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Originally Posted by roadrunner
I don't subscribe to the Catholic orthodoxy
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And yet you are using the same exact argument (extinguishing potential sentience/life) they use to attack contraception...
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Originally Posted by roadrunner
Just so that we are clear, when I stated opportunity below I wasnt talking about opportunity to get pregnant. I was referring to opportunity to continue living and growing into a healthy baby...
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If you use contraception you are using an artificial barrier to intercede in the life cycle, and gametogeniesis and eventually fertilization is part of that life cycle.
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Originally Posted by roadrunner
I brought in murder to the discussion. You cant murder sperm or an egg.
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you can't murder a 4 week old embryo either. You are not making sense.
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Originally Posted by roadrunner
But, to continue into your argument, lets build on where you seem to be headed. My question to you is everytime a woman hits her period is she is extinguishing potential life simply because she did not get pregnant before her egg died? And for the guys, every time we have a wet dream are we extinguishing potential life because we are spilling our sperm? And, if a husband doesn't sweet talk his wife and they don't have sex then is that extinguishing potential life? What about those that abuse drugs and trash their bodies are they potentially extinguishing life because they are killing their reproductive potency? I could go on and this could get even more ugly than it is now. I would hope you would agree that this is silly to call this some form of murder.
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Exactly! You get it! That is why the "potential sentience" argument is so idiotic. People who say, "well that clump of cells will possibly be sentient
one day, so aborting it is equivalent to murder" are being ridiculous. Ever heard of the phrase, "if 'ifs' and 'buts' were candy and nuts every day would be Christmas"? That clump of cells may be sentient one day, but not now.
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Originally Posted by roadrunner
Extinguishing the potential to getting pregnant and actually aborting a baby after conception are 2 totally different issues. The first deals with extinguishing potential but the second deals with inevitably extinguishing someone that is already a growing, developing, innocent human. This is what I refer to as murder, unless there is a really good reason to do it such as the mothers life is in danger. You are drawing a line in the sand months after this growing starts based on a non-thinking/non-feeling defense and I am drawing a line where conception and life starts.
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An innocent sperm and an innocent egg had to grow and develop. If the mere act of "developing" determines whether something should get the same rights as me, then your argument has a lot of issues beyond the embryo. I'm drawing the line at thinking and feeling and near absence of consciousness.
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Originally Posted by roadrunner
This brings me to another question about what you wrote prior about equating a baby to a vegatable. Is someone that is in a vegetative state still alive? They can't feel or think either, right?
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The word life means a lot of things to a lot of different people. I'm not concerned with that. I'm concerned with thinking and feeling. That is what makes us uniquely human, so yes someone who is brain dead shouldn't get the same rights as me. That is why it was perfectly appropriate to pull the plug on Terri Shiavo.