O'Neal has been blunt in his viewpoint.

"We can never play together,'' he said after Friday's game against Utah. "If he came back somehow, it would be him or me.''

O'Neal didn't back down from that Saturday, and offered no olive branch.

"Right now it's all about us," he said. "Ron's not part of this team right now. We're winning games. Asking questions about Ron doesn't make any sense right now."

Carlisle said he has not talked with Artest since Artest's trade demand, and is deliberately staying away from the issue.

"This is a franchise decision," he said before the game. "Fortunately for us, it's in the hands of Donnie Walsh and Larry Bird, who are two of the best basketball people there have ever been in this league. So, they'll decide which is the best way to go."

Stephen Jackson departed from the majority of his teammates, indicating he's still willing to forgive and forget. Jackson said Artest called him recently and indicated he wants to stay in Indiana.

"I think he wants to play basketball with us. He loves his teammates," Jackson said.

"He's told me personally that he doesn't have any problems with his teammates. I talk to him, we have no problems, we're both on the same page. We want to win basketball (games). We want to come out and play basketball and win games. That's all we have to do.

"I almost lost my job for him last year, so that's my friend. I respect his decision. Whatever he feels, he feels. If he's here, I'm going to play basketball and come and do my job. If he's not here, I'm still going to do my job."

Sarunas Jasikevicius noted that the Pacers have been more cohesive since Artest left the lineup -- first with a wrist injury and then with his trade demand -- regardless of whether it's because of Artest's absence or because the team has stepped up their effort in the face of adversity.

"This team is as tight as it's been all year," Jasikevicius said. "We're playing like one group, sharing the ball well and helping each other defensively and the results are here.

"We've been put in a difficult situation, but it looks like the Pacers are a better team when they're dealing with adversity. Things are much better now in Pacerland."

MavKikiNYC
12-18-2005, 01:01 PM
Artest's "advisers" finally got through to him.

Pacers are talking about suspending him with pay for the season a la Keshawn and T.O.

2 years out of basketball is not likely to increase his contract value if and when he gets traded.

So now he has to pretend that he wants to play for the Pacers, so that he'll have a legal straw at which to grasp if/when they decide to suspend him.

I hope they list his a$$. League will be much better without him.

Drbio
12-19-2005, 06:30 PM
A very good friend of mine who works in the Denver press tells me that Denver will trade Nene and another player for either Peja or Artest. Interesting huh?

Dirkenstien
12-19-2005, 07:30 PM
haha...so the drama continues. Send him to LA already.

MavKikiNYC
12-19-2005, 07:41 PM
Denver? Interesting.

Camby
K-Mart
Melo
Artest
Miller

That's some serious thug-court at the 2, 3, 4.

And I have half an intuition that Denver is one of the few places where Marbury might be saleable.

If Kiki pulls this off, I'll have to change my name.

TripleDipping
12-19-2005, 11:31 PM
A very good friend of mine who works in the Denver press tells me that Denver will trade Nene and another player for either Peja or Artest. Interesting huh?

Don't think the Pacers will bite... Sacramento, on the other hand, might just be desperate enough to ship Peja.