PDA

View Full Version : Official Lebron, Wade, Bosh FA watch thread.


Pages : [1] 2 3

Windmill360
05-14-2010, 11:16 PM
So here's one writers opinion on where he thinks teams rank in getting Lebron this summer.


By: Christopher Reina
RealGM.com Writer

May 14, 2010 2:31 AM

The Summer of LeBron launched quite a few weeks earlier than expected with Cleveland's elimination in the Eastern Conference Semifinals.

Teams 30 to nine are listed almost strictly for entertainment purposes, but here are the LeBron James Power Rankings, examining where he might end up signing this summer.



Read more: http://www.realgm.com/src_feature_pieces/904/20100514/the_lebron_james_power_rankings/#ixzz0ny5Nhyod

Zki41
05-14-2010, 11:32 PM
There have been rumors spread all over the internet about Delonte West apparently banging Gloria James

(http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/3004288/gloria_james_and_delonte_west_affair.html?cat=2)

If this is true, I doubt LeBron will ever trust his teammates in Cleveland again, and is most likely out of there based on this alone.

NOTHING OFFICIAL YET

clutch#41
05-14-2010, 11:37 PM
doesn't delonte west have herpes??? ha

mary
05-15-2010, 08:43 AM
There have been rumors spread all over the internet about Delonte West apparently banging Gloria James

(http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/3004288/gloria_james_and_delonte_west_affair.html?cat=2)

If this is true, I doubt LeBron will ever trust his teammates in Cleveland again, and is most likely out of there based on this alone.

NOTHING OFFICIAL YET


This seems like obvious bullsh to me.

Its fun to do bad things.

GuerillaBlack
05-15-2010, 09:58 AM
That LeBron-Delonte thing has been going around pretty fast. Here is something I found (take it for what it's worth):

A rumor hit the inbox this afternoon and Duffy and I dismissed it because it seemed too out there. Then another e-mail came. Then it was in the comments section and started making the rounds on Twitter. The rumor – something went on between Delonte West and LeBron James’ mother, Gloria.

Rumor has it that LeBron found out before Game 4 which is where the entire series changed. Delonte West stopped playing as much and LeBron’s numbers fell of a cliff. Here are Delonte West’s minutes in the playoffs:

First Round vs. Bulls
Game 1 – 24
Game 2 – 27
Game 3 – 30
Game 4 – 26
Game 5 -31

Second Round vs. Celtics
Game 1 – 27
Game 2 -31
Game 3 – 29
Game 4 – 20
Game 5 – 9
Game 6 – 14

That’s a pretty noticeable drop off for a guy that played 42 minutes a game during last season’s playoffs. This season he played 25 minutes a game during the regular season for the 61-win Cavs. Why does one of the Cavs’ best players suddenly fall out of the rotation in the most important games of the season?

As for LeBron’s performance… Going into Game 4 against the Celtics, LeBron was shooting 55 percent and had scored around 32 points a game in the playoffs. In games 4, 5, and 6 he shot a combined 33 percent and scored just 21 points a game. He was standing around on offense and when he was trying, it didn’t look like the old LeBron James.

Suddenly, in Game 4, Delonte West stopped playing the majority of the games and LeBron James completely stopped playing like LeBron James.I assumed he was hurt worse than initially reported, but Danny Ferry says he won’t be having surgery. No reason was given for shaking up the Cavs rotation that had been working all season and through the first 8 games of the playoffs. While this is probably a just a rumor, something happened between games 3 and 4 that affected both Delonte West and LeBron James. Right?

This is just too funny.

sefant77
05-15-2010, 01:05 PM
http://www.lebrontothemavs.com/

chumdawg
05-15-2010, 03:48 PM
http://www.lebrontothemavs.com/The dude, whoever it is, makes good points with his "Six Reasons" why LBJ should come to Dallas.

jthig32
05-15-2010, 04:32 PM
The dude, whoever it is, makes good points with his "Six Reasons" why LBJ should come to Dallas.

Interestingly enough, whoever made that site cared enough to establish the domain with a proxy so you couldn't do a simple lookup and figure out who owns the domain.

Based on the graphical quality of the site, and the use of a domain proxy, I feel pretty confident that the Mavs are behind that site.

dirno2000
05-15-2010, 05:26 PM
I don't see this as an attractive location for Lebron or Wade due to the age of our stars. In my mind either of them would make us the favorite next year but with the lockout looming you could make the case that there's a one year window. Wade in particular has already won a championship with a team that quickly got old around him. I can't imagine he wants to be in that situation again if he can avoid it.

Rick41
05-15-2010, 05:46 PM
I'm jealous of Delonte solely of the fact that he is able to use legit "Your Mom" jokes on Lebron.

jthig32
05-15-2010, 06:33 PM
I don't see this as an attractive location for Lebron or Wade due to the age of our stars. In my mind either of them would make us the favorite next year but with the lockout looming you could make the case that there's a one year window. Wade in particular has already won a championship with a team that quickly got old around him. I can't imagine he wants to be in that situation again if he can avoid it.

Stein was on Ben and Skin this week and stated that Wade is absolutely not an option. He said there is zero chance that he signs here and he thinks he's almost certainly staying in Miami.

As to your statement, I absolutely disagree with the one year window notion. I think Dirk is going to be capable of being the second best player on a championship team for quite a while. Beyond that, you have an owner that has proven he will spend what it takes to put pieces in place. Maybe Chicago looks better over the next five years, but other than them, I don't see a better opportunity than ours for the near future.

mac222b
05-15-2010, 07:57 PM
The dude, whoever it is, makes good points with his "Six Reasons" why LBJ should come to Dallas.

they are excellent points

FINtastic
05-15-2010, 09:12 PM
Stein was on Ben and Skin this week and stated that Wade is absolutely not an option. He said there is zero chance that he signs here and he thinks he's almost certainly staying in Miami.

As to your statement, I absolutely disagree with the one year window notion. I think Dirk is going to be capable of being the second best player on a championship team for quite a while. Beyond that, you have an owner that has proven he will spend what it takes to put pieces in place. Maybe Chicago looks better over the next five years, but other than them, I don't see a better opportunity than ours for the near future.

And given that Chicago is such an attractive place, I think that actually plays really nicely into our hands in the event that we can convince the LeBron to come here.

Then again, it might be so attractive that he doesn't want to go elsewhere. We'll see.

DirkFTW
05-15-2010, 09:45 PM
Interestingly enough, whoever made that site cared enough to establish the domain with a proxy so you couldn't do a simple lookup and figure out who owns the domain.

Based on the graphical quality of the site, and the use of a domain proxy, I feel pretty confident that the Mavs are behind that site.

Giggity!

Windmill360
05-17-2010, 12:06 PM
They just put up a C'mon Lebron song on that site. It's pretty good.

LonghornDub
05-17-2010, 05:01 PM
I don't see this as an attractive location for Lebron or Wade due to the age of our stars. In my mind either of them would make us the favorite next year but with the lockout looming you could make the case that there's a one year window. Wade in particular has already won a championship with a team that quickly got old around him. I can't imagine he wants to be in that situation again if he can avoid it.

You're thinking of it the wrong way. These aren't #2 guys who need a young stars with lots of years ahead of them to compete. These are #1 guys who expect that a team will be built around them. If we get Lebron or Wade, we are as young as either of those guys (25 or 28, respectively). The age of our other stars is pretty much irrelevant.

These guys have huge egos--they're not worried about "oh, but what happens once Dirk is too old?" They're thinking, "Once Dirk is too old, I'll still be the man in Dallas, just like I will be the first day I get there."

Kidd Karma
05-17-2010, 06:24 PM
And given that Chicago is such an attractive place, I think that actually plays really nicely into our hands in the event that we can convince the LeBron to come here.

Then again, it might be so attractive that he doesn't want to go elsewhere. We'll see.

NJ isn't all that bad either, big man, point guard, several wings, Brooklyn, Russian Cuban, and a high lottery pick this year. Cleveland's in the dumper and you can blame Delonte for that.

Every time I read that, I'm thinking you idiot, why did you have to answer the door, it's not your room, I'd be hiding under the bed.

horse900703
05-17-2010, 06:40 PM
What if we get Dwade... :)

FINtastic
05-17-2010, 07:50 PM
NJ isn't all that bad either, big man, point guard, several wings, Brooklyn, Russian Cuban, and a high lottery pick this year. Cleveland's in the dumper and you can blame Delonte for that.

Every time I read that, I'm thinking you idiot, why did you have to answer the door, it's not your room, I'd be hiding under the bed.

Is the Delonte story for real?

My feelings on New Jersey are solely dependent on how the lottery goes. If they end up with the first pick and grab John Wall and then deal Devin for a decent shooting guard, suddenly that does look like a very appealing place to go.

Male30Dan
05-17-2010, 08:16 PM
That is a very nicely put together website. Very professional.

dirno2000
05-17-2010, 11:56 PM
You're thinking of it the wrong way. These aren't #2 guys who need a young stars with lots of years ahead of them to compete. These are #1 guys who expect that a team will be built around them. If we get Lebron or Wade, we are as young as either of those guys (25 or 28, respectively). The age of our other stars is pretty much irrelevant.

These guys have huge egos--they're not worried about "oh, but what happens once Dirk is too old?" They're thinking, "Once Dirk is too old, I'll still be the man in Dallas, just like I will be the first day I get there."

I couldn't disagree more. Lebron's already been there and done that. It's lead to playoff disappointment and people questioning his ability to be a lead dog. I pretty sure that at this point he knows he needs help and wouldn't be so sure about our ability to replace a player as talented as Dirk.

He would have immediate help here but again, losing a year would be disastrous given the age of our core. Maybe in two years Dirk's still playing at a high level and we've managed to replace the production that we're currently getting from Kidd and Marion but it's going to take more than money. We're going to have to get lucky. If I'm Lebron I'm not betting my legacy on that. I hope he does but I wouldn't.

grndmstr_c
05-18-2010, 01:01 AM
I couldn't disagree more. Lebron's already been there and done that. It's lead to playoff disappointment and people questioning his ability to be a lead dog. I pretty sure that at this point he knows he needs help and wouldn't be so sure about our ability to replace a player as talented as Dirk.

He would have immediate help here but again, losing a year would be disastrous given the age of our core. Maybe in two years Dirk's still playing at a high level and we've managed to replace the production that we're currently getting from Kidd and Marion but it's going to take more than money. We're going to have to get lucky. If I'm Lebron I'm not betting my legacy on that. I hope he does but I wouldn't.
The age of the Dallas core might be enough to make Lebron/Wade shy away from a deal of maximum length, but who's to say that's what they're after anyway? If you start talking about a three year deal (and there's certainly precedent for believing that they'd consider a contract in that range), Dallas' age is of almost no concern.

fluid.forty.one
05-18-2010, 01:22 AM
The age of the Dallas core might be enough to make Lebron/Wade shy away from a deal of maximum length, but who's to say that's what they're after anyway? If you start talking about a three year deal (and there's certainly precedent for believing that they'd consider a contract in that range), Dallas' age is of almost no concern.

No one is going to pass up a maximum length deal at max pay especially if their reasoning is that the signing team won't be able to compete for very much longer....

grndmstr_c
05-18-2010, 01:31 AM
No one is going to pass up a maximum length deal at max pay especially if their reasoning is that the signing team won't be able to compete for very much longer....
Lebron, Wade and Bosh are all coming off three-year deals.

jthig32
05-18-2010, 07:11 AM
Lebron, Wade and Bosh are all coming off three-year deals.

Yeah but certainly they'd be crazy to sign three year deals this time around considering the pending labor issues and what people seem to think are going to happen to contract lengths and max numbers.

In fact those three year deals they're coming off of were specifically designed to expire just in time for them to sign huge, long contracts before the new CBA kicked in.

sefant77
05-18-2010, 07:24 AM
NJ is the 75% frontrunner for me.

It wont be Knicks or Heat.

I give us 20% and the other 5% anyone else...

Nets have Lopez (huge factor), Harris, several young players to pack in a deal (Lee, CDR, Williams, Yi), their pick, our pick AND probably also cap for 2 max players (and if not straight then after dumping one minor talent for a TE).

James can sell 2010 and 2012 new jerseys to the world...

Would be allready ok to grab Lee or Boozer.

Harris
CDR/Williams/Lee
James
Boozer or D.Lee
Lopez

Wall/Turner?!

Underdog
05-18-2010, 09:42 AM
NJ is the 75% frontrunner for me.

Why?

I don't see New Jersey offering anything that New York can't do better.

Knicks vs Nets is like Cowboys vs Texans - no contest!


I bet New Jersey is the one team left without a chair when the music stops...

grndmstr_c
05-18-2010, 10:47 AM
Yeah but certainly they'd be crazy to sign three year deals this time around considering the pending labor issues and what people seem to think are going to happen to contract lengths and max numbers.

In fact those three year deals they're coming off of were specifically designed to expire just in time for them to sign huge, long contracts before the new CBA kicked in.
That's a fair point. I'd not been considering the possibility that they wouldn't be able to sign a comparable deal next time around on the market. Though I also think the press to get the money now because it won't be available later favors a S&T if any of them leave their current teams, and that should be sufficient to keep the Mavs in the running for their services.

dirno2000
05-18-2010, 11:13 AM
Why?

I don't see New Jersey offering anything that New York can't do better.

Knicks vs Nets is like Cowboys vs Texans - no contest!


I bet New Jersey is the one team left without a chair when the music stops...

The Cowboys/Texans thing is true but NJ has a better core of young players and they're going to add a top four pick. The Nets are in much better position to win.

sefant77
05-18-2010, 12:05 PM
And they have one of the best young center. You need lenght to beat the Magic and Lakers the next year. They will laugh their asses off about Bosh/Curry.

And there arent many good center available. Or do you think the Magic gonna trade Gortat to the Knicks as a missing piece?

Its Lopez, the higher amount of talents (Gali/Chandler vs Harris/Lee/CDR/YI/Williams/Pick) and future picks. And probably Nets can sign 2 Max...

I just dont see any points for the Knicks.

Douglas
Chandler
James/Gali
Bosh
Curry

and no picks (the next years) or MLE is a joke..

Nets also moved out of the Izod trash center to Newark. Nice arena, no problems to fill it with James until 2012...

jthig32
05-18-2010, 01:53 PM
That's a fair point. I'd not been considering the possibility that they wouldn't be able to sign a comparable deal next time around on the market. Though I also think the press to get the money now because it won't be available later favors a S&T if any of them leave their current teams, and that should be sufficient to keep the Mavs in the running for their services.

Definitely. Any huge star that moves this off season through a straight contract signing needs to fire their agent. It's more important than ever to get that extra year.

FINtastic
05-18-2010, 04:43 PM
The Cowboys/Texans thing is true but NJ has a better core of young players and they're going to add a top four pick. The Nets are in much better position to win.

Besides Harris and Lopez, I don't see much on the Nets roster that is really appealing. The top four pick is still a little shaky in my book. If they can get Wall or Turner, that would be pretty appealing, but after those two I don't really see much in the way of can't-miss-prospects.

Kidd Karma
05-18-2010, 05:46 PM
Yeah but certainly they'd be crazy to sign three year deals this time around considering the pending labor issues and what people seem to think are going to happen to contract lengths and max numbers.

In fact those three year deals they're coming off of were specifically designed to expire just in time for them to sign huge, long contracts before the new CBA kicked in.

Yep, LBJ led the charge on that. Don't underestimate this kid's business sense. And they will max it out this time around.

Windmill360
05-20-2010, 03:03 PM
ESPN and Mark Cuban taking notice:

http://sports.espn.go.com/dallas/nba/news/story?id=5204809

sefant77
05-20-2010, 08:46 PM
http://www.lebrontodabulls.com/

mac222b
05-20-2010, 10:56 PM
NJ is the 75% frontrunner for me.

It wont be Knicks or Heat.

I give us 20% and the other 5% anyone else...

Nets have Lopez (huge factor), Harris, several young players to pack in a deal (Lee, CDR, Williams, Yi), their pick, our pick AND probably also cap for 2 max players (and if not straight then after dumping one minor talent for a TE).

James can sell 2010 and 2012 new jerseys to the world...

Would be allready ok to grab Lee or Boozer.

Harris
CDR/Williams/Lee
James
Boozer or D.Lee
Lopez

Wall/Turner?!

I wouldve been inclined to agree until recently but with NJ slipping to 3rd, them being in Newark for 2 or 3 more years and the fact that they won just 12 games last season might make it pretty hard to justify the switch.

mac222b
05-20-2010, 10:59 PM
i see it right now as Knicks, Mavs, and Bulls in a dead heat(no pun intended). i think he's gone from Cleveland and wants no part of sharing the rock with Dwade. NJ not landing Wall severely cripples their chances.

Thespiralgoeson
05-21-2010, 04:56 AM
i see it right now as Knicks, Mavs, and Bulls in a dead heat(no pun intended). i think he's gone from Cleveland and wants no part of sharing the rock with Dwade. NJ not landing Wall severely cripples their chances.

I brought this up in the other section, but I just cannot see Lebron gambling his entire legacy on New York. If they get Chris Bosh on the first day of free agency then maybe. But the guy has made it perfectly clear that winning is his top priority, and I just can't imagine Lebron sees the Knicks as any kind of greener pasture (same goes for New Jersey.)

sefant77
05-21-2010, 07:57 AM
Even with Bosh the frontcourt is still a joke if you have to beat the Lakers or Magic. And good centers are rare and i dont see the Magic trading Gortat to the Knicks ;)

Knicks need to get Bosh AND dump Curry for Okafor on the 1st day...

Underdog
05-21-2010, 09:12 AM
Every time someone mentions LeBron/Bosh, I wonder how the hell that's even close to LeBron/Dirk...

Age? What's a couple extra years of NOT winning a ring worth?

LonghornDub
05-21-2010, 11:36 AM
I couldn't disagree more. Lebron's already been there and done that. It's lead to playoff disappointment and people questioning his ability to be a lead dog. I pretty sure that at this point he knows he needs help and wouldn't be so sure about our ability to replace a player as talented as Dirk.

He would have immediate help here but again, losing a year would be disastrous given the age of our core. Maybe in two years Dirk's still playing at a high level and we've managed to replace the production that we're currently getting from Kidd and Marion but it's going to take more than money. We're going to have to get lucky. If I'm Lebron I'm not betting my legacy on that. I hope he does but I wouldn't.

You're still not thinking about it from the perspective of a guy who thinks he's the best player in the entire word and the greatest thing since sliced bread. His ego isn't going to allow him to believe that his "legacy" depends on people other than himself.

And nobody is reasonably questioning Lebron's ability to be a lead dog. Not a single person. People are questioning his enthusiasm for Cleveland, his heart, and the quality of this teammates, not his ability to be the guy.

chumdawg
05-21-2010, 11:53 AM
I heard a guy on ESPN this morning put it in a way that I had never considered before, but that made a lot of sense. He said that if Lebron doesn't win a ring, he goes down as the biggest bust of all time. Ouch.

LonghornDub
05-21-2010, 11:55 AM
I heard a guy on ESPN this morning put it in a way that I had never considered before, but that made a lot of sense. He said that if Lebron doesn't win a ring, he goes down as the biggest bust of all time. Ouch.

I heard that too. That was bold. But I wonder if that's a bit unfair....perhaps not.

92bDad
05-21-2010, 01:18 PM
The only part that concerns me is the lack of respect the Mavs get outside of Dallas...about anything.

What do the top FA truly think of the Mavs and Dallas? How will their perception of the Dallas area play into their business decision on where to play?

Sure those of us here in Dallas love it here and we love our Mavs as well as having the belief that they can win it all. However, with my travels so far this year taking me to the NY area, Atl, New England, Louisiana, California, Washington, Vegas, Canada...the ONLY time I hear anything about the Mavs is when I'm in Dallas.

As far as potential teams for LeBron, Dallas is never mentioned in these other cities...Cle, Miami, NY and Chicago are the ONLY ones who get regular mention. Now I know this is part Media, but even the talk shows...there's nobody calling in about Dallas.

Like it or not, Dallas is looked down on and I just wonder...what to do the people that really matter think of Dallas?

I can think to a recent baseball deal, were local talk of Tory Hunter coming to the Rangers was a big deal, only to see him sign with the Angels and making some type of comment that he didn't want his kids going to school and being laughed at because of where his dad played...

Perception is a real b*tch and saddly, our beloved Mavs have a negative view outside of our local minds.

Hopefully Cuban can negotiate a deal that brings in Lebron and another Superstar, lifting the Mavs to Championship status and lifting the city/metroplex into a new level of Super Cities!!!

clutch#41
05-21-2010, 02:42 PM
I heard a guy on ESPN this morning put it in a way that I had never considered before, but that made a lot of sense. He said that if Lebron doesn't win a ring, he goes down as the biggest bust of all time. Ouch.

biggest bust of all time??? how?? lmao...hes not kwame brown. he has 2 MVP's..bust??? pretty idiotic to say that on Lebron.

Mavericks Rockets Fan
05-21-2010, 02:46 PM
biggest bust of all time??? how?? lmao...hes not kwame brown. he has 2 MVP's..bust??? pretty idiotic to say that on Lebron.

Weren't you the one who said 1 championship > 10 MVP's? So apparently LeBron would be a HUGE bust compared to someone like Robert Horry...

Underdog
05-21-2010, 02:47 PM
Weren't you the one who said 1 championship > 10 MVP's? So apparently LeBron would be a HUGE bust compared to someone like Robert Horry...

http://www.ohsnap.ca/img/thumbnails/oh-snap.jpg

clutch#41
05-21-2010, 02:48 PM
Weren't you the one who said 1 championship > 10 MVP's? So apparently LeBron would be a HUGE bust compared to someone like Robert Horry...

ya i said that but i didnt say he would be a "bust"...i jus said he wouldnt be a LEGEND like bird or jordan who have multiple rings..the word bust is an insult and Lebron whether he wins a ring or not is not a bust. he's a proven player and the best in the league.

clutch#41
05-21-2010, 02:49 PM
Weren't you the one who said 1 championship > 10 MVP's? So apparently LeBron would be a HUGE bust compared to someone like Robert Horry...

and about the robert horry thing...DJ MBENGA has more rings then dirk..doesnt mean dirks a bust or mbenga is a great player lmao.

Mavericks Rockets Fan
05-21-2010, 02:59 PM
and about the robert horry thing...DJ MBENGA has more rings then dirk..doesnt mean dirks a bust or mbenga is a great player lmao.

So you agree with me that the supporting cast is the most important factor in determining how many rings you win?

clutch#41
05-21-2010, 03:09 PM
So you agree with me that the supporting cast is the most important factor in determining how many rings you win?

ya look at the celtics..they got 3 productive guys coming off the bench and producing..along with the big 3..Lebron would still be in the playoffs if the supporting cast didnt matter.

sefant77
05-21-2010, 03:15 PM
Of course no one knows how much thruth behind this:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=5208043

CHICAGO -- Chris Bosh's agent has told the Toronto Raptors that he's narrowed his list of preferred teams to five, two sources told ESPN.com's Chad Ford at the NBA draft camp.

Bosh
Bosh

The list of five teams -- Toronto plus the Chicago Bulls, Los Angeles Lakers, Miami Heat and New York Knicks, sources said -- were given to Toronto management in case the Raptors want to construct a sign-and-trade deal (assuming he doesn't re-sign with Toronto).

Bosh likes that option, sources told Ford, because he'd get one more year on his contract and could make more money.

Sources said the Raptors prefer a sign-and-trade if Bosh is intent on leaving as well. They likely would want a big man to replace the 6-10, 230-pound Bosh in the lineup.

One source said Bosh's decision hinges on where LeBron James signs.

"If LeBron decides to go to either New York or Chicago, I think that's where you'll see Chris land," the source told Ford. "If LeBron stays in Cleveland, I think the process is more wide open."

Bosh, 26, is an unrestricted free agent. He averaged 24 points per game last season and has averaged 20.2 points per game for his career.

dirno2000
05-21-2010, 03:22 PM
You're still not thinking about it from the perspective of a guy who thinks he's the best player in the entire word and the greatest thing since sliced bread. His ego isn't going to allow him to believe that his "legacy" depends on people other than himself.

There are two parts of his legacy, individual accolades and titles. He needs both to stand next to Jordan. Now If you're just talking about the individual stuff then you're right, he doesn't need anyone. By the time he's done his stats, MVP's and awards will speak for themselves. If that's all there was to it then he's fine but obviously it’s not.

To be talked about in the same terms as Jordan, Magic and Bird (among others) he needs to win not one but multiple titles. And if you don't think Lebron is aware that he needs help with that then I think you're selling him short. Maybe he thought that way when he was 20 but the last four years have shown otherwise.

Honestly if he thinks he can win a ring by himself then why would he come to Dallas? He’ll either stay in Cleveland or go to New York. The unique thing that we offer is the best chance to win it all next year because of Dirk and, to a lesser extent, the supporting cast.

And nobody is reasonably questioning Lebron's ability to be a lead dog. Not a single person. People are questioning his enthusiasm for Cleveland, his heart, and the quality of this teammates, not his ability to be the guy.

Keep in mind I’m not saying best player I’m saying lead dog. If you don’t think people are questioning that then we’re reading and listening to different things.

LonghornDub
05-21-2010, 03:32 PM
There are two parts of his legacy, individual accolades and titles. He needs both to stand next to Jordan. Now If you're just talking about the individual stuff then you're right, he doesn't need anyone. By the time he's done his stats, MVP's and awards will speak for themselves. If that's all there was to it then he's fine but obviously it’s not.

To be talked about in the same terms as Jordan, Magic and Bird (among others) he needs to win not one but multiple titles. And if you don't think Lebron is aware that he needs help with that then I think you're selling him short. Maybe he thought that way when he was 20 but the last four years have shown otherwise.

Honestly if he thinks he can win a ring by himself then why would he come to Dallas? He’ll either stay in Cleveland or go to New York. The unique thing that we offer is the best chance to win it all next year because of Dirk and, to a lesser extent, the supporting cast.

I'm not implying that he can win a ring by himself. I'm also not implying that he can equal Jordan without winning several rings. What I'm saying is that I think he is too egotistical to fully realize or admit either of these things. You're talking about the objective reality of the situation, which is absolutely correct. What I'm talking about is Lebron's skewed perception of the situation, which is tainted by his arrogance and ego.

Mark it down: if Lebron goes his entire career without a title, he will still be insisting during interviews that "you all have seen what I can do," etc., and talking about how great he is. It's not going to stop him from thinking he's the best player, even though he'll be wrong.

But that's sort of tangential to the point anyway. The point is that because of his ego, I really don't think he's going to even slightly base his decision on the ages of the other good players on the team he goes to. That's not what a dude like "the King" is concerned with.

quietsavant
05-21-2010, 03:41 PM
Of course no one knows how much thruth behind this:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=5208043
Hello all. It's been a bit.

Anyways, I think Bosh is seriously going to throw a wrench into our hopes of landing Bron.
If he pushes for new york or chicago, he gives Lebron, some serious second thoughts about both teams, as far as being able to compete.



EDIT: Now of course, both teams would have to give up a lot to land him. So, that leaves the question, would lebron sign on a team of him, bosh and 2 or 3 schmoes to win. i.e: chicago(give up noah and/or deng) knicks(dunno if they even have anything to give up)

The only way I see this working out is if they do a sign and trade with Miami(Beasley).

Underdog
05-21-2010, 03:43 PM
Mark it down: if Lebron goes his entire career without a title, he will still be insisting during interviews that "you all have seen what I can do," etc., and talking about how great he is. It's not going to stop him from thinking he's the best player, even though he'll be wrong.

Future Iverson/McGrady?

Underdog
05-21-2010, 03:44 PM
Hello all. It's been a bit.

Anyways, I think Bosh is seriously going to throw a wrench into our hopes of landing Bron.
If he pushes for new york or chicago, he gives Lebron, some serious second thoughts about both teams, as far as being able to compete

I'm going to say this for the millionth time: LeBron/Dirk > LeBron Bosh

quietsavant
05-21-2010, 03:52 PM
I'm going to say this for the millionth time: LeBron/Dirk > LeBron Bosh

We are on the same side of that coin UD, but I wonder what opinion, Lebron and his "advisors/team", might have on his ability to match with Bosh vs. Dirk. I see a lot of these guys, as having a bias towards dirk, the same way, the national media may sometimes have. We've all seen these idiotic PF rankings in which they rank Bosh higher than Dirk. Plus, the buddy factor as well (lebron and Bosh being olympic teammates). Hoping my speculation is a flaud idea.

Mavericks Rockets Fan
05-21-2010, 03:54 PM
I'm going to say this for the millionth time: LeBron/Dirk > LeBron Bosh

Not to mention they'd have an actual supporting cast unlike New York for example. They would have Haywood, Marion, Roddy or Butler (depending on how you envision the trade going down), Kidd, JET, and JJB. While NY would have nothing but Gallo + Junk around them.

Thespiralgoeson
05-21-2010, 03:56 PM
Hello all. It's been a bit.

Anyways, I think Bosh is seriously going to throw a wrench into our hopes of landing Bron.
If he pushes for new york or chicago, he gives Lebron, some serious second thoughts about both teams, as far as being able to compete.



EDIT: Now of course, both teams would have to give up a lot to land him. So, that leaves the question, would lebron sign on a team of him, bosh and 2 or 3 schmoes to win. i.e: chicago(give up noah and/or deng) knicks(dunno if they even have anything to give up)

The only way I see this working out is if they do a sign and trade with Miami(Beasley).

Bosh might be willing to take that gamble, but I don't think Lebron is. I think Lebron will ultimately go wherever he thinks is the clearest path to a championship. Even with Bosh, New York is a hell of a gamble.

Underdog
05-21-2010, 04:12 PM
Best-case scenario: Bosh goes to Miami, Wade re-signs, New York & New Jersey drop out of the conversation.

LeBron is left with the choices of Chicago or Dallas.

I like our chances if this happens...

Thespiralgoeson
05-21-2010, 04:22 PM
Best-case scenario: Bosh goes to Miami, Wade re-signs, New York & New Jersey drop out of the conversation.

LeBron is left with the choices of Chicago or Dallas.

I like our chances if this happens...

That seems like a much, much more likely scenario than Lebron and Bosh ending up in New York or anywhere else together.

Mavericks Rockets Fan
05-21-2010, 04:35 PM
Best-case scenario: Bosh goes to Miami, Wade re-signs, New York & New Jersey drop out of the conversation.

LeBron is left with the choices of Chicago or Dallas.

I like our chances if this happens...

And Boozer? I still see him and LeBron possibly going to New York to play together...

Thespiralgoeson
05-21-2010, 04:41 PM
And Boozer? I still see him and LeBron possibly going to New York to play together...

Once again, I just don't see any way Lebron throws his lot with New York. Even with Bosh, Boozer, Stoudemire, or whoever, that's still a HUGE risk.

FINtastic
05-21-2010, 05:25 PM
Once again, I just see any way Lebron throws his lot with New York. Even with Bosh, Boozer, Stoudemire, or whoever, that's still a HUGE risk.

I'm with you, I don't see the Knicks thing happening. The Knicks just don't have anything resembling a surrounding cast, and I just can't see that changing for the near-future.

The one place where I do think there there is a high probability of him signing with is Chicago. Very nice mix of pretty much everything LeBron could want.

Thespiralgoeson
05-21-2010, 05:31 PM
I'm with you, I don't see the Knicks thing happening. The one place where I do think there is a good chance of him going to is Chicago. Very nice mix of pretty much everything LeBron could want.

This is true, but frankly if it's between Chicago and Dallas, I like our chances. On top of having a better supporting cast to carry Lebron to a title, and not having to play in MJ's shadow, Dallas is also a better S&T option from Cleveland's end.

Frankly I think Lebron is much more likely to stay in Cleveland than he is to land in Chicago.

FINtastic
05-21-2010, 05:39 PM
This is true, but frankly if it's between Chicago and Dallas, I like our chances. On top of having a better supporting cast to carry Lebron to a title, and not having to play in MJ's shadow, Dallas is also a better S&T option from Cleveland's end.

Frankly I think Lebron is much more likely to stay in Cleveland than he is to land in Chicago.

I don't know, I kind of like the supporting cast Chicago has built (especially with nice young players like Rose and Noah). I think that's gotta be pretty appealing, especially compared with the aging, overpaid players he has to work with in Cleveland. If I'm betting between those two cities, I'm going with Chicago at this point.

Granted, I don't know where loyalty plays into all of this. Is LeBron way more loyal than I give him credit for? I guess that's what makes this summer interesting. But if he isn't, I can't see why he wouldn't bolt for a place like Chicago. I do think Dallas can offer some of the same things that would be appealing for LeBron, but with the caveat being that our supporting cast is a lot older.

mavs777
05-21-2010, 05:42 PM
Kidd-Lebron- Marion-DIRK- Hayood/ unknown not a bad lineup

Thespiralgoeson
05-21-2010, 05:51 PM
I don't know, I kind of like the supporting cast Chicago has built (especially with nice young players like Rose and Noah). I think that's gotta be pretty appealing, especially compared with the aging, overpaid players he has to work with in Cleveland. If I'm betting between those two cities, I'm going with Chicago at this point.

Granted, I don't know where loyalty plays into all of this. Is LeBron way more loyal than I give him credit for? I guess that's what makes this summer interesting. But if he isn't, I can't see why he wouldn't bolt for a place like Chicago. I do think Dallas can offer some of the same things that would be appealing for LeBron, but with the caveat being that our supporting cast is a lot older.

I could be wrong, but indeed I do think you are underestimating Lebron's loyalty a great deal. I don't have anything solid to back it up, but that's just the impression that I get from him. I think it would really pain him to leave Cleveland. Not only that, but I have to believe the spectra of Michael Jordan is going to be a factor into his decision as well.

I guess I just think it's going to take A LOT for him to leave Cleveland because of the way they've dominated the regular season the past couple of years. Lebron knows that even with the mediocre supporting cast he has there, they're only one small piece away from a title. Leaving Cleveland is NOT something he's going to do lightly. For him to bolt to another team, it has to be an almost guaranteed title, and I don't think Chicago qualifies (could be wrong.)

If I'm the Cavs' management, I'm doing everything I can to sweet-talk Lebron into taking his time making a decision, while trying to trade for a major supporting player in the meantime. The Cavs are certainly not helpless here. One good trade, and I'm almost positive Lebron will stay. And Lebron is undoubtedly going to consider all of his options thoroughly and talk to all potential suitors, so the Cavs have plenty of time to get a deal done as well.

sefant77
05-21-2010, 06:17 PM
Lebron wont pair up with Bosh with the Knicks. Gali/Bosh/Curry frontcourt will never be able to beat the Lakers. They need a good defense center and a good backup. Gortat is the only one kind of availabe but the Magic never gonna trade that "missing piece" inside the own conference. The only way the Knicks can pull that off is to trade on the same day Curry for Okafor and sign James and Bosh.

I totally could see James and Bosh signing with the Nets because of Lopez. Thats the center you will need the next years to beat the contenders. Bosh can move to the 4.

James and Bosh to the Bulls? Wont happen because its the same conference and Bulls just have to offer Hinrich or Deng in S&T and both Raps and Cavs say hell no to that players and contracts.

I still fear the Nets the most. They easily can pull off signing James and Bosh (maybe they have to dumb Yi/CDR for a TE to free up the last millions for the 2nd max contract).

Harris
Lee/CDR
James/Williams
Bosh/Favors/Yi
Lopez

FINtastic
05-21-2010, 06:23 PM
Lebron wont pair up with Bosh with the Knicks. Gali/Bosh/Curry frontcourt will never be able to beat the Lakers. They need a good defense center and a good backup. Gortat is the only one kind of availabe but the Magic never gonna trade that "missing piece" inside the own conference. The only way the Knicks can pull that off is to trade on the same day Curry for Okafor and sign James and Bosh.

I totally could see James and Bosh signing with the Nets because of Lopez. Thats the center you will need the next years to beat the contenders. Bosh can move to the 4.

James and Bosh to the Bulls? Wont happen because its the same conference and Bulls just have to offer Hinrich or Deng in S&T and both Raps and Cavs say hell no to that players and contracts.

I still fear the Nets the most. They easily can pull off signing James and Bosh (maybe they have to dumb Yi/CDR for a TE to free up the last millions for the 2nd max contract).

Harris
Lee/CDR
James/Williams
Bosh/Favors/Yi
Lopez

How are the Nets going to get the cap room to get both of them?

Dirkadirkastan
05-21-2010, 06:27 PM
http://www.pleasedontleave23.com/

Sheesh, what a sad pile of depressos over there. Come to Dallas, Lebron, let's get this party started!

quietsavant
05-21-2010, 06:53 PM
http://www.pleasedontleave23.com/

Sheesh, what a sad pile of depressos over there. Come to Dallas, Lebron, let's get this party started!

lol, their best effort at keeping Lebron, isn't 1/10th the site lebrontothemavs.com is.

sefant77
05-21-2010, 06:58 PM
How are the Nets going to get the cap room to get both of them?

Say the NBA salary cap is at $58 million next year. The Nets currently have a payroll of about $22 million. That's $36 million in cap space. A max contract starts out at 30% of the cap, which would be a starting salary of $17.4 million. Times two = $34.8 million. The Nets have enough for two max contracts.

Now granted, getting a top 4 pick means adding roughly $4.5-5 million to that payroll. So, if the Nets really want two max contract players (like a LeBron and Wade), then they'd either have to sell that lottery pick or find a way to dump Yi Jianlian without taking back a contract.


Have to see the exactly cap numbers. I also dont know how many (and how big) trade exceptions are around in the league, but its possible. And that sucks. And they not even need max-Bosh, David Lee should be availabe for 10-12mio.

At least they just got the 3rd pick.

Dirkadirkastan
05-21-2010, 07:04 PM
lol, their best effort at keeping Lebron, isn't 1/10th the site lebrontothemavs.com is.

But... they have Gilbert!

http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/7861/gilbert.png

Hey, stop laughing!

quietsavant
05-21-2010, 07:26 PM
But... they have Gilbert!

http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/7861/gilbert.png

Hey, stop laughing!

So let me get this straight:
Their best reasons lebron should stay are:

a. because of a reel of elementary school kids and a few fans reading a cue card on camera, saying "please don't leave lebron"

b. The goofy character with tears going down its eyes

c. A site so amateur, I believe I could have a better shot at building one with freesite.org

FINtastic
05-21-2010, 07:29 PM
Have to see the exactly cap numbers. I also dont know how many (and how big) trade exceptions are around in the league, but its possible. And that sucks. And they not even need max-Bosh, David Lee should be availabe for 10-12mio.

At least they just got the 3rd pick.

I didn't realize they had that much cap space. Well, maybe the Nets have a chance then if they can really score a second big name.

Thespiralgoeson
05-21-2010, 07:35 PM
I didn't realize they had that much cap space. Well, maybe the Nets have a chance then if they can really score a second big name.

I don't think the Nets are any less of a gamble than the Knicks, so again I can't see Lebron betting his entire future on either of those franchises. Besides, I seriously don't think he wants to spend the next two years in limbo while the Nets play in Newark.

fluid.forty.one
05-21-2010, 08:02 PM
http://www.pleasedontleave23.com/

Sheesh, what a sad pile of depressos over there. Come to Dallas, Lebron, let's get this party started!

hahahahaa

BGMaverick9
05-21-2010, 08:52 PM
I could be wrong, but indeed I do think you are underestimating Lebron's loyalty a great deal. I don't have anything solid to back it up, but that's just the impression that I get from him. I think it would really pain him to leave Cleveland. Not only that, but I have to believe the spectra of Michael Jordan is going to be a factor into his decision as well.

I guess I just think it's going to take A LOT for him to leave Cleveland because of the way they've dominated the regular season the past couple of years. Lebron knows that even with the mediocre supporting cast he has there, they're only one small piece away from a title. Leaving Cleveland is NOT something he's going to do lightly. For him to bolt to another team, it has to be an almost guaranteed title, and I don't think Chicago qualifies (could be wrong.)

If I'm the Cavs' management, I'm doing everything I can to sweet-talk Lebron into taking his time making a decision, while trying to trade for a major supporting player in the meantime. The Cavs are certainly not helpless here. One good trade, and I'm almost positive Lebron will stay. And Lebron is undoubtedly going to consider all of his options thoroughly and talk to all potential suitors, so the Cavs have plenty of time to get a deal done as well.

I have a hard time believing they're going to be able to work a trade for a supporting player. Plus I don't think they're just a small piece away from the title. They have coaching issues and very little creativity on the offensive end of the court. They mismanaged their use of Jamison and that's gotta fall on the staff. Williams is going to be incredibly inconsistent as a player and you can't have that from a starter with a thin supporting cast and championship aspirations. A tough defensive team (Boston) pretty much locked everyone else down and LeBron wasn't going to be able to do it himself. He didn't have a consistent second option by his side...they're not that close because they can't beat the fellow elite teams in a series.

I just don't see how they're THAT close, they luck into being close just because they're in the East. It's tougher opposition but Dallas has to be relatively close to Cleveland in terms of guaranteed title chances.

sefant77
05-21-2010, 09:07 PM
I have a hard time believing they're going to be able to work a trade for a supporting player. Plus I don't think they're just a small piece away from the title. They have coaching issues and very little creativity on the offensive end of the court. They mismanaged their use of Jamison and that's gotta fall on the staff. Williams is going to be incredibly inconsistent as a player and you can't have that from a starter with a thin supporting cast and championship aspirations. A tough defensive team (Boston) pretty much locked everyone else down and LeBron wasn't going to be able to do it himself. He didn't have a consistent second option by his side...they're not that close because they can't beat the fellow elite teams in a series.

I just don't see how they're THAT close, they luck into being close just because they're in the East. It's tougher opposition but Dallas has to be relatively close to Cleveland in terms of guaranteed title chances.

this.

Cavs were build for a win now and they failed.

They have no coach

They have no center right more and even if Shaq comes back, he isnt enough anymore.

Jamison and Parker are old

Mo Williams is inconsistent, their Jason Terry and for sure no #2 option.

Gibson and Hickson are average talents.

Yes James told few months ago he isnt done in Cleveland until he bring the ring, but it looks even worse there next year. He will remember Garnetts words...

Underdog
05-21-2010, 09:12 PM
And Boozer? I still see him and LeBron possibly going to New York to play together...

LeBron/Dirk > LeBron/Bosh > LeBron/Boozer

BGMaverick9
05-21-2010, 09:28 PM
this.

Cavs were build for a win now and they failed.

They have no coach

They have no center right more and even if Shaq comes back, he isnt enough anymore.

Jamison and Parker are old

Mo Williams is inconsistent, their Jason Terry and for sure no #2 option.

Gibson and Hickson are average talents.

Yes James told few months ago he isnt done in Cleveland until he bring the ring, but it looks even worse there next year. He will remember Garnetts words...

Yeah, I forgot to mention they were pretty much built for this season and last season. They ran into the Magic last year and then they rebuilt to try to take down the Magic this year and even pushed harder with going for Jamison and they still got throttled by a better team.

I do think Jamison is still talented and has plenty of gas left in the tank, he just wasn't used properly at all. Parker is pretty much a one dimensional scoring threat with defensive abilities.

Hickson DOES have some potential to amount to a relatively above average player but he's still got a while and they're not in the mode to start grooming players.

They definitely were built to win and win now and you got bounced in the second round. If you put all your eggs in the basket and came up short and it doesn't necessarily appear they'll get dramatically better...you're out of there. The difference with Dallas is they're in the position that Cleveland is in but they have the advantage of being able to pluck a star out of the crop. I just don't think Cleveland is going to be able to do that.

FINtastic
05-21-2010, 10:39 PM
Yeah, I forgot to mention they were pretty much built for this season and last season. They ran into the Magic last year and then they rebuilt to try to take down the Magic this year and even pushed harder with going for Jamison and they still got throttled by a better team.

I do think Jamison is still talented and has plenty of gas left in the tank, he just wasn't used properly at all. Parker is pretty much a one dimensional scoring threat with defensive abilities.

Hickson DOES have some potential to amount to a relatively above average player but he's still got a while and they're not in the mode to start grooming players.

They definitely were built to win and win now and you got bounced in the second round. If you put all your eggs in the basket and came up short and it doesn't necessarily appear they'll get dramatically better...you're out of there. The difference with Dallas is they're in the position that Cleveland is in but they have the advantage of being able to pluck a star out of the crop. I just don't think Cleveland is going to be able to do that.

These are pretty much my thoughts on Cleveland. They put all their eggs in one basket going for the ring, but unfortunately the basket spilled on the way home.

The only reason LeBron comes back to that is out of sheer loyalty. I don't think he can look at that situation and see a dynasty in the making. While I don't have any reason to doubt that LeBron is a loyal guy, I don't think he's that loyal to his hometown, especially when he needs rings in order to become a true legend of the game that he is capable of being.

FINtastic
05-21-2010, 10:44 PM
Btw, what is Shaq's contract like? Does he have any years left on that deal?

BGMaverick9
05-21-2010, 10:50 PM
Btw, what is Shaq's contract like? Does he have any years left on that deal?

His contract is done, he's a free agent.

Underdog
05-21-2010, 11:03 PM
Haywood/Shaq > Haywood/Damp

I wonder what the Big Diesel's price tag is? Would he re-team with LeBron in Dallas?

LeBron/Dirk/Kidd/Shaq - the marquee makes my pants soggy! ;)

Windmill360
05-21-2010, 11:20 PM
oh cmon I thought of that like two weeks ago, guys...

Yea Shaq has made it known before that he likes Dallas too. Not sure what he and Lebrons relationship is like right now though.

Thespiralgoeson
05-22-2010, 03:40 AM
I have a hard time believing they're going to be able to work a trade for a supporting player. Plus I don't think they're just a small piece away from the title. They have coaching issues and very little creativity on the offensive end of the court. They mismanaged their use of Jamison and that's gotta fall on the staff. Williams is going to be incredibly inconsistent as a player and you can't have that from a starter with a thin supporting cast and championship aspirations. A tough defensive team (Boston) pretty much locked everyone else down and LeBron wasn't going to be able to do it himself. He didn't have a consistent second option by his side...they're not that close because they can't beat the fellow elite teams in a series.

I just don't see how they're THAT close, they luck into being close just because they're in the East. It's tougher opposition but Dallas has to be relatively close to Cleveland in terms of guaranteed title chances.

I don't necessarily disagree with anything you're saying, but I'm just not sure Lebron sees it that way. You can argue whether or not they're one piece away from a title, but their dominance of the regular season would certainly suggest that they are (at least in Lebron's mind.) I'm not necessarily saying that Cleveland is his best shot at a title, but I could see the Cavs wooing him into staying much more easily than I could see another team convincing him otherwise.

As far as players being used incorrectly, that's an easy fix. Brown is obviously gone and then it's just a matter of finding a coach that Lebron likes(doesn't really matter if he's the best coach or not, just as long as Lebron thinks he is.)

Even if they can't trade for an ideal supporting star, I really think just a decent trade would be enough to convince him to stay.

You also have to take the big picture of the conference into consideration. You mentioned that they can't beat a fellow elite team. The thing is, who are the other elite teams in the East? Boston and Orlando, and that's it. How much longer is Boston going to be in the title picture? They're pretty damn old. Orlando is a very good team, but they hardly seem like an impassable roadblock to the title (the way, say, the Lakers are in the West.)

The bottom line is that it doesn't matter what any of us think about Cleveland's championship aspirations. The only thing that matters is what Lebron thinks. There's no obvious, clear-cut path to the championship, so Lebron is taking a pretty big risk anywhere he goes.

I hope you're right though. I hope his view of the Cavs' situation is as pessimistic as yours. Because if it is, then it pretty much comes down to Chicago and Dallas, and as I've said all throughout, I like Dallas' chances.

sefant77
05-22-2010, 07:49 AM
His contract is done, he's a free agent.

Shaw gonna wait which team can land the biggest names and then he gonna start talking how awesome this team and the franchise is blabla :rolleyes:

BGMaverick9
05-22-2010, 03:22 PM
I don't necessarily disagree with anything you're saying, but I'm just not sure Lebron sees it that way. You can argue whether or not they're one piece away from a title, but their dominance of the regular season would certainly suggest that they are (at least in Lebron's mind.) I'm not necessarily saying that Cleveland is his best shot at a title, but I could see the Cavs wooing him into staying much more easily than I could see another team convincing him otherwise.

As far as players being used incorrectly, that's an easy fix. Brown is obviously gone and then it's just a matter of finding a coach that Lebron likes(doesn't really matter if he's the best coach or not, just as long as Lebron thinks he is.)

Even if they can't trade for an ideal supporting star, I really think just a decent trade would be enough to convince him to stay.

You also have to take the big picture of the conference into consideration. You mentioned that they can't beat a fellow elite team. The thing is, who are the other elite teams in the East? Boston and Orlando, and that's it. How much longer is Boston going to be in the title picture? They're pretty damn old. Orlando is a very good team, but they hardly seem like an impassable roadblock to the title (the way, say, the Lakers are in the West.)

The bottom line is that it doesn't matter what any of us think about Cleveland's championship aspirations. The only thing that matters is what Lebron thinks. There's no obvious, clear-cut path to the championship, so Lebron is taking a pretty big risk anywhere he goes.

I hope you're right though. I hope his view of the Cavs' situation is as pessimistic as yours. Because if it is, then it pretty much comes down to Chicago and Dallas, and as I've said all throughout, I like Dallas' chances.

Dominance in the regular season is a totally different beast once you get into the playoffs, we all know that. You face teams that don't get to scout you as intensely as they'd like, there are injuries, B2Bs/4 games in 5 nights, yadda yadda yadda. Cleveland is clearly an above average team, at the very worst. They just had the mindset that they had to dominate the regular season and it'd be the same game in the playoffs when that clearly wasn't the situation.

Brown IS a problem, but he's not necessarily the biggest problem. You can easily make an argument that he is the problem or that the personnel is the fatal flaw. I still believe Jamison can get you 18 a night if he gets to work in the low post with his game...but once you get past him it gets very questionable what you're going to get on any given night. Based on that, I don't think they're just a supporting player away, he'll need a borderline all-star to go with James and I'm not sure how you're necessarily going to get that added on in Cleveland.

As for the elite teams in the East, yeah Boston is getting older but they've probably got Pierce and KG for at least another year or two and Rondo is going to keep emerging as the star, Perkins is a quality center as well, Tony Allen etc. etc. I still think they've got some time left and Orlando clearly was in the way of Cleveland last year and their piece that they got in attempt to stop Howard is definitely going to be out of the picture. With that, you could possibly say they're in the same spot as they were in last year: either the 2nd or 3rd best team in the East and that's more than likely going to get you beat in the semis or conference finals. Atlanta isn't an elite team and they're likely to slip but depending on what Miami does you could watch out for them to move up another level. I also think if Milwaukee can find a way to maintain health, they could push up a level and be near the bottom end of the elite in the East and give Cleveland a run for their money. It's slowly starting to get tougher in the East, that's my point.

I wouldn't necessarily say my assessment of Cleveland is pessimistic, it's pretty damn realistic lol. I know our situation is relatively shaky as well but ours has much more wiggle room for improvement in spite of the fact we are in the tougher conference.

Thespiralgoeson
05-22-2010, 04:23 PM
Dominance in the regular season is a totally different beast once you get into the playoffs, we all know that. You face teams that don't get to scout you as intensely as they'd like, there are injuries, B2Bs/4 games in 5 nights, yadda yadda yadda. Cleveland is clearly an above average team, at the very worst. They just had the mindset that they had to dominate the regular season and it'd be the same game in the playoffs when that clearly wasn't the situation.

Brown IS a problem, but he's not necessarily the biggest problem. You can easily make an argument that he is the problem or that the personnel is the fatal flaw. I still believe Jamison can get you 18 a night if he gets to work in the low post with his game...but once you get past him it gets very questionable what you're going to get on any given night. Based on that, I don't think they're just a supporting player away, he'll need a borderline all-star to go with James and I'm not sure how you're necessarily going to get that added on in Cleveland.

As for the elite teams in the East, yeah Boston is getting older but they've probably got Pierce and KG for at least another year or two and Rondo is going to keep emerging as the star, Perkins is a quality center as well, Tony Allen etc. etc. I still think they've got some time left and Orlando clearly was in the way of Cleveland last year and their piece that they got in attempt to stop Howard is definitely going to be out of the picture. With that, you could possibly say they're in the same spot as they were in last year: either the 2nd or 3rd best team in the East and that's more than likely going to get you beat in the semis or conference finals. Atlanta isn't an elite team and they're likely to slip but depending on what Miami does you could watch out for them to move up another level. I also think if Milwaukee can find a way to maintain health, they could push up a level and be near the bottom end of the elite in the East and give Cleveland a run for their money. It's slowly starting to get tougher in the East, that's my point.

I wouldn't necessarily say my assessment of Cleveland is pessimistic, it's pretty damn realistic lol. I know our situation is relatively shaky as well but ours has much more wiggle room for improvement in spite of the fact we are in the tougher conference.

Again, it doesn't matter what you or I think. I was never at any point arguing that Cleveland doesn't have any of these problems. My only point is that I think Lebron is more likely to stay in Cleveland than he is to go to another team. Not that Cleveland is any better than this team or that team.

Tell all this to Lebron.

BGMaverick9
05-22-2010, 04:43 PM
Again, it doesn't matter what you or I think. I was never at any point arguing that Cleveland doesn't have any of these problems. My only point is that I think Lebron is more likely to stay in Cleveland than he is to go to another team. Not that Cleveland is any better than this team or that team.

Tell all this to Lebron.

Already did bro :)
I even sent him the lebron to dallas song for a ringtone

FINtastic
05-22-2010, 05:25 PM
Again, it doesn't matter what you or I think. I was never at any point arguing that Cleveland doesn't have any of these problems. My only point is that I think Lebron is more likely to stay in Cleveland than he is to go to another team. Not that Cleveland is any better than this team or that team.

Tell all this to Lebron.

The nice thing is that the fans and the media are telling him this all offseason. He's receiving a large chunk of the blame for the loss in the playoffs (and he certainly deserves some of it). But don't you think a part of him has to look at his roster and say, "Was that all really on me?"

sefant77
05-22-2010, 05:32 PM
The nice thing is that the fans and the media are telling him this all offseason. He's receiving a large chunk of the blame for the loss in the playoffs (and he certainly deserves some of it). But don't you think a part of him has to look at his roster and say, "Was that all really on me?"

Yep. Mo and Jamison pulled a classic "Playoffs Mavs / Jason Terry"

Jamison disappearing in game 1, 5 and 6 and Mo in game 2, 4 and 5 of the Celtics series.

And behind them Cavs just had too less scoring weapons.

dirno2000
05-22-2010, 10:56 PM
I'm not implying that he can win a ring by himself. I'm also not implying that he can equal Jordan without winning several rings. What I'm saying is that I think he is too egotistical to fully realize or admit either of these things. You're talking about the objective reality of the situation, which is absolutely correct. What I'm talking about is Lebron's skewed perception of the situation, which is tainted by his arrogance and ego.

Mark it down: if Lebron goes his entire career without a title, he will still be insisting during interviews that "you all have seen what I can do," etc., and talking about how great he is. It's not going to stop him from thinking he's the best player, even though he'll be wrong.

But that's sort of tangential to the point anyway. The point is that because of his ego, I really don't think he's going to even slightly base his decision on the ages of the other good players on the team he goes to. That's not what a dude like "the King" is concerned with.

It seems the crux of the of the disagreement is that I give Lebron way more credit for having a realistic big picture view of things.

Lebron leaving Cleveland, where he as deep roots, for Dallas would be in itself an admission that he needs help. You don't have to go far from that point to assume that he's look at the age of the help.

Time will tell. If he's as egocentric as you say the Knicks are the only play.

Thespiralgoeson
05-23-2010, 03:46 AM
Already did bro :)
I even sent him the lebron to dallas song for a ringtone

Let me know what he says. Don't let Stern find out, or it's a 100k fine.

sefant77
05-23-2010, 01:12 PM
So sad...one more reason for James to leave :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qY1dQldCtOI

aquaadverse
05-24-2010, 09:56 AM
So sad...one more reason for James to leave :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qY1dQldCtOI

I wonder how many in the video booed Lebron during his poor performance against the Celtics.

Kidd Karma
05-24-2010, 06:12 PM
It seems the crux of the of the disagreement is that I give Lebron way more credit for having a realistic big picture view of things.

Lebron leaving Cleveland, where he as deep roots, for Dallas would be in itself an admission that he needs help. You don't have to go far from that point to assume that he's look at the age of the help.

Time will tell. If he's as egocentric as you say the Knicks are the only play.

The great one's needed help, MJ was nothing until Pippen and Grant got seasoned. Magic walked into Kareem, and Wilkes and Nixon. In recent years, the only team that lacked one hall of famer is Billups' Pistons....unless you count Coach Brown.

GuerillaBlack
05-26-2010, 10:03 AM
www.Houston4Bosh.com

Mav Addict
05-27-2010, 11:55 AM
www.DontNobodyWannaPlayinHouston.com (http://www.DontNobodyWannaPlayinHouston.com)

LonghornDub
05-27-2010, 12:39 PM
It seems the crux of the of the disagreement is that I give Lebron way more credit for having a realistic big picture view of things.

Lebron leaving Cleveland, where he as deep roots, for Dallas would be in itself an admission that he needs help. You don't have to go far from that point to assume that he's look at the age of the help.

Time will tell. If he's as egocentric as you say the Knicks are the only play.

But you're not just talking about whether he'd get help now. He absolutely would get help in Dallas now--Dirk is here. What you said is that he'd also be concerned with the ages of the team's stars, because he'll be worried about whether he'll have help down the road. I say there's absolutely no way a guy like him is thinking about that.

Certainly, he'll look at the current roster and whether the team is already a good one (Dallas, Chicago) or not (NY, NJ). But I just don't believe for a second that he's going to be scanning the roster ages and thinking to himself, "Oh man, if I go to Dallas, I'm screwed in 4-5 years when Dirk is too old."

Mavericks Rockets Fan
05-27-2010, 12:41 PM
www.DontNobodyWannaPlayinHouston.com (http://www.DontNobodyWannaPlayinHouston.com)

That page doesn't exist,...;)

Underdog
05-27-2010, 12:43 PM
But you're not just talking about whether he'd get help now. He absolutely would get help in Dallas now--Dirk is here. What you said is that he'd also be concerned with the ages of the team's stars, because he'll be worried about whether he'll have help down the road. I say there's absolutely no way a guy like him is thinking about that.

Certainly, he'll look at the current roster and whether the team is already a good one (Dallas, Chicago) or not (NY, NJ). But I just don't believe for a second that he's going to be scanning the roster ages and thinking to himself, "Oh man, if I go to Dallas, I'm screwed in 4-5 years when Dirk is too old."

Yeah, you have to win ONE ring before you start worrying about building a dynasty - I think LeBron is smart enough to realize this...

Dallas is easily his best "win-now" option. Name another top-10 player who could compliment LeBron better than Dirk (hell, name another top-10 player who would take a backseat to ANYONE in this league - Chris Bosh is the only guy I can think of and he's not as good as Dirk...)

KINGBEEF
05-27-2010, 02:12 PM
Yeah, you have to win ONE ring before you start worrying about building a dynasty - I think LeBron is smart enough to realize this...

Dallas is easily his best "win-now" option. Name another top-10 player who could compliment LeBron better than Dirk (hell, name another top-10 player who would take a backseat to ANYONE in this league - Chris Bosh is the only guy I can think of and he's not as good as Dirk...)


Well put. Dallas is easily his best "win-now" option. And that's not only clear to him but it's clear to the Analyst and it's clear to Mark Cuban and it's clear to Dirk. Now if we can only keep Cuban's mouth shut until July 1st.

BGMaverick9
05-27-2010, 07:15 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=5224873

KINGBEEF
05-27-2010, 07:23 PM
NJ is the 75% frontrunner for me.

It wont be Knicks or Heat.

I give us 20% and the other 5% anyone else...

Nets have Lopez (huge factor), Harris, several young players to pack in a deal (Lee, CDR, Williams, Yi), their pick, our pick AND probably also cap for 2 max players (and if not straight then after dumping one minor talent for a TE).

James can sell 2010 and 2012 new jerseys to the world...

Would be allready ok to grab Lee or Boozer.

Harris
CDR/Williams/Lee
James
Boozer or D.Lee
Lopez

Wall/Turner?!

uhhh, I'm not sure if you notice but Devin Harris has a problem passing the ball and plus NJ's bench is terrible. Why go to NJ when he can stay in Cleveland and have the same outcome

KINGBEEF
05-27-2010, 07:25 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=5224873

My question is how come Dirk didn't get invited to this fest?

sefant77
05-27-2010, 08:05 PM
Great analysis from Cavs-Boston Game 5 and 6.

No way in hell James stays in Cleveland with Mo and Jamison as #2 and #3.

He should be dying to play with Kidd and Dirk if you see this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60YWxNt9zbs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qkuO9p8slSI&feature=channel

Mavericks Rockets Fan
05-27-2010, 08:27 PM
My question is how come Dirk didn't get invited to this fest?

Because he is staying in Dallas,....;)

BGMaverick9
05-27-2010, 09:17 PM
It makes me think that LeBron sits at the head of the table obviously in the meeting, decides to see if Bosh or Wade would go with him to location X (Probably NY or NJ) and if not, then Wade talks to Bosh to see if he'd come to Miami with him.

Joe is basically picking up the tab on the entire meeting...he's probably irrelevant to the "grand scheme"

dirno2000
05-27-2010, 11:56 PM
But you're not just talking about whether he'd get help now. He absolutely would get help in Dallas now--Dirk is here. What you said is that he'd also be concerned with the ages of the team's stars, because he'll be worried about whether he'll have help down the road. I say there's absolutely no way a guy like him is thinking about that.

He should be. And based on everything I've heard about him he's a thoughtful guy and listens to those in his inner circle. Nobody's going to inform him that he might wanna look at the age of his supporting cast?

Certainly, he'll look at the current roster and whether the team is already a good one (Dallas, Chicago) or not (NY, NJ). But I just don't believe for a second that he's going to be scanning the roster ages and thinking to himself, "Oh man, if I go to Dallas, I'm screwed in 4-5 years when Dirk is too old."

4 or 5 years is the optimistic view. Dirk won't be the same player in three years that he is today. Will he be good enough? Depends on who else is on the team. Keep in mind Lebron wouldn't just be coming to play with Dirk. There's also Kidd, Marion, Terry and Butler to consider. The first three are clearly in decline and Butler may be.

Yes the owner is willing to spend but as you well know, that alone isn't always enough. You almost have to get lucky and have just the right assets for just the right player at just the right time. Again, If I'm Lebron that's not a gamble I'm willing to take. I know you think his ego is so big that he won't consider or care about these things and that's where we disagree.

sefant77
05-28-2010, 09:58 AM
uhhh, I'm not sure if you notice but Devin Harris has a problem passing the ball and plus NJ's bench is terrible. Why go to NJ when he can stay in Cleveland and have the same outcome

Because Harris as a bigger trade value, they could ship him.

And their bench is young, they can pack any of these guys with a pick for a veteran...

KINGBEEF
05-28-2010, 10:51 AM
Because Harris as a bigger trade value, they could ship him.

And their bench is young, they can pack any of these guys with a pick for a veteran...

so are you keeping Harris or shipping him away in a packed deal as you so call it. So, it seems that you want to get Boozer up there too? Too much red tape with that guy, and plus he wants money and he's played in the King's Court before and well we can see that he's not playing there anymore. Richtig!

sefant77
05-28-2010, 08:27 PM
I wanted to point out that the Nets not even need to ship Bosh or Amare beside James, they also could go with the 2nd tier PFs like Lee or Boozer to become a awesome team...

grndmstr_c
05-29-2010, 12:09 AM
I am not expecting the Nets to have a happy summer. Coming off one of the worst seasons ever, having the value of their most prized asset from one year ago (Devin) plummet on the heels of an injury plagued and relatively ineffective season, losing out in the draft lottery, trying to sell a new owner who's a near-complete unknown to a bunch of top-tier payers looking for a sure thing, playing second fiddle to the Knicks in the New York area...I just don't see them winning the allegiance of any of the top guys over the likes of Chicago, Miami, Dallas or even NYK.

KINGBEEF
05-29-2010, 07:04 AM
I agree I just think that the mountain is too high to climb right now for the Nets. New Owner, New Coach, New Roster, pretty soon New City. Just doesn't add up

sefant77
05-29-2010, 10:07 AM
Without the new CBA coming in 2011 i could see James signing 3 year contract (4th player option) with the Mavs. Winning a ring here (and cut out the pressure to get one finally) and then signing in 3-4 with Knicks or Brooklyn Bouncers...

But with the CBA i think he is looking for that 5-6 years contract right now...

clutch#41
06-04-2010, 01:04 PM
http://sports.yahoo.com/
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=5252256
Danny Ferry is Gone
So the Gm and Coach are gone..I believe Lebron has already told him he's not coming back. why else would he step down???

Thespiralgoeson
06-04-2010, 01:38 PM
I am not expecting the Nets to have a happy summer. Coming off one of the worst seasons ever, having the value of their most prized asset from one year ago (Devin) plummet on the heels of an injury plagued and relatively ineffective season, losing out in the draft lottery, trying to sell a new owner who's a near-complete unknown to a bunch of top-tier payers looking for a sure thing, playing second fiddle to the Knicks in the New York area...I just don't see them winning the allegiance of any of the top guys over the likes of Chicago, Miami, Dallas or even NYK.

It does sound pretty ridiculous, doesn't it? I think the final straw is that they won't be in Brooklyn for another two seasons at best. Lebron is at the peak of his abilities right now. I can't imagine him being okay with spending the next two years playing in Newark.

Seriously, when you list it all out together like that, it sounds almost as ridiculous as Lebron playing for the Clippers.

fluid.forty.one
06-04-2010, 09:23 PM
It does sound pretty ridiculous, doesn't it? I think the final straw is that they won't be in Brooklyn for another two seasons at best. Lebron is at the peak of his abilities right now. I can't imagine him being okay with spending the next two years playing in Newark.

Seriously, when you list it all out together like that, it sounds almost as ridiculous as Lebron playing for the Clippers.

LeBron playing for the Clippers would actually be pretty sweet if they were good. The LA-LA / LeBron-Kobe rivalry would be nuts.

Windmill360
06-26-2010, 11:48 AM
LeBron James(notes) is planning to invite six teams to meet him over the first three days of free agency, and rap mogul Jay-Z and Russian billionaire Mikhail Prokhorov will be part of a New Jersey Nets contingent that will make the first presentation on July 1 in the Akron, Ohio, area, league sources told Yahoo! Sports.

James and his advisors plan to have the Nets, New York Knicks, Chicago Bulls, Los Angeles Clippers, Miami Heat and Cleveland Cavaliers make presentations. Yahoo! Sports first reported on Thursday night that James would be taking appointments with teams on July 1 to begin his free-agency process.

MORE (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=A9G_XIxepCVMAS4BzcM5nYcB?slug=aw-lebronjayz062510)

No Mavs in there? Even the clips are invited...

dalger
06-26-2010, 12:30 PM
MORE (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=A9G_XIxepCVMAS4BzcM5nYcB?slug=aw-lebronjayz062510)

No Mavs in there? Even the clips are invited...

That would be a little discouraging, to be honest. Not that I was or am expecting a lot in this respect.

Underdog
06-26-2010, 12:35 PM
MORE (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=A9G_XIxepCVMAS4BzcM5nYcB?slug=aw-lebronjayz062510)

No Mavs in there? Even the clips are invited...

Watch - after all this noise he'll probably just end up re-signing with the Cavs...

DevinHarriswillstart
06-26-2010, 02:18 PM
To be fair, all of those teams have straight up cap room to sign him.

I'm content to have my hopes high for JJ either way. He might not be the star Dirk needs, but he is the best 2 we'd have since Finley. Plus, he'd be a good fit playing next to Roddy. Remember that getting Lebron would undoubtedly cost Roddy where as JJ probably wouldn't. I don't see the Mavs trading Roddy for JJ.

EricaLubarsky
06-26-2010, 02:56 PM
Were we ever in the LBJ race in the first place? Its highly doubtful in my opinion

As I see it...
60% re-signs with Cleveland
25% signs with Chicago
8% signs with Miami
5% signs with NY
1% SnT with Dallas
1% misc other improbably outcomes

Plus its hard to go court him when we really can't sign him. We dont have the market of NYC, we dont have the young nucleus or market of CHI, we don't have the nightlife, beaches and Wade of Miami...with solid options elsewhere could we really convince him that he wants Dallas so much that he'd demand a sign-n-trade to us? I dont see it especially for a guy like LeBron

FINtastic
06-26-2010, 04:24 PM
60% chance of resigning with Cleveland? I think you are being way too generous to the Cavs here.

Windmill360
06-26-2010, 09:24 PM
The Clips have the cap room to sign James?

Underdog
06-26-2010, 09:41 PM
The Clips have the cap room to sign James?

$33.5mil on the books...

(although I'd be happy to take Kaman off their hands to help facilitate a career-ending trade that sends LeBron to the Clips...)

Windmill360
06-28-2010, 12:20 AM
In hindsight, our Fastbreak FA panel forgot a vital element: no FA - LeBron, Joe, Bosh - wants to forfeit $30m. S&T still No. 1 objective.

- RicBucher Twitter

dirno2000
06-28-2010, 01:01 AM
In hindsight, our Fastbreak FA panel forgot a vital element: no FA - LeBron, Joe, Bosh - wants to forfeit $30m. S&T still No. 1 objective.

- RicBucher Twitter

This a huge point that seems to be getting overlooked. Yes Miami could, in theory, resign Wade then sign Lebron and Bosh to "max" deals. But would Bosh and Lebron be willing to play with Wade knowing he's making more than them? It sounds like a silly question considering the numbers but I don't think they would. And of course the heat gutted their roster to the point that they don't have any salary matching assets for a S&T. Would a team be willing to dump a contract they don't want so the Heat could use the player (along with maybe a pick) in a S&T with Cleveland or Toronto? Even if that were the case, why would the Cavs or the Raptors want that player on their cap?

The Bulls and the Knicks have the same problem to a lesser extent (they at least have Deng and Lee respectively). The Knicks are used to sucking but Miami and Chicago could very well end up worse than they were before if they can't lure the right players. Those teams that created cap space are basically making an all in bet. It's going to be fun to watch.

mac222b
06-28-2010, 05:11 AM
This a huge point that seems to be getting overlooked. Yes Miami could, in theory, resign Wade then sign Lebron and Bosh to "max" deals. But would Bosh and Lebron be willing to play with Wade knowing he's making more than them? It sounds like a silly question considering the numbers but I don't think they would. And of course the heat gutted their roster to the point that they don't have any salary matching assets for a S&T. Would a team be willing to dump a contract they don't want so the Heat could use the player (along with maybe a pick) in a S&T with Cleveland or Toronto? Even if that were the case, why would the Cavs or the Raptors want that player on their cap?

The Bulls and the Knicks have the same problem to a lesser extent (they at least have Deng and Lee respectively). The Knicks are used to sucking but Miami and Chicago could very well end up worse than they were before if they can't lure the right players. Those teams that created cap space are basically making an all in bet. It's going to be fun to watch.

i agree man. i don't care how much they make 30 million is still 30 million. a guy like Bosh can maybe make some of that back in endorsements in NY. but it's one of the best things we have going in our favor. that an owner thats willing to spend. and one of the top 5 or 10 players in the league :P

jthig32
06-28-2010, 07:22 AM
This a huge point that seems to be getting overlooked. Yes Miami could, in theory, resign Wade then sign Lebron and Bosh to "max" deals. But would Bosh and Lebron be willing to play with Wade knowing he's making more than them? It sounds like a silly question considering the numbers but I don't think they would. And of course the heat gutted their roster to the point that they don't have any salary matching assets for a S&T. Would a team be willing to dump a contract they don't want so the Heat could use the player (along with maybe a pick) in a S&T with Cleveland or Toronto? Even if that were the case, why would the Cavs or the Raptors want that player on their cap?

The Bulls and the Knicks have the same problem to a lesser extent (they at least have Deng and Lee respectively). The Knicks are used to sucking but Miami and Chicago could very well end up worse than they were before if they can't lure the right players. Those teams that created cap space are basically making an all in bet. It's going to be fun to watch.

Keep in mind that if a team is far enough under the salary cap to sign a player outright, they don't need matching salary to send back in a sign and trade. They can just send cash and picks and absorb the salary.

So the question really is whether they have enough assets like picks and cash to entice a team into a sign and trade.

SMC0007
06-28-2010, 10:31 AM
Were we ever in the LBJ race in the first place? Its highly doubtful in my opinion

As I see it...
60% re-signs with Cleveland
25% signs with Chicago
8% signs with Miami
5% signs with NY
1% SnT with Dallas
1% misc other improbably outcomes

Plus its hard to go court him when we really can't sign him. We dont have the market of NYC, we dont have the young nucleus or market of CHI, we don't have the nightlife, beaches and Wade of Miami...with solid options elsewhere could we really convince him that he wants Dallas so much that he'd demand a sign-n-trade to us? I dont see it especially for a guy like LeBron


If LBJ wants to win AND be batman #1 option we have a small chance. Thats IF he wants to win at all costs. My guess is that he doesn't want to win as much as Dirk or he would put his money where his mouth is just like Dirk seems willing to do.

If anyone really has their fingers crossed about us getting him or would possibly be upset if we didn't, they need to be checked in immediately. I still stand firmly on best case scenario JJ and or an upgrade of depth at the center position.

dirno2000
06-28-2010, 10:52 AM
Keep in mind that if a team is far enough under the salary cap to sign a player outright, they don't need matching salary to send back in a sign and trade. They can just send cash and picks and absorb the salary.

So the question really is whether they have enough assets like picks and cash to entice a team into a sign and trade.

That totally slipped my mind. You're right cash, picks and Beasley would be better than nothing for the Cavs or Raps.

aquaadverse
06-28-2010, 12:46 PM
This a huge point that seems to be getting overlooked. Yes Miami could, in theory, resign Wade then sign Lebron and Bosh to "max" deals. But would Bosh and Lebron be willing to play with Wade knowing he's making more than them? It sounds like a silly question considering the numbers but I don't think they would. And of course the heat gutted their roster to the point that they don't have any salary matching assets for a S&T. Would a team be willing to dump a contract they don't want so the Heat could use the player (along with maybe a pick) in a S&T with Cleveland or Toronto? Even if that were the case, why would the Cavs or the Raptors want that player on their cap?

The Bulls and the Knicks have the same problem to a lesser extent (they at least have Deng and Lee respectively). The Knicks are used to sucking but Miami and Chicago could very well end up worse than they were before if they can't lure the right players. Those teams that created cap space are basically making an all in bet. It's going to be fun to watch.

Considering Miami has essentially been Wade and expiring contracts in sneakers for the last couple of years, the only way they'd be worse is if Wade left, which seems unlikely, or Riley spent the cap space on crack. All Wade is really pushing for is a significant roster upgrade and there's a big candy jar even after the bourbon truffles are picked off the top.

Riley has been working on this gambit for a couple of seasons and has been up front about it which explains why Wade hasn't done an '07 Kobe fit.

If he doesn't think he has a legitimate shot at someone he thinks deserves a max contract, again unlikely, he'll start dealing for rum balls who are aware their value only remains high while the truffles are being sniffed and then try to find some Steve Kerrs.

Jon Avalon
06-28-2010, 04:55 PM
Hmmm, Wade appears to have us on his 3 team interview list.

http://www.dallasbasketball.com/fullColumn.php?id=3187

DirkFTW
06-28-2010, 05:41 PM
Hmmm, Wade appears to have us on his 3 team interview list.

http://www.dallasbasketball.com/fullColumn.php?id=3187

He just misses punching Mavs fans in the nutsack.

KINGBEEF
06-28-2010, 05:53 PM
Hmmm, Wade appears to have us on his 3 team interview list.

http://www.dallasbasketball.com/fullColumn.php?id=3187

go figure!!!

Dirkenstien
06-28-2010, 06:33 PM
Yep, I must say that is surprising.

dirno2000
06-28-2010, 10:56 PM
According to Larry Coon the Heat still don't have enough cap room sign Wade and two max free agents. The final numbers won't be available until the 7th but he doesn't think dumping Beasley gets them all the way there either.

If true that could kill the Wade/James/Bosh talk as I can't see any of them leaving money on the table. Also, Chicago doesn't have enough to sign two max free agents unless they can move Deng.

BGMaverick9
06-28-2010, 11:09 PM
According to Larry Coon the Heat still don't have enough cap room sign Wade and two max free agents. The final numbers won't be available until the 7th but he doesn't think dumping Beasley gets them all the way there either.

If true that could kill the Wade/James/Bosh talk as I can't see any of them leaving money on the table. Also, Chicago doesn't have enough to sign two max free agents unless they can move Deng.

Was that off his twitter account?

For anyone who is interested, he's having a chat tomorrow on hoopsworld.

dirno2000
06-28-2010, 11:50 PM
Yep, he's been pretty active. The chat is Wednesday BTW.

BGMaverick9
06-28-2010, 11:53 PM
Yep, he's been pretty active. The chat is Wednesday BTW.

Doh! Yup, Wednesday...

I trust Coon's analysis of the situation, looks like the situation is still nice for both of those teams...but not so pretty as they had hoped.

Underdog
06-29-2010, 12:05 AM
Sources said James remains committed to fielding free-agent pitches from several teams when free agency officially opens Thursday at 12:01 a.m. ET, with the Chicago Bulls continuing to rank as a highly appealing destination and a return to Cleveland still figuring prominently in his thinking and with the Dallas Mavericks looming as an intriguing outsider.

link (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=5338472)

Yesterday we weren't part of the LeBron conversation.

This morning we were considered a "long-shot dark horse".

Tonight we're being called an "intriguing outsider".


Momentum...

MaVs 41 BaLler
06-29-2010, 12:16 AM
We're gonna make a splash like always. But it's always not been enough. Hopefully it will be this season. I freaking killed my grades hoping the mavs would make it to the finals....

quietsavant
06-29-2010, 12:36 AM
A modified version of the ballyhooed free-agent summit that was initially suggested and then downplayed by Dwyane Wade has indeed taken place, ESPN.com has learned.

Sources close to the situation said Monday night that three of the biggest names in basketball -- Wade, Chris Bosh and LeBron James -- met over the weekend in Miami to seriously discuss their futures, with a focus on the increasingly plausible possibility of those three teaming up with Wade's Heat.

LeBron Tracker

James Where will LeBron James land? We're keeping tabs on the King. Here's the latest. LeBron Tracker

Yet sources with knowledge of the meeting stressed to ESPN.com that James, while clearly intrigued by the possibility of forming a star-studded Miami trio with Wade and Bosh, has not yet committed to leaving his hometown Cleveland Cavaliers for South Beach.

One source did label Miami as the new frontrunner to land James in a package deal with Bosh and a re-signed Wade but also cautioned that James was "non-committal" with the start of free agency fast approaching.

Sources said James remains committed to fielding free-agent pitches from several teams when free agency officially opens Thursday at 12:01 a.m. ET, with the Chicago Bulls continuing to rank as a highly appealing destination and a return to Cleveland still figuring prominently in his thinking and with the Dallas Mavericks looming as an intriguing outsider.

Earlier Monday, Fox Sports Radio's Stephen A. Smith reported on his morning radio show and via his Twitter feed that James and Bosh have committed to joining Wade in Miami. The South Florida Sun-Sentinel newspaper, in a report on its website Monday afternoon, quoted a source close to Wade as saying that the 2006 NBA Finals MVP "believes his team is poised to pull off a free-agency coup" by signing James and Bosh and re-signing Wade.

Unless Miami trades away former No. 2 overall pick Michael Beasley to a team with salary-cap space, so it can avoid taking salary back, Heat president Pat Riley will not be able to offer the estimated 2010-11 maximum salary of $16.5 million to all three Team USA stars.

But sources told ESPN.com that James, Wade and Bosh all expressed confidence at the meeting that contractual complexities to make this ambitious triple signing work can be worked out, although it was not immediately clear if all three players would receive an equal amount or if one or two would receive the max. Another variable is whether Bosh would be willing to sign with the Heat outright or if he wants to hold out for a sign-and-trade.

Toronto Raptors general manager Bryan Colangelo acknowledged Monday for the first time in a radio interview with the Fan590 in Toronto that "it's becoming more and more clear" that the prospect of Bosh re-signing with the Raptors is "not going to happen." But sources close to the situation have maintained for months that Bosh was likely to work with the Raptors on a sign-and-trade if he ultimately decided to leave in free agency, thereby ensuring that Toronto doesn't lose him without compensation and enabling Bosh to get an extra year on his contract potentially worth as much as $30 million.

Sources insisted, meanwhile, that other scenarios were discussed at the weekend meeting apart from the Miami plan. One source said James' admiration for Bulls legend Michael Jordan is such that he is determined to hear Chicago's pitch later this week, keeping alive the possibility that both James and Bosh could still wind up together with the Bulls.

In that scenario, sources said, James and Bosh would join Derrick Rose and Joakim Noah in Chicago, while Wade would hope to be joined in Miami by close friend Carlos Boozer, who was not at the meeting.

Sources said James, furthermore, has not ruled out staying with the Cavaliers. Although Cleveland does not have the financial flexibility or the trade assets to import Bosh or Wade and enhance its chances of retaining this summer's face of free agency, James is a proud Ohioan who is said to be still wrestling with the notion of leaving his home state, no matter how enticing the possibilities are in Miami and Chicago.

The Sun-Sentinel reported that Wade is also exploring his options by planning free-agent sitdowns in coming days with the Bulls and Mavericks. ESPN.com had previously reported that Wade and Bosh are scheduled to be in New York on Friday for separate recruiting visits with the New York Knicks and New Jersey Nets.

It was not immediately clear, as details of the Miami option emerged, whether Riley intends to stay in his front-office role and let coach Erik Spoelstra return for his third season or if, say, James urges the 65-year-old to return to the bench for a third stint coaching the Heat.

Chris Broussard is a senior NBA writer for ESPN The Magazine and Marc Stein is a senior NBA writer for ESPN.com.


http://sports.espn.go.com/dallas/nba/news/story?id=5338472

The whole thing is all a sham. It is truly my belief that they have made up their minds and this whole courting thing is just a formality. Book it, it will be Lebron, wade and bosh making about 45-48 mil of the miami cap. I wish riley luck filling up his team with spares.

tomly
06-29-2010, 02:46 AM
well hope they kick Kobe ass!

mac222b
06-29-2010, 04:26 AM
i just don't see any one dumb enough to take twice rehabbed douchebag tweener Beasley. i don't see LeBron or Bosh accepting less than max $ at max years. and i don't see Wade and LeBron sharing. i call bullshit. if they do it LeBron is viewed as weak. Miami is Wade's team. Bosh wants to be third wheel?

jthig32
06-29-2010, 07:26 AM
According to Larry Coon the Heat still don't have enough cap room sign Wade and two max free agents. The final numbers won't be available until the 7th but he doesn't think dumping Beasley gets them all the way there either.

If true that could kill the Wade/James/Bosh talk as I can't see any of them leaving money on the table. Also, Chicago doesn't have enough to sign two max free agents unless they can move Deng.

I'm glad that got confirmed. I was pretty sure that was the case but was starting to doubt my position with so many people talking about it.

Beyond having enough space, I don't see how Miami would have enough assets to pull off SnT's with both Cleveland and Toronto.

DevinHarriswillstart
06-29-2010, 08:19 AM
Lebron, Bosh, and Wade in Miami? Talk about headline gold. A lot of sports news outlets are making tons of money right now. Not even saying it's a bad thing because come on, this is fun no?

That just reeks of hot air....this sentence stuck out for me....

"One source did label Miami as the new frontrunner to land James in a package deal with Bosh and a re-signed Wade but also cautioned that James was "non-committal" with the start of free agency fast approaching."

KINGBEEF
06-29-2010, 08:38 AM
Just found out that Cleveland will not do a sign and trade no matter what. They do not want to be known as the team that traded Lebron away. They would rather let him go for a ridiculous price. Bummer!!!

Dirkenstien
06-29-2010, 08:53 AM
Just found out that Cleveland will not do a sign and trade no matter what. They do not want to be known as the team that traded Lebron away. They would rather let him go for a ridiculous price. Bummer!!!

http://espn.go.com/blog/dallasmavericks/post/_/id/4669690/buchers-report-is-bad-news-for-mavs


If Rick Bucher's sources are correct, the Mavericks are out of the LeBron James race before it even starts.

The ESPN NBA reporter is reporting that the Cavaliers have no intention of being part of a sign-and-trade should James choose to leave Cleveland.

The Mavericks are over the salary cap, so a sign-and-trade deal is their only hope of acquiring King James.


Of course Cleveland is going to say that. They still have hope in resigning him. How much damage would it do to their chances of resigning Lebron if Cleveland started saying they were open to S&T scenarios? Right now they're proud, a bit hopeful, and a bit cocky but once Lebron is on the cusp of leaving to a conference rival I'm guessing they'll be much more inclined to change that posturing stance. They simply have very little if no leverage.

Jus think about it, what are their options here? Either Cleveland wallows in self pity while Lebron goes to a conference rival to start a potential dynasty that Cleveland will have to play at least four times a year OR Cleveland can get some nice young pieces back in return while having at least some kind of say in where he ends up.

They're selling. I'm not buying.

FreshJive
06-29-2010, 09:38 AM
Cleveland's main selling point is the extra year. If they refuse to sign and trade he has to go there to get it.

Dirkenstien
06-29-2010, 09:50 AM
Cleveland's main selling point is the extra year. If they refuse to sign and trade he has to go there to get it.

That may work with guys like Joe Johnson who are fighting for their last big contract but when you're talking about someone like Lebron who is both young and an absolute marketing force then that extra year doesn't hold much weight at all. If Cleveland's main selling point is that extra year then they should be preparing for the worst.

I'm not saying he wouldn't want it, just that if Cleveland plans on trying to hamstring him with an "extra year take it or leave it" ultimatum then they may just as well pack his bags for him.

FreshJive
06-29-2010, 09:55 AM
That may work with guys like Johnson who are fighting for their last big contract but when you're talking about someone like Lebron who is both young and an absolute marketing force then that extra year doesn't hold much weight at all.

I'm not saying he wouldn't want it, just that if Cleveland plans on trying to hamstring him with an "extra year take it or leave it" ultimatum then they may just as well pack his bags for him.

With the new CBA there is no way for him to know how much he might be giving up that year. I'm with you though. It won't change his mind.

KINGBEEF
06-29-2010, 10:13 AM
I feel a little better now. You both make good points. Yeah i'm quite sure he's leaving Cleveland, just wondering how we can still pull off one of the biggest transactions that this franchise has ever seen?

Dirkenstien
06-29-2010, 10:14 AM
Just as a reference, here is an example where James turned down a more lucrative offer before:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1028848/index.htm


James, the certain No. 1 pick in June's NBA draft, signed a seven-year deal with Nike last week. But the 6'8" high school senior from Akron did not go with the company that dangled the most dollars. Nike's offer, which included a $10 million signing bonus and could bring James more than double the reported $90 million if sales goals are met, was more than $15 million lower than a bid by Reebok, according to one shoe-company executive.

Why did James take less cash?

...Both Adidas and Reebok sought to make up for any shortcomings with whopping offers. But the Adidas pitch was based on incentives, leaving Reebok's bid the most lucrative on the table.

...That night James, his family and Goodwin met with Reebok CEO Paul Fireman at an Akron hotel, and Goodwin said James left the meeting "thinking he was going to sign with Reebok."

Yet hours later James had second thoughts. He liked Nike's product best and, according to Goodwin, appreciated its cultivation of "the superstars before him." Around midnight James told Goodwin, "Make the deal with Nike."


If dangling one extra year is all Cleveland has going for them then they're in trouble. Cleveland management ruling out the possibility of working a S&T sounds like a decision based purely on emotion and not reason. Saying it is one thing, but if they actually do refuse to look at S&T possibilities when it comes down to it that would flat out be bad business and could be an indication to Lebron of what kind of people he'd be entrusting his legacy to by resigning.

FINtastic
06-29-2010, 02:19 PM
Yeah, this whole deal with Cleveland comes down to leverage. Cleveland is trying to gain leverage by refusing to sign and trade. However, Lebron ultimately holds the keys to the car here. If Lebron can convince Cleveland that he has no intention of resigning, Cleveland's leverage drops to zero, and you better believe that would be willing to sign and trade if the price is right. The key here is he needs an attractive team that he can leave for, and I think he has that in Chicago. If Cleveland tries to play hardball here, I ultimately see Lebron just packing his bags and heading over to the Windy City.

So Cleveland can instead be known as the franchise that let Lebron walk away for nothing.

DevinHarriswillstart
06-29-2010, 03:44 PM
According to his agent, Wade was in Chicago this past weekend...whoops.....

"However, this report of a summit over the weekend in Miami involving Dwyane is untrue. He was here in Chicago with his kids and when he left town on Sunday, he was not headed back to Miami."

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/chi-bulls-update-0629,0,1291088.story


It's ok though...tomorrow the Nets get to be the team that lands all three stars.....

MavsX
06-29-2010, 03:58 PM
i really will be pissed off if lebron, wade and bosh get together on one team.

KINGBEEF
06-29-2010, 04:14 PM
According to this agent, Wade was in Chicago this past weekend...whoops.....

"However, this report of a summit over the weekend in Miami involving Dwyane is untrue. He was here in Chicago with his kids and when he left town on Sunday, he was not headed back to Miami."

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/chi-bulls-update-0629,0,1291088.story


It's ok though...tomorrow the Nets get to be the team that lands all three stars.....




i mean do these guys have us by the balls or what?

mac222b
06-29-2010, 06:05 PM
i really will be pissed off if lebron, wade and bosh get together on one team.

it would be bad for basketball if they did

MavsX
06-29-2010, 09:09 PM
it would be bad for basketball if they did

I know, that's what i'm saying. It would be worse than the ridiculous BS trade that the lakers got when they get gasol. Look what happened with that crap. 2 back to back titles.

LonghornDub
06-30-2010, 01:12 AM
chrisbosh

After all these years... Just 24 hrs left..... Wow. I'm getting anxious.

Doesn't sound like a guy who believes that there's some magical deal with Miami all wrapped up.

Windmill360
06-30-2010, 01:41 AM
Sounds like a guy who's been wanting to leave Toronto, "after all these years".

LonghornDub
06-30-2010, 01:44 AM
Sounds like a guy who's been wanting to leave Toronto, "after all these years".

Yeah, it really does. He's the one guy you get the feeling is absolutely going to a new team no matter what.

LonghornDub
06-30-2010, 02:05 AM
Paul Pierce also opting out. This just keeps getting better.

http://sports.espn.go.com/boston/nba/news/story?id=5341636

quietsavant
06-30-2010, 02:46 AM
This is getting fun.

Despite discussing a contract extension with Carmelo Anthony, sources close to the situation indicate the Nuggets would rather trade him than risk losing him in free agency for nothing.

The Nuggets are attempting to be proactive by securing Anthony to an extension this summer. He will become a free agent on July 1, 2011 if he doesn't sign an extension.

Read more: http://www.denverpost.com/nuggets/ci_15405631?

Windmill360
06-30-2010, 02:49 AM
Now that one is totally BS IMO.

GuerillaBlack
06-30-2010, 04:15 AM
"Raptors general manager Bryan Colangelo told a Toronto radio station he thinks Bosh “likely” will leave the team. Should Bosh decide to sign elsewhere, Colangelo also said the Raptors will try to engage in a sign-and-trade deal to bring the franchise some measure of compensation.

Sources said the Raptors will try to acquire draft picks and young players in return for Bosh. They would likely ask for forward Michael Beasley(notes) and point guard Mario Chalmers(notes) in any deal with the Miami Heat. If Bosh were to go to the Chicago Bulls, the Raptors like forward Taj Gibson(notes) and center Joakim Noah(notes), though Noah could prove impossible to pry from Chicago. If Bosh settles on the New York Knicks, the Raptors would try to engage in a double sign-and-trade that sends Knicks forward David Lee(notes) to Toronto.

Sources called a potential sign-and-trade with the Los Angeles Lakers “doubtful.”

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=Ap9CLFrKqctYVETZk77.sbK8vLYF?slug=ys-boshwade062910

Dirkenstien
06-30-2010, 10:05 AM
Dan Lebatard is saying Bosh to Miami is a done deal. Teams agree in principle:

http://twitter.com/lebatardshow


I hear bosh-miami is done ..bosh-wade shared agent avoids tampering...its why beasley, chalmers, anthony still here...raptors get them


agree in principle...process plays out...pat riley got scorched on juwan howard but wade and bosh are just dealing with their agent

And then there's this:
http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/67598/20100630/lebron_says_his_people_are_putting_together_dream_ team_in_miami/#ixzz0sLSBQf4q


LeBron Says His People Are Putting Together 'Dream Team' In Miami
LeBron James already recruited one player to join him, Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh in Miami, according to Frank Isola.

"He said, 'Would you be willing to take less to join Dream Team?'" the unidentified player told the New York Daily News. "He said his people were putting it together."





So, Cleveland ... you still feeling pretty cocky? Still unwilling to consider S&T possibilities?

Like I said, once Lebron is on the cusp of leaving their management will be inclined to change that tough guy approach. Well, that is unless they want to lose Lebron for nothing and deal with the Miami "Dream Team" for the next half decade and beyond.

Maringa
06-30-2010, 10:59 AM
The only way to overcome the Bird Right's issue is to do some backdoor, NBA illegal deal in which Lebron is offered the difference in terms of real estate, non-cash compensation through 3rd party, endorsement deals, etc...and threaten/buy off Stern to not interfere...Miami is a pretty crooked town....

SMC0007
06-30-2010, 11:02 AM
lebatard is full of chit. He don't know anything, even if he gets lucky with this one. He is a Miami guy.

BGMaverick9
06-30-2010, 11:28 AM
http://espn.go.com/nba/dailydime/_/page/dime-freeagency-100629/cap-room-summary

solid update by the wizard, Mr. Larry Coon

LonghornDub
06-30-2010, 12:11 PM
Dan Lebatard is saying Bosh to Miami is a done deal. Teams agree in principle:


Very suspect considering Miami isn't even allowed to talk to Bosh until tomorrow. They agreed in principle without talking?

Or maybe he's insinuating that going through their shared agent and avoiding "tampering" allowed them to talk to Bosh before July 1st, which isn't true either.

BGMaverick9
06-30-2010, 12:13 PM
Very suspect considering Miami isn't even allowed to talk to Bosh until tomorrow. They agreed in principle without talking?

Or maybe he's insinuating that going through their shared agent and avoiding "tampering" allowed them to talk to Bosh before July 1st, which isn't true either.

making up sh!t is fun :)
We'll see starting tonight

Dirkenstien
06-30-2010, 12:24 PM
Good points and probably nothing more than a rumor but it is something to consider.

grndmstr_c
06-30-2010, 12:52 PM
My suspicion is that Miami has talked to Toronto about Bosh (which as I understand things is perfectly legal) and has reached an agreement in principle about what would be required to ensure Toronto's participation in a S&T. That still leaves open the question of whether Bosh will end up deciding to go there, but I can certainly see it as an attractive destination for him.

Edit: I'm sure Toronto has had discussions with other teams as well, including the Mavs.

Dirkenstien
06-30-2010, 01:29 PM
My suspicion is that Miami has talked to Toronto about Bosh (which as I understand things is perfectly legal) and has reached an agreement in principle about what would be required to ensure Toronto's participation in a S&T. That still leaves open the question of whether Bosh will end up deciding to go there, but I can certainly see it as an attractive destination for him.

Edit: I'm sure Toronto has had discussions with other teams as well, including the Mavs.

Yeah, it doesn't appear to be tampering for management to discuss potential trade scenarios with other teams' management.

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/sfl-miami-heat-free-agency-s062910,0,3801207.story

Team executives are prohibited from discussing outside free agents before the midnight start of the free-agency period. However, the Sun Sentinel did confirm through the league office that teams are allowed to discuss possible sign-and-trade parameters in advance. Heat President Pat Riley has said he would make such discussions a priority.

Therefore, even if the Heat and Raptors have struck such an agreement, Bosh would still need to sign off on such an agreement. Under no circumstance could such a subject be broached with Bosh prior to July 1 without creating the consequences of severe NBA sanctions.


So essentially a scenario could be in place by management that could land Bosh in Miami but Bosh can't know about it until midnight tonight. This would correlate with Bosh's tweet about being anxious. He must have the impression that something is in the works but not know exactly what yet.

EricaLubarsky
06-30-2010, 02:43 PM
If everyone goes to Miami I will laugh heartily

and then cry that I even care about the laugh-fest that is the NBA

and then I'd laugh some more

LonghornDub
06-30-2010, 02:47 PM
My suspicion is that Miami has talked to Toronto about Bosh (which as I understand things is perfectly legal) and has reached an agreement in principle about what would be required to ensure Toronto's participation in a S&T. That still leaves open the question of whether Bosh will end up deciding to go there, but I can certainly see it as an attractive destination for him.

Edit: I'm sure Toronto has had discussions with other teams as well, including the Mavs.

This isn't an "agreement in principle," though. You can't have an agreement in principle without one of the parties to the agreement even knowing any of the terms.

Unless they've broken the rules, it is entirely impossible for any team other than the Raptors themselves to have an agreement in principle for signing Bosh.

Dirkenstien
06-30-2010, 02:58 PM
This isn't an "agreement in principle," though. You can't have an agreement in principle without one of the parties to the agreement even knowing any of the terms.

Unless they've broken the rules, it is entirely impossible for any team other than the Raptors themselves to have an agreement in principle for signing Bosh.

Bosh most likely gave Colangelo a list of teams he's interested in and informed him that if he could work a S&T he would be willing to go through with it.

They can have a deal in principle set up, but of course it will be ultimately barring the approval of Bosh which they probably assume won't be a problem.

LonghornDub
06-30-2010, 03:07 PM
Bosh most likely gave Colangelo a list of teams he's interested in and informed him that if he could work a S&T he would be willing to go through with it.

They can have a deal in principle set up, but of course it will be ultimately barring the approval of Bosh which they probably assume won't be a problem.

But that's not an agreement in principle, that's exactly my point. It's bad reporting on that guy's part. You cannot have an agreement in principle until Bosh himself has heard and agreed verbally to at least a rough outline of the terms with his new team. Anything short of that is nowhere near an "agreement in principle."

grndmstr_c
06-30-2010, 03:19 PM
LD, I don't know if you're just haggling over semantics, but I stand by my contention. Miami, or any other team, could very easily have everything already settled with Toronto concerning what they'd give up in a S&T for Bosh without having started contract negotiations. It may not be an agreement in principle that includes all the necessary parties, but it can obviously be an agreement in principle about how the teams would handle their business with one another should Miami and Bosh be able to agree to terms on Bosh's new deal.

BGMaverick9
06-30-2010, 03:20 PM
But that's not an agreement in principle, that's exactly my point. It's bad reporting on that guy's part. You cannot have an agreement in principle until Bosh himself has heard and agreed verbally to at least a rough outline of the terms with his new team. Anything short of that is nowhere near an "agreement in principle."

Bold: The big story for the lead-up to free agency.

Dirkenstien
06-30-2010, 03:24 PM
This brings up another question, though. If Wade gets his extra $30m by resigning with Miami and Bosh gets his extra $30m via S&T, that leaves the best player in the FA class, Lebron, as the only guy taking a pay cut. I don't see that happening or can at least see potential for ego issues.

jthig32
06-30-2010, 03:33 PM
This brings up another question, though. If Wade gets his extra $30m by resigning with Miami and Bosh gets his extra $30m via S&T, that leaves the best player in the FA class, Lebron, as the only guy taking a pay cut. I don't see that happening or can at least see potential for ego issues.

Lebron's not going anywhere without a SnT. Book it.

LonghornDub
06-30-2010, 03:35 PM
LD, I don't know if you're just haggling over semantics, but I stand by my contention. Miami, or any other team, could very easily have everything already settled with Toronto concerning what they'd give up in a S&T for Bosh without having started contract negotiations. It may not be an agreement in principle that includes all the necessary parties, but it can obviously be an agreement in principle about how the teams would handle their business with one another should Miami and Bosh be able to agree to terms on Bosh's new deal.

That's reading a whole lot into "agreement in principle for Bosh to go to Miami," which is what the guy twittered.

What you just said, while maybe true, requires a lot of assumptions on your part and nevertheless is not an agreement in principle for Bosh to go to Miami. Again, it's bad reporting on that guy's part. I wouldn't say it's "sematics"--if you call something an agreement in principle and it's not, that's more than an error in semantics.

Dirkenstien
06-30-2010, 04:18 PM
Lebron's not going anywhere without a SnT. Book it.

Well I just wonder if Miami working a S&T for Bosh would actually hurt their chances?

Lebron's the best player in the league and the star of this FA class, yet he'll be making less than two players on his own team when it's all said and done. Maybe if Wade says he'll also take less (equal to what Lebron agrees to) then that would make it easier for him.

It may not be a dealbreaker but it adds another dynamic to the situation. Like you said, though, S&T is definitely the best option and if Cleveland is going to work a S&T why not send him out West to a team that can give you more in return.

FINtastic
06-30-2010, 05:42 PM
Well I just wonder if Miami working a S&T for Bosh would actually hurt their chances?

Lebron's the best player in the league and the star of this FA class, yet he'll be making less than two players on his own team when it's all said and done. Maybe if Wade says he'll also take less (equal to what Lebron agrees to) then that would make it easier for him.

It may not be a dealbreaker but it adds another dynamic to the situation. Like you said, though, S&T is definitely the best option and if Cleveland is going to work a S&T why not send him out West to a team that can give you more in return.

What does Miami have that Cleveland would really even want? Do you really want to help someone take your best player off your hands when all you get back is a headcase like Beasley in return? Considering that the Cavs don't seem very receptive to the sign and trade idea, I'm not sure Beasley is going to change their minds.

Dirkenstien
06-30-2010, 06:12 PM
What does Miami have Cleveland would really even want? Do you really want to help someone take your best player off your hands when all you get back is a headcase like Beasley in return? Considering that the Cavs don't seem very receptive to the sign and trade idea, I'm not sure Beasley is going to change their minds.

Yeah Miami doesn't appear to have much, and if they do a S&T with Toronto they will have pretty much no one else under contract.

grndmstr_c
06-30-2010, 06:15 PM
That's reading a whole lot into "agreement in principle for Bosh to go to Miami," which is what the guy twittered.

What you just said, while maybe true, requires a lot of assumptions on your part and nevertheless is not an agreement in principle for Bosh to go to Miami. Again, it's bad reporting on that guy's part. I wouldn't say it's "sematics"--if you call something an agreement in principle and it's not, that's more than an error in semantics.
Perhaps you misunderstand me. The original reports about Bosh to Miami being a done deal struck me as B.S. I tried to make a reasonable inference about how the story could be both true and false. The notion that Miami and Toronto had reached an agreement and would have a scenario to present to Bosh tonight was my best guess because it's in the neighborhood of the report, it wouldn't entail any illegality, and it makes plenty of sense for Bosh to be interested in Miami and for him to have communicated that to Toronto. Simple as that. I'm not getting sucked in by bad reporting. I'm trying to read between the lines of the bad reporting to get a sense of what might actually be going on.

BGMaverick9
06-30-2010, 08:20 PM
Apparently Cleveland is in negotiations for the new coach: Byron Scott

The speculative person would suggest he ready to jump on that job b/c he knows something...or not.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=5344512

GuerillaBlack
07-01-2010, 01:37 AM
Early today, a Twitter post from Rockets general manager Daryl Morey said: "Just finished meeting with @chrisbosh - great player & person. He is about winning so I focused on how w/Houston he can win a championship."

The Miami Heat appeared to be in position to reach a rapid agreement to sign Bosh, the Rockets’ primary target, with a sign-and-trade deal with the Toronto Raptors. However, the 6-10 forward indicated Wednesday through third-party intermediaries he "definitely" would consider the Rockets and specifically cited an interest in playing with Yao Ming and the chance to play on "a world stage," a person with knowledge of Bosh’s planning said.

With Bosh’s input, the Raptors have worked out the framework of sign-and-trade agreements with several teams, including the Rockets, the individual said, but have not been told to complete any deal.

"I'm happy we had the chance to meet with Chris to put our best foot forward and he could learn about the Rockets," said Morey, who met with Bosh in Dallas. "It's an important time for both teams and free agents. I'm glad he has the chance to consider what we have to offer. We think with Chris, we can win a championship in Houston."

One of Morey’s arguments for the Rockets is that their deep roster will offer Bosh a better chance to win than a Miami or New York Knicks roster gutted to create the salary-cap room needed to sign free agents.http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/bk/bkn/7088998.html

Dirkenstien
07-01-2010, 01:55 AM
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/bk/bkn/7088998.html

Houston definitely has better pieces to offer in a S&T but is it Bosh's first choice? It seems to me he'd want to use this opportunity to play with a superstar and Ming is just too big of a question mark at the moment.

GuerillaBlack
07-01-2010, 02:05 AM
Houston definitely has better pieces to offer in a S&T but is it Bosh's first choice? It seems to me he'd want to use this opportunity to play with a superstar and Ming is just too big of a question mark at the moment.

Well....

The Miami Heat seemed to be in position to reach a rapid agreement to sign Bosh, the Rockets’ primary target, with a sign-and-trade deal with the Toronto Raptors. Bosh, however, indicated through third-party intermediaries he “definitely” would consider the Rockets and specifically cited an interest in playing with Yao Ming and the chance to play on “a world stage,” a person with knowledge of his planning said.

The Rockets had hoped Bosh would be most driven to find a team with which he would win quickly, giving general manager Daryl Morey a chance to argue that the Rockets’ deep roster would offer a better chance than a Heat or New York Knicks roster gutted to create the salary-cap room needed to sign free agents.

Whether Morey might still get the chance to make that case was unclear. With Bosh’s input, the Raptors had worked out the framework of sign-and-trade deals with several teams, including the Rockets, the individual said, but had not been told to complete a deal.

The Rockets, however, had to get in line behind teams with cap room. They expected that, but it does not make waiting easier.

“For us, the free agents would have to move through a sign-and-trade,” Morey said. “The agents are focusing on the teams with room. That’s to leverage their original teams so they can go through sign-and-trade where they maximize their money. The free agents will make $30 million more through sign-and-trade.

“I think they’ll all look at us. It’s such a big decision for all the free agents. They’re making a five- or six-year decision. I think they’ll all very carefully evaluate their options.”

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/bk/bkn/7088998.html

Would be so ironic if the Rockets got Bosh because of Jordan Hill.

Dirkenstien
07-01-2010, 10:45 AM
Well....



http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/bk/bkn/7088998.html

Would be so ironic if the Rockets got Bosh because of Jordan Hill.

Looks like yall might have a solid chance. Bosh would be a tremendous acquisition for Houston and I think Toronto would be much more inclined to make a deal with yall.

Windmill360
07-01-2010, 11:03 AM
http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2010/0630/nba_free_agency_614.jpg
http://espn.go.com/nba/

grndmstr_c
07-01-2010, 11:04 AM
With Bosh’s input, the Raptors have worked out the framework of sign-and-trade agreements with several teams, including the Rockets, the individual said, but have not been told to complete any deal.Called it.

Underdog
07-01-2010, 11:15 AM
http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2010/0630/nba_free_agency_614.jpg
http://espn.go.com/nba/

I'd be pumped that Dallas' name is on there, but they have both Newark and Brooklyn listed for the Nets so it's a bit hard to get excited...

SMC0007
07-01-2010, 12:17 PM
I frickin want to punch Ric Bucher right in his stupid face!!!!!!!! Jeezus, shut up! You too chris Broussssard.

Windmill360
07-01-2010, 12:34 PM
Tweeter close to Bosh says @hadisworld Just getting word 1 of the big 7 Free agents is off the market....apparently it'll be official soon.

- TrueHoop, Twitter

MaVs 41 BaLler
07-01-2010, 01:11 PM
Tweeter close to Bosh says @hadisworld Just getting word 1 of the big 7 Free agents is off the market....apparently it'll be official soon.

- TrueHoop, Twitter

John Salmons?

Windmill360
07-01-2010, 01:39 PM
I wouldn't count him in the big 7. Probably JJ.

nikeball
07-01-2010, 01:49 PM
What happens if an NBA team is over the cap, used their MLE and Bi-Annual Exception and all that other stuff.. and has like 10 players on their roster? Who are they allowed to sign?

Kidd Karma
07-01-2010, 01:55 PM
Interesting thought, with the looming CBA up and talks of losing 400 million, why are owners tossing out contracts of 120 million to everyone? I mean if the league was in such turmoil, wouldn't you do business with a little bit more caution. Here are the Knicks planning on bringing out the best for a Lebron visit that never materialized? Come one, geez, if the league was in such dire straits, wouldn't you reign in your spending?

jthig32
07-01-2010, 02:03 PM
What happens if an NBA team is over the cap, used their MLE and Bi-Annual Exception and all that other stuff.. and has like 10 players on their roster? Who are they allowed to sign?

Veteran minimum players.

Mav Addict
07-01-2010, 03:07 PM
Tweeter close to Bosh says @hadisworld Just getting word 1 of the big 7 Free agents is off the market....apparently it'll be official soon.

- TrueHoop, Twitter


Rudy Gay...dammit I wanted him to come to Dallas....after LBJ and Wade

Edit: 5year/$82 million

FINtastic
07-01-2010, 03:33 PM
Rudy Gay...dammit I wanted him to come to Dallas....after LBJ and Wade

Edit: 5year/$82 million

Uh, why?

FINtastic
07-01-2010, 03:38 PM
Btw, is Chris Wallace the only GM in the league that would sign his slightly-above-average restricted free agent to a max deal on the first day of free agency? He never disappoints, does he?

Mav Addict
07-01-2010, 03:38 PM
Uh, why?


Why not?....he is better than Caron and younger than JJ

GuerillaBlack
07-01-2010, 03:39 PM
Tweeter close to Bosh says @hadisworld Just getting word 1 of the big 7 Free agents is off the market....apparently it'll be official soon.

- TrueHoop, Twitter

ESPN just had a some news in their scoll thing, saying that Pat Riley has contacted Amare on being on a team with LeBron and Wade...so no Bosh? Interesting stuff.

FINtastic
07-01-2010, 03:46 PM
Why not?....he is better than Caron and younger than JJ

He's really not that much better than Caron, we already have a logjam at small forward, it was going to take an albatross of a contract to do it, and he's always been a bit of an underachiever. I'm more than happy to watch Chris Wallace give him a contract that he'll never live up to. It's much more humorous to watch someone else do it.

MaVs 41 BaLler
07-01-2010, 04:04 PM
What if we picked up Pierce? Sure he's old but so is Dirk and Kidd.

GuerillaBlack
07-01-2010, 04:07 PM
I'm pretty sure Pierce is signing back with Boston. He just wanted a new contract under the current CBA...like Dirk.

Dirkadirkastan
07-01-2010, 04:30 PM
I'd be pumped that Dallas' name is on there, but they have both Newark and Brooklyn listed for the Nets so it's a bit hard to get excited...

So what if the Nets have a 2/8 = 1/4 chance at Lebron? They had the same odds to win the draft lottery, ask them how that went.

tcat075
07-01-2010, 09:00 PM
So what if the Nets have a 2/8 = 1/4 chance at Lebron? They had the same odds to win the draft lottery, ask them how that went.

The Net's odds go a little like this.
http://jehutch.avatar.yuku.com/dallasbasketballdotcom

Dirkenstien
07-01-2010, 09:11 PM
So what do yall think of the "$1billion earnings" pitch NY made to Lebron.

http://blogs.forbes.com/sportsmoney/2010/07/lebron-james-what-the-knicks-told-lebron-new-york-and-make-billion-dollars/

They're essentially saying in New York he has a 50% hot at earning at least one billion, but in Cleveland and Chicago that drops to 1% and in Miami it's 0%.

Effective?


Honestly I hope someone starts pulling at Lebron. The greater the chance he's leaving the better chance Dallas has.

GermanDunk
07-01-2010, 09:14 PM
Look at Us. The Garden. Over Here.
By HARVEY ARATON
Published: July 1, 2010

For two years, the Knicks have been selling hope at exorbitant prices and depositing the receipts in a high-risk account, to be used primarily this summer on LeBron James. All along, there has been a disquieting undercurrent to the plan, the specter of presumption or delusion.

Mike and Bron meeting in Cleveland
http://i249.photobucket.com/albums/gg207/Bunkertor/SPORT/LEBRON-popup.jpg

It wasn’t quite all or nothing, with other free agents to pursue, or potentially overpay. But there was always an element of Wall Street speculation to the scheme, the over-the-rainbow belief that James — a 25-year-old prince of the planet — would be intoxicated by the opportunity to play basketball in New York City.

Did the city also naïvely buy into the gutting of the team’s roster and the tanking of two seasons after eight years of mediocrity or worse because, like the Knicks, it embraced a fool’s-gold principle that James needs Madison Square Garden even half as much as the Garden needs him?

There has long been a widely held belief that the N.B.A. would exponentially be enhanced by having a powerhouse team in the New York market. By extension comes the premise that a superstar like James would equally benefit from playing in Madison Square Garden, locally known as the World’s Most Famous Arena.

But if ever there was discrediting imagery to that myth, it was when a Knicks contingent led by the owner James L. Dolan jetted into Cleveland on Thursday to, in effect, beg James to come save the franchise from its own sense of self-aggrandizement.

With suitors other than Cleveland readying offers of almost $100 million on top of the ransom James takes annually from a multitude of endorsements, it is conspicuously clear that the sport has provided quite well for the league’s gifted and talented despite a decade of Knicks irrelevance and no championship in New York since 1973.

James may yet choose New York over remaining in Cleveland or going to Chicago or Miami or, say, even Newark/Brooklyn, and in the process bring along a desirable friend like the free-agent power forward Chris Bosh. But if he doesn’t — and preliminary reports seemed to be moving in that direction — the Knicks could be left with consolation prizes at paralyzing costs — and that’s if they’re lucky — along with questions about the two-year gamble that has now characterized them as the most buoyancy-challenged party in the deep end of the free-agent pool.

If they do sink into another decade of underachievement and incur the wrath of their long-suffering fans, they will have only themselves to blame for failing to study the history and geography of the contemporary N.B.A. megastar.

Michael Jordan ruled the basketball universe for a decade from a throne in downtown Chicago. James became a money-printing icon without winning a single championship in his seven-year run in Cleveland.

Did the Knicks really love the odds of winning his signature with celebrity chefs and video pleas from the rich and famous but without a modestly respectable cast of complementary talent?

The Knicks have been far from alone in discarding players they weren’t going to win a championship with in order to get in the game for James and the rest of this summer’s splashy catch. The difference is that they have managed to position themselves as the most desperate of James supplicants based on who they are, how bad they’ve become, how much they’ve promised and how little they will have to offer their fan base if Plans A and B do not work out.

The expectations for them are overwhelming and the early tea leaves are not promising. Secondary acquisition targets like Joe Johnson and Rudy Gay are reportedly close to re-signing with Atlanta and Memphis, respectively, for more money than the Knicks could offer them under the complicated rules of the N.B.A.’s collective bargaining agreement.

Speculation has had James still feeling the love from Cleveland or going to Chicago, which created space under the salary cap without diminishing a core of young talent. Dwyane Wade has always been a long shot to leave Miami, where he has already won a championship and will attract a companion star like Bosh, who is said to prefer a place where he does not have to carry the burden as the No. 1 star, as he did in Toronto.

Unless James comes with him, Bosh is unlikely to be in a New York state of mind, which means that the Knicks’ foreseeable future now rides on Thursday’s pitch to James.

This is what happens when you aim for the stars without first building a strong foundation to stand on, when free-agent money must compensate for the lack of analytical prowess in the college draft and the careful compilation of assets, when the future of your franchise rests on a 25-year-old who has everything but a championship and must be convinced the best place to win one is in New York.

Even if it’s been 37 years — or 12 years before James was born — since that’s been the case.

Dirkenstien
07-01-2010, 09:27 PM
Good article. They sure have put a lot of stock into this off-season and to be frank it's not really looking promising. I wonder if they lottery or at least top 1-3 protected those picks they traded away? It could be a long uphill battle if they strike out.

sefant77
07-01-2010, 11:18 PM
They didnt throw two years away, with the future picks in Houston it was even more....

twistaeffect2004
07-01-2010, 11:28 PM
A couple of sources are saying that Amare and the Knicks have come to an agreement.

http://twitter.com/tommydeetkb
"Trying to confirm but source says Amare to NY is "almost" done and they are "working out numbers"...half of the pick and roll set? #july1st"
http://twitter.com/BenjaminHochma
"We have sources confirming that Amare has accepted a deal with the #NY #Knicks #NBA #FreeAgent"

grndmstr_c
07-01-2010, 11:43 PM
Amare would be the first one to pick NY.

BGMaverick9
07-02-2010, 12:07 AM
Amare would be the first one to pick NY.

Good luck without Nash

grndmstr_c
07-02-2010, 12:17 AM
Amare to the Knicks sounds like a B.S. rumor. From Woj:
Knicks haven't yet made an offer to Amar'e, sources say. Sides will talk over weekend. LBJ and Wade still recruiting forwards for themselves
Dangit. And that fit in so well with my contempt for Amare.

rabbitproof
07-02-2010, 06:59 AM
Reports the LBJ wants to make up his mind by the 5th.

I'm starting to think the Mavs were never in the LBJ race..

tcat075
07-02-2010, 08:33 AM
Reports the LBJ wants to make up his mind by the 5th.

I'm starting to think the Mavs were never in the LBJ race..

Heh. I knew they never were. That's a bit harsh, but I had serious, serious doubts about James coming here. It was just too perfect.

SMC0007
07-02-2010, 09:48 AM
We all knew we aren't in the LBJ race to begin with. Lets get real. Sometimes the ultra optimistic dreamer in us starts to implant these thoughts and those who haven't been scorched by the wicked ways of the world don't know any better and it becomes contagious. Then all of the sudden hope creeps in to a few others and it's like "whoa maybe, doh, well we have a lot to offer", bah shut up. The big dogs don't come to Dallas. We got lucky with Dirk. Now sit back and wait for a miracle.

:l

Underdog
07-02-2010, 10:15 AM
We all knew we aren't in the LBJ race to begin with. Lets get real. Sometimes the ultra optimistic dreamer in us starts to implant these thoughts and those who haven't been scorched by the wicked ways of the world don't know any better and it becomes contagious. Then all of the sudden hope creeps in to a few others and it's like "whoa maybe, doh, well we have a lot to offer", bah shut up. The big dogs don't come to Dallas. We got lucky with Dirk. Now sit back and wait for a miracle.

:l

You're the first person I'm calling out when LeBron signs here...

:p

DevinHarriswillstart
07-02-2010, 10:16 AM
We all knew we aren't in the LBJ race to begin with. Lets get real. Sometimes the ultra optimistic dreamer in us starts to implant these thoughts and those who haven't been scorched by the wicked ways of the world don't know any better and it becomes contagious. Then all of the sudden hope creeps in to a few others and it's like "whoa maybe, doh, well we have a lot to offer", bah shut up. The big dogs don't come to Dallas. We got lucky with Dirk. Now sit back and wait for a miracle.

:l

Hooray for optimism!

LonghornDub
07-02-2010, 12:13 PM
You all realize that Lebron (or any other FA) not signing here doesn't prove that we were "never in the Lebron race," right?

Just checking.

Dirkadirkastan
07-02-2010, 12:52 PM
The thing to get excited about Lebron has been the fact there is no red tape in the way. No salary cap issues, trade restrictions, amount of money in the contract, or even anything Cleveland could do to stop it (unless they're stupid). If Lebron wants to be a Maverick, he's in with a max deal. The ONLY issue is whether he wants to be here, and we have a laundry list of reasons why he should consider it.

Of course, he may never look at the list or even realize he's on our radar. He may be secretly predisposed to head to some other city and he's pulling our leg with all this indecisive free agent crap. We can't read his mind. But we do realize that's all it comes down to and we have as good a case as anybody.

tcat075
07-02-2010, 03:26 PM
You're the first person I'm calling out when LeBron signs here...

:p

Hooray for optimism!


I like how you guys call out SMC when my post right above his says the exact same thing. :D

tcat075
07-02-2010, 03:29 PM
The thing to get excited about Lebron has been the fact there is no red tape in the way. No salary cap issues, trade restrictions, amount of money in the contract, or even anything Cleveland could do to stop it (unless they're stupid). If Lebron wants to be a Maverick, he's in with a max deal. The ONLY issue is whether he wants to be here, and we have a laundry list of reasons why he should consider it.

Of course, he may never look at the list or even realize he's on our radar. He may be secretly predisposed to head to some other city and he's pulling our leg with all this indecisive free agent crap. We can't read his mind. But we do realize that's all it comes down to and we have as good a case as anybody.

What does this mean? Yes, there are definitely red tape in the way. We have to sign and trade to get him, and Cleveland has said they aren't doing it. That seems like a legitimate issue right there. Now, I do think they're bluffing, but its not just "max deal and we get him". Its that simple for Chicago, New York and Miami. Not us.

Dirkadirkastan
07-02-2010, 03:36 PM
No, those teams CAN'T give him a max deal, and I said right there Cleveland could block it, but they would be stupid.

tcat075
07-02-2010, 03:52 PM
Those team can give him a max deal. If Miami wants to sign, say, Bosh and Wade as well, THEN they can't give max.

While it may be stupid for Cleveland to block Dallas from coming here, they have clearly said they are not going to do it. Whether they're bluffing, like most think, or whether they're completely serious, that is an issue that has to be dealt with. They could not like the deal we offer, so there is a potential issue. All I'm trying to say is that a S&T clearly is not as flat out simple as it is to just go sign an unrestricted free agent. So many more hoops to jump through in a S&T.

dalmations202
07-02-2010, 04:03 PM
Those team can give him a max deal. If Miami wants to sign, say, Bosh and Wade as well, THEN they can't give max.

While it may be stupid for Cleveland to block Dallas from coming here, they have clearly said they are not going to do it. Whether they're bluffing, like most think, or whether they're completely serious, that is an issue that has to be dealt with. They could not like the deal we offer, so there is a potential issue. All I'm trying to say is that a S&T clearly is not as flat out simple as it is to just go sign an unrestricted free agent. So many more hoops to jump through in a S&T.

But the SNT offers more $$$$$.

Cleveland can offer the most because the increases are by 10.5% instead of 8.5% by rule. Hence the SNT being a "sign" by Cleveland then the trade makes it the true Max.

One of the reasons that I doubt the Wade, Bron, Bosh deal in Miami is that Wade would pocket the most $$$$, unless the other two are gotten by SNT. I am not sure Miami has enough assets left to get them via SNT.

Maybe LBJ will leave $$$$ on the table, but I am doubting it.

tcat075
07-02-2010, 04:24 PM
But the SNT offers more $$$$$.

Cleveland can offer the most because the increases are by 10.5% instead of 8.5% by rule. Hence the SNT being a "sign" by Cleveland then the trade makes it the true Max.

One of the reasons that I doubt the Wade, Bron, Bosh deal in Miami is that Wade would pocket the most $$$$, unless the other two are gotten by SNT. I am not sure Miami has enough assets left to get them via SNT.

Maybe LBJ will leave $$$$ on the table, but I am doubting it.

That is true. I forgot about that part. I still think there are some issues, but yes, it is true that if he wanted the most money, he could come to a team that already has a good core.

SMC0007
07-02-2010, 05:51 PM
You all realize that Lebron (or any other FA) not signing here doesn't prove that we were "never in the Lebron race," right?

Just checking.


Why?

Underdog
07-02-2010, 05:55 PM
Why?

Because. Duh.


(I should let L-Dub defend his own point, but I think my explanation is obviously sufficient...)

SMC0007
07-02-2010, 05:56 PM
yeah. I didn't think about that.

Underdog
07-02-2010, 06:02 PM
If we don't get a sit-down with LeBron, then we aren't in the race...

If we do, then we are...



EDIT: cue Murph's "thanks, captain obvious!" quip.

SMC0007
07-02-2010, 06:14 PM
thx capt obvious

Kidd Karma
07-02-2010, 06:22 PM
James does not want Miami. 2 sources, don't know if it's same source, but one came via Chad ford, Wade is leaning to Chicago, having requested a 2nd meeting with Bulls brass today.

Bulls have also proposed a Deng trade for a center than clears cap.

Kidd Karma
07-02-2010, 06:23 PM
Deng proposal link:

http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/67763/20100702/bulls_have_proposed_deng_trade_for_serviceable_cen ter/

Wade Bulls:

http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/67759/20100702/wade_meets_with_bulls_for_second_time/

mac222b
07-02-2010, 06:50 PM
strange. but i still don't believe in this LeBron/Wade alliance. so Wade is suddenly gonna ride the King's coattails? maybe Bosh would. his releasing a pic of him hugging D-Wade was pretty pathetic. it's like bragging about being invited to hang out with the popular kid in middle school.
could this all mean that: Bosh wants to get paid max and will need a sign and trade
Bron is going to NJ
Amare is going to NY
JJ is re-signing w/ATL
Wade doesn't think Boozer and he can win a championship alone so he's getting out to a better team while he can?

mac222b
07-02-2010, 06:51 PM
i think we're seeing the beginning of things shaking out here

sefant77
07-02-2010, 08:20 PM
I say after these 2 days:
Wade/Bosh Bulls
James Nets (maybe with Lee or Boozer)

Heat and Knicks the big loser

We use Dust for in a traditional trade