Dallas @ Lakers GameDay Thread

[V2M]

Originally posted by: dude1394
Shawn started, played 17 minutes and got 2 rebounds, 1 BS, 4 fouls and 6 points..
Hendu played 16 minutes and got 3 rebounds, 0 BS, 2 fouls and 3 points.

So out of 33 minutes of center we got 5 rebounds, 1 BS, 6 fouls and 9 points.

Damn Nellie...Are you some sort of idiot!!! Why didn't you play one of those stellar centers for another 15 minutes. We could have gotten a total of 7 rebounds out of them and 2 blocked shots!!!.

Probably would have only gotten out-rebounded by 15 too, instead of just 9.

Oh yeah and what's the idea of only playing dirk 42 minutes anyway! He should have at least played as much as Kobe.

1. Hendu is a PF, not a Center.
2. There's 48min to be played at Center and only 17min were played by a true Center. The other 31min were played by PFs.
3. A true center gave you 6pts (3 of 4), 2rebs, 1stl, 1blk, 4pfs in 17min. But that's just the stats. The intangible benefits were: it allowed our best player, Dirk, to play at his natural position; allowed the team to play in a more traditional lineup (set rotation, anyone!); kept the other team from taking the ball to the rack on every frickin' possession; etc.; etc.
4. We have lost 3 of 4 playing Dirk & Hendu at Center. How much worse can it be if we play MBenga and Bradley more min?

Finally, every player has weaknesses. There's no perfect player out there. Likewise MBenga & Bradley may have their fair share of weaknesses. But given the situation (i.e. until Damp comes back), they are our best options at Center position and not Dirk or Hendu.

[rakesh.s]

Originally posted by: Nash13
FFM, Nelson promised Cuban to emphasize defense more. If he doesn't do that, he's gone. Cuban had to have had that talk with him before the trade.

we've been through this before

everyone was saying the same thing last year when the mavs were strugahhhlllllling with antoine walker playing center.."cuban will fire nellie" and even nellie said "well if you're gonna fire me, do it right now..i don't want any suspense" or something like that. Then Cuban said "well i'm not going to pay him to sit around in Maui".

Face it folks, as long as Nellie is here, nothing is going to happen and Cuban will let his contract run out before he gets rid of him.

Too many players, one ball......the rotations are a mess

[dude1394]

Originally posted by: V2M

1. Hendu is a PF, not a Center.
2. There's 48min to be played at Center and only 17min were played by a true Center. The other 31min were played by PFs.
3. A true center gave you 6pts (3 of 4), 2rebs, 1stl, 1blk, 4pfs in 17min. But that's just the stats. The intangible benefits were: it allowed our best player, Dirk, to play at his natural position; allowed the team to play in a more traditional lineup (set rotation, anyone!); kept the other team from taking the ball to the rack on every frickin' possession; etc.; etc.
4. We have lost 3 of 4 playing Dirk & Hendu at Center. How much worse can it be if we play MBenga and Bradley more min?

Finally, every player has weaknesses. There's no perfect player out there. Likewise MBenga & Bradley may have their fair share of weaknesses. But given the situation (i.e. until Damp comes back), they are our best options at Center position and not Dirk or Hendu.

I don't disagree that Hendu is a PF but not a center, but he was playing as a "true" center and not dirk which was your point in number 3, I think you are splitting hairs a little bit. Just because he's not a very good one doesn't invalidate the point.

I don't understand really why you think Mbenga is a viable option, he doesn't know what he's doing out there. Of course I've only seen him play in summer league and during the phoenix game so I may be completely wrong. I'm sure nellie/aj must be off their medications playing Hendu/Shawn over Mbenga.

[Big Boy Laroux]

the reason we lost this game? dirk took only 17 shots, and that's only cause he threw some up at the end. for the longest time in this game, it was the stack and marquis shooting show. i love the fact that stak is getting to the line, but if you consider the attempts that don't count as attempts (i.e. when he was fouled), and don't count those last few shots from dirk, stack had about 5-8 more shots that dirk (that's just off the top of my head). it's been proven that stack can not carry a team. he's never done it. why does he (or nellie) expect to be able to do it now?

I blame dirk, too. He has got to DEMAND the ball. he had some nice passes out of double-teams or pick and rolls (one to bradley who converted... one to daniels who hit the bottom of the back board with his layup attempt!) when damp is back, we better be back on track, cause this was ridiculous.

this was my first real long look at van horn in a while. and i have to admit i liked what i saw. sure, he missed some shots (and was blocked a few times), and that frustrated the hell out of me, but he was getting to the basket AT WILL. dirk was commenting about his quick first step, and he really has it. if van horn had hit just a few of those layups he blew, we win this one easy. also, he seemed to be hustling to get boards, although he is still below average on D.

and where was harris? it would have been nice to get him in there. he has a great ability to pentrate to the basket.

[dude1394]

Dirk's shots...Since this whole thread seemed to revolve around it. [img]i/expressions/devil.gif[/img]

Dirk averages around 19.4.

Lakers - 17
Clips- 15
Hornets-19
Suns - 18
Kings - 25..

Doesn't look terribly out of the norm to me.

[Murphy3]

Honestly, the Mavs decided that their best chance to win the game was to take their men off of the dribble. Unfortunately, it quickly became a one on one game featuring Howard, Daniels, and Stackhouse. I honestly believe that Nellie thought that they had a better chance to beat their man off of the dribble than Dirk did with Odom. Nellie made the decision. It was an idiotic decision. No, it's not the only reason why the Mavs lost this game, but it was a big reason.

[Murphy3]

From Tom at LMF. I don't buy it, but it's interesting nonetheless:

There's a rumor going around in media circles that the calf injury is just a cover up.

In reality... Finley is too embarased to get back on the floor of the Staples Center so soon after the stinko performance vs. the Clippers.

[mary]

Originally posted by: Murphy3
From Tom at LMF. I don't buy it, but it's interesting nonetheless:

That seems a little ridiculous.

[Murphy3]

Originally posted by: mary

That seems a little ridiculous.

I agree that it's probably off base. However, it is interesting that things like this would start circulating concerning Finley. It leads me to believe that Fin has done a thing or two behind closed doors this year that would cause the media to lose alot of respect for the guy. Otherwise, rumors like the one that I mentioned probably wouldn't be 'going around'.

[dude1394]

and where was harris? it would have been nice to get him in there. he has a great ability to pentrate to the basket.

From star-telegram...

Rookie point guard Devin Harris suffered a slight left ankle sprain Thursday at practice and didn't play against the Lakers.

[Big Boy Laroux]

Originally posted by: dude1394
Dirk's shots...Since this whole thread seemed to revolve around it. [img]i/expressions/devil.gif[/img]

Dirk averages around 19.4.

Lakers - 17
Clips- 15
Hornets-19
Suns - 18
Kings - 25..

Doesn't look terribly out of the norm to me.

but dude, he only got to 17 attempts because he had to jack up those late 3's when we were down at the end of the game.

[Murphy3]

Originally posted by: Big Boy Laroux

but dude, he only got to 17 attempts because he had to jack up those late 3's when we were down at the end of the game.

In the Clippers game and in the Lakers game, many of the shots came out of complete desperation late in the game.

[dude1394]

Originally posted by: Big Boy Laroux

but dude, he only got to 17 attempts because he had to jack up those late 3's when we were down at the end of the game.

Not really saying he didn't in the lakers game, just that's it's not tremendously out of the norm. I'm not really sure 5 shots +/- are significant.

[Captain Disaster]

You know, after reading many of the posts last night, it appears that many people feel as though the sky is falling. It isn't; we just aren't really that good, and Kobe showed us why: we have no TRUE superstar. Sure Dirk is a great player, but he is not as good as Kobe. And when Kobe is up for a game, you'd better put the game out of reach, or he will beat you. Despite many people's disdain for him, whenever the Lakers get a good supporting cast around him, they will be contenders again.

The Mavs are among the top 5 - 10 teams in the league, but we're not in the top 5. One thought that has occurred to me concerning Mbenga is that maybe the MAvs are INTENTIONALLY limiting his exposure so that they have a shot at retaining him. From what I rember about his contract, we DON'T get first shot at him after two seasons. But the Mavs do need another legit center who can give them 10 or so quality minutes.

[Big Boy Laroux]

dirk is a superstar, plain and simple, talent-wise. but he has yet to develop that mindset in which he KNOWS he can take over a game. as much as i don't like kobe, that guy knows he is good, and has the confidence to take over games.

[Murphy3]

Originally posted by: Captain Disaster
You know, after reading many of the posts last night, it appears that many people feel as though the sky is falling. It isn't; we just aren't really that good, and Kobe showed us why: we have no TRUE superstar. Sure Dirk is a great player, but he is not as good as Kobe. And when Kobe is up for a game, you'd better put the game out of reach, or he will beat you. Despite many people's disdain for him, whenever the Lakers get a good supporting cast around him, they will be contenders again.

Thank God that Dirk is not Kobe...On or off the court.

[Murphy3]

Originally posted by: Big Boy Laroux
dirk is a superstar, plain and simple, talent-wise. but he has yet to develop that mindset in which he KNOWS he can take over a game. as much as i don't like kobe, that guy knows he is good, and has the confidence to take over games.

Hasn't Dirk poured in 17 points and 11 points in the 4th quarter in close games very recently? Hasn't Dirk been one of the most dominant player in the history of the NBA in playoff elimination games?

Honestly, people jump to conclusions very quickly because we see Dirk and the Mavs play every game. Dirk routinely takes over games during crunch time. However, when there's a case in which he doesn't and the Mavs are playing someone like the Lakers, people quickly jump to conclusions forgetting what Dirk has done in the very recent past.

[Big Boy Laroux]

man, i love dirk. easily my favorite player ever (since laettner hasn't done anything in like 5 years... [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img] ) and he has the ability to close out games, and win them, which he has done. but you just don't see the "i know i'm the best player on the floor" mindset with dirk. he's been the best player on the mavs for what, 3 or 4 years now? and he still defers too much to his teammates. it'd be one thing if dirk were simply passing the ball off and getting others involved. he can do that, and when he does, he is actually a very good passer. my thing is when he doesn't touch the ball AT ALL on a posession. with stackhouse forcing up shots. the ball has to go through dirk, and he has to demand it. sure, it's mostly nellie's fault (as are most things...), but dirk has to demand it from nellie. say, "enough with the ridiculous matchups. i need the ball." I know NVE was vastly overrated when he was here, but his "F'em" attitude rubbed off on dirk then, but it has since gone away.

[Murphy3]

Trust me, I'd love to see Dirk sucker punch Nellie and tell him to stop the b.s. that he was pulling in the Laker game... And yes, I do believe that Dirk knows that he is the man. However, I unfortunately do not think we're going to see any blatant disregard for the coaches wishes from Dirk.

[Big Boy Laroux]

right, because dirk is a class act. but to get to that next level, you have to have some of that arrogance. i in no way want dirk to be kobe, who takes arrogance to a whole new level.

but look at what many were saying about the lakers when it came time to replace phil jackson. "It doesn't matter, cause kobe is the real coach of the team." now, i don't want that exact scenario to happen with Dirk, cause that's taking it too far. but dirk has too much respect for nellie, mainly because he probably feels that he owes the nelsons for getting him to the NBA. i think that, out of respect for nellie, dirk needs to take more leadership. might help nellie keep his job. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]