Jerry Stackhouse for Beno Udrih?

[numnuts665]

http://mavsblog.dallasnews.com/archi....html#comments

Well, this would hurt the run for a star in 2010, but would help the team right now. Thoughts?

[Underdog]

I'd rather use Stack's contract as part of a larger deal, but I won't be unhappy if this goes through...

Udrih > JJB

[jthig32]

Um...HELL no.

HELL no.

Barea and Udrih are a lot more similar than you might think. Looking at PER and per/40 stats this season they're almost identical.

28 mil over the next four seasons for a backup PG that is marginally (at best) better than our current backup PG? Again...HELL no.

[Robillion]

That would be stupid on our part, and I doubt our FO is actually considering anything of the like with all their talk of paying attention to the payroll for 2010. If we are going after a backup point we should try to get Mike Conley or Felton still. Both with much more upside and better contracts for what we are planning.

[nikeball]

Originally Posted by jthig32

Barea and Udrih are a lot more similar than you might think. Looking at PER and per/40 stats this season they're almost identical.

I don't think we can look at PER in this case. Beno has played more minutes (diminishing returns) than JJB has. JJB's sample size is too small.

[grndmstr_c]

I'm with jthig on this one. Udrih is not worth screwing up cap room for. I'd rather ride the season out with no trades and then see what could be done with Stack's contract over the summer than use him in a deal that would actually hurt the team's chances long-term without providing any meaningful help in the short term.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by jthig32

28 mil over the next four seasons for a backup PG that is marginally (at best) better than our current backup PG? Again...HELL no.

I had no idea his contract was so inflated - definitely not worth the money to ride pine behind Kidd...

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by nikeball

I don't think we can look at PER in this case. Beno has played more minutes (diminishing returns) than JJB has. JJB's sample size is too small.

Barea's averaging 18 minutes a game. It's not ideal, but those amount of minutes are adequate to use in per/40 averages.

Udrih is a quality backup PG. As is JJB.

Salaries being equal I'd take Udrih. Giving up our only real trade asset for Udrih would be a horrendous move.

[SeriousSummer]

I think the Mavs would be better off going contrarian--take some long term deals as long as the talent was sufficient to make it worthwhile and let everyone else scramble after the 2010 free agents. Most of them won't move, and the ones that do will most likely go to New York or L.A. I would be amazed if Dallas could land a significant free agent in 2010.

I am not sure about Udrih, but he's 6'3" as compared to Barrea's 5'10" (?). That means he has at least the potential to be a full time starting point guard. I don't think JJ does.

[nikeball]

Originally Posted by jthig32

Barea's averaging 18 minutes a game. It's not ideal, but those amount of minutes are adequate to use in per/40 averages.

Udrih is a quality backup PG. As is JJB.

Salaries being equal I'd take Udrih. Giving up our only real trade asset for Udrih would be a horrendous move.

I agree. But he has a championship and has valuable playoff experience

Not getting anything for Stack would be a blunder..since so many GMs nowadays covet that expiring contract.

[SMC0007]

I find this trade hard to believe. Even our FO isn't going to pull a stunt like this.

[MavsWiLLHaVeRinGs]

Bill Ingram predicted this last offseason.

Ingram = genious.

All bad jokes aside, I agree this is not the right trade for us.

[Windmill360]

that contract is butt ugly.

[Kidd Karma]

No thanks. Doesn't upgrade us much this year and hurts our chances for in FA bidding 2010. Still waiting for Cuban to Gasol someone this winter and this is not it.

[purplefrog]

Say no to Beno. Here's another rumor that says the Thunder are interested in John Salmons and are offering the expiring contract of Joe Smith. Why not offer Stack for Salmons? Salmons could play SG and has a better contract. If the Kings don't like that one, then maybe you include Shawne Williams and do a Willams+Stack for Salmons and Beno.

http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archiv...d_in_salmons/#

[BGMaverick9]

the article made a good point that teams like NO and Orlando might make a strong push, especially Orlando. They need a STARTING point guard, so maybe Sacramento can get a better deal with more of what they're looking for.

The contract is pretty heavy on him so I don't think he fits into our plans very much. IMO, I'd be interested in either Garcia or Salmons.

[Kidd Karma]

Yea, either player would work. But not Udrih. I'd be more interested in moving JHo for Salmons and a protected lottery, then getting Mike Miller for Stack. So Miller-Salmons-Terry would be our rotation at the wing spot.

[grndmstr_c]

Not sure I see the point in trading Josh for Salmons. If you can get Miller for Stack, sure, that's a no-brainer, but stop there. That's a team you can roll with.

[BGMaverick9]

Stack for any working piece is an upgrade, you still have to be selective though. Beno's deal and his position/production factor doesn't suggest it's the BEST move to make for Stack.

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

Stack for any working piece is an upgrade, you still have to be selective though. Beno's deal and his position/production factor doesn't suggest it's the BEST move to make for Stack.

I don't agree. Moving Stack for any marginal player regardless of contract is not an upgrade.

It'd be better for the future of this team to waive Stack than to trade him for Beno Udrih.

[birdsanctuary]

Udrih is a very servicable point guard. I'd move Stack in a heartbeat, at least there would be some insurance in place if ever there is an injury at the point guard spot...

[craggmac]

Just Say No to white guys, man.
White guys that don't play for Utah, that is.

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by birdsanctuary

Udrih is a very servicable point guard. I'd move Stack in a heartbeat, at least there would be some insurance in place if ever there is an injury at the point guard spot...

Udrih is a serviceble backup PG.

As is Barea.

[wmbwinn]

Originally Posted by SeriousSummer

I think the Mavs would be better off going contrarian--take some long term deals as long as the talent was sufficient to make it worthwhile and let everyone else scramble after the 2010 free agents. Most of them won't move, and the ones that do will most likely go to New York or L.A. I would be amazed if Dallas could land a significant free agent in 2010.

I am not sure about Udrih, but he's 6'3" as compared to Barrea's 5'10" (?). That means he has at least the potential to be a full time starting point guard. I don't think JJ does.

Agreed that Udrih is more likely to be a starting PG at some point that Barrea. Would hope we can do better than either when JKidd is gone.

[wmbwinn]

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

Stack for any working piece is an upgrade, you still have to be selective though. Beno's deal and his position/production factor doesn't suggest it's the BEST move to make for Stack.

I think you said everything in a few words. Well said.
1)any one who can play is an upgrade
2)we can probably do better with the carrot of a large expiring contract

[BGMaverick9]

Originally Posted by jthig32

I don't agree. Moving Stack for any marginal player regardless of contract is not an upgrade.

It'd be better for the future of this team to waive Stack than to trade him for Beno Udrih.

I'm not sure if you read my comment correctly. Stack is basically isn't going to give you anything for the long haul, so getting something back with on-court value is going to be good. Just because that is the case doesn't mean you settle! There are some conditions that make it optimal for a Stack move, Beno doesn't really fit the bill. Beno is a player that helps BUT his contract and the fact he helps in a situation where he doesn't fill a major needs makes it not that great of a move. I think you can still get a guard player with a much friendlier contract (Have your cake and eat it too). Don't settle, you can do better than Beno.

Like I said, it's a move that can help, but it's not the greatest thing we could do in terms of value for Stack (price/length and the position). I'd wanna see a swing player come in place of him. For the pricetag, JJ does fine for the backup spot.

[grndmstr_c]

It cannot be stated too much that the fact that Stack's deal next season is only partially guaranteed means he will have greater value as a trade chip over the summer than he does this year, and hence his value has not yet hit its peak. Factor in that when the draft comes along the Mavs could very easily come to a prearranged deal to draft for another team and then trade that draft choice with Stack for a player more desirable than any they could get now, and it becomes clear that not only does his value increase over the summer, but the flexibility with which he can be packaged with more desirable assets (in terms of youth and potential, at least) increases as well.

Is it okay to trade Stack for a marginal contributor now? Absolutely, as long as that player's salary doesn't run past next year. Is it okay to trade him for a player whose contract runs past next year? Only if he's considerably better than Beno Udrih.

[BGMaverick9]

Originally Posted by grndmstr_c

It cannot be stated too much that the fact that Stack's deal next season is only partially guaranteed means he will have greater value as a trade chip over the summer than he does this year, and hence his value has not yet hit its peak. Factor in that when the draft comes along the Mavs could very easily come to a prearranged deal to draft for another team and then trade that draft choice with Stack for a player more desirable than any they could get now, and it becomes clear that not only does his value increase over the summer, but the flexibility with which he can be packaged with more desirable assets (in terms of youth and potential, at least) increases as well.

Is it okay to trade Stack for a marginal contributor now? Absolutely, as long as that player's salary doesn't run past next year. Is it okay to trade him for a player whose contract runs past next year? Only if he's considerably better than Beno Udrih.

That's true about his value not at it's peak yet. Very nice suggestion with that draft day idea...that's some creative thinking right there.

There is a value matrix that can easily be made for a deal that is ideal for Stack and I think you're second paragraph pretty much writes it out as clearly as can be.

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

I'm not sure if you read my comment correctly. Stack is basically isn't going to give you anything for the long haul, so getting something back with on-court value is going to be good. Just because that is the case doesn't mean you settle! There are some conditions that make it optimal for a Stack move, Beno doesn't really fit the bill. Beno is a player that helps BUT his contract and the fact he helps in a situation where he doesn't fill a major needs makes it not that great of a move. I think you can still get a guard player with a much friendlier contract (Have your cake and eat it too). Don't settle, you can do better than Beno.

Like I said, it's a move that can help, but it's not the greatest thing we could do in terms of value for Stack (price/length and the position). I'd wanna see a swing player come in place of him. For the pricetag, JJ does fine for the backup spot.

I got what you were saying, I just think you undersell how bad Udrih's contract is when you say that it would be a wastge of Stack as an asset.

I wouldn't take on Udrih and his salary for free.

Overall I agree with your sentiment, I jut have an even stronger negative feeling on Udrih.

[BGMaverick9]

Originally Posted by jthig32

I got what you were saying, I just think you undersell how bad Udrih's contract is when you say that it would be a wastge of Stack as an asset.

I wouldn't take on Udrih and his salary for free.

Overall I agree with your sentiment, I jut have an even stronger negative feeling on Udrih.

That IS a pretty strong sentiment for Udrih.

[Dirkgreatness]

No thanks to Beno and his contract. He's waaaay overpaid for a backup PG.

[Thomas86]

Beno would be a insurance policy just incase we can't resign Kidd in the offseason and I would feel better with Beno as the starter then JJ.....I want the Mavs to try to go after Raymond Felton.

[Dirkgreatness]

If you're worried about replacing Kidd incase he walks this is a list of unrestricted and restricted free agents with can maybe get. BTW all these guys would be better than having an overpaid Beno.

Andre Miller
Raymond Felton
Ramon Sessions
Jarrett Jack
Mike Bibby
Bobby Jackson

[BGMaverick9]

Originally Posted by Dirkgreatness

If you're worried about replacing Kidd incase he walks this is a list of unrestricted and restricted free agents with can maybe get. BTW all these guys would be better than having an overpaid Beno.

Andre Miller
Raymond Felton
Ramon Sessions
Jarrett Jack
Mike Bibby
Bobby Jackson

I would say all but Miller and Bibby could be possibly to an extent with Stack and maybe something else.

[mac222b]

Originally Posted by Dirkgreatness

If you're worried about replacing Kidd incase he walks this is a list of unrestricted and restricted free agents with can maybe get. BTW all these guys would be better than having an overpaid Beno.

Andre Miller
Raymond Felton
Ramon Sessions
Jarrett Jack
Mike Bibby
Bobby Jackson

Right on man

[DLord]

Udrih for Stackhouse? No thanks.
Udrih for Carroll? Yes.

[dalmations202]

Originally Posted by DLord

Udrih for Stackhouse? No thanks.
Udrih for Carroll? Yes.

Agreed