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Just211
06-06-2003, 12:20 AM
This isn't exactly landing JO, but


This trade isn't that stoopid, and I'm curious to see if any of you guys like it, or think Utah would like it.

Dallas Trades:
PG Nash, C Bradley, SF/PF Najera
Utah Trades
SF Kirilenko, C Ostertag, C Ameachi

This would solve Dallas SF need for a long time, and would take Utahs 2 highest paid players off their books. Bradley is a Utah guy, eddie would fit Sloan's all hustle attitude, and Nash would replace Stockton.

The #'s match up. slaries for next year are Ostertag $8.6, Ameachi $2.6, and Kirilenko almost $1. Nash $5.7, Bradley $3.5 and Najera at $3.5. THats 12.2 to 12.7.

I know trading 3 Mavs for 1 player and 2 scrubs seems a little crazy, but Kirilenko would be perfect in Dallas , you'd get rid of the constant headache known as Mantis, and Ostertag only has next year on salary, and Ameachi only has 2 years left. Ostertag would be gone next year, or you could even trade him at the deadline to a team wanting a cap clearer going into the offseason.

Only thing is Kirilenko is obviuosly has a very good future, and would Utah deal him, And they too know that Ostertag only has one year left, I doubt they'd do it, but it would help them rebuild quickly.


UTAH
PG Nash as opposed to Mark JAckson
SG Cheaney
SF Harpring
PF ?? Najera, Massenburg...........?????????
C Bradley............................Ostertag

Dallas
PG NVE
SG FIN
SF Kirilenko
PF Dirk
C Raef

and hopefully Cubes adds a C and backup PF in FA, and PG in Draft or FA

Just211
06-06-2003, 12:30 AM
okay maybe it's little STOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOPID, but i think Dirk and Kirilenko would be a great combo for a log time

one long blue sock
06-06-2003, 12:35 AM
Why would Utah trade its ONLY good youth away for a 29 or 30 year old.

Just211
06-06-2003, 12:38 AM
they probably wouldn't, but they're not going to have much talent next year, and could get a top PG, and a Utah native too, while getting rid of 2 spares

aexchange
06-06-2003, 12:40 AM
not in a million years would i make this trade. why is everybody so intent on trading a 3rd team ALL NBA PG?

and what we are left with is a PG who is a couple years older?!?!?!

one long blue sock
06-06-2003, 12:51 AM
Nash is having bad hip problems, and its not like the rest of the squad can last for much longer. So they might as well go for a point guard that can step it up in the playoffs.

hero = dirk
06-06-2003, 01:57 AM
i don't like the idea of both nash and najera leaving. they are both central players to the mavs, and losing both of them would be a mistake.

Mandyahl
06-06-2003, 03:49 AM
Kirilenko is ugly. So is Ostertag, for that matter. We shouldn't trade away our pretty players for their ugly ones. Yeah. Really though I don't know how much I like this idea...trading an all-star point guard for some ugly Russian that doesn't even start for the Jazz? He does have a lot of potential though...

Epitome22
06-06-2003, 05:28 AM
I don't mind the "who's the hottest mavs" threads. But how good looking Kirilenko is compared to how good looking a certain Maverick is should never eneter serious conversation about potential trades unless you want to be made fun of.


Honestly, I don't wanna get rid of Nash, but from a purely practical perspective, that's a move you'd have to make. Nash isn't getting any younger and already has questionable fatique problems. Kirilenko is an all defensive caliber defender even if he doesen't have the credentials yet. He's young, athletic, He has a strong not to mention versatile on the ball defensive capability rivaled only by guys like Kevin Garnett; Capable of guarding guys from Kobe to Jermaine O'Neal. Not to mention he's an absolute pest on the help side, with a fury that would humble even the likes of Najera. He's not a bad rebounder and if you gave him 35 minutes he could probably get you 7-8 boards a game. He hits his free throws, he doesen't have the strongest jumpshot in the world but he's dependable enough outside 15 feet if you leave him open and he doesen't take dumb or questionable shots. Nash, with his fatique issues, has maybe 4 good years left before he's a potential backup again. Kirilenko is of a comparable age to Dirk and they could play together for a long time.

ariosto
06-06-2003, 08:49 AM
Does anybody want to start a long thread along these lines, for realistic trade ideas that must work under the cap? Called "Serious Trade Thread" or something? Problem would be that 'serious' is highly subjective. We should start one if enough people want to participate.

Edit: Or we could just use this thread.

Just211
06-06-2003, 10:15 AM
aexchange, i don't want to trade Nash either, but Dallas is getting to the point where a lot of players are getting older, and with only late draft picks, you have to start trading age for young potential to stay good. While I wouldn't like the ideal of seeing NVE as our starter, Nash is probably our most tradable(value) player, and i'd love the ideal of picking up a young up and coming SF.

Just211
06-06-2003, 10:38 AM
Why would Utah trade its ONLY good youth away for a 29 or 30 year old.

because SF is actually the one position they have someone(HARPRING) They could add a top caliber PG, and an avg center(while dumping 1 avg center, and 1 pile of crap) and depth at PF

Chiwas
06-06-2003, 12:20 PM
i don't like the idea of both nash and najera leaving. they are both central players to the mavs, and losing both of them would be a mistake. Wise, wise.


Kirilenko is ugly. So is Ostertag, for that matter. We shouldn't trade away our pretty players for their ugly onesHehehe.



(What kind of place would this be without our lovely female members?)


i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif

Just211
06-08-2003, 12:30 AM
<u>NOT SO STOOPID TRADE #2</u>

This is a deal involving NVE that is very risky, and I would only do if nothing better at all is possible


Dallas trades:
PG: NVE, SF: Rigo
Memphis trades:
PG: Jason Williams, PF Stromile Swift, PF Ryan Humphrey

Dallas does trade to add 2 young PF projects. Swift is talented, but not using all his talent. Humphrey is a hustler, who would be great off the bench. Dallas also has to swallow JWIll's contract. It's got 5 years left, 37.5 mil. But imo nellie could maximaze Williams, who last year had a better TO/Assist ratio than Nash.(Nash 7.3/2.5, Williams 8.3/2.21). Williams is streaky. but so is NVE. and williams is 4 years younger. Rigo salary makes the trade fit.

Memphis does trade to dump JWilll's contract, while acquiring a starting PG. West drafted NVE, so he might have a soft spot for him. Also, NVE has an out after next year, so Memphis would have salary cap room to go after Kobe, if NVE bails on them. And West has been trying to deal Williams, and Swift for awhile, now here's his chance. and Rigo is thrown away after contract is up in a year.

Dallas:
PG: Nash/Willimas/AJ
SG: Fin/Bell/SEK
SF: Dirk/ Eddie/TAW
PF: Swift/Humphrey
C: (ZO?) Raef/Bradley
plus a pick, and who knows what they'll really do this offseason.

Memphis
PG: NVE/Watson/Knight
SG: Person/Dickerson
SF: Miller/Battier
PF: Gasol/ ROOKIE
C: Wright/ trybanski/ ROOKIE

doesn't leave them that bad, but in all honesty, I think they'd trade JwILL and Swift for NVE, but I don't think they'd throw in Humphrey.

Now i know nobody likes JwIll, but he's gotten better about sloppy play, and if groomed right, could be a great fit. AND this is a trade i do only if you're set on trading NVE for big men, and can't find something better

MikeB
06-08-2003, 03:33 PM
Throw in Esch and get them to give us Dickerson and its a definite.....MAYBE!

I like Swift's athleticism but he is not a good defender(yet? ever?)except that he can block shots. He is not a good rebounder(ever? yet?)which we need. Humprey would be another Najera type...undersized body...oversized heart...better rebounder on the defensive end though. Jwill scares the bejesus out of me though....and if Nellie ever decided to play Jwill and Nash together with Fin then ALL HELL would break loose around here as Jwill is a worse defender than NVE.

The Utah trade is actually stoopid...never happen...Utah has set themselves up with a young PG already in the kid from Spain. Add him with Harpring and Kirelinko plus the Big guys from Stanford and they have a decent enough young team to stay fairly competive till they grow up.

madape
06-09-2003, 08:59 AM
We've tried to trade for Kiralinko before and Utah wouldn't budge. Now that he's a rising star and one of the biggest building blocks of the Jazz youth revival, you can forget about it. I love the guy, but I wouldn't trade Nash for him. A good point guard is sooooo hard to find.

ariosto
06-09-2003, 09:16 AM
Not So Stoopid Trade #3

Thought I'd chime in with a 'not so stoopid' trade. Although it may be stoopid, and I'm sure if it is you guys will tell me.

Dallas Trades: PF/C Raef LaFrentz
Seattle Trades: SG Brent Barry, Ansu Sesay and Joe Forte.

This is essentially a Raef for Barry trade. Sesay and Forte are minimum salaries thrown in for cap purposes. Salaries match up.

Seattle does the trade to get some size, which they need. Of course, Raef likes jumpers like everyone else on Seattle, but at least he's 6'11". Drobnjak may be leaving soon and Raef could be very helpful as a starting center or PF. Barry is expendable as they have Ray Allen now and will almost definitely draft a starting PG.

We do the trade to get rid of Raef's 7 year contract, and to get some back-court depth. Barry become either an excellent back-up SG (and PG if we trade Nick), or become the starting SG, with Fin starting at forward. Barry is an great shooter, passer and team defender. He has serious hops (won the dunk contest a few years back), but his limited ball-handling skill keeps him from being a great slasher, just like Fin.

Dallas line-up:

Nash/NVE
Barry
Fin
Dirk
Malone (??) /Bradley

Seattle Line-up:

Draft Pick (Hinnrich?)
Ray Allen
Rashard Lewis
Radmonovich
Raef

LRB
06-09-2003, 04:21 PM
Originally posted by: madape
We've tried to trade for Kiralinko before and Utah wouldn't budge. Now that he's a rising star and one of the biggest building blocks of the Jazz youth revival, you can forget about it. I love the guy, but I wouldn't trade Nash for him. A good point guard is sooooo hard to find.

Not to mention that Nash would have at least 4 chances per year to bite us in the ass with this trade.

mavsfanforever
06-09-2003, 07:42 PM
Originally posted by: LRB

Originally posted by: madape
We've tried to trade for Kiralinko before and Utah wouldn't budge. Now that he's a rising star and one of the biggest building blocks of the Jazz youth revival, you can forget about it. I love the guy, but I wouldn't trade Nash for him. A good point guard is sooooo hard to find.

Not to mention that Nash would have at least 4 chances per year to bite us in the ass with this trade.

Ask Indiana or Bulls or Lakers how difficult it is to find a good PG.

nowitzki_prophecy
06-10-2003, 11:46 AM
sorry "just" but it IS a stupid trade.

true,AK is a very nice talent,and MAYBE a future all-star,but what your talking about here is the second best PG in the NBA!!and Eddie,which i think can start in almost every NBA team other than the top 4-5.

and for what??a talent,but not a very muscelar player that would'nt solve our low post problems,an ageing over payed center,that is about the same level as Shawn,and John freakin ameachi???

no way in hell would i even consider a deal like that.

Ummmmm Ok
06-10-2003, 12:40 PM
Why the hell not:


Dallas trades:
PG Nick Van Exel (12.5 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 4.3 apg in 27.8 minutes)
C Evan Eschmeyer (1.0 ppg, 1.7 rpg, 0.4 apg in 7.9 minutes)
Dallas receives:
SF Jalen Rose (22.1 ppg, 4.3 rpg, 4.8 apg in 40.9 minutes)
Change in team outlook: +8.6 ppg, -0.3 rpg, and +0.1 apg.

Chicago trades:
SF Jalen Rose (22.1 ppg, 4.3 rpg, 4.8 apg in 40.9 minutes)
Chicago receives:
SG Wesley Person (11.0 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 1.7 apg in 66 games)
C Lorenzen Wright (11.4 ppg, 7.5 rpg, 1.1 apg in 70 games)
Change in team outlook: +0.3 ppg, +6.1 rpg, and -2.0 apg.

Memphis trades:
SG Wesley Person (11.0 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 1.7 apg in 29.4 minutes)
C Lorenzen Wright (11.4 ppg, 7.5 rpg, 1.1 apg in 28.3 minutes)
Memphis receives:
PG Nick Van Exel (12.5 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 4.3 apg in 73 games)
C Evan Eschmeyer (1.0 ppg, 1.7 rpg, 0.4 apg in 17 games)
Change in team outlook: -8.9 ppg, -5.8 rpg, and +1.9 apg.

TRADE ACCEPTED

Blonde Bomber
06-10-2003, 12:51 PM
Originally posted by: Ummmmm Ok
Why the hell not:


Dallas trades:
PG Nick Van Exel (12.5 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 4.3 apg in 27.8 minutes)
C Evan Eschmeyer (1.0 ppg, 1.7 rpg, 0.4 apg in 7.9 minutes)
Dallas receives:
SF Jalen Rose (22.1 ppg, 4.3 rpg, 4.8 apg in 40.9 minutes)
Change in team outlook: +8.6 ppg, -0.3 rpg, and +0.1 apg.

Chicago trades:
SF Jalen Rose (22.1 ppg, 4.3 rpg, 4.8 apg in 40.9 minutes)
Chicago receives:
SG Wesley Person (11.0 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 1.7 apg in 66 games)
C Lorenzen Wright (11.4 ppg, 7.5 rpg, 1.1 apg in 70 games)
Change in team outlook: +0.3 ppg, +6.1 rpg, and -2.0 apg.

Memphis trades:
SG Wesley Person (11.0 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 1.7 apg in 29.4 minutes)
C Lorenzen Wright (11.4 ppg, 7.5 rpg, 1.1 apg in 28.3 minutes)
Memphis receives:
PG Nick Van Exel (12.5 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 4.3 apg in 73 games)
C Evan Eschmeyer (1.0 ppg, 1.7 rpg, 0.4 apg in 17 games)
Change in team outlook: -8.9 ppg, -5.8 rpg, and +1.9 apg.

TRADE ACCEPTED

Why don't we just bypass Chicago all together and get Person and Lorenzen ourselves. Even though Rose is the better players I think Person and Wright would make more of an impact...jmo

Ummmmm Ok
06-10-2003, 12:58 PM
because madape loves Rose!!!! i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif

But actually I was just thinking of a way to get Rose here, but more I think about it, I like your idea better. i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif But I started thinking earlier about my proposal. Dallas and Chicago would do those trades but why would West and Memphis? WHy would they trade away Person/Wright for NVE? They wouldn't!!!

So how about a NVE/Najera/29th pick for Wright/Person/13th pick. Money matches. Dallas wouldn't trade NVE and Najera for just Person and Wright. Memphis on the other hand would. I think if we swap picks I think Dallas would probably go ahead and do it.

Thoughts?

Blonde Bomber
06-10-2003, 01:11 PM
Originally posted by: Ummmmm Ok
because madape loves Rose!!!! i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif

But actually I was just thinking of a way to get Rose here, but more I think about it, I like your idea better. i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif But I started thinking earlier about my proposal. Dallas and Chicago would do those trades but why would West and Memphis? WHy would they trade away Person/Wright for NVE? They wouldn't!!!

So how about a NVE/Najera/29th pick for Wright/Person/13th pick. Money matches. Dallas wouldn't trade NVE and Najera for just Person and Wright. Memphis on the other hand would. I think if we swap picks I think Dallas would probably go ahead and do it.

Thoughts?


I would only to that deal whenever I know whats available at #13 and if somebody falls. It would be hard to get rid of Najera in that deal. I would do backflips if we could get Gasol instead of the others but I know there not that stupid.

But yes I would consider it if we could get a Lampe at #13 or some big body. You add him with Wright and you have upgraded your lowpost without spending a dime of your exception. Then go out and sign Alonzo Mourning and Stephen Jackson. Find a backup PG with the 1.5, maybe Claxton and you may have something.


pg- Nash, Claxton
sg- Finley, Person, Bell
sf- Nowitzki, Jackson
pf- Wright, LaFrentz, Lampe(rk)
c- Mourning, Bradley

Chiwas
06-10-2003, 01:19 PM
Eddie and Dirk are going to die in Dallas.

El Eduardo means big money and Cuban knows it. Get it?

foglemann
06-10-2003, 01:26 PM
On the Brent Barry trade, I like the idea A LOT!!! I have always been a big fan of Brent and I wish he was on our team. Does everything from the SG spot that we need, passing, ball handling, dunking, spot up shooting. Him Nash, Fin, Brent, Dirk would be awsome. But we do need some low post player to come in here and that does not cut it. But if we can still get ZO with some of the MLE, I would be all for this, b/c Fin, I think, would be fine moving to SF with a lineup so big. ZO, 7'0; Dirk, 7'0; Fin 6'8; Brent 6'6; Nash 6'1 and with Nick, Eddie, Bradley off the bench. Really like this lineup.


Jalen would be great if we could get him, and the three way deal looks good. But I think Memphis would want to get rid of a PG if they were to give up anything. JWill might be able to play back up, but I don't know. I like the Person and Wright trade, but we get an aging spot up SG and a tweener in Wright, good rebounder though. I would not give up Nick for those two. Battier and someone else or two that makes the salaries match, maybe JWill, I would be all about it. Give us our SF spot.

Blonde Bomber
06-10-2003, 01:35 PM
OK...I think we would be idiots not to make the trade with Memphis....if we could end up with Lampe..

This guy has a bright future

http://www.nbadraft.net/profiles/headshots/maciej-lampe-hd2.jpg

Just211
06-13-2003, 12:52 AM
alright, here's a not so stoopid trade that makes sense, and no major Mav leaves.
Atlanta is trying to dump salary, because they have no cap space and a shitty team. Rumor is that just about every high paid Hawk is available for a contract relief trade except Shareef.
and if Dallas can't find a quality PF/C with MLE, then they might try this:

Dallas trades :
Avery Johnson ($5.4 mil, one year left)

Atlanta trades:
Nazr Mohammed ($5 mil in 03-04,$5.25 in 04-05, $5.5 in 05-06)

Atlanta does this trade to create cap space after next year, while acquiring a SMART Pg to help develop Dickua(or some other PG) while playing sparingly.

Dallas does this trade to acquire depth at PF/C. Mohammed is a DEFENDER/REBOUNDER, who showed a lot of promise, until his minutes were cut. Last year, His per 48 on rebounds was 13.98, but he didn't get the time. the two years prior(00-02) to that he avg 26 min, 8.45 boards. compare that to the 4.4 Raef got in 24.6 min per game, and he looks good. Also i know he'd seem like another high paid bench huggin center, but chances are Dallas won't land a good big guy in the draft(Badaine will be gone) and they will probably land a higher quality foreign SF or PG. SO adding depth this way would help. plus he'll only be 26

Pg: Nash/NVE/ROOKIE
SG:FIN/Bell/SEK?
SF: Eddie/TAW/ROOKIE
PF: Dirk/Nazr
C:Raef/Bradley/Esch

It's not a sexy trade, but it's a good plan C or D

Lonely PSU Mavs Fan
06-13-2003, 10:21 AM
I do like Nazr and i think he is a capable big, but i would do this as a last ditch desperation plan if we cant get one of the more high profile FAs

madape
06-19-2003, 09:21 AM
http://sportsmed.starwave.com/media/ncb/2002/0316/photo/a_hinrich_vt.jpg

Sorry, I normally don't promote trades, but the more I think about Kirk Hinrich on the Mavs, the more excited I get.
Here's a dream offseason.

Dallas Trades: Michael Finley, #29 in this year's draft, next year's first rounder, and Cash
to Chicago for: Jalen Rose and the #7 and the #36 pick in this years draft.

Dallas picks Kirk Hinrich with #7
Dallas picks Slavko Vranes with #36

Then after July 1st:

Dallas Trades: Nick Van Exel, Avery Johnson and Eduardo Najera
to Miami for: Eddie Jones and a newly re-signed Alonzo Mourning

The same day we sign Karl Malone for $4.9
and Askarabic for $1.5

Here's our new team:

PG: Nash, Hinrich
SG: Rose, Abdul-Wahad
SF: Dirk, Eddie Jones, Askarabic
PF: Malone, Raef
C: Mourning, Bradley, Esch

Blonde Bomber
06-19-2003, 09:41 AM
madape..

I think you left off Mourning in your starting lineup..


but yeah...that would be a GREAT offseason for the mavs. I would be thrilled if half of that happened.

Blonde Bomber
06-19-2003, 09:50 AM
I would take you offseason a step further and do this to keep our 4.9 exception intact..

Sign and Trade

Utah signs and trades:

Karl Malone to Dallas

Dallas trades:

Shawn Bradley to Utah


Then sign Corey Maggette to the full 4.9

Then our lineup looks like this:

pg: Nash - Hinrich
sg: Rose - Magette - Bell
sf: Dirk - Jones - Oggy
pf: Malone - LaFrentz
c: Mourning - Esch

OutletPass
06-19-2003, 09:59 AM
When will everyone learn that Dirk is no longer a SF....please. He's a PF and it's not going to change. Our hole is at the 3 and that's what we need to fill.....along with the 5.


That's a very nice fantasy lineup though, BB !

madape
06-19-2003, 11:34 AM
BB - I did forget Mourning. Thanks.

Well, there are a few problems with your counter idea BB. First, Bradley will make less than $4M next year. Malone is going to be asking for at LEAST $4.9. So in order to get the trade to work the Mavs would probably have to throw something else in. And the whole reason Utah is considering dumping Malone is so that they'll have money to go after free agents. They've got major personell issues all over the place. I'm not sure they would give up their rebuilding plan for Bradley. Second, I don't think there is any chance of getting Maggette for the $4.9. He is a restricted free agent. If Corey accepts a Mav three-year option for the $4.9, the Clips can match and lock him in as a Clip for three more years. Maggette knows this and won't sign any mid-level exception offers this summer. Unless someonewho's far under the cap like San Antonio decides to go after him, I think you'll see Magette signing the Clips one year quilifying offer in order to become unrestricted next year...like Kandi did last year. I think it would be fine to save the exception if you had someone else in mind for it. But why give up productive players for an exception you don't need? Bradley as ugly as he is is at the very leasy a very fine backup center. I'm not giving him up for nothing. Finally, your lineup fits in two pretty unreliable guys at the center position. There is a big risk in taking on Mourning. There is an enormous chance he won't make it halfway through the season, much less play forty minutes per game in a tough playoff run. Esch is just as undependable as a backup. I think your idea puts an even bigger question mark on our center position. Fragile Fragile Fragile. Is that what you want?

Outlet pass. Eddie Jones is an attempt to solidify the three spot. He's a pretty good all around player and at one time was consdered the best defender in the league at the three. As far as the center position, I think we're potentially as strong and deep as anyone in the league. Mourning has a chance, however small, of returning to his all-NBA form, but even if he doesn't pan out, we still have loads of guys on the roster who can get it done. Raef will still be only 26 years old and have all the talent in the world, we'd still have the leagues most efficient shotblocker in Bradley, Karl Malone and Dirk can both play center if we ask them to, Esch can be a very capable backup, and we've got a 7'6" monster brooding and developing in Europe. Mourning, Malone, Raef, Bradley, Esch, Vranes... I don't think we can ask for much more this offseason. As for Dirk playing the three, we all know that the positions don't mean as much in Nelsons system. With an upgrade in the defensive capabilities of those around him, Dirk will probably be asket to guard our opponents least threatening scorer. He'd still be allowed to do the things he's always done on defense. With Malone in the game, he'd be even deadlier. If it chaps your hide to have Dirk on the court with another power forward, then let's shuffle the starting lineup to make you feel better:

PG: Nash
SG: Rose
SF: Jones
PF: Dirk
C: Malone

Bench: Hinrich, Bradley, Raef, Mourning

Tell me how this doesn't work.

OutletPass
06-19-2003, 11:51 AM
Outlet pass. Jones is an attempt to solidify the three spot. As far as the center position, I think we're stronger. We've got talent, upside and depth, as well as a 7'6" monster brooding and developing in Europe. Mourning, Raef, Bradley, Esch, Vranes... I don't think we can ask for much more this offseason. As for Dirk playing the three, we all know that positions don't really matter in Nelsons system. Dirk will probably guard the teams least threatening scorer on defense and still do the things he does on offense. If it chaps your hide to have Dirk on the court with another power forward, then lets shuffle the starting lineup to make you feel better:

Mad...I understand about jones...no problem there. but, at the 5, all we have NOW is Raef and Shawn...Esch is a non-factor in my eyes. I'm cool with Shawn as our backup/disruption specialist...but I don't know about Raef. I assume that Dirk will play the "least threatening" scorer on D, so my hide is just fine. I was really only commenting on everyone looking at Dirk at the 3 on offense. Just my opinion, but I think that, over the summer, he works very hard on his moves down in the post....so instead of the 4 being a huge priority, i'd rather fill the 3 deeply and get a good PF/C who can add to our rebounding and defense...

Zo scares me for medical reasons only....and, well, we don't have Vranes do we ?

I like your lineup, too. But remember, it's all fantasy lineups until it happens...just like Vranes.

Blonde Bomber
06-19-2003, 04:38 PM
Mad, I see your point on how fragile the center position would be, even though with a suspect Mourning the center position would be upgraded over last years team.

It is a BIG risk in depending on Mourning but theres not that many other options on the market..

I wonder if we could get a player like a Stepania or someone else that wouldn't command a high salary?

MikeB
06-19-2003, 07:17 PM
Originally posted by: madape
http://sportsmed.starwave.com/media/ncb/2002/0316/photo/a_hinrich_vt.jpg

Sorry, I normally don't promote trades, but the more I think about Kirk Hinrich on the Mavs, the more excited I get.
Here's a dream offseason.

Dallas Trades: Michael Finley, #29 in this year's draft, next year's first rounder, and Cash
to Chicago for: Jalen Rose and the #7 and the #36 pick in this years draft.

Dallas picks Kirk Hinrich with #7
Dallas picks Slavko Vranes with #36

Then after July 1st:

Dallas Trades: Nick Van Exel, Avery Johnson and Eduardo Najera
to Miami for: Eddie Jones and a newly re-signed Alonzo Mourning

The same day we sign Karl Malone for $4.9
and Askarabic for $1.5

Here's our new team:

PG: Nash, Hinrich
SG: Rose, Abdul-Wahad
SF: Dirk, Eddie Jones, Askarabic
PF: Malone, Raef
C: Mourning, Bradley, Esch

Why in the world would a team that is THIS close to a championship BLOWUP the team?
Only 6 returning players out of 15...isn't that a bit drastic? I mean we aren't the Clippers...at least not anymore. Fantasy is alright as long as you can still distinguish it from the reality that this team only needs to add 2-3 players to the 10 we have returning. Of course I would love to move Esch and AJ may well be the most tradeable Mav because of his expiring contract but I didn't see anything THAT wrong with the team to take a chainsaw to the roster.

Step 1- Sign Alonzo if you are sure he is healthy
Step 2- Go hard after PJ Brown...even if it takes a sign and trade...AJ may be valuable here.
Step 3- Find a SF...Jumaine Jones or Calbert Cheaney while not stars would be an upgrade at least in size
Step 4- Resign Raja Bell after giving him the summer program of working on his PG skills so he can be a combo G

The roster could look alot like this:
PG Nash, NVE, Bell
SG Finley, Bell, TAW
SF J.Jones or Cheaney or both, or Walt Williams, Rookie or Sekularac
PF Dirk, PJ, Raef, Eddie
C Alonzo, Bradley, Esch

That is 15...with only 5 changes. 5 is still a huge roster turnover as it is 33%

Chicago JK
06-19-2003, 07:35 PM
Originally posted by: MikeB

Originally posted by: madape
http://sportsmed.starwave.com/media/ncb/2002/0316/photo/a_hinrich_vt.jpg

Sorry, I normally don't promote trades, but the more I think about Kirk Hinrich on the Mavs, the more excited I get.
Here's a dream offseason.

Dallas Trades: Michael Finley, #29 in this year's draft, next year's first rounder, and Cash
to Chicago for: Jalen Rose and the #7 and the #36 pick in this years draft.

Dallas picks Kirk Hinrich with #7
Dallas picks Slavko Vranes with #36

Then after July 1st:

Dallas Trades: Nick Van Exel, Avery Johnson and Eduardo Najera
to Miami for: Eddie Jones and a newly re-signed Alonzo Mourning

The same day we sign Karl Malone for $4.9
and Askarabic for $1.5

Here's our new team:

PG: Nash, Hinrich
SG: Rose, Abdul-Wahad
SF: Dirk, Eddie Jones, Askarabic
PF: Malone, Raef
C: Mourning, Bradley, Esch

Why in the world would a team that is THIS close to a championship BLOWUP the team?
Only 6 returning players out of 15...isn't that a bit drastic? I mean we aren't the Clippers...at least not anymore. Fantasy is alright as long as you can still distinguish it from the reality that this team only needs to add 2-3 players to the 10 we have returning. Of course I would love to move Esch and AJ may well be the most tradeable Mav because of his expiring contract but I didn't see anything THAT wrong with the team to take a chainsaw to the roster.

Step 1- Sign Alonzo if you are sure he is healthy
Step 2- Go hard after PJ Brown...even if it takes a sign and trade...AJ may be valuable here.
Step 3- Find a SF...Jumaine Jones or Calbert Cheaney while not stars would be an upgrade at least in size
Step 4- Resign Raja Bell after giving him the summer program of working on his PG skills so he can be a combo G

The roster could look alot like this:
PG Nash, NVE, Bell
SG Finley, Bell, TAW
SF J.Jones or Cheaney or both, or Walt Williams, Rookie or Sekularac
PF Dirk, PJ, Raef, Eddie
C Alonzo, Bradley, Esch

That is 15...with only 5 changes. 5 is still a huge roster turnover as it is 33%

Very good post Mike B. First of all you should only try to sign one player between Mourning and Malone. I personally think Malone will run into a culture shock next year when he isn't playing with stockton and in a new system. He is going to slow down eventually and I think next year he takes another step back. Malone probably has a maximum of 2 years left and Mourning can leave the game at anytime, so if you have these two on your team you are really crippling yourself in two years when Dirk, Nash and Finley are still in their primes. To get both you would have to give up Raef in one of the deals.

My offseason plan is similar to yours. I would go after Mourning if he is healthy. I would then go after Jumaine and start him at small forward. The addition of Jumaine would really even out the team. he is a nice young athlete who will be able to provide nice small forward minutes. Plus he played with AI so he is use to not having plays called for him.

In the draft, I really like some of the seniors that appear to be falling, but unless they are the absolute best player available I am going to pass. I say the Mavs should gamble on a HS player or Euro. Either stash him overseas or sit him on the bench. He won't help you for 2-3 years. Maybe it is Perkins, Ebi, Malick or other. Just grab someone you think will be a player down the road.

I would trade either NVE or Raef, but only if I get value back. It will be tough to do this in this market with their contracts, so more than likely I hold onto them. I am not a big fan of Raef's, but he does have talent. I think having Raef back up Dirk and Mourning is a lot better role for him. I never thought his calling was as a starting center. He is more of a PF than a center.

The Mavs would now have a solid 8-9 rotation. That is all you need. Anything else would be going to the extreme.

Here is your lineup

Nash
Finley
Jumaine Jones
Dirk
Mourning

Bench
NVE
Raef
Najara
Griffin or Wahad


emergency backup-Bradley
AJ-player coach unless you can trade him for value like you say
In the freezer-Perkins, EBi, Malick or etc....working with a legions of assistance on the smaller points of the game.

Nash13
06-19-2003, 10:55 PM
Here's a not so stupid, actually pretty smart trade. Like Madape, i don't promote a whole lot of trades.

Chicago Trades:

Donyell Marshall
Marcus Fizer

Dallas Trades:

Eduardo Najera
Nick Van Exel
maybe the 1st round draft pick

TRADE ACCEPTED

This trade would solve a lot of problems and would make a lot of sense. Since Fizer was injured, the Bulls will lower their standards. I just hoped none of that Post-Jordan Bulls team doesn't rub off on them.

Mandyahl
06-20-2003, 12:32 AM
I just hoped none of that Post-Jordan Bulls team doesn't rub off on them.

huh?

MFFL
06-20-2003, 08:07 AM
Originally posted by: MikeB

Why in the world would a team that is THIS close to a championship [i]BLOWUP the team?
Only 6 returning players out of 15...isn't that a bit drastic?


I think the Lakers might blow up their team in a similar fashion.

superheadcat
06-20-2003, 02:35 PM
this is definitely one of the stoopid trades:
"Antonio Davis, Morris Peterson and Toronto's fourth overall pick to Dallas for Steve Nash and Raef LaFrentz.
The Mavericks get Davis, the tough guy and post presence they need. He's a little small for the Western Conference, but he's rugged and can battle the bigger forwards in the West. The Mavs also get the Raptors' No. 4 overall pick to get a project big guy they can wait for, like Chris Kaman. The key in the deal is Steve Nash, the British Columbia native, returning to Canada. Nick Van Exel was on the court at the end of all the Mavs' big playoff games, and Nash comes up for a new deal after the 2004-05 season. Better to trade Nash a year soon. The Raptors also get Raef LaFrentz, who'll fit better in the East away from the Mavs' frenetic game. Toronto would be so thrilled to get Nash, a potential franchise savior, it would probably throw in whomever the Mavs wanted, perhaps Peterson or to expand the deal if the Mavs want Alvin Williams and would send back someone like Evan Eschmeyer. " from espn.com's Sam Smith
.
what the hell is he thinking?

Ummmmm Ok
08-29-2003, 06:15 PM
Didn't wanna start a new thread so how about this trade idea:

Dallas trades Howard/Raef to Chicago for Marshall/Curry.

I know people are going to say I am crazy for trading Howard but with Welch here now, isn't he an upgrade over Howard? Jamison is already set in the 3 spot, and Finley in the 2 with Welch backing him up. That leaves nothing but a backup spot for Howard. I think Chicago would love to have Howard sitting in the wings to replace Rose in the future. Now the only thing that is going to hold this possible trade up is, we will have to wait until December 15th because Howard signed a contract, and I also think Chicago might want Welsh more than they want Howard.

After Trade Lineups.

Dallas:
PG: Nash, Best, Daniels
SG: Finley, Welsh, Bell
SF: Jamison, Marshall, TAW
PF: Dirk, Fortson, Najera
C: Bradley, Curry

Chicago:
PG: Crawford, Hinrich, Williams
SG: Rose, Howard, Gill
SF: Pippen, Robinson
PF: Fizer, Baxton, Austin
C: Chandler, Raef, Bagaric

Any thoughts?

uberfan
08-29-2003, 06:27 PM
Trade Mills to Wizards for Etan Thomas and Larry Hughes. Let Hughes shake hands with the other former GSW and then move him on if a better deal comes up later.

EricaLubarsky
08-29-2003, 06:42 PM
I love Curry's play. Mmmmmmmmm

jayC
08-29-2003, 08:21 PM
Why? andrei is a role player at best so you would be willing to trade a two time all-star for a role player. This one is as dumb as they come.

jayC
08-29-2003, 08:21 PM
Why? andrei is a role player at best so you would be willing to trade a two time all-star for a role player. This one is as dumb as they come.

MavsFanatik33
08-29-2003, 10:48 PM
Yeah, and then what... Best starts? Also, we have Jamison...why would we need Kirilenko?... and OSTERTAG SUCKS!

EricaLubarsky
08-30-2003, 12:01 AM
Originally posted by: MavsFanatik33
Yeah, and then what... Best starts? Also, we have Jamison...why would we need Kirilenko?... and OSTERTAG SUCKS!

Ostertag is great. He should get best supporting model for half the dunk posters out there.

MFFL
08-30-2003, 12:11 AM
Originally posted by: EricaLubarsky

Originally posted by: MavsFanatik33
Yeah, and then what... Best starts? Also, we have Jamison...why would we need Kirilenko?... and OSTERTAG SUCKS!

Ostertag is great. He should get best supporting model for half the dunk posters out there.

LOL - and Bradley is on the other half.

EricaLubarsky
08-30-2003, 12:27 AM
http://www.nba.com/playoffs2001/images/brad_ostertag_010503.jpg

LOL - and Bradley is on the other half.

Nash13
08-30-2003, 11:55 AM
Here's one that's sounds kinda good:

Dallas trades: C Raef LaFrentz (9.3 ppg, 4.8 rpg, 0.8 apg in 23.4 minutes)
SF Chris Mills (4.8 ppg, 2.4 rpg, 1.1 apg in 12.5 minutes)
SG Tariq Abdul-Wahad (4.1 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 1.5 apg in 14.6 minutes)
Dallas receives: SG Antonio McDyess (4.1 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 1.5 apg in 14.6 minutes)
C Travis Knight (1.9 ppg, 1.9 rpg, 0.4 apg in 9.0 minutes)
C Michael Doleac (4.4 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 0.6 apg in 13.9 minutes)
Change in team outlook: -11.9 ppg, -5.3 rpg, and -2.4 apg.

New York trades: SG Antonio McDyess (4.1 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 1.5 apg in 14.6 minutes)
C Travis Knight (1.9 ppg, 1.9 rpg, 0.4 apg in 9.0 minutes)
C Michael Doleac (4.4 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 0.6 apg in 13.9 minutes)
New York receives: C Raef LaFrentz (9.3 ppg, 4.8 rpg, 0.8 apg in 69 games)
SF Chris Mills (4.8 ppg, 2.4 rpg, 1.1 apg in 21 games)
SG Tariq Abdul-Wahad (4.1 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 1.5 apg in 14 games)
Change in team outlook: +11.9 ppg, +5.3 rpg, and +2.4 apg.

TRADE ACCEPTED

Nash13
08-30-2003, 11:58 AM
Here's one that will never happen:

Dallas trades: PG Steve Nash (17.7 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 7.3 apg in 33.1 minutes)
SF Chris Mills (4.8 ppg, 2.4 rpg, 1.1 apg in 12.5 minutes)
SF Antawn Jamison (22.2 ppg, 7.0 rpg, 1.9 apg in 39.3 minutes)
Dallas receives: PF Pat Garrity (10.7 ppg, 3.8 rpg, 1.5 apg in 31.9 minutes)
PF Drew Gooden (12.5 ppg, 6.5 rpg, 1.2 apg in 26.8 minutes)
SF Tracy McGrady (32.1 ppg, 6.5 rpg, 5.5 apg in 39.4 minutes)
C Andrew DeClercq (4.7 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 0.7 apg in 17.2 minutes)
Change in team outlook: +15.3 ppg, +8.9 rpg, and -1.4 apg.

Orlando trades: PF Pat Garrity (10.7 ppg, 3.8 rpg, 1.5 apg in 31.9 minutes)
PF Drew Gooden (12.5 ppg, 6.5 rpg, 1.2 apg in 26.8 minutes)
SF Tracy McGrady (32.1 ppg, 6.5 rpg, 5.5 apg in 39.4 minutes)
C Andrew DeClercq (4.7 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 0.7 apg in 17.2 minutes)
Orlando receives: PG Steve Nash (17.7 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 7.3 apg in 82 games)
SF Chris Mills (4.8 ppg, 2.4 rpg, 1.1 apg in 21 games)
SF Antawn Jamison (22.2 ppg, 7.0 rpg, 1.9 apg in 82 games)
Change in team outlook: -15.3 ppg, -8.9 rpg, and +1.4 apg.

TRADE ACCEPTED

PlAyMaKeR
08-30-2003, 01:11 PM
we must trade mills and some others backups for a young center and a backup.

I'd do this:

Chris Mills and Raef Lafrentz
for
Brad Miller and Brent Price

Ummmmm Ok
08-30-2003, 11:04 PM
Originally posted by: Nash13
Here's one that will never happen:

Dallas trades: PG Steve Nash (17.7 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 7.3 apg in 33.1 minutes)
SF Chris Mills (4.8 ppg, 2.4 rpg, 1.1 apg in 12.5 minutes)
SF Antawn Jamison (22.2 ppg, 7.0 rpg, 1.9 apg in 39.3 minutes)
Dallas receives: PF Pat Garrity (10.7 ppg, 3.8 rpg, 1.5 apg in 31.9 minutes)
PF Drew Gooden (12.5 ppg, 6.5 rpg, 1.2 apg in 26.8 minutes)
SF Tracy McGrady (32.1 ppg, 6.5 rpg, 5.5 apg in 39.4 minutes)
C Andrew DeClercq (4.7 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 0.7 apg in 17.2 minutes)
Change in team outlook: +15.3 ppg, +8.9 rpg, and -1.4 apg.

Orlando trades: PF Pat Garrity (10.7 ppg, 3.8 rpg, 1.5 apg in 31.9 minutes)
PF Drew Gooden (12.5 ppg, 6.5 rpg, 1.2 apg in 26.8 minutes)
SF Tracy McGrady (32.1 ppg, 6.5 rpg, 5.5 apg in 39.4 minutes)
C Andrew DeClercq (4.7 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 0.7 apg in 17.2 minutes)
Orlando receives: PG Steve Nash (17.7 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 7.3 apg in 82 games)
SF Chris Mills (4.8 ppg, 2.4 rpg, 1.1 apg in 21 games)
SF Antawn Jamison (22.2 ppg, 7.0 rpg, 1.9 apg in 82 games)
Change in team outlook: -15.3 ppg, -8.9 rpg, and +1.4 apg.

TRADE ACCEPTED

We would only have Best or Daniels as the Point guard, but DAMN! Finley, McGrady, and Dirk all playing on the court for the D-Mavs? Damn!!! BTW, we would have to send them more than Mills, Maybe Raef?

Nash13
08-31-2003, 07:03 AM
Ummmmm Ok, Steve Nash is in that too.

Nash13
08-31-2003, 07:07 PM
Here's another one:

Dallas trades: SF Chris Mills (4.8 ppg, 2.4 rpg, 1.1 apg in 12.5 minutes)
SG Tariq Abdul-Wahad (4.1 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 1.5 apg in 14.6 minutes)
Dallas receives: SG Eddie Jones (18.5 ppg, 4.8 rpg, 3.7 apg in 38.1 minutes)
Change in team outlook: +9.6 ppg, -0.5 rpg, and +1.1 apg.

Miami trades: SG Eddie Jones (18.5 ppg, 4.8 rpg, 3.7 apg in 38.1 minutes)
Miami receives: SF Chris Mills (4.8 ppg, 2.4 rpg, 1.1 apg in 21 games)
SG Tariq Abdul-Wahad (4.1 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 1.5 apg in 14 games)
Change in team outlook: -9.6 ppg, +0.5 rpg, and -1.1 apg.

TRADE ACCEPTED

Due to Dallas and Miami being over the cap

EricaLubarsky
09-01-2003, 12:13 AM
Originally posted by: PlAyMaKeR
we must trade mills and some others backups for a young center and a backup.

I'd do this:

Chris Mills and Raef Lafrentz
for
Brad Miller and Brent Price

ummm....no.

EricaLubarsky
09-01-2003, 12:15 AM
Originally posted by: Nash13
Here's another one:

Dallas trades: SF Chris Mills (4.8 ppg, 2.4 rpg, 1.1 apg in 12.5 minutes)
SG Tariq Abdul-Wahad (4.1 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 1.5 apg in 14.6 minutes)
Dallas receives: SG Eddie Jones (18.5 ppg, 4.8 rpg, 3.7 apg in 38.1 minutes)
Change in team outlook: +9.6 ppg, -0.5 rpg, and +1.1 apg.

Miami trades: SG Eddie Jones (18.5 ppg, 4.8 rpg, 3.7 apg in 38.1 minutes)
Miami receives: SF Chris Mills (4.8 ppg, 2.4 rpg, 1.1 apg in 21 games)
SG Tariq Abdul-Wahad (4.1 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 1.5 apg in 14 games)
Change in team outlook: -9.6 ppg, +0.5 rpg, and -1.1 apg.

TRADE ACCEPTED

Due to Dallas and Miami being over the cap

Too bad one move is all many teams need to make the playoffs in the East. Miami thinks they have what it takes so I dont think Miami is getting rid of their most promising SG.

PlAyMaKeR
09-01-2003, 12:21 PM
I think's a good trade for mavs but Tariq's a great player and Nellie doesn't use him very much... I think Tariq must be the Finley's first backup and trade another one with mills to miami for eddie jones.

Ummmmm Ok
10-23-2003, 02:37 PM
I figured I would bring this Thread BACK up with all the trade rumors that are going around now. Heres mine for the day:


Dallas trades: SF Eduardo Najera (6.7 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 1.0 apg in 23.0 minutes)
Dallas receives: C Tyson Chandler (9.2 ppg, 6.8 rpg, 1.0 apg in 24.4 minutes)
Change in team outlook: +2.5 ppg, +2.1 rpg, and 0.0 apg.

Chicago trades: C Tyson Chandler (9.2 ppg, 6.8 rpg, 1.0 apg in 24.4 minutes)
Chicago receives: SF Eduardo Najera (6.7 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 1.0 apg in 48 games)
Change in team outlook: -2.5 ppg, -2.1 rpg, and 0.0 apg.

This is a HOMER trade and it supports the Mavs! Chicago has no reason whatsoever to do this trade, unless they have full faith in Curry being their future. I wouldn't have even posted it if I didn't think Cuban and Nellie could pull it off. They seem to get the better of deals this summer and if we can't get Curry *which we never would* than why not get his backup.

grndmstr_c
10-23-2003, 02:52 PM
For that matter how about TAW and Fortson for Antonio Davis, to bring up a tired name that has once again been brought up by our buddies at hoopsworld (though for some reason they think we should trade AJ for him. Yeah, right). Of course, again, it would never happen, as it would end up costing Toronto quite a bit more in the long run.

Ummmmm Ok
10-23-2003, 02:59 PM
Well I was trying to do a trade where we could find a young Center for the future that would be here for a couple of years. Antonio Davis is a 6'9" Power Forward in the West but plays Center in the East. I would rather go with 7'1" Tyson Chandler who IS actually tall enough to play Center in the West. If I am not mistaken Chandler is only like 21 or something too. When the season starts we will only be using Najera for spurts anyways, why not go ahead and get Chandler to play center than you can move Fortson back to his real position to backup Dirk in the PF position.

Edit: Grammer Purposes *its my downfall*

grndmstr_c
10-23-2003, 03:06 PM
Ummmmmm, cause neither trade would ever happen. But as long as we're in fantasy land, since different players were involved we could just do both.

madape
10-23-2003, 03:47 PM
Chicago won't trade Chandler or Curry for anything short of Dirk. They have staked their future in these guys and both look like absolute studs right now. A stright up proposal of Najera for Chandler is not just ridiculous.... it's certifiably STOOOOOOOPID!!!!!!!

Ummmmm Ok
10-23-2003, 03:53 PM
So Ape, would you do a trade of Jamison for Chandler/Eddie Robinson?

sike
10-23-2003, 03:53 PM
Originally posted by: madape
Chicago won't trade Chandler or Curry for anything short of Dirk. They have staked their future in these guys and both look like absolute studs right now. A stright up proposal of Najera for Chandler is not just ridiculous.... it's certifiably STOOOOOOOPID!!!!!!!

huh? oh I did really have much to say, I just wanted to make sure that you read this previous post...cuz it flat out the truth

madape
10-23-2003, 04:05 PM
Originally posted by: Ummmmm Ok
So Ape, would you do a trade of Jamison for Chandler/Eddie Robinson?

Absolutely. I'm a huge fan of Chandler. He's going to be a superstar.

inter1488
06-27-2004, 02:22 PM
its not that dumb