11-17-2010, 03:48 PM
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#81
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Waco, TX
Posts: 8,141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LonghornDub
Wash getting 2nd for Manager of the Year is an absolute screw job.
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In fairness, some of the 5 runner-up finishes that Gardenhire received were screw jobs as well. Both were deserving...
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11-17-2010, 03:50 PM
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#82
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 17,873
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Male29Dan
In fairness, some of the 5 runner-up finishes that Gardenhire received were screw jobs as well. Both were deserving...
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Sure. But Wash was more deserving, IMO. No disrespect to Gardenhire.
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John Madden on Former NFL Running Back Leroy Hoard: "You want one yard, he'll get you three. You want five yards, he'll get you three."
"Your'e a low-mentality drama gay queen!!" -- She_Growls
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11-17-2010, 04:28 PM
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#83
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Guru
Join Date: May 2001
Location: sport
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I have no problem with it. I might have put Francona up there with those two as well.
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11-17-2010, 05:19 PM
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#84
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Platinum Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: north texas
Posts: 2,186
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LonghornDub
Sure. But Wash was more deserving, IMO. No disrespect to Gardenhire.
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gotta disagree. Gardenhire lost his top flight closer before the year began, and Morneau too, and they still won 95 games...and they don't really have much of a pitching staff either.
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Texas Rangers 2011 Regular Season Win/Losses
24-23
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11-17-2010, 05:30 PM
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#85
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 17,873
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Apologies folks. I wasn't keeping in mind that the awards are voted on at season's end. I always forget that, since in other instances where that's the case (e.g., NBA MVP), the award is given out well before the championship is decided.
Based on regular-season results, I'm more than fine with Gardenhire. I will say I don't think Francona was in the top three, though. It's Gardenhire, Maddon, Wash, then everyone else.
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John Madden on Former NFL Running Back Leroy Hoard: "You want one yard, he'll get you three. You want five yards, he'll get you three."
"Your'e a low-mentality drama gay queen!!" -- She_Growls
Last edited by LonghornDub; 11-17-2010 at 05:33 PM.
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11-17-2010, 05:31 PM
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#86
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Golden Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,628
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If the Red Sox had made the playoffs, Francona would have probably been unanimous as MOY. It's hard to deny what he did with a makeshift team. Still had 89 wins.
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11-17-2010, 06:11 PM
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#87
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Guru
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 10,016
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sike
Uncle Norm wants Martinez as DH, part time 1B, and only rarely at catcher.
He said if Lee $ just gets stupid (ala 7 for 27) then he would go for V.Mart and Greinke with the same money.
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The problem with that is you have to trade for greinke. And im thinking that cost cruz and martin perez which i wouldnt do
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11-17-2010, 06:11 PM
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#88
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Guru
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 10,016
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sike
Uncle Norm wants Martinez as DH, part time 1B, and only rarely at catcher.
He said if Lee $ just gets stupid (ala 7 for 27) then he would go for V.Mart and Greinke with the same money.
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The problem with that is you have to trade for greinke. And im thinking that cost cruz and martin perez which i wouldnt do
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11-17-2010, 11:17 PM
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#89
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The Preacha
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: The Rock
Posts: 36,066
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Five-ofan
The problem with that is you have to trade for greinke. And im thinking that cost cruz and martin perez which i wouldnt do
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Is there another Cruz in our farm or are you talking Nellie? I'm not for moving Nellie AND top prospects.
Norm seemed to think he could be had for some our top propects alone...which I would do for a young proven ace. emphasis on the "young" part.
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ok, we've talked about the problem of evil, and the extent of the atonement's application, but my real question to you is, "Could Jesus dunk?"
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11-18-2010, 02:40 AM
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#90
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Guru
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 10,016
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sike
Is there another Cruz in our farm or are you talking Nellie? I'm not for moving Nellie AND top prospects.
Norm seemed to think he could be had for some our top propects alone...which I would do for a young proven ace. emphasis on the "young" part.
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No i mean nellie, which is why I said i wouldnt do it. The problem with trading for Greinke is he is a FA after 2012 which means you only get him for two years. If you do purely prospects for greinke its probably Perez, Holland, Beltre and Jorge Alfaro. Which yet again, as much as I love Greinke, I wouldnt do for 2 years. And I actually would prefer Greinke to Lee, given exactly the same salary.
As for the MOTY, I thought Wash had a very solid case but it is in no way a screw job for him to have lost. The twins had a better record and probably less talent.
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11-18-2010, 08:25 AM
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#91
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Waco, TX
Posts: 8,141
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11-18-2010, 09:34 AM
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#92
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Guru
Join Date: May 2001
Location: sport
Posts: 39,432
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Newberg's most recent report said that the club would most likely move Ogando into the rotation ahead of Feliz. I would agree with that decision.
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11-18-2010, 11:10 AM
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#93
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Minister of Soul
Join Date: May 2001
Location: on the Mothership
Posts: 4,893
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Murphy3
Newberg's most recent report said that the club would most likely move Ogando into the rotation ahead of Feliz. I would agree with that decision.
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I need to see more of him in the majors with runners on... as we all know, he craps his britches with other guys' runners. And he hardly allowed enough of his own runners for me to form an opinion there. But I love the guy. Around the office, we say he looks like the kind of guy who would knife your ass without thinking twice.
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11-18-2010, 11:55 AM
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#94
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
Posts: 18,721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhylan
I need to see more of him in the majors with runners on... as we all know, he craps his britches with other guys' runners. And he hardly allowed enough of his own runners for me to form an opinion there. But I love the guy. Around the office, we say he looks like the kind of guy who would knife your ass without thinking twice.
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I think it might be hard to distinguish whether the problem is entering with runner's on, or entering in the middle of an inning. The two generally go hand in hand. I read a few articles that seemed to intimate that the Rangers felt like it was more the latter than the former.
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11-23-2010, 02:26 PM
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#95
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 17,873
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__________________
John Madden on Former NFL Running Back Leroy Hoard: "You want one yard, he'll get you three. You want five yards, he'll get you three."
"Your'e a low-mentality drama gay queen!!" -- She_Growls
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11-23-2010, 03:46 PM
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#96
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The Preacha
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: The Rock
Posts: 36,066
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LonghornDub
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But still
!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!
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ok, we've talked about the problem of evil, and the extent of the atonement's application, but my real question to you is, "Could Jesus dunk?"
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11-23-2010, 06:31 PM
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#97
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Golden Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,628
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Hamilton clinched the award on August 13. From that day forward, everyone else was fighting for second place.
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11-25-2010, 12:23 PM
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#98
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Waco, TX
Posts: 8,141
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Just throwing this out there (cough, cough)... Arbitration offered to Frankie and he is likely to accept. Stories out there suggesting this means Feliz will get a shot at the rotation.
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11-25-2010, 01:03 PM
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#99
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Male29Dan
Just throwing this out there (cough, cough)... Arbitration offered to Frankie and he is likely to accept. Stories out there suggesting this means Feliz will get a shot at the rotation.
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Frankie coming back certainly would make it more likely, but I'd still say it's a pretty safe bet that Feliz stays in the bullpen.
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11-25-2010, 11:39 PM
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#100
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Waco, TX
Posts: 8,141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthig32
Frankie coming back certainly would make it more likely, but I'd still say it's a pretty safe bet that Feliz stays in the bullpen.
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In fairness, didn't you also think it was a pretty safe bet that Frankie was gone?
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11-26-2010, 10:30 AM
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#101
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
Posts: 18,721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Male29Dan
In fairness, didn't you also think it was a pretty safe bet that Frankie was gone?
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No.
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Frankie's far from a guarantee to be back. His injury might have lowered his value to the point that he accepts arbitration, but if not I think he's gone.
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11-29-2010, 10:55 AM
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#102
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Waco, TX
Posts: 8,141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthig32
No.
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I could have worded the question better, but it is clear you were leaning toward the "He is leaving" camp. You put a support valve in there, but you were leaning.
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11-29-2010, 11:08 AM
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#103
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
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Well sure but leaning isn't the same as "safe bet".
FWIW, there does seem to be even more momentum building on moving Feliz to the rotation. We'll see. I think it's a mistake if they do it.
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11-29-2010, 11:43 AM
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#104
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Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 576
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthig32
Well sure but leaning isn't the same as "safe bet".
FWIW, there does seem to be even more momentum building on moving Feliz to the rotation. We'll see. I think it's a mistake if they do it.
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Same here. He was one of the top closers in all of baseball. Why mess with a good thing?
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11-29-2010, 11:47 AM
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#105
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Old School Balla
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 13,097
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Just read through the past couple of pages in this thread.
Feliz as a starter would be a mistake. He doesn't have enough pitches to make that work.
Also, I disagree with the assertion that Borbon is superior to D. Murphy defensively.
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11-29-2010, 11:50 AM
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#106
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Waco, TX
Posts: 8,141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthig32
Well sure but leaning isn't the same as "safe bet".
FWIW, there does seem to be even more momentum building on moving Feliz to the rotation. We'll see. I think it's a mistake if they do it.
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Some don't view it as a mistake as far as pulling him out is concerned... Him succeeding as a starter is yet to be seen of course, and Joe doesn't touch on that.
Hell, it could be argued that we could be much improved with Francisco/Ogando as the closer, Greinke in Lee's spot via trade, Feliz in Hunter's spot, and an abundance of offense brought in with the money we were going to spend on Lee IF he leaves (maybe Dunn for DH AND someone like Konerko). I hope we sign Lee, trade for Greinke, AND get one big bat in here, but I also realize this isn't being played out on PS3.
We shall see indeed...
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Last edited by Male30Dan; 11-29-2010 at 12:05 PM.
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11-29-2010, 11:54 AM
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#107
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Waco, TX
Posts: 8,141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kg_veteran
Just read through the past couple of pages in this thread.
Feliz as a starter would be a mistake. He doesn't have enough pitches to make that work.
Also, I disagree with the assertion that Borbon is superior to D. Murphy defensively.
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He has enough - he just doesn't currently trust them enough. He has a very nice changeup and you can just ask ARod about his curveball. You remember the one right? The one that took us to the World Series? There was also talk of him working on a 2-seamer. A full training camp stretched out and asked to rely on more than just that standard fastball would do him wonders. If he could start mixing in movement and speed regularly, this guy would be a Fing beast (more than he already is).
Regarding Borbon, well, I disagree. He is the superior defender out of those two but he isn't as good as some in here make him out to be.
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Last edited by Male30Dan; 11-29-2010 at 12:00 PM.
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11-29-2010, 12:15 PM
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#108
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
Posts: 18,721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Male29Dan
Some don't view it as a mistake...
Hell, it could be argued that we could be much improved with Francisco/Ogando as the closer, Greinke in Lee's spot via trade, Feliz in Hunter's spot, and an abundance of offense brought in with the money we were going to spend on Lee IF he leaves (maybe Dunn for DH AND someone like Konerko). I hope we sign Lee, trade for Greinke, AND get one big bat in here, but I also realize this isn't being played out on PS3.
We shall see indeed...
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I don't really see how JoPos' article (which was a great read btw) works as an admonition that Feliz should be a starter. It just argues that he should be used differently, and I agree.
BBTIA had some quotes from Jason Parks about Feliz this morning. I really respect Parks' opinions of the Rangers, as he's a legitimate scout that spends a lot of time following the Rangers. Here was his take:
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"Feliz threw 80 percent fastballs last year. He barely touched the curveball, which used to be his best [secondary pitch]. At this point, his fastball is solid, but his curveball is underdeveloped, so it will take time to refine. His transition wouldn't be as smooth as people think it would be. He would need half a season in AAA, if not more.
"I'm not sure it's the right time, and I know his stuff isn't ready for two, three, or four passes through a lineup. Big league hitters will eventually adjust to fastball-heavy pitchers after seeing it a few times. His change-up is very good, but he deploys it in a closer's sequence, and he goes to it more against left-handed hitters, obviously. How does that change-up play off a fastball that isn't 98 mph? How do those pitches pair after multiple passes? Where does the curveball fit in? Development doesnt just happen because the fanbase thinks its a good idea. The Rangers know Feliz's arm. They will make the right call. Fans aren't privy to the right info. Period."
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11-29-2010, 12:18 PM
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#109
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
Posts: 18,721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kg_veteran
Also, I disagree with the assertion that Borbon is superior to D. Murphy defensively.
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What is your basis for this? The Rangers certainly think so.
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11-29-2010, 01:01 PM
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#110
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Old School Balla
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 13,097
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Male29Dan
He has enough - he just doesn't currently trust them enough. He has a very nice changeup and you can just ask ARod about his curveball. You remember the one right? The one that took us to the World Series? There was also talk of him working on a 2-seamer. A full training camp stretched out and asked to rely on more than just that standard fastball would do him wonders. If he could start mixing in movement and speed regularly, this guy would be a Fing beast (more than he already is).
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Right now, Feliz has two pitches. I'm sure he could develop into a starter, but I think it's an iffy proposition for next year and a bad decision given his performance as a closer.
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11-29-2010, 01:05 PM
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#111
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Old School Balla
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 13,097
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthig32
What is your basis for this? The Rangers certainly think so.
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Watching a heck of a lot of Rangers games. Also, a friend who is a baseball nut/Rangers fan extraordinaire whose baseball opinions I respect quite a bit agrees with me.
Borbon might have a step on Murphy, but Murphy is more than fast enough to play any outfield position. He also (from my viewpoint) tends to get a better read/jump on the ball and has a much better arm than Borbon does. In other words, whatever Borbon has on him in speed, Murphy makes up for it with his arm and his ability to get a good jump on the ball.
And beyond all that, even if Borbon had a defensive advantage over Murphy, it certainly isn't enough to justify playing Borbon over Murphy when offense is taken into consideration.
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11-29-2010, 01:36 PM
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#112
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
Posts: 18,721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kg_veteran
Watching a heck of a lot of Rangers games. Also, a friend who is a baseball nut/Rangers fan extraordinaire whose baseball opinions I respect quite a bit agrees with me.
Borbon might have a step on Murphy, but Murphy is more than fast enough to play any outfield position. He also (from my viewpoint) tends to get a better read/jump on the ball and has a much better arm than Borbon does. In other words, whatever Borbon has on him in speed, Murphy makes up for it with his arm and his ability to get a good jump on the ball.
And beyond all that, even if Borbon had a defensive advantage over Murphy, it certainly isn't enough to justify playing Borbon over Murphy when offense is taken into consideration.
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Well, imo, Borbon has a lot more than a step on Murphy. He's a lot faster than Murphy. Murphy is nothing more than an emergency option in CF due to his lack of range.
Last year Murphy certainly had a good enough year to start ahead of Borbon if we're talking left field. I'm not sure that will continue to be the case, but regardless I want Borbon in the lineup because I don't want Hamilton in center.
FWIW, Borbon was ranked at the sixth best CF in baseball by the Fielding Bible, which is quickly becoming a very respected fielding assessment/award. And it's not just the geeky nerd stats either (Dan). It's voted on by a panel of people, including Peter Gammon and Joe Posnaski. One of the voters is also a group of video scouts that breaks down every play of every game for the entire season.
So there is some sentiment out there amongst the general baseball populous that Borbon is a very good defender.
Using your eyes on television can be a difficult way to guage defense, especially outfield defense. Mike Rhyner declared Nelson Cruz to be the worst defensive outfielder the Rangers had ever had a couple years ago. Of course maybe he's just a moron.
Anyway, bottom line, you won't find very many people in scouting circles to support the argument that Murphy and Borbon are even in the same stratosphere defensively, at least from what I've read/heard.
But I do love me some Murph.
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11-29-2010, 01:54 PM
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#113
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Waco, TX
Posts: 8,141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthig32
I don't really see how JoPos' article (which was a great read btw) works as an admonition that Feliz should be a starter. It just argues that he should be used differently, and I agree.
BBTIA had some quotes from Jason Parks about Feliz this morning. I really respect Parks' opinions of the Rangers, as he's a legitimate scout that spends a lot of time following the Rangers. Here was his take:
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I edited my post 10 minutes before you posted this - see my edit. I understood it didn't really suggest Feliz should be a starter - only that he isn't nearly as important as a closer and could/should be used differently.
Regarding Jason - sounds like a cocky little shit, but that's just my take on his post. I understand he throws fastball heavy, but I would think that is what is required out of a closer. Didn't Washington and Maddux tell him to go after guys instead of nibbling? That wasn't all fastball nibbling early on. My point is that he CAN throw the other pitches but simply hasn't because that type of a role doesn't (shouldn't) get too fancy - if you have overpowering stuff for 3 hitters, you get them out with it.
Bottom line, while there would most definitely be a transition period (though I think his talent would help jump that gap better than most), what better time than now. Why waste prime years of him as a starter when there are other guys available that can or even have been successful at his role?
To me it is an absolute no brainer to give him the same chance we gave CJ. IF he proves in spring training he can't handle it, fine, keep him as the closer (at least until the next year when I will want to try again), but damn it - let the kid try. How many thought CJ would do this well?
*crickets*
*crickets*
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11-29-2010, 01:58 PM
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#114
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Waco, TX
Posts: 8,141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kg_veteran
Watching a heck of a lot of Rangers games. Also, a friend who is a baseball nut/Rangers fan extraordinaire whose baseball opinions I respect quite a bit agrees with me.
Borbon might have a step on Murphy, but Murphy is more than fast enough to play any outfield position. He also (from my viewpoint) tends to get a better read/jump on the ball and has a much better arm than Borbon does. In other words, whatever Borbon has on him in speed, Murphy makes up for it with his arm and his ability to get a good jump on the ball.
And beyond all that, even if Borbon had a defensive advantage over Murphy, it certainly isn't enough to justify playing Borbon over Murphy when offense is taken into consideration.
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I agree with the part in bold greatly and have been preaching as much, despite Hamilton playing CF as a result.
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11-29-2010, 02:13 PM
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#115
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthig32
Well, imo, Borbon has a lot more than a step on Murphy. He's a lot faster than Murphy. Murphy is nothing more than an emergency option in CF due to his lack of range.
Last year Murphy certainly had a good enough year to start ahead of Borbon if we're talking left field. I'm not sure that will continue to be the case, but regardless I want Borbon in the lineup because I don't want Hamilton in center.
FWIW, Borbon was ranked at the sixth best CF in baseball by the Fielding Bible, which is quickly becoming a very respected fielding assessment/award. And it's not just the geeky nerd stats either (Dan). It's voted on by a panel of people, including Peter Gammon and Joe Posnaski. One of the voters is also a group of video scouts that breaks down every play of every game for the entire season.
So there is some sentiment out there amongst the general baseball populous that Borbon is a very good defender.
Using your eyes on television can be a difficult way to guage defense, especially outfield defense. Mike Rhyner declared Nelson Cruz to be the worst defensive outfielder the Rangers had ever had a couple years ago. Of course maybe he's just a moron.
Anyway, bottom line, you won't find very many people in scouting circles to support the argument that Murphy and Borbon are even in the same stratosphere defensively, at least from what I've read/heard.
But I do love me some Murph.
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He is definitely a lot faster than Murphy, but Murphy is still fast and does indeed get a good jump on balls. That is why I said (and I use my eyes too) that it isn't as crazy as some think to suggest Murphy is a darn good defender that can absolutely hold his own. He might not be as good as Borbon, but he is a good defender.
...and calling out eye-judgements based on one guy's view of one player's defense is silly. You had it right - he is a moron.
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11-29-2010, 02:16 PM
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#116
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
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Posts: 8,141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Male29Dan
He is definitely a lot faster than Murphy, but Murphy is still fast and does indeed get a good jump on balls. That is why I said (and I use my eyes too) that it isn't as crazy as some think to suggest Murphy is a darn good defender that can absolutely hold his own. He might not be as good as Borbon, but he is a good defender.
...and calling out eye-judgements based on one guy's view of one player's defense is silly. You had it right - he is a moron.
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FWIW - I just looked on that same site and David Murphy is listed as 7th for LF defense, just behind Hamilton who is 6th... Thiggy, would that be considered in the same stratosphere, or just outside of it?
Link...
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Last edited by Male30Dan; 11-29-2010 at 02:27 PM.
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11-29-2010, 02:27 PM
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#117
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
Posts: 18,721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Male29Dan
Regarding Jason - sounds like a cocky little shit, but that's just my take on his post. I understand he throws fastball heavy, but I would think that is what is required out of a closer. Didn't Washington and Maddux tell him to go after guys instead of nibbling? That wasn't all fastball nibbling early on. My point is that he CAN throw the other pitches but simply hasn't because that type of a role doesn't (shouldn't) get too fancy - if you have overpowering stuff for 3 hitters, you get them out with it.
Bottom line, while there would most definitely be a transition period (though I think his talent would help jump that gap better than most), what better time than now. Why waste prime years of him as a starter when there are other guys available that can or even have been successful at his role?
To me it is an absolute no brainer to give him the same chance we gave CJ. IF he proves in spring training he can't handle it, fine, keep him as the closer (at least until the next year when I will want to try again), but damn it - let the kid try. How many thought CJ would do this well?
*crickets*
*crickets*
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Oh JParks is quite cocky. No doubt. But he's also a professional scout that has spent a ton of time around the Rangers farm system, especially the guys that were coming up around the time that Feliz and Elvis were.
I'm not saying that means you take it as gospel, just presenting it as information to consider.
And I'm not necessarily opposed to giving him another shot in spring training. But I don't consider the comparison to CJ to be very valid. CJ's repertoire is light years ahead of Neffy's.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Male29Dan
FWIW - I just looked on that same site and David Murphy is listed as 7th for LF defense, just behind Hamilton who is 6th...
Link...
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Well, to be fair, he's just behind in the rankings but quite a bit behind on the actual point totals.
And I don't have much quibble with that. I'd be curious to see where they'd rank Borbon in left. I suspect it would be quite high, especially considering his arm doesn't hurt him much there.
And on the flip side, I feel pretty confident in saying that Murphy would be positioned as below average in center by anyone that would vote on this. He just doesn't have the range for center.
Last edited by jthig32; 11-29-2010 at 02:28 PM.
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11-29-2010, 02:30 PM
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#118
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Waco, TX
Posts: 8,141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthig32
Well, to be fair, he's just behind in the rankings but quite a bit behind on the actual point totals.
And I don't have much quibble with that. I'd be curious to see where they'd rank Borbon in left. I suspect it would be quite high, especially considering his arm doesn't hurt him much there.
And on the flip side, I feel pretty confident in saying that Murphy would be positioned as below average in center by anyone that would vote on this. He just doesn't have the range for center.
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Check my edit above...
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Last edited by Male30Dan; 11-29-2010 at 02:31 PM.
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11-29-2010, 02:33 PM
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#119
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
Posts: 18,721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Male29Dan
Check my edit above...
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Alright, maybe "same stratosphere" was hyperbolic. It's certainly not the first time I've been guilty of that.
It is interesting to note that Bill James has Murphy as the 3rd best left fielder in baseball, and Borbon as the 3rd best CF.
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11-29-2010, 02:35 PM
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#120
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Waco, TX
Posts: 8,141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthig32
Alright, maybe "same stratosphere" was hyperbolic. It's certainly not the first time I've been guilty of that.
It is interesting to note that Bill James has Murphy as the 3rd best left fielder in baseball, and Borbon as the 3rd best CF.
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Equally interesting is that several "experts" didn't vote for Hamilton at all.
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