Can Janett and dude still vote for their beloved party candidates? A flip-flop thread

[Arne]

Let's make a list about America's next flip-flop presidents best principled standings on issues.

I'm gonna start with a Boston Globe article on both of them...

Obama and McCain - flip-flop, flip-flop
Globe Columnist / June 22, 2008

THERE IS no "straight talk." There isn't "a different kind of politics." There are just two men who really want to be president.

In their zeal to win the White House, Barack Obama and John McCain already own enough flip-flops to hang out comfortably in Jimmy Buffett's "Margaritaville," right next to John Kerry and Mitt Romney.

Obama, a longtime advocate for public financing, just announced that he would opt out of the public financing system for the general election. In a statement of breathtaking chutzpah, Obama blamed his decision on Republicans. Meanwhile, he's the one with the fund-raising advantage, including pivotal backing from MoveOn.org, which isn't bound by public spending limits and is already running an anti-McCain ad.

The Democrat who promises change is demonstrating the capacity to embrace an age-old political premise: cave, when necessary.

Obama did it most famously with the Rev. Jeremiah Wright. He was against cutting the controversial minister loose until he was for it. He was also against wearing a flag pin as a knee-jerk symbol of patriotism until he put one on as a knee-jerk symbol of patriotism.

Striking at the heart of Obama's message of inclusion, campaign volunteers last week barred two Muslim women from sitting behind the podium at an Obama rally in Detroit. They apparently wanted to prevent the women's headscarves from appearing in photographs with the candidate.The campaign apologized for the volunteers' actions, saying "This is of course not the policy of the campaign. It is offensive and counter to Obama's commitment to bring Americans together."

On foreign policy, Obama went from stating that he would meet, without preconditions, with the president of Iran, to saying he would meet "with the appropriate Iranian leaders at a time and place of my choosing - if and only if - it can advance the interests of the United States."

On personnel, Obama put James A. Johnson, chairman of the Federal National Mortgage Association, in charge of vetting potential running mates. Then he quickly dropped him in the aftermath of news reports that Johnson received favorable deals on loans from the same mortgage lender that Obama criticized.

For Obama, it all adds up to politics as very usual. But, McCain's flip-flops represent an even bigger affront to the straight talk he promises voters.

As a presidential candidate, McCain now opposes his own immigration plan. He backs the Bush tax cuts he once opposed with contempt. While McCain presents himself as a maverick feared by lobbyists and special interests, his campaign has many ties to both and includes staffers who were once lobbyists.

Last week, the Republican called for lifting the moratorium on offshore drilling, a dramatic contrast with his strong support for upholding the moratorium during his 2000 bid for the Republican nomination.

A former prisoner of war, who suffered torture in Vietnam, McCain has called for the US detention center in Guantanamo Bay to be closed and for torture to be banned. Last week, he criticized the US Supreme Court for "one of the worst decisions in the history of this country" after the court ruled that detainees should be allowed to challenge their detentions in US courts.

McCain has also been trying to distance himself even further from an earlier comment that it "would be fine with me" if the US military stayed in Iraq "for a hundred years," a remark he qualified at the time with the condition that Americans were not being injured or killed.

Meanwhile, McCain is blasting Obama for opting out of public financing. But as Media Matters for America reports, McCain is being asked by federal elections officials to show that he did not use the promise of public money to obtain a $4 million loan to kickstart his once faltering presidential campaign. Doing so would be disingenuous from a candidate who is routinely described as a champion of campaign finance reform.

Perhaps its best to get past the marketing slogans, sooner rather that later. Let voters strip illusion from reality in this campaign.

As they are swiftly finding out, principle is the first casualty in the war to be president.

Joan Vennochi can be reached at vennochi@globe.com.

© Copyright 2008 Globe Newspaper Company.
http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/ed...lop_flip_flop/

[Arne]

McCain on Affirmative Action:
Flip: In 1998, the state legislature of McCain's home state of Arizona considered sending the voters a measure to end affirmative action, McCain spoke out against the measure calling it "divisive." Ten years later, Arizona Republicans are still trying to get the measure on the state ballot.

Flop: During his interview on the 7/26 edition of ABC's "This Week" (advance video to very end for his response), when asked specifically about the Arizona proposal, McCain stated that he "supports" the referendum to end affirmative action in the state of Arizona. He made the assertion in response to his "opposition to gay adoption", in which he implied that it was preferable for children to remain in orphanages rather than be adopted by a carefully screened gay couple.

McCain on Raising Taxes:
Flip: Senator McCain has repeatedly attacked Senator Obama on the issue of taxes, in one appearance saying (quote):
McCain: "The choice in this election is stark & simple. Senator Obama will raise your taxes; I won't."

Flop: During his interview on ABC's This Week, Senator McCain said that the possibility of raising taxes "to save Social Security" is an option he's willing to consider:
George S: "Is [sic] payroll tax increases on the table as well?"

McCain: "There’s nothing that’s off the table. I have my positions and I will articulate them, but nothing is off the table."

Flip-Flop: After angering the powerful Conservative group "Club for Growth", Senator McCain immediately recanted his assertion that he's willing to raise taxes to save Social Security.

(Editors Note: This is the fourth flip-flop/gaffe I have had to document in just the past 12 hours, three of them coming from the ABC "This Week" interview alone. Keeping up with "Senator Gaffe-machine" is shaping up to be a full-time job.)

McCain on his support for "MLK Day":
Flip: When answering questions following a speech he gave in Panama City, FL, Senator McCain answered a question regarding his support for African-Americans by stating:
"...I'm proud of that record... from fighting for the recognition of Doctor Martin Luther King's birthday in my state, to sponsoring specific legislation that would prevent discrimination..."

Flop: Senator McCain appears to have forgotten that he fought against making Dr. King's birthday a Federal holiday, not once but three times (follow link for details).

(Editor's Note: It was only this past April, on the 40th anniversary of Dr. King's assassination, that McCain found himself in the uncomfortable position of trying to explain why he repeatedly voted against the bill for a National holiday in King's name, so it's not like how he voted at the time wasn't fresh in his memory.)

McCain on public speaking outside the U.S. during the campaign:
Flip: Immediately following Senator Obama's speech before 200,000 cheering Berliners in Germany, Senator McCain criticized his opponent:
“I would rather speak at a rally or a political gathering any place outside of the country after I am president of the United States,” McCain told O’Donnell. “But that’s a judgment that Sen. Obama and the American people will make.”

Flop: Senator McCain forgets that just one month earlier on January 20th, he gave a speech paid for by his own campaign in neighboring Canada:
"McCain himself gave a speech in Canada — to the Economic Club of Canada — in which he applauded NAFTA’s successes. An implicit message behind that speech was that Obama had been critical of the trade accord."

NBC's Andrea Mitchell reported that McCain is criticizing Obama for "being overseas while voters are struggling at home" despite the fact Senator McCain himself just returned from campaign visits to both Mexico and Columbia earlier the same month.

McCain on Which came 1st? The Surge or the Awakening?:
Gaffe: During an interview with CBS News' Katie Couric, Senator McCain was asked what he thought about Senator Obama's comment that the decline in violence in Iraq might very well be attributable to a number of other occurrences in Iraq, such as the "Sunni Awakening". Senator McCain scoffed at the notion, claiming the "Surge" was responsible for all those events, including the "Sunni Awakening":
"Couric QUESTION #3: Senator McCain, Sen. Obama says, while the increased number of U.S. troops contributed to increased security in Iraq, he also credits the Sunni awakening and the Shiite government going after militias. And says that there might have been improved security even without the surge. What’s your response to that?"

McCain (edited portion): "I don’t know how you respond to something that is such a false depiction of what actually happened. Colonel McFarlane (phonetic) was contacted by one of the major Sunni sheiks. Because of the surge we were able to go out and protect that sheik and others." (the full response can be seen in the linked video.)

Problem is, ALL of those events occurred BEFORE the Surge, not after.

In a highly controversial move, CBS broadcast McCain's comment with the preceding gaffe edited out and the enclosing comments spliced together to make it appear the gaffe never happened.

McCain on Shifting troops from Iraq to Afghanistan:
Flip: In response to Senator Obama calling "Afghanistan, not Iraq" as "the central front front on the War on Terror" requiring a redeployment of U.S. troops from Iraq to Afghanistan, Senator McCain balked at the idea, citing both General David Petraeus and "al Qaeda" as calling "Iraq, not Afghanistan" the "central front of the war on terror", and that America should focus on finishing the war in Iraq before diverting attention to Afghanistan.

Flop: Following reports of a sharp rise in U.S. troop casualties and a resurgent Taliban in Afghanistan, and the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Admiral Mike Mullen stating that he "needs three additional brigades in Afghanistan", Senator McCain changed his position on diverting U.S. forces from Iraq to Afghanistan. McCain's website now says, the Arizona Republican wants "at least three additional brigades" for the fight in Afghanistan.

McCain on Economic Psychology:
Flip: Following criticism of his Chief Economic Advisor, former Texas Senator Phil Gramm, who described the prevailing economic mood of the country as a "mental recession" rather than based on any valid reason for displeasure with the U.S. economy, followed by calling most Americans "a nation of whiners", Senator McCain disavowed Senator Gramm's remarks and accepted Gramm's resignation as an advisor to his campaign.

Flop: However, several videos of Senator McCain soon surfaced where he too referred to the current economic mood as being based more on "psychology" than the actual state of the economy.

McCain on Equal Pay for Women:
Flip: Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) participated in a town hall meeting in Wisconsin. During the discussion, he claimed that he is a strong supporter of equal pay for women and other workers:
"We haven’t done enough. We have not done enough. And I’m committed to making sure that there’s equal pay for equal work. That there is equal opportunity in every aspect of our society. And that is my record and you can count on it." - (video)

Flop: In April, McCain skipped the vote on the Ledbetter Fair Pay Act, which would have rectified the Supreme Court decision in Ledbetter v. Goodyear “that made it much harder for women and other workers to pursue pay discrimination claims.”
In fact, on that very same day, McCain said that if he had been in the Senate, he would have voted against it because the bill “opens us up to lawsuits for all kinds of problems.” He also dismissed the importance of equal pay, saying that women simply need “education and training“:

“They need the education and training, particularly since more and more women are heads of their households, as much or more than anybody else,” McCain said. “And it’s hard for them to leave their families when they don’t have somebody to take care of them.

The issue is not “education and training.” When denied equal pay by her supervisor, Lilly Ledbetter was doing the exact same job as her male counterparts and received numerous performance-based awards.

As [ThinkProgress'] Wonk Room notes, in 2000, McCain also opposed an amendment aimed at providing “more effective remedies to victims of discrimination in the payment of wages on the basis of sex.” In 1985, McCain voted against a study to investigate pay differences among federal employees and determine whether they were the result of discrimination.
In May, McCain told a 14-year-old girl that equal pay and legislation such as Ledbetter bill don’t do “anything to help the rights of women.” McCain, however, is no expert on women’s issues. He has earned a 0 percent rating from NARAL ProChoice America six years in a row, from 2001-2007.

McCain on criticizing others for missing Senate votes:
Gaffe: Following Iran’s missile tests this week, Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) slammed Sen. Barack Obama’s (D-IL) position on the Iranian Revolutionary Guard, declaring, “This is the same organization that I voted to condemn as a terrorist organization when an amendment was on the floor of the United States Senate. Senator Obama refused to vote.” CNN’s Political Ticker notes a flaw with McCain’s attack:
The problem with the critique? McCain also missed that vote on the Kyl-Lieberman amendment on September 26, 2007. Records show that Obama was in New Hampshire and McCain was in New York instead of being in the Senate chamber for the vote in question.

Indeed, McCain — the most absent Senator — has missed more than 60 percent of the votes in the 110th Congress.

McCain on his POW torture story:
Gaffe: In McCain’s best-selling 1999 memoir “Faith of My Fathers”, McCain writes:
"Once my condition had stabilized, my interrogators resumed their work. Demands for military information were accompanied by threats to terminate my medical treatment if I did not cooperate. Eventually, I gave them my ship’s name and squadron number, and confirmed that my target had been the power plant. Pressed for more useful information, I gave the names of the Green Bay Packers offensive line, and said they were members of my squadron. When asked to identify future targets, I simply recited the names of a number of North Vietnamese cities that had already been bombed." - ABC News

While visiting Pittsburgh, John McCain said that while he was captured, he really loved the Steelers, and it was their names that he gave up to Viet-Cong interrogators (video)

McCain on "Economists":
Flip: During a June 12th Town Hall in New Hampshire:

"If you want to call it [his proposal to temporarily suspend the gas tax, decried by most economists] a gimmick, fine. You know the economists? They’re the same ones that didn’t predict this housing crisis we’re in." [video]

Senior Advisor Carly Fiorina: During an appearance on ABC’s This Week, Fiorina “scoffed at the lack of support from economic analysts” for McCain’s proposed gas-tax holiday, “‘I don’t think it matters,’ she said.”

Senior Advisor Douglas Holtz-Eaken: “You can stack all the economists end to end and still not find common sense.”

Flop: The McCain campaign is announcing that the Senator's economic plan has been endorsed by some 300 economists:

"U.S. Senator John McCain’s presidential campaign today released a statement signed by over 300 professional economists in support of John McCain’s Jobs for America economic plan. The list includes Nobel Prize winners, business economists with experience in the private sector, policy economists with experience in government and academic economists from major universities and state and community colleges."

Not mentioned in the announcement is that two key factors in the McCain economic plan... his 'gas tax holiday' and promise to 'balance the budget by 2013"... were not included in the proposal given to the economists.

(UPDATE: Many of McCain’s 300 economists ‘don’t actually support’ his full economic agenda. "One economist even said he was supporting Obama." - ThinkProgress)

McCain on criticizing those who say "Military service not a requirement to be CIC":
Flip: The McCain campaign, responding to Fmr. General Wesley Clark's suggestion that "[I don't think] getting shot down is a qualification to be President" after extensive mention of his respect for McCain's service, even calling McCain "a hero", issued the following statement:
The American people know that John McCain’s record of service and sacrifice is not a matter of debate. He has written about and discussed his service as a POW extensively — often in excruciating and painful detail. The American people will judge harshly anyone who demeans or attacks that service.

Flop: John McCain on "military service as a requirement to be President" during the 2000 and 2004 Presidential campaigns:

- During an interview with National Journal, John McCain was asked if “military service inherently makes somebody better equipped to be commander-in-chief.” McCain said, “Absolutely not… I absolutely don’t believe that it’s necessary.” [National Journal, 2/15/2003]

- I believe that military service is the most honorable endeavor an American may undertake.But I’ve never believed that lack of military service disqualifies one from occupying positions of political leadership or as Commander and Chief. In America, the people are sovereign, and they decide who is and is not qualified to lead us. [American Legion Speech, 9/7/1999]

- Earlier this year at Washington’s Gridiron Club, where humor is the required fare, McCain lay bare what underlies his candidacy. Wearing a jacket outlandishly festooned with dozens of fake military medals, McCain said, “The question I ask myself every morning while shaving in front of the mirror is: OK, John, you’re an incredible war hero, an inspiration to all Americans. But what qualifies you to be president of the United States?” [Minneapolis Star Tribune, 11/7/1999]

McCain on supporting the 1986 Immigration Reform Act:
Gaffe: Speaking before NALEO (the National Association of Latino Elected and Appointed Officials), McCain stated:
"[I]n 1986, we passed a law and said we would secure the borders and gave amnesty to a couple — three million people. I supported that legislation way back then."

In actuality, McCain vocally opposed and voted against the 1986 Immigration Reform Act:
The Arizona Republic newspaper in 1986 reported that he had called the bill racist and quoted him as saying the bill’s requirements for employers to verify workers “would institutionalize discrimination.” He said employers would refuse to hire Hispanics to avoid running afoul of the law.

A McCain campaign official said the senator “was referring to his support for a comprehensive solution - going back to that time.

McCain On Terrorist threats helping Republican candidates:
Flip: On June 23rd, Fortune Magazine released an interview with McCain's chief strategist Charlie Black who said that, like the assassination of Pakistani leader Bhutto last year, another terrorist attack on U.S. soil “would be a big advantage” for McCain. Senator McCain responded:
“If he said that, and I do not know the context, I strenuously disagree.”

Flop: But during President Bush's 2004 re-election campaign, McCain's response to Osama bin Laden's video taped message just days before the election was:
“I think it’s very helpful to President Bush,” said McCain, R-Ariz., while stumping in Stamford for U.S. Rep. Christopher Shays. “It focuses America’s attention on the war on terrorism. I’m not sure if it was intentional or not, but I think it does have an effect.” [AP, 10/30/04]

McCain on windfall profits tax on oil companies:
Flip: Criticized Obama's support of a "windfall profits" tax on oil companies as "If the plan sounds familiar, that's because that was Jimmy Carter's big idea too! And a lot of good it did us."

Flop: Said he'd be "glad to look at the idea of a windfall profits tax" on oil companies during a speech to the Charlotte, NC Chamber of Commerce on May 5th.

McCain on funding National Defense:
Flip: In the November 2007 issue of Foreign Affairs, McCain argued “we can also afford to spend more on national defense, which currently consumes less than four cents of every dollar that our economy generates - far less than what we spent during the Cold War.”

Flop: Facing the $2 trillion budgetary hole the McCain tax plan is forecast to produce (a sea of red ink even the Wall Street Journal noticed), Team McCain changed its tune. As Forbes scoffed in amazement:
“McCain’s top economic adviser, Doug Holtz-Eakin, blithely supposes that cuts in defense spending could make up for reducing the corporate tax rate from 35% to 25% and the subsequent shrinkage in federal revenues. Get that? The national security candidate wants to cut spending on our national security. Wait until the generals and the admirals hear that.”

McCain on balancing the budget:
Flip: During a February 15th rally in La Crosse, Wisconsin, “McCain promised he’d offer a balanced budget by the end of his first term.”

Flippity: Days later, McCain’s senior economic adviser Douglas Holtz-Eakin announced a deficit-ending target of 2017. In mid-April, Holtz-Eakin proclaimed, “I would like the next president not to talk about deficit reduction.” McCain, too, signaled the retreat from his first-term balance budget commitment, explaining to Chris Matthews on April 15th that “economic conditions are reversed.”
Flop: On June 6, Holtz-Eakin announced, “That plan, when appropriately phased in, as it has always been intended to be, will bring the budget to balance by the end of his first term.”

McCain on The Estate Tax:
Flip: On June 8, 2006, McCain on the Senate floor expressed his agreement with Teddy Roosevelt that “most great civilized countries have an income tax and an inheritance tax” and “in my judgment both should be part of our system of federal taxation.”

Flop: In a speech before small business owners in New York, McCain declared “the estate tax is one of the most unfair tax laws on the books.” link - Huffington Post 6/10/08

McCain on differing from Bush:
Flip: In a televised speech hoping to steal some of the thunder from Barack Obama's announcement that he had clinched the Democratic nomination, McCain said:
"You will hear from my opponent’s campaign in every speech, every interview, every press release that I’m running for President Bush’s third term. You will hear every policy of the President described as the Bush-McCain policy. Why does Senator Obama believe it’s so important to repeat that idea over and over again? Because he knows it’s very difficult to get Americans to believe something they know is false."

Flop: During his appearance on the June 19, 2005 edition of "Meet the Press", McCain responded to Tim Russert's claim, "The fact is you are different than George Bush.":
"No. No. I--the fact is that I'm different but the fact is that I have agreed with President Bush far more than I have disagreed. And on the transcendent issues, the most important issues of our day, I've been totally in agreement and support of President Bush."

McCain on immigration reform:
Flip: Speaking on the Senate floor in March 2006, Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) argued for comprehensive immigration reform, stating that “while strengthening border security is an essential component of national security, it must also be accompanied by immigration reforms.”

Flop: But while seeking the GOP nomination for president, McCain “encountered anger from hard-line immigration foes,” particularly over his support for a bill that would “have allowed most undocumented immigrants to work toward citizenship.” Thus, in order to pander to the far right during the primary, McCain changed his position, saying the U.S. must secure the borders before undocumented immigrants are dealt with, thereby discarding the “comprehensive” nature of his previous immigration position:
[I] have pledged that it would be among my highest priorities to secure our borders first, and only after we achieved widespread consensus that our borders are secure, would we address other aspects of the problem in a way that defends the rule of law and does not encourage another wave of illegal immigration.


Flip: But now that McCain has all but locked up the nomination, he has to start dancing. Trying to court Latino voters, McCain flipped back to his original position, saying he now supports “comprehensive immigration reform“:
MCCAIN: We get in this kind of a circular firing squad on immigration reform in the Congress of the United States, and the lesson I learned from it is we’ve got to have comprehensive immigration reform.

(UPDATE: On June 27, 2008, McCain praised himself for sponsoring the McCain-Kennedy immigration reform legislation of 2006). In a Jan. 30 GOP debate, McCain said he would not vote for his own bill today:

Q: At this point, if your original proposal came to a vote on the Senate floor, would you vote for it? […]

McCAIN: No, I would not, because we know what the situation is today. The people want the borders secured first.

McCain on "tax cuts for the wealthy":
. Flip: Opposed George Bush's proposed "tax cuts for the wealthy" during the 2000 Presidential campaign:
"I don’t believe the wealthiest 10% of Americans should get 60% of the tax breaks. I think the lowest 10% should get the breaks." - 1/5/00

again in 2001:
“I am disappointed that the Senate Finance Committee preferred instead to cut the top tax rate of 39.6% to 36%, thereby granting generous tax relief to the wealthiest individuals of our country at the expense of lower- and middle-income American taxpayers.” - 5/21/01

And again in 2003:
“But when you look at the percentage of the tax cuts that–as the previous tax cuts–that go to the wealthiest Americans, you will find that the bulk of it, again, goes to wealthiest Americans.” - 1/7/03


Flop: During an Interview on ABC's "This Week with George Stephanopoulos", McCain debated the term "wealthy"
(Making "finger-quotes in the air) "Oh, yes, sure, the wealthy, the wealthy. Always be interested in when people talk about who the, quote, “wealthy” are in America. I find it interesting."

Link: http://www.bi30.org/wordpress/flipflopper.htm

[Arne]

The John McCain flip flop song:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fziJZA218uE

Another flop song: (So funny just had to bring it in...)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8BjhfwVY_p8

[Arne]

John McCain has his very own "nation building moment" about Somalia:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RzcPpZEs4t0

John McCain changing opinion on if they're in Iraq for oil or not and trying to explain why Ron Paul is outscoring ALL OF THE OTHER CANDIDATES in campaign donations from active military personel, as well as many other flip flops on Iraq:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NbYwQbcnG5s

On the religious right:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbrejLsixwk

Contradicting himself in the SAME debate about whether or not there was failure in Iraq:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jul_Aia50Qo

[Arne]

Forever Wrong: Five Years of John McCain on Iraq


Just in time for the fifth anniversary of the U.S. invasion, presumptive Republican presidential nominee John McCain made an unannounced visit to Iraq. While McCain deemed the visit a "fact-finding" mission, his secret visit to Baghdad is just part of an extended photo opportunity in the Middle East and Europe designed to highlight his national security credentials.
Unfortunately for McCain, his excellent Baghdad adventure could well produce the opposite effect. After all, this week's looming anniversary highlights that at almost every turn, John McCain has been disastrously wrong about Iraq. From his predictions of a short war and U.S. troops greeted as liberators to "mission accomplished" and a thousand year American presence, the supposed maverick sounds hauntingly similar to President Bush and Vice President Cheney. The simple lesson for Americans is that you don't get to be this wrong and still become President of the United States. The corollary: John McCain is unfit for command.

Here, then, is a look back at five years of John McCain on Iraq.

On the Run-Up to War

"Look, we're going to send young men and women in harm's way and that's always a great danger, but I cannot believe that there is an Iraqi soldier who is going to be willing to die for Saddam Hussein, particularly since he will know that our objective is to remove Saddam Hussein from power."
John McCain, September 15, 2002.

"But the fact is, I think we could go in with much smaller numbers than we had to do in the past. But any military man worth his salt is going to have to prepare for any contingency, but I don't believe it's going to be nearly the size and scope that it was in 1991."
John McCain, September 15, 2002.

"He's a patriot who has the best interests of his country at heart."
John McCain, on Ahmed Chalabi, 2003.

On Saddam's Weapons of Mass Destruction

"Proponents of containment claim that Iraq is in a "box." But it is a box with no lid, no bottom, and whose sides are falling out. Within this box are definitive footprints of germ, chemical and nuclear programs."
John McCain, February 13, 2003.

"I remain confident that we will find weapons of mass destruction in Iraq."
John McCain, June 11, 2003.

On Being Greeted as Liberators

"Absolutely. Absolutely."
John McCain, asked by Chris Matthews, "you believe that the people of Iraq or at least a large number of them will treat us as liberators?" March 12, 2003.

"Not only that, they'll be relieved that he's not in the neighborhood because he has invaded his neighbors on several occasions."
John McCain, asked by Chris Matthews, "And you think the Arab world will come to a grudging recognition that what we did was necessary?" March 12, 2003.

"There's no doubt in my mind that we will prevail and there's no doubt in my mind, once these people are gone, that we will be welcomed as liberators."
John McCain, March 24, 2003.

On a Rapid Victory and Mission Accomplished

"I think the victory will be rapid, within about three weeks."
John McCain, January 28, 2003.

"It's clear that the end is very much in sight...It won't be long. It, it'll be a fairly short period of time."
John McCain, April 9, 2003.

"Well, then why was there a banner that said mission accomplished on the aircraft carrier?"
John McCain, responding to assertion by Fox News' Neil Cavuto that "many argue the conflict isn't over," June 11, 2003.

"I have said a long time that reconstruction of Iraq would be a long, long, difficult process, but the conflict -- the major conflict is over, the regime change has been accomplished, and it's very appropriate."
John McCain, June 11, 2003.

"I'm confident we're on the right course."
John McCain, March 7, 2004.

"We're either going to lose this thing or win this thing within the next several months."
John McCain, November 12, 2006.

"My friends, the war will be over soon, the war for all intents and purposes although the insurgency will go on for years and years and years."
John McCain, February 25, 2008.

On the Safe Streets of Baghdad

"[There] there "are neighborhoods in Baghdad where you and I could walk through those neighborhoods, today."
John McCain, after touring a Baghdad market wearing a bulletproof vest and guarded by "100 American soldiers, with three Blackhawk helicopters, and two Apache gunships overhead, April 1, 2007.

"There's problems in America with safe neighborhoods as we well know."
John McCain, March 8, 2008.

On President Bush and His Team

"We are very fortunate that our president in these challenging days can rely on the counsel of a man who has demonstrated time and again the resolve, experience, and patriotism that will be required for success and the hard-headed clear thinking necessary to prevail in this global fight between good and evil."
John McCain, on Dick Cheney, July 16, 2004.

"I think he strengthened our national defenses. I think he has a good team around him."
John McCain, on President Bush, September 3, 2004.

"I said no. My answer is still no. No confidence."
John McCain, on whether he had confidence in Bush Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, December 15, 2004.

On a Permanent American Military Presence in Iraq

"We cannot keep our forces indefinitely staged in the region. Were we to attempt again to contain Saddam, we would eventually have to withdraw them. The world is full of dangers and, more likely than not, we will need some of those brave men and women to face them down."
John McCain, February 13, 2003.

"We have had troops in South Korea for 60 years and nobody minds."
John McCain, June 7, 2007.

"Make it a hundred."
John McCain, told that President Bush had said American troops could remain in Iraq for 50 years, January 3, 2008.

"I asked McCain about his 'hundred years' comment, and he reaffirmed the remark, excitedly declaring that U.S. troops could be in Iraq for 'a thousand years' or 'a million years,' as far as he was concerned."
David Corn, January 3, 2008.

"The U.S. could have a military presence anywhere in the world for a long period of time."
John McCain, February 20, 2008.

UPDATE: On Tuesday in Amman Jordan, McCain added a new chapter to his reign of error on Iraq, this time comically proclaiming an Iranian-Al Qaeda alliance featuring Iranian operatives operatives "taking al-Qaeda into Iran, training them and sending them back."

Link: http://www.perrspectives.com/blog/archives/000979.htm

[Arne]

Monday, February 25, 2008; Page A04

Top Obama Flip-Flops


1. Special interests In January, the Obama campaign described union contributions to the campaigns of Clinton and John Edwards as "special interest" money. Obama changed his tune as he began gathering his own union endorsements. He now refers respectfully to unions as the representatives of "working people" and says he is "thrilled" by their support.


2. Public financing Obama replied "yes" in September 2007 when asked if he would agree to public financing of the presidential election if his GOP opponent did the same. Obama has now attached several conditions to such an agreement, including regulating spending by outside groups. His spokesman says the candidate never committed himself on the matter.


3. The Cuba embargo In January 2004, Obama said it was time "to end the embargo with Cuba" because it had "utterly failed in the effort to overthrow Castro." Speaking to a Cuban American audience in Miami in August 2007, he said he would not "take off the embargo" as president because it is "an important inducement for change."


4. Illegal immigration In a March 2004 questionnaire, Obama was asked if the government should "crack down on businesses that hire illegal immigrants." He replied "Oppose." In a Jan. 31, 2008, televised debate, he said that "we do have to crack down on those employers that are taking advantage of the situation."



5. Decriminalization of marijuana While running for the U.S. Senate in January 2004, Obama told Illinois college students that he supported eliminating criminal penalties for marijuana use. In the Oct. 30, 2007, presidential debate, he joined other Democratic candidates in opposing the decriminalization of marijuana.

Link:http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...022402094.html

[Arne]

Have fun voting and I hope you guys don't throw up afterwards...

[alby]

hell of a thread. props Arne

[92bDad]

For the first time, I truly believe that I have to vote on the better of two wrongs.

I truly do not trust Obama, thus he will NOT get my vote.

I have a hard time with McCain, because I do see some contreversy as to where he stands...but he has more beliefs that are in line with mine, thus I am voting for McCain.

I would rather vote for Fred Thompson or Mike Huckabee...but it doesn't look like I will have that opportunity.

[rabbitproof]

Oh, politics.... you lie to our faces and we smile politely.

[ribosoma]

Politics and nationalism... the fine art of peeing in the wind...

How's about some extremely profane Doug Stanhope on: FREEDOM?

[wmbwinn]

I said on day one that both candidates stink. I stand by that statement. But, I have to vote for the one that will do the least damage or prevent the most damage.

[wmbwinn]

During July, the number of Americans who consider themselves to be Democrats fell two percentage points to 39.2%. That’s the first time since January that the number of Democrats has fallen below 41% (see history from January 2004 to present).

While the number of Democrats declined, there was virtually no change in the number of Republicans. In July, 31.6% said they were Republicans, the fourth straight month that number has been below 31.4% and 31.6%.

The Democrats now have a 7.6 percentage point advantage over the Republicans, down from a 9.5 percentage point advantage in June and 10.1 percentage points in May.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/publ...artisan_trends

Thought Janet might enjoy this one...

This is the first time I have seen any evidence of any change in momentum nationally.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

I feel like Arne is in a way mocking the political forum.

It really has just become people posting a bunch of biased articles. That is why it's nearly impossible to have a logical or reasonable discussion round here. Too much hot air on both sides.

[Arne]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

I feel like Arne is in a way mocking the political forum.

It really has just become people posting a bunch of biased articles. That is why it's nearly impossible to have a logical or reasonable discussion round here. Too much hot air on both sides.

I'm mocking some people who routinely post there party propaganda. Still, there have been some interesting discussions on this board that I enjoyed. I do learn some new stuff here by going through the threads and trying to isolate the information from the propaganda in each post.

Now let's continue with a classic Ron Paul response to Obama's "Change" slogan:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ez5robAWmu4

Once again, I'm not mocking the whole board, even though I do find many many posts just hilarious.

[Arne]

Originally Posted by wmbwinn

During July, the number of Americans who consider themselves to be Democrats fell two percentage points to 39.2%. That’s the first time since January that the number of Democrats has fallen below 41% (see history from January 2004 to present).

While the number of Democrats declined, there was virtually no change in the number of Republicans. In July, 31.6% said they were Republicans, the fourth straight month that number has been below 31.4% and 31.6%.

The Democrats now have a 7.6 percentage point advantage over the Republicans, down from a 9.5 percentage point advantage in June and 10.1 percentage points in May.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/publ...artisan_trends

Thought Janet might enjoy this one...

This is the first time I have seen any evidence of any change in momentum nationally.

It seems to me that the Republicans will have a hard time once there is a truely popular libertarian out there.

Then again there's more than just poll results. This article paints a different picture:

August 5, 2008
G.O.P. Drops in Voting Rolls in Many States
By JENNIFER STEINHAUER
Well before Senators Barack Obama and John McCain rose to the top of their parties, a partisan shift was under way at the local and state level. For more than three years starting in 2005, there has been a reduction in the number of voters who register with the Republican Party and a rise among voters who affiliate with Democrats and, almost as often, with no party at all.

While the implications of the changing landscape for Mr. Obama and Mr. McCain are far from clear, voting experts say the registration numbers may signal the beginning of a move away from Republicans that could affect local, state and national politics over several election cycles. Already, there has been a sharp reversal for Republicans in many statehouses and governors’ mansions.

In several states, including the traditional battlegrounds of Nevada and Iowa, Democrats have surprised their own party officials with significant gains in registration. In both of those states, there are now more registered Democrats than Republicans, a flip from 2004. No states have switched to the Republicans over the same period, according to data from 26 of the 29 states in which voters register by party. (Three of the states did not have complete data.)

In six states, including Iowa, New Hampshire and Pennsylvania, the Democratic piece of the registration pie grew more than three percentage points, while the Republican share declined. In only three states — Kentucky, Louisiana and Oklahoma — did Republican registration rise while Democratic registration fell, but the Republican increase was less than a percentage point in Kentucky and Oklahoma. Louisiana was the only state to register a gain of more than one percentage point for Republicans as Democratic numbers declined.

Over the same period, the share of the electorate that registers as independent has grown at a faster rate than Republicans or Democrats in 12 states. The rise has been so significant that in states like Arizona, Colorado and North Carolina, nonpartisan voters essentially constitute a third party.

Swings in party registration are not uncommon from one year to the next, or even over two years. Registration, moreover, often has no impact on how people actually vote, and people sometimes switch registration to vote in a primary, then flip again come Election Day.

But for a shift away from one party to sustain itself — the current registration trend is now in its fourth year — is remarkable, researchers who study voting patterns say. And though comparable data are not available for the 21 states where voters do not register by party, there is evidence that an increasing number of voters in those states are also moving away from the Republican Party based on the results of recent state and Congressional elections, the researchers said.

“This is very suggestive that there is a fundamental change going on in the electorate,” said Michael P. McDonald, a senior fellow at the Brookings Institution and an associate professor of political science at George Mason University who has studied voting patterns.

Mr. McDonald added that, more typically, voting and registration patterns tended to even out or revert to the opposing party between elections.

Dick Armey, the former House majority leader and one of the designers of the so-called Republican Revolution of 1994, said: “Obviously, these are not good numbers for the party to be looking at. Democrats have always had extremely broad multifaceted registration programs.”

But in terms of the presidential election, Mr. Armey said the tea leaves were harder to read.

“I think the key in this one is, where do all these new independent voters break?” he said. “I think right now, you’ve got a guy in western Pennsylvania saying, ‘I am really disgusted right now and I’m not going to register as a Republican anymore, but I really don’t want this guy Obama elected.’ ”

Those in charge of state Democratic parties cite a national displeasure with the Bush administration as an impetus for the changing numbers, which run counter to a goal of Karl Rove, President Bush’s former top adviser, to create a permanent realignment in favor of Republicans.

“I think nationally and here, people are kind of tired of the way this administration has been conducting the policies of this country,” said Pat Waak, chairwoman of the Colorado Democratic Party.

Yet while an unpopular war, a faltering economy and a president held in low esteem have combined to hurt the Republican Party, Democrats are also benefiting from demographic changes, including the rise in the number of younger voters and the urbanization of suburbs, which has resulted in a different political flavor there, voting and campaign experts said. The party has also been helped by a willingness to run more pragmatic candidates, who have helped make the party more appealing to a broader swath of the electorate.

Among the 26 states with registration data, the percentage of those who have signed on with Democrats has risen in 15 states since 2004, and the percentage for Republicans has risen in six, according to state data. The number of registered Democrats fell in 11 states, compared with 20 states where Republican registration numbers fell.

In the 26 states and the District of Columbia where registration data were available, the total number of registered Democrats increased by 214,656, while the number of Republicans fell by 1,407,971.

The unsettled political ground has manifested itself in state and local elections. Twenty-three state legislatures are controlled by Democrats and 14 by Republicans, with 12 states with divided chambers (Nebraska has a nonpartisan legislature). After the 2000 election, 16 state legislatures were dominated by Democrats, and 17 by Republicans, with 16 divided.

It is a similar story in governors’ mansions. After the 2004 election, there were 28 Republican governors and 22 Democrats; those numbers are now reversed. After the 2000 election, there were only 19 Democratic governors.

Elected Democrats have made significant inroads even in places where Republicans have enjoyed a generation of dominance. In Colorado, for example, Democrats control the governorship and both houses of the Legislature for the first time in over four decades. Last year, Virginia Democrats gained a 21-to-19 majority over Republicans in the State Senate, the first time the party has controlled that body in a decade.

In New Hampshire, Democrats are in control of both the legislative and executive branches for the first time since 1874. In Iowa, Democrats have taken over the statehouse and the governor’s office simultaneously for the first time in a generation.

The changes in state government could have broad implications for Congressional redistricting and on policies like immigration, health care reform and environmental regulation, which are increasingly decided at the state level.

In many states, Democrats have benefited from a rise in younger potential voters, after declines or small increases in the number of those voters in the 1980s and ’90s. The population of 18- to 24-year-olds rose from about 27 million in 2000 to nearly 30 million in 2006, according to Census figures.

Mr. Obama’s candidacy has drawn many young people to register to vote, and some of the recent gains by Democrats have no doubt been influenced by excitement over his campaign. But even before Mr. Obama’s ascendancy among Democrats, younger voters were moving toward the Democratic Party, demographers said.

Dowell Myers, a professor of policy, planning and development at the University of Southern California, also noted that a younger, native-born generation of Latinos who have a tendency to support Democrats is coming of age.

Further, young Americans have migrated in recent years to high-growth states that have traditionally been dominated by Republicans, like Arizona, Colorado and Nevada, which may have had an impact on the changing registration numbers in those places.

The changing face of many American suburbs has also had in impact both in voter registration and voting patterns. In many major metropolitan areas, suburbs that were once largely white and Republican have become more mixed, as people living in cities have been priced out into surrounding areas, and exurban regions have absorbed those residents who once favored the close-in suburbs of cities.

“What we speculate is that density attracts Democrats,” said Robert Lang, director of the Metropolitan Institute at Virginia Tech who has researched voting patterns. “It is not that people move to those areas and change positions. It tends now to be a self-selection of singles, childless couples,” who tend to vote Democrat more than their married with children counterparts.

In the nation’s 50 largest metropolitan areas, Democrats carried nearly 60 percent of the Congressional vote in 2006 in inner suburbs, up from about 53 percent in 2002, according to Mr. Lang’s research.

This trend is particularly evident in places like St. Louis, southern Pennsylvania and Fairfax County, Va., which President Bush won in 2000 but lost in 2004.

Senator Claire McCaskill, Democrat of Missouri, who won her seat in 2006, picked up the large majority of voters in the St. Louis and Kansas City metropolitan areas, and Senator Jim Webb, also a Democrat, won his seat in a similar manner in Virginia, which has not voted for a Democrat for president since 1964.

Democrats have also succeeded, at least in part, by running centrist candidates where they are most needed. Bill Ritter, the Democratic governor of Colorado and former district attorney of Denver, opposes abortion rights. Among the men who flipped three of Indiana’s eight Congressional seats in the midterm election in 2006, two also oppose both abortion rights and gun control.

What the demographers, political scientists and party officials wonder now is whether the shift of the last few years will be sustained.

“Major political realignment is not just controlling the branches of government,” said Mr. McDonald of the Brookings Institution. “It is when you decisively do it. We haven’t seen that in modern generations.”

Rebecca Cathcart contributed reporting.

Link: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/05/us...05flip.html?hp

But this doesn't belong into this thread, since in here we're watching the politician flip flop and nothing else!

[wmbwinn]

The article you quoted, Arne, is using data obtained from voter registration numbers. That is old news and, yes, we know that the Republican party was/is suffering losses. But, the article I posted is brand new data from Rasmusen showing for the first time a gain for Republicans and loss for Dems. The Reps have a lot of ground to make up to make it a race.

As to flips and flops, both candidates do this like trichomonas on a microscope slide...

Have fun looking that up.

[jefelump]

As to flips and flops, both candidates do this like trichomonas on a microscope slide

http://www.dpd.cdc.gov/dpdx/HTML/Fra...sis_video2.htm

For your viewing pleasure... trichomonas vaginalis...

[wmbwinn]

Uh-roh, Jefelump. The Mods might find that distasteful...

It might "burn" a bit...

We'll have no undulating flagellations on this site...

[ribosoma]

Originally Posted by wmbwinn

The article you quoted, Arne, is using data obtained from voter registration numbers. That is old news and, yes, we know that the Republican party was/is suffering losses. But, the article I posted is brand new data from Rasmusen showing for the first time a gain for Republicans and loss for Dems. The Reps have a lot of ground to make up to make it a race.

As to flips and flops, both candidates do this like trichomonas on a microscope slide...

Have fun looking that up.

[Underdog]

bump



(too many propagandist rants burying a good thread...)

[alexamenos]

one of my favorite takes on JFKerry in that last bit of bufoonery went something to the effect of:

"Kerry sounds very anti-war when he is in front of an anti-war crowd, and very pro-war in front of a pro-war crowd. A lot of people think he is flip-flopping but he isn't--He's lying and pandering."

This is what politicians do -- they get votes by telling people what they want to hear. Complaining that politicians flip-flop, pander and lie is like complaining that hookers have sex with strangers for money.

[Arne]

Originally Posted by alexamenos

one of my favorite takes on JFKerry in that last bit of bufoonery went something to the effect of:

"Kerry sounds very anti-war when he is in front of an anti-war crowd, and very pro-war in front of a pro-war crowd. A lot of people think he is flip-flopping but he isn't--He's lying and pandering."

This is what politicians do -- they get votes by telling people what they want to hear. Complaining that politicians flip-flop, pander and lie is like complaining that hookers have sex with strangers for money.

"People never lie so much as after a hunt, during a war or before an election."

- Otto von Bismarck

:-)

[wmbwinn]

Originally Posted by alexamenos

one of my favorite takes on JFKerry in that last bit of bufoonery went something to the effect of:

"Kerry sounds very anti-war when he is in front of an anti-war crowd, and very pro-war in front of a pro-war crowd. A lot of people think he is flip-flopping but he isn't--He's lying and pandering."

This is what politicians do -- they get votes by telling people what they want to hear. Complaining that politicians flip-flop, pander and lie is like complaining that hookers have sex with strangers for money.

And, so the trichomonas addition to the thread was entirely appropriate...

You see that there are a lot of similarities after all...

[chumdawg]

Originally Posted by wmbwinn

And, so the trichomonas addition to the thread was entirely appropriate...

You see that there are a lot of similarities after all...

Dude, the post you quoted at least has meat--a whole lot of meat, in fact--to bite onto. Why are you waving this trichomony flag? No one knows what the hell you are talking about, or cares.

I'm starting to think you don't have anything besides guns and microscopes. No, we don't know about your vintage World War I weapons. No, we don't know about your trichomamas. It is so difficult to discuss things with you when all you have in your bag is old guns and Mexican jumping beans.

[ribosoma]

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Dude, the post you quoted at least has meat--a whole lot of meat, in fact--to bite onto. Why are you waving this trichomony flag? No one knows what the hell you are talking about, or cares.

I'm starting to think you don't have anything besides guns and microscopes. No, we don't know about your vintage World War I weapons. No, we don't know about your trichomamas. It is so difficult to discuss things with you when all you have in your bag is old guns and Mexican jumping beans.

I actually sprayed iced water on my monitor while I was reading this. I needed to clean it anyway, although a few of the dust-bunnies made wmbtrichomonas' posts more interesting.

PS- Sorry you got burnt, wmbtrichomonas. You might want to ask Juwan Howard how to deal with the emotional effects picking up an STD.

[wmbwinn]

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Dude, the post you quoted at least has meat--a whole lot of meat, in fact--to bite onto. Why are you waving this trichomony flag? No one knows what the hell you are talking about, or cares.

I'm starting to think you don't have anything besides guns and microscopes. No, we don't know about your vintage World War I weapons. No, we don't know about your trichomamas. It is so difficult to discuss things with you when all you have in your bag is old guns and Mexican jumping beans.

Alex's post is low on meat. It just says what we all know which is that politicians lie and prostitutes have sex with strangers for money.

I think the more interesting part here is how much anger I generate by comparing your favorite presidential candidate to a sexually transmitted protozoa. I compared both candidates, by the way.

Based on Alex's two points, the protozoa fit. We're talking about lying and prostitutes. That combination frequently leads straight to trich.

[wmbwinn]

Originally Posted by ribosoma

I actually sprayed iced water on my monitor while I was reading this. I needed to clean it anyway, although a few of the dust-bunnies made wmbtrichomonas' posts more interesting.

PS- Sorry you got burnt, wmbtrichomonas. You might want to ask Juwan Howard how to deal with the emotional effects picking up an STD.

I happen to be the last person on the face of the earth that will pick up a STD. I have had sex with only one woman in my life and I married her first. I have been married for 16 years and have 3 children. My educational background includes OB/Gyn so I have seen plenty of trich in people who chose to live differently than me.
Mitt Romney and I don't have to worry about Trich.

[wmbwinn]

Originally Posted by ribosoma

Jeopardy!!!

Alex Trebek: "McCain, Obama, Liars, Prostitutes, Trichomonas

wmbwinn: What are life forms that go flip flop?

----------------------

They all fit in this thread....

[ribosoma]

I find you referencing a game show to explain your logic very delicious. Thanks for the snack.

[alby]

[wmbwinn]

love that pic Alby. That is another great addition. And, Ribosoma, I'm glad you probably smiled a little bit...

[Arne]

John McCain in a stunning debate...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ioy90...eature=related

...with himself.

John McCain answers a question by Ron Paul and once again showcases his ability to answer without even answering. Somewhere along his line he might have hoped to actually get the question but it sidn't happen:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HcdLO...eature=related

John McCain on the economy in general:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1X3efvVTLA

[Arne]

Sarah Palin joins the club. On the issue of building famous "bridge to nowhere":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FA26CGyGug0


John McCain debates himself on interventionism and nation building:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RDEJQ...2509DC&index=2


John McCain debates himself on privatizing social security:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPVEH...2509DC&index=8

[Arne]

Funny Obama speech:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QE1QT...01F514&index=6

Might not fit in here, but hey...

[chumdawg]

That's some big-league flip-flopping. Not to be attempted at home.

[Arne]

Barack Obama flip-flopping on how serious a thread Iran really is:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__JQq...eature=related

[Arne]

That's a nice fli flop summary for John McCain:

John McCain -- 61 Flip-Flops and Counting

By Steve Benen, The Carpetbagger Report

Posted on July 10, 2008, Printed on September 10, 2008
http://www.alternet.org/story/90956/

Editor's Note: Writer Steve Benen has graciously compiled a comprehensive tally of John McCain's flip-flops on issues ranging from national security to energy. The following is Benen's list of 61 clear 180-degree switches by McCain on the biggest issues of the day.

National Security Policy

1. McCain thought Bush's warrantless wiretap program circumvented the law; now he believes the opposite.

2. McCain insisted that everyone, even "terrible killers," "the worst kind of scum of humanity," and detainees at Guantanamo Bay, "deserve to have some adjudication of their cases," even if that means "releasing some of them." McCain now believes the opposite.

3. He opposed indefinite detention of terrorist suspects. When the Supreme Court reached the same conclusion, he called it "one of the worst decisions in the history of this country."

4. In February, McCain reversed course on prohibiting waterboarding.

5. McCain favored closing the detention facility at Guantanamo Bay before he was against it.

6. When Barack Obama talked about going after terrorists in Pakistani mountains with Predators, McCain criticized him for it. He's since come to the opposite conclusion.

Foreign Policy

7. McCain was for kicking Russia out of the G8 before he was against it.

8. McCain supported moving "toward normalization of relations" with Cuba. Now he believes the opposite.

9. McCain believed the United States should engage in diplomacy with Hamas. Now he believes the opposite.

10. McCain believed the United States should engage in diplomacy with Syria. Now he believes the opposite.

11. McCain is both for and against a "rogue state rollback" as a focus of his foreign policy vision.

12. McCain used to champion the Law of the Sea convention, even volunteering to testify on the treaty's behalf before a Senate committee. Now he opposes it.

13. McCain was against divestment from South Africa before he was for it.

Military Policy

14. McCain recently claimed that he was the "greatest critic" of Rumsfeld's failed Iraq policy. In December 2003, McCain praised the same strategy as "a mission accomplished." In March 2004, he said, "I'm confident we're on the right course." In December 2005, he said, "Overall, I think a year from now, we will have made a fair amount of progress if we stay the course."

15. McCain has changed his mind about a long-term U.S. military presence in Iraq on multiple occasions, concluding, on multiple occasions, that a Korea-like presence is both a good idea and a bad idea.

16. McCain said before the war in Iraq, "We will win this conflict. We will win it easily." Four years later, McCain said he knew all along that the war in Iraq war was "probably going to be long and hard and tough."

17. McCain has repeatedly said it's a dangerous mistake to tell the "enemy" when U.S. troops would be out of Iraq. In May, McCain announced that most American troops would be home from Iraq by 2013.

18. McCain was against expanding the GI Bill before he was for it.

Domestic Policy

19. McCain defended "privatizing" Social Security. Now he says he's against privatization (though he actually still supports it.)

20. McCain wanted to change the Republican Party platform to protect abortion rights in cases of rape and incest. Now he doesn't.

21. McCain supported storing spent nuclear fuel at Yucca Mountain in Nevada. Now he believes the opposite.

22. He argued that the NRA should not have a role in the Republican Party's policy making. Now he believes the opposite.

23. In 1998, he championed raising cigarette taxes to fund programs to cut underage smoking, insisting that it would prevent illnesses and provide resources for public health programs. Now, McCain opposes a $0.61-per-pack tax increase, won't commit to supporting a regulation bill he's co-sponsoring, and has hired Philip Morris' former lobbyist as his senior campaign adviser.

24. McCain is both for and against earmarks for Arizona.

25. McCain's first mortgage plan was premised on the notion that homeowners facing foreclosure shouldn't be "rewarded" for acting "irresponsibly." His second mortgage plan took largely the opposite position.

26. McCain went from saying gay marriage should be allowed, to saying gay marriage shouldn't be allowed.

27. McCain opposed a holiday to honor Martin Luther King Jr. before he supported it.

28. McCain was anti-ethanol. Now he's pro-ethanol.

29. McCain was both for and against state promotion of the Confederate flag.

30. In 2005, McCain endorsed intelligent design creationism, a year later he said the opposite, and a few months after that, he was both for and against creationism at the same time.

Economic Policy

31. McCain was against Bush's tax cuts for the very wealthy before he was for them.

32. John McCain initially argued that economics is not an area of expertise for him, saying, "I'm going to be honest: I know a lot less about economics than I do about military and foreign policy issues; I still need to be educated," and "The issue of economics is not something I've understood as well as I should." He now falsely denies ever having made these remarks and insists that he has a "very strong" understanding of economics.

33. McCain vowed, if elected, to balance the federal budget by the end of his first term. Soon after, he decided he would no longer even try to reach that goal. And soon after that, McCain abandoned his second position and went back to his first.

34. McCain said in 2005 that he opposed the tax cuts because they were "too tilted to the wealthy." By 2007, he denied ever having said this, and falsely argued that he opposed the cuts because of increased government spending.

35. McCain thought the estate tax was perfectly fair. Now he believes the opposite.

36. McCain pledged in February 2008 that he would not, under any circumstances, raise taxes. Specifically, McCain was asked if he is a "'read my lips' candidate, no new taxes, no matter what?" referring to George H.W. Bush's 1988 pledge. "No new taxes," McCain responded. Two weeks later, McCain said, "I'm not making a 'read my lips' statement, in that I will not raise taxes."

37. McCain has changed his entire economic worldview on multiple occasions.

38. McCain believes Americans are both better and worse off economically than they were before Bush took office.

Energy Policy

39. McCain supported the moratorium on coastal drilling; now he's against it.

40. McCain recently announced his strong opposition to a windfall tax on oil company profits. Three weeks earlier, he was perfectly comfortable with the idea.

41. McCain endorsed a cap-and-trade policy with a mandatory emissions cap. In mid-June, McCain announced he wants the caps to be voluntary.

42. McCain explained his belief that a temporary suspension of the federal gas tax would provide an immediate economic stimulus. Shortly thereafter, he argued the exact opposite.

43. McCain supported the Lieberman/Warner legislation to combat global warming. Now he doesn't.

Immigration Policy

44. McCain was a co-sponsor of the DREAM Act, which would grant legal status to illegal immigrants' kids who graduate from high school. Now he's against it.

45. On immigration policy in general, McCain announced in February 2008 that he would vote against his own bill.

46. In April, McCain promised voters that he would secure the borders "before proceeding to other reform measures." Two months later, he abandoned his public pledge, pretended that he'd never made the promise in the first place, and vowed that a comprehensive immigration reform policy has always been, and would always be, his "top priority."

Judicial Policy and the Rule of Law

47. McCain said he would "not impose a litmus test on any nominee." He used to promise the opposite.

48. McCain believes the telecoms should be forced to explain their role in the administration's warrantless surveillance program as a condition for retroactive immunity. He used to believe the opposite.

49. McCain went from saying he would not support repeal of Roe v. Wade to saying the exact opposite.

Campaign, Ethics, and Lobbying Reform

50. McCain supported his own lobbying-reform legislation from 1997. Now he doesn't.

51. In 2006, McCain sponsored legislation to require grassroots lobbying coalitions to reveal their financial donors. In 2007, after receiving "feedback" on the proposal, McCain told far-right activist groups that he opposes his own measure.

52. McCain supported a campaign-finance bill, which bore his name, on strengthening the public-financing system. In June 2007, he abandoned his own legislation.

Politics and Associations

53. McCain wanted political support from radical televangelist John Hagee. Now he doesn't.

54. McCain wanted political support from radical televangelist Rod Parsley. Now he doesn't.

55. McCain says he considered and did not consider joining John Kerry's Democratic ticket in 2004.

56. McCain is both for and against attacking Barack Obama over his former pastor at his former church.

57. McCain criticized TV preacher Jerry Falwell as "an agent of intolerance" in 2002, but then decided to cozy up to the man who said Americans "deserved" the 9/11 attacks.

58. In 2000, McCain accused Texas businessmen Sam and Charles Wyly of being corrupt, spending "dirty money" to help finance Bush's presidential campaign. McCain not only filed a complaint against the Wylys for allegedly violating campaign finance law, he also lashed out at them publicly. In April, McCain reached out to the Wylys for support.

59. McCain was against presidential candidates campaigning at Bob Jones University before he was for it.

60. McCain decided in 2000 that he didn't want anything to do with former Secretary of State Henry Kissinger, believing he "would taint the image of the 'Straight Talk Express.'" Kissinger is now the honorary co-chair for his presidential campaign in New York.

61. McCain believed powerful right-wing activist/lobbyist Grover Norquist was "corrupt, a shill for dictators, and (with just a dose of sarcasm) Jack Abramoff's gay lover." McCain now considers Norquist a key political ally.

And while I realize there are some who believe these constant flip-flops are irrelevant, I respectfully disagree.

AlterNet is a nonprofit organization and does not make political endorsements. The opinions expressed by its writers are their own.

Steve Benen is a freelance writer and editor of The Carpetbagger Report.

[rabbitproof]

John McCain's Journey From Maverick to Liar

http://www.usnews.com/blogs/john-far...k-to-liar.html

There is a good reason why John McCain's campaign is having some trouble with truthiness these days.

McCain's claim to be a "maverick" rests on the liberal positions he took during the days when he openly fought with Republican leaders and the party's conservative base.

Because he cannot very well motivate Republicans by reminding them of the times he and they have quarreled, he has to distract and dissemble.

Think of the breaks that McCain has made with Republican orthodoxy.

He joined liberal Russ Feingold and pushed for campaign finance reform—conservatives loathed it.

He was a soldier with Al Gore in the fight against global warming—the oil industry and free market think tanks opposed them.

He and Ted Kennedy helped write a humane immigration bill—the GOP nativists despised him.

He joined with Bob Byrd and six other Democrats to kill a Senate Republican plan to pack the federal judiciary—abortion opponents were furious.

He sided with Tom Daschle's Democrats and voted against the Bush tax cuts—the antitax groups fumed.

He took on House and Senate Republicans who were trying to bring pork barrel spending to their states—the GOP majority went ballistic.

And he aligned himself with liberal groups like People for the American Way, when denouncing the clout of "evil" evangelical political leaders.

Actions like these endeared McCain to left-leaning journalists and independent voters who were alarmed by the influence of GOP social and religious conservatives. Even though he was voting with his fellow Republicans 85 percent of the time, McCain built a reputation as a maverick.

Yet, as they prepared for the 2008 presidential race, McCain's advisers knew they would have to woo those conservatives. And so they launched what they called "McCain 2.0" in 2007.

When Jon Stewart asked McCain last year, "Are you going into crazy base world?" the celebrated maverick acknowledged, "I'm afraid so."

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Also: http://www.mccainpedia.org/index.php/Count_the_Lies

[Usually Lurkin]

Originally Posted by rabbitproof

John McCain's Journey From Maverick to Liar

http://www.usnews.com/blogs/john-far...k-to-liar.html


Yet, as they prepared for the 2008 presidential race, McCain's advisers knew they would have to woo those conservatives. And so they launched what they called "McCain 2.0" in 2007.

good grief, these one-sided hit pieces are ridiculous. The guy throws out the "votes with his party 85% of the time" fact like it is scary to the right. How much do you think Obama votes in line with his party? Hint: it's more than anyone else.

It closes with this:

For 18 months, Obama has wagered all his chips on the (quaint? idealistic? brilliant?) idea that the American people are tired of the same old sleazy and divisive politics. McCain has now chosen to bet against him

So McCain's downside is that he's too moderate for his crazy base? But this author thinks he might govern in the extreme, even though he never has, isn't promising to, and nobody expects him to? And Obama's new politics is that he's historically as left as his crazy base, and that he will govern in the etreme?