09-27-2011, 07:06 PM
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#441
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 2,012
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Geez, Cleveland's just laying down for the Tigers.
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09-27-2011, 10:47 PM
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#442
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Golden Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,628
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Beltre, Napoli, and Nellie go back-to-back-to-back. lmao
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09-27-2011, 10:55 PM
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#443
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Guru
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Cowboys Country
Posts: 23,336
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mavspwnage
Beltre, Napoli, and Nellie go back-to-back-to-back. lmao
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Insult to injury?
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09-27-2011, 11:17 PM
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#444
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Golden Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,628
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man, the Rangers are bludgeoning the Angels as if they were Bob Crane.
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09-27-2011, 11:35 PM
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#445
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Guru
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Cowboys Country
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mavspwnage
man, the Rangers are bludgeoning the Angels as if they were Bob Crane.
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The sons of bitches deserved every bit of it.
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09-28-2011, 01:15 AM
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#446
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Guru
Join Date: May 2001
Location: sport
Posts: 39,432
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirobaito
The OPS+ of that club was 103, and the ERA+ was 113. They were actually better pitching than hitting, once the era/park was accounted for (i.e., steroids). Pudge's .300/.342/.473 was only league average. Ken Hill's 1996 (16-10, 3.63 ERA in 250.1 IP, 145 ERA+, 6.5 WAR) is criminally underappreciated.
The 2011 Rangers have an OPS+ of 108 and an ERA+ of 117.
EDIT: Speaking of Ken Hill, I vividly remember being at this game: http://www.baseball-reference.com/bo...99607170.shtml . I was eight years old at the time, but I remember Hill being lifted by Oates with two outs in the ninth and not being very happy about it (because my dad wasn't very happy about it).
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Yeah, I'm gonna go ahead and say bulsh on a couple of those stats. Again, I've learned to take all stats with a grain of salt. No one that was around following baseball would agree with the statement that the Rangers pitching was actually better than their hitting that year. If that's what some advanced metrics show, then the advanced metrics are wrong.
Trying to put a number to how much a ballpark impacts an offense is a good idea in theory, but it really cannot be done. Obviously playing in the ballpark has a positive imapct on offense, but how much compared to league average is something that we'll truly never know. There's simply no way to quantify all of the factors that would need to be quantified.
Last edited by Murphy3; 09-28-2011 at 01:21 AM.
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09-28-2011, 01:43 AM
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#447
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Golden Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,628
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A fascinating scenario has arisen. Jered Weaver was originally scheduled to start the season finale against the Rangers. But with the Angels falling out of the race, they removed Ervin Santana from his start tonight, and will do the same thing for Weaver tomorrow. However, if Weaver were to record just TWO outs, he would win the AL ERA title over Justin Verlander. But if Weaver does not pitch, then Verlander would win the triple crown. Kershaw has already clinched the NL triple crown. Not since 1924 has there been an AL and NL pitching triple crown in the same season.
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09-28-2011, 08:50 AM
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#448
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 2,012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Murphy3
Yeah, I'm gonna go ahead and say bulsh on a couple of those stats. Again, I've learned to take all stats with a grain of salt. No one that was around following baseball would agree with the statement that the Rangers pitching was actually better than their hitting that year. If that's what some advanced metrics show, then the advanced metrics are wrong.
Trying to put a number to how much a ballpark impacts an offense is a good idea in theory, but it really cannot be done. Obviously playing in the ballpark has a positive imapct on offense, but how much compared to league average is something that we'll truly never know. There's simply no way to quantify all of the factors that would need to be quantified.
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The league ERA that year was 4.99. The Rangers had a 4.65 ERA. The Rangers scored 5.69 runs per game, compared with 5.39 runs per game leaguewide. Even if one only adjusts the tiniest sliver for ballpark effects (or, not at all - we're .34 runs a game lower than the average in ERA and only .3 runs a game over the average rpg), I think the statistics back up the argument that, in the context of the time, the Rangers excelled more at pitching than hitting. It may indeed be misleading to say they were BETTER at pitching than hitting, if only because EVERYBODY in 1996 was better at hitting. But we were more above average in pitching than they were in hitting. It doesn't really even take advanced metrics to make that argument.
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Last edited by Kirobaito; 09-28-2011 at 08:52 AM.
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09-28-2011, 09:11 AM
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#449
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
Posts: 18,721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirobaito
The league ERA that year was 4.99. The Rangers had a 4.65 ERA. The Rangers scored 5.69 runs per game, compared with 5.39 runs per game leaguewide. Even if one only adjusts the tiniest sliver for ballpark effects (or, not at all - we're .34 runs a game lower than the average in ERA and only .3 runs a game over the average rpg), I think the statistics back up the argument that, in the context of the time, the Rangers excelled more at pitching than hitting. It may indeed be misleading to say they were BETTER at pitching than hitting, if only because EVERYBODY in 1996 was better at hitting. But we were more above average in pitching than they were in hitting. It doesn't really even take advanced metrics to make that argument.
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Yup, no advanced stats needed at all for that argument. The general sentiment among the masses was that the Rangers were bashing their way to the playoffs, but that year it really was the pitching that made the biggest difference.
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09-28-2011, 11:31 AM
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#450
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Guru
Join Date: May 2001
Location: sport
Posts: 39,432
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthig32
Yup, no advanced stats needed at all for that argument. The general sentiment among the masses was that the Rangers were bashing their way to the playoffs, but that year it really was the pitching that made the biggest difference.
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Actually, if you look a little deeper, you will see how foolish someone looks when they're looking at 1996 player stats but 1999 team stats on baseball reference and then basing his argument off of .... arrogance and a screw up.
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09-28-2011, 02:39 PM
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#451
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Deutschland
Posts: 7,885
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Which team ist the first opponent ? A wildcard team ?
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09-28-2011, 02:47 PM
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#452
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Waco, TX
Posts: 8,141
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If we win tonight or Detroit loses, we get Boston or Tampa Bay with home field advantage (depending on who ends up winning the wild card race). If we lose and Detroit wins we end up both with 95 wins but they hold the tie breaker in head to head games so we face NY without home field advantage.
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09-28-2011, 03:04 PM
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#453
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Deutschland
Posts: 7,885
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Thanks Dan. Hm, Boston and NY would be tough, but makeable. The American League seems to be much stronger than the National League.
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09-28-2011, 03:17 PM
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#454
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 2,012
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Looks likely that the Rangers are going Holland in game 2, wherever it is. Hopefully that's Harrison in game 3 and Lewis in a not-happening game 4.
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09-28-2011, 03:23 PM
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#455
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Waco, TX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GermanDunk
Thanks Dan. Hm, Boston and NY would be tough, but makeable. The American League seems to be much stronger than the National League.
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Philly and Milwaukee are very good teams and so is Arizona (man - did you see their crazy game the other night - several records broken). Atlanta is falling fast and will be an easy out in all likelihood if they manage to sneak in but it appears that a very hot St. Louis team is in there as well.
If Philly makes it to the World Series, they will be terribly difficult to knock out. Not impossible by any means - but very, very hard. Tough to face Halladay, Lee, Hamels and Worley... Very tough. You could easily blink and their opponent be down 0-3, no matter who they are up against.
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09-28-2011, 04:19 PM
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#456
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Deutschland
Posts: 7,885
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Wait. 6:5 in the 10th inning Which records were broken ?
Really bad for the Rangers that Lee has left. With Lee pitching, i´d rate their chances for the finals ~ 75%. But anyway.
Overall a very nice sports-season for the North-Texans, especially with the Cowboys back on the track. A cup and several playoffs made in four years is a good result.
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Last edited by GermanDunk; 09-28-2011 at 04:20 PM.
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09-28-2011, 07:31 PM
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#457
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Golden Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,628
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Another HR for Napoli. lmao
He must feel like a giant middle finger walking through the city of Anaheim. And he's loving every second of it.
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09-28-2011, 09:28 PM
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#458
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 5,249
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nervous
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Is this ghost ball??
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09-28-2011, 09:37 PM
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#459
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 5,249
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Napoli's getting tons of mileage out of his middle finger tonight!
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Is this ghost ball??
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09-28-2011, 09:38 PM
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#460
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Basketball fan nirvana
Posts: 5,625
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Bring it on home.
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"It does not take a brain seargant to know the reason this team struggles." -- dmack24
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09-28-2011, 09:40 PM
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#461
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Golden Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,628
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I want to hug Mike Napoli right now. A big bear hug.
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09-28-2011, 09:48 PM
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#462
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Golden Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,628
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ballgame! hello win column! franchise record 96 wins!
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09-28-2011, 09:49 PM
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#463
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Basketball fan nirvana
Posts: 5,625
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Rays tie it up against NY. Rangers sitting at home while Boston and Rays play tomorrow is best case scenario.
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"It does not take a brain seargant to know the reason this team struggles." -- dmack24
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09-28-2011, 10:05 PM
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#464
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
Posts: 18,721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Murphy3
Actually, if you look a little deeper, you will see how foolish someone looks when they're looking at 1996 player stats but 1999 team stats on baseball reference and then basing his argument off of .... arrogance and a screw up.
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????
Kiro's stats are correct.
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09-28-2011, 10:07 PM
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#465
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Golden Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,628
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Game 1 is 4:07pm on Friday. I'll be there! Hope the Red Sox and Rays have to play each other tomorrow.
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09-28-2011, 10:17 PM
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#466
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Basketball fan nirvana
Posts: 5,625
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mavspwnage
Game 1 is 4:07pm on Friday. I'll be there! Hope the Red Sox and Rays have to play each other tomorrow.
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Awesome.
I caught a game in each of the ALDS, ALCS and WS last year. Rangers went 0-3 in those game. Think I'll stay home this year.
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"It does not take a brain seargant to know the reason this team struggles." -- dmack24
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09-28-2011, 10:20 PM
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#467
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Golden Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,628
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alexamenos
Awesome.
I caught a game in each of the ALDS, ALCS and WS last year. Rangers went 0-3 in those game. Think I'll stay home this year.
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yep, same here. Went 0-3. I was at Game 3 vs the Rays...lost that one in the final innings. I was at Game 1 vs the Yankees...lost that one in the final innings. Went to Game 5 vs the Giants...another one lost in the final innings. Brutal.
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09-28-2011, 10:29 PM
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#468
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 2,012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthig32
????
Kiro's stats are correct.
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I think he was referring to himself. Thinking of the 1996 team as the 1999 team. At least that's what I can figure.
God, the Rangers really traded FRANK FRANCISCO for effin' Mike Napoli? That guy is my least favorite Angel! I'm so mad right now.
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09-28-2011, 11:19 PM
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#469
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Golden Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,628
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Papelbon blows the save and the O's walk off...only minutes later, Longoria walks off for the Rays. And Boston has completed their choke. The Rays win the WC and will be coming to Texas.
Red Sox and Braves fans will join hand-in-hand for a candlelight vigil. wow
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09-28-2011, 11:30 PM
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#470
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Golden Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,628
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09-29-2011, 02:42 AM
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#471
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Deutschland
Posts: 7,885
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How many games did the Red Sox lose ? 18 of the last 22 or so ?
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09-29-2011, 07:57 AM
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#472
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Waco, TX
Posts: 8,141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GermanDunk
Wait. 6:5 in the 10th inning Which records were broken ?
Really bad for the Rangers that Lee has left. With Lee pitching, i´d rate their chances for the finals ~ 75%. But anyway.
Overall a very nice sports-season for the North-Texans, especially with the Cowboys back on the track. A cup and several playoffs made in four years is a good result.
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It was something like a 1-1 game going into the top of the 10th. LA scored 4 and led 5-1. Arizona came storming back and hit a grand slam in the bottom of the 10th to win by 1. Not sure the records, but there was something mentioned on ESPN radio that next morning by either Mike and Mike or their guest Olney.
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09-29-2011, 10:16 AM
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#473
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Diamond Member
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Location: Just outside the Metroplex
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Rangers vs Tampa --- should be fine.
Will the Tigers take out the Yankees though is the question.
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"A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have". Gerald Ford
"Life's tough, it's even tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.
-Capt. Bob "Wolf" Johnson
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09-29-2011, 11:23 AM
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#474
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 2,012
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Yankees missed the playoffs in 2008. They signed Tex, Sabathia, and Burnett to compensate.
Red Sox missed the playoffs in 2010. They traded for/signed Adrian Gonzalez and Carl Crawford.
Now that they missed the playoffs again, anyone want to put odds on, like, them doing something like signing Pujols, Fielder, CJ, Buehrle, Bell, Kuroda, and Reyes? Who cares about position?
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09-29-2011, 12:16 PM
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#475
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Waco, TX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dalmations202
Rangers vs Tampa --- should be fine.
Will the Tigers take out the Yankees though is the question.
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I know if I were a Yankee fan I would be very nervous about this series.
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09-29-2011, 12:35 PM
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#476
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Waco, TX
Posts: 8,141
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09-29-2011, 02:08 PM
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#477
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Guru
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Cowboys Country
Posts: 23,336
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Male30Dan
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Wow...that's a great column.
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09-29-2011, 03:59 PM
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#478
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 2,012
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Game 1 (Fri)- Wilson v Niemann
Game 2 (Sat)- Holland v Shields
Game 3 (Mon)- Harrison v Price
Game 4 (Tue)- Lewis v Hellickson
Game 5 (Thur)- Wilson v Shields
Ogando and Moore as the long men if the starters can't wrangle it. Our game 3 and 4 starters could be flipped, but it looks like that will be how it shakes out.
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09-29-2011, 08:05 PM
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#479
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Waco, TX
Posts: 8,141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chumdawg
Wow...that's a great column.
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Yeah, check some of his older stuff. He is just top notch. As good as I have found. In fact, I always imagined the guy like 65 years old and super, super wise and was thrown off to hear him refer to himself as a 40-year old in the playing tennis in the rain piece.
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09-29-2011, 08:13 PM
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#480
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Waco, TX
Posts: 8,141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirobaito
Game 1 (Fri)- Wilson v Niemann
Game 2 (Sat)- Holland v Shields
Game 3 (Mon)- Harrison v Price
Game 4 (Tue)- Lewis v Hellickson
Game 5 (Thur)- Wilson v Shields
Ogando and Moore as the long men if the starters can't wrangle it. Our game 3 and 4 starters could be flipped, but it looks like that will be how it shakes out.
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Man, Holland has a tough matchup in Game 2 and it would be hard going back to Tampa 1-1. Game 1 is pretty much a must-win considering how they laid out their pitching staff because I can absolutely see us losing game 2. Holland is pitching quite well and could steal that one by simply not allowing any runs but we have so much trouble hitting Shields.
With the way Price pitched this last game out we might be able to steal that game in Tampa but I have ZERO confidence in Colby for game 4. If we go to a game 5, man, tough to be super confident there. We can beat this team and I am confident we will, but there are some matchups we have to win to avoid being in a tough spot.
The more I think about it, the more I feel for their starting pitcher no matter who it is. Napoli, Cruz, Hamilton, Young, Beltre, Kinsler, Andrus, Murphy and Moreland (or Gentry or Torrealba)... Just damn. No wonder we won 96 games, and that's before you look at our bullpen.
6 SOLID innings from our starters and our offense and bullpen should take this thing home. GO RANGERS!
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