2009 NBA Playoffs Discussion/Watch live thread - Page 19 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

DirkFTW · 05-23-2009, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RareMilk

I don't see how the mavs can do anything next season if Lebron keeps playing like this! We might as well just aim for the WCF trophy...

I'm still holding out hope that the Cavs monumentally collapse, leaving LeBron to realize he'll never win there. Then he'll call up his good buddy Jason Kidd and say "stay put, I'm coming to you."

u2sarajevo · 05-23-2009, 02:03 PM

I have a question I'm hoping someone can answer.

If a player shoots a three at the buzzer and a defender knocks the ball away before it makes it in the basket and goal tending is called... does it count for 3? I would think it would have to. I've never seen that happen....

LonghornDub · 05-23-2009, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by u2sarajevo

I have a question I'm hoping someone can answer.

If a player shoots a three at the buzzer and a defender knocks the ball away before it makes it in the basket and goal tending is called... does it count for 3? I would think it would have to. I've never seen that happen....

I've never seen that happen either, but in theory, it would count as long as the ball left the shooter's hands before the buzzer.

chumdawg · 05-23-2009, 02:54 PM

The ball is still live until it touches something. Off the ball fouls would count, too.

FINtastic · 05-23-2009, 09:56 PM

This has to be the best conference finals in some time. Seriously, it's must see TV every night.

FINtastic · 05-23-2009, 10:23 PM

Do the Nuggets think Ariza is switching teams in the last minute of the game or something? Why do they keep throwing him the ball?

FINtastic · 05-23-2009, 10:26 PM

Boy the Nuggets went braindead at the end.

BGMaverick9 · 05-23-2009, 10:29 PM

The Nuggets are a pretty stout team but it just seems like they're a year or so away from really breaking through. They make really silly mistakes and have a hard time controlling their aggression and emotions. Gasol was pretty big in that game as well.

SlimBig · 05-23-2009, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

The Nuggets are a pretty stout team but it just seems like they're a year or so away from really breaking through. They make really silly mistakes and have a hard time controlling their aggression and emotions. Gasol was pretty big in that game as well.

They won't win anything with JR Smith getting heavy minutes and a major part of the rotation.

Flacolaco · 05-23-2009, 11:02 PM

The Nuggets are lucky the Lakers missed so many free throws. It shouldn't have been that close.

That 3 by Kobe towards the end was something else. And I hate that guy, but that was so clutch.

BGMaverick9 · 05-23-2009, 11:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flacolaco

The Nuggets are lucky the Lakers missed so many free throws. It shouldn't have been that close.

That 3 by Kobe towards the end was something else. And I hate that guy, but that was so clutch.

A while before that I was thinking, "yeah, they're milking Gasol in the post...but you've still got Kobe out there. He's going to have his time coming up."

stoble · 05-23-2009, 11:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

A while before that I was thinking, "yeah, they're milking Gasol in the post...but you've still got Kobe out there. He's going to have his time coming up."

Kobe looked visibly gassed and I thought he was on the verge of making a bad play or turnover, then he nails that 3, I'm no Kobe fan but WOW!

CadBane · 05-24-2009, 01:42 AM

Ariza is shooting over 50% on threes in the playoffs, that's crazy. Makes up for Fisher being a total spare I guess.

12 Tone Melodies · 05-24-2009, 09:49 AM

Game 11 of the 2009 LeHype Validation Tour

http://www.nba.com/news/referee.html
Referee Assignments
May 24, 2009
Cleveland @ Orlando--J. Crawford; G. Willard; M. Wunderlich

Dirkadirkastan · 05-24-2009, 01:37 PM

Oh shnap.

Fidel · 05-24-2009, 08:46 PM

A cellphone rings.

Crawford: "What are my orders?"
Darth Vader: "Howard. Foul him out in under 20 minutes!"
Crawford: "Yes master"

somewhere else a cellphone rings.

Wunderlich: "What are my...

Fidel · 05-24-2009, 08:46 PM

double post.

GermanDunk · 05-24-2009, 09:14 PM

The Mafia doesn´t use cell phones.

Fidel · 05-24-2009, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GermanDunk

The Mafia doesn´t use cell phones.

I don´t know THE mafia. But actually most of those criminal organizations use stolen prepaids. At least where you and I live.

FINtastic · 05-24-2009, 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fidel

A cellphone rings.

Darth Crawford: "What are my orders?"
Emperor Sternpatine: "Howard. Foul him out in under 20 minutes!"
Darth Crawford: "Yes master"

Fixed

GermanDunk · 05-24-2009, 10:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fidel

I don´t know THE mafia. But actually most of those criminal organizations use stolen prepaids. At least where you and I live.

Or T-Mobile...haha

Fidel · 05-24-2009, 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINtastic

Fixed

lol.

On another note. I know there are alot of guys here who really believe the NBA is rigged (I don´t. We had that discussions in the Mavs forum). So what do you make of this series so far (Cavs-Magic)? If not for a miracle shot by LeBron (boy was he clutch tonight again...) the Cavs would be down 3-0.

So what´s going on here? Seeing how the Magic are clearly the better team (Barkley called it, ok not that hard given recent head to head record) shouldn´t the refs really make a push for the Cavs now to ensure the Lakers-Cavs matchup in the finals? Also would any other pairing in the finals convince you that the league is not rigged? I mean if there ever was a situation where it made sense for the league to fix the games it would be now with Kobe vs. Lebron just around the corner. That would be so huge from a buisiness standpoint that if it doesn´t happen any theory about the league just going for profit and ratings goes out of the window IMO.

Or maybe it´ll be the other way around... if really fishy stuff now starts to happen (especially in the Cavs-Magic series where I clearly think the Magic are the better team, they just crushed the Cavs tonight with Howard on the floor) maybe that´ll convince me that the league is rigged indeed. It really is a good test with such a big bait for the league (maybe they´ll shy from too obvious manipulation because they know they are being watched).

CadBane · 05-24-2009, 11:00 PM

Despite the NBA's best efforts, Lebron couldn't win. He was clutch in the 4th right guy's? Oh, when Lebron goes 5-10 in fta's and clanks J after J it's not choking.

FINtastic · 05-24-2009, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadBane

Despite the NBA's best efforts, Lebron couldn't win. He was clutch in the 4th right guy's? Oh, when Lebron goes 5-10 in fta's and clanks J after J it's not choking.

Holy crap, the dude puts up 41 points, 9 assists, and 7 rebounds and you are complaining that he didn't do enough?

FINtastic · 05-24-2009, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fidel

lol.

On another note. I know there are alot of guys here who really believe the NBA is rigged (I don´t. We had that discussions in the Mavs forum). So what do you make of this series so far (Cavs-Magic)? If not for a miracle shot by LeBron (boy was he clutch tonight again...) the Cavs would be down 3-0.

So what´s going on here? Seeing how the Magic are clearly the better team (Barkley called it, ok not that hard given recent head to head record) shouldn´t the refs really make a push for the Cavs now to ensure the Lakers-Cavs matchup in the finals? Also would any other pairing in the finals convince you that the league is not rigged? I mean if there ever was a situation where it made sense for the league to fix the games it would be now with Kobe vs. Lebron just around the corner. That would be so huge from a buisiness standpoint that if it doesn´t happen any theory about the league just going for profit and ratings goes out of the window IMO.

Or maybe it´ll be the other way around... if really fishy stuff now starts to happen (especially in the Cavs-Magic series where I clearly think the Magic are the better team, they just crushed the Cavs tonight with Howard on the floor) maybe that´ll convince me that the league is rigged indeed. It really is a good test with such a big bait for the league (maybe they´ll shy from too obvious manipulation because they know they are being watched).

Yeah, I don't know if it's really rigged, it does seem like it would be hard to keep all that under wraps. The reffing is crap though, as was on display for a good chunk of tonight (and I guess for the entire playoffs).

CadBane · 05-24-2009, 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINtastic

Holy crap, the dude puts up 41 points, 9 assists, and 7 rebounds and you are complaining that he didn't do enough?

Are you serious? Get out of here with that weak shit. I'm not saying he's not an amazing basketball player and the 1st or 2nd best player in the NBA. I'm not saying he didn't have a good game (Although he was 11-28). I'm saying he's NOT that clutch.

Dude didn't come up big in the 4th when they needed him. Before that absolute PHANTOM call when D12 blocked his three when the game was over, he was 5-10 in ft's. 5-10. Not to mention he missed several big jumpers and had two costly turnovers with several minutes left. Put down the Gatorade for one second.

CadBane · 05-24-2009, 11:10 PM

Not to mention, he was -12. Second worst plus/minus on the team.

FINtastic · 05-24-2009, 11:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadBane

Are you serious? Get out of here with that weak shit. I'm not saying he's not an amazing basketball player and the 1st or 2nd best player in the NBA. I'm not saying he didn't have a good game (Although he was 11-28). I'm saying he's NOT that clutch.

Dude didn't come up big in the 4th when they needed him. Before that absolute PHANTOM call when D12 blocked his three when the game was over, he was 5-10 in ft's. 5-10. Not to mention he missed several big jumpers and had two costly turnovers with several minutes left. Put down the Gatorade for one second.

Well, he carried his team the entire game, he might have been just a bit worn out.

Regardless, this whole "clutch" player argument is way too played out imo. You go through any player's career, and he's going to have some bad 4th quarters. Yeah, that includes Jordan.

FINtastic · 05-24-2009, 11:27 PM

And btw, it wasn't his best game, but the guy has to get a little more help from his team. I just don't get tearing the guy apart when he still put 41 points, 9 assists, and 7 boards. Seriously, if you are losing when your superstar is putting that up, I think you've got bigger problems than your superstar.

BGMaverick9 · 05-24-2009, 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINtastic

And btw, it wasn't his best game, but the guy has to get a little more help from his team. I just don't get tearing the guy apart when he still put 41 points, 9 assists, and 7 boards. Seriously, if you are losing when your superstar is putting that up, I think you've got bigger problems than your superstar.

Yup...he's gonna run out of gas. He needs Williams to show up in this series from here on out. He needs that or 2 other guys to bring some more consistent numbers, he's not going to win it on his own against Orlando.

Flacolaco · 05-25-2009, 12:12 AM

I just finished watching that game, and I find myself wondering the same thing I've been wondering about Cleveland all season long...who in the hell is going to score the ball for them when they've gotta have it besides Lebron?

It's obviously early but...Is Cleveland done? That was not an encouraging 3 game stretch for them or their fans.

FINtastic · 05-25-2009, 12:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flacolaco

I just finished watching that game, and I find myself wondering the same thing I've been wondering about Cleveland all season long...who in the hell is going to score the ball for them when they've gotta have it besides Lebron?

It's obviously early but...Is Cleveland done? That was not an encouraging 3 game stretch for them or their fans.

Well the nice thing for Cleveland is all they need to do is win Game 4 and they are back in the driver's seat. So as bad as it's been for the Cavaliers, winning the next game would cure a lot of their ills.

But I have to agree, the Magic look like the better team out there. I didn't really watch a whole lot of Cleveland games this season, but I really couldn't figure out how they were winning all of these ball games. I mean when your second guy is Mo Williams and you don't even have a clear cut third guy (Big Z?), what kind of supporting cast do you have? Considering that Mo Williams is struggling out there, it's not looking all that great for the Cavs. Maybe Mo can get hot next game because they sure need it.

CadBane · 05-25-2009, 12:23 AM

FYI, LeBron had the 2nd worst plus/minus on the team....

It's not about tearing LeBron down (for me at least). It's about being objective and not hyping the guy up as the greatest player ever. He hits that fluke in Game 2 and he's the most clutch player ever. He lays an egg in the 4th, not a word of criticism. The whole idea that he can do no wrong is what I find the need to correct.

Thomas86 · 05-25-2009, 12:25 AM

This series is far from over...I watch David Stern and the refs bring the Heat back from a 0-2 hole to hand the Heat the title, if Stern feel the need to step in he's gonna do it...Nike spent so much money promoting Lebron vs. Kobe so Stern has gotta make sure it happen plus ABC is gonna be pissed also if the Cavs are not in the finals.

AxdemxO · 05-25-2009, 12:41 AM

GOOOOO ORLANDO : )

BGMaverick9 · 05-25-2009, 12:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadBane

FYI, LeBron had the 2nd worst plus/minus on the team....

It's not about tearing LeBron down (for me at least). It's about being objective and not hyping the guy up as the greatest player ever. He hits that fluke in Game 2 and he's the most clutch player ever. He lays an egg in the 4th, not a word of criticism. The whole idea that he can do no wrong is what I find the need to correct.

The much bigger issue is Lebron's TEAM laid an egg for pretty much the entire game. Pointing the finger at Lebron for this game doesn't make a lot of sense. He didn't have a good 4th quarter, but I can't blame him for that.

-Did he miss critical shots/much needed free throws in the end? Yes he did.

-Am I going to get pissed if I'm a Cleveland fan that Lebron scored 41 instead of 45 or so? No.

The much bigger issue is Mo Williams hasn't been a factor in this series and he has to be for Cleveland to really be a force. They only had 3 guys in double figures, that's not going to cut it. They're giving up way too many opportunities for Orlando's offense...that's not going to cut it. If you have to force Lebron to check Hedu and/or Lewis and still be the lone force on offense, you're screwed.

CadBane · 05-25-2009, 12:58 AM

Mo and Jet are eerily similar, right down to both being no-shows in the playoffs.

alby · 05-25-2009, 01:03 AM

^ so why are you critiquing Lebron.

You are stating the primary reason for Cleveland's performance right there.

CadBane · 05-25-2009, 01:14 AM

Not sure how that's a direct connection there. I certainly didn't make one. Don't put words in my mouth. Yes Mo has been a no-show in the playoffs. That doesn't change the fact that LeBron choked in the 4th. See how that works? Conversely, Delonte West has outperformed his regular season stats.

BGMaverick9 · 05-25-2009, 01:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadBane

Not sure how that's a direct connection there. I certainly didn't make one. Don't put words in my mouth. Yes Mo has been a no-show in the playoffs. That doesn't change the fact that LeBron choked in the 4th. See how that works? Conversely, Delonte West has outperformed his regular season stats.

Delonte's numbers aren't going to have a major impact if Williams isn't producing as well. You need Williams rolling and West and/or someone else to be a factor with Lebron leading the charge.

Scoring is an issue for the Cavs but defense is the bigger one, they just don't have any answers for Hedu and Lewis.

Lebron is part of the reason they lost...but he's not THE reason. If you want to say Lebron choked that's fine, I don't agree with it at all. If a guy is averaging nearly 42 points in the series, it's pretty hard to make him the fall guy for any of the games. If he's doing that and they're down 1-2, they need to be looking at everyone else for criticism, not him. He is clearly doing his part.

It's like I said earlier, would I be pissed at Lebron for not scoring an extra 5-7 points? No, that's just being absurd. You've gotta demand more from the rest of your team, don't pile on his back and expect him to carry you....do you're f'n job and contribute.