Mavs win @ Knicks: 3-7

[cinemablend]

Dirk almost had to score 40 for them to win.... and the only reason they even got to OT is because The Knicks LET them in the final minutes of regulation by abandoning their style and trying to run out the clock.

Before the Knicks stupidly started playing run out the clock, they had this game WELL in hand and Dallas had started doing exactly what they do in ever 4th quarter... which is turn turtle and suck.

The Knicks lost, Dallas did not win.

There is no reason at all to be encouraged by this.

I'm happy because finally I got to watch a game with a good result, but anybody who thinks this means the team is going to suddenly turn it around is fooling themselves. Even the worst teams win once in awhile.

[candid_snoop41]

Originally Posted by cinemablend

Dirk almost had to score 40 for them to win.... and the only reason they even got to OT is because The Knicks LET them in the final minutes of regulation by abandoning their style and trying to run out the clock.

Before the Knicks stupidly started playing run out the clock, they had this game WELL in hand and Dallas had started doing exactly what they do in ever 4th quarter... which is turn turtle and suck.

The Knicks lost, Dallas did not win.

There is no reason at all to be encouraged by this.

I'm happy because finally I got to watch a game with a good result, but anybody who thinks this means the team is going to suddenly turn it around is fooling themselves. Even the worst teams win once in awhile.

You might as well argue that the mavs came up with timely stops in the 4th and won a close game against a GOOD team down the stretch...at this point all that counts is Ws

Great game by dirk. Everyone who is still bashing the team - s*** it

[Zki41]

Great game by dirk.

Yes this is true

Everyone who is still bashing the team - s*** it

If we lie to ourselves and say this is going to make a difference, it's not. We're just going to make ourselves miserable by being happy and content with the way Mavericks Basketball is right now. Something BIG has to be done.

[ghazi]

my biggest concerns are bench play and defense.

The bench seems to lack talent. Bass sucks, Stackhouse sucks, Terry is the only reliable player, Wright has no offense, Barea is a midget, George? To be honest, I'd rather see George than Stackhouse. Atleast one can backup his terrible shot selection with some defense and rebounding.


The defense? Seems to lack effort, discipline, positioning, and roster necessary to be elite. But we were like 7th-8th in league last year I think, which isn't bad, but isn't terrible in the way the Jazz/Suns were last year... I think we're 20ish so far? What gives for the dropoff? Under a defensive minded coach, no less?

Win doesn't mean much, but it feels good ... hopefully it helps the team get out of a funk.

if we lose the next 2 games, we definitely suck.

I'll be pleased with a split.

[ghazi]

I think something big has to be done too, but what can be done? What are the trading chips?

trading Howard would be a lateral move IMO. The only reason the Gasol/Artest trades were huge for the Lakers/Rockets is because they gave up spares.

We'd need someone to take some spares off of our hands.... either for a consistent bench player, a backup PG, or a starting shooting guard (VINCE CARTER !!)

plus, so far, he's (Howard) turned it around. His jumpshot looks more consistent, plus he's attacking the basket instead of the patented stepback jumper that vexed everyone toward the end of last season

[ghazi]

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Here is one thing to think about. If we had lost home games to Houston, Cleveland, the Lakers, and Orlando over the course of the season...would that really raise any eyebrows? Those are very good teams, among the best teams in the league. We just happened to have to face them all at home four in a row to start the year. Would have been nice to have some patsies in there...but the schedule is what it is.

Let's not count the little mavericks out just yet!

But the problem is, we're 1-5 versus playoff teams from last year, continuing a late season trend last year of losing to teams w/ winning records. If we started out with a bunch of patsies, then it would've just been fools gold. We have to do good against the teams we are gonna face in the postseason.

As fans we want to think the Mavs are contenders, and since when do contenders start 2-7 and 0-4 on their homecourt, regardless of schedule? We've still yet to play the Suns, Hornets, Jazz, Pistons, celtics, etc. Our early schedule hasn't been easy, but it hasn't been terribly difficult at the same time. It's been very discouraging to me. Last year this team tricked me up until the 2nd half of the 1st game of the playoffs into thinking they were contenders... after the 3rd game v Cleveland I started to think we lack the stuff of champions this year. But, I think we can get better.

I remember the Lakers and Bulls during championship runs had some poor starts, but poor for them was like .500 through 15-20 games, not 2-7.

We'll see what happens, perhaps you're right.

[basketballgirl25]

Originally Posted by ghazi

We'd need someone to take some spares off of our hands.... either for a consistent bench player, a backup PG, or a starting shooting guard (VINCE CARTER !!)

Vince Carter and Kidd playing together isn't a good idea, choose another player they didn't win in NJ and they wouldn't win in Dallas either and Mavericks could be more screwed if they traded for Vince Carter and I trade for Vince Carter would prob have to be for a good player. or great things for the future. like draft picks and such not crappy things Dallas has.

[Dirkadirkastan]

wat

[antoinewalker]

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

So maybe that's why nobody said "the Mavericks beat a good team." The person said, "The Mavericks beat a winning team." There's a difference.

i see someone is in law school.

[catsil]

Originally Posted by fluid.forty.one

haha

this video was linked to that one and it made me laugh out loud

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YvKwa...eature=related

Wow, thats hilarious!! ...and sadly eerily similar to the Kidd/Singleton fumble up that led to the David Lee layup-and-one.

[Willstar]

Originally Posted by basketballgirl25

Vince Carter and Kidd playing together isn't a good idea, choose another player they didn't win in NJ and they wouldn't win in Dallas either and Mavericks could be more screwed if they traded for Vince Carter and I trade for Vince Carter would prob have to be for a good player. or great things for the future. like draft picks and such not crappy things Dallas has.

are you german? like me?=

[Dirkenstien]

Good to see our boys finally get a W. Let's see if this builds any momentum and gets things on track. Dirk played great and Howard was assertive. Good game.

[SMC0007]

Great to see Howard in the 4th Qrtr. I liked how Carlisle had him out there with the 2nd team early 4th to carry the scoring load, I think it's a great idea to keep him in the game.

I'm happy for the win at this point and surely it is at least something to build on. We held them to 2 pts in OT, thats a solid! That is pretty rare.

[jayC]

4th quarter collapses and a real lack of energy on hustle plays has been the mo of this club for the last 40 or so games with Kidd. Singleton was good at getting second chance points. Dirk was great going to the basket and hitting his patient fifteen foot fadeaway jumpshot. Let's see what happens at the half way point before we start to draw any conclusions.

[horse900703]

huge win for us

[Eman]

Patience People!!!!!! wait for 20-30 games before we start to draw conclusions. Carlisle is still trying to find the best lineup. the Mav's will get better.

[Sportstudi]

Originally Posted by jayC

4th quarter collapses and a real lack of energy on hustle plays has been the mo of this club for the last 40 or so games with Kidd. Singleton was good at getting second chance points. Dirk was great going to the basket and hitting his patient fifteen foot fadeaway jumpshot. Let's see what happens at the half way point before we start to draw any conclusions.

I agree. But Dirk struggled in the third and the early fourth quarter because he didn't get enough shots. From midway of the third until the end of the fourth he was stone cold. Dirk is IMO a rhythm shooter and you have to feed him on a consistent basis. Otherwise his game might falter in the end.

[alby]

Now win another 4 games in a roll to get to .500

[pepe]

Originally Posted by alby

Now win another 4 games in a roll to get to .500

that be sweet. I also want to see Bass having great games, I want his stock to go up up up, so we can package him with Stack for a good player

Since christmas is coming, I want to see George coming back into the rotation. Singleton and Green getting more pt and getting Marbury after the buyout.

Make it happen Santa.

[basketballgirl25]

Originally Posted by pepe

that be sweet. I also want to see Bass having great games, I want his stock to go up up up, so we can package him with Stack for a good player

Since christmas is coming, I want to see George coming back into the rotation. Singleton and Green getting more pt and getting Marbury after the buyout.

Make it happen Santa.

Marbury on the Mavericks, would he start? If he is playing backup too Kidd I'd wonder how long that will last before someone starts saying stuff. Look at the history of it all

[Kidd Karma]

A win is a win....at this point for the Mavs. Hopefully Cuban got a chance to talk with Marbury laying the ground work a possible signing. I think he's ideal as a backup point, the ability to score and play the point with starter minutes. Mavs first win against a winning team last year was against the Warriors, who play a similar up and down pace like....the Suns, who the Mavs also beat last year, and the coach of the Suns was, D'Antoni....no coincidence. The Mavs need to continue to push the ball to be successful throughout the game, that can't play at a snail's pace. Get Dirk more shots in the 2nd half.

I'd like to see Kidd more in control in the 4th. I feel his atttitude to defer when it gets late hurts the team. He still has to create and run the basic offensive sets, to make the game easier. He has an open lane to the rim, he has to finish or at least draw a weakside defender so that the Mavs get the offensive board.

[Rick41]

Originally Posted by basketballgirl25

Vince Carter and Kidd playing together isn't a good idea, choose another player they didn't win in NJ and they wouldn't win in Dallas either and Mavericks could be more screwed if they traded for Vince Carter and I trade for Vince Carter would prob have to be for a good player. or great things for the future. like draft picks and such not crappy things Dallas has.

Originally Posted by Dirkadirkastan

wat

double wat

[basketballgirl25]

Originally Posted by Rick41

double wat

ghazi said you a post mavs need a backup pg or a a starting shooting guard (VINCE CARTER !!)

just like that and I was saying the Vince Carter and Kidd thing on the same team didn't work out, it wouldn't work out for VC to be on Dallas and how would dallas get him they have nothing the Nets would want. that's all I was saying

[Kidd Karma]

VC is an ISO type player. The Nets tried to change his game, but Frarnk was frustrated and when asked at STH meeting, he said that it's hard to teach old dogs new tricks. I felt VC had a great jump shot to be a catch and shoot guy getting passes from Kidd, but he'd catch the pass and just hold it, then start dribbling and going one on one with the defender, when you do that, you make the game easier for the opponents. He will never be the slashing, motion type player. Plus I think Kidd has a grudge against VC, because VC doesn't work hard on his game, when VC got his extension last summer, Kidd went and asked for an extension, but didn't get it, he started a trade me brouhaha, and well he's in Dallas now. I don't think Kidd's game really meshes well with VC's. I think Redd would be a better player in my mind for Kidd's game. Watching Randolph, wouldn't he look nice with the Mavs? Sure the defense would suck, but man, getting automatic points down low? IT wouldn't cost too much either, Stack and Diop, should get it done. Then it becomes a 3 year plan with Dirk and the existing cast.....Redd's still my first choice.

[SMC0007]

REDD. KIDD. double d's to end the last name. Guaranteed championship.

[basketballgirl25]

Originally Posted by Kidd Karma

I don't think Kidd's game really meshes well with VC's. I think Redd would be a better player in my mind for Kidd's game.

that's pretty much what I was trying to say Kidd doesn't really go good with Carter. and I agree I think Redd would be a better player for Kidds game

[ghazi]

I expect this team to surpass .500 in early December amidst the 7 game home stretch. and God willing, never look back.

If we're not .500 by then, we suck, period. The only games we "should" lose during this time are @ Houston and @ Lakers. but of course, it is the NBA, sometimes you win when you're supposed to lose and vice versa.

Looking at those games, there really isn't any reason why we shouldn't go 6-1 or 7-0 during that stretch. Thunder, Clippres, and Bobcats are gimmes, and Nuggets/Suns/Spurs/Hawks are good, but very beatable, especially at home.

[Kidd Karma]

Originally Posted by basketballgirl25

that's pretty much what I was trying to say Kidd doesn't really go good with Carter. and I agree I think Redd would be a better player for Kidds game

Just the ability to catch and shoot makes him a perfect offensive weapon for Kidd. You mix that with Dirk and JHo's all around ability, Kidd would be in a candy store on the offensive end. When VC first got to NJ, VC deferred a lot to Kidd being the new comer, but once he got comfortable, the Nets would just ISO him on one side. But at the end of the day, a clone of Kittles would probably put this team in the conference finals. Kittles ability to defend the better guard, allows Kidd to free lance which he does best. The Nets were at their best defensively when Kittles and Kidd were the guards. Kittles has a respectable offensive game, slashing or catch and shooting from the stripe on in.

[Kidd Karma]

Originally Posted by ghazi

I expect this team to surpass .500 in early December amidst the 7 game home stretch. and God willing, never look back.

If we're not .500 by then, we suck, period. The only games we "should" lose during this time are @ Houston and @ Lakers. but of course, it is the NBA, sometimes you win when you're supposed to lose and vice versa.

Looking at those games, there really isn't any reason why we shouldn't go 6-1 or 7-0 during that stretch. Thunder, Clippres, and Bobcats are gimmes, and Nuggets/Suns/Spurs/Hawks are good, but very beatable, especially at home.

Spurs beat Houston the other night, anything can happen. "oh it's just the Mavs." then boom we upset them on the road.

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by ghazi

I expect this team to surpass .500 in early December amidst the 7 game home stretch. and God willing, never look back.

If we're not .500 by then, we suck, period. The only games we "should" lose during this time are @ Houston and @ Lakers. but of course, it is the NBA, sometimes you win when you're supposed to lose and vice versa.

Looking at those games, there really isn't any reason why we shouldn't go 6-1 or 7-0 during that stretch. Thunder, Clippres, and Bobcats are gimmes, and Nuggets/Suns/Spurs/Hawks are good, but very beatable, especially at home.

Clipps are NO gimmie!!!!! Baron Davis has the magic wand on us. Makes me ILL to watch him play us. I circle this one.

[fluid.forty.one]

no games are "gimmes" at this point

[sike]

Originally Posted by Kidd Karma

IT wouldn't cost too much either, Stack and Diop, should get it done. Then it becomes a 3 year plan with Dirk and the existing cast.....Redd's still my first choice.

So the Knicks do it as a salary dumb?

Every time I've ever mentioned Zach Randolph around here...I've gotten a ton of bricks dropped on me. I admit he has been a dog, but he has been on dog teams.

Of course, how would he and Dirk co exist? Dirk and the 4 and Zach at the 5...talk about a terrible defensive team. But one would think that just having a legit offensive post threat would limit opponent's willingness to double Dirk. At this point, I'm willing to do anything to shake things up (especially if all it requires is moving Stack or Diop and spending Cuban's cash). I just don't see this current cast getting deep into the playoffs.

[LSMF]

Originally Posted by fluid.forty.one

no games are "gimmes" at this point

+1, how can anyone say we have "gimmes" at this point? We need to get better defensively and offensively, this team has alot of work to do.

[LonghornDub]

This team needs a low post threat. I personally feel that that's way more important than a SG, but that's just my take.

[Kidd Karma]

Originally Posted by sike

So the Knicks do it as a salary dumb?

Every time I've ever mentioned Zach Randolph around here...I've gotten a ton of bricks dropped on me. I admit he has been a dog, but he has been on dog teams.

Of course, how would he and Dirk co exist? Dirk and the 4 and Zach at the 5...talk about a terrible defensive team. But one would think that just having a legit offensive post threat would limit opponent's willingness to double Dirk. At this point, I'm willing to do anything to shake things up (especially if all it requires is moving Stack or Diop and spending Cuban's cash). I just don't see this current cast getting deep into the playoffs.

At this point, yea, I'd try anything, seems a guy driving a hummer can score against our defense.

[sike]

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

This team needs a low post threat. I personally feel that that's way more important than a SG, but that's just my take.

I'd agree with this. But I would say it depends on the quality of the player. For example, I'd take an exceptional SG over a "good" post scorer. All things being equal, I'd go with the post scorer though.

[fluid.forty.one]

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

This team needs a low post threat. I personally feel that that's way more important than a SG, but that's just my take.

Technically, we made it to the finals without a low post threat.. but it took an otherworldy playoff performance from Dirk and a lot of luck. It sure would have been easier with one.

And honestly it's pretty obvious we won't be able to repeat that, at least "exact", success with the state of mind the organization is in right now.

[Kidd Karma]

Originally Posted by sike

I'd agree with this. But I would say it depends on the quality of the player. For example, I'd take an exceptional SG over a "good" post scorer. All things being equal, I'd go with the post scorer though.

Oh yea, no doubt, it's easier to get points from 5 feet out then 20 feet out. Plus the inside guy gets you a few more open looks from the perimeter. Redd won't get you a few more open looks, but you'd balance the floor better with a guy like Redd.

[sike]

With a guy like Randolph on the block, I think Terry could come pretty close to Redd Jr.

[LSMF]

Seriously guys Randolph is not so much of a post presence, he's a jumpshooter. I've seen alot of his games and this guys shoots alot of jumpshots, think about it have you ever even seen Randolph dunk? This guy is not the answer, and his defense sucks also.