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View Full Version : Stupid Kings- "One of the Greatest Teams Ever Assembled"...


Evilmav2
08-20-2002, 11:22 PM
“ I think that, with (Keon Clark and Mike Bibby's additions), we have one of the greatest teams ever assembled. I do. I think we could win 65 games, don't you? ”
Coowner Joe Maloof

... I guess signing skinny, journeyman forwards and overrated 13 ppg, 5 apg point guards to salary cap crippling contracts ($80 million for Bibby) buys you bragging rights...

Red White and Blue
08-21-2002, 12:21 AM
They did have the best record in the league last year, and with real officiating they would have been champs. They have a great team, IMO they are the team to beat. With that said, if any team does beat them I sure hope it is the Mavs.

DTL
08-21-2002, 01:57 AM
This seems a more reasonable appraisal. From the Kings Report at Hoopsworld.

They signed [Keon Clark] to become the most complete team 1-12 that the game has seen in several years. With a bench consisting of Bobby Jackson, Hedo Turkoglu, Clark, Scot Pollard and Gerald Wallace - we're looking at five bench players who could probably whoop half of the Eastern Conference teams starting squads!

Nellie
08-21-2002, 09:37 AM
<< “ I think that, with (Keon Clark and Mike Bibby's additions), we have one of the greatest teams ever assembled. I do. I think we could win 65 games, don't you? ”
Coowner Joe Maloof

... I guess signing skinny, journeyman forwards and overrated 13 ppg, 5 apg point guards to salary cap crippling contracts ($80 million for Bibby) buys you bragging rights... >>



I don't know what kind of denial you are in Evilmav but the reality of it is that the Kings kicked our ass and almost kicked the Lakers ass if they hadn't had the help of officials. It is debatable what Clark brings to them but I think we can all agree that they didn't get worse. I think they have a great chance of knocking off the Lakers next year and I hope they do if it came down to the 2 of them.

madape
08-21-2002, 10:33 AM
Nellie, the Kings are a good team. But don't they at least have to win one NBA championship before we start referring to them as the greatest team ever assembled? They haven't even won a Western Conference championship yet, and yet we still hear this bullshit. I'm not even sure they have a single hall-of-fame caliber player on the team.

Nellie
08-21-2002, 10:55 AM
<< Nellie, the Kings are a good team. But don't they at least have to win one NBA championship before we start referring to them as the greatest team ever assembled? They haven't even won a Western Conference championship yet, and yet we still hear this bullshit. I'm not even sure they have a single hall-of-fame caliber player on the team. >>



Ahhh, Madape's daily rebuttle...like clockwork.

This post is realy funny coming from somebody who considers the Mavs a title contender. And WTF does hall-of-fame players have anything to do with it?

madape
08-21-2002, 11:30 AM
Nellie - there is a difference between being a title contender and being the greatest team ever assembled. I would hope that the greatest team ever assembled would have at least one hall of fame player, and have at least one NBA championship title. The Kings have none, and its is the joke of all jokes to proclaim them the best team ever assembled.

Nellie
08-21-2002, 12:15 PM
We are not talking about the same thing.

nowitzki_prophecy
08-21-2002, 01:12 PM
one of the greatest team ever assembeld?this is gotta be a joke,but its cool,the maloof bros no nothing about the game,they came in to make their money,thats it.
they make too much of keon,6'11 skinny,but an o.k player,nothing more,we'll see what they say when we fuck them up this year,revenge will be sweet.
btw,if rashard signs with us,i do believe its one of the best team ever assembeld.

Drbio
08-21-2002, 02:23 PM
One of the greatest teams ever? No..not yet anyway.

And I think think the Mavs are a title contender. Did I miss something?

PeterVecseyisdumb
08-21-2002, 02:42 PM
The kings did not get screwed by the refs in the lakers/kings playoff series. The kings shot more free throws than the lakers in the lakers/kings playoff series. A lot of people talk about game #6, and say the kings were screwed by the refs. The lakers obviously shot too many free throws in game #6, however, the kings shot more free throws than the lakers in the series. Didn't shaq shoot 1 free throw for the entire game, in one of those games? Shaq was in foul trouble in a few of those games, and shaq fouled out in one of those games. In one of the games, shaq was destroying the kings in the first half, then got in foul trouble and had to sit on the bench for the rest of the first half. The refs were falling for vlade's flopping for the first couple of games in the series, even though the refs knew that vlade is one of the biggest floppers of all time. The refs didn't make the lakers blow about a 24 point lead in game #4. The refs didn't make the kings miss all of those free throws in game #7. The kings had a crappy ft percentage for the entire series. The refs didn't make peja shoot an air ball when he was wide open towards the end of the game in game #7.

The kings were not screwed by the refs in the lakers/kings playoff series. The kings shot more free throws than the lakers. The kings missed their free throws. The kings had a few chances to win the series, but the kings didn't. The kings choked.

Nellie
08-21-2002, 02:51 PM
<< The kings had a few chances to win the series, but the kings didn't. The kings choked. >>



Was this before or after the 3-pointer that shouldn't have counted?

Drbio
08-21-2002, 03:00 PM
Everyone likes to remind us of the one game where the refs took a win from Sac, but noone seems to want to remember that the Lakers got screwed the game before on shoddy refs as well. I hate the Lakers, but refs didn't cost the Kings the series. Not making shots did.

Nellie
08-21-2002, 03:02 PM
<< Did I miss something? >>



Exactly where in my post did I agree with Maloof? I responded to DTL's bragging rights comment.

PeterVecseyisdumb
08-21-2002, 03:02 PM
<<

<< The kings had a few chances to win the series, but the kings didn't. The kings choked. >>



Was this before or after the 3-pointer that shouldn't have counted? >>



I don't think that three pointer should have counted. However, refs make mistakes. Regardless, if the refs said the three pointer shouldn't have been counted, the kings still blew a big lead in game #4 of the kings/lakers playoff series. I'm not going to look at one play without looking at the big picture. The kings shot more free throws than the lakers in the series.

pepperfletch
08-21-2002, 03:03 PM
Noway SAC is the best team ever assembled. I do not believe they have 5 of the top 60 players like we currently do. While I agree they are double deep across the board, there are only so many total minutes per game and their coach has a horrible habit of going 8 deep rotation most of the time. Why do you need 10 deep if 2 set most of the time? The best teams have 2 or 3 big time top players (Current Lakers) (Celtics with Bird/Mccale) (Bulls with Jordan/Pippen) Lakers with Magic/Kareem) etc. Back ups like Clark DO NOT WIN TITLES. Stars win titles.........AND THE MAVS top 3 or 4 players match up well with their top 3 or 4...and ours continue to improve. Back ups shpould be used to rest your star player through the season. Cubes has said that WILL HAPPEN in 2003, so lets see the play-offs with our stars as fresh as anyones...I am willing to bet we will give everyone a run for the money...Call me a homer, but I still take Mavs squad over Sac's...

Lets see were we are in the spring. I feel the Mavs are still on the UP CURVE as far as improvemnt per player as we are the youngest of the 3 top west teams....

Red White and Blue
08-21-2002, 03:04 PM
It's obvious that some of us didn't watch the Kings/Lakers series, because if you did you would have seen the Kings were screwed. The Kings were screwed heavily in that game. This team the way it is now, is only a midwest contendor at best. I don't see how we can contend with teams who were already better, and improved more this offseason. I think the Kings will win the title next year, if every team stays the way it is now. I think when Webber is done in this league he will be a Hall Of Famer. If he continues to put up the numbers he's been putting up, he will be an HOFer. I think he has 6 more years on his deal, if he plays it out and continue to put up great numbers then yes he will be a HOFer IMO.

PeterVecseyisdumb
08-21-2002, 03:09 PM
<< It's obvious that some of us didn't watch the Kings/Lakers series, because if you did you would have seen the Kings were screwed. The Kings were screwed heavily in that game. This team the way it is now, is only a midwest contendor at best. I don't see how we can contend with teams who were already better, and improved more this offseason. I think the Kings will win the title next year, if every team stays the way it is now. I think when Webber is done in this league he will be a Hall Of Famer. If he continues to put up the numbers he's been putting up, he will be an HOFer. I think he has 6 more years on his deal, if he plays it out and continue to put up great numbers then yes he will be a HOFer IMO. >>



The kings shot more free throws than the lakers in the kings/lakers playoff series. No matter what you say, it isn't going to change that fact.

Red White and Blue
08-21-2002, 03:10 PM
pepperfletch, did you watch the Kings/Mavs series last season? Didn't they beat us into the ground, and more?

Have the Mavs improved their roster from last year? NO, have they gotten worse IMO? Yes

Have the Kings improved their roster from last year? YES, have they gotten worse IMO? NO

Nellie
08-21-2002, 03:12 PM
Sorry Vescey, I don't buy it...a series altering shot that shouldn't have counted, a Kobe elbow to the face that should have been a flagarant, then playing a game 7 that shouldn't have existed and then blame the Kings for missing freethrows in the series? That is avoiding the issue and giving the Lakers a pass.

Red White and Blue
08-21-2002, 03:16 PM
Peter, I am not trying to change that but was that 3 supposed to count? NO, you cannot change that fact. It's a fact, it shouldn't have counted. I am tired of the people always making excuses for the refs, yes they make mistakes but int he WCF they have to be on their games. On other boards, when the Mavs are getting screwed people are calling for the refs head. When it is another team, their bad play is the reason the refs. Give me a break here please......

Red White and Blue
08-21-2002, 03:17 PM
You're exactly right IMO Nellie.

PeterVecseyisdumb
08-21-2002, 03:23 PM
<< Sorry Vescey, I don't buy it...a series altering shot that shouldn't have counted, a Kobe elbow to the face that should have been a flagarant, then playing a game 7 that shouldn't have existed and then blame the Kings for missing freethrows in the series? That is avoiding the issue and giving the Lakers a pass. >>



How am I avoiding the issue? The kings shot more free throws than the lakers in the kings/lakers playoff series. You can point out the samaki walker three pointer, but I can point out that the refs fell for vlade's flopping for the first couple of games in the series. Game #6 might not even have been played, if the kings didn't blow about a 24 point lead in game #4. The kings missed their free throws for the entire series. Why don't you consider the kings missing free throws, series altering? The kings missed their free throws for the entire series. The refs didn't make the kings miss their free throws.

PeterVecseyisdumb
08-21-2002, 03:32 PM
<< Peter, I am not trying to change that but was that 3 supposed to count? NO, you cannot change that fact. It's a fact, it shouldn't have counted. I am tired of the people always making excuses for the refs, yes they make mistakes but int he WCF they have to be on their games. On other boards, when the Mavs are getting screwed people are calling for the refs head. When it is another team, their bad play is the reason the refs. Give me a break here please...... >>



The funny thing is that you talk about the samaki walker three pointer and you overlook vlade getting calls for the first couple of games in the series, when vlade clearly was flopping. Not only did that give the kings more free throws, it also put shaq in foul trouble and made shaq miss part of the game, in a couple of the games. In one of the games, shaq fouled out.

Nellie
08-21-2002, 03:36 PM
<< How am I avoiding the issue? >>



By considering a free throw total for a series that's outcome was obviously infected with outside influence.

PeterVecseyisdumb
08-21-2002, 03:45 PM
<<

<< How am I avoiding the issue? >>



By considering a free throw total for a series that's outcome was obviously infected with outside influence. >>



The refs didn't make the kings miss their free throws. The kings shot more free throws than the lakers in the kings/lakers playoff series. The amount of points the kings lost from missed free throws is much greater than three points from a samaki walker three pointer. It is mindboggling to me that someone would say the refs screwed the kings in the lakers/kings playoff series, when the kings shot more free throws than the lakers in the kings/lakers playoff series.

Nellie
08-21-2002, 03:49 PM
Well, that is your opinion then. Mine is that the bottom line doesn't mean as much as how you get there. And if there was multiple game altering mistakes, which there was, everything is polluted at that point and nothing can be viewed accurately anymore. The fact that the Kings missed important freethrows is nothing more than an irrelevant detail if the series should have been over in 5 games.

PeterVecseyisdumb
08-21-2002, 04:07 PM
<< Well, that is your opinion then. Mine is that the bottom line doesn't mean as much as how you get there. And if there was multiple game altering mistakes, which there was, everything is polluted at that point and nothing can be viewed accurately anymore. The fact that the Kings missed important freethrows is nothing more than an irrelevant detail if the series should have been over in 5 games. >>



The kings missed their free throws during the entire lakers/kings playoff series. If the kings had made their free throws in game #4 and didn't blow about a 24 point lead, then the kings might have won game #4. If the kings had won game #4, then the kings might have won the series in 5 games. The kings missed their free throws in game #4, which was part of the reason the kings blew their big lead in game #4. The kings lost game #4, partly because they missed their free throws in game #4.

Lvubun1
08-21-2002, 04:23 PM
Personally, the best team on paper in my opinion the last 10 years were the '98 Lakers. I don't see the Kings having 4 players making the all-star team next season, Webber, Peja, maybe Bibby but 15 points and 5 assist like he avg. last year won't get it done. The Lakers had Kobe, Shaq, Eddie Jones and NVE, also Elden Campbell who is probably one the top 10-15 big men in the East, Derek Fisher coming off the bench and a decent player like Jon Barry who gets about 10 with the Pistons. They just didn't have a coach, if Phil Jackson coached that team they would probably be on their 5th Championship. I think the Kings are on par with the 2000 Blazers, and we know what happened to them.

Nellie
08-21-2002, 04:42 PM
<< The kings missed free throws during the entire lakers/kings playoff series. If the kings had made their free throws in game #4, then the kings might have won the series in 5 games. The kings missed their free throws in game #4, which was part of the reason the kings blew their big lead in game #4. The kings lost game #4, partly because they missed their free throws in game #4. >>



Damn dude...let this go. Games can be won even missing freethrows. Games can not be won when refs alter the outcome of a play that was the difference in the game. If we where to somehow re-play this series with the shot clock rules they have now starting next year, the refs would have looked at the play, changed it, and the Kings would have won NO MATTER IF THEY MADE THE FREETHROWS OR NOT!!!!! You are right in saying that the Kings had a SECOND chance at destiny even after all the crap the refs dished out, I agree with you there. But where I don't agree is that is not where the blame lies for the Kings losing the series cause if we could re-play it under current rules they would have won it...with or without the damn freethrows.

PeterVecseyisdumb
08-21-2002, 05:08 PM
<<

<< The kings missed free throws during the entire lakers/kings playoff series. If the kings had made their free throws in game #4, then the kings might have won the series in 5 games. The kings missed their free throws in game #4, which was part of the reason the kings blew their big lead in game #4. The kings lost game #4, partly because they missed their free throws in game #4. >>



Damn dude...let this go. Games can be won even missing freethrows. Games can not be won when refs alter the outcome of a play that was the difference in the game. If we where to somehow re-play this series with the shot clock rules they have now starting next year, the refs would have looked at the play, changed it, and the Kings would have won NO MATTER IF THEY MADE THE FREETHROWS OR NOT!!!!! You are right in saying that the Kings had a SECOND chance at destiny even after all the crap the refs dished out, I agree with you there. But where I don't agree is that is not where the blame lies for the Kings losing the series cause if we could re-play it under current rules they would have won it...with or without the damn freethrows. >>



Nellie, you are using a samaki walker three pointer as the deciding play in game #4? What kind of logic is that? In other words you are overlooking everything else that happened in game #4 and are blaming the kings game #4 loss on the samaki walker three pointer?

If you have some sort of evidence that shows the kings losing to the lakers in the playoffs, is an nba conspiracy, show me some proof. I find it humorous that you keep blaming the refs and don't blame the kings. You keep using isolated incidents, instead of the looking at the big picture.

Also, telling me to let it go, is humorous since you keep on replying to my posts in this thread. I really don't want to get into an argument with you. You do seem to be taking this thread too personal, and it's pointless for me to continue posting in this thread, since no matter what I say, you won't change you mind.

Red White and Blue
08-21-2002, 05:52 PM
I think some of you are missing what Maloof said, he said &quot;One of the.....&quot; not &quot;The&quot; Greatest. I do think they very well may have &quot;1&quot; of the greatest teams assembled. He did not say they had the greatest, just 1 of the greatest.

#1MavsFan
08-21-2002, 05:54 PM
Mavs will be better than the kings if they get rashard and dont trade nick to ny. Plus when mladen and his buddy come they will be even more deeper plus the kings might lose peja because if they give him a big contract they will be way way over the salary cap.

Drbio
08-21-2002, 06:58 PM
The Mavs are better than the Knicks anyway...even if Dirk sat out all year. The Knicks suck. And there is no way in freaking hell the Mavs got worse in this offseason. That is ridiculous.

Fidel
08-21-2002, 07:12 PM
I think #1MavsFan meant the Kings, not the Knicks. It΄s a typo.

Drbio
08-21-2002, 07:20 PM
In that case I agree with him. i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif

pepperfletch
08-21-2002, 07:37 PM
Mavs will be improved just by playing together all season. We have young players who will step up their game. Even if we only sign a few role players to fill our roster holes, we will be better. Dirk will be better, Eddie will be better, Wang will be better, Raef will be better! Nash, Finley and Nick will not go backwards. Heck we still have potential upside improvements from Bradley and Esch...they can't get worse than this past year can they? This team is young and improving...Kings are much older with potential aging problems on FRONT line starters...IMO

If we get Lewis we get better!

Red White and Blue
08-21-2002, 09:54 PM
Well if you have a team, and lose players on that team without signing anymore then you get worse. Especially if that player you lost was a player in the rotation. Sure they will play more games together but the core of this team have been together for quite a while. We also have players on last years roster that we have a chance to sign, and we haven't done that yet. This team has not gotten better, and IMO has gotten worse. I don't know how you don't get worse if you lose players, without gaining any. We can only use the youth thing for so long. Just my opinion.....sign our FAs and possibly Lewis then it's a totally different BALL GAME.

Evilmav2
08-22-2002, 12:28 AM
Evilmav &quot;Take It To The Bank&quot; prediction of the day: The kings will not win 65 games this season. The kings will not return to the finals with this team, and they will absolutely not win the championship that their newly aquired bandwagon fans and fellow travelors think they deserved last year...


Last year's kings were not one of the greatest teams ever assembled. Signing their overated, slowfooted, 13 ppg, 5 apg point guard does not make them one of the greatest teams ever assembled. Neither does signing a skinny, statistically unimpressive, journeyman like Keon Clark...

Anyone arguing that it does is making bad comedy... whether they be team owners or mike bibby fans...

http://www.toiletmuseum.com/enter.gif
The hopes and dreams of a king's championship

Red White and Blue
08-22-2002, 03:35 AM
You are using Mike Bibbys reg season numbers to your advantage, but just take a look at his playoff numbers. Aren't the playoffs what counts? He was rewarded because of his play, and in case you missed the Mavs/Kings series the guy torched us. The whole playoffs the guy stepped it up big time, and that's what counts. Not to mention he was the floor general to the 65 win season, especially when both Webber and Peja missed time.

Nellie
08-22-2002, 09:33 AM
<< Also, telling me to let it go, is humorous since you keep on replying to my posts in this thread. I really don't want to get into an argument with you. >>



Then you should have dropped it a couple of posts up after I said you had your opinion and I had mine.




<< You do seem to be taking this thread too personal, and it's pointless for me to continue posting in this thread, since no matter what I say, you won't change you mind. >>



First of all, don't act like you know what I take personaly and what I don't. Just cause I am sick of this thread because you can't accept that we have different opinions on something (again, refer to a few posts up) doesn't mean I am taking anything too personal. Second of all, refer to my above comments.

I think refs fuck games up, you don't. I'm sick of talking about it so stop trying to &quot;change my mind.&quot;

Aight? Aight.

PeterVecseyisdumb
08-22-2002, 12:55 PM
<<

<< Also, telling me to let it go, is humorous since you keep on replying to my posts in this thread. I really don't want to get into an argument with you. >>



Then you should have dropped it a couple of posts up after I said you had your opinion and I had mine.




<< You do seem to be taking this thread too personal, and it's pointless for me to continue posting in this thread, since no matter what I say, you won't change you mind. >>



First of all, don't act like you know what I take personaly and what I don't. Just cause I am sick of this thread because you can't accept that we have different opinions on something (again, refer to a few posts up) doesn't mean I am taking anything too personal. Second of all, refer to my above comments.

I think refs fuck games up, you don't. I'm sick of talking about it so stop trying to &quot;change my mind.&quot;

Aight? Aight. >>



Nellie, for someone who is sick of this thread, you sure do keep making a lot of posts in this thread. Anyway, this my last post in this thread.