Gortat or Tyson - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

dude1394 · 12-24-2010, 01:07 AM

So Gortat was the big center that we needed last year. We didn't get him but if we had we certainly wouldn't have gotten Chandler I don't think..

Funny how things work out...

chumdawg · 12-24-2010, 01:15 AM

Blab or Tarpley?

MavsFTR · 12-24-2010, 01:52 AM

There are a million different things that could have happened differently if we had gotten Gortat. This sort of speculation makes little sense and has no bearing on anything. Someone should put that 'nice thread' image of the guys high-fiving haha.

xrobx · 12-24-2010, 01:58 AM

i think i'd rather have brenda than gortat

dude1394 · 12-24-2010, 02:05 AM

Kinda the point of the thread. Gortat looks like what he was paid to be...a backup.

chumdawg · 12-24-2010, 02:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MavsFTR

There are a million different things that could have happened differently if we had gotten Gortat. This sort of speculation makes little sense and has no bearing on anything. Someone should put that 'nice thread' image of the guys high-fiving haha.

Is that a cute rendering of the butterfly theory?

mavs777 · 12-24-2010, 03:21 AM

But see thats the thing Gortat hasn't had a fair chance to be a starter so you can't say he isn't good enough to be one. His numbers in little minutes are very impressive, he is a good player

41mvp · 12-24-2010, 03:55 AM

Gortat or Tyson
Of course Tyson is better player

Thespiralgoeson · 12-24-2010, 05:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

So Gortat was the big center that we needed last year. We didn't get him but if we had we certainly wouldn't have gotten Chandler I don't think..

Funny how things work out...

I dunno. I mean, didn't it seem like we traded for Chandler just because he was an expiring contract? I know I thought it was basically a wash talent-wise. If we had gotten Gortat we might still had ended up trading Dampier for Chandler and could've just let Haywood walk instead of signing him to that ridiculous contract.

Usually Lurkin · 12-24-2010, 09:24 AM

If Gortat is able to turn Phoenix into an elite defensive team for about a quarter of a season before they start reverting to their old selves, then maybe I'll call it a wash.

dalger · 12-24-2010, 09:32 AM

Is it in the realm of possibility that Gortat is overrated as soon as someone compares him to a healthy Tyson Chandler? I'm somehow tempted to think that way since he hasn't even proven to be a decent starter in this league while Tyson has shown the potential to be a difference maker.

FromDownTown! · 12-24-2010, 09:46 AM

Tyson! Tyson brings another dimension to this team that Gortat doesnt have(IMO). TC has given this team defensive leadership and taken the energy to another level.

deamon · 12-24-2010, 10:54 AM

Definitely Tyson is better than Gortat. Marcin isn't agressive like Tyson, I watched yesterday game vs. MIA. Gortat is more dynamic than Haywood, but in overall even Brendan is better.

sefant77 · 12-24-2010, 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thespiralgoeson

I dunno. I mean, didn't it seem like we traded for Chandler just because he was an expiring contract? I know I thought it was basically a wash talent-wise. If we had gotten Gortat we might still had ended up trading Dampier for Chandler and could've just let Haywood walk instead of signing him to that ridiculous contract.

We traded for Chandler (after James/Wade pipedream blowing up) because Casey gave the hint that Chandler is absolutly healthy again and that we would get at least a 80-90% of the "Hornets Chandler" and that this would be an upgrade.

With Gortat i say maybe it would have been just the Howard-Butler swap at the deadline since Stevensons contract was probably the "price" to get Haywood too.

fluid.forty.one · 12-24-2010, 03:10 PM

Tyson's intangibles > Gortat's intangibles

Underdog · 12-24-2010, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fluid.forty.one

Tyson's intangibles > Gortat's intangibles

Hell, Tyson's tangibles > Gortat's tangibles...

Dirkadirkastan · 12-24-2010, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Usually Lurkin

If Gortat is able to turn Phoenix into an elite defensive team for about a quarter of a season before they start reverting to their old selves, then maybe I'll call it a wash.

What exactly are you saying?

chumdawg · 12-24-2010, 05:32 PM

Am I the only one who sees the thread title and imagines Marcin Gortat in the ring with Mike Tyson?

deamon · 12-24-2010, 05:42 PM

No you're not, but not Marcin. His father Janusz Gortat was boxer.

jcm28 · 12-24-2010, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deamon

No you're not, but not Marcin. His father Janusz Gortat was boxer.

I think tyson would have won that one.

chumdawg · 12-24-2010, 10:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcm28

I think tyson would have won that one.

Yeah, which Tyson? He was a fat jelly roll when Douglas knocked his old ass out.

ty · 12-25-2010, 01:05 AM

Gortat has a Jordan tattoo on his calf...

...that has to count for something right?

Usually Lurkin · 12-25-2010, 01:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dirkadirkastan

What exactly are you saying?

I'm saying I hope nobody in the Mavericks is saying "no, we won't trade Chandler for Melo, because with Tyson, we've got championship level defense."

I'm saying that we've gotten a quarter of a season's worth of that from Tyson, which is much more than I'd expect from Gortat, but that I expect our long term outlook to come back to "good but average," which I would expect from Gortat.

I'm saying that if Chandler is a super-hot trade chip right now, we should use it, which is more than I would've expected for Chandler.

dude1394 · 12-25-2010, 02:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Usually Lurkin

I'm saying I hope nobody in the Mavericks is saying "no, we won't trade Chandler for Melo, because with Tyson, we've got championship level defense."

I'm saying that we've gotten a quarter of a season's worth of that from Tyson, which is much more than I'd expect from Gortat, but that I expect our long term outlook to come back to "good but average," which I would expect from Gortat.

I'm saying that if Chandler is a super-hot trade chip right now, we should use it, which is more than I would've expected for Chandler.

Woah...interesting...I couldn't disagree with you more however. Just hearing the dirkster talking about how chandler has energized their defense seems way out of the ordinary to me. I would be very hard pressed to pull the trigger and trade Ty. We'd have to throw some names out there, but short of a very,very solid all-start I wouldn't see it.

Melo for tyson...that would be a tough one.

wilmtalk · 12-25-2010, 12:04 PM

The value of TC is very high on this team. It would not be as high to another team. One has to consider what each individual teams needs are and it that player fills that need. With a less pass efficiant point guard Chandler would not be the offensive threat he is on the Mavs. The Mavs also have a dire need for his off the ball defensive abilitys. With out him their defense would drop considerably. On a team that played less zone than the Mavs TC's value would also drop.

Gordat might be a better fit for another team than Dallas. I do feel that Chandler would also have been a better fit for the Suns since they need basically the same things out of their center than Dallas and Nash would have been able to feed TC just as well as Kidd. TC is a perfect fit for this team. The only center who would be more effective for the Mavs is Howard.

I would not trade Chandler for Melo because what we would lose on the Defensive end we would not gain enough offense to compensate for it. Right now we are playing and winning through defense. Everyone needs to consider that Melo's along with Dirks and other Mavs players individual offensive numbers would drop considerably because there is only one ball and a limited amount of shots available for each team.

Usually Lurkin · 12-25-2010, 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wilmtalk

The value of TC is very high on this team. It would not be as high to another team.

Other teams would only want to know if what the Mavs have adds enough to their team to be worth whatever they are trading. Across the board, the opinion right now would be that Chandler adds more to their team than Haywood. Gortat - who knows.

Quote:

I would not trade Chandler for Melo because what we would lose on the Defensive end we would not gain enough offense to compensate for it.

Before the season started, I thought that adding Melo to the team puts us close to championship. I still do. And I think that our defense will come back to earth, if it hasn't already, even with Chandler.

Quote:

Dirks and other Mavs players individual offensive numbers would drop considerably because there is only one ball and a limited amount of shots available for each team.

Miami.

kg_veteran · 12-25-2010, 11:04 PM

I wouldn't give up Chandler for Anthony at this point.

LonghornDub · 12-25-2010, 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kg_veteran

I wouldn't give up Chandler for Anthony at this point.

With or without an extension?

deamon · 12-26-2010, 05:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ty

Gortat has a Jordan tattoo on his calf...

...that has to count for something right?

People called him ,,white boy with MJ tattoo" in his first season.
Reebok are dumbs, they said Gortat should wear longer socks.
Gortat also has little Gremlin tattoo on his left arm,
and the third one is dedicated to his father:

rabbitproof · 12-26-2010, 07:18 AM

Chandler is playing like an All-Star so it would be an AS for AS talent swap, which makes the rental piece uncomfortable.

I think Melo with extension MAY be worth it just because Melo has a more consistent track record and is younger but at that point, you're not thinking about this season but rather the future.

Usually Lurkin · 12-26-2010, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rabbitproof

Chandler is playing like an All-Star so it would be an AS for AS talent swap, which makes the rental piece uncomfortable.

I think Melo with extension MAY be worth it just because Melo has a more consistent track record and is younger but at that point, you're not thinking about this season but rather the future.

This is all true, and without an extension, I don't know if I'd want Melo at all - I can't see that he'd be giving it his all for anyone this year if he's looking ahead to NY with friends next year.

But Chandler's All-Star play is not franchise-player level, and you need two franchise type players to win. If Chandler's the cost, then he's the cost. (And I'm more convinced that one of those franchise players needs to be the right kind of shoe contract type player. Melo gives us that.)

She_Growls · 12-26-2010, 08:25 PM

Wow, what a no brainer...

She_Growls · 12-26-2010, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ty

Gortat has a Jordan tattoo on his calf...

...that has to count for something right?

Wow, I'm speechless...

mavs777 · 12-26-2010, 09:11 PM

i would trade TC for Carmello in half an instance, get real people

Dirkadirkastan · 12-26-2010, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mavs777

i would trade TC for Carmello in half an instance, get real people

For half a season of a disinterested ball hog?

mavs777 · 12-26-2010, 10:03 PM

Well considering all of that is incorrect im not sure why that would be a question

Dirkadirkastan · 12-26-2010, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mavs777

Well considering all of that is incorrect im not sure why that would be a question

For two thirds of a season of a selfish player with divided loyalties?

sefant77 · 12-26-2010, 10:46 PM

And his sister passing away days ago? I dont wanna sound rude but dont know if he will play "100%" this season, specially on a "rental" team after all the headlines, rumors and the family stuff...

mavs777 · 12-26-2010, 10:50 PM

Why would I want a selfish player on this team? I sure as hell wouldn't. But obviously Carmello isn't, the reason he is taking so many shots is cause he has to, Billups is on the decline, Karl doesn't like to play J.R with Carmello cause he steals shots from him. He is also a defensive upgrade over Butler and a great rebounder, gets to the line a ton and shoots 80% there

mavs777 · 12-26-2010, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sefant77

And his sister passing away days ago? I dont wanna sound rude but dont know if he will play "100%" this season, specially on a "rental" team after all the headlines, rumors and the family stuff...

What a terrible thing to say