The Official: Michael Finley: Thread

[MavsFanFinley]

Nash's primary role on this team isn't to be a scorer.

That excludes him from poor shooting then? That's BS. But, I didn't expect anything less.

[ReDIRKulous]

That excludes him from poor shooting then?

More than it does Fin... that is for sure. You disagree? Hell, Nash is the one setting Fin up for those wide open shots he misses. Have Fin set Nash up like that and if he misses them then I can see your point... otherwise it is just nonsense.

[MavsFanFinley]

I'm going stir-crazy with all these numbers. But, I want to make sure I get this right. Here are the numbers for Dirk. I'll assume that since he gets to the line that excuses his poor shooting against the elite teams? Or is it the rebounds and other things?

87-208 (42%)
17-54 (31%)
67-75 (89%)
258pts (21.5)
117rbs (10)
42as (3.5)
13stls (1)
24to's (2)
14blks (1.2)

[ReDIRKulous]

MFF... I never had a problem with Finley not playing great... my problem was with Finley playing great against the weak teams and then playing terrible against the best teams... within a three game stretch. Also... it frustrated me that Nellie took all the blame in that game and no one held Finley responsible.


All players have bad stretches... but until recently it seemed terminal with Finley. If Dirk had the same problems you would be bitching too... in fact... you already are.

No one is happier than me that Fin is turning things around. Don't make it like I am some enemy of Michael Finley. Because I am not and never have been... I really just want what is best for theteam. If trading Dirk was best for the team I would be for it... and he is my favorite player. I don't understand why Fin is infallable in your eyes. He isn't perfect.

Now Nash... he is about as close to perfection as you can possibly get with the tools he is working with. He is really beyond criticsm imo.

[MavsFanFinley]

ReDirk, I just showed you the numbers for the big 3.

Fin (43%, 43%, 82%)
Dirk (42%, 31%, 89%)
Nash (43%, 35%, 95%)

You keep pointing out how Fin is a disaster yet the big 3 are almost identical to their season averages. I'm trying to understand how that works.

I don't think Fin is perfect. I've given him my share of criticism too. And lord knows I've begged that he be traded. What irritates me is that there is always a line of excuses for Dirk and Nash performing bad, but when it's Finley it's because he sucks or it's a mental thing. Just like the numbers I showed for the elite teams and all I'm hearing is how poor Fin is against those teams.

[ReDIRKulous]

What is the time frame of those stats, MFF?

[MavsFanFinley]

[/quote]What is the time frame of those stats, MFF?[/quote]

Oct.28-Lakers
Nov.8-SA
Nov.17-Portland
Nov.20-SA
Nov.29-Minnesota
Dec.4-Lakers
Dec.10-Lakers
Dec.18-Minnesota
Dec.23-Portland
Dec.25-Kings
Jan.3-Minnesota
Jan.17-Portland
Jan.22-Lakers
Jan.25-Kings

[ReDIRKulous]

I thought we went through this MFF... Portland is not an elite team anymore.


These are Fin's stats against the elite teams... they are atrocious. By putting in Portland's stats you are putting Fin at an advantage -- because they stink. There is no question that Fin can get up for the weak teams.... just like Bradley... but if we want to win a championship we need guys that are going to bring it in big games. Or at least the right balance of guys.

Also, your sample size is too small. We know everyone has been struggling lately. That happens from time to time. I wouldn't say we need to trade Fin for something that minor.

Fin:

LAL, 2G, 73MIN, 10-32 FG, 1-10 3PT, 10-11 FT, 2ST, 0BL, 2TO, 7REB, 2AST, 31PTS
MIN, 1G, 44MIN, 8-23 FG, 5-12 3PT, 4-5 FT, 2ST, 1BL, 1TO, 8REB, 1AST, 25PTS
SAC, 1G, 38MIN, 3-15 FG, 2-6 3PT, 4-6 FT, 1ST, 3BL, 2TO, 4REB, 1AST, 12PTS
SAN, 2G, 80MIN, 7-25 FG, 2-10 3PT, 8-10 FT, 8ST, 3BL, 2TO, 5REB, 6AST, 24PTS

Total against contenders:
235MIN, 28-95 FG, 10-38 3PT, 26-32 FT, 13ST, 7BL, 7TO, 24REB, 10AST, 92PTS
39.2MIN, 29.5% FG, 26.3% 3PT, 81.3% FT, 2.2ST, 1.2BL, 1.2TO, 4REB, 1.7AST, 15.3PTS a game (on 15.8FGA, and 5.3FTA a game, he's struggling from the field, but he gets to the line)

overall:
38.8MIN, 43.9% FG, 40% 3PT, 81.8% FT, 1.3ST, .5BL, 1.3TO, 4.5REB, 2.8AST, 17.2PTS (on 14.9FGA and 2.8FTA a game)

[sike]

Fin hit a couple good ones as the clock was ticking down.....nice
I'll give him that corner three anyday!

[MavsFanFinley]

You don't count Portland as an elite team, but you do Minnesota?

And you keep bringing up those stats and they're still not updated. You're missing a Laker, Minnesota and Kings game.

[ReDIRKulous]

Minny is an elite team now... and Portland is crap since they lost Pip and Sabas. They are garbage.

Why is my opinion so important to you MFF? lol

It isn't like I am god or something... though I am A god. Just not THE god. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif[/img]

Seriously though... we could show stats till we are blue in the face and argue whether this team is elite or not or how far back should we go... imo Fin was in an incredible slump against the elite teams... and for some reaono he is breaking out of it(hopefully). Dirk and Nash have been in a slump recently. Nash is always battling physical and mental exhaustion because he has an incredible task. Fin carried this team for years and probably suffered for it. Dirk is going through growing pains. Let's just hope our guys can get it going and win a championship... it is too late to trade now anyway. Just gotta play out what we got at this point and hope for the best.

[MavsFanFinley]

If you take out Portland and add the other games in, Fin is shooting: (40%, 41%, 81%)

Conveniently, you take out the Portland games and Nash and Dirk's numbers go up.

[ReDIRKulous]

If you take out Portland and add the other games in, Fin is shooting: (40%, 41%, 81%)

Conveniently, you take out the Portland games and Nash and Dirk's numbers go up.

It is no coincidence imo. They aren't an elite team anymore... and Fin knew it... so no psychological block. I believe he has/had a block. That is just my opinion. From my view point the stats support that.

[Max Power]

Originally posted by: ReDIRKulous
MAx... you know I don't like to argue... but I must correct you on this matter...

So you are saying that the leader of our team was unable to tell Nick to pass him the ball? And as for NAsh... he takes the brunt of every defense. It is a known fact that every teams method of attack it to send waves and waves of defenders at Steve Nash. It is amazing he performed as well as he did under the circumstances.

Yep. That's what I'm saying. NVE did what he wanted too when he wanted to. I'm glad he isn't an integral part of the team anymore.

How much does Nellie want Nash to score? How do you know that Nash wasn't scoring sufficiently? So you are telling me that not only does Nash have to take care of all the ball handling duty... he is also expected to score at the same level as michael Finley? Yeah... right. Get real man. You are too funny Max. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

Nellie wanted a point forward to take some of the ball handling duties away from Nash so Nash would score more points. For some reason you think Nash is above reproach but he is having a two subpar seasons in a row. I guess he's peaked and is in his decline.

[ReDIRKulous]

Nellie wanted a point forward to take some of the ball handling duties away from Nash so Nash would score more points. For some reason you think Nash is above reproach but he is having a two subpar seasons in a row. I guess he's peaked and is in his decline.

Nash is above reproach... you know if he isn't performing it isn't for lack of effort... or lack of heart... or lack of taking responsibilty... it is only from physical and mental exhaustion. There is always the possiilty that his body will breakdown... and that is definately a reason to consider replacing him... but I personally would never do it. Nash is definately worth the risk.

[MavsFanFinley]

Finley-tuned: Mavs take cues from veteran during recent surge

By EDDIE SEFKO / The Dallas Morning News

After staying true to their philosophy of not getting too down when things were so crummy six weeks ago, the Mavericks now have skyrocketing hopes and are ready to proclaim that, with the right breaks, they are a threat to win the NBA championship.

And no, those breaks don't involve Shaquille O'Neal's leg and Peja Stojakovic's arm.

They owe this mostly untempered enthusiasm to two things: Their resiliency and Michael Finley's flair for picking the Mavericks up by the scruff of the neck.

It was Finley who made a vow to himself at the start of this stretch, in which the Mavericks have gone 17-4 and moved into the top four in the Western Conference. That vow included nothing more than "being more aggressive," he said Friday. Translated, that means shooting the ball without fear and working harder on other aspects of the game.

It wasn't long before his teammates picked up on this pledge and Finley began getting more scoring opportunities. The revival fostered a team-wide attitude adjustment that's turned heads around the league. Even the team is amped up by the possibilities.

"I think anybody who wins between 50 and 60 games has a legitimate chance to be a world champion," Mavericks coach Don Nelson said. "You may not be the favorite. But if things break right for you, you have a chance."

This is a bit of a departure for Nelson and the Mavericks, who in the past have downplayed hopes for greatness. And Nelson admits staying grounded in good times can be more challenging than staying positive in dire moments.

"I have the same posture, although I'm feeling pretty good about the team playing at a high level now," he said. "Mike is there every night to really anchor the deal. Usually we have somebody who doesn't play well. But we're so strong that it doesn't matter. We can handle one guy being off."

The way Finley has played covers up for a variety of malfunctions. He has been averaging nearly 24 points in the 17-4 run. If he is becoming the anchor as Nelson says – and they can stay healthy – the Mavericks would be justified in their big talk. However, there's a cautionary word from somebody who has been there and done that.

"It's February," said center Scott Williams, who won three rings with the Chicago Bulls in the 1990s. "You don't want to start talking about a championship in February. But at the same time, you're starting to see the pieces come together a little bit."

Steve Nash has watched the Mavericks come together nicely in recent weeks. But he is wary that three of their top six players – Josh Howard, Antoine Walker and Antawn Jamison – have been with the team less than 60 games.

"A lot of it comes down to how comfortable we are with one another," Nash said. "[Winning it all] is pretty rare for a new team in the playoffs. Usually you see teams take a couple hacks at it first.

"I'm not going to say we can't do it. You have to go for it every year. Last year, we were a heartbeat away. But LA has the two best players in the league who have won three championships."

[twelli]

everything under control...



keep going fin!

[Chiwas]

It was Finley who made a vow to himself at the start of this stretch, in which the Mavericks have gone 17-4 and moved into the top four in the Western Conference. That vow included nothing more than "being more aggressive," he said Friday. Translated, that means shooting the ball without fear and working harder on other aspects of the game.

It means to take the initiative over the other team. Nothing else.

[MavsFanFinley]

Taken from the Oregonian:

Fantastic Finley: The Mavericks have won four in a row and 17 of their past 21 games, in large part to the emergence of Michael Finley from an early-season slump.

Finley was starting to get a reputation for disappearing against top-tier teams, but he has put that reputation to bed with a flurry of sensational games, the latest coming during Thursday's 115-91 victory over San Antonio, when he had 30 points.

In the first six games against the Western Conference's best teams -- Sacramento, Minnesota, San Antonio and Los Angeles Lakers -- Finley averaged 15.3 points, making 28 of 95 shots, including 10 of 37 three-pointers. But in his last four games against those teams, Finley has averaged 27.0 points, making 40 of 64 shots, including 18 of 25 three-pointers.

[Max Power]

Finley might not have had the points tonight but he was EVERYWHERE on defense.

[MavsFanFinley]

MP, I wonder how long it takes for the DMN or FWST to acknowledge he had a career high in blocks? Hell, I wonder if NBA.com will even register it.

[Max Power]

Originally posted by: MavsFanFinley
MP, I wonder how long it takes for the DMN or FWST to acknowledge he had a career high in blocks? Hell, I wonder if NBA.com will even register it.

They will notice almost immediately since you posted it here and it looks like some sportswriters come here for "inspiration".

[OutletPass]

Fin is starting at the point tonight !! How well has he been playing.... ?

Well here's the last 5 games.
39 minutes .....50.9 from 2....and 44.8 from 3 for 23.2 points per game....1.4 blocks...1 stl..0.8 TO's.

That's an All Star !!

[Max Power]

Finley proved last night that HE was the All-Star, not Allen.

[TheKid]

You know what's funny about some of this post? One of the threads was talking about Fin only playing well against the weak teams and bad against elite teams. That is VERY funny because I've said this before about people comparing the Western Conference to the Eastern Conference. It's all relative, in my opinion. To play well at the NBA level is GREAT. NBA players are NBA players, some are great and some aren't as great but all are still the best athletes nonetheless.

Simply because Fin may have 40 points against Detroit doesn't make it any less great because it's versus Detroit. It's like I say about Allen Iverson, just because he shoots 30 times a game doesn't mean he can't shoot. Not anybody can go out and get 30 shots off. Do I think Najera can go out and consistently get 30 shots off? Even if he did, does that ensure he would be the number two scoring player in the league? So if Fin goes out and gets 35 points against the Atlanta Hawks, that's still a damn good game, I don't care who it's against.

A year ago when Fin got hurt and had to sit out 13 or 14 games, when the Mavs only lost one of those games, I didn't hear anyone saying those weren't good wins when only two teams during that stretch were playoff caliber teams (the Mavs lost one and won the other). The same philosophy can be in place if you look at it that way. My point is to say he only had a good game against the weaker caliber teams is a futile argument because a good game in the NBA is still a good game.

[Drbio]

I don't care what anyone says.....Mike Finley is the heart and soul of this team. Anyone believing anything less is just fooling themselves.



He is an all star nba stud. period.

[sike]

I have to say, Fin's retalitation was perhaps just what this team needed. Now it would nice to see that same kind of heart from Dirk!

[mmmfast]

Originally posted by: sike
I have to say, Fin's retalitation was perhaps just what this team needed. Now it would nice to see that same kind of heart from Dirk!

Can't argue with that.
It's sad that our rooks are the most aggressive players on the team.

[Mandyahl]

with all the noise about the bowen incident, it seems that we have forgotten about mr. michael finley's 31st birthday. technically it's still march 6 in california, so this will have to do. happy birthday mike! you the man!

[twelli]

[img]http://rds.yahoo.com/S=96062883/K=michael+finley/v=2/l=IVI/*-http://www.nba.com/mavericks/images/Finley_modelB.jpg[/img]

"Thanks Mandy, I'll dunk on Yao for you on Sunday!"