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View Full Version : So, did Pierce choke?


The Crippler
05-28-2002, 09:05 AM
Hales, you've been ripping Nowitzki for choking in the playoffs...why don't I see you ripping Pierce for not sacking up and hitting his FTs? This was a monumental choke job...not only did he miss the FT, but he had 3 offensive fouls in the fourth quarter alone.

And I don't want to hear that I'm a Pierce "hater". He's easily my favorite non-mav. Everybody chokes at one time or another, and you can't base it on one game or even one series...

Murphy3
05-28-2002, 09:11 AM
yeah,he choked.
but, i wouldn't classify him as a choker.
great players aren't going to come up big every time.
it just doesn't happen

MavKikiNYC
05-28-2002, 10:55 AM
One vote 'choke'. But he's a great player and great fun to watch.

Drbio
05-28-2002, 12:41 PM
ChOkeD

The Crippler
05-28-2002, 12:46 PM
My points exactly, and that is why people claiming Dirk is a choker is laughable based on one series/game/whatever...

I bet Dirk chokes again, but I also bet the times he is a hero is more than the times he chokes when his career is over. And the same goes with Pierce.

MavKikiNYC
05-28-2002, 12:58 PM
Well done.

Go, Dirk. Go, Pierce.

Deja-Vu
05-28-2002, 03:36 PM
I think it's a big difference with a FT, and a Layup. The Celts still had a chance to tie, if Battie wouldv'e hit the shot, in the Mavs case it was tie the game or lose.

Murphy3
05-28-2002, 03:42 PM
a tough contested "lay-up" versus a free throw?
give me a break

Deja-Vu
05-28-2002, 03:45 PM
Keywords: Lay-up and Free Throw

They both should have been made, but I would think players have a higher percentage on lay-ups, than they do on FTs. Of course I could be wrong, but in this case I don't think I am.

Murphy3
05-28-2002, 03:51 PM
Yes, you are.
a highly contested "lay-up" versus a free throw..there's no contest.

both of them could have made the shot, and dirk would make that shot more often than he'll miss..however, it wasn't as easy of a shot as a layup.

you cannot classify all layups in the same category. if it would have been an easy layup, he would have slammed it. however, it was a heavily contested drive and a contested shot.

Deja-Vu
05-28-2002, 03:55 PM
Yes, go to the rim with some balls and slam it like you have done many times in the past, or try to throw it up with your left hand. It was not contested as much as you are making it out to be. I was right there at the game, the shot couldv'e and shouldv'e been made. The same with the FTs, but I think it's a lot harder to make 2 FTs than it is to make 1 lay-up. Just my opinion of course, and I don't think an opinion can be wrong, because it's just that my opinion.

Murphy3
05-28-2002, 04:08 PM
there was no chance to slam it.
he missed the shot. end of story.
however, his look wasn't nearly as easy of an attempt as a free throw.

Deja-Vu
05-28-2002, 04:12 PM
Which in your opinion is harder to make, 2 FT's or 1 layup?

Murphy3
05-28-2002, 04:18 PM
it depends on how contested the layup.
if it's an open path to the basket and easy off the glass, then the layup.
but the layup dirk needed to hit versus the free throws that pierce needed to hit, no doubt..the free throws.
dirk could have very easily made the shot. it was a difficult shot but he should have made it.
however, there's no excuse for missing a free throw by almost a foot in pierce's situation.

Murphy3
05-28-2002, 04:19 PM
neither came up big in their situation. that is the point.

Deja-Vu
05-28-2002, 04:27 PM
Just as you say there's no excuse for Pierce, there's no excuse for Dirk as well. In my opionion, I think it's much easier to make the layup but that's just me. I do agree that neither came up big in both cases. I also never once said either of them choked, I am just saying that the layup is much easier IMO.

David
05-28-2002, 05:24 PM
<< Just my opinion of course, and I don't think an opinion can be wrong, because it's just that my opinion. >>



An opinion can easily be wrong. Some opinions turn out to be facts and some opinion don't. Everyone has a right to their own opinion but not their own facts, as someone once said.

Murphy3
05-28-2002, 05:38 PM
many people had the opinion that the mavs would beat the kings..
apparently our opinion was a bit off.
much as the same as yours is right now

The Crippler
05-28-2002, 07:00 PM
you've already given yourself away...

ArcticBlast
05-28-2002, 07:58 PM
Pierce missed a free throw, as he has been all playoffs. My idea of a choke is if the player misses something that he would make during a normal situation, which isn't the case with Pierce right now. So, no, I don't think Pierce choked.

Murphy3
05-28-2002, 08:09 PM
it was definitely a choke job.
he doesn't &quot;Normally&quot; miss free throws. look at the percentages.
even though he has shot free throws relatively poorly by his standards in the playoffs doesn't make him missing the free throw with a little over a second left any less than a choke job.

Drbio
05-28-2002, 08:12 PM
crippler- LOL!

You have to at least see murph's point. If you are being contested on a layup it is a tough shot. Free throws? The key word there is &quot;FREE&quot;.

ArcticBlast
05-28-2002, 08:12 PM
Well, he *has* been missing FTs during the recent games. Especially the first of two.

He's even admitted it.

Deja-Vu
05-28-2002, 08:31 PM
My opinion: It is easier to make 1 layup, contested or not, than it is to make 2 FREE throws.

Drbio
05-28-2002, 08:33 PM
Dejavu- welcome to the board.

thanks for prefacing with IMO.

Murphy3
05-28-2002, 08:37 PM
in my opinion, dejavu, apparently you didn't watch the game
in my opinion, you're wrong.

Deja-Vu
05-28-2002, 08:42 PM
What gives you the idea I didn't watch the game? I said, it's my opinion. That's all, just by saying I think it's harder to make 2 FTs than it is to make 1 layup I didn't watch the game? What makes you believe I didn't watch the game?

Murphy3
05-28-2002, 08:43 PM
your opinion gives me the idea that you didn't watch the game.
there must be some excuse for what you say, so i assumed that you didn't watch the game.

Drbio
05-28-2002, 08:47 PM
in my opinion...shit...I don't have an opinion....

Murphy3
05-28-2002, 08:48 PM
i'm pretty sure we probably share the same opinion on this one doc

Deja-Vu
05-28-2002, 08:56 PM
Sorry that my OPINION leads you to believe that.

Murphy3
05-28-2002, 09:00 PM
it's cool dejavu, i just don't have the slightest idea how you could come up with the opinion you have.
it amazes me that someone could actually look at the shot that dirk had to put up and say that it's easier than hitting a free throw.

Deja-Vu
05-28-2002, 09:10 PM
If he had to hit A FT as you say, then I might agree with you but he had to hit 2 FTs to tie the game.

Murphy3
05-28-2002, 09:18 PM
don't buy it deja vu.
your argument makes no sense

Deja-Vu
05-28-2002, 10:12 PM
That's fine, I do not expect everyone to agree, especially guys who are in denial about what happened. End of story, both missed their shots. As far as I am concerned, this thread is done.

NotEnuffEyesToSee
05-29-2002, 12:36 AM
Deja-Vu, do you like irk ?

Deja-Vu
05-29-2002, 12:39 AM
I not only like Dirk, but has a great deal of respect for him and everyone else who made this league. From the 1st man, to the 15th man on the roster. I never said either of them choked, just stated my opinion on which is harder to make, that's all.

NotEnuffEyesToSee
05-29-2002, 12:49 AM
Cool, I like EVERY Dirk's fan NOT Irk's ...

TheKid
05-30-2002, 06:29 PM
People kill me with this choking stuff. Ok, he missed ONE free throw because the second one he missed purposely. NOW if you want to say he choked, game 5 where he didn't score a POINT in the fourth quarter, I look at that more as choking than ONE SHOT!

ANYONE can miss one shot, layup, free throw or three pointer, the same way ANYONE can make one shot and that doesn't make them a god send.

My comparison, Robert Horry.. He has been clutch these playoffs, but ask me if I want Him taking the shot going forward down the stretch or Kobe, Pierce or Dirk, I would still take all of those guys before Horry. So one shot doesn't make you or break you in my book.