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MavsFanFinley
07-12-2006, 06:24 PM
Vaughn's a decent signing for 3rd pg and for the vet minimum. I can't believe they'll go with Beno as 2nd backup. Not because he doesn't have potential but because Pop has yet to trust him the last couple years. Looking at the Spurs board, Javtokas has signed with a team in Greece. (correction) There guessing that they've split the MLE between the 2 centers.

Spurs sign point guard Jacque Vaughn, extend offers to centers Elson and Butler

Web Posted: 07/12/2006 03:06 PM CDT
By Johnny Ludden
Express-News Staff Writer

The Spurs moved quickly when the NBA’s free-agent signing period began Wednesday, signing point guard Jacque Vaughn and extending offer sheets to centers Francisco Elson and Jackie Butler.

Elson and Butler are restricted free agents, so Denver and New York have seven days to match the offers. The Knicks have already indicated they want to keep Butler.

The Spurs extended offers to both Elson and Butler in part because they were unable to reach agreement with former second-round pick Robertas Javtokas. Javtokas is preparing to play in Greece, but the Spurs haven’t given up hope they will be able to resume negotiations with him, if needed.

Vaughn, who signed a one-year contract for the league minimum, will compete with Beno Udrih for the backup point-guard job.

Five-ofan
07-12-2006, 07:30 PM
Well this is a ver "meh" move.

Evilmav2
07-12-2006, 08:48 PM
Boy, the big moves by the sp*rs just never seem to stop coming. Maybe they'll tender an offer to Marcus Fizer, and try to entice Zan Tabak out of retirement next, in their great drive to reload for the '07 playoff run...

Five-ofan
07-12-2006, 08:52 PM
I would love to make fun of the spurs but apparently (im holding out hope the salary is a typo) we just made a HORRIBLE(i cant overstate that word) signing so i have no room to laugh. I am deeply saddened by the buckner signing.

nashtymavsfan13
07-12-2006, 11:30 PM
I would love to make fun of the spurs but apparently (im holding out hope the salary is a typo) we just made a HORRIBLE(i cant overstate that word) signing so i have no room to laugh. I am deeply saddened by the buckner signing.

How much did it cost us?

DelNegro
07-12-2006, 11:38 PM
Well this is a ver "meh" move.

Even as a Spurs fan, I agree with that assessment. But I guess the Spurs think that Elson and Butler at $5 mil is better than Rasho + Nazr at $13 mil.

Truth be told I don't think either the Spurs or the Mavs have done much to get excited about.

sike
07-13-2006, 01:11 AM
eh.

dirno2000
07-13-2006, 01:16 AM
Even as a Spurs fan, I agree with that assessment. But I guess the Spurs think that Elson and Butler at $5 mil is better than Rasho + Nazr at $13 mil.

Truth be told I don't think either the Spurs or the Mavs have done much to get excited about.

I agree that the Mavs haven't done anything to get exited but the Spurs have gotten worse. As much heat as Rash and Nazr have taken, they're better then Elson and Butler.

And while the Mavs have to worry about Stackhouse getting a year older, the Spurs have to worry about Finley, Horry, Barry and Bowen.

Maybe Butler will suprise people the way Diop did but I think the Knicks will match.

Evilmav2
07-13-2006, 01:35 AM
Maybe Butler will suprise people the way Diop did but I think the Knicks will match.

San Antonio beat writer Johnny Ludden writes in his latest column that Knicks officials have indicated that they will match the offer, but that the Nuggets will let Francisco 'Geico'* Elson walk...

http://www.mysanantonio.com/




*Elson's teammates all called him Geico because he never played unless his fellow Denver big-man teammates were hurt. As George Karl just said, "He hated to be called an insurance policy, but he was"...

nashtymavsfan13
07-13-2006, 01:45 AM
Will Elson help them at all? Duncan will start at center with Elson at backup right?

nashtymavsfan13
07-13-2006, 01:47 AM
I agree that the Mavs haven't done anything to get exited but the Spurs have gotten worse. As much heat as Rash and Nazr have taken, they're better then Elson and Butler.

And while the Mavs have to worry about Stackhouse getting a year older, the Spurs have to worry about Finley, Horry, Barry and Bowen.

Maybe Butler will suprise people the way Diop did but I think the Knicks will match.

Definetly. The Mavs haven't done anything huge, but they have slightly improved in areas they needed to improve upon. All the Spurs have done is get worse, and older. The Mavs are a much younger team, so they don't have to make any big moves.

capitalcity
07-13-2006, 01:57 AM
http://static.flickr.com/51/147623067_243df2ca3c.jpg

2006: The longest, hottest, most excruciating Bexar Co. summer that ever was...

nashtymavsfan13
07-13-2006, 01:58 AM
http://static.flickr.com/51/147623067_243df2ca3c.jpg

2006: The longest, hottest, most excruciating Bexar Co. summer that ever was...

LOL! :D

DelNegro
07-13-2006, 07:47 AM
I agree that the Mavs haven't done anything to get exited but the Spurs have gotten worse. As much heat as Rash and Nazr have taken, they're better then Elson and Butler.

And while the Mavs have to worry about Stackhouse getting a year older, the Spurs have to worry about Finley, Horry, Barry and Bowen.

Maybe Butler will suprise people the way Diop did but I think the Knicks will match.

Agreed. Not a good start to the offseason. The Spurs still have some cards to play with the expiring contracts they got for Rasho, and those guys can't get traded again until August so my hope is that the Spurs can find some team looking to cut some payroll and pick a useful player away.

No telling on what the Knicks will do with Butler. It is the Knicks so trying to apply logic to the situation is a fruitless endeavor. Instead I just flipped a coin and it came up tails so Butler will be a Spur next year.

DelNegro
07-13-2006, 07:49 AM
Will Elson help them at all? Duncan will start at center with Elson at backup right?

As of right now, Elson probably starts. But that doesn't really mean much since the center position will be played by committee with Elson, Duncan, Butler or someone other than Butler, and Oberto stealing time there.

Stranger
07-13-2006, 07:53 AM
But is Horry going to be the only other option at PF besides Duncan? Because he seems in serious decline.

Edit: Or is Matt Bonner still around? He played some pretty good minutes for the Raptors.

MavKikiNYC
07-14-2006, 02:11 PM
Isiah now thinking Butler doesn't do it


BY FRANK ISOLA
DAILY NEWS SPORTS WRITER Isiah Thomas is having second thoughts on matching the three-year, $7 million offer sheet Jackie Butler received from the San Antonio Spurs. According to sources, Thomas is surprised that the center, who is entering his second season, managed to secure a contract that dwarfs the $900,000 the Knicks offered him. The same source said there is a "50-50 chance" that Butler won't return. Thomas has until Wednesday to match the offer.
The Knicks already have 14 players under contract, and Thomas is finding it hard to justify signing Butler for $7 million when he could be the team's third-string center behind Eddy Curry and Jerome James.
Thomas, however, has a soft spot for the 6-10 Butler, whom he signed out of the CBA two years ago on the advice of former scout Del Demps, who now works for the Spurs. There is a good chance that former Knicks coach Larry Brown gave his good friend, San Antonio head coach Gregg Popovich, a thorough scouting report on Butler.
The Knicks have had strange dealings with the Spurs in recent years. Three years ago, Thomas agreed to send Kurt Thomas to San Antonio for Malik Rose only to rescind the offer at the last minute.
The following season, Thomas sent Nazr Mohammed to the Spurs for Rose, and Mohammed helped San Antonio win the title. Now, Butler could be replacing Mohammed, who is now a Piston.

MavKikiNYC
07-18-2006, 07:21 PM
Isiah has interest in Jeffries


BY FRANK ISOLA
DAILY NEWS SPORTS WRITER Isiah Thomas says he is not actively pursing deals for free agents, but behind the scenes the Knicks' president and coach continues to search for ways to bolster his roster.

One player who continues to draw interest from the Knicks is Washington forward Jared Jeffries, a restricted free agent. According to sources, the Knicks have had conversations with Jeffries' agent, Andy Miller, in recent days as negotiations between Jeffries and the Wizards have stalled. Jeffries is considering accepting Washington's one-year qualifying offer for approximately $3 million, which would make him an unrestricted free agent next summer.

Miller, who also represents free agent forward Al Harrington, did not return phone calls yesterday.

The Knicks can offer Jeffries their mid-level exception, starting at approximately $5.2 million. The Knicks are reluctant to add salary, but the 6-11 Jeffries, who can play four positions, would give the team a versatile player who is regarded as a strong defender. The 24-year-old Jeffries averaged 6.4 points and 4.9 rebounds in 77 games last season

The Knicks' interest in Jeffries suggests that Thomas will not match the three-year, $7 million offer Jackie Butler received from the San Antonio Spurs. The Knicks have until tomorrow to decide on Butler's fate. By allowing Butler to leave, the Knicks would have one roster spot available.

Washington would have the option to match any offer made to Jeffries. A sign-and-trade scenario is unlikely because of salary cap restrictions. Jeffries is best suited to play small forward, a position that is currently filled by Jalen Rose, Quentin Richardson and first-round pick Renaldo Balkman. David Lee is another option for small forward.

Jeffries, however, can play both forward positions as well as center and has even played big guard for Washington.

MavsFanFinley
07-18-2006, 09:51 PM
That would be a steal for the Spurs if NY doesn't match.

nashtymavsfan13
07-18-2006, 11:36 PM
That would be a steal for the Spurs if NY doesn't match.

Really? Is Butler any good?

MavsFanFinley
07-19-2006, 09:49 AM
Really? Is Butler any good?

IMO, it's like Dallas stealing Diop away from Cleveland.

Butler is only 21yrs old too.

DelNegro
07-19-2006, 11:06 AM
Really? Is Butler any good?

He's a project but definitely has upside. As MFF pointed out he is only 21 and even if he only puts up the same numbers he did last year it's Rasho-esque production at a quarter of the cost.

Butler doesn't make me jump for joy and proclaim us as the team to beat, but it would be a very solid signing.

MavKikiNYC
07-19-2006, 11:31 AM
He's a project but definitely has upside. As MFF pointed out he is only 21 and even if he only puts up the same numbers he did last year it's Rasho-esque production at a quarter of the cost.

Butler doesn't make me jump for joy and proclaim us as the team to beat, but it would be a very solid signing.

NYKs apparently get an extra day because of a clerical error on the offer sheet. Don't think they plan to match.

I think you've pegged it--Butler is a value signing, not an impact signing.

DelNegro
07-19-2006, 02:55 PM
Knicks decline to match Spurs' offer to Butler

Web Posted: 07/19/2006 01:55 PM CDT
Express-News

SALT LAKE CITY – The New York Knicks have decided not to match the Spurs’ three-year, $7 million offer to restricted free agent Jackie Butler, a Knicks’ spokesman said Wednesday.


advertisement





The Spurs have yet to officially hear from the Knicks or the NBA.

The Spurs also have not heard from the Denver Nuggets, who have until Thursday to match an offer for restricted free agent Francisco Elson.

Both Butler and Elson are centers.

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/stories/MYSA071906.butler.EN.203c608.html

Nash13
07-19-2006, 03:40 PM
I agree that the Mavs haven't done anything to get exited but the Spurs have gotten worse. As much heat as Rash and Nazr have taken, they're better then Elson and Butler.


But they save money, therefor, it's a brilliant move by the Spurs. But let Cuban do crap like that, and he gets called cheap and it's doom and gloom.

DelNegro
07-19-2006, 04:09 PM
But they save money, therefor, it's a brilliant move by the Spurs. But let Cuban do crap like that, and he gets called cheap and it's doom and gloom.

I agree with you, but the fact that Nazr Mohammed and Rasho Nesterovic won't be winning any MVP trophies any time soon will cause most people to see the two situations differently.

Drbio
07-19-2006, 04:20 PM
Jackie Vaugh? The Spurs would have done better with Jackie Christie.

Nash13
07-19-2006, 10:38 PM
I agree with you, but the fact that Nazr Mohammed and Rasho Nesterovic won't be winning any MVP trophies any time soon will cause most people to see the two situations differently.


How about the Finley and Daniels situations?

DelNegro
07-20-2006, 09:45 AM
How about the Finley and Daniels situations?

The Spurs have always operated with an eye on profits and payroll so I've long since accepted cost cutting moves as an unfortunate, but necessary, practice in the business that is the NBA. From that standpoint I've got no problems whatsoever with those decisions.

I'm just making the observation that this sense of fiscal consciousness is new to Mark Cuban and Mav fans used to seeing the "whatever it takes, cost is no issue" approach don't appear to be liking it too much.

Nash13
07-20-2006, 11:34 AM
The Spurs have always operated with an eye on profits and payroll so I've long since accepted cost cutting moves as an unfortunate, but necessary, practice in the business that is the NBA. From that standpoint I've got no problems whatsoever with those decisions.

I'm just making the observation that this sense of fiscal consciousness is new to Mark Cuban and Mav fans used to seeing the "whatever it takes, cost is no issue" approach don't appear to be liking it too much.


I understand you DelNegro.

It just annoys the heck out of me the tone of this board. It seems like for the last 2 offseasons, everything Cuban does seems to be wrong. But somehow, everything Houston and San Antonio does seems to be good. And the double standard of cuban cost cutting compared to other teams. I mean, besides the Antoine Walker trade, Cuban hasn't done anything bad as far as personnel goes to this organization.

capitalcity
07-20-2006, 12:09 PM
I understand you DelNegro.

It just annoys the heck out of me the tone of this board. It seems like for the last 2 offseasons, everything Cuban does seems to be wrong. But somehow, everything Houston and San Antonio does seems to be good. And the double standard of cuban cost cutting compared to other teams. I agree with your first sentiments - some people have an axe to grind with cuban over the dismantliing of the 2003 squad/percieved misstatements/so-called embarrassing PR situations, etc.

However the spurs and houston haven't wowed me with their moves for going on 2 years now. Anybody who points to their transactions as a cause for alarm has to be nuts. Rafer Alston, NVE - no sane person would think the mavs are making worse moves than their little brothers to the south.

The truth remains clear. Dallas is younger, deeper, and more talented than both the rockettes and the spurts. And while San Ant_ni_ still has an edge in experience, that didn't seem to help them much in a game seven on their homecourt.

MavKikiNYC
07-20-2006, 12:42 PM
some people have an axe to grind with cuban over the dismantliing of the 2003 squad

What really chafed my 'nads was that he let Wang Zhi Zhi walk for nothing.

George Gervin
07-20-2006, 02:36 PM
I agree with your first sentiments - some people have an axe to grind with cuban over the dismantliing of the 2003 squad/percieved misstatements/so-called embarrassing PR situations, etc.

However the spurs and houston haven't wowed me with their moves for going on 2 years now. Anybody who points to their transactions as a cause for alarm has to be nuts. Rafer Alston, NVE - no sane person would think the mavs are making worse moves than their little brothers to the south.

The truth remains clear. Dallas is younger, deeper, and more talented than both the rockettes and the spurts. And while San Ant_ni_ still has an edge in experience, that didn't seem to help them much in a game seven on their homecourt.


blah, blah, blah..Like Pop said after the series. He laughed at the notion that Dallas was supposed to be more athletic than the Spurs were.. He asked how much more athletic do we need to get 1 point , 2 points?.. And of course a team ALWAYS progresses from their previous season.. oh wait they don't automatically get better... The younger , deeper mavs are still a jump shooting team that was exposed in the Finals.. Pop stubborness caused the Spurs the series when he refused to play any zone defense... oh and you better hope that the Mavs can replicate the 85% shooting in 1st qtr and 68% for the first half in game 7.. I know, I know it's becuase they are younger and deeper.. Let's review the history of each franchise's ability to rebuild to compete for a championship............ let's see the Spurs have twice..and the mavs.... help me out here.. hey cap city how was that parade..?

MavsFanFinley
07-20-2006, 03:03 PM
While I'm not as threatened by the Spurs as years past I'm not going to dismiss them simply because they haven't gotten younger or more athletic (Butler being the exception). It's not like Dallas thumped them in convincing manner. And you have to question Pop's refusal to not play the centers at all. I still believe as long as Duncan, Ginobli, and Parker are healthy they're a threat still.

The latest reports have Denver leaning towards matching the offer for Elson and I guess we'll know by the end of the day. If true, it will be interesting to see who the Spurs target next.

Until the center situation is sovled will we see what they do with Oberto, Barry, Williams, and Udrih. They solved the 3rd pg with the signing of Vaughn (although I think he beats out Udrih if he's still in uniform at the start of the season). No one seems to be biting on Barry or Oberto. I still think Williams has value with that expiring contract but if they pair him with the other guys then they can't make the trade until August 21st.

Next month might be more telling of what the Spurs are doing or not instead of this day.

The lineup as it stands now:

??/Butler/Oberto
Duncan/Bonner/Horry
Bowen/Finley/Williams
Ginobli/Barry
Parker/Vaughn/Udrih

EricaLubarsky
07-20-2006, 03:31 PM
What really chafed my 'nads was that he let Wang Zhi Zhi walk for nothing.
That didnt bother me as much as letting him walk away to our direct competitor, Miami.

dude1394
07-20-2006, 05:06 PM
blah, blah, blah..

SCOREBOARD dimwit.

George Gervin
07-21-2006, 06:58 AM
Butler Splits for San Antonio, And the Knicks Look Stupid
By JOHN HOLLINGER
July 21, 2006

And now, my friends, I present you with the ultimate irony.

The Knicks, who for years have spent like drunken sailors to acquire even the most marginal prospects, are now in such a dire financial situation that they can't afford to keep a player who is both inexpensive and productive.

Yesterday, news leaked that the Knicks would not match San Antonio's three-year, $7 million offer sheet for center Jackie Butler. Reasoning that it was too much to pay for a third-string center, especially since the cost would double to $14 million after factoring in the luxury tax implications, New York decided to let the 6-foot-10-inch, 260-pounder head for Texas.

The Knicks are giving the outward impression of finally having had a moment of clarity and making a rational, grownup decision about how to spend their money. In reality, this was another enormous personnel blunder that, much like the Eddy Curry trade a year ago, could end up haunting the team for years.

Butler went undrafted and was nominally the Knicks' third-string center last season, which has prevented most observers from understanding just how good he is.When Larry Brown called him the Knicks' best center last season, a lot of people wondered if the coach had finally gone off the deep end. In reality, this may be the only sane thing Brown said or did all season.

Look at the numbers. Last season, the 20-year-old Butler the Knicks' youngest player shot 54.4% from the floor and had the team's second-best perminute rebound rate (David Lee was first).His 15.4 points per 40 minutes were well above average for a center, and notable in light of the high percentage he shot. Overall, his Player Efficiency Rating (my per-minute rating of a player's statistical production) of 14.67 was near the league average of 15.0 and ranked 22nd among the 62 centers who played at least 500 minutes last season.

That's not a fluke, either, based on what he did a year before in the CBA. Yes, it was the CBA, but Butler didn't just play well he dominated.At 19, he was easily the best player in that league, which was why since-departed scout Dell Demps recommended him to the Knicks in the first place. (Incidentally, Demps is now the Spurs' personnel director. For all the Larry-told-his-friend-Gregg-Popovich-to-sign-Butler theories floating around, this connection seems a far more obvious one.)

Butler's current production alone would make him worth much more than the pittance for which San Antonio stole him.In a league where mediocre centers like Sam Dalembert and Nene (and, um, Eddy Curry) are pulling down $60 million deals, Butler would be worth at least a team's midlevel exception just as other middling centers like Nazr Mohammed and Joel Pryzbilla received in recent days.

The big story, however, isn't what Butler is doing now, it's what he's likely to do in the future. Big men who demonstrate a knack for scoring at a young age almost never fail, and when they do it's usually due to such factors as conditioning or injuries.

To see what I mean, let me introduce you to a tool I've developed that ranks players according to how similar they are.I use a number of criterion height, age, and several barometers of statistical performance. According to this method, the five most similar players to Jackie Butler at the same age were Shawn Kemp, Eddy Curry, Jermaine O'Neal, Carlos Boozer, and Chris Webber.

Of that group, only Curry has failed to become a star, and he's been held back only by a lack of conditioning and a bad heart. So basically, the worst-case scenario is that Butler would become as good as the Knicks' current center and cost about a fifth as much.

Yet the Knicks wouldn't agree to pay him $7 million over three years, only slightly more than they'll be paying firstround mystery man Renaldo Balkman. That isn't prudence folks it's insanity.

Amusingly, the Knicks reportedly were shocked that Butler received such a "big" offer from San Antonio. That proves to me that the Knicks genuinely had no idea what they had in the youngster, because I was surprised he got such a small offer. I figured Butler would get close to the mid-level exception and would be limited to that only because of his restricted free agent status.

Even at that price, the Knicks would have ended up with a rare bargain amid a sea of salary excess. Instead, they'll spend close to $100 million on the contracts of two players Curry and Jerome James who will probably be less effective than Butler this year, and almost certainly will be three years from now. Curry at least has ability on his side, but he remains a question mark. James can't play at all, of course, and it's troubling that New York's brass actually had Butler behind him on the team's depth chart.

Butler, meanwhile, is likely to take another step forward in his development as a high quality low-post scorer. Yes, his conditioning is a concern, and he'll probably never make the All-Defense team, but as a 20-year-old he sure looked like the new and improved version of Curry armed with similar size and skill but a much better motor. His departure leaves one more gaping wound for whomever succeeds Isiah Thomas to heal. When the Knicks announced Isiah would be taking over as coach, I hoped that at the very least, the new responsibilities would distract him from inflicting further ruin upon the franchise as general manager. No such luck.

For San Antonio, it's just one more personnel coup. Yet again, the Spurs have nabbed a good young player for peanuts while other league executives have their fingers up their noses.

It's instructive to note that the Knicks and Spurs operate at opposite ends of the spending spectrum yet the team that spends less continually outfoxes the guys with the deep pockets. That, in a nutshell, is why the Spurs will again win twice as many games as the Knicks while spending half as much money.

DelNegro
07-21-2006, 08:34 AM
Good find. There have also been other articles floating around mentioning that Butler took less money to sign SA's offer sheet. Butler most likely won't make a huge impact next year, but the prospects for this guy down the road look pretty good.

ocelot_ark
07-21-2006, 11:17 AM
Is this a f'ing SA board? geez.

George Gervin
07-21-2006, 12:42 PM
Is this a f'ing SA board? geez.


Oh I'm sorry where do I post stuff about the NBA in general?

Drbio
07-21-2006, 12:54 PM
I know where you can stick your NBA general information.

DevinHarriswillstart
07-21-2006, 12:56 PM
The problem is Butler is too young to handle the pressure when it really counts. The Spurs need a vet center right now, not a project one. I mean if they only use Butler for 10 minutes, then sure its a steal. However, come playoff time, Butler isn't the type of guy who you are going to put in at crunch time.

Solid signing if you are going to give him a few years to develop. Makes no sense though if he is Nazr's replacement.

George Gervin
07-21-2006, 01:51 PM
I know where you can stick your NBA general information.


So are you the censor now? What exactly does "Around the NBA" forum cover? Pro-NBA Mav articles? All NBA information excluding the Spurs? Let me know because you offered nothing but an insult (which is par for the course) when I asked a question.

DevinHarriswillstart
07-21-2006, 02:03 PM
Either respond to what you wrote or go away man. Mavs fans don't like the Spurs. If you can't deal with the heat of a Mavs message board, then don't post here. I've posted on Spurs boards and got railed many times. Key is to stick to the topic. I responded civily to what you posted so either respond to that or go waste your time somewhere else.

EricaLubarsky
07-21-2006, 02:15 PM
I could swear there was a thread about the Spurs and Jackie Butler somewhere, not 4-5 posts down. It would have been respectful to the fans that are running the board to keep the discussion in one place, when no Mav fan is really all that interested in the first place. I guess the Spurs fans wanted to create their own little wasted space here.

George Gervin
07-21-2006, 02:45 PM
Either respond to what you wrote or go away man. Mavs fans don't like the Spurs. If you can't deal with the heat of a Mavs message board, then don't post here. I've posted on Spurs boards and got railed many times. Key is to stick to the topic. I responded civily to what you posted so either respond to that or go waste your time somewhere else.


So insulting people you don't agree with is ok on the board? Funny when I insult people I get warnings of being banned and sent private messages from moderators. I quoted the person I was referring to and not you so why are you insulted? Heat? No our servicemen in Iraq and Afghanistan feel the heat.. I don't sweat any of you

George Gervin
07-21-2006, 02:47 PM
I could swear there was a thread about the Spurs and Jackie Butler somewhere, not 4-5 posts down. It would have been respectful to the fans that are running the board to keep the discussion in one place, when no Mav fan is really all that interested in the first place. I guess the Spurs fans wanted to create their own little wasted space here.

I guess I was wrong assuming that Around the NBA included the Spurs..sorry Erica Miss America

EricaLubarsky
07-21-2006, 02:48 PM
I guess I was wrong assuming that Around the NBA included the Spurs..sorry Erica Miss America
well now you know and that is half the battle as they say.

Drbio
07-21-2006, 03:37 PM
So are you the censor now? What exactly does "Around the NBA" forum cover? Pro-NBA Mav articles? All NBA information excluding the Spurs? Let me know because you offered nothing but an insult (which is par for the course) when I asked a question.

I just think you are a dickhead to a lot of our members here. You are often a smart ass and you certainly have not earned the respect of anyone here. So with that in mind, go fark yourself spurts b*tch.

DevinHarriswillstart
07-21-2006, 05:32 PM
So insulting people you don't agree with is ok on the board? Funny when I insult people I get warnings of being banned and sent private messages from moderators. I quoted the person I was referring to and not you so why are you insulted? Heat? No our servicemen in Iraq and Afghanistan feel the heat.. I don't sweat any of you

LOL you're a joke.

chumdawg
07-21-2006, 05:55 PM
I don't know about the rest of you all, but I keep a pretty close eye on our division rivals from the shit-stained-river town down south. Especially when such a noted source as John Hollinger writes about one of their personnel moves, I want to read about it.

(I'd argue it's far more relevant to Mavs fans, if that's the protocol, than a thread on Steve Nash's hair.)

DevinHarriswillstart
07-21-2006, 06:23 PM
Well so far they've managed to sign Butler and Jacque Vaughn. Yawn. Not much to keep an eye on.

DelNegro
07-21-2006, 10:19 PM
Well so far they've managed to sign Butler and Jacque Vaughn. Yawn. Not much to keep an eye on.

Yeah I guess when your team lands Austin Croshere anything anyone else does is just going to pale in comparison.

The Crippler
07-21-2006, 10:23 PM
my aunt's name is Jackie. I don't respect any man with a chick's name.

jleefilled
07-21-2006, 10:52 PM
Yeah I guess when your team lands Austin Croshere anything anyone else does is just going to pale in comparison.

Don't forget Maurice Ager, the stud swingman out of Michigan State. Spurs' management sure hasn't.

MavsFanFinley
07-21-2006, 10:52 PM
Well so far they've managed to sign Butler and Jacque Vaughn. Yawn. Not much to keep an eye on.

They will also sign Francisco Elson after Denver declined to match the offer sheet. They haven't addressed the long small forward they talked about either. They listed 3 needs going into summer and they took care of 2 of them.

I don't buy the talk of Udrih getting a chance to backup Parker. Or the talk that they're happy with Williams for spot minutes.

They've been shopping Oberto, Barry, Udrih, the rights to Scola, and I imagine Williams. I'd be pretty surprised if we don't see a trade or two.

DelNegro
07-21-2006, 11:13 PM
Don't forget Maurice Ager, the stud swingman out of Michigan State. Spurs' management sure hasn't.

If Ager is playing, then someone out of the Terry/Harris/Howard/Stackhouse quartet isn't. Not worried about Ager at all.

Nash13
07-21-2006, 11:36 PM
They will also sign Francisco Elson after Denver declined to match the offer sheet. They haven't addressed the long small forward they talked about either. They listed 3 needs going into summer and they took care of 2 of them.

I don't buy the talk of Udrih getting a chance to backup Parker. Or the talk that they're happy with Williams for spot minutes.

They've been shopping Oberto, Barry, Udrih, the rights to Scola, and I imagine Williams. I'd be pretty surprised if we don't see a trade or two.


I'd be shocked if they got anything useful out of those names you mentioned.

MavsFanFinley
07-21-2006, 11:48 PM
I'd be shocked if they got anything useful out of those names you mentioned.

It doesn't have to be a big name to get the need met. Barry and Udrih have drawn interest but the asking price for Scola's rights were too high for teams. Oberto doesn't do a whole lot for me but who knows what some teams would grab. I think Williams $4 million expiring contact could help net them something. If not now then around the trading deadline.

They still have the LLE available.

DevinHarriswillstart
07-22-2006, 08:15 AM
If Ager is playing, then someone out of the Terry/Harris/Howard/Stackhouse quartet isn't. Not worried about Ager at all.

Not worried about Vaughn, Butler or Elson.....at all. Offering to both Elson and Butler just proves that its gonna be a center by committee.

DelNegro
07-22-2006, 11:01 AM
Not worried about Vaughn, Butler or Elson.....at all.

Nor would I expect you to be. The Spurs and Mavs are having the identical offseason. Both teams are making moves that make the accountants a lot happier than the fans. Niether team has done anything to get better. Not that it really matters though because both teams are still really, really good and Maurice Ager, Francisco Elson, Austin Croshere and Jacque Vaughn weren't ever going to be deciding a Spurs-Mavs playoff series to begin with.

Offering to both Elson and Butler just proves that its gonna be a center by committee.

Status quo. Been that way since David Robinson retired.

MavKikiNYC
07-22-2006, 12:11 PM
Not worried about Vaughn, Butler or Elson.....at all. Offering to both Elson and Butler just proves that its gonna be a center by committee.

Much like Diop and Damp?

George Gervin
07-24-2006, 09:23 AM
I just think you are a dickhead to a lot of our members here. You are often a smart ass and you certainly have not earned the respect of anyone here. So with that in mind, go fark yourself spurts b*tch.


Well I can also mention your a dickhead to anyone who does not believe the mavs are the best NBA franchise in history so your a hypocrite( for which I already knew). Earning respect here? I don't need your respect because people who throw that word around lightly, such as you, usually struggle to get it in everyday life. Please refer to me as a 3 time NBA champ spurts b*tch and I will refer to you as the 0 time NBA champ pony b*tch.. oh Lord now I'm going to be banned for repeating exactly what the smart guy said.. by the way moron I simply posted the story and responded to someone who question why a spurs story was on this forum. (Why do I feel you are pouring over the history of this topic to see if I am lying but when you realize I am not then you will follow with some more personal insults) And the peanut gallery chimed in..

DevinHarriswillstart
07-24-2006, 09:30 AM
I lesser man's Diop and Damp. Butler and Elson do not equal Diop and Damp. Diop and Damp combined give us Ben Wallace type numbers at the center spot.

George Gervin
07-24-2006, 09:36 AM
I lesser man's Diop and Damp. Butler and Elson do not equal Diop and Damp. Diop and Damp combined give us Ben Wallace type numbers at the center spot.


what are ben wallace type numbers? I imagine that Elson/Butler/Oberta combined could give the Spurs numbers similar to Damp/Diop.

Drbio
07-24-2006, 09:45 AM
I see the spurts bitch (Gervinfag) who needs validation from Mavericks (true fans) has come back for more. Pathetic bitch. Spursreport is for asshats like you. Feel free to frequent and clutter their board asshole.

George Gervin
07-24-2006, 09:47 AM
I see the spurts bitch (Gervinfag) who needs validation from Mavericks (true fans) has come back for more. Pathetic bitch. Spursreport is for asshats like you. Feel free to frequent and clutter their board asshole.


so predictable... name calling personal insults... when one is relegated to these you can assume which side they fall on when dealing with an issue...

Drbio
07-24-2006, 09:57 AM
So predictable...hanging off the nuts of a spurs team because you have accomplished nothing. Also, needing to be validated by Mavs fans is pretty bad for a spurts fan. Of course, I have yet to meet a spurts fan worth a damn anyways.

As for issues...you have plenty. Try psychopath.org for help.

DevinHarriswillstart
07-24-2006, 09:58 AM
Speaking of falling, Ginobili's stock after that poorous foul.

capitalcity
07-24-2006, 10:10 AM
when dealing with an issue...The issue being you.

Asshole.

George Gervin
07-24-2006, 10:13 AM
Speaking of falling, Ginobili's stock after that poorous foul.


uh he has a gold medal and 2 championship rings.. he has accomplished more than the Maverick franchise has.. so I will stick with his stock.. speaking of falling how did that parade go down?

Drbio
07-24-2006, 10:15 AM
The spurts asshat troll is back.

George Gervin
07-24-2006, 10:16 AM
So predictable...hanging off the nuts of a spurs team because you have accomplished nothing. Also, needing to be validated by Mavs fans is pretty bad for a spurts fan. Of course, I have yet to meet a spurts fan worth a damn anyways.

As for issues...you have plenty. Try psychopath.org for help.


oh ok doc now you are the judge of whether a person has accomplished anything in their life... now i hang of the nuts of the spurs team..no need to do that doc i live a pretty good life and it so happens that my team is in the midst of winning 4 championships in 10 yrs.. they may never win again but i can always pass along to my son how fun it was when they did win.. he has go spurs go down pat!

Drbio
07-24-2006, 10:17 AM
More asshat less intelligence. *sigh*

George Gervin
07-24-2006, 10:17 AM
The spurts asshat troll is back.


for self proclaimed smart guy your vocabulary is rather limited..

Drbio
07-24-2006, 10:18 AM
*sigh* More asshat spurts troll.

George Gervin
07-24-2006, 10:19 AM
*sigh* More asshat spurts troll.


that's ok all you have left is insults and we all know what that means..

capitalcity
07-24-2006, 10:21 AM
that's ok all you have left is insults and we all know what that means..It means you're getting railroaded outta here.

Douchebag.

George Gervin
07-24-2006, 10:27 AM
It means you're getting railroaded outta here.

Douchebag.


what will i do...

DevinHarriswillstart
07-24-2006, 10:27 AM
that's ok all you have left is insults and we all know what that means..

That you have no good come backs.

Drbio
07-24-2006, 10:31 AM
what will i do...

Die hopefully.

George Gervin
07-24-2006, 10:44 AM
Die hopefully.


you must be one of those pro-life conservative christians.

DevinHarriswillstart
07-24-2006, 10:47 AM
what will i do...

Obviously spend too much time on Mavs message boards. I mean we may spend a lot of time posting here, but how lame is it to spend your time posting on your opposing team's forums? No life. You're like a little circus monkey, where all of the children laugh and throw small rotten pieces of kiwi at out of pity.

George Gervin
07-24-2006, 10:51 AM
Obviously spend too much time on Mavs message boards. I mean we may spend a lot of time posting here, but how lame is it to spend your time posting on your opposing team's forums? No life. You're like a little circus monkey, where all of the children laugh and throw small rotten pieces of kiwi at out of pity.


unlike many of you i am not adverse to opposing opinions or view points. i enjoy reading many things including opposing team's message boars however i am not kool aid drinker like alot of you are.

by the way do you picture me with that cute little red vest on?

capitalcity
07-24-2006, 11:00 AM
picture me
http://static.flickr.com/73/158432557_32ff62e6a2_m.jpg
"I pleasure men." - George Gervin

DevinHarriswillstart
07-24-2006, 12:08 PM
Unlike many of you, I prefer Grey Poupon to that French's garbage. Tisk tisk. -Gervin

sike
07-24-2006, 12:42 PM
I feel sorry for the real George Gervin...

Drbio
07-24-2006, 12:43 PM
Unlike many of you, I prefer Grey Poupon to that French's garbage. Tisk tisk. -Gervin

Genius.



OMG Cap that was great. I tried a rep hit but I have to pass some around. Greatness.

George Gervin
07-24-2006, 12:46 PM
yawn.... name calling stopped yet?

Ray (San Antonio, TX): Give me a Spurs question Marc, please! No Scola, Oberto not looking great, no real offensive pickups in the offseason! What are my Spurs doing? It looks like Dallas and Pheonix are moving forward and the Spurs are running in place. Any chance we can convince Duncan to play the 5 and pick up another strong 4 (or bring Scola in)? They don't look like an elite team to me next year with this bench.

Marc Stein: (1:42 PM ET ) What? I thought the Spurs had a quietly HUGE week last week. I'd much rather have Elson and Butler splitting $5 mil than Mohammed. I'm betting on the Spurs to make a player out of one of them at the least.

capitalcity
07-24-2006, 01:19 PM
yawn.... name calling stopped yet?

Ray (San Antonio, TX): Give me a Spurs question Marc, please! No Scola, Oberto not looking great, no real offensive pickups in the offseason! What are my Spurs doing? It looks like Dallas and Pheonix are moving forward and the Spurs are running in place. Any chance we can convince Duncan to play the 5 and pick up another strong 4 (or bring Scola in)? They don't look like an elite team to me next year with this bench.

Marc Stein: (1:42 PM ET ) What? I thought the Spurs had a quietly HUGE week last week. I'd much rather have Elson and Butler splitting $5 mil than Mohammed. I'm betting on the Spurs to make a player out of one of them at the least.Link (http://www.spursreport.com/forums/showthread.php?t=58882)

chumdawg
07-24-2006, 02:19 PM
I thought you guys really got off on Spurs fans coming here. Well, as long they are patting you on the back head and saying "It's gonna be okay, and by the way, I really like you"...a la Big Shot Rob.

Drbio
07-24-2006, 03:55 PM
There are no acceptable spurts fans. They all suck ass. Unfortunately, George Gervin just REALLY likes the taste of ass so much he steps up his trollish game. It is funny that he comes to a Mavs site for validation though. Probably because his own kind hate him too.

DevinHarriswillstart
07-24-2006, 04:08 PM
How sad. So unlikable that even the rotten riverwalk folk don't like him. I've posted on ESPN boards for years and this one for a few. Any other fan that is "self-righteous" in their acts are just trolls trying to "sophisticatingly" try and rub it in. Seen it a million times. Gervs is no different.

MavsFanFinley
07-24-2006, 04:23 PM
Enough name calling. Are we adults or not?

If you don't want to talk anything Spurs then don't contribute to this thread or any like it. We don't pull this crap in other team threads.

nashtymavsfan13
07-24-2006, 05:34 PM
There are no acceptable spurts fans. They all suck ass.

Word!

capitalcity
07-24-2006, 06:23 PM
I'm glad you've taken the high road MFF... Unfortunately, George continues to divert threads into the gutter so he can talk about man ass.

Back on topic... San Ant_ni_ is losing the offseason like they lost the state championship.

MavsFanFinley
07-24-2006, 11:08 PM
I haven't taken the high road but it's damn annoying when half the thread is filled with your an ass, no your an ass, no I said your an ass first. You die, no you die, I said you die first.

If a mod hasn't found something bring it to our attention instead of stooping to his/her level and then say he started it first when we say cool it.

TVI
07-27-2006, 12:41 AM
Well so far they've managed to sign Butler and Jacque Vaughn. Yawn. Not much to keep an eye on. I understand that some people look at Jackie as a CBA scrub but I don't see it that way. He was a McDonald's HS All-American and Mississippi's Mr. Basketball twice.

I think his mistake was trying to enter the 2004 NBA draft straight out of high school. He went undrafted. However, he only had to spend half a year in the CBA (where he dominated, averaging 18.1 ppg, 10.7 rpg, and 1.45 bpg). The Knicks picked him up in Feb 2005, but Butler wasn't ever going to get a lot of playing time since Isiah committed to building the team around Curry. Also, after Zeke gave Jerome James that ridiculous contract, he'd look really foolish if he allowed him to sit the bench. With the center minutes going to Curry and James, their simply weren't many minutes for Butler, but he produced when he was in the game.

Time will tell, but this could turn out to be another coup. He's got a good BB IQ, solid moves around the basket, shoots a high percentage. There is a chance Larry Brown knew something when he remarked at times that Butler was their best center.

Tokey41
07-27-2006, 01:22 AM
Butler has the potential to be an upgrade over Rasho and Nazr but thats not saying much. And if he doesnt produce what the hell are they going to do? Give up and die? If Duncan has a season like he did last year and Parker becomes their go to guy they might as well. We are going to crush them in years to come anyway, get used to it.

DevinHarriswillstart
07-27-2006, 10:29 AM
I understand that some people look at Jackie as a CBA scrub but I don't see it that way. He was a McDonald's HS All-American and Mississippi's Mr. Basketball twice.

I think his mistake was trying to enter the 2004 NBA draft straight out of high school. He went undrafted. However, he only had to spend half a year in the CBA (where he dominated, averaging 18.1 ppg, 10.7 rpg, and 1.45 bpg). The Knicks picked him up in Feb 2005, but Butler wasn't ever going to get a lot of playing time since Isiah committed to building the team around Curry. Also, after Zeke gave Jerome James that ridiculous contract, he'd look really foolish if he allowed him to sit the bench. With the center minutes going to Curry and James, their simply weren't many minutes for Butler, but he produced when he was in the game.

Time will tell, but this could turn out to be another coup. He's got a good BB IQ, solid moves around the basket, shoots a high percentage. There is a chance Larry Brown knew something when he remarked at times that Butler was their best center.

Yeah....not convincing. Playing well on the Knicks is lookin like Kobe on a D 3 team. Yawn. You mean ridiculous contract like the one you gave Rasho?

DelNegro
07-27-2006, 10:41 AM
Butler has the potential to be an upgrade over Rasho and Nazr but thats not saying much. And if he doesnt produce what the hell are they going to do? Give up and die? If Duncan has a season like he did last year and Parker becomes their go to guy they might as well. We are going to crush them in years to come anyway, get used to it.

You did watch the conference semi's right? It's impossible for Elson and Butler to do any less that Rasho and Nazr did. As for crushing the Spurs in years to come, we'll see. It was a coin flip series last year and neither team has made any offseason move yet to clearly distinguish themselves from the other.

DelNegro
07-27-2006, 10:46 AM
Yeah....not convincing. Playing well on the Knicks is lookin like Kobe on a D 3 team. Yawn.

The Hawks haven't been much better than the knicks these past few years yet Jason Terry seems to have shown he can be just as productive on a better team.

You mean ridiculous contract like the one you gave Rasho?

You mean the ridiculous contract we got rid of in Rasho, or the uber-ridiculous one you guys gave Dampier which you won't be able to get rid of?

dirno2000
07-27-2006, 10:58 AM
You did watch the conference semi's right? It's impossible for Elson and Butler to do any less that Rasho and Nazr did. As for crushing the Spurs in years to come, we'll see. It was a coin flip series last year and neither team has made any offseason move yet to clearly distinguish themselves from the other.

I think this is where a lot of Spurs fans aren't looking at the big picture. The prevailing sentiment seems to be that since Pop didn't use his centers in the Dallas series, they were useless. The fact is, you have to play 82 games before you get to the playoffs. The Spurs won 63 of them, and weather or not their fans want to admit it, Nazr and Rasho helped.

Rasho was kind of stiff but he was a good post defender and his ability to hit the spot up jump shot kept his defender from sagging on Duncan too much. And while not consistent, Nazr was capable of putting together good stretches.

Of course the X-factor in all this is Jackie Butler. Everybody (spurs fans included) laughed at us when we signed Diop last summer. Turns out that was a tremendous asset. Butler is similar in that he's a high school kid that came out too early. He could be a good player. Just from looking at him, he may also have the potential to eat himself out of the league.

DelNegro
07-27-2006, 11:42 AM
I think this is where a lot of Spurs fans aren't looking at the big picture. The prevailing sentiment seems to be that since Pop didn't use his centers in the Dallas series, they were useless. The fact is, you have to play 82 games before you get to the playoffs. The Spurs won 63 of them, and weather or not their fans want to admit it, Nazr and Rasho helped.

Rasho was kind of stiff but he was a good post defender and his ability to hit the spot up jump shot kept his defender from sagging on Duncan too much. And while not consistent, Nazr was capable of putting together good stretches.

Of course the X-factor in all this is Jackie Butler. Everybody (spurs fans included) laughed at us when we signed Diop last summer. Turns out that was a tremendous asset. Butler is similar in that he's a high school kid that came out too early. He could be a good player. Just from looking at him, he may also have the potential to eat himself out of the league.

You raise good points, but to teams trying to win championships the regular season doesn't really matter. It's about who you're going to have to beat in the postseason and how you match up with them. The Spurs aren't trying to win 63 games next year, they're trying to figure out how they're going to beat you guys. The Spurs are going to make the playoffs regardless what Elson and Butler do or don't do compared to Rasho & Nazr. From the Spurs standpoint it's 82 games just to decide where game 7 gets played and as you guys proved last year home court doesn't guarantee anything.

The Spurs teams of the last several years were built to match up with the Shaq-Kobe lakers. They went out and got Bruce Bowen to guard Kobe and signed Rasho and Nazr to bang with Shaq. Everything the Spurs did was about matching up with the lakers. In the mean time the Mavs have been building a team to beat the Spurs and they finally pulled it off by composing a team of Dirk who's probably the most unique mismatch in the game today and a bunch of perimeter guys who can slash and shoot from the outside.

The Spurs now have to find a way to adjust and they way they've chosen to do that was to swap out the plodders Nazr and Rasho for guys in Elson and Butler who can run the floor better and actually have a shot at playing in the up tempo game.

Does swapping Rasho & Nazr for Elson & Butler mean the Spurs will win as many games as they did last year? I doubt it. You guys are actually my pick to win the SW division next year. But I think that Elson and Butler give us a better shot at beating the Mavs than Rasho and Nazr did and that's what I care about. Will it play out that way? Until the games are actually played we won't know.

V2M
07-27-2006, 12:15 PM
You raise good points, but to teams trying to win championships the regular season doesn't really matter. It's about who you're going to have to beat in the postseason and how you match up with them. The Spurs aren't trying to win 63 games next year, they're trying to figure out how they're going to beat you guys. The Spurs are going to make the playoffs regardless what Elson and Butler do or don't do compared to Rasho & Nazr. From the Spurs standpoint it's 82 games just to decide where game 7 gets played and as you guys proved last year home court doesn't guarantee anything.

The Spurs teams of the last several years were built to match up with the Shaq-Kobe lakers. They went out and got Bruce Bowen to guard Kobe and signed Rasho and Nazr to bang with Shaq. Everything the Spurs did was about matching up with the lakers. In the mean time the Mavs have been building a team to beat the Spurs and they finally pulled it off by composing a team of Dirk who's probably the most unique mismatch in the game today and a bunch of perimeter guys who can slash and shoot from the outside.

The Spurs now have to find a way to adjust and they way they've chosen to do that was to swap out the plodders Nazr and Rasho for guys in Elson and Butler who can run the floor better and actually have a shot at playing in the up tempo game.

Does swapping Rasho & Nazr for Elson & Butler mean the Spurs will win as many games as they did last year? I doubt it. You guys are actually my pick to win the SW division next year. But I think that Elson and Butler give us a better shot at beating the Mavs than Rasho and Nazr did and that's what I care about. Will it play out that way? Until the games are actually played we won't know.


Nice post. I agree with you that the Spurs, Mavs and I'll add Suns too to that list, in the West... are just thinking more of how to match up against the other two than merely worrying about an 82 game regular season.

Of course, for us Mavs, an extra worry is how do we handle the deadly duo... D Wade & D Refs?! ;)

dalmations202
07-27-2006, 03:00 PM
You raise good points, but to teams trying to win championships the regular season doesn't really matter. It's about who you're going to have to beat in the postseason and how you match up with them. The Spurs aren't trying to win 63 games next year, they're trying to figure out how they're going to beat you guys. The Spurs are going to make the playoffs regardless what Elson and Butler do or don't do compared to Rasho & Nazr. From the Spurs standpoint it's 82 games just to decide where game 7 gets played and as you guys proved last year home court doesn't guarantee anything.

The Spurs teams of the last several years were built to match up with the Shaq-Kobe lakers. They went out and got Bruce Bowen to guard Kobe and signed Rasho and Nazr to bang with Shaq. Everything the Spurs did was about matching up with the lakers. In the mean time the Mavs have been building a team to beat the Spurs and they finally pulled it off by composing a team of Dirk who's probably the most unique mismatch in the game today and a bunch of perimeter guys who can slash and shoot from the outside.

The Spurs now have to find a way to adjust and they way they've chosen to do that was to swap out the plodders Nazr and Rasho for guys in Elson and Butler who can run the floor better and actually have a shot at playing in the up tempo game.

Does swapping Rasho & Nazr for Elson & Butler mean the Spurs will win as many games as they did last year? I doubt it. You guys are actually my pick to win the SW division next year. But I think that Elson and Butler give us a better shot at beating the Mavs than Rasho and Nazr did and that's what I care about. Will it play out that way? Until the games are actually played we won't know.


This is dead on, and well written.

The Spurs realized that the tempo and rules are pushing tempo. No longer is the banging type center going to win it all. Shaq is done, and the league gave him his parting gift. Now the Suns, Mavs, etc are going to rule the league for a few years -- better marketability. The Spurs aren't worried about scoring, TD will get his, and they have Parker and Ginobili. The Spurs are worried about defending a faster paced game.

Wouldn't surprise me if they come up with an athletic PF that can shoot, and move TD to the C position -- and once again become the team to beat in the conference.

DevinHarriswillstart
07-27-2006, 04:30 PM
The Hawks haven't been much better than the knicks these past few years yet Jason Terry seems to have shown he can be just as productive on a better team.



You mean the ridiculous contract we got rid of in Rasho, or the uber-ridiculous one you guys gave Dampier which you won't be able to get rid of?


The difference is Dampier can actually be effective, like against Shaq in the finals. Rasho just gave us his best "what am I doing here" look everytime on the bench where he was nicely utilized.

Also, comparing Butler to Terry just shows you obviously don't watch much basketball. Terry was a 15/5 automatic for years. Butler had a few good games for crying out loud.

DelNegro
07-27-2006, 09:02 PM
The difference is Dampier can actually be effective, like against Shaq in the finals. Rasho just gave us his best "what am I doing here" look everytime on the bench where he was nicely utilized.

Rasho was effective against shaq. That's why the Spurs got him in the first place. Plus the Shaq Rasho was facing was a hell of alot better than the Shaq Dampier faced. Shaq is gone, Rasho can't help much versus the Mavs, thus the need to keep Rasho around is no longer there.

Also, comparing Butler to Terry just shows you obviously don't watch much basketball. Terry was a 15/5 automatic for years. Butler had a few good games for crying out loud.

You missed the point. The point was that just because someone plays on a crappy team doesn't mean you can automatically reduce the production you can expect from them once they get on a good team. Terry's numbers didn't dip when he went to a good team. Therefore there's nothing that says that Butler's numbers have to dip when he joins the Spurs.

nashtymavsfan13
07-27-2006, 11:07 PM
You missed the point. The point was that just because someone plays on a crappy team doesn't mean you can automatically reduce the production you can expect from them once they get on a good team. Terry's numbers didn't dip when he went to a good team. Therefore there's nothing that says that Butler's numbers have to dip when he joins the Spurs.

Butler's numbers won't dip because he doesn't really even have numbers. He's a decent signing and the Spurs are hoping he'll end up kind of like Diop ended up for us, but comparing him to Terry when Terry started and put up good numbers while Butler was a 3rd string center who didn't really get the chance to put up numbers is incorrect.

Tokey41
07-27-2006, 11:43 PM
I wouldnt want to touch anything from the Knicks... but the Spurs really needed to find something to replace their bigs and he seems like the best choice. As for finding out how to beat the Mavs... thats excellent. I know we have been trying to do the same to you for years as well. I dont think Butler will be better for the 82 long run against other teams like someone mentioned but it will help you contend in the playoffs for sure (might hurt your positioning) against us and Phoenix because lets be honest... who else do you have to figure out how to beat? The Grizz, Clippers, Kings, etc. they are all above average teams but they are no where near the elite like the Spurs, Mavs, and Suns who are easily the best three teams in the league right now.

That said this could REALLY blow up in your face when you have no reliable 5 and need Duncan to fill in (so who will fill in for Duncan now?), we got lucky with Diop... even we were suprised.

DevinHarriswillstart
07-28-2006, 12:52 PM
Hey, I fully admit Diop was a yawn of a signing until it turned out he was pretty decent. If Butler pans out, shitty for us, wonderful for you. Until then, your offseason concerns me not. Neither does your team.