The Official Warriors at Mavericks Gameday Thread - Page 2 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

Murphy3 · 03-23-2006, 09:04 PM

ahh...well, if he doesn't win it this year, I don't think he'll ever win it. It'll just prove that no matter what he does, he'll still be ignored by many..

chumdawg · 03-23-2006, 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NXperience

Hmmm I think it is an interesting question, if Dirk doesn't win the MVP award ... what is he supposed to do to convince the Media? Statistically he is awesome ... he is the leader of the team. What is missing?

An owner not named Mark Cuban?

Murphy3 · 03-23-2006, 09:05 PM

I'd like to see less touches for Stack.... If he wasn't one of the few warm bodies that the Mavs have left, I wouldn't want him anywhere near the court as of late.

Murphy3 · 03-23-2006, 09:06 PM

disappointing end to the first. You could tell that last shot was well off.

Locked_Up_Tonight · 03-23-2006, 09:07 PM

There are a ton of turnovers tonight. Take care of the ball. Damn.

Murphy3 · 03-23-2006, 09:08 PM

wow...talk about a horseshit call in the Duke game... I suppose the officials didn't want to see Duke play the final couple of minutes without Williams, but call the damn game the way it's supposed to be called.

Murphy3 · 03-23-2006, 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Locked_Up_Tonight

There are a ton of turnovers tonight. Take care of the ball. Damn.

Yeah, I know...Stack had 4 TO's in the first.

chumdawg · 03-23-2006, 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Murphy3

ahh...well, if he doesn't win it this year, I don't think he'll ever win it. It'll just prove that no matter what he does, he'll still be ignored by many..

Honestly, he isn't doing much, if anything, more than he did in '03.

If he somehow becomes a shut-down defender, he'll be a lock for the award. He has a lot of room to improve on that side of the ball. He also has room to improve in terms of the authority with which he takes the ball to the goal on offense.

Murphy3 · 03-23-2006, 09:10 PM

Well...I'd say the last half of '03... He was the best player in the league the last half of the season that year....

Murphy3 · 03-23-2006, 09:11 PM

nice follow by sleestack

chumdawg · 03-23-2006, 09:12 PM

Love the volleyball block by Benga.

Locked_Up_Tonight · 03-23-2006, 09:12 PM

Quote:

Honestly, he isn't doing much, if anything, more than he did in '03.

Huh?

Dirk is shooting better from everywhere on the court than he did in 2003. He's the clear leader now. He's the clear number 1 option now. He's getting to the line more. He's actually defending better. (The numbers on defense though don't prove it.)

He's vastly superior than what he was in 2003.

Murphy3 · 03-23-2006, 09:12 PM

Mbenga..that was so much more impressive than any slam I've seen in ages.

NXperience · 03-23-2006, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Honestly, he isn't doing much, if anything, more than he did in '03.

If he somehow becomes a shut-down defender, he'll be a lock for the award. He has a lot of room to improve on that side of the ball. He also has room to improve in terms of the authority with which he takes the ball to the goal on offense.

Ah a shut-down defender a la Nash? (Sorry had to ask this

)

And I think he does more. He is now the Leader of the team has no creator for him like in 03 the offense is running more through him and he gets double teamed much more often so I think his numbers are even better considering all that.

Murphy3 · 03-23-2006, 09:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Locked_Up_Tonight

Huh?

Dirk is shooting better from everywhere on the court than he did in 2003. He's the clear leader now. He's the clear number 1 option now. He's getting to the line more. He's actually defending better. (The numbers on defense though don't prove it.)

He's vastly superior than what he was in 2003.

He was the clear leader the last half of 2003. He was getting to the line... Hitting at a high percentage, and was the clear #1 option. I think he averaged around 27 the last half of the season.

Unfortunately, Nellie pulled the rug out from under his feet by making Antoine Walker the focal point of the offense the next season and basically stalling Dirk's growth. Nellie should have been removed from his job that very moment. Dirk was getting the ball in the post more at that point than at any other point in his career. He was getting the ball on the wing and just taking his man one on one and taking the ball to the bucket repeatedly. Dirk was eveen rebounding at a much higher clip the last half of the season.

Locked_Up_Tonight · 03-23-2006, 09:15 PM

The Mavs are just stupid in fast break opportunities.

That is the low basketball IQ that Dirk talks about.

They f'n suck in it. How Marquis Daniels, and Josh Howard can be such ballhog/tunnel vision slobs in the fast break is mind boggling.

NXperience · 03-23-2006, 09:16 PM

Hmmm they get too many second chance oppotunities in my opinion

Locked_Up_Tonight · 03-23-2006, 09:17 PM

Games like these is why Avery has no faith in Marquis daniels. He f'n sucks some night. Nights like these is why he wasn't drafted in the league.

Murphy3 · 03-23-2006, 09:17 PM

where's Doc? Is he tired of sparing us to death?

chumdawg · 03-23-2006, 09:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Locked_Up_Tonight

Huh?

Dirk is shooting better from everywhere on the court than he did in 2003. He's the clear leader now. He's the clear number 1 option now. He's getting to the line more. He's actually defending better. (The numbers on defense though don't prove it.)

He's vastly superior than what he was in 2003.

He's getting half as many steals as he did then, and he's rebounding the ball one less time per game. His shooting is very similar, numbers-wise.

Look, I'm not trying to be negative IN THE LEAST about his play. He is playing fantastic this year. But he was playing fantastic back then, too. That simply cannot be questioned. In fact, I don't know how it would be possible for ANY player to be "vastly superior" to what Dirk was in '03, or this year.

chumdawg · 03-23-2006, 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Murphy3

He was the clear leader the last half of 2003. He was getting to the line... Hitting at a high percentage, and was the clear #1 option. I think he averaged around 27 the last half of the season.

Unfortunately, Nellie pulled the rug out from under his feet by making Antoine Walker the focal point of the offense the next season and basically stalling Dirk's growth. Nellie should have been removed from his job that very moment. Dirk was getting the ball in the post more at that point than at any other point in his career. He was getting the ball on the wing and just taking his man one on one and taking the ball to the bucket repeatedly. Dirk was eveen rebounding at a much higher clip the last half of the season.

This could not be any more correct. Well, I guess it could, if you took the responsibility away from Nellie and put it on Cuban for the acquisition of Walker. But when it comes to Dirk, the points are unarguably correct.

Locked_Up_Tonight · 03-23-2006, 09:22 PM

Dirk is shooting well.

Bookit · 03-23-2006, 09:23 PM

I guess Stack just won't contribute much again this season.

Murphy3 · 03-23-2006, 09:24 PM

Here's an email that I sent to Bob Sturm back in 2004:

I've heard alot of crap about the Mavs not having a go
to guy the past few weeks. You know what? Whoever
mentioned that is exactly right. Now, let's examine
why the Mavs do not have a go to guy.

First off, I believe we should establish the fact that
the Mavs did have a definitive go to guy establish
himself the last half of the season last year and on
into the playoffs. Dirk Nowitzki averaged around 28
points and 11 boards the last half of the season in
2002-2003. He continued his dominance into the
playoffs. Dirk developed the attitude that no one
could stop him and that the 4th quarter was his. Dirk
was the league MVP the second half of the season last
year in my opinion. There was no one better.

What happened? Well, we can first look back to the
second round of the playoffs last season. After
averaging 30+ points against Portland and just tearing
them to shreds in virtually every game, Don Nelson
decided to make him a passer going into the Sacramento
series. Now, the Mavs went on to win the series in 7
games with much help from Webber injuring his knee.
But, after the Mavs failed to close out the Kings
through 6 games, Nellie finally decided to allow Dirk
to be the focal point of the offense. What happened?
Dirk goes off for 30+ points and around 20 boards in
leading the Mavs over the Kings and into the Western
Conference Finals. Unfortunately, an injury to Dirk
ended his season and ended the Mavs title hopes.

How is he rewarded for his play in the 2002-2003
season in which he averaged 25+ points for the season
including around 28 the last half of the season? Of
course, Nellie decides to trade for someone to take
his place as the focal point in the offense. Nellie
gets his dream player in Antoine Walker. He now has
his point forward that he has dreamed of for years and
years.

What impact did this have on the Mavs? What impact did
it have on Dirk? Through the first half of the season,
the ball ran through Nash and Walker. Walker led the
team in field goal attempts for much of the season.
Dirk struggles to get looks as he's forced to take a
back seat to a vastly inferior player on the offensive
side of the court. The Mavs sputtered offensively. The
Mavs sputtered on the road. The Mavs had absolutely no
identity as they tried to incorporate a new offensive
style. Did Nellie make an adjustment? Dirk sputtered
in his reduced role. It wasn't just the lack of shots
that he was getting, but it was the lack of touches.
When Dirk actually got touches, he almost had to shoot
the ball in fear of not receiving another pass the
next 5-10 possessions.

Why did this occur? Wasn't it painfully obvious that
Walker should not be the focal point of the offense?
Wasn't it painfully obvious that Dirk was the best
offensive player on the team?

Nellie completely undermined the aggressiveness that
Dirk had developed the last half of the season by
forcing him to take a back seat. Nellie completely
undermined the identity that the Mavs had finally
established by forcing Dirk to take a back seat. There
is no excuse for such a horrendous decision from a
head coach.

Why? Was Nellie simply being stubborn and wanting to
do things his way? What else did it do to Dirk's game?
Dirk either hit his shot or got to the line over 62%
of the time in which he got the ball while posting up
the second half of the 2002-2003 season. With Walker
becoming the focal point of the offense, Dirk was
suddenly forced to the perimeter and virtually only
the perimeter. Nellie completely stiffled Dirk's
development in the low post as well as halting his
development as the go to guy.

I don't know. I've got nothing left to say about
Nellie. I sincerely believe that Nellie's the reason
why Dirk isn't the most dominant offensive player in
the NBA. Nellie's failure to utilize Dirk in the low
post has completely halted his development. That alone
is reason enough to fire Nellie. Nellie's insistance
in using Walker as a point forward and making Dirk
play second fiddle to him is reason enough to fire
Nellie.

I'm so thoroughly disgusted with his act. He set the
Mavs back at least a year. He set Dirk's development
as the go to guy by at least a year. He made me sit
through a year of Antoine Walker. That alone is enough
to fire Nellie.

Murph

Locked_Up_Tonight · 03-23-2006, 09:25 PM

If Avery had any other players tonight he'd sit Stack and Daniels and make them stay there for a very long time.

Murphy3 · 03-23-2006, 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

This could not be any more correct. Well, I guess it could, if you took the responsibility away from Nellie and put it on Cuban for the acquisition of Walker. But when it comes to Dirk, the points are unarguably correct.

Sure, Cuban deserves some of the blame. But, Nellie's the guy that decided to make Walker the focal point of the offense.

Murphy3 · 03-23-2006, 09:26 PM

Great pass by Dirk and great finish by Marshall..

Bookit · 03-23-2006, 09:27 PM

Marshall flew to the hoop. Damn.

Murphy3 · 03-23-2006, 09:27 PM

Damn good move by Dirk to get to the line.

Murphy3 · 03-23-2006, 09:28 PM

And Duke is gone.

Locked_Up_Tonight · 03-23-2006, 09:30 PM

Dallas cannot stop them and secure the board.

Bookit · 03-23-2006, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Murphy3

And Duke is gone.

The Aggs must have toughened LSU up.

Locked_Up_Tonight · 03-23-2006, 09:32 PM

I loathe Stackhouse.

The Crippler · 03-23-2006, 09:32 PM

stack is just a momentum killer, isn't he? Not a bad shot at all, he just can't make shit right now.

NXperience · 03-23-2006, 09:33 PM

Hmm without all the turnovers we surely would be up.

The Crippler · 03-23-2006, 09:33 PM

again...quit shooting, damn.

Murphy3 · 03-23-2006, 09:33 PM

I almost enjoy seeing Stackhouse miss...

Murphy3 · 03-23-2006, 09:33 PM

5 TO's by Stack..

Murphy3 · 03-23-2006, 09:34 PM

It looked like Richardson cleared out with his left...he might have been fouled before that though.

chumdawg · 03-23-2006, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Murphy3

Sure, Cuban deserves some of the blame. But, Nellie's the guy that decided to make Walker the focal point of the offense.

Fair enough. Nice email, by the way. I think I remember reading it once before. Tough to argue with anything there, except maybe that you did a good enough in the beginning of establishing that Dirk was indeed a go-to guy already, which diminishes your complaint that Nellie set Dirk's development toward *becoming* a go-to guy back by one year.

You also demonstrated how Nellie was able to go to his bread and butter when he needed to, as in the last game of the SAC series. So perhaps Nellie was going counter to the rep he always gets, which is to say that perhaps he was sacrificing regular season wins in an effort to develop a system that would work in the playoffs.

Either way, I think we all can be happy that Dirk seems not to have suffered any long-term effects from the '04 season, and he is now playing as well as or better than anyone else in the NBA.

I kinda doubt that he will win the MVP this year. But I'm pretty certain he will win at least one, and probably more than one, before his career is done.