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Old 06-24-2021, 10:24 AM   #481
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Rick Carlisle to the Pacers
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Old 06-24-2021, 10:48 AM   #482
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They don't have much in Indiana anymore. If he's an all time great coach he has his chance to prove it.
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Old 06-24-2021, 11:36 AM   #483
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Deleted. Duplicate post.
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Old 06-24-2021, 11:38 AM   #484
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They don't have much in Indiana anymore. If he's an all time great coach he has his chance to prove it.
I disagree....hell I'd say he just upgraded teams honestly.

Myles Turner
Sabonis
Brogdon
Caris Levert

That top 4 is better than anything he's ever had in Dallas.
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Old 06-24-2021, 11:43 AM   #485
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I disagree....hell I'd say he just upgraded teams honestly.

Myles Turner
Sabonis
Brogdon
Caris Levert

That top 4 is better than anything he's ever had in Dallas.
Yet Dallas was #5 and made the playoffs while Indiana took an early vacation this summer.
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Old 06-24-2021, 11:52 AM   #486
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Yet Dallas was #5 and made the playoffs while Indiana took an early vacation this summer.
But you are aware that the Pacers suffered injuries all year....not only that but they had coaching issues which is why they hired Carlisle to begin with lol.

And I just posted their 4 best players....

I didn't even mention that Edmund Sumner, Oshae Brissett and Aaron Holiday have potential....

Justin Holiday is there. Doug McDermott. TJ Warren. Jeremy Lamb.

They have a very good roster. They aren't on TV much if it all so people sleep on them......

But give Luka Levert and Myles Turner and they would've been in the 2nd round of the playoffs this year.
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Old 06-24-2021, 11:56 AM   #487
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Rick Carlisle to the Pacers
Good to see him land on his feet. Hard to turn down a nice paycheck.

Nothing against Carlisle personally, but he had apparently lost both autonomy within the organization, and authority with respect to his team. Whatever the reason, he did not seem to be getting the most out of the current talent, and things appeared to be on the verge of ending up in the ditch.

When that happens, it's time to reboot. Elsewhere.

Carlisle's personality reminds me of Bill Fitch, to whom I believe RC has referred as a 'mentor'. Fitch was notoriously curmudgeonly, back in an era when coaches could get by with it more easily.

It's a little bit curious that Indiana is hiring that type of coaching personality given the dynamic that reportedly existed last year with first-year coach Nate Bjorkgren, with both assistant coach Greg Foster and player Goga Bitadze being suspended for an in-game confrontation/altercation:

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The situation comes during a frustrating two-month stretch for the Pacers. Wojnarowski reported Tuesday that first-year head coach Nate Bjorkgren's future with the organization is uncertain.

"Bjorkgren has significant work to do with his relationships among players throughout the team and with some members of the organization, but he has thus far shown a willingness to try to address those issues, sources said," wrote Wojnarowski.
So Carlisle may have to rely on his reputed 'adaptable AF' skill to make things work. All the best, RC.
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Old 06-24-2021, 02:07 PM   #488
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But you are aware that the Pacers suffered injuries all year....not only that but they had coaching issues which is why they hired Carlisle to begin with lol.

And I just posted their 4 best players....

I didn't even mention that Edmund Sumner, Oshae Brissett and Aaron Holiday have potential....

Justin Holiday is there. Doug McDermott. TJ Warren. Jeremy Lamb.

They have a very good roster. They aren't on TV much if it all so people sleep on them......

But give Luka Levert and Myles Turner and they would've been in the 2nd round of the playoffs this year.
Better players doesnít always account to a better team. Just ask Brooklyn.
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Old 06-24-2021, 03:15 PM   #489
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Better players doesnít always account to a better team. Just ask Brooklyn.
Ask Brooklyn what? They were a shot away from being in the ECF without Harden and Kyrie lol. That's without a head coach......

But let's say Brooklyn sucks.....they are one of the best teams out East....even more reason why the Pacers gig is a upgrade from the Mavs. Mavs are fighting for the 8th seed out West. Pacers can be a top 5 team out East.
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Old 06-24-2021, 05:45 PM   #490
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Honestly, Pacers are overflowing with talent. That's a hell of a team that Rick has to work with and I'd be surprised if they weren't 4-5 seed.

Also Mavs have a terrible roster outside of Rick. I'm not sure that any other coach could make us worse. We're probably not going to get appreciably better with a coaching change-- that's going to take a roster upgrade-- but at least we can give another coach an opportunity to get KP and Luka to play together because Rick completely failed and we're stuck with KP.
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Old 06-24-2021, 08:06 PM   #491
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TJ McConnell seems like Rick's perfect backup point guard.
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Old 06-24-2021, 09:28 PM   #492
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TJ McConnell seems like Rick's perfect backup point guard.
Forgot about McConnell being there....Pacers have a nice team.
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Old 06-25-2021, 12:52 AM   #493
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McConnell is a FA too so no guarantee he’ll be back. I’m sure they’ll try to keep him though.
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Old 06-25-2021, 02:12 AM   #494
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I disagree....hell I'd say he just upgraded teams honestly.

Myles Turner
Sabonis
Brogdon
Caris Levert

That top 4 is better than anything he's ever had in Dallas.
Add Luka to that lineup and they are in the ECF's at minimal

The Pacers have a very underrated roster and if memory serves me right some of those players missed significant time with injuries.

I've been a huge fan of Brogdon and Turner and was hoping at the deadline the Pacers would blow up their roster and trade one of them to Dallas LOL

Wonder if we can get them (Rick) to bite on a THJ (S & T) + Brunson package for Brogdon.

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Old 06-25-2021, 09:48 AM   #495
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We are gonna see Suns vs. Bucks in the finals.

Clippers grinded one out last night. Don't think Pandemic P will keep up his level of play as role players disappear. And the Suns aren't going to see another game, if only one, where Booker and CP3 shoot and play like they did. Actually going say the Clippers don't win another game and this one goes 4-1.

Hawks are certainly a fun team to watch. It's annoying to see the recency bias play out with the new Luka vs. Trae talk, but I'm not worried long term at all. However, Trae has certainly made his own spotlight and continues to improve. But anyone remotely thinking the Hawks won the trade is an imbecile. Reddish is not good and for a shooter reputation, his numbers are trash. The other young pieces and vets are what we expected Donnie to surround Luka with. That team with Luka instead of Trae and in the west? We are still watching our Mavs play...

Trae's performance (which can arguably be said won't happen again, to that level) and Middleton's non-performance, won't be a series long thing. I do expect this one to go at least 6 games, with Bucks moving on 4-2. I'm just glad these series will produce some first time champions and have really intriguing story lines and young guys and vets gunning for their ring.

Fun basketball.
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Old 06-25-2021, 09:49 AM   #496
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Forgot about McConnell being there....Pacers have a nice team.
Rick has also been the NBAís biggest Myles Turner fan, and the perfect center for his system. A shot blocker, with quickness, who can shoot the three.
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Old 06-25-2021, 02:42 PM   #497
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Rick has also been the NBAís biggest Myles Turner fan, and the perfect center for his system. A shot blocker, with quickness, who can shoot the three.
I was hoping the Mavs would trade for him honestly lol.
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Old 06-25-2021, 05:02 PM   #498
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I was hoping the Mavs would trade for him honestly lol.
Iíve wanted him since about his second season.
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Old 06-25-2021, 07:54 PM   #499
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Blazers about to sign Billups for head coach. I would have preferred him to Kidd.
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Old 06-25-2021, 08:02 PM   #500
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Blazers about to sign Billups for head coach. I would have preferred him to Kidd.
I would have also. I would have preferred all 3 Clippers candidates over Kidd personally...
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Old 06-25-2021, 09:08 PM   #501
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Blazers about to sign Billups for head coach. I would have preferred him to Kidd.
Same.
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Old 06-25-2021, 09:41 PM   #502
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I would have also. I would have preferred all 3 Clippers candidates over Kidd personally...
Are you talking Patrick Beverly, Reggie Jackson, and Marcus Morris Sr.?
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Old 06-26-2021, 12:04 AM   #503
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I’d take Kidd over Billups every time
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Old 06-26-2021, 08:55 AM   #504
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Iíd take Kidd over Billups every time
This. Would love to hear the arguments for Billups over Kidd...
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Old 06-26-2021, 10:23 AM   #505
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Billups is an unknown as a coach, Kidd has experience but not positive ones. I don't know if I would favor one over the other in those scenarios it's just TBD. When Billups has a few years experience we can decide then.
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Old 06-26-2021, 01:22 PM   #506
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This. Would love to hear the arguments for Billups over Kidd...
I just like Billups. He made me laugh when he was with ESPN. Mainly due to how he was seen as both a genius(he's not ftr) and a mentor to the special needs kid next to him aka Paul Pierce. He has no HC experience but there was no vet coach outside of Atkinson I really wanted of the names being thrown out around here. But Billups is respected as a former player as well. Outside of the recent reporting of Kidd being liked by basically every star player, which I can only imagine is because he was a HOF player because as a coach I see nothing to latch onto. Bucks literally went from mediocre to 60 wins the year he left and Bud was hired. But I'm supposed to be optimistic that Kidd learned something after 2 yrs as an assistant coaching Lebron, who likely doesn't need all that much coaching... and learning under Vogel?

My main top choice was Atkinson but I'd literally take almost every name mentioned so far on this board over Kidd because I have placed him firmly in the great player mediocre coach category like Bird and Ewing and every other one you want to throw out until I see otherwise. Maybe He and Nico get us free agents. If he does then all we need is a quality staff supporting him. I like that we seem to be hiring JJ as I always thought he'd be great as a players coach and even good in player development. I'm optimistic about Terry but not as much as JJ. We need some veterans on the staff though.
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Old 06-26-2021, 07:03 PM   #507
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Wow, that didn't take long. Orlando and Washington are requesting an interview with Mosley.

Definitely think the Magic make the most sense for a rookie coach.
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Old 06-27-2021, 10:11 AM   #508
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Wow, that didn't take long. Orlando and Washington are requesting an interview with Mosley.

Definitely think the Magic make the most sense for a rookie coach.
Yeah Mosley is a great coach, particularly for a young team. I'm sad to see him go, but he's yet another of the guys who have learned under RC who are about to flourish as head coaches. I think 1/8 of the league at one point were RC or his disciples (Stotts, Casey, Silas, etc.) I think that trend continues next season.

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Old 06-27-2021, 10:54 AM   #509
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I just like Billups. He made me laugh when he was with ESPN. Mainly due to how he was seen as both a genius(he's not ftr) and a mentor to the special needs kid next to him aka Paul Pierce. He has no HC experience but there was no vet coach outside of Atkinson I really wanted of the names being thrown out around here. But Billups is respected as a former player as well. Outside of the recent reporting of Kidd being liked by basically every star player, which I can only imagine is because he was a HOF player because as a coach I see nothing to latch onto. Bucks literally went from mediocre to 60 wins the year he left and Bud was hired. But I'm supposed to be optimistic that Kidd learned something after 2 yrs as an assistant coaching Lebron, who likely doesn't need all that much coaching... and learning under Vogel?

My main top choice was Atkinson but I'd literally take almost every name mentioned so far on this board over Kidd because I have placed him firmly in the great player mediocre coach category like Bird and Ewing and every other one you want to throw out until I see otherwise. Maybe He and Nico get us free agents. If he does then all we need is a quality staff supporting him. I like that we seem to be hiring JJ as I always thought he'd be great as a players coach and even good in player development. I'm optimistic about Terry but not as much as JJ. We need some veterans on the staff though.
I've seen this a few times. I think we are unfairly attributing the next season success to Kidd. IMO, it has more to do with the fact he didn't have Jabari Parker at all, who was playing well for them the year prior and obviously before his injury. Also another year of improvement from Giannis, though perhaps not as much as Brogdon and the addition of Brook Lopez. Then midseason stuff like Nikola Mirotic and Goerge Hill.

It's also widely rumored Giannis was pushing to retain Kidd as coach. An idea of which seems to align with a lot of players around the league in their respect and endorsement for Kidd.

I just think it's odd a guy with barely any coaching experience is more desired than someone who been at it for a while, with HC experience. That in and of itself is enough for me to want Kidd, despite whatever success or non-success he's had at previous stops. I just view it differently, and think he's smart enough to adjust his styles.

Totally agree with the second part though. I've said it elsewhere that his coaching staff will be very important. The Terry and Barea rumors I view more mid to end of bench coaching, but would welcome in the right roles.
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Old 06-27-2021, 11:37 AM   #510
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Wow, that didn't take long. Orlando and Washington are requesting an interview with Mosley.

Definitely think the Magic make the most sense for a rookie coach.
Magic are so bad that he would be a stop gap coach....they are going to suck for the next few years and build up talent and then by the time they get a decent roster Mosley will be gone....
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Old 06-27-2021, 11:38 AM   #511
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This. Would love to hear the arguments for Billups over Kidd...
I mean the argument would be the unknown. We don't now what Billups is....but we know what Kidd WAS and it wasn't very good.
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Old 06-27-2021, 12:33 PM   #512
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I mean the argument would be the unknown. We don't now what Billups is....but we know what Kidd WAS and it wasn't very good.
I disagree and will not conclude Kidd's coaching abilities on those two stops. I'm at least giving him a chance here way before Billups. That unknown is SUPER unknown at best.
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Old 06-27-2021, 05:48 PM   #513
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I mean the argument would be the unknown. We don't now what Billups is....but we know what Kidd WAS and it wasn't very good.
I usually agree with most of your post

But here I disagree

What has Billups done besides stand on the sideline and clap that makes him a better fit than Kidd?

Kidd actually did a terrific job his 1st go round with the Nets and they had average talent.

He wasn't that bad in Milwaukee considering Giannis was still just starting out.

Luka is already a top 5 talent and if Kidd somehow figures out this KP issue lack of touches he will most likely have immediate success in Dallas as a coach.

I also believe relationships matter amongst players and coaches now days more than in years past.

Kidd seems like a guy that will be someone who the players will follow and respect.

I think he needs a veteran Assistant next to him but I can see this team being very similar to the one Avery Johnson took over where the players just responded to him being a new voice right out the gates.

Avery was demanding, preached defense and maximum effort. His teams played hard and very rarely took night's off he just got his kicked by Nellie.

He did get the finals not being a great coach but again he motivated that team and to be fair they got screwed by ref's or else Avery would might have won a title in a short amount of time.

I can see Kidd getting more energy out this team especially from guys like Josh Green. I can see being more app to use KP in the mid post area similar to Dirk and get him touches that way more often.

If the Front office can convince someone like Demar DeRozan to come here and help Luka I don't think anyone is going to speak much about the coaching as a weakness next year.

I believe the changes to this organization recently was much needed and I expect for the 1st time in a decade that this franchise will get beyond the 1st round of the playoffs and close to the WCF's.
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Old 06-27-2021, 07:47 PM   #514
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There are reports coming out that Dame may want out of Portland, and one reason is that fans are giving him shit over the Billups hire. I donít believe it is actually the real reason, but he did feel the need to tweet about it.
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Old 06-27-2021, 08:24 PM   #515
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There are reports coming out that Dame may want out of Portland, and one reason is that fans are giving him shit over the Billups hire. I donít believe it is actually the real reason, but he did feel the need to tweet about it.
The angry twitter mob strikes again. They were brutal with J Kidd as well.

Problem is they are always angry about pretty much everything. I bitched for a good day about the Kidd hiring and moved on. What good does it to do be unhappy all the time?

The Portland fans just put Lillard and the Blazers in a no-win situation. If they back out of the Billups deal now, then Lillard will for sure request a trade.
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Old 06-27-2021, 09:52 PM   #516
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I'm not going to overreact and say it's over for Atlanta, but Milwaukee is the more talented team I don't think it's even close. It seems to happen more often lately that the underdog takes game 1 and everyone overreacts, then the better team wins in 5 or 6.

I do believe we're going to get Bucks/Suns Finals and either Giannis or Chris Paul who have had their playoff struggles will get a ring. Not that I'm going out on a limb they're both ahead in their series.

Anything would be better than Suns/Hawks where low IQ fans would go "Look at the teams who didn't draft Luka, it must be because Luka sucks"

Last edited by JustJay; 06-27-2021 at 10:02 PM.
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Old 06-27-2021, 11:47 PM   #517
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I'm not going to overreact and say it's over for Atlanta, but Milwaukee is the more talented team I don't think it's even close. It seems to happen more often lately that the underdog takes game 1 and everyone overreacts, then the better team wins in 5 or 6.

I do believe we're going to get Bucks/Suns Finals and either Giannis or Chris Paul who have had their playoff struggles will get a ring. Not that I'm going out on a limb they're both ahead in their series.

Anything would be better than Suns/Hawks where low IQ fans would go "Look at the teams who didn't draft Luka, it must be because Luka sucks"
Hawks are too jump shot dependent for me to see them as a legit threat.
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Old 06-27-2021, 11:49 PM   #518
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I disagree and will not conclude Kidd's coaching abilities on those two stops. I'm at least giving him a chance here way before Billups. That unknown is SUPER unknown at best.
For the record I have no issue with Kidd I'm just saying that's the argument here for Billups. He's the unknown.
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Old 06-27-2021, 11:55 PM   #519
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I usually agree with most of your post

But here I disagree

What has Billups done besides stand on the sideline and clap that makes him a better fit than Kidd?

Kidd actually did a terrific job his 1st go round with the Nets and they had average talent.

He wasn't that bad in Milwaukee considering Giannis was still just starting out.

Luka is already a top 5 talent and if Kidd somehow figures out this KP issue lack of touches he will most likely have immediate success in Dallas as a coach.

I also believe relationships matter amongst players and coaches now days more than in years past.

Kidd seems like a guy that will be someone who the players will follow and respect.

I think he needs a veteran Assistant next to him but I can see this team being very similar to the one Avery Johnson took over where the players just responded to him being a new voice right out the gates.

Avery was demanding, preached defense and maximum effort. His teams played hard and very rarely took night's off he just got his kicked by Nellie.

He did get the finals not being a great coach but again he motivated that team and to be fair they got screwed by ref's or else Avery would might have won a title in a short amount of time.

I can see Kidd getting more energy out this team especially from guys like Josh Green. I can see being more app to use KP in the mid post area similar to Dirk and get him touches that way more often.

If the Front office can convince someone like Demar DeRozan to come here and help Luka I don't think anyone is going to speak much about the coaching as a weakness next year.

I believe the changes to this organization recently was much needed and I expect for the 1st time in a decade that this franchise will get beyond the 1st round of the playoffs and close to the WCF's.
Billups has done nothing. I'm not saying he's a better hire than Kidd. The poster asked what the argument would be and I was just stating its the unknown vs. the known even though I'd probably argue Kidd at this point in his coaching career may be more of a unknown.
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Old 06-28-2021, 02:24 AM   #520
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The angry twitter mob strikes again. They were brutal with J Kidd as well.

Problem is they are always angry about pretty much everything. I bitched for a good day about the Kidd hiring and moved on. What good does it to do be unhappy all the time?

The Portland fans just put Lillard and the Blazers in a no-win situation. If they back out of the Billups deal now, then Lillard will for sure request a trade.
Portland is the epicenter of angry Twitter mobs. Dame was a little kid when Billups was accused. They just find a reason to be outraged, and lean into it.
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