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Janett_Reno
08-21-2007, 11:46 PM
One of the things that was funny to me in this but showed how great this guy was, he predicted they would win all 7 or 8 games on the road trip and he would average like 40 a night and double figure rebounds or some wild number. They had won ever game and the last game against the Blazers i think, he told his teammates, tonight i am playing one handed for 3 quarters and we are going to win. After three quarters of playing left handed he had 27 after three. This guy was simply amazing good.

NBA TV presents Celtics great Larry Bird's 50 greatest moments.

http://search.atomz.com/search/?sp_i=1&sp_q=%22larry+bird%22&sp_a=sp10038c44&sp_advanced=&sp_n=11&sp_s=postdate&sp_f=ISO-8859-1&sp_t=video

It is the one that is 48 mins long. The Lakers was going to destroy them the first playoffs with Bird/Magic and was, as it was a layup or dunk all games and going to be a shutout, when Bird went in the locker and told them it better not be another layup for them. It was a knock down drag out after this. The Celtics won the title. Watch some of those fouls and physical play, Bird turned that into. He had to or they would have lost.

George Gervin would ask, who is that dude running laps way up there in the Garden as the Spurs held practice? Some of his teammates said that is the guy we play tonight and his name is Larry Bird, he never stops practicing or running. Even on game days.

Philadelphia was so good with J, Barkley, Bobby Jones, Cheeks, Toney and more but Bird was always there. Robert Parrish just laughs and says about 5,000 of his points was because of Bird, giving him free baskets. The coach asked McHale, why can't you be like Bird and shoot about 500 shots a day and run laps everyday of the year, McHale tells the coach, because i have another life also. McHale calls home when he gets to Boston, telling his friends, this is one amazing kid, named Larry Bird, he told MN they would hear of him soon enough.

Sometimes i forget just how great this guy was and also Magic. Some of these things Bird did, bordered on almost impossible.

StackAttack
08-22-2007, 10:05 AM
http://broadband.nba.com/cc/playa.php?content=video&url=http://boss.streamos.com/wmedia/nba/nbacom/history/bird_50_greatest_moments.asx&video=blank&nbasite=nba

That's the link you want.

EricaLubarsky
08-22-2007, 10:59 AM
you tricked me-- I went to that link and I didnt see a single minute of Dirk Nowitzki.

Silk Smoov
08-22-2007, 11:48 AM
One of the things that was funny to me in this but showed how great this guy was, he predicted they would win all 7 or 8 games on the road trip and he would average like 40 a night and double figure rebounds or some wild number. They had won ever game and the last game against the Blazers i think, he told his teammates, tonight i am playing one handed for 3 quarters and we are going to win. After three quarters of playing left handed he had 27 after three. This guy was simply amazing good.

NBA TV presents Celtics great Larry Bird's 50 greatest moments.

http://search.atomz.com/search/?sp_i=1&sp_q=%22larry+bird%22&sp_a=sp10038c44&sp_advanced=&sp_n=11&sp_s=postdate&sp_f=ISO-8859-1&sp_t=video

It is the one that is 48 mins long. The Lakers was going to destroy them the first playoffs with Bird/Magic and was, as it was a layup or dunk all games and going to be a shutout, when Bird went in the locker and told them it better not be another layup for them. It was a knock down drag out after this. The Celtics won the title. Watch some of those fouls and physical play, Bird turned that into. He had to or they would have lost.

George Gervin would ask, who is that dude running laps way up there in the Garden as the Spurs held practice? Some of his teammates said that is the guy we play tonight and his name is Larry Bird, he never stops practicing or running. Even on game days.

Philadelphia was so good with J, Barkley, Bobby Jones, Cheeks, Toney and more but Bird was always there. Robert Parrish just laughs and says about 5,000 of his points was because of Bird, giving him free baskets. The coach asked McHale, why can't you be like Bird and shoot about 500 shots a day and run laps everyday of the year, McHale tells the coach, because i have another life also. McHale calls home when he gets to Boston, telling his friends, this is one amazing kid, named Larry Bird, he told MN they would hear of him soon enough.

Sometimes i forget just how great this guy was and also Magic. Some of these things Bird did, bordered on almost impossible.

I will never 4get anything that Bird/Magic did. When I look at the current young players who people think are great, I just compare them to those two and MJ to see if they are really great.

When I think about the early/mid 80's, I just get filled up with joy when thinking about basketball. I promise, I wish I could go back in time to just feel the moment with Magic/Bird playing. I really loved the game back then. The game was pure and the team with the best heart won. Players would have to be physical/mental tough to make it back then. Hand checking was allowed, and you could lose a whole row of teeth going to the basket against the wrong person.

I remember the message fouls from certain players. I mean the ones that told a player not to come back into the lane. I think the one current Superstar that would not make it back then would be Wade. Wade's body would have taken a pounding.

Back to Bird/Magic:
Back then basketball was a art form, and Bird/Magic were artists. And they had the most respect for each other as well. Anyone remember the Bird/Magic commercials? Those were the good ole days.....

When people try to compare Dirk to Bird, I just dont understand it. Not to take anything from Dirk, but he is NOT a Larry Bird. This may sound a little crazy, but the last person to be a Larry Bird was MJ.

alby
08-22-2007, 02:10 PM
I'm going to say this again

Mchale > Bird

Hitman
08-22-2007, 03:05 PM
I'm going to say this again

Mchale > Bird


Sorry alby, there is no freaking way in hell.

Larry Bird is the greatest forward ever to play the game of basketball.

Janett_Reno
08-22-2007, 03:56 PM
I agree silk, sometimes i like to watch basketball back then because i sometimes think how good are the best guys now and then i go back and look, and get a reality check. No one could play with Bird, Magic and Jordan. It is very few now that eat, drink, sleep and breathe basketball and is obsessed. Those 3 guys were. The concentration they had and playing hurt. They were very smart and if you listen to Dr J, he says Bird wanted everyone to think he was a hick from French Lick, he played the part and when you thought he was stupid and dumb, J said he would destroy you. He was 2 or 3 steps ahead of everyone else because of his mind.

Reggie Miller has a video over there and said Al Harrington and another teammate challenged Bird to a horse game, this was when Bird was old, either coaching or doing what he does now and Bird never lost a game to either one. Miller laughed and said Harrington and the other guy thought Bird was left handed, because he never played right handed against them and he beat them every game that year left handed.

He said in that piece, his sophmore year in high school, he broke his left ankle and when he came back, he was the scorrer for his team and he was so slow he couldn't get a shot off because he couldn't move on that ankle. They put him in a few times and he found out, i can control the game with my passing and if i set these teammates up, then the coach will play me, even if i can't score. This is when he became a good passer he said. He had to or he would not get to play that year.

It is a 20 minute video over at that same place where Walton interviewed him and it was a game against Dallas and Dallas had never beat the Celts and Bird warned Walton and McHale if they goofed off at practice or wasn't in the room the night before game time at a certain time, they would not touch the ball the next day against Dallas. Bird scorred over 50 against Dallas and had a terrible game. He ball hogged it and Dallas won. Walton and McHale did not touch the ball and he told them after the game, remember what he said. Haha. He was something.

Ainge talked of one practice, where Bird got under this table and as KC Jones was talking to them, Bird tied KC's shoes together and when they went onto the court KC tripped and fell and everyone laughed but they said even though he was serious and one of the greatest to ever play, he had a joking and pranking side.

How come Dirk and these guys now never have a shot at being like a Magic or Bird, is what star or superstar will dive for a ball, who will take a chance every play on an injury like Bird and Magic did? No one plays balls out every single play like they did. Jordan i feel did also. His talent was unbelievable and plus Jordan played balls out. The funny thing was if you told Bird he couldn't jump, he would dunk on you, if you told him he was to slow he would be the first one down the court, if you said he shouldn't go inside with the centers because he might get hurt or couldn't rebound, then he would have about 20 rebounds, his ast was like a point guard, plus he would fight you, deadly shot and had ice water in his veins.

Magic said he fears no one but Larry Bird. It is pretty amazing looking at the talent in the league those years. Not just Boston/LA but so many teams. It just isn't anyone that want's to win that much as Jordan, Bird and Magic anymore and give it all up for every single win. I see streaks at times of Kobe wanting this but he is very selfish and want's to do it his way, like keeping the ball from Shaq because Kobe wanted the limelight. Bird, Magic and Jordan was not that way and did it in sync with team play and the game. I have seen hard hard play from Tim Duncan and wanted to win so much. Steve Nash does play balls out and he tries as hard as anyone now. Lebron seems to and he is young and has a great future ahead of him. That series we saw where Wade tries hard.

Probably the only guy playing now that plays the whole game at a blistering pace is Nash but remember Magic, Bird and Jordan played it on defense also. They never rested. People forget how good Jordan was on defense. He was very good. On those great Philly teams, Moses Malone played with them also. He was good.

In the interview with Walton, he hurts now. He has had back surgeries and hurts daily but he said that is ok, he wouldn't take none of it back and was happy the way he played. He just doesn't talk of his body pain these days. One thing he said if he had a chance to do over and he second gueeses himself would be his college team, In State was 33 - 0 and i remember that game as Bird was a good player and he didn't have anyone else that good and Mich St had Magic, Greg Kelser and and another good player but Bird said histeam had to have him to score. He said he shot so bad that game like 7 for 21 or something. He wishes he could have now practiced so much harder on his shot and play that game again.

He wanted to win for IN and he want's IN pro team to win and give back to IN. That Mich St was so good on defense also. That had alot to do with Bird shooting bad.

If you want to watch some other video on guys back then and see how good the nba was, watch Moses Malone, Barkley, Bobby Jones(Philly), J, Cooper, Dumars, Thomas, Laimbeer, Sikma, Alvin Adams, Elvin Hayes, Wes Unself and Jeff something on that Bullets team, Bernard King, Dominique, all of LA, plus it is so many more. I enjoy watching footage back then, even if Bird, Magic and Jordan wasn't playing because the guys was so good and played hard. Do not get me wrong, i like it now but it is alot softer now and we do not have the sheer complete talent like we did then. The nba then was so deep and some of the common guys back then would be stars today. Many of today's bench players could not make the nba back then. Maybe some that even start today.

I was watching and never knew one year, Bird's team only lost 1 home game all year. It might have been when they won the title. I think he won 3. Bruce Bowen comes to mind and a throw back to back then. He plays hard or has always. In all fairness to today's players, the coaches and management probably doesn't want the superstars to play as hard as they did back then, risking injury and if the superstars get hurt today it could kill the nba, of fans watching on tv.

So money and the business of it maybe they do not want them to play as hard. You are right, the nba stopped the physical play like back then and they want more of a Suns play. Run and gun and maybe less defense. In the end, still it is defense. Look at the Spurs shutting down Lebron. That is why the Spurs are a threat to win every year, of the defense.

Then Miami beat us with defense, plus who knows now, the cheating ref was back then as well.

One last funny thing on Bird, when McHale was a rookie and McHale was going to jump Elvin Hayes for the ball at the start of a game, Bird said out loud where ever one could hear him, Kevin tell Hayes what you told all of us. Hayes was listening. You know, tell him how bad you are going toi kick his ass tonight. McHale was like oh no, why me? Finally he just played the part, ok i said it.

Robert Parrish laughed so hard but with the joking, it was still mind games being played. Bird knew how good McHale was and Barkley said he was the hardest man in the nba ever for him to guard or stop. He said he couldn't. Bird also knew McHale came in very soft but so talented. So people feared Bird, they would not fight with Parrish but he had to let other teams, you better fear McHale plus put McHale in situations where he had to fight. It made Mchale very good. McHale was not a softy after this also. He complained all his life to the refs, like Kobe does.

I feel Bird knew it was one man that had the mental toughness he had that he played with. He would not back down from a freight train and that was Dennis Johnson. Bird really liked him and talked as if this was the best player he played with. Bird would set Johnson up at the end of the game and dish off to him, because he knew Johnson had ice water in his veins also and he would win the game.

In the off season i like watching some of the old footage.

Janett_Reno
08-22-2007, 04:21 PM
As far as McHale being better than Bird, no way. McHale, Worthy, Cooper, AC Green, Byron Scott, Parrish, Ainge, Maxwell, Bob McAdoo and others on those two teams was great players. It was one player that was great on both those teams that was a superstar without Bird/Magic and his name was Kareem. He was a superstar regardless if he played with 5 high school kids.

You team up good players with guys like Jordan, Bird and Magic and now these guys become stars. Bird, Magic and Jordan made you a star. Parrish said he had 5,000 free points because of Bird. Kareem you know did. McHale became a star/superstar because of Bird. McHale would have been good without Bird and alot of these guys was good without them but would have been a shawdow of what they was without him. They went from being fair to stars. Those 3 men give you dunks and layups alot of times down, to their teammates.

To sum it up, these 3 guys could pass like Steve Nash, they could fill it up like Kobe or Dirk, they could rebound like Ben Wallace, they could ast like Nash. They also blocked shots, stole the ball, and could make freethrows. Then to boot, they was smarter than all players around them and never got tired playing the whole game. Bascially they was supermen. These guys even played defense. I do not think we will ever see a Magic, Bird and Jordan again. They made players around them look very good.

alby
08-22-2007, 06:34 PM
There are actually a lot of old timers from Boston who agree with me. (All I've done for the past month has been reading their boards) Talent wise and legendary status, Mchale may not compare to Bird. But as far as the value each player meant for Boston, a lot of people argue that Mchale was the rock. It's really hard for me to make this claim because I only have about 30-40 Celtic games to base it off of (they are on my computer or on VHS). I was born in 84 so I didn't get to watch the glory teams of Boston much and if I did, I was too young to remember it. However, going off the games that I've seen--I really give props to Kevin Mchale. Talk about slow and unathletic, Mchale was even worse than Larry Legend in this respect. However, Mchale's footwork and positioning is probably the best I've ever seen in the history of the NBA. Larry could shoot lights out and he was never scared to take that final shot. He definitely deserves all the credit he gets, but I believe people downplay Mchale and his importance to all those great Boston teams of yesteryears.

Silk Smoov
08-22-2007, 06:48 PM
There are actually a lot of old timers from Boston who agree with me. (All I've done for the past month has been reading their boards) Talent wise and legendary status, Mchale may not compare to Bird. But as far as the value each player meant for Boston, a lot of people argue that Mchale was the rock. It's really hard for me to make this claim because I only have about 30-40 Celtic games to base it off of (they are on my computer or on VHS). I was born in 84 so I didn't get to watch the glory teams of Boston much and if I did, I was too young to remember it. However, going off the games that I've seen--I really give props to Kevin Mchale. Talk about slow and unathletic, Mchale was even worse than Larry Legend in this respect. However, Mchale's footwork and positioning is probably the best I've ever seen in the history of the NBA. Larry could shoot lights out and he was never scared to take that final shot. He definitely deserves all the credit he gets, but I believe people downplay Mchale and his importance to all those great Boston teams of yesteryears.

For us ole timers, we would NEVER agree that McHale was better than Bird. I cant imagine a single Celtic fan who followed Boston back then saying that. I am a big McHale fan, but McHale is a product of Bird. The same as Pippen was a product of MJ. Without MJ/Bird there is no Pippen/McHale hall of fame careers.

If you get a chance, please watch that video that Janet posted. It is a great indicator of what Bird brought to the game of basketball. And just in case you did not know. Bird was the biggest trash talker in the league at the time. He beat you mentally and physically.

Bird is the only player that I ever thought, that if he touched the ball he was going to score. Coined the phrase "Lay-up".... This is the term we used back then when he got the ball on the perimeter. The only way to stop him was to not let him touch the ball. I promise, a double team was not going to work. Back then, a double team on players like Magic/Bird/MJ was a death sentence, because they would pick you a part. And the role players that played with them, knew exactly where to be on a double/triple team. Role players on there team had very high basketball I.Q. because all they did was practice hard together for perfection. This to me, is the difference between then and now.

Janett_Reno
08-22-2007, 08:59 PM
I agree again with Silk. Those guys had to be ready at all times as Jordan, Bird and Magic would hit you in the eyes with a pass at anytime, you had to be ready. You play them one on one, you was going to get killed, you double and tripple team them, you was also going to get killed. They passed the ball like a Stockton or Nash, except they was like point guards with the ball that was close to 7' feet tall.

I feel Magic Johnson could have played all 5 positions and be good at any of them. Alby, you are right that McHale was a great player. He was the black hole in the middle, you go to him and it was going in the basket and he was not never passing it back out. Those arms and was so long and he had wonderful pivot moves inside. We need him now, a young McHale. James Worthy was also great swooping in like Connie Hawkins to the rim. Bird and Magic and even Pippen was a product of those 3 great players. You can't double Pippen, Worthy and McHale because it was Bird, magic and Jordan. Plus it was Kareem on LA.

Even when Bob McAdoo's career looked sort of old and over and he came to LA, now he looks like a superstar as Magic found him at the sweet spots and let him fill it up. Bird was this way with Parrish and McHale. Parrish was always rolling to the basket and if you stayed on Bird real close, he just dished to Parrish for a dunk, if you played off him any, it was like a lay up from 25 feet. He was almost impossible to guard. I really feel Michael Cooper played him so hard and the best at times. Bird would go inside and fight then, if a quick skinny guy was on him. He would bump them around and go inside like a center or power forward. He would challenge Mosses Malone, Kareem and much bigger guys and take Cooper down in there. It was bad physical dirty in there.

I might go look for that video of him and Laimbeer fighting. Laimbeer pretty muched would physically beat you up down there in the paint and bruise you. I forget the other Detroit guy that would also. He was very good also and bad physical. Both would hurt you. Bird would even challenge the best fighters and bruisers in the day, down in the paint at their position and Bird would actually fight them, so they respected him in a brawl or his natural talent. I don't think Bird, Magic or Jordan had a weakness. I felt Magic's weakness comming to the nba was his outside shot, they would just leave him open but he said if Larry shot 500 shots a day, he wanted to.

Magic practiced his butt off on his outside shot and very quickly he became so so deadly and a very good shooter and he did not have a weakness.

McHale, i feel Boston was weaker at pg at some of the times as some was slow and Ainge was streaky but pretty good but gave up points on defense. Quinn, Gerald and others was not that great, but Dennis Johnson filled that spot great. McHale made it much easier for the Celts to win titles. LA was sooooooooooo loaded and sooo loaded off the bench, i am not sure if Boston could have won without McHale. He was a nightmare for people inside as you could not stop him as Bird fed him great.

But on the other hand, LA had to have Kareem. It would have been so much harder if they did not have Cooper, Worthy and even AC Green. I would rather have McHale over Worthy but Worthy was so good. I would rather have Kareem over Parrish. You could go on and on but Parrish was solid.

If you played with those 3 guys, you became good because those 3 was perfection. They wanted close to perfection from their teammates and helped them so much. So i do agree McHale, Worthy and Pippen was very important but they became stars with Bird, Magic and Jordan and because of them.

Janett_Reno
08-22-2007, 09:10 PM
How do all of you feel about Amare and Marion? Are they great or is it, they are the product of Nash? Both have so much talent and now evcen Raja Bell is good on offense and this has to be because of Nash. Those other 3 guys we talked about, McHale, Worthy and Pippen was so good but they was so lucky to have been helped by the three best. This helped them when Bird, Jordan and Magic was gone.

No doubt that Amare and Marion having a Steve Nash will make them better and smarter players when Nash is gone. I am not comparring Nash to those other 3 as those other 3 was very complete players and was very tall. Nash is amazing on offense, his smarts, passing and i feel he will help those guys for when he is gone.

It is fun looking at footage of all those players back then.

Silk Smoov
08-23-2007, 12:09 AM
I agree again with Silk. Those guys had to be ready at all times as Jordan, Bird and Magic would hit you in the eyes with a pass at anytime, you had to be ready. You play them one on one, you was going to get killed, you double and tripple team them, you was also going to get killed. They passed the ball like a Stockton or Nash, except they was like point guards with the ball that was close to 7' feet tall.

I feel Magic Johnson could have played all 5 positions and be good at any of them. Alby, you are right that McHale was a great player. He was the black hole in the middle, you go to him and it was going in the basket and he was not never passing it back out. Those arms and was so long and he had wonderful pivot moves inside. We need him now, a young McHale. James Worthy was also great swooping in like Connie Hawkins to the rim. Bird and Magic and even Pippen was a product of those 3 great players. You can't double Pippen, Worthy and McHale because it was Bird, magic and Jordan. Plus it was Kareem on LA.

Even when Bob McAdoo's career looked sort of old and over and he came to LA, now he looks like a superstar as Magic found him at the sweet spots and let him fill it up. Bird was this way with Parrish and McHale. Parrish was always rolling to the basket and if you stayed on Bird real close, he just dished to Parrish for a dunk, if you played off him any, it was like a lay up from 25 feet. He was almost impossible to guard. I really feel Michael Cooper played him so hard and the best at times. Bird would go inside and fight then, if a quick skinny guy was on him. He would bump them around and go inside like a center or power forward. He would challenge Mosses Malone, Kareem and much bigger guys and take Cooper down in there. It was bad physical dirty in there.

I might go look for that video of him and Laimbeer fighting. Laimbeer pretty muched would physically beat you up down there in the paint and bruise you. I forget the other Detroit guy that would also. He was very good also and bad physical. Both would hurt you. Bird would even challenge the best fighters and bruisers in the day, down in the paint at their position and Bird would actually fight them, so they respected him in a brawl or his natural talent. I don't think Bird, Magic or Jordan had a weakness. I felt Magic's weakness comming to the nba was his outside shot, they would just leave him open but he said if Larry shot 500 shots a day, he wanted to.

Magic practiced his butt off on his outside shot and very quickly he became so so deadly and a very good shooter and he did not have a weakness.

McHale, i feel Boston was weaker at pg at some of the times as some was slow and Ainge was streaky but pretty good but gave up points on defense. Quinn, Gerald and others was not that great, but Dennis Johnson filled that spot great. McHale made it much easier for the Celts to win titles. LA was sooooooooooo loaded and sooo loaded off the bench, i am not sure if Boston could have won without McHale. He was a nightmare for people inside as you could not stop him as Bird fed him great.

But on the other hand, LA had to have Kareem. It would have been so much harder if they did not have Cooper, Worthy and even AC Green. I would rather have McHale over Worthy but Worthy was so good. I would rather have Kareem over Parrish. You could go on and on but Parrish was solid.

If you played with those 3 guys, you became good because those 3 was perfection. They wanted close to perfection from their teammates and helped them so much. So i do agree McHale, Worthy and Pippen was very important but they became stars with Bird, Magic and Jordan and because of them.

That Piston player was Rick Mahorn ;)

Lambeer/Mahorn have teamed up to win some WNBA titles as well with the Shocks. Go figure....:p :p :p

alby
08-23-2007, 12:50 AM
great players invite that double team

I can't think of a Maverick who wants to see that double team.

Just like what Silk was referring to, Magic/Bird/MJ wanted them to come.

alby
08-23-2007, 12:51 AM
its a great vid, i just hate that rick guy (narrator)

Janett_Reno
08-23-2007, 01:57 AM
Thanks, it was Rick Mahorn. He was another big bad bruiser. Back then playing Deroit, you must have had lumps and bruises for a week or more after playing them. I think if they went to long without a fight, they would fight among each other in practice.

chumdawg
08-23-2007, 02:04 AM
I watched it. Thanks. That was balls-on.

alby
08-23-2007, 10:45 AM
I was talking about rick kamla

Silk Smoov
08-23-2007, 11:45 AM
great players invite that double team

I can't think of a Maverick who wants to see that double team.

Just like what Silk was referring to, Magic/Bird/MJ wanted them to come.

Alby,
You just entered the "Silk World" of basketball thinking ;) This is exactly how I rate Superstars. This little trait tells me who is truly great. This is exactly how I look at every so called Superstar. I view them by comparing them to Bird/Magic/MJ qualities. You hit it right on the head about our Mavs. And when you did, you just hit on the biggest point I have been trying to make about Dirk.

That is why a truly great player cant be stopped. They only can stop themselves. If you can double team a player, then truly that player is not a "Great" player. I called them All-Stars. This is why I feel so high about Kobe type of players. He can kill you many ways, no matter what you throw at him. Wade did this against the Mavs in the Championship. This was the difference between Wade and Dirk.