My Recent Encounter of Matt Barnes..... - Page 2 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

chumdawg · 07-09-2007, 01:20 AM

Barnes is worth the full MLE because he has TOOLS. Barnes can cover anywhere from the one to the four, given favorable circumstances. Barnes can also play inside or float outside for the jumper. The dude has no holes in his game. No, he is not excellent at anything he does. But he is solid, and that's what the Mavs need. He is a warrior, and the Mavs could use more of that.

alby · 07-09-2007, 01:20 AM

I would sign Matt Barnes for 1-2 million for 2 years. That's it.

If Oberto is only worth 3 million a year for 3 years, Barnes has to be worth less.

alby · 07-09-2007, 01:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Barnes is worth the full MLE because he has TOOLS. Barnes can cover anywhere from the one to the four, given favorable circumstances. Barnes can also play inside or float outside for the jumper. The dude has no holes in his game. No, he is not excellent at anything he does. But he is solid, and that's what the Mavs need. He is a warrior, and the Mavs could use more of that.

Matt Barnes has no holes in his game?

ty · 07-09-2007, 01:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Barnes can cover anywhere from the one to the four, given favorable circumstances.

From one to FOUR? That is an insane exaggeration...

chumdawg · 07-09-2007, 01:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ty

From one to FOUR? That is an insane remark...

Really? Did you not see Barnes covering Dirk in that playoff series?

ty · 07-09-2007, 01:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Really? Did you not see Barnes covering Dirk in that playoff series?

...not alone.

Male30Dan · 07-09-2007, 01:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Really? Did you not see Barnes covering Dirk in that playoff series?

Uh oh!

ty · 07-09-2007, 01:28 AM

With that being said...couldn't JJB guard Dirk with help D as well?

chumdawg · 07-09-2007, 01:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alby

Matt Barnes has no holes in his game?

In the place you are going to put him, not really, no.

alby · 07-09-2007, 01:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ty

From one to FOUR? That is an insane remark...

I think he is referring to the time when he shutdown Boozer in their playoff series against Utah.

24.2 points
14.0 rebounds

Male30Dan · 07-09-2007, 01:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ty

...not alone.

Who can cover him alone. His point is you can put him on 4s when the matchup is favorable. He is long and quick and he gives guys like Dirk trouble. One on one, sure, Dirk will own him as he owns just about everyone one on one, (or has that now become everyone). But that isn't the point. The point is you claimed he couldn't and Chum pointed out he could - and he can. Not all of them mind you, but Chum never said that.

chumdawg · 07-09-2007, 01:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ty

...not alone.

Gimme a break. Barnes was balls-on, even asked to cover Dirk.

Male30Dan · 07-09-2007, 01:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alby

I think he is referring to the time when he shutdown Boozer in their playoff series against Utah.

24.2 points
14.0 rebounds

Did you see him on Boozer? Talk about two very different players. No one would expect Barnes to cover that type of a PF.

Male30Dan · 07-09-2007, 01:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ty

With that being said...couldn't JJB guard Dirk with help D as well?

No... Dirk would just shoot over him all day long without ever worrying about anything other than getting fouled - something he would be glad to receive.

What a stupid comparison.

ty · 07-09-2007, 01:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Male26Dan

Who can cover him alone. His point is you can put him on 4s when the matchup is favorable. He is long and quick and he gives guys like Dirk trouble. One on one, sure, Dirk will own him as he owns just about everyone one on one, (or has that now become everyone). But that isn't the point. The point is you claimed he couldn't and Chum pointed out he could - and he can. Not all of them mind you, but Chum never said that.

Give me one other 4 that Matt Barnes can guard. We all know that Dirk is 3 in a 4's body.

Male30Dan · 07-09-2007, 01:33 AM

This argument is silly to begin with. Either you like Barnes enough to overpay or you don't. I am a bit on the fence for a full MLE, but if all of the other guys I like are taken then you sign him up and enjoy a great hustle guy that can shoot the 3 pretty well. I will admit there are a few guys I would prefer over him, but to dismiss him as a spare is ridiculous.

Male30Dan · 07-09-2007, 01:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ty

Give me one other 4 that Matt Barnes can guard. We all know that Dirk is 3 in a 4's body.

The other 4s that are 3s in a 4s body. Do you really need a list dude?

alby · 07-09-2007, 01:35 AM

Stephen Jackson guarded Dirk for the majority of the series with J-Rich and Al Harrington blitzing him everytime he put the ball on the floor.

chumdawg · 07-09-2007, 01:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Male26Dan

Who can cover him alone. His point is you can put him on 4s when the matchup is favorable. He is long and quick and he gives guys like Dirk trouble. One on one, sure, Dirk will own him as he owns just about everyone one on one, (or has that now become everyone). But that isn't the point. The point is you claimed he couldn't and Chum pointed out he could - and he can. Not all of them mind you, but Chum never said that.

Good point. No one covers Dirk alone. But if they are quick enough to front Dirk, yet tall enough to cover him from behind if the fronting doesn't work, Dirk has a problem.

Point is, Barnes can throw trouble at you that you don't like to see.

Male30Dan · 07-09-2007, 01:36 AM

For the record - I count 4 if I use this list and this is supposedly the top 15 fantasy guys - anotherwords a pretty good list to go by. The list gets much longer if you click the next set of guys.

alby · 07-09-2007, 01:37 AM

Their are so many players each year who have reaped the benefits of playing in an open system or playing well in a playoff series. Matt Barnes is not the answer to the Mavericks' problems, simple as that.

Male30Dan · 07-09-2007, 01:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alby

Stephen Jackson guarded Dirk for the majority of the series with J-Rich and Al Harrington blitzing him everytime he put the ball on the floor.

Alby, I like you, but you aren't reading very well tonight.

Chum said HE CAN GUARD the 1-4 POSITIONS... He didn't say that he guarded him the entire series, but he definitely did guard him and did an effective job by having length over his shots and help defense on his drives.

ty · 07-09-2007, 01:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Good point. No one covers Dirk alone. But if they are quick enough to front Dirk, yet tall enough to cover him from behind if the fronting doesn't work, Dirk has a problem.

Point is, Barnes can throw trouble at you that you don't like to see.

Yes, that's a great point in a special case like Dirk, who we can all agree is a special player.

Now put him on the Mavs, along-side Dirk. So who's another "special" 4 that he can "trouble". Who are these other 4's that you're talking about...?

Male30Dan · 07-09-2007, 01:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ty

Yes, that's a great point in a special case like Dirk, who we can all agree is a special player.

Now put him on the Mavs, along-side Dirk. So who's another "special" 4 that he can "trouble". Who are these other 4's that you're talking about...?

I provided you a link with other 4s that he could trouble - did you care to avoid it. I don't remember the "special" term being thrown around in anyones argument tonight but it is nice of you to use as a crutch when your argument begins to fail.

Also, he said he could guard the 1-4 positions. Do you really think he couldn't have been VERY useful against Davis, J-Rich, and Jackson in this past playoff series? Davis would have still been a bit too quick for him but there would have been zero posting up making him only useful for the drive.

BGMaverick9 · 07-09-2007, 01:48 AM

reading the RealGM thread for the Warriors:

Both Pietrus and Barnes could be had for most of the MLE, all of it is pretty safe to get one of the two...either or. 5 mil for sure will get Pietrus, they won't want to match that. I think it might be iffy for Barnes, but if you go with all of the MLE, you'll probably get Barnes. A lot of them think one or both will probably be gone. They're more content with keeping Barnes over Pietrus. But they think both of them will probably take the money and run.

So that makes it clear: It's pretty much all or nothing (MLE-wise) for either of them.

Male30Dan · 07-09-2007, 01:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alby

Their are so many players each year who have reaped the benefits of playing in an open system or playing well in a playoff series. Matt Barnes is not the answer to the Mavericks' problems, simple as that.

Fair enough. That is your opinion that he wouldn't help the Mavericks. I think he could have greatly helped us last year because he would have been a very good defensive option to throw on the GS boys and could hit a 3. Which other defenders that we ran out there could do that as well as him?

Nah, no use.

Male30Dan · 07-09-2007, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

reading the RealGM thread for the Warriors:

Both Pietrus and Barnes could be had for most of the MLE, all of it is pretty safe to get one of the two...either or. 5 mil for sure will get Pietrus, they won't want to match that. I think it might be iffy for Barnes, but if you go with all of the MLE, you'll probably get Barnes. A lot of them think one or both will probably be gone. They're more content with keeping Barnes over Pietrus. But they think both of them will probably take the money and run.

So that makes it clear: It's pretty much all or nothing (MLE-wise) for either of them.

That is unfortunate but expected. No matter who you are you want to eventually get a nice payday and he is definitely wanting to cash in on a fine playoff series. I don't blame him, but I wish we could get him cheaper. Someone mentioned this in another thread or maybe even this one but I think I would end up overpaying in the end to get him here AND hurt the Warriors. One less guy to give Dirk trouble and one less hustle guy.

chumdawg · 07-09-2007, 01:51 AM

That's a good point, Dan. Baron Davis may have drived past Barnes, but he certainly wasn't going to do any good posting against him. And Barnes could have stretched out to cover anyone from Jackson to Richardson.

You need versatlie defenders, just like you need versatile offensive men. When the Mavs get into a matchup like they suffered against Golden State, they would be well served to hvae a guy who can cover several spots on defense.

alby · 07-09-2007, 01:52 AM

You guys are right. Matt Barnes should be the premier free agent target for the Mavericks this summer because he would be offered the entire MLE and since we are over the cap, he is the only signing we would be able to acquire. He has no holes in his game so he would definitely put us ahead of Phoenix, San Antonio, and the other contenders in the NBA. Matt Barnes is the key to winning an NBA title.

ty · 07-09-2007, 01:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Male26Dan

I provided you a link with other 4s that he could trouble - did you care to avoid it. I don't remember the "special" term being thrown around in anyones argument tonight but it is nice of you to use as a crutch when your argument begins to fail.

Also, he said he could guard the 1-4 positions. Do you really think he couldn't have been VERY useful against Davis, J-Rich, and Jackson in this past playoff series? Davis would have still been a bit too quick for him but there would have been zero posting up making him only useful for the drive.

Male--before you talk about arguments failing...

The argument is if Barnes guard the 4.

The point is. Dirk is not your regular 4.

Of course I saw your link. The only other 4 in that list that Barnes could possibly guard would be.....Diaw?

Let Matt Barnes guard the 13 other 4's on your list.

alby · 07-09-2007, 01:55 AM

Matt Barnes definitely slowed down Dirk and the rest of the Mavericks--they only averaged 105 points per game that series against the Warriors.

nashtymavsfan13 · 07-09-2007, 01:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alby

Go to a Warriors board where the fans had the chance to watch him for the entire year and see what they think of him. Trust me, you do not want him on this team--ESPECIALLY for the full MLE.

Actually, all the Warriors fans I know and the ones I saw yesterday adore him. He's one of the most popular players on the team from what I've heard for people.

I wouldn't mind getting him at all, and I don't think it'll even take the full MLE. It all depends on how much the Warriors offer and whether they determine that Pietrus or Barnes is the bigger priority for them to sign.

Male30Dan · 07-09-2007, 01:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alby

You guys are right. Matt Barnes should be the premier free agent target for the Mavericks this summer because he would be offered the entire MLE and since we are over the cap, he is the only signing we would be able to acquire. He has no holes in his game so he would definitely put us ahead of Phoenix, San Antonio, and the other contenders in the NBA. Matt Barnes is the key to winning an NBA title.

First of all, we were already better than Phoenix, San Antonio, and the other contenders in the NBA; however, we got beat by the one team we couldn't beat.

I am not even going to respond to the other ridiculous satire because it is just stupid.

Male30Dan · 07-09-2007, 01:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alby

Matt Barnes definitely slowed down Dirk and the rest of the Mavericks--they only averaged 105 points per game that series against the Warriors.

You need to go to bed. You are making yourself look really foolish tonight.

Yeah, that had nothing to do with the pace. How well did DIRK play by the way?

chumdawg · 07-09-2007, 01:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alby

You guys are right. Matt Barnes should be the premier free agent target for the Mavericks this summer because he would be offered the entire MLE and since we are over the cap, he is the only signing we would be able to acquire. He has no holes in his game so he would definitely put us ahead of Phoenix, San Antonio, and the other contenders in the NBA. Matt Barnes is the key to winning an NBA title.

I'm glad you see the light.

alby · 07-09-2007, 01:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nashtymavsfan13

Actually, all the Warriors fans I know and the ones I saw yesterday adore him. He's one of the most popular players on the team from what I've heard for people.

I wouldn't mind getting him at all, and I don't think it'll even take the full MLE. It all depends on how much the Warriors offer and whether they determine that Pietrus or Barnes is the bigger priority for them to sign.

So you enjoyed the ill-advised pull up three's throughout the year? and the fancy passes on every fast break that never worked out? are you referring to the fans who think and1 basketball is quality stuff or are you talking about the fans who appreciate a good basketball play?

alby · 07-09-2007, 02:00 AM

Ha, it has gotten to the point where I want the Mavericks to sign Barnes just so you can see the type of player he is.

ty · 07-09-2007, 02:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Male26Dan

I provided you a link with other 4s that he could trouble - did you care to avoid it. I don't remember the "special" term being thrown around in anyones argument tonight but it is nice of you to use as a crutch when your argument begins to fail.

Also, he said he could guard the 1-4 positions. Do you really think he couldn't have been VERY useful against Davis, J-Rich, and Jackson in this past playoff series? Davis would have still been a bit too quick for him but there would have been zero posting up making him only useful for the drive.

This whole time I have been talking strictly about the 4 position. In my initial response to chum I was sure to put "FOUR" in "one to FOUR" in caps.

I'm not quite sure why you're talking about Davis J-Rich, etc. I never said anything about him not being able to guard 1-3.

Since you're so good at translating the technicalities of what chum says, maybe you can be better at translating mine next time.

Male30Dan · 07-09-2007, 02:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ty

Male--before you talk about arguments failing...

The argument is if Barnes guard the 4.

The point is. Dirk is not your regular 4.

Of course I saw your link. The only other 4 in that list that Barnes could possibly guard would be.....Diaw?

Let Matt Barnes guard the 13 other 4's on your list.

OK... Here is my personal list that he could guard from the first two pages - all of which are starters or part time starters:

1) Dirk (with help defense, he gives him problems - without it, he gets owned, but who doesn't)
2) Jamison (no explanation necessary)
3) Diaw (no explanation necessary)
4) Webber (he is a shell of his former self and is primarily a jump shooter)
5) Wallace (another shooter that has some inside game but with help defense he would be fine)
6) West (little post up game)
7) Gooden (soft player)
8) Abdur-Rahim (see above)
9) Thomas (strictly a jump shooter)
10) Marshall (no explanation necessary)
11) Haslem (little post up game)

Several of these guys he could guard man to man and others like Dirk, Wallace, and MAYBE Webber would require some help defense if they started taking advantage of him in the post. Oh, 6 of those were on the first page.

alby · 07-09-2007, 02:08 AM

I was just wondering if you guys are basing your analysis of Barnes on his one playoff series against the Mavericks, or for the whole playoffs, or the regular season, or for his entire career? I was just wondering...