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Old 11-06-2017, 10:49 AM   #81
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@MichaelSkolnik:

Aurora: AR-15
Orlando: AR-15
Las Vegas: AR-15
Sandy Hook: AR-15
Umpqua CC: AR-15
San Bernardino: AR-15
Sutherland Springs: AR-15
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Old 11-06-2017, 11:13 AM   #82
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Old 11-06-2017, 11:15 AM   #83
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@ChrisMurphyCT:

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Old 11-06-2017, 11:59 AM   #84
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According to your boy Donald its not a gun issue, its a mental health issue.

Looks like USA is the only western country on earth where people with mental health issues are living.
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Old 11-06-2017, 03:10 PM   #85
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Dude went into the armed services mentally ill.
Dude was kicked out for being a psycho and beating his family
Dude continued to beat and threaten his family, including text messages that were reported to police.

Dude still had access to at least two rifles and two pistols with hundreds of rounds of ammo for each.

I am 100% pro gun ownership and own a gun myself for target practice and self defense, but the dangerously mentally ill, domestic abusers, and suspected terrorists should have at least a speed bump before getting their rifles and hundreds/thousands of rounds of ammo. We certainly can't stop all psychos from getting guns, but at least at some point we have to admit that making it harder for them-- even slightly-- wouldn't be the worst thing in the world, even if it means that the rest of us have to wait a couple of days to buy a gun.

Basically 0.1% of all people in the world are sociopaths or psychopaths. America isn't the only country that has these monsters. We're the only country in the developed world where it's incredibly easy for them to amass an armory and then be rewarded with nonstop media coverage after. It's a cake walk to go from angry psycho to infamous villain and it seems like each one is trying to outdo the prior.

Of the 30 deadliest shootings in American history, 18 have been in the last decade. Two of the five deadliest have happened in the last 35 days.
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Old 11-06-2017, 05:27 PM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky View Post
Dude went into the armed services mentally ill.
I am 100% pro gun ownership and own a gun myself for target practice and self defense
I will never understand this self defense/protection argument.

If you want it for protection, you need the gun near. Unlooked. Unsafe. Kid picks it out of your purse, side table etc and boom. You keeP it save locked up? Then its no protection. Its either "feeled" protection or unsafe, so what is it you are exactly gaining here?

Ah yeah and if the day comes you may still lose. And instead of some material crap you lose your life because things excalated.

Im a german living in brazil. I would never ever even think about trying to defend me here from a thug. Even if its a way smaller teenager with a knife. There is no reason risking your life over some stupid replaceable material things like ur cell, wallet or insured car...sure, a lot of americans will call it weak, no guts, not defending "ur freedom"...i call it the smart decision.

Quote:
but the dangerously mentally ill, domestic abusers, and suspected terrorists should have at least a speed bump before getting their rifles and hundreds/thousands of rounds of ammo. We certainly can't stop all psychos from getting guns, but at least at some point we have to admit that making it harder for them-- even slightly-- wouldn't be the worst thing in the world, even if it means that the rest of us have to wait a couple of days to buy a gun.
Improved background checks etc wont change a thing. This people buy then their weapons still dirt cheap on the black market. You have to ban the sales and kill the black market, thats the only way to prevent most of the guys from at least getting their hands on assault weapons. Australia banned guns in 1996. The Sandy hook Bushmaster (less than 1000 bucks in the usa) costs there way over 30000$ on the black market. You think the guy yesterday, the colorado or the Sandy Hook guy, could have handed out this amount of cash?

Thats how you do it. Thats the only way. Ban the shit and dry out the black market until the prices skyrock...then you get lucky when the nutjobs "just" buy normal pistols etc on the black market and kill 4-5 people instead of 40-50

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Old 11-07-2017, 11:04 AM   #87
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Old 02-15-2018, 11:30 AM   #88
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Every teacher need a gun and this stuff wont happen.

I swear....really....totally...
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Old 02-15-2018, 12:32 PM   #89
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Originally Posted by sefant77 View Post
According to your boy Donald its not a gun issue, its a mental health issue.

Looks like USA is the only western country on earth where people with mental health issues are living.
Damn, the bodies were still warm and Donald played allready the mental health card on twitter
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Old 02-16-2018, 01:34 PM   #90
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Old 02-16-2018, 02:53 PM   #91
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You live in a country where like half of the people still believe in this "protection" crap
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Old 02-16-2018, 03:46 PM   #92
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Originally Posted by sefant77 View Post
Damn, the bodies were still warm and Donald played allready the mental health card on twitter
Which is amazing considering one of his first orders of business after getting elected was to roll back Obama era legislation that prevented people with certain mental health disorders from buying weapons.
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Old 02-16-2018, 04:13 PM   #93
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I like AR-15s as they are cool guns and come in many varieties.

The real question is this: Will my life have less quality if they are banned, or god forbid, not sold to mentally ill people.

No, no it won't.

And it's almost always an AR. Just get rid of that gun and go from there.
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Old 02-17-2018, 06:07 AM   #94
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as to the OP thread title
....and humanity's descent into madness

And the Devil Smiled by Todd Starnes
Feb 15, 2018 By Todd Starnes

Another American high school has been turned into a killing field. And the nation wonders why.

Well, I'm going to answer that question for you. And the answer may leave you a bit unsettled. You see - I believe there is a God -- but I also believe there is a Devil. And I see his hand at work here.

We've raised a generation to believe that truth is relative - that there is no right or wrong.
And the Devil smiled.

They kicked God out of public schools - banned Bibles and prayer.
And the Devil smiled.

We've destroyed the traditional family - broken homes raising broken kids
And the Devil smiled.

There are no consequences for bad behavior - no personal responsibility.
And the Devil smiled.

Our movies and music and games glorify violence and gore. Marriage vows poisoned by pornography.
And the Devil smiled.

What happened in Parkland, Florida is about wickedness - a war with the forces of darkness - good versus evil.

There is no doubt our land is wounded, her people suffering. But we have turned our backs on the One who promised to heal our Land.

The politicians and pundits would have you believe this is not about God, it's not about righteousness. They would have you believe it's about politics and mental illness and gun control.
And the Devil smiled.
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Old 02-17-2018, 09:51 AM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dirt_dobber View Post
as to the OP thread title
....and humanity's descent into madness

And the Devil Smiled by Todd Starnes
Feb 15, 2018 By Todd Starnes

Another American high school has been turned into a killing field. And the nation wonders why.

Well, I'm going to answer that question for you. And the answer may leave you a bit unsettled. You see - I believe there is a God -- but I also believe there is a Devil. And I see his hand at work here.

We've raised a generation to believe that truth is relative - that there is no right or wrong.
And the Devil smiled.

They kicked God out of public schools - banned Bibles and prayer.
And the Devil smiled.

We've destroyed the traditional family - broken homes raising broken kids
And the Devil smiled.

There are no consequences for bad behavior - no personal responsibility.
And the Devil smiled.

Our movies and music and games glorify violence and gore. Marriage vows poisoned by pornography.
And the Devil smiled.

What happened in Parkland, Florida is about wickedness - a war with the forces of darkness - good versus evil.

There is no doubt our land is wounded, her people suffering. But we have turned our backs on the One who promised to heal our Land.

The politicians and pundits would have you believe this is not about God, it's not about righteousness. They would have you believe it's about politics and mental illness and gun control.
And the Devil smiled.
Tell that to the "righteous believers" of Sutherland Springs...

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Old 02-17-2018, 09:52 AM   #96
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Originally Posted by Underdog View Post
Aurora: AR-15
Orlando: AR-15
Las Vegas: AR-15
Sandy Hook: AR-15
Umpqua CC: AR-15
San Bernardino: AR-15
Sutherland Springs: AR-15
Parkland: AR-15
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Old 02-17-2018, 01:01 PM   #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dirt_dobber View Post
as to the OP thread title
....and humanity's descent into madness

And the Devil Smiled by Todd Starnes
Feb 15, 2018 By Todd Starnes

Another American high school has been turned into a killing field. And the nation wonders why.

Well, I'm going to answer that question for you. And the answer may leave you a bit unsettled. You see - I believe there is a God -- but I also believe there is a Devil. And I see his hand at work here.

We've raised a generation to believe that truth is relative - that there is no right or wrong.
And the Devil smiled.

They kicked God out of public schools - banned Bibles and prayer.
And the Devil smiled.

We've destroyed the traditional family - broken homes raising broken kids
And the Devil smiled.

There are no consequences for bad behavior - no personal responsibility.
And the Devil smiled.

Our movies and music and games glorify violence and gore. Marriage vows poisoned by pornography.
And the Devil smiled.

What happened in Parkland, Florida is about wickedness - a war with the forces of darkness - good versus evil.

There is no doubt our land is wounded, her people suffering. But we have turned our backs on the One who promised to heal our Land.

The politicians and pundits would have you believe this is not about God, it's not about righteousness. They would have you believe it's about politics and mental illness and gun control.
And the Devil smiled.
Sorry, i dont want to offend you...but what a boatload of horseshit.

I dont want to list all the evil the church did in the name of "god"...you can start with the crusades and end somewhere near the sexual abuse scandal.

The church needs to be kicked out of the public life like schools etc. In your free time, do whatever....go to church, dont go...pray, dont pray...what you think its best for yourself. But it should not be forced on anyone.

PS: I wrote a shorter version:
"We keep as only western country an outdated and absurd gun law for no logical reason in the year 2018. And the devil smiled."

Thats it. ONLY this.
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Old 05-18-2018, 10:55 AM   #98
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Old 05-18-2018, 06:12 PM   #99
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Number of school shootings that have happened around the world since the year 2000:

ENGLAND: 0
GREECE: 1
NETHERLANDS: 1
SPAIN: 1
INDIA: 1
ARGENTINA: 1
RUSSIA: 1
CHINA: 3
MEXICO: 4
AUSTRALIA: 5
CANADA: 5
GERMANY: 5
SOUTH AFRICA: 5
USA: 213
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Old 05-18-2018, 06:49 PM   #100
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Seriously, is Dan Patrick an idiot?

So its the right amount of guns, its just too many doors! Who cares about fire regulations, guns are more important

https://twitter.com/TomNamako/status/997557776850268162

Thank you Fox News:
https://twitter.com/JackSmithIV/stat...34329331953664

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Old 05-22-2018, 03:14 PM   #101
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I'm sue I will get hammered for this on this site, but I don't guns are anywhere close to the biggest issue here. Sure, it's the biggest hot button issue, but it's become political at this point. Once things become political, it's more about who can scream the loudest and who's team will win and less about who actually wants to improve the situation.
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Old 05-22-2018, 04:58 PM   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Luke View Post
I'm sue I will get hammered for this on this site, but I don't guns are anywhere close to the biggest issue here. Sure, it's the biggest hot button issue, but it's become political at this point. Once things become political, it's more about who can scream the loudest and who's team will win and less about who actually wants to improve the situation.


I actually tend to agree. By far and away the media glorification of the subject is the biggest issue. Easily influenced, troubled youth disconnected from society/ reality in part due to social media with easy access to weapons being exposed to the 24/7 media frenzy (right as the alt-right creeps into the mainstream because our 'president' has hijacked issues that appeal to baser instincts) is the real problem.
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Old 05-22-2018, 10:09 PM   #103
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No, its not. Sorry to disappoint you. Its the guns. Its ONLY the guns.

guns
guns
guns
guns
guns

Quote:
"No Way To Prevent This,’ Says Only Nation Where This Regularly Happens"
Every freaking western country has a lot of mental ill people. Every freaking country has millions of kids being bullied etc etc. And no, there are not even close as many deaths in europe or even the rest of the world.

So...soon...when the next bunch of kids or normal people get their brains spilled over the floor...dont start to discuss mental illness or doors or armed guards or politic instrumentalizing the topic...just say "Ah..who cares, bad luck for them, our guns are more important". Because thats it.

The freaking guns are the problem. But instead at least half of the people blame something else. Anything else but the guns.


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Old 10-27-2018, 02:14 PM   #104
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Probably the synagogue had too many doors...too bad, thats why it happened.
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Old 01-29-2019, 06:50 PM   #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dirt_dobber View Post
as to the OP thread title
....and humanity's descent into madness

And the Devil Smiled by Todd Starnes
Feb 15, 2018 By Todd Starnes

Another American high school has been turned into a killing field. And the nation wonders why.

Well, I'm going to answer that question for you. And the answer may leave you a bit unsettled. You see - I believe there is a God -- but I also believe there is a Devil. And I see his hand at work here.

We've raised a generation to believe that truth is relative - that there is no right or wrong.
And the Devil smiled.

They kicked God out of public schools - banned Bibles and prayer.
And the Devil smiled.

We've destroyed the traditional family - broken homes raising broken kids
And the Devil smiled.

There are no consequences for bad behavior - no personal responsibility.
And the Devil smiled.

Our movies and music and games glorify violence and gore. Marriage vows poisoned by pornography.
And the Devil smiled.

What happened in Parkland, Florida is about wickedness - a war with the forces of darkness - good versus evil.

There is no doubt our land is wounded, her people suffering. But we have turned our backs on the One who promised to heal our Land.

The politicians and pundits would have you believe this is not about God, it's not about righteousness. They would have you believe it's about politics and mental illness and gun control.
And the Devil smiled.
I happened to see this thread and hadn't read it until today and man, browsing through and being reminded of these acts of violence just kind of broke my heart all over again. The post I've quoted specifically caught my eye. That and the post that followed it calling it a boatload of horse crap (paraphrasing of course).

I will lead with the absolute true statement that I hope I don't offend anyone with what I'm about to type. It's not my intent. It really isn't. My preacher would say that he hopes he does, because if so, that's God speaking to you. But I don't want to myself. All I can do is plow the field and occasionally plant a seed, but it's up to God to grow that seed (and he certainly can).

That said, I couldn't possibly agree more with Mr. Starnes' writing above and couldn't possible disagree more with Sefant77's (gun laws can certainly help and there are clearly sins committed by saved people - we are all sinners saved by grace - but those sins don't change the fact that there is a God and our world needs Him) and Underdog's (bad things happen to good people all the time UD - it doesn't mean God doesn't exist and it doesn't mean God made it happen). I wouldn't tell you that I've always agreed with this writer's work, but the truth is, over the past couple of years, my life has changed pretty drastically.

Cue backstory music (hehe)... You see, I always considered myself a Christian. I had been saved by way of me stating that I believed in Christ at a pretty young age. I had even been baptized at the age of 18. Of course I know now I was never really saved as I didn't mean the words I said at the time that I said them. Nothing changed in my heart and, as those of you know all too well that have been around me from all the early years I've posted here, I did, in no way, shine Christ's light with my words, actions, etc.

Well, that has changed over the past couple of years. It's funny when you really do get saved how the Holy Spirit truly comes rushing into your life. Those of you that are atheists, agnostic, etc - I know how you can doubt as I also doubted several times over the years, but I can only understand right up until the moment you stand before God with tears running down your face and honestly surrender yourself to His will and God himself enters your very body with a sledgehammer and starts tearing down walls that change your very stance on, well, everything. After that, if ever you take that leap, there's literally zero doubting. It certainly didn't happen all at once, but God did start changing me and, while I have SO much more changing needed in my life, I have him to thank for who I am today.

I know with all of my heart and soul that God exists. I literally FEEL His presence in my life. I know with all of my heart and soul that Jesus Christ lived a perfect sinless life, died for our sins, was buried and rose again. I know with all of my heart and soul that God gave us a comforter in the way of the Holy Spirit to help guide us through scripture, connect us to Christ, etc. I know with all of my heart and soul that all three are one and that every word in the Bible is the very inspired and infallible word of God. I'd also truly love discussing any and all of this with anyone on the fence, doubting, or those of you that believe and want encouragement from the testimony of someone that was very much not living his life as a Christian for a very long time but that, thanks solely to God's love, mercy and grace, found my way, but that's a different topic for a different day.

So why am I prefacing all of this with some boring story of my last couple of years? I guess because I want any of you that don't know God due to not yet being saved, choosing to never believe, etc to understand the transforming power God can have in a life. Likewise, for those of you that may have been a Christian your entire life, never backsliding, etc, I wanted to point this out so that you can understand that same power that you may not have ever fully experienced because your entire life you believed, followed God, etc. God absolutely changes people. The old man falls away and the new man is born. Your flesh is still there and the devil pulls against it all the time (read Romans), but you ARE changed by believing in Christ!

I honestly can't believe I came across this if I'm being honest because it feels quite strange given how much it relates to a message I prepared a couple of weeks ago that I'm presenting for my Sunday School class this week. The really odd thing is that it's sports-themed (with a heavy emphasis on Basketball). I've actually decided to post it in it's entirety so feel free to read it, ignore it, etc, but I think it's useful in this context and would ask that you specifically look at the last quoted scripture from Ephesians pertaining to Satan... The message I plan on teaching Sunday copied straight from Word:

Sunday School Lesson (02/03/2019):

• How was everyone’s week?
• Prayer requests?
• Let us pray
__________________________________________________ _________________

• The last time I spoke, we talked about 3 topics that I wanted to just briefly recap, especially since today’s message will touch on a couple of those. Those original topics were:

o God’s word is truth and you should absolutely trust Him
o God is worth being courageous for and He wants us to be
o God is always with us and, through Him, anything is possible

• Today’s message covers a single topic that deals with our need to rely on God. To be more specific, whether our life’s management supports that need and whether or not we might need to make a change in management.

• This topic actually came to me a few weeks back when I watched a movie with my wife for the first time by the name of War Room. I’m sure all of you have seen it but, if not, I can’t recommend it enough. Once the movie ended, the main takeaway I had dealt with the scene where it was loudly declared to Satan that the lead character’s home was under new management and that her joy was no longer going to be taken away by the Devil in all the ways that he had been doing that prior to that moment.

• What I kept going back to in my mind was how many years I lived my life with terrible management that not only allowed Satan to steal my joy, but provided the exact conditions for him to thrive in. I kept thinking about this reality and I couldn’t get over how poorly I ran my life. How badly I needed new management. A coaching change for my life was an urgent need and I wasn’t even aware of it.

• See, I mention coaching change interchangeably with management change because this resonates to me given I’m such a sports fan. Baseball, Basketball, Football, Hockey, Tennis – you name it and I either played it when I was younger (and in some cases still do) or love to watch it today. So when I was thinking of how to best explain this message, what I kept coming back to was sports and how a coach is his team’s manager and how a coach leads his team and how a poor coach will often do his team a great disservice that will directly lead to losses.

• Then I started thinking about the best players in the history of sports. The best players in basketball’s history. The best players in football’s history. Baseball’s history. Hockey’s history. In the NBA you have Michael Jordan, who is regularly considered the greatest of all time. In the NFL, you have Tom Brady who is often mentioned as the best QB, but hey, we’re in Texas so we’ll just use Troy Aikman in this example. In baseball the greatest is often said to be Babe Ruth and, for hockey, definitely Wayne Gretzky.

• I started looking up all 4 of these amazing players and I found a total of 17 championships won among them. Of course, when you add up the total years played from all 4 of these tremendous players, it came to 70 years. So that means that the absolute best players in their respective sport won their championship less than 25% of the time. We’ll come back to that…

• Now, I reflected back to what a poor coach might do. The thing that stood out to me that never happened for any of these team’s players I mentioned above would be not playing them. They’re the best right? Why on Earth wouldn’t they start and play a huge role on their teams. But that’s what came back to me as the most obvious error a terrible coach might make when they have a true super star on their team like these teams had.

• So now let’s expand on basketball given Jordan is often considered the greatest athlete of all time across all sports. You see, Jordan actually won a title in 6 of his 15 seasons, so he actually managed a 40% success rate and was helping to prop up the averages for those other players I mentioned. 40% is a lot better than 25%, wouldn’t you say?

• Now, let’s say we were in a close game and we decided, when the game got the most difficult, and we were being pressured by the opposing defense the most, to take our best player out of the game. To actually bench Michael Jordan! What an insane thought, right? Who would take him out of the game? Only the worst coach! Jordan played the majority of every minute of every game he ever suited up for but still failed 60% of the time.

• Now ask yourself when you’re dealing with a difficult challenge in your life, if you ever find yourself taking your best player out. Ignoring your super star that so badly wants to be put into the game. That so badly wants to take the last shot to secure victory for you. And, amazingly enough, that wins at a slightly higher percentage of, well, 100%. Not too shabby huh?

• So I want you to think about that and I’m going to read a few verses and then we’ll come back to this analogy later. Again, feel free to turn to each of these if you’d like or feel free to write them down to review later. It’s totally up to you. First, I’d like to read from:

o Jeremiah 17:5-14 “Thus saith the LORD; Cursed be the man that trusteth in man, and maketh flesh his arm, and whose heart departeth from the LORD. For he shall be like the heath in the desert, and shall not see when good cometh; but shall inhabit the parched places in the wilderness, in a salt land and not inhabited. Blessed is the man that trusteth in the LORD, and whose hope the LORD is. For he shall be as a tree planted by the waters, and that spreadeth out her roots by the river, and shall not see when heat cometh, but her leaf shall be green; and shall not be careful in the year of drought, neither shall cease from yielding fruit. The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it? I the LORD search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings. As the partridge sitteth on eggs, and hatcheth them not; so he that getteth riches, and not by right, shall leave them in the midst of his days, and at his end shall be a fool. A glorious high throne from the beginning is the place of our sanctuary. O LORD, the hope of Israel, all that forsake thee shall be ashamed, and they that depart from me shall be written in the earth, because they have forsaken the LORD, the fountain of living waters. Heal me, O LORD, and I shall be healed; save me, and I shall be saved: for thou art my praise.”

 Here’s specific scripture that outlines the very real need to avoid trusting in the ways of man. Instead God wants us to trust totally in Him and to rely on Him in our lives and to put our hope into Him! But again, do we ever find ourselves in a troublesome situation, whether small or large, where we fail to rely on God? Where we feel we’re sufficient without turning to God in prayer. Where we feel we can handle the issue so we ignore involving God. I know I’ve sure failed to properly put on God’s armor through reading His word and praying while instead trusting I’m sufficient, but we’re not sufficient. God, however, is! Next, please turn to:

o John 15:1-11 “I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman. Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit. Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you. Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me. I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing. If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned. If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you. Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples. As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love. If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love. These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full.”

 These verses so accurately depict how God wants us to fully abide in Him and, without doing so, will lead to us withering away like a dead branch that has been broken off from a living tree. The tree goes on providing for all other branches that remain a part of the tree, but the separated branch dies. That really shows just how helpless we are when we depend only on ourselves and fail to rely on God. That said, if we truly rely on God, he has promised us that His joy will remain in us and that our joy will be full! Just as the War Room’s lead character passionately declared, shouldn’t we want to stop Satan from stealing our joy? God shows us here that we can do that by abiding in him! Next, please turn to:

o Matthew 6:24-33 “No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon. Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat, or what ye shall drink; nor yet for your body, what ye shall put on. Is not the life more than meat, and the body than raiment? Behold the fowls of the air: for they sow not, neither do they reap, nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feedeth them. Are ye not much better than they? Which of you by taking thought can add one cubit unto his stature? And why take ye thought for raiment? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow; they toil not, neither do they spin: And yet I say unto you, That even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these. Wherefore, if God so clothe the grass of the field, which to day is, and to morrow is cast into the oven, shall he not much more clothe you, O ye of little faith? Therefore take no thought, saying, What shall we eat? or, What shall we drink? or, Wherewithal shall we be clothed? (For after all these things do the Gentiles seek) for your heavenly Father knoweth that ye have need of all these things. But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you."

 Here it is made clear that we can’t serve God and any other master, whether that master is man, money, or anything else that we elect to put on a pedestal beside God. It is also explained that we shouldn’t worry ourselves with our needs and instead should seek God and his righteousness and, in doing so, will ensure that our needs are met. It is when we turn away from relying on ourselves to meet our needs and fully realize that our Father in Heaven loves us and desires to provide for us and that we should rely on Him that our life can fully change. To put it simply, we must put God in the game!

• So, back to my earlier analogy, we’re in a lifetime battle with Satan. We’re constantly competing with him and we will be until the day we die or until God calls us home. Satan has lost the war with Christ and he IS defeated, but that doesn’t mean he won’t try to pull each of us down with him before the trumpets sound.
• As a result, Satan is constantly trying to scrimmage us in all of our small day-to-day situations. He’s trying to play competitive games in our bigger and more important life issues. He’s trying to play for a championship in the really huge situations in our life, which we desperately need to win.

• So there’s always some small, medium or large game we have going on with Satan and each with just a few seconds on the clock. We’re always a shot away from victory if we handle the situation in a way that is pleasing to God by relying on Him and abiding in Him OR a shot away from defeat if we rely on ourselves and come to the false realization that we are sufficient and don’t need God to see us through.

• The truth is that we can’t beat Satan. We want to beat him by ourselves sometimes and, sadly, we all too often try; however, Satan is TOO fast, TOO crafty and his 3 point shot, if left open, will be a perfect swish every single time. He’s good. He’s really good.

• Here’s the amazing thing though! God is better! Not just a little better. Not just Jordan better. He’s undefeated. Praise God, He is undefeated! His shot never misses and his defense is swarming. Yet all too often we’ve left Him on the bench like that bad coach in the example above. He’s our super star left to only wish He could help us drain that last second shot to send the Devil home frustrated. He loves us, has pleaded with us to rely on Him and gave us the blueprint on how to defeat Satan. All we have to do is trust Him, rely on Him and abide in Him, but will we?

• So today I ask you to fully accept these 3 truths:

o Satan is alive and constantly seeks to defeat us in every way possible
o Satan is stronger than we are and we can’t defeat him by ourselves
o God, if relied on and abided in, can defeat Satan 100% of the time

• So I simply wanted to challenge each of you today to put God in your game. It doesn’t matter how small or large that game might be. It could be when traffic is difficult and you’re growing impatient. It could be when you make a mess by being clumsy. It could be when you hear an ugly rumor and want to defend yourself. In each of those small issues, if you rely on yourself and fail to abide in God, you’ll find yourself screaming at the car in front of you, cursing at your terrible luck and saying revengeful words that ruin your testimony. In all of these cases, you’ll allow Satan to steal your joy!

• My hope is that we all walk away today putting on God’s armor, abiding in God to see us through even the smallest of battles with Satan (and certainly the bigger ones) and find a way to consistently send Satan home as a loser. I feel like Paul said it best:

o Ephesians 6:10-17 “Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might. Put on the whole armor of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. Wherefore take unto you the whole armor of God that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand. Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness; And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace; Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked. And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:”

• Let’s put ourselves and our homes under new management today and let’s tell Satan that he will no longer steal our joy! So that’s what God put on my heart to share today - does anyone have anything they’d like to add?

__________________________________________________ _________________

• Let us Pray


So, that will be what I present this Sunday that God put on my heart to talk about and I gave this long history of my personal backstory and shared this message because I can't believe more people don't see the truth in that America has turned their back on God. We've asked Him to leave our schools. We've taken His commandments down all over our nation. We're raising (and have been raising) Americans that have very little in the way of moral and biblical principles, and then we wonder why these things happen at the frequency that they do.

And don't get me wrong as guns are a problem. But you could ban AKs until the Sun stops rising and they would still be fully attainable by way of other methods (or the guns that are still easily attainable would be used or the tons of videos posted all over the web to make bombs would be used, etc). Bottom line, those wanting to kill and cause destruction still could. Also, in addition to guns being a problem, bad things are still going to happen as it's not like any sort of an American revival or movement is going to change everyone - as Paul mentioned above, wickedness is very much here to stay until Satan is fully defeated (read Revelation).

The bottom line is that our children need God in their lives. Our directors and producers and movie stars we all look up to, watch their work, etc need God in their lives. Our athletes need God in their lives. I need God in my life. You need God in your life. Our country needs God but we're turning our back on God so we can be more accepting of sin. I believe the ending should read "One Nation, Under the Premise that we don't want to offend anyone lest we be blasted on Social Media, Easily Divided by Politics, Religion and Sexuality, With Liberty and Justice for All, especially those practicing sin as fully described in the very scripture that this pledge USED to be based on." But hey, I digress...

So yeah, sorry for the book, and I hope I haven't offended, but the more I think about it, if I have, I don't necessarily think that's a bad thing. God bless.
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Old 01-29-2019, 08:54 PM   #106
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but those sins don't change the fact that there is a God and our world needs Him
Umm, i never saw this "facts". Could you help me out showing me the "facts" for "gods" existence? And no, whats written in the bible arent facts, sorry again.

Again, everyone is free to feel and think the way they like. But NO ONE has the right to force HIS believes onto other people. How they wanna live their lifes, who they wanna love or marry etc.

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Old 01-29-2019, 11:43 PM   #107
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Thoughts and prayers have never stopped a bullet.
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Old 01-30-2019, 01:42 AM   #108
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Umm, i never saw this "facts". Could you help me out showing me the "facts" for "gods" existence? And no, whats written in the bible arent facts, sorry again.

Again, everyone is free to feel and think the way they like. But NO ONE has the right to force HIS believes onto other people. How they wanna live their lifes, who they wanna love or marry etc.
Do you really want to go down this road? Because it comes with a lot of reading I’m happy to share with you, documentaries, movies and, in general, homework. It will still ultimately come down to a decision you will have to make after reading, watching and studying (and yes, a lot of that reading will certainly point to the Bible, it’s many manuscripts, archeological finds proving the Bible does correspond to historical reality, consistency and coherence despite many different authors over many centuries, etc). I wish there was (would’ve made it easier for me too), but there’s no AHA moment. There will always be a leap of faith involved that will need to be made by you.

At the end of the day, if all you plan on doing here is ignoring everything I say because your mind is already made up no matter what information I provide, I’ll just offer a retort as eloquently as you did by simply saying “We’ll agree to disagree.” I simply don’t have the faith it takes to NOT believe in a single maker. There’s far, far too much happenstance involved with what it would’ve taken to have all of us come totally into existence by some explosion, frolicking as an amoeba for millions of years before eventually becoming a monkey only to then turn into a man (somehow still living alongside, wait for it, MONKEYS). Again, but I digress...

As for your stance that no one has the right to force beliefs onto someone else, you are absolutely right. Despite this country’s early foundations being built around the belief in God, America is very much taking a stand against God and there’s certainly nothing I can do about it and likely nothing anyone can do about it given the speed and size of the snowball rolling downhill. Well, anyone but God that is.

You see, your knee will bow one way or the other. You don’t have to agree with me anymore than you have to agree that If you jump off of a cliff you will fall. But your knee will bow now, here on earth, before you die in the way of accepting Christ and receiving salvation or it will bow at judgment, after you die, in the way or condemnation. What God does provide you is free will to decide which outcome you want. He gives you all the tools, methods to know him (thereby HAVING proof by EXPERIENCING Him, which IS the proof but I wasn’t even going to type that above because, well, how do you experience that if you refuse to accept Him?). So no, Christianity, Jesus, God, etc are NOT forced upon you. You must decide. That said, the Bible calls fellow believers to spread the Gospel (good news) and that’s all I’ve done here.

You know the incredibly unfunny thing about this all? If I’m wrong, all that has happened is I’ve lived a gullible, chaos-less existence, treating people good instead of taking advantage, being kind instead of hurtful, avoiding sinful activities that would’ve been perfectly fine to commit given, in this example, there’s no God and, once the lights go out, we just become dust, etc. If you’re wrong, there’s not even adequate words to describe the fall out. “Everlasting” and “forever and ever” (terms used in the Bible) is a never ending time. If the Bible simply said a million years, well, at least there would be hope that, at some point, Hell would end for you. But everlasting? Forever and ever? There’s no hope there.

Happy to discuss in PMs, on a phone call, etc. Happy to share very specific scripture for questions you have. Hit me up. That said, I’m not going to have an argument about it on a Mavericks forum. I’ve said my peace on the matter and truly hope it’s helped in some way, but if not, I accept that and will leave it to God to do the rest. I pray you’ll reconsider though.
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Old 01-30-2019, 01:50 AM   #109
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Thoughts and prayers have never stopped a bullet.
Wow on a few levels.

No, it just overcame infertility for Hannah, saved Jerusalem by laying waste to 85,000 Assyrian soldiers, released Peter from prison, raised Jairus’s daughter from the dead, added 15 years to Hezekiah’s life, healed blind/sick several times over, saved Elisha by blinding his enemies, saved the thief across from Jesus during his crucifixion, and this could go on and on and on. If only the Bible was told in a time when guns were readily available, maybe THEN the power of prayer could somehow be made understandable. :/

Goodnight sir.
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Old 01-30-2019, 08:09 AM   #110
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Do you really want to go down this road? Because it comes with a lot of reading I’m happy to share with you, documentaries, movies and, in general, homework. It will still ultimately come down to a decision you will have to make after reading, watching and studying (and yes, a lot of that reading will certainly point to the Bible, it’s many manuscripts, archeological finds proving the Bible does correspond to historical reality, consistency and coherence despite many different authors over many centuries, etc). I wish there was (would’ve made it easier for me too), but there’s no AHA moment. There will always be a leap of faith involved that will need to be made by you..

Yes please! Im a science guy, so i really love facts, you know? Cant wait to read some good explanation why the Big Bang Theory is bullshit and "god" created everything snipping his hands for seven days.

Would also love to read the facts about Moses recieving the 10 commandments. In this story it always annoyed me that he claimed it but was alone on that hill. But maybe i missed it and he had his GoPro with him and videotaped it and there is proof. Ah and virgin Maria is also a big one, cant wait for the facts how she received a child without....u know...

Quote:
At the end of the day, if all you plan on doing here is ignoring everything I say because your mind is already made up no matter what information I provide, I’ll just offer a retort as eloquently as you did by simply saying “We’ll agree to disagree.” .
Na sorry, thats too easy. You told its a FACT that god exists. So now please deliver them.

Quote:
I simply don’t have the faith it takes to NOT believe in a single maker. There’s far, far too much happenstance involved with what it would’ve taken to have all of us come totally into existence by some explosion, frolicking as an amoeba for millions of years before eventually becoming a monkey only to then turn into a man (somehow still living alongside, wait for it, MONKEYS). Again, but I digress....
Yeah because "someone" creating the world in seven days, cutting a rip out and creating a female person out of it, receiving a child without human intercourse etc etc etc etc...that makes so much more sense

Quote:
As for your stance that no one has the right to force beliefs onto someone else, you are absolutely right. Despite this country’s early foundations being built around the belief in God.
Taking land from native people and kill them all in the name of god...yes, you are right. I mean im german so i know the history of the church pretty well and how the church was until the late 1800s pretty much involved in every conflict, war etc. In europe, during the crusades etc. Was just lovely stuff happening over almost 2000 years in the name and "believes" of "god"
And then this lovely stuff of ten thousands of child abuse scandals with a systematic cover up, lovely.

Or that lovely missionar going to the Sentinal Islands. People minding their own business for thousands of year, never tried to reach out, never tried to attack or hurt anyone outside of their island...but yet this guy and his organisation thought they have the RIGHT to force their believes onto this people. Knowing they would endanger the entire tribe getting wiped out by an disease they cant handle. Ah remember that interview with Mary Ho from All Nations after the death of this guy? She sais they sent him and that the travel ban was lifted and it was legal for him to go there. They sent him on a tourist visa there because legally he had to apply for a missionars visa that he would never ever had gotten claiming he wanna go to the Sentinal. So this lovely christian woman just lied coldblooded on purpose to millions of viewers. Thats the spirit!

Quote:
He gives you all the tools, methods to know him (thereby HAVING proof by EXPERIENCING Him, which IS the proof but I wasn’t even going to type that above because, well, how do you experience that if you refuse to accept Him?).
Sorry, thats not proof of anything


Quote:
That said, I’m not going to have an argument about it on a Mavericks forum. I’ve said my peace on the matter and truly hope it’s helped in some way, but if not, I accept that and will leave it to God to do the rest. I pray you’ll reconsider though.
If you refuse to argue after stating that you have facts/proof for your claims, then dont start this whole crap in the beginning. Thats just lame.

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Old 01-30-2019, 09:47 AM   #111
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Yes please! Im a science guy, so i really love facts, you know? Cant wait to read some good explanation why the Big Bang Theory is bullshit and "god" created everything snipping his hands for seven days.

Would also love to read the facts about Moses recieving the 10 commandments. In this story it always annoyed me that he claimed it but was alone on that hill. But maybe i missed it and he had his GoPro with him and videotaped it and there is proof. Ah and virgin Maria is also a big one, cant wait for the facts how she received a child without....u know...

Na sorry, thats too easy. You told its a FACT that god exists. So now please deliver them.

Yeah because "someone" creating the world in seven days, cutting a rip out and creating a female person out of it, receiving a child without human intercourse etc etc etc etc...that makes so much more sense

Taking land from native people and kill them all in the name of god...yes, you are right. I mean im german so i know the history of the church pretty well and how the church was until the late 1800s pretty much involved in every conflict, war etc. In europe, during the crusades etc. Was just lovely stuff happening over almost 2000 years in the name and "believes" of "god"
And then this lovely stuff of ten thousands of child abuse scandals with a systematic cover up, lovely.

Or that lovely missionar going to the Sentinal Islands. People minding is own business for thousands of year, never tried to reach out, never tried to attack or hurt anyone outside of their island...but yet this guy and his organisation thought they have the RIGHT to force their believes onto this people. Knowing they would endanger the entire tribe getting wiped out by an disease they cant handle. Ah remember that interview with Mary Ho from All Nations after the death of this guy? She sais they sent him and that the travel ban was lifted and it was legal for him to go there. They sent him on a tourist visa there because legally he had to apply for a missionars visa that he would never ever had gotten claiming he wanna go to the Sentinal. So this lovely christian woman just lied coldblooded on purpose to millions of viewers. Thats the spirit!


Sorry, thats not proof of anything

If you refuse to argue after stating that you have facts/proof for your claims, then dont start this whole crap in the beginning. Thats just lame.
There is no doubt that discussing God and faith is one of the most difficult things to do between someone that truly believes and someone that does not while at the same time making jokes, sneers, and sarcasm. There really is nothing that Male30Dan can say or do that will change your mind if you choose not to even consider what he says or does. If I come to you with open hands and a bible while you come to me swinging a baseball bat, I'm going to get beat up and it has nothing do with me the bible being true or false.

Sefant77 you, like most people on this board, are a smart guy. It's why I've been lurking and posting here for over 10 years. If you say you are "a science guy, (and) really love facts", I would honestly say to just take time and think about what you believe and ask why, while being ready for answers that may not align with what you originally thought. And don't go through the process with a baseball bat, but instead do it with a cup of coffee and maybe another person that is in the same mindset.

This is a good book to start at and get your mind going down the investigation road and is written by a journalist that was hard core atheist until his wife started believing:
The Case For Christ by Lee Strobel

I'm not stupid and think that reading that book will convert you, but it's a quick read and is a jumping off point for questions that have been asked above.

As a rebuttal to some of the comments:

Big Bang Theory - I actually this one lines up with God pretty well. Where exactly did all of this matter in the Big Bang come from? It just appeared in the blink of an eye, exploded on the scene and started cooling off? For a long time, it was theorized that the Big Bang happened for a source, matter blew apart and then it would start contracting just to repeat again. Well, it's been recently that the universe is actually speeding up blowing apart rather than slowing down. This doesn't really line up too well with the Big Bang.

Creating the world in seven (literal) days - This is a tough for even the hard core bible scholars. They agree/disagree on whether this is a literal seven days or a general timeline. Before you start saying "well what's true and not true?", one of the first things you get from the bible is that Jesus spoke in parables in order to get his point across to the people. So not everything in the bible is 100% literal. Again, if you truly want answers, you have to find them as Male30Dan said.

The Virgin Mary - I really like this one actually. This is probably the most easiest to defend in this time when artificial insemination happens every day. We believe in insemination science but we rule out that a creator of the universe couldn't do it.

Crusades - Believe it or not, bad people do bad things while using good things. This happens all the time. There is truth in the saying, "Power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely." The fact is that all men (and women) sin and fall short. When the more corrupt get into positions of authority, even worse things happen.

For people like you, and I'm in your boat of 'I like facts', this is a difficult road. It would be amazing if you could come to a faith in God and Jesus with just a couple of forum posts. I would make Billy Graham look like nothing. So I'm taking you at your word and not assuming you to be sarcastic, start with basic or fundamental questions and look for an answer that you believe. The worst that could happen is that it just reinforces your own faith which is already athiestic. But looking an answer that doesn't align with your means honestly talking with people that don't believe like you.

Did Jesus really exist? Look at the corroborating evidence that he actually existed. That he was gaining followers, was persecuted, and was crucified or killed.

What proof is there that he rose from the dead? Why did the women initially see it? The women part is important.

If Jesus is God, why didn't he just *poof* everyone into submission and make things perfect? This one leads into why does God allow bad things to happen like a car wreck, accidental shooting, or even mass shooting.

Is the bible accurate? It was written by over 40 authors and more than 1,000 years. People think the bible is a single book but it's not. If it's written by 40 authors, where is it contradicting itself? How does it hold up against itself?

What is this holy trinity stuff? Father, Son, Spirit? That's a good one and will have to come later when you have started down the belief road because it'll blow your mind. It still blows mine.

Did God create the universe or did it pop into existence? It's really interesting to see verses in the bible that were later actually proved by science hundreds and hundreds of years later. It takes investigation if you truly want answers.

Let's say that there is a creator of the universe, what does that mean for him and me personally? This is another one that is really deep and will require a basic level of belief and faith to step into.

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Old 01-30-2019, 10:37 AM   #112
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Yes please! Im a science guy, so i really love facts, you know? Cant wait to read some good explanation why the Big Bang Theory is bullshit and "god" created everything snipping his hands for seven days.

Would also love to read the facts about Moses recieving the 10 commandments. In this story it always annoyed me that he claimed it but was alone on that hill. But maybe i missed it and he had his GoPro with him and videotaped it and there is proof. Ah and virgin Maria is also a big one, cant wait for the facts how she received a child without....u know...



Na sorry, thats too easy. You told its a FACT that god exists. So now please deliver them.



Yeah because "someone" creating the world in seven days, cutting a rip out and creating a female person out of it, receiving a child without human intercourse etc etc etc etc...that makes so much more sense



Taking land from native people and kill them all in the name of god...yes, you are right. I mean im german so i know the history of the church pretty well and how the church was until the late 1800s pretty much involved in every conflict, war etc. In europe, during the crusades etc. Was just lovely stuff happening over almost 2000 years in the name and "believes" of "god"
And then this lovely stuff of ten thousands of child abuse scandals with a systematic cover up, lovely.

Or that lovely missionar going to the Sentinal Islands. People minding their own business for thousands of year, never tried to reach out, never tried to attack or hurt anyone outside of their island...but yet this guy and his organisation thought they have the RIGHT to force their believes onto this people. Knowing they would endanger the entire tribe getting wiped out by an disease they cant handle. Ah remember that interview with Mary Ho from All Nations after the death of this guy? She sais they sent him and that the travel ban was lifted and it was legal for him to go there. They sent him on a tourist visa there because legally he had to apply for a missionars visa that he would never ever had gotten claiming he wanna go to the Sentinal. So this lovely christian woman just lied coldblooded on purpose to millions of viewers. Thats the spirit!



Sorry, thats not proof of anything




If you refuse to argue after stating that you have facts/proof for your claims, then dont start this whole crap in the beginning. Thats just lame.
Sorry man, but like I said, I'm done. I'm not going to entertain this really rude thing you've started. Enjoy your life, but one day your knee will bow and, if you haven't changed your stance here, you certainly won't enjoy what comes after. Not something I want for you (or anyone that thinks like you do), but again, I'm not going to have some rebuttal with someone that has absolutely no interest to do anything but flame a Christian. Good luck and, again, God Bless!
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Old 01-30-2019, 04:26 PM   #113
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Sorry man, but like I said, I'm done. I'm not going to entertain this really rude thing you've started. Enjoy your life, but one day your knee will bow and, if you haven't changed your stance here, you certainly won't enjoy what comes after. Not something I want for you (or anyone that thinks like you do), but again, I'm not going to have some rebuttal with someone that has absolutely no interest to do anything but flame a Christian. Good luck and, again, God Bless!
My only thing is it's pretty hypocritical to me to say "I won't have a rebuttal with someone who has no interest in anything but flaming a Christian" but Christian's are always saying things like "if you haven't changed your stance here you certainly won't enjoy what comes after". You can say you don't wish it on someone all you want but it comes off as a backhanded statement where you are saying something to the effect of "I pity you that you will be judged harshly since you don't believe like I do". As someone who comes from a very devout Lutheran family(I haven't been religious since I was a teen) I can say it's absurd to me that people of faith who imply a burning hell of sorts for not believing in a book written by man and translated and interpreted so many times over is to be believed "or else". In the example a few posts up people can't even agree on the time frame of 7 days and it's said the book is to be interpreted in some areas and not taken literal.

The fact is the biggest problem with Christianity is the bible itself is loaded with an absurd amount of contradictions or inconsistencies. Anyone who has actually read it and taken notes knows that it's a ridiculous amount. I haven't read the whole thing but I read a whole lot for my Confirmation when I was young. And depending on who you talk to those contradictions are explained away from human error or not to be taken literally, or embellishment, or sensationalizing, or some such excuse. It's written nobody has seen God face to face, and it's also written I have seen God's face. That's explained away as an interpretation and being a bit sensational with a vision of sorts or the idea of God itself. It's written to never harm innocents. Then it's written several times actions condoning hurting and killing innocents. It's written an eye for an eye so to speak and then also written to be the better person and forgive. Divorce is fine, and then it's apparently also not and tantamount to adultery. It's not good to steal but also you can take the livestock and belongings of the enemies. I mean you can list probably hundreds of inconsistencies. Those are just some off the top of my head. So when people ask questions it's understandable.
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Old 01-30-2019, 04:55 PM   #114
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Nothing like "gosh, we can agree to disagree"....BUT YOU'RE GOING TO HELL IF YOU DON'T! BETTER KNEEL!
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Old 01-30-2019, 08:07 PM   #115
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Nothing like "gosh, we can agree to disagree"....BUT YOU'RE GOING TO HELL IF YOU DON'T! BETTER KNEEL!
I simply don’t want to argue. A discussion? Sure. And I PM’d him for that by the way, which you of course didn’t know. I’m not going to go back and forth publicly though with the type of angst and sarcasm he was speaking with.

That said, I stand by literally every word I said above. Every single word.
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Old 01-30-2019, 08:10 PM   #116
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My only thing is it's pretty hypocritical to me to say "I won't have a rebuttal with someone who has no interest in anything but flaming a Christian" but Christian's are always saying things like "if you haven't changed your stance here you certainly won't enjoy what comes after". You can say you don't wish it on someone all you want but it comes off as a backhanded statement where you are saying something to the effect of "I pity you that you will be judged harshly since you don't believe like I do". As someone who comes from a very devout Lutheran family(I haven't been religious since I was a teen) I can say it's absurd to me that people of faith who imply a burning hell of sorts for not believing in a book written by man and translated and interpreted so many times over is to be believed "or else". In the example a few posts up people can't even agree on the time frame of 7 days and it's said the book is to be interpreted in some areas and not taken literal.

The fact is the biggest problem with Christianity is the bible itself is loaded with an absurd amount of contradictions or inconsistencies. Anyone who has actually read it and taken notes knows that it's a ridiculous amount. I haven't read the whole thing but I read a whole lot for my Confirmation when I was young. And depending on who you talk to those contradictions are explained away from human error or not to be taken literally, or embellishment, or sensationalizing, or some such excuse. It's written nobody has seen God face to face, and it's also written I have seen God's face. That's explained away as an interpretation and being a bit sensational with a vision of sorts or the idea of God itself. It's written to never harm innocents. Then it's written several times actions condoning hurting and killing innocents. It's written an eye for an eye so to speak and then also written to be the better person and forgive. Divorce is fine, and then it's apparently also not and tantamount to adultery. It's not good to steal but also you can take the livestock and belongings of the enemies. I mean you can list probably hundreds of inconsistencies. Those are just some off the top of my head. So when people ask questions it's understandable.
See my post above. Discussion is one thing. Responding to the posts in the way I did for the reasons I’ve already outlined is another.

I’m sorry you (or others) took what I said as backhanded, but it wasn’t intended to be backhanded. Of course that’s the issue with bringing forth the truth (edit - to avoid additional frustration, the truth as “I” know it). Someone is always offended (see my edit moments ago). I won’t apologize for my faith or for doing what God and my faith asks of me. I’m not at all sorry for that.
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Old 01-30-2019, 09:27 PM   #117
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Exclamation

There's a lot of disagreement in this thread, but you guys are mostly playing nice with each other. I know emotions can run high when you're passionate about a topic, so I'd like to thank you all for curbing personal attacks, and would ask you to continue doing so. Thanks!

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Old 01-30-2019, 10:13 PM   #118
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I simply don’t want to argue. A discussion? Sure. And I PM’d him for that by the way, which you of course didn’t know. I’m not going to go back and forth publicly though with the type of angst and sarcasm he was speaking with.

That said, I stand by literally every word I said above. Every single word.
"angst"?

If you dont know how to use a german word in the right way, then dont use it...talking to a german.

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Old 01-31-2019, 03:29 AM   #119
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"angst"?

If you dont know how to use a german word in the right way, then dont use it...talking to a german.
Smh... At least you focus on all the right things. Take care.
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Old 01-31-2019, 09:50 AM   #120
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My only thing is it's pretty hypocritical to me to say "I won't have a rebuttal with someone who has no interest in anything but flaming a Christian" but Christian's are always saying things like "if you haven't changed your stance here you certainly won't enjoy what comes after". You can say you don't wish it on someone all you want but it comes off as a backhanded statement where you are saying something to the effect of "I pity you that you will be judged harshly since you don't believe like I do". As someone who comes from a very devout Lutheran family(I haven't been religious since I was a teen) I can say it's absurd to me that people of faith who imply a burning hell of sorts for not believing in a book written by man and translated and interpreted so many times over is to be believed "or else". In the example a few posts up people can't even agree on the time frame of 7 days and it's said the book is to be interpreted in some areas and not taken literal.

The fact is the biggest problem with Christianity is the bible itself is loaded with an absurd amount of contradictions or inconsistencies. Anyone who has actually read it and taken notes knows that it's a ridiculous amount. I haven't read the whole thing but I read a whole lot for my Confirmation when I was young. And depending on who you talk to those contradictions are explained away from human error or not to be taken literally, or embellishment, or sensationalizing, or some such excuse. It's written nobody has seen God face to face, and it's also written I have seen God's face. That's explained away as an interpretation and being a bit sensational with a vision of sorts or the idea of God itself. It's written to never harm innocents. Then it's written several times actions condoning hurting and killing innocents. It's written an eye for an eye so to speak and then also written to be the better person and forgive. Divorce is fine, and then it's apparently also not and tantamount to adultery. It's not good to steal but also you can take the livestock and belongings of the enemies. I mean you can list probably hundreds of inconsistencies. Those are just some off the top of my head. So when people ask questions it's understandable.
I do agree with you to some extent on the hypocritical point. I don't like it when christians aren't able to defend their faith, but make no mistake about it, it's a difficult thing to come to and defend. In fact, accepting Christ and following that path almost guarantees you trouble in today's society. Well, I guess you could argue it was trouble in Jesus' time also. Anyway, I'd like to take up just one of your contradictions and bring up the christian viewpoint. Please don't think of this as an attack or arguing, but rather just something to think about. Feel free to respond with questions or comments and I will do my best to give an answer, but obviously I'm not a scholar and my knowledge is just personal study, seeking and listening.

Everywhere in the bible (including Jesus' own words) it says that divorce is never fine. I think you can agree that 99% of the time, divorce is a very painful process. The reason for this is because marriage is such a deep connection on all levels, that it is literally ripping apart much like surgery is for the body.

What is God's intent of marriage? The intent of a biblical marriage is to "leave his father and mother and is united to his wife, and they become one flesh." This is the view that God has of marriage, becoming one flesh, one person, one mind, one with each other's thoughts, hopes, and desires. That is the goal.

So when/why is it accepted? Jesus' own words are "I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery." In the verse before, he says "Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard." Infidelity is something that is extremely difficult to overcome because the sexual union between a husband and wife is more than just physical. I can go into this in more detail, but won't at this time just to stay on topic.

Why did Moses say how to divorce? The reason for this is because at the time, divorce was seen even as a lesser thing than it is today. A man could walk out in the street and just declare that he is divorcing his wife and then be done with it. Also keep in mind, that wives in the day had very little rights. Moses' intent was to not allow a divorce to be simple and encourage the importance of marriage.
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