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View Full Version : Jazz/Mavs: Playoff Positioning


LonestarROB
04-06-2001, 01:40 PM
Oohh this game is sooo Huge. A win gives us the season series and a strangle hold on 4th place.

It's gonna be a nasty/physical game. They'll try and intimidate us again and will fail.

Jazz 91
Mavs 101

MavsFanFinley
04-06-2001, 10:25 PM
I don't see us losing this game unless we simply can't hit our shots. I think the Mavs understand the importance of this game and will come out strong. They most likely remember what the Jazz tried to do to us last Monday.

Hales233
04-06-2001, 10:26 PM
Mavs 108, Jazz 91

erub
04-06-2001, 11:18 PM
Chalupas, but barely

Mavs 101
Jazz 97

dallmav
04-07-2001, 05:00 AM
This will be a nasty battle. I hope karl malone gets his nose broken by a flying Bradley elbow.

big_pth
04-07-2001, 09:45 AM
We all hope that Karl malone gets banged...I really hate him!

djb
04-07-2001, 11:54 AM
A win tonight would be HUGE! I've been a bit pessimistic thus far, but taking the series would make a believer out of me i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif Mavs 97, Jazz 90

MavsFanFinley
04-07-2001, 02:19 PM
The Mavs will definitely have to bring their A game tonight for them to win. Defense is a must, I think they held the Jazz to 37 or 39% in the last meeting and must bring similar efforts tonight.

Also, someone needs to help Finley early. Remember last time? He carried the team until the 4th when Dirk went ballistic on the Jazz. Howard was also quite until his 8 points came in the 4th. I would love it if Eisley could have just one good game against his former team, could it be tonight? I'll just say my fingers will be crossed i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif

I hope the refs are watching Malone too. Those flying elbows must stop before someone gets hurt for real. And I hope Dirk remembers real well what Marshall did to him and take it to him hard tonight.

djb
04-07-2001, 07:40 PM
Mavs just showed everyone how NOT to close a half i/expressions/face-icon-small-mad.gif

Hoover
04-07-2001, 07:41 PM
My God Eisley kills any offensive momentum that we have.i/expressions/face-icon-small-disgusted.gif

LonestarROB
04-07-2001, 07:49 PM
Must play better the second half if we want to win. 15 turnovers already is pitiful.

Howard having a nice game and Booth was a big reason we got the lead early. Why he hardly played much after that is beyond me. Finley's got to step up and needs to protect the ball better. Bradley's played bad thus far. Had 1 nice dunk but it looks like he could give a rats a$$ about this game. He's got to become more of a presence.

How 'bout Finley's dunk i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif . WOW

djb
04-07-2001, 08:00 PM
This is starting to get ugly.

ReggieThetaChi
04-07-2001, 08:40 PM
Fourth Quarter, 8 minutes left. This is exactly the kind of game I expected. Utah got pissed, but Dallas is coming back with some great play from Nowitzki. I think Dallas will get hot pretty soon. Impressive shooting from the line. But, anything impresses the poorest free-throw shooting center in the U of F Greek League A.

LonestarROB
04-07-2001, 09:04 PM
Unless a minor miracle happens, this ones over. Rather poor performance. Not much energy and effort. There were spots here and there where they played good but they were few and far between.

Howard's just about the only guy who showed up. Dirk's coming late but too little to late. I don't remember Finley have a game this bad ever since he came here. Booth played good early, was benched and never got his rythm back. Bradley's effort was poor.

Oh well, can't and wont win them all.

ReggieThetaChi
04-07-2001, 09:04 PM
Ok, tonight officially sucked. There is a brother who came here from Utah giving me a tremendous amount of hell right now, so you can feel what I'm going through. I'm really unhappy with the performance overall, but maybe this will serve as a wake up call for the coming tough pseudo road trip againts San Antonio and Phoenix.

djb
04-07-2001, 09:06 PM
That 11pt run by the Jazz to close the half really killed us tonight. Those punks just wouldn't miss i/expressions/face-icon-small-mad.gif

LonestarROB
04-07-2001, 09:09 PM
It was the 19-0 Utah run that killed us i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif .

Hales233
04-07-2001, 09:12 PM
oh rob...you are so much more insightful than the rest of us i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif

djb
04-07-2001, 09:17 PM
Ya it's an obvious stat but Rob's right on that. The Jazz closed the half on an 11-0 run, and that momentum carried over to the third quarter when they drilled off eight straight points. The number of times the Mavs turned it over tonight was just pathetic i/expressions/face-icon-small-disgusted.gif

Mavinator
04-07-2001, 09:21 PM
arrrrrrrrrrrrggg

There were very bad things in this game, mostly in the first half.

Turnovers. That's obvious.

Dirk getting, what, 5 touches in the first half? That is pitiful for your primary offensive weapon, and I love Michael Finley, but it was Finley's fault. He only had 9 attempts in the first half, but he carried the ball nearly every possession, and turned it over countless times. Dirk got it a lot in the third, but then everyone forgot he existed again in the fourth. Give Dirk the damned ball. Dirk does not consistently miss shots or turn over the ball. Give Dirk the damned ball.

And finally- GIVE BRADLEY MORE MINUTES! Yes, I realize this outing was poor. That is because he only played in three or four-minute spurts on two occasions tonight. Booth is in no way a better player than Bradley, at all, period. He is a slightly better individual defender (very slightly) but he is so foul-prone that he erases all his good work by sending the opposing team to the line a thousand times a night. He is not as good a shotblocker as Bradley is, and he is not nearly the rebounder Bradley is. He has the EXACT SAME offensive game as Bradley- dunks and midrange jumpers. I mean, what, does Nellie think Officer Polynice is going to explode on us offensively or something? In the second half, where it's clear to any layman that the Mavs need defensive stops like crazy, does Nellie put in his single best defender, Bradley, or how about the Booth and Bradley combination that crushed the Jazz so badly last time we played? No, of course not, he plays his damned new toy Calvin Booth so he can come out and foul Malone two more times. Don't get me wrong, I love Calvin Booth, but Nellie is being ridiculous starting him and playing him twice as long as Shawn Bradley.

Jordan23TX
04-07-2001, 09:22 PM
Im not going to get too upset about this game ... for a couple reasons ...We played like chit we really didnt deserve to win... Also, whenever the Mavs have gotten national recognition such as the National television games or the nice piece done by AHmad Rashad today,...the Mavs come out in stink up the joint.... I should have known this afternoon we were going to stink it up ...it never fails. So tomorrow when they talk about the Mavs during the NBC tripleheader it will be only about the ass whupping we took tonite....go figga..

J

Hales233
04-07-2001, 09:22 PM
yeah, Finley had 8 TO's....not good i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif

Hales233
04-07-2001, 09:23 PM
7 my bad

Jordan23TX
04-07-2001, 09:27 PM
Mavinator your Bradley rhetoric is becoming so amusing....I mean Calvin Booth played horribly.......BUT "Bradley" was in the game when the Jazz went on their run in the second quarter. I mean I saw 2 layups on him by Stockton ....not to mention a Dunk by Marshall... In the beginning of the 3rd ......Bradley was taken out for Maxwell.....then in the 4th he was subbed for Najera.. I mean the comparisons of Booth to Bradley are pointless.... considering that BOOTH now starts at center.....that should speak volumes in itself.

Mavinator
04-07-2001, 09:31 PM
Booth and Bradley both played p*ss-poor tonight, but in Bradley's case it was due largely to a sudden cutback in PT that he really isn't deserving of...

I am aware that Booth is starting ahead of Bradley. I contend that this is not a good thing... I'd wager that as Nelson sees more of Booth's foul-prone crap, Bradley will get his starting position back...

djb
04-07-2001, 09:33 PM
Bradley really didn't do much at all tonight but I still would have liked to see the Bradley/Booth combo that's been so effective the last few games.

djb
04-07-2001, 09:35 PM
Oh and I agree Bradley is better defensively (shotblocking), but Booth definitely has edge offensively. He shoots the jumper better and is more effective on the offensive glass.

LonestarROB
04-07-2001, 09:38 PM
Jordan, that's what pissed me off too. Stockton had 2 layups and Starks 1 layup where Bradley could have easily blocked all three. And then Vaughn got a rebound from behind Bradley. That's just pitiful.

Jordan23TX
04-07-2001, 09:40 PM
Wasnt it Del Harris who played the BOOTH/BRADLEY combo ???? I dont think Nelson has used it much if any..... I like it also & it was succesful against UTAH last time .. Nash also looked bad tonite... Stockton had free reigns to run all over the court.... no pressure on the entry passes into Malone. ..But the killer was 3's by Russell & Starks repeatedly. Not to mention Finley being MIA...

Mavinator
04-07-2001, 09:41 PM
Bradley usually nails that set shot... you're right that Booth is a better offensive rebounder, though, I had forgotten about that...

djb
04-07-2001, 09:42 PM
Everyone on the Jazz killed us tonight. Stockton, Starks, Malone, Russell, Marshall..didn't even know Marshall could shoot the 3 i/expressions/face-icon-small-mad.gif

Mavinator
04-07-2001, 09:44 PM
I know where you guys are coming from, but Stockton and Marshall pulled really sneaky moves on those layups, pulling reversals in the middle of crazy moves to get them by Bradley... those were 30% lapse on Bradley's part and 70% offensive creativeness and luck. I never thought I'd be saying this, but I wish Del Harris had coached this game...

erub
04-07-2001, 09:53 PM
The team just looses all momentum when Nash comes out. With him out with 5 fouls, we couldn't get anything done. We racked up too many fouls too early on in the game. Malone is such a beast - his arms were twice the size of anybody else out on the court.

Mavinator
04-07-2001, 09:54 PM
That was another gaping problem in the Mavs' game- Nash getting into early foul trouble. I knew I left one out...

djb
04-07-2001, 09:55 PM
..which then led to another problem in the Mavs' game tonight - Eisley i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif

LonestarROB
04-07-2001, 09:57 PM
I think we should trade Eisley in the offseason. He just can't do anything with this team. We strugle everytime he's in.

Mavinator
04-07-2001, 10:02 PM
I don't think Eisley's a bad point guard- he just looks much worse coming in after super-point-guard Nash! It seems to me like Eisley just thinks too much when he's on the court. He doesn't know what his role is at the point- Should he shoot? Should he drive the ball and try to make a play? Should he just give the ball to someone else? He seems downright confused. He is a MUCH better player at the 2 guard, because no matter what his shooting slump or statistics might say this year, he's got a sweet stroke and is one of the better pure shooters in the league... We definitely need a better (or maybe just more confident) backup point than Eisley, but I don't strongly feel we need to trade him... Not that I would mind...

MavsFanFinley
04-07-2001, 10:06 PM
Whoa, there were many things that went wrong tonight. Sorry, but Finley wasn't the sole cause. If you noticed, he had those 7 turnovers in the first half when we're only down 6. In the second half, that's when the others started turning the ball over.

How sick is that we shot the ball better than the Jazz and still lose? We shot 52.4% to there 51.3% Not much difference but still sickening. Same thing with the ft line. We shot 93.8% to there 74.4%.

Fouls killed us too. Howard, Booth, Dirk and Nash each had 5. Finley had 4, with Bradley having 3. Every time we made a stop or run, we we're called for fouls and the Jazz went back up. I don't remember fouls being so awful for the Mavs in a long time.

Again, Dirk didn't do anything until the 4th quarter and this time it came too late. Howard is the only one who was consistant throughout the game. I don't think Finley shot enough, but credit the Jazz for double-teaming him early and causing him to turn the ball over. Going into the 4th, Finley had only taken 7 shots. He ended up 5-10.

Ironic isn't it that we complain when the bench doesn't contribute? Tonight I think they contributed too much. How? Bradley, Eisley, Maxwell and Najera combined for 8-14. They took more shots than Finley and Howard. They almost took as many shots as Dirk. Why is that strange? Because the Mavs usually have 3 guys, maybe 4 that do the bulk of scoring with the others pitching in. Tonight, everyone scored points, except Wang.

djb
04-07-2001, 10:08 PM
You're dead-on about Eisley. The guy just plays too cautiously. We need someone who can penetrate, draw the defenders in, and dish out the assists. Someone who brings a whole lot of energy to the floor. Isn't Damon Jones a free agent this offseason?

MavsFanFinley
04-07-2001, 10:09 PM
What might help Eisley is if they would try the 2 man game. He's not going to drive the lane like Nash does and kick out to the others. Why not do what Stockton and Malone do? Only with Eisley and Howard? Or Eisley and Dirk? It could be effective, look how long Eisley did that with the Jazz. No, it won't be like Stockton and Malone but could be effective still.

LonestarROB
04-07-2001, 10:12 PM
The problem I have with Eisley is that(to me anyways) he looks to create a shot for himself first. Instead of trying to get others involved.

djb
04-07-2001, 10:14 PM
That's because he's not very good at drawing the defenders and finding the open man. He plays too much like a two-guard out there.

Mavinator
04-07-2001, 10:14 PM
MavsFanFinley- I am the farthest thing on this board from a Finley-hater, but I think he really just had a terrible game tonight, and I think it was largely his fault that Dirk didn't get the ball at all in the first half- only 5 attempts is ridiculous. Finley's 9 attempts plus 6 turnovers = 15 times when he took control of the ball, that's three times as many as Dirk had, and Dirk is generally the more effective offensive weapon, especially against the Jazz.

I like Howard's consistency, though- after those two or three bad games he had a while ago, he's been consistently pretty effective both early in games and in the fourth quarter... it seems like every game he gets 12-16 in the first half and then 4-8 in the fourth quarter.

MavsFanFinley
04-07-2001, 10:21 PM
Im not saying your a finley hater, I just think it's a bit harsh to put this loss on his shoulders alone.

What do you mean Finley's 9 attempts? He only had 7 going into the 4th quarter.

Mavinator
04-07-2001, 10:25 PM
Oh, I wasn't putting it on his shoulders alone- a whole lot of our guys had problems tonight. And, whoops, you're right about the shot-attempts thing, I usually quote statistics from memory and I was in error there. Of course, I also accidentally said 6 TO's when he actually had 7, so it still equates to 14 possessions...

That dunk on Polynice was NICE, though.

MavsFanFinley
04-07-2001, 10:32 PM
I didn't get to see the dunk i/expressions/face-icon-small-blush.gif I heard about it though, I'll have to catch some highlights but it'll probably be all Jazz though.

I guess Im not seeing your logic about Fin and posessions. Those turnovers all came in the first half. No, 7 turnovers isn't pretty but as I understood it, they came from the Jazz double-teaming him. How does that count as a posession? And how would it be different if Dirk had the ball in those situations? Im confused but what else is new? Dirk still shot the ball more than Fin and we lost.

Dirk 7-16 and 7-7 (ft)
Fin 5-10 and 3-3 (ft)

MavsFanFinley
04-07-2001, 10:38 PM
I wish Nelson would of got kicked out again i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif

That way Harris would of used both Booth and Bradley and we could of had a repeat of the last game i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif

Speaking of Fin's turnover problem, both Nash and Dirk had 4 apiece too. Howard had 3, with Booth and Bradley having 2 also.

Mavinator
04-07-2001, 11:21 PM
Finley's seven first-half turnovers all came as a result of trying to drive the lane and being immediately double-teamed. This is why I have never been a big proponent of many fans' views that Finley "should drive the lane more". As great as Finley is, he is still a subpar ball-handler, and I actually think he's better off taking mostly jumpshots and only occasionally trying to push the ball into the middle... his game requires a lot of balance to minimize turnovers. Anyway, my point is that if Finley hadn't turned the ball over those seven times, I guarantee you he would have shot the ball 5 or 6 of those times, not because he's greedy, just because that's what he does when he drives the lane. Dirk's turnovers, on the other hand, all came from bad crosscourt passes- I remember most of them specifically. Nash did have a couple turnovers too, but that's actually fairly typical of him. When he racks up assists, he also rachs up turnovers (usually with about a 3-to-1 ratio) and this was one of those nights...

Finley was downright noble taking so few shots in the second half, but the difference between Dirk and Finley tonight was that Finley was just way off, but Dirk was hitting his shots...

Jordan23TX
04-07-2001, 11:38 PM
Collectively, we all agree there is plenty blame to go around ... from the players to the coaching staff...Hope we get back on track tuesday....Guys ease off Eisley , he's not doing as bad as we make it... His role has changed ..& he's struggling with his new role ..The trade affected his game moreso then anyones..

erub
04-08-2001, 02:54 PM
A loss is a loss...can't do much about it. We're still in pretty good shape though, with 3 tough games coming up.

ReggieThetaChi
04-08-2001, 04:15 PM
No player can be credited with losing a game on their own. It isn't fair to put the blame on Eisley's paling in comparison to Nash, Booth playing like crap, Finley turning the ball over, or ineffectiveness of the bench. This is a team game, and the bottom line is that the team played like crap. Saddling the loss on one scapegoat sure makes it alot easier to accept a loss, but it is not accurate. The bottom line is Dallas played like crap, not any individual player. This statement is a bit incoherent, because I'm loaded up on painkiller right now, but I'm sure all of you get the gist of it.

Flying Tiger
04-08-2001, 08:48 PM
I'm not too upset with the loss. I would rather stay in the 4/5 spot then move up to 3. In my opinion, we have a better chance of getting by Utah in the 1st than even the T-Wolves. It would be a rough series, but if the Mavs are still alive, I think we would advance to the 2nd.

TheKid
04-09-2001, 08:44 AM
I think this was a game as a Mavericks fan we all want to forget about as soon as possible. It was just terrible, other than Juwan, I personally don't think anyone played particularly well. I tell you what though, I'm probably going to become an anti Bradley person very soon....