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Old 04-07-2016, 01:35 PM   #41
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You can say that about basically any big budget movie these days. And if you mention the Marvel movies, then you've lost me as those are now the most rehashed seen it over and over over stuff again and again. I'd rather see star wars stuff over marvel stuff. None of it is original. Like do you honestly think there will be anything original in Captain America Civil War? Wow, they even have spider man show up at the end! Never seen him before! Wish he'd get his own movie though since we haven't had any of those lately...
If you want to take the word "unoriginal" to such an extreme that there's no such thing as an original thought, then I guess I can't argue with you... But I'm talking about this kind of uninspired laziness:


Attack of the Clones


Revenge of the Sith


Rogue One


A New Hope


Return of the Jedi


The Force Awakens



I get it, the Death Star was awesome in A New Hope, but does it really need 3 movies of backstory before it inevitably gets blown up? Is there anything else awesome going on in this universe, or is that it? Because sphere-shaped superweapons are kinda played-out.

It's like they're admitting that they can't come up with anything better than A New Hope, so they keep orbiting that time period when Star Wars was fresh and new, rather than just making Star Wars fresh and new again (hence the Han Solo, Boba Fett and Obi Wan Kenobi spinoffs)... It's the laziest way to make a buck, but everyone seems to be comfortable that their standards are in the shitter (as you've basically admitted), so I guess Disney doesn't really have to try that hard to get your money.
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Old 04-07-2016, 05:49 PM   #42
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Hey you know, the death star was a grade a filet...not a mcrib. And it's kinda hard to out do a giant space station that destroys planets and/or entire solar systems. But the death star in too many movies...I'll give it to you.

Still, Rogue One looks badass either way.
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Old 04-10-2016, 06:06 PM   #43
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‏@Ssnyder1835: Little one saw me watching Llewyn Davis and asked if that was Kylo and Poe singing together & who was the other guy

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Old 04-11-2016, 12:04 PM   #44
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Old 04-11-2016, 03:30 PM   #45
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So it's good because it's popular? Is that where our standards are now? (/checks polls to see Donald Trump still leading the Republicans). Yep.

I mean, I'm sure the multi-billion dollar cinematic equivalent of McDonalds is going to do just fine without my money, but that doesn't mean I don't have the right to be offended with the uninspired cash grabs they've churned out over the last 2 decades.

But by all means, don't let me keep you from enjoying Star Wars: McRib One... I hear it's popular, so it must be good for you.
Honestly, with the exception of Star Wars and The Empire Strikes Back, I think the series has been pretty mediocre to bad. I'm not a Star Wars hater. I think Luke Skywalker and Han Solo kick some major butt... but the screenwriters simply need to do better.
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Old 04-11-2016, 03:31 PM   #46
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And Underdog has a point... popularity means little. Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton are the two popular choices of the Democratic party? That's kinda pathetic.
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Old 04-11-2016, 03:42 PM   #47
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And Underdog has a point... popularity means little. Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton are the two popular choices of the Democratic party? That's kinda pathetic.
That's a topic for a different thread, but I don't disagree with you.
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Old 04-13-2016, 12:41 PM   #48
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Fool me once, shame on you... Fool me over & over & over & over again since 1983, shame on my dumb ass for never growing up enough to spot a scam.

If I've learned anything over the years, it's that Star Wars banks hard on GenX's blind nostalgia to overhype their mediocre franchise and keep the cash flowing in... The brand has absolutely nothing new to offer at this point, that's why they're retreading prequel territory (again).

Hell, The Force Awakens was so unoriginal that they're still mining the old characters/plots for new movies. In addition to Rogue One, there's Han Solo, Boba Fett and Obi Wan Kenobi prequels in the works. I guess Emo Darth Vader Remix, Orange Yoda Chick, and iPhone Storm Troopers don't milk those nostalgia bucks like the original characters.
Disney wants to max out that 4 billion they banked on the franchise. What is it, a new flick each year for the next 5 years? Rogue One, Part 8, Han Solo, Part 9, Boba Fett. Crazy. Today it's not about what you produce....but the money you earn. You have companies buying out mom and pop because they are afraid of competition, so the product suffers.....just like the Star Wars franchise....you get these 2 advertising legends to feed you trailers all year, commercials every hour....print ads every where you look.....
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Old 06-01-2016, 03:34 PM   #49
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Finally watched it a second time, became even more aware of how completely unoriginal this steaming pile of crap was... They straight-up lifted ANH's and a bit of ESB's scripts, beat-for-beat:


ANH/TFA Plot Summary

- Leia/Poe gives droid important intel to give to the rebels.

- Darth Vader/Kylo Ren shows up and kills one of the rebels while asking for the plans.

- Leia/Poe is then captured by Darth Vader/Kylo Ren and tortured.

- The droid reaches our hero Luke/Rey who now needs to leave the desert planet Tattooine/Jakku.

- They end up meeting an old mentor/hero Ben/Han, who tells them that the Jedi were hunted down and destroyed by young apprentice, Darth Vader/Kylo Ren.

- He takes them to a cantina so they can get safe passage to the rebels, but the Death Star/Starkiller blows up rebel planet and now they need to infiltrate the Death Star/Starkiller to rescue Leia/Rey.

- Ben/Han confronts his apprentice/son Darth Vader/Kylo Ren, who kills him while the heroes escape.

- The Death Star/Starkiller is about to blow up the rebel planet, but the rebels do a trench run on the Death Star/Starkiller and blow it up.

- As this happens Darth Vader/Kylo Ren realizes Luke/Rey’s Force abilities.

- Luke/Rey realizes he/she needs to go to the last remaining Jedi who is hiding on a remote planet in seclusion.


HOW CAN ANYONE CONSIDER THIS TO BE ANYTHING OTHER THAN A BLATANT RIPOFF??
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Old 06-01-2016, 04:34 PM   #50
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It's a ripoff In the way that the heroes journey is retold. Is O Brother Where Art Though a rip off of the Odyssey? The idea of balance to the universe and spiraling storylines are built into the almost Shinto religion of the Jedis. It's about connecting to the past. Is it any surprise that we see a new story with parallels to the repeating stories?

Americans have the idea of ripping off ideas way off. It's about iteration and revision. People have been riffing on older stories since we first started telling stories.
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Old 06-01-2016, 05:41 PM   #51
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It's a ripoff In the way that the heroes journey is retold. Is O Brother Where Art Though a rip off of the Odyssey? The idea of balance to the universe and spiraling storylines are built into the almost Shinto religion of the Jedis. It's about connecting to the past. Is it any surprise that we see a new story with parallels to the repeating stories?

Americans have the idea of ripping off ideas way off. It's about iteration and revision. People have been riffing on older stories since we first started telling stories.
If the Cohens wrote and directed a movie of the Odyssey, then made O Brother Where Art Thou as a sequel, your point might be relevant... Seriously, read my last post again and tell me JarJar Abrams didn't just copy/paste the script of A New Hope. You don't have to repeat the same story to play on nostalgia, you just need to bring back all the characters that we already know & love. Repeating the same story is just LAZY and fails to capture the wonder that made Star Wars worth a damn in the first place. Even the godawful prequels managed to introduce new ideas and themes to the franchise -- TFA does neither.

If this is what passes for quality entertainment in America, then maybe we deserve whatever hell Hillary or Trump are about to unleash on us -- obviously we're just simple-minded children who don't know any better (or at best, we don't care!)
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Old 06-01-2016, 06:39 PM   #52
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And then there's Rogue One doing reshoots because "it didnt measure up to the bar set in terms of four-quadrant appeal."

Might as well just give their focus groups a writing credit at this point...
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Old 06-01-2016, 06:58 PM   #53
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And then there's Rogue One doing reshoots because "it didnt measure up to the bar set in terms of four-quadrant appeal."

Might as well just give their focus groups a writing credit at this point...
That's because Gareth Edwards doesn't understand pace. Monsters and Godzilla were solid efforts, but both movies really drag in parts. This doesn't surprise me one bit.
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Old 06-01-2016, 07:10 PM   #54
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That's because Gareth Edwards doesn't understand pace. Monsters and Godzilla were solid efforts, but both movies really drag in parts. This doesn't surprise me one bit.
Great hire! He probably only got the job because he's a bitch who will do whatever the studio tells him to... Hell, it's still not too late for the suits to turn Rogue One into an Ewoks: The Battle for Endor remix -- I bet it would make a billion dollars anyway.
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Old 06-01-2016, 07:33 PM   #55
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@bobbykaralla: Dirk said he's never watched a single Star Wars movie. So yeah...


Or should I post this in the Dirk Is Great Thread?

(also, wtf? how??)
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Old 06-02-2016, 11:01 PM   #56
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And then there's Rogue One doing reshoots because "it didnt measure up to the bar set in terms of four-quadrant appeal."

Might as well just give their focus groups a writing credit at this point...
40% of the film is being overhauled for the final cut.

http://www.cinemablend.com/new/Rogue...st-134887.html
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Old 06-03-2016, 01:27 PM   #57
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If you want to take the word "unoriginal" to such an extreme that there's no such thing as an original thought, then I guess I can't argue with you
I just happened to listen to this one the other day. Very interesting observations that ... nothing is original.

Ted Radio Hour - What Is Original?
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Old 06-04-2016, 05:39 AM   #58
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Tapping the brakes on the bs click bait rumors...

http://www.ew.com/article/2016/06/03/rogue-one-reshoots
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Old 06-04-2016, 07:08 PM   #59
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It's a ripoff In the way that the heroes journey is retold. Is O Brother Where Art Though a rip off of the Odyssey? The idea of balance to the universe and spiraling storylines are built into the almost Shinto religion of the Jedis. It's about connecting to the past. Is it any surprise that we see a new story with parallels to the repeating stories?

Americans have the idea of ripping off ideas way off. It's about iteration and revision. People have been riffing on older stories since we first started telling stories.
Here's the problem... It's one thing to borrow liberally in a manner such as O Brother Where Art Thou and the Odyssey... It's a completely different thing to do so within the same movie franchise....
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Old 06-05-2016, 08:47 AM   #60
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Here's the problem... It's one thing to borrow liberally in a manner such as O Brother Where Art Thou and the Odyssey... It's a completely different thing to do so within the same movie franchise....
That's a fair point, but I think Jurassic World did the same thing. I mean, the Indominus Rex is basically the Spinosaurus from part 3. They sell the IR as being part Raptor and what not, but it's essentially still the same idea of being a bigger, badder T-Rex.

But yes, TFA is basically SW 4, 5, and 6 wrapped up into one movie. But you know, those three movies are arguably the best trilogy of all time. To completely damn a movie for wanting to be those is a bit misguided when your goal is to make billions off of a single film. And after the horrible prequels, it was almost a given that the franchise was going to emulate what people liked and wanted. And why pretend that Star Wars isn't a well oiled corporate franchise? Anything that becomes as popular as Star Wars goes the same route of cha ching cha ching.

And being unoriginal doesn't equate to being bad and being original doesn't equate to being good. TFA was still a decent movie, imo, original or not. And the main characters Rey, Ren, and Finn are all reasonably different from what we've seen in the past.
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Old 06-06-2016, 11:25 AM   #61
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I know that there's a lot of Star Wars nostalgia..but 4, 5, and 6 are definitely not the best trilogy of all time... LOTR is definitely better. Episode VI was a pretty decent misstep. It was still a quality movie, but it definitely drags it down below LOTR.

As for TFA, it was enjoyable regardless whether or not it borrowed liberally from its predecessors. But, I can see how that would definitely bother some quite a bit. It was a pretty good movie. I was let down..I expected better. I'm not a huge Star Wars guy, but the hype was so insane that I expected a really good movie. Instead, it was a pretty good movie..enjoyable. There's nothing wrong with that. I accept it for what it is. Fortunately for TFA, the previous three movies set the bar incredibly low. A pretty good movie was obviously going to be received as greatness because the episodes 1, 2, and 3 were so mediocre on the whole.
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Old 06-10-2016, 05:44 AM   #62
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LOTR is seriously the most boring series of movies ever.
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Old 06-10-2016, 10:08 AM   #63
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Obviously, I disagree... But even boring is far better than Ewoks.
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Old 10-04-2017, 10:51 PM   #64
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Old 10-20-2017, 07:56 AM   #65
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LOTR is seriously the most boring series of movies ever.
Bad troll is bad. Nice try pal.
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Old 11-21-2017, 10:04 AM   #66
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LOTR is far superior to Star Wars... without a doubt. Star Wars is enjoyable but the LOTR movies are several levels above in the quality of movie.
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Old 12-16-2017, 12:18 AM   #67
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You know, I defended Force Awakens because even as a retread I thought it was fun and well-made. Rogue One was more serious and felt fresh from that perspective.

The Last Jedi is a pile of crap. Shockingly bad.
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Old 12-16-2017, 01:28 AM   #68
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The Last Jedi is a pile of crap. Shockingly bad.
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Old 12-16-2017, 01:44 AM   #69
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The Last Jedi felt like it was trying to be Guardians of the Galaxy with the never-ending quips and attempts at humor, but ended up being a lot more like Batman v Superman with shitty pacing and a tone that's all over the place. It's slightly more original than The Force Awakens, but all of the original parts are terrible, while still managing to crib several iconic scenes from ESB and ROTJ... Although the biggest sin is that several plot lines go absolutely nowhere and some major characters are completely wasted.

Glad I got free tickets, I don't think I'm ever going to pay to watch another Star Wars movie again -- I just don't like this franchise, especially with the direction Disney has taken it... Hell, I wonder if this series would still be around if the Empire Strikes Back had just been a mediocre movie instead of a great one -- everything after the first act of Return of the Jedi has been somewhere between middling and godawful. This movie was prequel-bad, maybe even a franchise-killer as far as anyone who grew up on SW is concerned (if TFA didn't already kill your fandom).

Rotten Tomatoes: 93% Critic Score, 56% Audience Score... Proof that the movie industry is influenced by paid shills.
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Old 12-16-2017, 09:40 AM   #70
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Yeah, I think Rottentomatoes is in big trouble after this movie. Already articles popping up about the divide between the paid critics and the audience.

SPOILER ALERT

The hook is just awful. It starts off with two of the worst actors in a big budget production I've ever seen clearly standing in front of a green screen. I almost thought it was a fan film a first and the real movie hadn't started. Did Disney like cut the budget or something because the effects were borderline terrible multiple times.

Look, Star Wars is a kids movie. I get it. That was made blatantly obvious at the end with the "we don't approve of horse racing" slave kid wanting to become a rebel. But that doesn't excuse a terrible, terrible film. Why you'd even have a subplot that is anti-horse racing is downright shocking.

Funny that Star Wars is becoming a prisoner of it's own fable of light and dark. We all hated Jar Jar so much and yet TLJ had like 20 Jar Jar moments/characters in it. In fact, I felt like this movie was STRONGLY influenced by the prequels to a huge detriment.

I really don't care who owns the franchise, but I do care that Star Wars no longer feels special. When you break almost every rule you've set in the franchise, then nothing has any meaning anymore.

And I saw it at the Drafthouse with the biggest movie buffs. Barely a clap at the end spoke volumes.
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Old 12-16-2017, 10:08 AM   #71
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I really don't care who owns the franchise, but I do care that Star Wars no longer feels special.
Bingo. Star Wars feels like just another mediocre summer tentpole now.


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Old 12-20-2017, 01:35 AM   #72
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RedLetterMedia: The Last Jedi Review
http://redlettermedia.com/half-in-th...t-jedi-review/
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Old 12-20-2017, 09:15 AM   #73
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There are tons of bad reviews now around the interwebs.

It pisses me off the people defending it saying "people didn't like TFA because it wasn't original and didn't like TLJ because it wasn't" which is total dog poo. Bad is bad, original or not.

The kids movie defense doesn't really jive either. Let's see, if I'm directing/writing a kids movie, I don't think putting a giant Casino in it for half the movie is wise.

And the originals had funny, goofy moments, but they were mostly serious in tone. Perhaps 10% of those movies had jokes or humor. Now it's about 80% of stupidness. Why? Do we really have to treat kids/teens like they are complete morons? That is exactly what TLJ did, and I don't agree with it.

Even on the most elementary of levels, the universe is missing, characters uninteresting, no real arcs outside of one or two characters, dialogue bad, plot bad, ship/vehicle designs meh, sound effects/soundtrack meh. It's the whole package. I'll give it a D for one or two cool scenes.
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Old 12-21-2017, 12:52 AM   #74
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"I said to Rian, I said, "Jedi's don't give up. I mean even if he had a problem he would maybe take a year to try and regroup, but if he made a mistake he would try and right that wrong." So right there we had a fundamental difference, but it's not my story anymore. It's somebody else's story, and Rian needed me to be a certain way to make the ending effective. That's the crux of my problem. Luke would never say that. I'm sorry. Well in this version, see I'm talking about the George Lucas Star Wars. This is the next generation of Star Wars, so I almost had to think of Luke as another character. Maybe he is Jake Skywalker." --Mark Hamill
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Old 12-21-2017, 04:57 PM   #75
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The problem with Star Wars is that the original trilogy worked so well because it is basically the monomyth, but once that story is told there is nothing left to tell. There is a reason that there wasn't a Gilgamesh II or a Beowulf the Beginning. As amazing a job Lucas did with his world building (even with the prequels), without something engaging it is all flash and no substance. The sad thing is that Disney seems determined to try to repeat the success without putting in the work. Instead of copying the beats from the original trilogy, they would have been better served by picking up a copy of Joseph Conrad's Hero with a thousand faces and working from that.
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Old 12-21-2017, 06:41 PM   #76
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The problem with Star Wars is that the original trilogy worked so well because it is basically the monomyth, but once that story is told there is nothing left to tell. There is a reason that there wasn't a Gilgamesh II or a Beowulf the Beginning. As amazing a job Lucas did with his world building (even with the prequels), without something engaging it is all flash and no substance. The sad thing is that Disney seems determined to try to repeat the success without putting in the work. Instead of copying the beats from the original trilogy, they would have been better served by picking up a copy of Joseph Conrad's Hero with a thousand faces and working from that.
It's the riding the line between the old and the new that doesn't work. Sorta like the treadmill of mediocrity going for the 8th seed in the NBA. Sure, people will still pay to see it, but it will always be meh and never great.

I would actually just rather them do what they did with Rogue One and stick with the old. None of the post original trilogy interests me in the least anymore.
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Old 01-02-2018, 10:59 AM   #77
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The reality is that the series had two really good to great movies. The original and The Empire Strikes back. And you can argue that Rogue One was a really good movies as well. However, everything else has been mediocre at best and highly overrated. I hate that they're turning into Disney garbage. But the reality is that Return of the Jedi was Disney garbage in large part.
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Old 01-17-2018, 12:42 AM   #78
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Star Wars: The Last Jedi -- Movie Pitch [SPOILERS]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1v2P...pZgnnw&index=7
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Old 07-10-2018, 03:52 PM   #79
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It's the riding the line between the old and the new that doesn't work. Sorta like the treadmill of mediocrity going for the 8th seed in the NBA. Sure, people will still pay to see it, but it will always be meh and never great.

I would actually just rather them do what they did with Rogue One and stick with the old. None of the post original trilogy interests me in the least anymore.
I actually had no interest in seeing the last two that came out.. Solo and whatever came out prior. I eventually saw it, but that had more to do with kids than anything else. I must say that I was never a huge Star Wars nerd.. but I did enjoy them and can remember seeing Return of the Jedi in the theaters. What's amazing is how low the bar actually is for the franchise. Throw out a little horse crap with some frosting on top and it gets great reviews and makes hundreds of millions....

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Old 07-11-2018, 02:57 PM   #80
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The reality is that the series had two really good to great movies. The original and The Empire Strikes back. And you can argue that Rogue One was a really good movies as well. However, everything else has been mediocre at best and highly overrated. I hate that they're turning into Disney garbage. But the reality is that Return of the Jedi was Disney garbage in large part.
The thing I found stupid about the whole thing was not the change of Luke's character. I can see him not wanting to harm anyone with the force ever again. And the power he showed to be able to project himself across the galaxy in real time was cool as hell.

But how do you have time to leave a fleeing fleet, go to a planet, have adventures on said planet AND THEN CATCH the fleet before the enemy. Just stupid.

And if flying ships into objects then using hyperdrive was so stupid that it hurt. If that's the case why weren't there droid piloted kamikaze missions every other battle.

These were so bad they ruined the movie for me.
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