Mavs Mid Season Report

[tcat075]

Part 1 and Part 2 of the Mavs Moneyball report are up, and good reads. However, I'm kind of interested in seeing what you guys think, too. The questions I asked in the report are below:

What is the biggest surprise, and the biggest disappointment, so far?
One word that best describes the season so far.
Favorite game this year?
Biggest strength and weakness of the Mavericks going forward?
Who or what do you want to watch the most headed forwards?
How do you see the season ending?

Pick just one question to answer or all of them, I don't care.

[jcm28]

-Surprise: Chandler Disappointment: Butler's injury

-Word: Promising

-Fav Game: Personally I loved snapping the Heat's streak for the second time

-Strength: Dirkness, Haywood+Chandler in that C spot

-Weakness: Not enough scoring when Dirk's not playing (except for the inconsistent Terry)

-I want to see that Iggy trade happen. If not Iggy, then another good tall winger who can pump some more energy into the aging team.

-Quite honestly I think we lose in the west finals, but if we can start playing like we did before the Caron+Dirk injury then anything is possible.

[tcat075]

Originally Posted by jcm28

-Surprise: Chandler Disappointment: Butler's injury

-Word: Promising

-Fav Game: Personally I loved snapping the Heat's streak for the second time

-Strength: Dirkness, Haywood+Chandler in that C spot

-Weakness: Not enough scoring when Dirk's not playing (except for the inconsistent Terry)

-I want to see that Iggy trade happen. If not Iggy, then another good tall winger who can pump some more energy into the aging team.

-Quite honestly I think we lose in the west finals, but if we can start playing like we did before the Caron+Dirk injury then anything is possible.

At the very least its better than a first round exit, though obviously were looking for rings this time.

Oh, and while I think Iggy is a good player, I don't think he's what we need...as you said, we need scoring besides Dirk and while Iguodala isn't quite Marion on the offensive end, he's not Butler either.

[jcm28]

Originally Posted by tcat075

At the very least its better than a first round exit, though obviously were looking for rings this time.

Oh, and while I think Iggy is a good player, I don't think he's what we need...as you said, we need scoring besides Dirk and while Iguodala isn't quite Marion on the offensive end, he's not Butler either.

So who do you suggest we get instead of Iggy? Its true that he's not the best scorer in the league but our fastbreak plays would rock with the Jkidd+Iggy combination.

[tcat075]

Originally Posted by jcm28

So who do you suggest we get instead of Iggy? Its true that he's not the best scorer in the league but our fastbreak plays would rock with the Jkidd+Iggy combination.

I hate to be boring, but its gotta be Stephen Jackson. Maybe Harris, before the Carmelo deal went kaput, or Kevin Martin if he was more available, but that's about it. Jackson has to be it...he a prolific scorer, and a team that can only score 87 against the freaking Nets need that.

[CadBane]

Haywood is in no way, shape or form involved in any strength.

Unless said strength involves being a lazy bum.

[jcm28]

Originally Posted by CadBane

Haywood is in no way, shape or form involved in any strength.

Unless said strength involves being a lazy bum.

You're probably right but I prefer him over, say, a washed-up/injury prone Dampier coming off the bench.

[mav4ever]

1. surprise: just how good chandler has been, in many ways.

2. disappointment: that bobo heals with the speed and youthfulness of a 90 year old.

3. word? barbaro

4. fav game: upsetting the cHeat so bad labron tried to run over his little coach (ya, i spelled it wrong on purpose.)

5. strength: our early domination of all the top teams in the league.

6. weakness: depth @ center and jason terry in the first 36 minutes of seemingly every game.

7. watching the rest of the season: want to see if we are prepared to do anything it takes to get dirk what he deserves before its too late (front office)

8. how will it end? i think it completely depends on number 7...... if our eforts to replace the experience and production of caron butler end with peja,,,,,,,,, 1st round exit, 2nd round tops.......... if a big move is made to get someone in here that dirk can rely on,,,,,,, skies the limit.

[grndmstr_c]

You are very mistaken if you think Jax is a prolific scorer.

[BGMaverick9]

Originally Posted by grndmstr_c

You are very mistaken if you think Jax is a prolific scorer.

Right, the scary thing? The options get incredibly dry after you take Jackson out of the mix and you're only looking at lighter contract players.

[grndmstr_c]

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

Right, the scary thing? The options get incredibly dry after you take Jackson out of the mix and you're only looking at lighter contract players.

Perhaps true, but I also think the need will eventually prove to be less than present circumstances have conspired to make it appear. The team that took the floor tonight was still well short of what can reasonably be called full strength.

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by grndmstr_c

Perhaps true, but I also think the need will eventually prove to be less than present circumstances have conspired to make it appear. The team that took the floor tonight was still well short of what can reasonably be called full strength.

I'm not even thinking about trades for small forwards anymore. Pavlovic and Peja should be able to provide decent enough contributions to compliment Marion AND allow him to go back to backup up at PF (which is a key).

I'm far, far more interested in backup PG right now.

[grndmstr_c]

Originally Posted by jthig32

I'm not even thinking about trades for small forwards anymore. Pavlovic and Peja should be able to provide decent enough contributions to compliment Marion AND allow him to go back to backup up at PF (which is a key).

I'm far, far more interested in backup PG right now.

I have to say that I'm a little fixated on JR Smith at the moment, but outside of that I'm right there with you.

[BGMaverick9]

Originally Posted by jthig32

I'm not even thinking about trades for small forwards anymore. Pavlovic and Peja should be able to provide decent enough contributions to compliment Marion AND allow him to go back to backup up at PF (which is a key).

I'm far, far more interested in backup PG right now.

Hinrich (my favorite choice) is hurt now
Billups is a longshot
Beno is expensive as hell

[mavs777]

Originally Posted by jthig32

I'm not even thinking about trades for small forwards anymore. Pavlovic and Peja should be able to provide decent enough contributions to compliment Marion AND allow him to go back to backup up at PF (which is a key).

I'm far, far more interested in backup PG right now.

They can be ok but I still think we need another play maker, even if Roddy gives us 15 PPG, preferably a big wing, if we don't get 1 than i would prefer a backup point and some rebounding help (this is an obvious weakness of the team)

[jcm28]

Originally Posted by jthig32

I'm not even thinking about trades for small forwards anymore. Pavlovic and Peja should be able to provide decent enough contributions to compliment Marion AND allow him to go back to backup up at PF (which is a key).

I'm far, far more interested in backup PG right now.

Its true that with Peja we have a lot of depth at SF, but neither Peja nor Sasha can offer what Butler offered. I still think that our only way of being able to compete for the title this season is if we somehow trade Butler for another SF good enough to start for us.

[mavs777]

I have moved over to the side of Crash and Iggy, given neither gives up Roddy, the reason is we get another scorer (while neither are number 2 options to be honest), we get great rebounders for the positions they play (rebounding is an issue), and they both can really defend. Hopefully roddy can come back and give us 15 or so PPG while being efficient, plus Iggy/Wallace I think that would be enough to make us a legit contender

[BGMaverick9]

Originally Posted by mavs777

I have moved over to the side of Crash and Iggy, given neither gives up Roddy, the reason is we get another scorer (while neither are number 2 options to be honest), we get great rebounders for the positions they play (rebounding is an issue), and they both can really defend. Hopefully roddy can come back and give us 15 or so PPG while being efficient, plus Iggy/Wallace I think that would be enough to make us a legit contender

They're already hesitant on Jackson's deal....I highly doubt they're willing to bite the bullet on Iggy.

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by tcat075

Part 1 and Part 2 of the Mavs Moneyball report are up, and good reads. However, I'm kind of interested in seeing what you guys think, too. The questions I asked in the report are below:

What is the biggest surprise, and the biggest disappointment, so far?
One word that best describes the season so far.
Favorite game this year?
Biggest strength and weakness of the Mavericks going forward?
Who or what do you want to watch the most headed forwards?
How do you see the season ending?

Pick just one question to answer or all of them, I don't care.

1. Biggest surprise is Chandler by a mile. He's been a revelation. Biggest disappointment is a tie between Roddy being hurt and Haywood being the lazy contract whore that everyone always accused Damp of being (but were wrong).

2. Frustrating

3. Biggest strength is their defense, which I consider legit. Biggest weakness is their lack of offensive firepower after Dirk.

4. I want to see Roddy.

5. No freaking idea.

[cuckold]

spurs lost tonight to new orleans

[LonghornDub]

As far as I'm concerned, the most important thing is just getting more scoring at the 1, 2, or 3. Whether it's a backup PG, a starting SF, a starting SG, whatever, we just have to have more offense from at least one of those three positions.

I don't wanna get too hung up on which of those things we need more than the other, because at the end of the day, I'm not sure it matters. What we really need more than anything is another guy (or 2) who can score some.

[mac222b]

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

As far as I'm concerned, the most important thing is just getting more scoring at the 1, 2, or 3. Whether it's a backup PG, a starting SF, a starting SG, whatever, we just have to have more offense from at least one of those three positions.

I don't wanna get too hung up on which of those things we need more than the other, because at the end of the day, I'm not sure it matters. What we really need more than anything is another guy (or 2) who can score some.

I'm inclined to agree with this. Another consistent scoring option(or two)is what is needed most, regardless of position.

[jcm28]

I think it would also be alot to ask for him to score around 15 ppg once he comes back as well (and thats IF RC plays him as much as we are hoping he will).

[jthig32]

Hmm. Now I'm confused. I'm pretty sure Wally Z expired this past season. There was a big story about whether they would trade him or take the salary savings.

Must look into this further.

[BGMaverick9]

Originally Posted by jthig32

Hmm. Now I'm confused. I'm pretty sure Wally Z expired this past season. There was a big story about whether they would trade him or take the salary savings.

Must look into this further.

http://www.shamsports.com/whatthedeuce.htm

I'm thinking the bold is the situation.

Your team's free agents have what is called a "cap hold." This is an amount of money that is charged to your team's salary cap number, even though the player isn't under contract. This is a deliberate ploy that exists to close a loophole; if cap holds didn't exist, it's theoretically possible for a team to have its entire roster become free agents at the same time, have their entire cap to spend on other team's free agents, and then use Bird rights to re-sign their own ones afterwards. And that would be disingenuous. This way, your free agents eat into your cap room, forcing you to prioritise a bit better. And the players below have cap holds (also known as "free agent amounts") that have not yet been renounced, making them technically interesting. Technically.

If you waive a player, they are automatically renounced, and so will not have a cap hold. If a player signs with another NBA team, they also no longer have a cap hold to their former team. And if a player retires (by which I mean he properly retires, sending official retirement paperwork to league and everything, and not just informally saying that they've retired), then their free agent amount is removed too. However, players often don't formally retire until they're eligible for their NBA pension, and the reason for that (other than laziness) is that many of them still have cap holds with NBA teams, which means that they can still be incorporated into sign and trades as salary filler for trades. It would be an extremely impossible thing to imagine had it not already happened: at the 2007 trade deadline, Aaron McKie and Keith Van Horn were both signed and traded to complete deals while being unofficially retired, earning them 7 figures worth of free cheddar. And all they had to do was not file the retirement paperwork. It's implausible, but it happens. (Similarly, if a player's contract with an NBA team expires without him going through waivers, and he then signs with a non-NBA team, he will continue to have a cap hold until he's renounced.)

[jthig32]

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

http://www.shamsports.com/whatthedeuce.htm

I'm thinking the bold is the situation.

Yeah, you're right. That's just a cap hold, not a salary slot.

So no, they're not in the LT. I'm fairly confident of that.

[BGMaverick9]

Originally Posted by jthig32

Yeah, you're right. That's just a cap hold, not a salary slot.

So no, they're not in the LT. I'm fairly confident of that.

Either way...if the Mavs wanted Sessions, I'm sure he could be had on the cheap.

They are a LOOOOONG way from resembling an NBA team, might as well stockpile assets and reduce payroll.

[mac222b]

Sessions was also playing really well for them last 4 games: 15/6 assists, 21/9 and 1 turnover in 31mins, 19/8/5to's in 38mins. and 22/4 and 14/16! from the FT line in just 34 minutes. That's absolutely Maggette-esque
Then he went out with an abdominal strain.
This leads me to believe they'd want more than just savings for him.

[BGMaverick9]

Originally Posted by mac222b

Sessions was also playing really well for them last 4 games: 15/6 assists, 21/9 and 1 turnover in 31mins, 19/8/5to's in 38mins. and 22/4 and 14/16! from the FT line in just 34 minutes. That's absolutely Maggette-esque
Then he went out with an abdominal strain.
This leads me to believe they'd want more than just savings for him.

Playing well leads you to think they'll look for more than savings? Salary dumps happen plenty of times.

A player like Sessions won't get them dramatically better right now and that kind of player won't get them a player back that can make them better right now, they are several years away. Reduce the payroll and get a pick or an exception to work on for the future.

[mac222b]

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

Playing well leads you to think they'll look for more than savings? Salary dumps happen plenty of times.

A player like Sessions won't get them dramatically better right now and that kind of player won't get them a player back that can make them better right now, they are several years away. Reduce the payroll and get a pick or an exception to work on for the future.

Possibly. I think they may actually say he's been playing well, we're gonna need a little more. I think that's conceivable. Rip Hamilton being on the Pistons bench isn't helping his value. If he put together a stretch of good games... it probably still wouldn't but you get my point.

[mac222b]

I think in fact that Sessions becomes a more desirable back-up point than Udrih now that we have Peja to help spread the floor. Sessions isn't much of a 3point shooter, to put it mildly, but that seems less of a need now. He's also cheaper than Udrih and can conceivably be gotten for a TE.
If Chauncey and Devin aren't going to be available i'd say it's a no- brainer.

[mavs777]

Its pretty amazing Sessions is just 24 is it just me or does it seem he has been in the league a lot longer?

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by mavs777

Its pretty amazing Sessions is just 24 is it just me or does it seem he has been in the league a lot longer?

3 teams in 4 seasons can make it look longer than it is...


(oh, and I'd LOVE to have Sessions on this team - much better than Barea!)

[Luc]

How do you see the season ending?

First round if we don't sort SF out.

[spreedom]

What is the biggest surprise, and the biggest disappointment, so far? Chandler and Haywood.
One word that best describes the season so far. Tumultuous.
Favorite game this year? Nov 26th vs Spurs, Jan 19 vs Lakers.
Biggest strength and weakness of the Mavericks going forward? Strength is our defense, weakness is consistent second scoring option that can create his own shot.
Who or What do you want to watch the most headed forwards? Want to see DeShawn continue lighting it up from downtown, also hoping for a trade for Jax/Crash/Iggy/Tayshaun.
How do you see the season ending? First-round loss if no trades, WCF if good wingman acquired.

Regarding getting Ramon Sessions, I don't think the Cavs would be as deperate to trade him/his contract as you might think. Yes, salary dumps do happen, but rarely involving cheap players that are close to their primes. I could see us possibly using a TE in combination with a future first-rounder (and really, that should be the going market for a top backup PG: cap space and a mid-late first), but sending them nothing and hoping to get a significant backup is probably not going to happen.

[BGMaverick9]

Originally Posted by spreedom

Regarding getting Ramon Sessions, I don't think the Cavs would be as deperate to trade him/his contract as you might think. Yes, salary dumps do happen, but rarely involving cheap players that are close to their primes. I could see us possibly using a TE in combination with a future first-rounder (and really, that should be the going market for a top backup PG: cap space and a mid-late first), but sending them nothing and hoping to get a significant backup is probably not going to happen.

Sessions at his prime is going to do what exactly for the Cavaliers?
What you suggested is essentially a salary dump lol

They're just going to want picks, money or something to slowly build off of for the future.

[spreedom]

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

Sessions at his prime is going to do what exactly for the Cavaliers?
What you suggested is essentially a salary dump lol

They're just going to want picks, money or something to slowly build off of for the future.

Yep, Sessions' fault that the team stinks.

Honestly, he probably has more trade value than anyone else on that team considering his age, skillset, and contract (unless you are a believer that JJ Hickson is suddenly going to get it with a different team). There is a HUGE difference between trading for a TPE only (that would expire this coming offseason, as the Cavs would then be under the cap) or getting a TPE/1st rounder. Even IF they stayed over the cap and had what would be a $4M TPE, what player is out there that they could possibly get without also trading their own first-rounder? Sessions is a huge bargain at ~$4M per, and I am pretty confident that the Cavs recognize that.

Other than simply dumping salary (which they don't need to do at ~$6M under the cap), what would the Cavs' incentive be to trade him? If they would be trading anyone, it would be the high-priced guys they have like Jamison and Mo Williams. I don't see any way they trade Sessions for money reasons unless he is a throw-in with a larger salaried player or if they're going much younger (i.e. prospect or pick).