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View Full Version : Report: NBA considering penalizing players for flops


Darke
01-25-2007, 05:04 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2742835

Hopefully soon.

RePLAY
01-25-2007, 05:11 PM
What will Raja Bell do?!??!?!

TheBlueVan
01-25-2007, 05:23 PM
nothing will come of this

Drbio
01-25-2007, 05:26 PM
Raja, Manu and Bowen will be out of the league in a year if it happens.

fluid.forty.one
01-25-2007, 05:27 PM
Wow

DevinHarriswillstart
01-25-2007, 05:30 PM
SOmething more to control the game.....I'm against everything that gives more for the refs to do to stop the game. This is like cracking down on technicals. The refs now get to use their own discretion on who is flopping and in what way. Taking a charge is essentially a flop....I'm certain Harris acts on some of those. I'm sorry, this is just plain stupid. Players that flop a lot get reputations for it. Leave it at that.

mffl03
01-25-2007, 05:43 PM
I'm more for handing out a Technical for the next game. Of course the game would have to be reviewed over tape in order to assure flopping. And there would have to be substantial evidence.

I think a suspension is too harsh....I would love a Foul or T to carry over though.

Usually Lurkin
01-25-2007, 05:50 PM
If they could review tape and give DWayde a tech for every freethrow he shoots when noone touches him, that'd be great.

They could count up points for "flagrant flopping" across the season that result in suspensions, fines, removal of endorsments, and tarring, feathering, and spitting upon by fans.

V2M
01-25-2007, 05:50 PM
I think a T for the most obvious flops would be nice! It brings a lil' more credibility to the game. While what Manu's flops are borderline cheating... Wade's are just too blatant!

DarenG
01-25-2007, 06:32 PM
This would be incredibly stupid and extemely bad for the NBA. First off doesn't the NBA already have enough rules that are so subjective that they are never called consistantly from game to game? Wow. Go ahead NBA put in another rule that your Refs will never be able to call on a consistant basis.

antoinewalker
01-25-2007, 06:44 PM
if they penalize flops, manu ginobili and devin harris are going to be in big trouble.

Tokey41
01-25-2007, 06:45 PM
I'm still in favor of something similar to NFL's challenges when it comes to teams wanting to review a foul. If it's clear the refs made a bad call then teams should be able to protest, I think it would cut down the T's as well.

HexNBA
01-25-2007, 06:58 PM
This will never happen

chumdawg
01-25-2007, 07:01 PM
This would be incredibly stupid and extemely bad for the NBA. First off doesn't the NBA already have enough rules that are so subjective that they are never called consistantly from game to game? Wow. Go ahead NBA put in another rule that your Refs will never be able to call on a consistant basis.I think flopping is incredibly stupid and bad for the NBA.

If we want to keep from increasing the number of subjective rules, then let's go with the flopping and scrap the hanging on the rim bit. I don't really care if a guy showboats by hanging on the rim. I do care, however, when a guy tries to manipulate the referees as his preferred method of "defense."

mavs413
01-25-2007, 07:03 PM
I would like to see offensive fouls called when the ballcarrier clearly throws himself into the defender while they are standing straight up and down with hands in the air (why is it only a charge if the defender's arms are down by their side?)
The players I see do this the most are Arenas and Wade.

Also when the offensive player deliberately swerves in front of a defender and cuts them off on a fast break or drive to the lane. It is often called as a foul on the defender when they also had no control over the contact that was made. The players I see do this the most are Nash and Parker

MavKikiNYC
01-25-2007, 09:43 PM
Stu Jackson just keeps outdoing himself. This is one of the stupidest ideas I've ever heard.

The people they should be penalizing are the g*d-d*mned referees who are too stupid to tell the difference.

Fine the officials for miscalling flops and see how quickly the problem clears up.

MavsX
01-25-2007, 09:51 PM
if they penalize flops, manu ginobili and devin harris are going to be in big trouble.

i thought i told you to go clean your room.

chumdawg
01-25-2007, 09:54 PM
Stu Jackson just keeps outdoing himself. This is one of the stupidest ideas I've ever heard.

The people they should be penalizing are the g*d-d*mned referees who are too stupid to tell the difference.

Fine the officials for miscalling flops and see how quickly the problem clears up.What disincentive would you propose for players who are inclined to flop?

Or do you feel that they generally don't, and it's not a problem?

Or do you feel that they generally do, yet it's not a problem?

Dirkadirkastan
01-25-2007, 10:39 PM
Stu Jackson just keeps outdoing himself. This is one of the stupidest ideas I've ever heard.

The people they should be penalizing are the g*d-d*mned referees who are too stupid to tell the difference.

Fine the officials for miscalling flops and see how quickly the problem clears up.

I like this idea.

You won't be directly penalized for flopping, but you'll get a T if you make a scene after not getting the call.

Nash13
01-25-2007, 10:47 PM
I'm actually going to back Chum on this one. Flopping is awful for the NBA, especially in the playoff games where an important game is determined by a person wrecklessly throwing their body around. I think the front office should look at games after they're over and give fines or that point system they have for Techs/Flags.

This would actually be a very good thing for the Mavs. Mav players (except maybe Harris) generally don't flop. You could name at least two people on the Suns/Spurs who do it night in night out.

MavKikiNYC
01-25-2007, 11:27 PM
It's a spineless cop-out to consider penalizing players for mistakes made by the referees. Should they also consider fining players for uncalled palming violations? For uncalled travelling violations? For missed goaltending calls? Should shooters be fined/suspended for attempting to draw contact?

Players only flop (or palm, or travel, or goaltend) if it works. Players who flop do so because it works with lazy, inattentive officials--they see movement, they respond with a quick call, oftimes an incorrect one. They make a call not based on actual contact, but based on movement.

Train/condition referees to recognize and distinguish actual contact from extraneous movment.

The disincentive to the flopping players would be that:

1) flopping often puts the player out of position and thus at a disadvantage;

2) uncalled flops would make the defender more likely to draw a foul as he tried to recover;

3) players who flopped would lose credibility with referees, if referees were being financially penalized for missed calls. and having their mistakes pointed out to them in post-game review.

As an aside, far worse for the NBA than the micro-issue of flopping, is the tendency toward too many foul calls. The sport would be better served by conditioning referrees to be extremely conservative with foul calls. Unfortunately, the NBA spectacle is better served by manipulating the game to the advantage of shooters and scorers.

By the way, a couple of years ago, Dirk was not above flopping and flailing to try to draw attention to the defensive contact he was getting. The pussified rules changes have worked to his advantage so that he doesn't have to do nearly as much of this anymore.

chumdawg
01-25-2007, 11:46 PM
The trouble is that if a guy wants to flop, he is already facing all of the disincentives you mention. And evidently some guys are doing it well.

What it amounts to is that these days it is a neutral-win situation for a guy who wants to flop. The proposed rule change would make it a lose-win proposition, which is advantageous in my opinion.

I think you will agree that if players are penalized for flopping, however often, that will be some disincentive for them to flop. And I hope you would agree that flopping is bad for the game.

To me it seems like a win-win situation for the referees. At worse, they are exactly where they stand now. At best, they have a tool to try to prevent players from doing something that shouldn't be part of the game.

mqywaaah
01-26-2007, 03:24 AM
DivaWade would have some special treatment of some sort. This rule, if ever they make it happen, would be useless against him. Seeing how hes above the law and all that.

Dirkadirkastan
01-26-2007, 04:19 AM
DivaWade would have some special treatment of some sort. This rule, if ever they make it happen, would be useless against him. Seeing how hes above the law and all that.

There will be rewarded flops, and false flop accusations. Basically it'll be a mess. But macky hit the nail on the head right here.

Case closed.

Triple T's
01-26-2007, 08:09 AM
what they should do is just leave it up to the refs to decide whether its a flop or not. Since a flop puts the defender at a disadvantage, give the official the right to make a non call on it. thats all. No techs, no penaties. An easier shot for the defender is a better punishment. I wouldnt say all flopping is bad because it calls to the attention of the ref something they may not otherwise see. its like tattle telling for grownups...

TexasSportsFan4
01-26-2007, 08:22 AM
I'd agree with getting T'd up if you flop and then make a big scene for not getting the call.

DevinHarriswillstart
01-26-2007, 09:06 AM
I think flopping is incredibly stupid and bad for the NBA.

If we want to keep from increasing the number of subjective rules, then let's go with the flopping and scrap the hanging on the rim bit. I don't really care if a guy showboats by hanging on the rim. I do care, however, when a guy tries to manipulate the referees as his preferred method of "defense."

And you think this will stop the manipulation of refs? hahahaha

scorched03
01-26-2007, 09:35 AM
if this rule doesnt include/affect dwade i'm pissed. does it have to be DEFENSIVE flop? or offensive stupid failing flops witnessed in the finals?

here's my previous rant and looks like they finally listened!:
"Refs are inconsistent in the NBA.

My solution: Anti Foul Rule. If said player is retarded and thinks he is an actor rather than a world class athlete, other team gets a free throw and the ball. This is verified by the crowd on instant reply to show how big of a loser the player is by holding flop scorecards of 1 to 10.

Then: No blood no foul. This only takes effect in final 2 minutes of every game and officials must leave the court. Players play on, but stop only when blood is drawn by opponent which eliminates worthless potential game changing calls in final 2 minutes. Penalty for official remaining in the game is to eat his/her whistle and tar and feather himself. Exception: Ejection for touching another man's jewels ala Reggie Evans as this violates every Man Law possible (althought that Brokeback looking cowboy might not agree)

Then: ESPN live poll on refs phrased as "Is this _________'s last game as a Ref?"
---------------------
Anti Foul Rule and no blood no foul can be taken into football and soccer also to eliminate refs ejecting players randomly, or other game changing calls in moments such as the Super Bowl or World Cup."

Dtownsfinest
01-26-2007, 11:18 PM
Stupid idea. I don't know if people realize but there are Mavs players who flop. Every team in the NBA will be hurt by this. If the flop has contact it deserves to be called. But if there is some way to penalize the players who don't even get contact but fall to the ground like they were shot in the head by a sawed off then I have no problem with that.

The Crippler
01-27-2007, 09:56 AM
this might be the single dumbest thing I've seen discussed by the NBA this season...

George Gervin
01-27-2007, 10:07 AM
Raja, Manu and Bowen will be out of the league in a year if it happens.


don't forget devin harris..he may be out in 6 months

dude1394
01-27-2007, 10:48 AM
don't forget devin harris..he may be out in 6 months

What a tool you are. Devin might flop while trying to draw a charge, but you don't see him flopping all over the place ala ginobbli when he's breathed on.

Go back to spurtstalk and commiserate with the peasants.

Murphy3
01-27-2007, 12:21 PM
This is a good idea..penalizing those for flopping. However, whether or not it can truly work has to be based upon the penalty for the flop. Perhaps when you pick up your 5th, 8th, or 10th..whatever, at some point, you face a suspension.

WurzburgBorn
01-27-2007, 01:12 PM
here's an idea:

regular flop yields 1 free throw for opposing team
D-wade flop yields 2 free throws for opposing team

MavKikiNYC
01-27-2007, 01:31 PM
Think about how inconsistently flagrant foul penatlies are called/imposed--

Implementing a formal system of penalties for "flopping" (whatever that means) would be that fiasco, cubed, on meth.

Flopping is an officiating problem, not a player problem.

Should be addressed at the proper level.

WurzburgBorn
01-27-2007, 01:43 PM
Manu to Pops, "But coach, I can't turn off that part of my brain anymore."

dude1394
01-27-2007, 02:19 PM
Think about how inconsistently flagrant foul penatlies are called/imposed--

Implementing a formal system of penalties for "flopping" (whatever that means) would be that fiasco, cubed, on meth.

Flopping is an officiating problem, not a player problem.

Should be addressed at the proper level.

I agree with you Kiki...Giving referees even MORE discression is not a good idea to me. They already do make up calls, call things they don't see, give techs for some things but not others. Less discression for refs should be the path to travel, not more.

DevinHarriswillstart
01-27-2007, 05:02 PM
I agree with you Kiki...Giving referees even MORE discression is not a good idea to me. They already do make up calls, call things they don't see, give techs for some things but not others. Less discression for refs should be the path to travel, not more.

I said the same thing earlier in the thread :)....I can't spread reputation naturally.

Cuban and the Mavs should go on a Stern ass kissing campaign so that we'll be set for years. The league and the refs can do what they want as long as they favor is right? (barf)

Actually, this isn't that far fetched if you bring back the sarcasm. Why does Cuban insist on continuously making snaps at Stern. What good does it do? He was interviewed just a few days ago and says the same stuff. Just say Stern is the greatest. You lose nothing except for the refs calling the game against your favor.