Quote:
Originally Posted by Murphy3
Well, maybe you should actually look at the numbers.
WinShares per 48 in playoff history:
1. Jordan .553
2. Mikan .2541
3. LeBron James .2218
4. Magic .2078
5. Dirk .2067
6. West .2031
12. Barkley .1932
29. Dr. J .1756 ABA/NBA
55. Dr. J .1493 NBA only
77. Karl Malone .1396
97. Elgin Baylor .1338
Player Efficiency Rating in playoff history
7. Dirk 24.75
10. Barkley 24.18
13. West 23.06
22. Julius Erving 22.05 ABA/NBA
23. Elgin Baylor 21.83
40. Julius Erving 19.96 NBA only
31. Karl Malone 21.12 (ahead of OscarRobertson but behind Paul Gasol and Baron freaking Davis)
Dirk leads both statistical ratings. Obviously Barkley and West aren't too far off, but Dirk separates himself nicely from Dr. J, Elgin Baylor, and Karl Malone when it comes to the playoffs.
And statistically, this was as close to an "average" playoff run as Dirk's had in his career. His WS/48 was at .210. His career playoff w/s is .2067. So yeah, Dirk was rather average this year as far as the numbers go. He was just huge in the clutch.
I can't find the numbers to back this up just yet, but I'd be willing to bet that this was at least a top 2-3 most statistically clutch performance in the history of the NBA for any of the Finals MVP's..ever. Sometimes it's not always about your numbers on the whole but when you get the numbers. Dirk had a solid post season this year, but he was a basketball God in the final 5:00 minutes of games decided by 5 or fewer points.
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I am assuming that it's ok for me to respond to this post since I don't see
sike or anyone else telling you not to make it or to put it in the other thread. Plus another 2 posters responded to it, so I will do the same. Don't feel like being accused of trolling again.
The first stat that you provided was playoff win shares
per 48. Why did you use per 48 numbers instead of the stat for playoff win shares, which is actually based on what the players did? Dirk isn't playing 48 mpg and neither is anyone else on the list besides Wilt. Per 48 stats often make players look better than they actually were. For example, using your list, Shaq is #20 behind Barkley, Baron Davis and Billups? Robinson is #8? Gasol (#26) is ahead of McHale, Bird and Moses (#30-#32) and Kobe (#43)? Horace Grant (#48) is ahead of Dr J (#55)? That stat doesn't seem very reliable to me.
Using the regular per 48 stat Dirk is top 14, right behind:
1. Michael Jordan* 39.76
2. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar* 35.56
3. Magic Johnson* 32.63
4. Wilt Chamberlain* 31.46
5. Shaquille O'Neal 31.08
6. Tim Duncan 28.84
7. Bill Russell* 27.76
8. Kobe Bryant 26.85
9. Jerry West* 26.75
10. Larry Bird* 24.83
11. Scottie Pippen* 23.58
12. Karl Malone* 22.99
13. Hakeem Olajuwon* 22.60
14. Dirk Nowitzki 22.08
Some of the guys we discussed are ahead of him (Malone, Pippen, West), and some are behind (Stockton, Barkley, Robinson). Dr J is #8 on the combined NBA/ABA list. But as I mentioned earlier, when comparing a current players playoff numbers to a retired player, especially Barkley and Malone, you have to remember that they played post their prime and their playoff numbers dipped. Dirk's numbers will decline as well eventually. Using this stat, he is already behind Malone who has his post prime years included in his avg.
The second stat that you used was PER, which largely measures offensive performance. Even Hollinger freely admits that two of the defensive statistics it incorporates -- blocks and steals -- can produce a distorted picture of a player's value and that PER is not a reliable measure of a player's defensive acumen (from wiki). There are two sides of a basketball court and most of the players that I mentioned were good on the other side of the court....defense. I'll also note that using playoff PER, Magic is only #17 (20, 8, 12), Wilt only #18 (23, 25, 4) and Bird is only #24 (24, 10, 7). Their playoff numbers are in (). Would you really use PER to argue that T-Mac (#8 on the list) was a better playoff performer than Magic, Wilt and Bird?
I agree that Dirk was a basketball God to close games in this Finals.