Butler/Haywood/Stevenson to the Mavs!! - Page 17 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

twistaeffect2004 · 02-16-2010, 01:26 AM

Call me crazy, but I think Stevenson has a chance to also ignite something in himself here. I think he became stagnant with the Wiz, but he's been a pretty nice role player in the past. He can hit the three on occasion and he's a good defender. There's no doubt about it, he has a couple screws loose up there, but hell, we need some of those players. I like the toughness he brings. He's an upgrade compared to what we had.

mary · 02-16-2010, 01:37 AM

Is Stevenson being waived?

badfish22 · 02-16-2010, 01:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Male28Dan

God I hate poor spelling. That is all.

cool story bra

Quote:

Originally Posted by mary

Is Stevenson being waived?

no hes contract is too long.

alby · 02-16-2010, 01:46 AM

I don't mind having Stevenson to throw at Kobe to give Caron and Marion a brief rest on defense. It's better than watching JET or JJB try to stop him in the post.

Underdog · 02-16-2010, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alby

I don't mind having Stevenson to throw at Kobe to give Caron and Marion a brief rest on defense. It's better than watching JET or JJB try to stop him in the post.

How does Stevenson's defense compare to Ross?

(I know almost nothing about the guy.)

alby · 02-16-2010, 01:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

How does Stevenson's defense compare to Ross?

(I know almost nothing about the guy.)

Other than his antics in calling out the King, he is actually a pretty decent basketball player. He can hit the corner three and he can move his feet fairly well on defense; he came into the league as a high flyer, but he quickly found his niche as a player after he left the noose that was Jerry Sloan. He's also pretty physical as a player, I never viewed Ross as being someone that was intimidating defensively so that to me is the biggest difference. Maybe the beard is blinding me, but DeShawn would scare me if I were to go up against him.

AO41 · 02-16-2010, 01:56 AM

I agree with those that say Stevenson has something to bring. Hes tough and a little crazy. But he has been good in the past and averaged double digits 2 years ago. I think he will bring some spot up shooting and some good/ tough D

badfish22 · 02-16-2010, 01:58 AM

Hes gonna have to really earn his minutes though. And we all know how hard that can be with Rick.

alby · 02-16-2010, 02:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by badfish22

Hes gonna have to really earn his minutes though. And we all know how hard that can be with Rick.

I agree. He is clearly not a consistent rotation player. But he can be someone that can be effective if put in the right situation (ie guard big time swingmen when our main guys are in foul trouble and/or tired)

G-Man · 02-16-2010, 03:17 AM

I'm really disappointed in all the Josh bashing on this thread. True, he's not the smartest guy in the NBA, but in a sports world with Michael Vick, where all the baseball records from the last 15 years went to cheaters, Josh's off the court stuff is miniscle. This week, 30 million Americans will smoke a joint, thousands of teenagers will drag race, and at the next Mavs game, hundreds will fail to salute the flag, and no one will care about any of it.

On the court, he was always capable of doing something dumb, but despite his BB-iq score, the guy had a solid career here and helped the Mavs win most of the games he played in. He had many huge games and hit many big shots. I cheered for every one. He was averaging 19.9 right up until he got hurt. He suffered through last season after getting a serious ankle injury in November. He could not walk during the playoffs without limping, but he took a shot of something and gutted it out. He scored 25 in that first game in SA to steal back home court advantage, and averaged 19 for the series. He got us out of the 1st round for the 1st time since the finals year. Watching that series, my level of respect for the guy went way up. I think he deserves way more respect than people here are dishing out.

He had surgery. He is still in pain when he plays. That's not really his fault. I wish he'd been born smarter, but if he was, we would have never gotten him with the 29th pick. He is who he is...the 2nd or 3rd best player on my team for many of its best years. The Josh hate on here seems unseemly. The idea that he quit trying after Harris was traded or he got the contract is contradicted by the statistics, which did not start to drop until he got hurt.

After his injury, he may never play the same again. That saddens me. The Mavs can't afford to wait and see. I love the trade. Swapping a gimpy Josh for a healthy guy who's smarter and more skilled is wonderful. I wish Josh luck. I'm just really disappointed that so few here seem to remember any of the good stuff he did, or cut him any slack for being hurt. I think thats a crappy way for fans to act.

ty · 02-16-2010, 03:57 AM

Centerpiece of the trade............b*atches!

blessednegr0 · 02-16-2010, 04:01 AM

So, I rarely post here... But I agree 110923801924% with G-Man. Josh did a lot of good here for the Mavericks. We just tried to make him a player he wasnt... Plus the injuries really slowed him down.

I wish him the best. And he will still be one of my favorite players.

ty · 02-16-2010, 04:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

From a spurs board... From a spurs board...

Quote:

Quote:
ummm.
not only is this a great trade for the Mavs, they close the gap to the Lakers, it could also turn into a disaster trade for us, if we play the Mavs again in the PO.
you don't want to have Haywood cover Tim. (he will be a much tougher defender for Tim than Dampier). and even if Josh Howard always did a lot of damage to the Spurs, you also don't want to meet Caron Butler with Jefferson virtually the only option to guard him. Butler is a so much better passer and ball handler than JH, I'm really not looking forward to face all the plays the Mavs can run with him and Dirk, that JH couldn't.
Mavs have been a bad match up for us for years. with this trade the match ups turn even worse.

How you like them apples?

jthig32 · 02-16-2010, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alby

Other than his antics in calling out the King, he is actually a pretty decent basketball player. He can hit the corner three and he can move his feet fairly well on defense; he came into the league as a high flyer, but he quickly found his niche as a player after he left the noose that was Jerry Sloan. He's also pretty physical as a player, I never viewed Ross as being someone that was intimidating defensively so that to me is the biggest difference. Maybe the beard is blinding me, but DeShawn would scare me if I were to go up against him.

Stevenson shot 4 threes a game last year and made 27% of them......

I don't expect anything from Stevenson.

Murphy3 · 02-16-2010, 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G-Man

I'm really disappointed in all the Josh bashing on this thread. True, he's not the smartest guy in the NBA, but in a sports world with Michael Vick, where all the baseball records from the last 15 years went to cheaters, Josh's off the court stuff is miniscle. This week, 30 million Americans will smoke a joint, thousands of teenagers will drag race, and at the next Mavs game, hundreds will fail to salute the flag, and no one will care about any of it.

On the court, he was always capable of doing something dumb, but despite his BB-iq score, the guy had a solid career here and helped the Mavs win most of the games he played in. He had many huge games and hit many big shots. I cheered for every one. He was averaging 19.9 right up until he got hurt. He suffered through last season after getting a serious ankle injury in November. He could not walk during the playoffs without limping, but he took a shot of something and gutted it out. He scored 25 in that first game in SA to steal back home court advantage, and averaged 19 for the series. He got us out of the 1st round for the 1st time since the finals year. Watching that series, my level of respect for the guy went way up. I think he deserves way more respect than people here are dishing out.

He had surgery. He is still in pain when he plays. That's not really his fault. I wish he'd been born smarter, but if he was, we would have never gotten him with the 29th pick. He is who he is...the 2nd or 3rd best player on my team for many of its best years. The Josh hate on here seems unseemly. The idea that he quit trying after Harris was traded or he got the contract is contradicted by the statistics, which did not start to drop until he got hurt.

After his injury, he may never play the same again. That saddens me. The Mavs can't afford to wait and see. I love the trade. Swapping a gimpy Josh for a healthy guy who's smarter and more skilled is wonderful. I wish Josh luck. I'm just really disappointed that so few here seem to remember any of the good stuff he did, or cut him any slack for being hurt. I think thats a crappy way for fans to act.

Josh is an idiot.

sike · 02-16-2010, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Murphy3

Josh is an idiot.

something very close to THIS ^

Murphy3 · 02-16-2010, 11:19 AM

But hey, he's consistently an idiot at this point of his career. I guess all we can really ask for is consistency. And for that JHO, I thank you. Thank you for making the decision VERY easy for the Mavs.

Dirkenstien · 02-16-2010, 11:45 AM

As far as ability goes I'd much rather have Ross than Stevenson, but hey, we had to get him in the deal and he's an expiring next season so it's not that bad.

Kidd Karma · 02-16-2010, 12:14 PM

Stevenson's contract is not all bad. Nice negotiating ploy by Cuban to walk away from the table when Deshawn's name hit the brainstorm board. then said throw in Haywood and we'll take him. Stevenson's a movable chip by summer time with his expiring. It can be huge with the CBA up at the end of next year.

Rhylan · 02-16-2010, 12:22 PM

G-Man, I generally agree with the basis of your sentiment, but your argument doesn't hold up because... we've all seen Howard play disinterested and lazy with no correlation to injury. If anything, I thought last year's issues with ankle and wrist, when pressing him, seemed to give him something else to prove.

From early in the 2007-2008 season prior to last year's injuries, and again after returning this year, he was essentially healthy and had a recurring lack of effort.

For a guy who made himself a better career on the back of giving extra effort in his first couple of years, that's just unacceptable.

Skywalker · 02-16-2010, 12:41 PM

This gave me chills. Probably the best Caron Butler mix out there.

CapitanObvious · 02-16-2010, 01:02 PM

Underdog's sig is epic lol

alby · 02-16-2010, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

Stevenson shot 4 threes a game last year and made 27% of them......

I don't expect anything from Stevenson.

Wasn't Stevenson their #1 option last year at times? Gil, Jamison, Haywood, and Butler all missed games. I agree however that Stevenson isn't going to bring much. All I'm saying is that he may be useful at times, filling in that Ross void (with more range and physicality)

SMC0007 · 02-16-2010, 01:42 PM

Stevenson > Ross- offensively

Ross > Stevenson- defensively

jthig32 · 02-16-2010, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SMC0007

Stevenson > Ross- offensively

Ross > Stevenson- defensively

I agree, except that Ross at least knows to only shoot when he absolutely has to. If Stevenson isn't playing his role on offense he can become worse than Ross very quickly.

SMC0007 · 02-16-2010, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

I agree, except that Ross at least knows to only shoot when he absolutely has to. If Stevenson isn't playing his role on offense he can become worse than Ross very quickly.

imo, until proven otherwise. Ross > Stevenson as far as being a MAV.

jthig32 · 02-16-2010, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SMC0007

imo, until proven otherwise. Ross > Stevenson as far as being a MAV.

Definitely.

One caveat though, is that Stevenson clearly has better raw talent. Much better actually. And I'm a big believer in Carlisle and his ability to teach and get the best out of players.

So maybe I shouldn't discount Stevenson quite as much as I have so far.

Kidd Karma · 02-16-2010, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by twistaeffect2004

Call me crazy, but I think Stevenson has a chance to also ignite something in himself here. I think he became stagnant with the Wiz, but he's been a pretty nice role player in the past. He can hit the three on occasion and he's a good defender. There's no doubt about it, he has a couple screws loose up there, but hell, we need some of those players. I like the toughness he brings. He's an upgrade compared to what we had.

He gives us experience on the wing. Put up nice numbers in back to back seasons, one with Gil and then the 2nd without Gil. I think he needs regular minutes and needs to know his role to provide some good minutes, otherwise he'd just be another Carroll to us.

Rhylan · 02-16-2010, 02:18 PM

If Stevenson even considers looking for his own shot while on the court, he'll be sent to the end of the bench permanently. On this team, there's just no question about it, and no need to entertain him for any period of time beyond the minimum to establish whether or not he's gonna do what we could use him for.

I think he'll have 10-20 minutes of total game time over the next 4 or 5 games to show that he's 100% focused on being a defender and a hustle guy on this team. If he does anything more than shoot uncontested layups or wide open from the elbow, Carlisle will be there to yank him off stage with a cane like Sandman from Showtime at the Apollo.

There's just not any other role for him. He has to be like a Ruben Patterson in 2003, minus the ability to floor the ball and get to the rim. Lengthy, strong, athletic hustle defender.

Anything else, and he and Matt Carroll will be braiding each other's hair at the end of the bench.

sike · 02-16-2010, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhylan

There's just not any other role for him. He has to be like a Ruben Patterson in 2003, minus the ability to floor the ball and get to the rim. Lengthy, strong, athletic hustle defender.

I love the Patterson comparison...

sike · 02-16-2010, 02:25 PM

"I'm gonna sit down with coach (Carlisle) and talk to him about what areas he thinks I can improve on and whatever intangibles I can bring to this team I will to help bring a championship here"

Caron Butler

I can't help but love this guy. He brings a seriousness to the #2 option that I really like. Not to bury him further, but Josh just always seemed like a big kid whereas Caron is a MAN.

alby · 02-16-2010, 02:29 PM

CARON IS FORTY

sike · 02-16-2010, 02:38 PM

Chuck Cooperstein says he can't remember a game that he has been more excited about calling in his 5 years with the Mavs...

twistaeffect2004 · 02-16-2010, 02:49 PM

This almost feels like a new start. The slate is wiped clean, and we have a new season to look forward too. Of course that isn't the case, but it just feels that way. It never felt (at least to me) that this team was right. Whether it because of injuries, inconsistent play, etc. But now it seems there is new life installed into not only the team, but the fan base and city. We'll see if these good feelings translate to success on the court, but as of right now, it feels like the Mavericks are back.

DirkFTW · 02-16-2010, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sike

Chuck Cooperstein says he can't remember a game that he has been more excited about calling in his 5 years with the Mavs...

Why do I feel like WraithXX is mere moments away from twisting your post into something abominable?

Dnowit41 · 02-16-2010, 02:51 PM

Can't wait for tonight's game. Counting down the hours already

jthig32 · 02-16-2010, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhylan

If Stevenson even considers looking for his own shot while on the court, he'll be sent to the end of the bench permanently. On this team, there's just no question about it, and no need to entertain him for any period of time beyond the minimum to establish whether or not he's gonna do what we could use him for.

I think he'll have 10-20 minutes of total game time over the next 4 or 5 games to show that he's 100% focused on being a defender and a hustle guy on this team. If he does anything more than shoot uncontested layups or wide open from the elbow, Carlisle will be there to yank him off stage with a cane like Sandman from Showtime at the Apollo.

There's just not any other role for him. He has to be like a Ruben Patterson in 2003, minus the ability to floor the ball and get to the rim. Lengthy, strong, athletic hustle defender.

Anything else, and he and Matt Carroll will be braiding each other's hair at the end of the bench.

Excellent points.

Big Boy Laroux · 02-16-2010, 03:25 PM

Anybody with a sweet grizzly adams beard AND a tattoo of abe lincoln has to bring something to the table.

That is my contribution to the discussion. You're welcome.

SMC0007 · 02-16-2010, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Boy Laroux

Anybody with a sweet grizzly adams beard AND a tattoo of abe lincoln has to bring something to the table.

That is my contribution to the discussion. You're welcome.

umm, strong to quite strong!?.

ReDirkulous Tyme · 02-16-2010, 03:41 PM

I concur with everyone that has the notion and vibe that this is almost like a new season, a fresh start. Although we have virtually no time to gel as a team and gear up for the playoffs, I am EXTREMELY optimistic about this current squad, I just wish we could have gotten rid of JJ

I also never felt as if this team was right. Always felt like when this team was clicking on all cylinders, with everyone going 110% the entire game that this was a scary good team. However, lack of effort, injuries, and roster changes never allowed that to happen. There are elements of its failure that couldn't have been helped or been foreseen. However, as scary as this team looked when fully healthy and motivated, I think our current squad is far more talented, skilled, and both mentally and physically tough and motivated.

Needless to say, just as many of you are, I'm quite, quite excited about the rest of this month.