Fortson Breaks Zarko's Wrist.... - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

MightyToine · 11-27-2003, 12:22 AM

http://boards.espn.go.com/cgi/nba/re..._pho&id=131150

Looks like Danny-boy may get his ass suspended to top this shitty night all off....

AdamAMMP · 11-27-2003, 01:02 AM

OUCH!! I'm glad I missed the game. Did Fort do it on purpose?

sike · 11-27-2003, 01:08 AM

oh yeah...he was frustrated...and was sick of gettng played!.....at least someone stood out!

V · 11-27-2003, 01:11 AM

Suns' Rookie Cabarkapa Breaks Wrist
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Associated Press

PHOENIX -- Phoenix rookie Zarko Cabarkapa broke his right wrist Wednesday night after he was pushed by Dallas' Danny Fortson while driving to the basket with less than three minutes remaining in the Suns' 121-90 victory.

The Serbian forward is expected to be sidelined six to eight weeks.

Fortson was called for a flagrant foul on the play, and Suns owner Jerry Colangelo said he will ask the NBA to fine or suspend the Dallas player.

"Whether it's a fine or a suspension, it's not enough for him," Colangelo said. "He should be put down for every day that he (Cabarkapa) is out. I'll do everything in my power to see that happens. With the game over, there was no need for that."

The injury came with 2:58 left and the Suns leading 112-88.

"He's a thug," Colangelo said.

Before leaving, Fortson said he apologized to Cabarkapa.

"I had no evil intent," he said.

Cabarkapa was in tears in the Suns' dressing room, but later composed himself and said through a translator, "I can't comprehend it. I don't know exactly what happened. I just know I was trying to drive to the basket and Fortson pushed me."

AdamAMMP · 11-27-2003, 01:12 AM

that kind of crap doesn't belong in the NBA.

MavsFanFinley · 11-27-2003, 01:14 AM

Damn.

You can bet Fortson will be suspended for 2 games, at least. From what I'm reading, Fortson really took a cheap shot at him. And that's from a lot of Mavs fans too.

ReDIRKulous · 11-27-2003, 01:17 AM

Was it any different than the cheap shot KG took at Dirk that time when he clocked him in the head while he was going for a dunk?

Did KG get suspended? Dirk didn't miss any time but he easily could have if things went slightly different.

senorfrog · 11-27-2003, 01:19 AM

Danny, the ass, with zero class. I understand the frustration, but this puts the organization in poor light. He needs to get the maximum punishment, IMO.

sike · 11-27-2003, 01:21 AM

the thin line between toughness and a dirty play.......where is the line drawn in heat of a game.....Dont burry fortson just yet....you'll love that toughness later on.....

u2sarajevo · 11-27-2003, 01:23 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by: ReDIRKulous
Was it any different than the cheap shot KG took at Dirk that time when he clocked him in the head while he was going for a dunk?

Did KG get suspended? Dirk didn't miss any time but he easily could have if things went slightly different.

Probably not.... but in this league the stars get protected. Fortson is not a star.

Stick him in the potato sack for a couple of games.

AdamAMMP · 11-27-2003, 01:27 AM

Colangelo said. "He should be put down for every day that he (Cabarkapa) is out. I'll do everything in my power to see that happens."

The Mavs are done if this happens.

V · 11-27-2003, 01:27 AM

Zarko was driving for a layup & Fortson shoved him in the ribs sending him to the floor near the stansion.

It looked like he fell on an outstretched hand which typically breaks the scaphoid bone (also called the navicular bone) in his wrist. He'll be out for a while... and I suspect Forston will be suspended.

... By my count that leaves Nelly with one healthy Center on his roster.

u2sarajevo · 11-27-2003, 01:29 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by: AdamAMMP
Colangelo said. "He should be put down for every day that he (Cabarkapa) is out. I'll do everything in my power to see that happens."

The Mavs are done if this happens.

I wouldn't expect to see him say anything other than that. I don't think a 6-8 week game suspension will be handed down. I'm not sure what the precedent for flagrant fouls that knock a player out is... but I am reasonably certain it will be at least 2 games. Probably more.

Anyone have a clue as to the length we can expect to see of the Potato suspension?

MavsFanFinley · 11-27-2003, 01:31 AM

Quote:

Was it any different than the cheap shot KG took at Dirk that time when he clocked him in the head while he was going for a dunk?

Did KG get suspended? Dirk didn't miss any time but he easily could have if things went slightly different.

What's different?

KG actually went for the ball. He also happened to hit Dirk hard, but at least he went for the ball.

Fortson didn't make an attempt for the ball. He probably didn't intend to hurt Zarko, but he made no attempt for the ball. He shoved him in the air.

ReDIRKulous · 11-27-2003, 01:34 AM

Quote:

What's different?

KG actually went for the ball. He also happened to hit Dirk hard, but at least he went for the ball.

Fortson didn't make an attempt for the ball. He probably didn't intend to hurt Zarko, but he made no attempt for the ball. He shoved him in the air.

I saw the play... at least both Fin and I knew KG wasn't going for the ball.

ReDIRKulous · 11-27-2003, 01:55 AM

Was the officiating partially to blame for this?

I didn't see the game... but I know that the MAvs get absolutely screwed by the officials on a nightly basis. I am not saying that is an excuse for what Fortson did... but the NBA has just as much a responsibility as our players to prevent these kinds of incidents. It was a miracle someone from the Mavs never got frustrated before. Maybe if they had gotten frustrated about the officiating and done what Fortson did before the bad officiating would have ended long ago... or the Mavs would have imploded from it... which might be happening before our very eyes right now. Remember what that official said to one of the MAvs players a couple games ago... "just wait".

V · 11-27-2003, 02:07 AM

No, this had nothing to do with the officiating.

Fortson was out of position & he just way-layed the driving Zarko.

Others may have a different opinion but I thought the officiating was fine. Sure, we saw Nash whine about some calls but the Mavs were thoughly outplayed on both ends... and he was probably just frustrated because they couldn't figure out the Suns' 2-3 zone.

Evilmav2 · 11-27-2003, 02:12 AM

I would expect that Danny recieves a three game suspension for this. Aside from Colangelo's bitter polemics about the matter, the actual play did not look overly malicious to me. The foul was obviously unnecesary, but I really don't think that Fortson meant to do anything other than give a hard foul to discourage the Suns (who were still playing their first team against our scrubs at that time) from show-timing and running up the score any more.

I think the results of the foul are unfortunate, but I understand why Fortson probably made it. The Suns were still playing all out after we had waived the white flag, and if some guy wants to come up and dunk or finger roll on you when they are already up by 30 or so points and the game is over, then that same guy shouldn't be crying in the locker room after he was hard fouled in that attempt. That is to say, that if another teams players try to have fun when the outcome of the game has already been determined, they shouldn't be surprised when the pride-hurt losers throw some cheap shots to stop the fun.

As I said, I think that Fortson's foul was very hard and the results of it were unfortunate, but I for one, will not condemn him for making it.

4cwebb · 11-27-2003, 02:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by: Evilmav2
I would expect that Danny recieves a three game suspension for this. Aside from Colangelo's bitter polemics about the matter, the actual play did not look overly malicious to me. The foul was obviously unnecesary, but I really don't think that Fortson meant to do anything other than give a hard foul to discourage the Suns (who were still playing their first team against our scrubs at that time) from show-timing and running up the score any more.

I think the results of the foul are unfortunate, but I understand why Fortson probably made it. The Suns were still playing all out after we had waived the white flag, and if some guy wants to come up and dunk or finger roll on you when they are already up by 30 or so points and the game is over, then that same guy shouldn't be crying in the locker room after he was hard fouled in that attempt. That is to say, that if another teams players try to have fun when the outcome of the game has already been determined, they shouldn't be surprised when the pride-hurt losers throw some cheap shots to stop the fun.

As I said, I think that Fortson's foul was very hard and the results of it were unfortunate, but I for one, will not condemn him for making it.

This is the first response on this forum which has disappointed me (not that I expect Mavs' fans to care). Actually, I was pleasantly surprised to read the majority of the responses calling Fortson out for his ridiculous action.

Granted, if this were Tony Massenburg (to name the only Kings' thug), I might feel a bit differently, but I don't think so in this instance. The Suns were playing on their homecourt, and, despite the notion that the Mavs' had waved a white flag, it didn't sound to me as if some of the Mavs' players who normally don't get too many minutes were letting up (Daniels, Howard, etc.). Cabarkapa normally is not a starter, but started tonight due to Marion's injury. Playing on your home floor, it's not out of the ordinary to give the fans something to cheer about, even in blowouts. If Fortson had a play on the ball, or any shot to prevent himself from being posterized other than a push to his opponent's stomach, his actions may be justifiable. Or, if the Suns were running the Mavs off the AAC floor, that might be another instance in which his conduct could be defended.

But in this instance, it's entirely too late to point to pride or effort. The Mavs were down 20. One dunk doesn't change the flow or outcome of the game. One cheap shot changed this player's fortunes. I'd like to see a 6 week suspension, even if it won't happen. There is no call for this type of foul in this instance, and I'd like to see the league react accordingly.

As for KG's swipe at Dirk's head, I can't say that I saw the play. But, I can't imagine that it was as egregious as this play, and if it was, then KG should have been suspended as well. And the fact that Dirk didn't get injured would mitigate the length of his suspension.

For Fortson to tell the public that he had no evil intentions in shoving a player out of midair is laughable, and if he isn't served with a five-game suspension, it will be an injustice in my book.

Finally, I don't see that losing Fortson for any length of time really injures the Mavs. His offensive play has been inconsistent at best, and his defensive play hasn't been terribly consistent, either.

Fah Q · 11-27-2003, 03:04 AM

I for one am on Evil's side on this. Fortson IMO did what was necessary. I really liked the way Fortson fouled with hard contact on other plays, but this one unfortunatley injured Zarko. It is always repeated that you make a person earn their points and that is what Fortson intended to do. He wasn't trying to hurt Zarko, and for those who watched the game, did anyone notice that Fortson went to Zarko right after the play to see if he was alright. From that moment on you could tell that injuring another player was not his intention.

madape · 11-27-2003, 03:30 AM

This is not the behavior of a championship team. Fortson has disgraced this franchise. His actions were inexcusable. The Maverics are a team built on skill, not thuggery. Fortson is a low class payer. I'm ashamed he's a Mav. I would not only suspend him, but waive him. There is no room for this kind of crap on my favorite team. I'm embarassed.

Fah Q · 11-27-2003, 03:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by: madape
This is not the behavior of a championship team. Fortson has disgraced this franchise. His actions were inexcusable. The Maverics are a team built on skill, not thuggery. Fortson is a low class payer. I'm ashamed he's a Mav. I would not only suspend him, but waive him. There is no room for this kind of crap on my favorite team. I'm embarassed.

Come on don't be so hard on the guy, he was out of position and when he turned around Zarko was already in the air, so he did the first thing that he could and that was to put his arms out to stop the easy bucket. I'm not saying that it was the smartest play but you can tell that it was not his intention to injure Zarko.

madape · 11-27-2003, 03:42 AM

Zarko is a promising young player who was cut down by a thug. You tell me what's fair.

EricaLubarsky · 11-27-2003, 03:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by: AdamAMMP
Colangelo said. "He should be put down for every day that he (Cabarkapa) is out. I'll do everything in my power to see that happens."

The Mavs are done if this happens.

The Mavs may need to fill their 15th spot if that happens and I will for one be glad. Nowitzki doesnt seem like he can stand for more than 100 minutes straight on the hardwood (not to mention he's not a center) and Fortson was never a solution to our problems at Center- only a patch. Bradley is great in many circumstances but he can't do it alone.

I was in a position to see this game tonight through a loophole (by finding someone who got Fox Sports AZ) but they blacked it out because they didnt fill more than half their seats or something. Im kind of glad the Suns organization was dishonest and decided to pull the game last minute. It sounded really ugly.

EricaLubarsky · 11-27-2003, 04:02 AM

If the foul was intentional but the harm was not he should spend some time on the bench but he should be welcomed back to the team.

If, however the foul and damage were intentional he should be immediately put on the IL never to play again. Nellie should make sure that he knew that he wasnt welcome back

It is truly sad when the "soft" or "finesse" label has gotten so bad that someone would defend Fortson's actions as defending our toughness.

Evilmav2 · 11-27-2003, 04:16 AM

Fortson didn't mean to hurt anyone. He reached out, while out of position, to try to stop a dunk/layup and he ended up being too strong for his own good. I feel bad about what happened to the Chupacabra, but after watching the play numerous times, I am convinced that Fortson was not acting maliciously.

He deserves to be suspended for a couple of games, but considering the fact that he could have done even worse damage to Zarko, and he immediately looked concerned and went over to try to help him up after the hard foul, I think it is absurd to argue that Colangelo or anybody else is right in wanting him to be suspended for six weeks or be drummed off of the team.

The incident was greatly unfortunate, but I just don't believe that Dan meant to really hurt Mr. Zarko, and thus I don't think he deserves any greater punishment than other flagrant foulers have recieved for their transgressions over the last couple of years (2-3 games of suspension is my prediction, even after Colangelo uses all of his "power").

Peja_owns · 11-27-2003, 04:22 AM

Very disappointing foul by fortson.

jmiles65 · 11-27-2003, 04:57 AM

Very disappointed in Forston.
If he doesn't get suspended by the league office, I would hope Cuban and Nellie would take some sort of action...

No room for that in the NBA, and certainly no room for it on the Dallas Mavericks.

mary · 11-27-2003, 05:28 AM

Clearly Fortson was sorry he did it as soon as it happened. Now whether or not he was sorry for Zarko's sake or his own, who knows. I like to see toughness on the team and I don't normally mind flagrant fouls as long as they are retaliatory. But shoving someone while they're in the air is WAY OVER THE LINE. Sure things would've been better if Zarko wouldn't have fell on his wrist, but he did.

Fortson fully deserves a fine and a suspension.

mary · 11-27-2003, 05:38 AM

Suns lose rookie in victory over Mavs
By Craig Morgan, Tribune
PHOENIX — Where there should have been celebration, instead there was anger.
Where there should have been a young player exulting in his first professional start, instead there were tears.

The final box will show the Suns rebounded convincingly from Tuesday's debacle in Denver by throttling the Dallas Mavericks 121-90 Wednesday at America West Arena.

But one play changed the satisfaction of a near-perfect game into sorrow.
Suns rookie Zarko Cabarkapa will miss the next six to eight weeks with a broken right wrist after Mavericks center Danny Fortson shoved him on a drive to the basket late in the game.

Cabarkapa landed awkwardly and broke his fall with his right wrist.
The incident had the Suns' executives, coaches and players seething.

“I want to go after his jugular," said Suns chairman Jerry Colangelo, who vowed to pursue the matter tirelessly with the league office. “He's a thug and he always has been. Whatever the fine and suspension is, it's not going to be enough for me. He should be out every bit as long as the kid is out. I'll do everything in my power to see to it that he gets that kind of fine and suspension."

A teary-eyed Cabarkapa was unable to address the media immediately after a game in which he scored 17 points and grabbed nine rebounds in place of the injured Shawn Marion. He emerged from the locker room later to say simply: “There are some things you can never expect."

Cabarkapa declined to speculate on whether Fortson's shove was a dirty play, but guard Stephon Marbury was not as diplomatic.

“Hell, yeah that (expletive) was intentional. It was a (expletive) play," Marbury said. “The league talks about making statements all the time for this kind of thing," Suns general manager Bryan Colangelo said. “This is a statement that has to be made." The Suns certainly made a statement of their own Wednesday. In beating the Mavericks by 31 one night after losing by 30, Phoenix broke a franchise record for biggest point differential in two games (61).

“I think everybody couldn't sleep last night over that (Denver) game," said center Jahidi White, who was a one-man wrecking crew on the glass with 11-first-half rebounds and 12 points. “Because of that lack of energy from last night, the mistakes and the lack of defense, we brought extra tonight."

kg_veteran · 11-27-2003, 09:31 AM

Evil's right on this one. Just about everyone complaining about Fortson here didn't watch the game.

The foul wasn't malicious. It was more a product of frustration and Fortson not being quick enough to get in position to give a hard foul and catch the man. Did you see any Suns getting in Fortson's face or getting upset? Hardly. The players knew it wasn't intentional. Coangelo is just reacting this way because he has to. If it were Nash or Finley or even Josh Howard (knock on wood) who had just broken their wrists, Cuban would probably react the same way.

I think Fortson should be suspended for a couple of games, because they need to discourage those types of fouls (out of position, no play for the ball, etc). But 6-8 week suspension? Come on. They don't give those for punching fans. They're not gonna give that for a play during the game, no matter how severe.

Simon2 · 11-27-2003, 10:04 AM

First of all, the hand broke when the guy landed and not when Fortson hit him. The broken hand was a result of landing improperly. In my opinion, it was a nice hard foul. If you think about it, Dirk turned his ankle when he landed but was anyone thrown out? Danny just wanted to stop the guy from a layup. If he isn't tough enough to take a foul, then he shouldn't be in there anyway. I kinda wish it was on one of their superstars, did you still see them out there with the game out of hand? I think Amare was the last to go. Nellie always makes it a point to remove his stars during a blowout. Last night, Marbury was still in the game against Daniels and Howard. What was that?

Bookit · 11-27-2003, 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by: Simon2
First of all, the hand broke when the guy landed and not when Fortson hit him. The broken hand was a result of landing improperly. In my opinion, it was a nice hard foul. If you think about it, Dirk turned his ankle when he landed but was anyone thrown out? Danny just wanted to stop the guy from a layup. If he isn't tough enough to take a foul, then he shouldn't be in there anyway. I kinda wish it was on one of their superstars, did you still see them out there with the game out of hand? I think Amare was the last to go. Nellie always makes it a point to remove his stars during a blowout. Last night, Marbury was still in the game against Daniels and Howard. What was that?

LOL. Very funny post.

MavsFanFinley · 11-27-2003, 10:36 AM

I wonder if those that think it was a good hard foul would feel the same way if it was Googs that had done that to one of the big 5 or Howard or Daniels?

kg_veteran · 11-27-2003, 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by: MavsFanFinley
I wonder if those that think it was a good hard foul would feel the same way if it was Googs that had done that to one of the big 5 or Howard or Daniels?

I agree, MFF. It wasn't a "good hard foul." It merits punishment. It just wasn't as malicious as it's being made out to be.

And Simon, I also wondered why Marbury, Stoudemire and Joe Johnson were on the floor virtually to the end. That wasn't very classy by Frank Johnson, but then again, he's the one running the risk there. If one of them does get hurt in such a scenario, he has only himself to blame.

sike · 11-27-2003, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by: MavsFanFinley
I wonder if those that think it was a good hard foul would feel the same way if it was Googs that had done that to one of the big 5 or Howard or Daniels?

is anyone say it was in anyway good??? I think what many are saying is that it was not an evil play...no intent to harm....not a good play, but we've seen worse.....not a smart play, but we've seen dumber!...he'll get his couple games and the rest of you should let it go....Fortson is not the antichrist, just a player who made a bad split decision in the moment of a play....which he'll pay for...let the rest alone!

Chiwas · 11-27-2003, 11:52 AM

Evidently Fortson is too strong to make those kind of plays. If Bradley or other had made it, the player probably would still have made the basket and wouldn't fall down at all.

However, it happened and Fortson deserves a substancial punishment. He mustn't do it again.

In the moment it happened, I pictured an Indiana-Mavs team that I didn't like a bit.

MightyToine · 11-27-2003, 01:04 PM

Quote:

Colangelo said. "He should be put down for every day that he (Cabarkapa) is out. I'll do everything in my power to see that happens."

The Mavs are done if this happens.

Oh please....

What the hell is Fatass Colangelo going to do? He has ZERO power to do ANYTHING. It's in the League's hands now. He can cry and whine about anything he wants but the final decision will come from the League Office. And if they feel it only warrants a 2-game suspension, then that's what it's going to be.

That said, I wonder what Walker thinks of his "friend" doing what he did? Not too good...

grndmstr_c · 11-27-2003, 01:33 PM

I had turned the game off in the third quarter so I didn't see it happen live, but on the replays that didn't at all look to me like a deliberate attempt to injure Zarko. Danny should be fined and suspended for it, and the severity of his punishment should match whatever the NBA typically imposes in incidents of this sort, which I'm guessing will be a 2-3 game suspension and a pretty hefty fine (not by any means does he deserve to be punished as harshly as Colangelo has suggested).

dallas_esq · 11-27-2003, 01:54 PM

y favorite comment on this thread, in response to the quesion, did he do it on purpose?

Quote:

Originally posted by: sike
oh yeah...he was frustrated...and was sick of gettng played!.....at least someone stood out!

This is apparently the axis of the debate here. I would like to see it let go by everybody without a doubt. It's just better for the team. But there seems to at least be a question as to whether he acted intentionally. But I don't think anyone thinks his intent rose to the level of intent to do injury. Except maybe the always emotional Madape.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img] This kind of "thug" play is what we may need on an occasion. It is certainly not to be glorified, but maybe it can be utilized?