Lakers : Shaq Is Back

[Shaq Attack2]

Originally posted by: Evilmav2
Shaq Attack wasn't banned from this site was he? If that is the reason "Shaq Attack II" has surfaced and I just didn't have a good grasp on his origination, that doesn't say anything good about our board...

I certainly won't agree with everything SA has argued on this thread, but I can't argue against the fact that most of his claims are based upon reasonable argumente... Folks: Let's extend a little bit of respect to folks who will argue logically in favor ot their favorite team's individual strengths...

Shaq Attack isn't making any cardboard-piece-gingerly-wiping-his-ass-statements while defending his Lakers, so I say the man deserves a bit of respect on this board. Maybe it is a terrible thing to realize, but the fact remains, that next year the NBA Hall-Of-Fame roster that the darned Lakers are going to possess are going to dominate the unanswered question of who will be NBA champion...

Our dramatically improved Mavs will certainly have a chance to smash the old-timer Lakers and the never-timer Kings next year, but it is just as likely that our championship dreams will take small steps forward and our ultimate glory will unfortunately be deferred by a year or two... Regardless of what happens this season, we are still richer in talent than any team save the aged Lakers, so our future is shining and bright...

We may not be able to forestall the LA train in the playoffs this year, but we have a darned, darned good chance of burying the rapist's squad, and barring that eventuality, we have a darned good chance of climbing that mountain sometime during the next couple of years...

Thanks Evilmav. You were one of the more sensible non-Kings fans over at the KingsFans forums when I used to post there.

If anyone honestly thinks I'm just trying to start trouble because I'm a Laker fan, you're simply wrong. I mean that in a nice way too, because I honestly just want to talk hoops. Evilmav talks hoops very well over at KingsFans, and a lot of the time it's defending the Mavs. I'm surprised KingsFan hasn't banned him yet, as they are extremely touchy about non-Kings fans defending their teams. I'd love to post on Dallas-Mavs forums and not have to be careful about what I say (in terms of negative comments about the Mavs) for fear of banning. IMO it's always good to get the non-Lakers fan perspective on the state of things, and that's why I'd like to post here. I learn more this way. In addition, because I follow the Lakers more closely than the Mavs, I'll definitely be able to find fans here that are more knowledgeable. For example, it's well known that the Mavs don't have the best defense out of the top Western teams, but after watching them last year I'd have to say that they will definitely improve their defense this year to the point where it's well above average, which given their offensive prowess should be more than enough. Lots of Lakers, Kings, and Spurs fans will say "Mavs just suck at D". I honestly believe these fans don't watch enough Mavs games, as I believe myself to be pretty knowledgeable about bball and I feel that the Mavs supposed "terrible D" is over exaggerated based on the stats and games I've watched.

Anyway, thanks for any consideration.

[kg_veteran]

It’s not your message board.

Wow, the ever insightful "you're not the boss of me" response. This IS my message board, because it's where I talk basketball.

Interesting analysis.

If you want to talk about luck being involved in basketball, or pro sports, we could pretty much be here all year. You could make a pretty decent argument that a lot of teams would have done ___________ if only this, that, and the other thing had happened. But those things didn't happen, and it just ends up sounding like sour grapes. Imagine the ridicule a Mavericks fan would take if they started talking about how the Mavericks would have won the title if only Dirk hadn't gotten hurt, the Mavs hadn't ignored Steve Kerr in Game 6, etc, etc, etc. I don't think the standard should be any different for a Laker fan.

Profound.

It is profound. In spite of your speculation about what Horry MIGHT have done, we all know what he did. Thus, we can analyze how things are, not how they might have been.

Insightful.

Thanks for the compliment. Pointing out the obvious and turning someone's own arguments against them is often considered insightful.

LMAO! If any statement deserves the childish responses you’ve been making, it’s this one; “Excuses are what losers make.”

If I've got you pegged wrong, as Evil seems to suggest, then I apologize. But you sure sound like a guy who just came here to talk smack. I didn't like it when the Lakers tried to put an asterisk next to the first Spurs title, and I don't like this method of trying to put an asterisk by the most recent one. I'm not a Spurs fan. I just think credit should be given where it's deserved. And the Spurs deserve credit because they beat the teams in front of them. That's what they're required to do. No one puts an asterisk beside the 1989 Pistons title, and they beat a Lakers team that didn't have its starting backcourt and best player.

No, no one does, that’s the point.

Actually, yeah, we do. He has arthritis in his big toe. The doctors in the room say that it's a degenerative condition that can't be treated or cured; I'm gonna believe what they have to say on the issue.

No.

Well then, you'd better have something worthwhile to say. Thus far, you haven't.

[Murphy3]

evil, i don't extend a welcome to mavs fans that have nothing of importance to say. So, I'm not going to extend a welcome to a laker fan that has nothing of importance to say.

[kg_veteran]

I certainly won't agree with everything SA has argued on this thread, but I can't argue against the fact that most of his claims are based upon reasonable argumente... Folks: Let's extend a little bit of respect to folks who will argue logically in favor ot their favorite team's individual strengths...

If he wants to argue logically in favor of the Lakers' individual strengths, that's fine. But it's annoying when a brand new guy comes in and starts talking about how lucky everyone is that the Lakers didn't win 4 in a row. Also, it's annoying when a brand new guy proclaims himself a medical expert on top of everything else.

[Drbio]

Especially when he clearly does not understand the medical condition that he extolls to understand. I assume he has a brain too, but that clearly doesn't make him a brain surgeon.

[OutletPass]

Quote:
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Originally posted by: OutletPass
I'll also go rhyme and verse with you on arthritis treatment, Fat Attack, and so will the esteemed physician Dr. Mrs. OutletPass...by the end, you'll be dropping your pants when she says "Turn your head and cough"...and getting your nuts caught in a vise.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What grade are you in?

Quote
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If you have Doctor level credentials, then bring it on. If not, quit the "short bus" posturing.
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LOL! Like I actually need “Doctor level credentials” to tell you that arthritis is treatable. I'm posting under this new handle because apparently I've been banned.

-- What grade am I in ? Maybe that ridiculous question applies to you, Fat Attack, but I managed over "25 grades" years ago... And, yes, it would help the discussion if you were a physician, which you apparently are NOT. What you are is a TROLL who's been banned and created a new profile in order to troll AGAIN

Osteoarthritis (AH-stee-oh-ar-THREYE-tis) is the most common type of arthritis, especially among older people. Sometimes it is called degenerative joint disease or osteoarthrosis. Osteoarthritis is a joint disease that mostly affects the cartilage (KAR-til-uj). Cartilage is the slippery tissue that covers the ends of bones in a joint. Healthy cartilage allows bones to glide over one another. It also absorbs energy from the shock of physical movement. In osteoarthritis, the surface layer of cartilage breaks down and wears away. This allows bones under the cartilage to rub together, causing pain, swelling, and loss of motion of the joint. Over time, the joint may lose its normal shape. Also, bone spurs--small growths called osteophytes--may grow on the edges of the joint. Bits of bone or cartilage can break off and float inside the joint space. This causes more pain and damage. People with osteoarthritis usually have joint pain and limited movement. Unlike some other forms of arthritis, osteoarthritis affects only joints and not internal organs. For example, rheumatoid arthritis--the second most common form of arthritis--affects other parts of the body besides the joints. It begins at a younger age than osteoarthritis, causes swelling and redness in joints, and may make people feel sick, tired, and (uncommonly) feverish. Scientists do not know yet what causes the disease, but they suspect a combination of factors, including being overweight, the aging process, joint injury, and stresses on the joints from certain jobs and sports activities.

Treatment Approaches to Osteoarthritis (and please note: This doesn't say CURE.)

Exercise (Didn't work)
Weight control (Didn't work)
Rest and joint care (Didn't Work)
Pain relief techniques (Didn't work)
Medicines (Shaq used corticosteroids, which didn't work)
Surgery (Shaq had a cheilectomy, discussed below)


Corticosteroids, powerful anti-inflammatory hormones made naturally in the body or manmade for use as medicine. Corticosteroids may be injected into the affected joints to temporarily relieve pain. This is a short-term measure, generally not recommended for more than two or three treatments per year. Oral corticosteroids should not be used to treat osteoarthritis.

Surgery: For many people, surgery helps relieve the pain and disability of osteoarthritis. Surgery may be performed to 1) Remove pieces of bone and cartilage from the joint if they are causing mechanical symptoms of buckling or locking; 2) Resurface (smooth out) bones;3) Reposition bones; 4) Replace joints.

Surgeons may replace affected joints with artificial joints called prostheses. These joints can be made from metal alloys, high-density plastic, and ceramic material. They can be joined to bone surfaces by special cements. Artificial joints can last 10 to 15 years or longer. About 10 percent of artificial joints may need revision. Surgeons choose the design and components of prostheses according to their patient's weight, sex, age, activity level, and other medical conditions.

When nothin else worked, Shaq had a cheilectomy to TREAT the pain by removing bone spurs and inserting a metal screw.

What is cheilectomy?

Cheilectomy is a surgical procedure to remove a bony lump (made up of bone spurs) on the top of the main joint of the big toe. The bone spurs are almost always caused by degenerative arthritis of the big toe (sometimes known as "Hallux Rigidus"). Sometimes an injury to the cartilage covering the end of the big toe will set the degenerative motion in process and eventually lead to Hallux Rigidus.

Why would someone have a cheilectomy done?

This operation is performed as a treatment for degenerative arthritis, as in the case of Shaq, and when the bony spurs are pressing painfully on the shoe. Bone spurs form around the joint as part of the degenerative process. The spurs may restrict the motion in the joint, especially the ability of the toe to bend upward when the foot moves forward.

What is degenerative arthritis?

Degenerative athritis is a break down of the joints in the body, a wearing away of the joint itself and the connective tissue around the joint. While the cause of most forms of arthritis is unknown, there are three major factors that play a role: heredity, lifestyle and environmental factors such as overuse and/or a traumatic injury.

Here's what his surgeon, Dr. Mohr, said: "There is no cure for the arthritic condition -- and thus no guarantee O'Neal won't encounter similar problems in the future. Whether O'Neal, who turns 31 in March, will be able to play out his career without recurring problems in the toe is unknown. Doctors have said there is a small chance the cheilectomy could even accelerate the arthritis.

Here's what his diagnostician (Dr. Kwong) said: "Trimming the spur may facilitate the movement in some ways, but you still don't have cartilage between the bones. That's going to be an ongoing issue . "This is not a treatment that can remedy the underlying (problem). He still has an arthritic joint. ... You're trying to lengthen the longevity of what cartilage you have left. You haven't solved the biomechanical problem."


----- Ok, Fat Attack, do YOU GET IT, Shaq has a degenerative, chronic condition that was treated by the LAST MEANS AVAILABLE, BUT IT DIDN'T SOLVE the underlying problem . Read what Dr. Mohr and Dr. Kwong have said.

Then try to understand this VERY difficult quote by Dr. Lombardo, the Laker's Team physician ""I think if he was 120 pounds, it would still be a problem."

[Drbio]

[kg_veteran]

OP, I'd appreciate it if you could stop being so conclusory and provide a little support for your position. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

Honestly, it's enjoyable watching you work. You ripped the poor bastard to shreds.

[Murphy3]

it reminds me of chiwas being ripped to shreds by KG

[Drbio]

[MFFL]

There are certain internet boards where Shaq Attack can bring his weak ass shit and get away with it.

This ain't one of those boards.

Great job op and kg!

[Chiwas]

This reminds me of Murphy3 being ripped hundred times to shreds by Drbio.

[OutletPass]

Just ANOTHER case of someone not thinking or researching or knowing what they're talking about BEFORE they post....no biggie.

Let him come back and challenge medical facts....


Your Obedient Servant......OP.









"From Hell" !

[Murphy3]

good comeback chiwas...

if you had any pride whatsoever, you would have left the site a long time ago after all the debates that you've lost

[Chiwas]

The All Time bashed guy has spoken. Even the gals have bashed you Murph time after time in every subject and you get back time after time. Maybe you're proud just to be listened despite the bashing because your lack of anything.

[Murphy3]

i think you'd be hard pressed to come up with many people that would actually say that they've beaten me badly in any kind of debate.

now, you might have some girls and guys that don't like me on a personal level. However, I'm not a whipping boy, like yourself...Everyone doesn't take a turn destroying me in debates like they do with you.

Now, maybe it's more important for you to develop internet relationships than it is to actually get on here and talk intelligent basketball. Apparently, that is the case. However, it's not the case with me. And I'm sure that as long as your goals are simply to sit around in a circle jerk in the lounge and drool over najera in the mavs section, you will in fact be able to reach your goals.

But, if you'd want to be respected for your basketball knowledge by anyone worth more than a rat's ass, well..let's just say that you've got a long ways to go

[Chiwas]

Your intelligent basketball:

- Dallas should post Dirk up more.
- Najera can't rebound.

Do you have anything else in your bag?

[Murphy3]

sure, what else would you like to know?

[Murphy3]

I just wanted to correctly you really quickly. Najera can't rebound on the defensive end. He can rebound on the offensive end.

If you're going to rip on the guy, at least know what you're talking about first. That's a little unfair to Najera to just throw out a blanket statement without issuing the correct qualifying remarks.

Please don't let that happen again. It does little for your credibility.

[Shaq Attack2]

What grade am I in ? Maybe that ridiculous question applies to you, Fat Attack, but I managed over "25 grades" years ago... And, yes, it would help the discussion if you were a physician, which you apparently are NOT. What you are is a TROLL who's been banned and created a new profile in order to troll AGAIN.

Apparently critical reading wasn't part of your 25 grades of curriculum all those years ago. Reread my comments above.

Osteoarthritis (AH-stee-oh-ar-THREYE-tis) is the most common type of arthritis, especially among older people. Sometimes it is called degenerative joint disease or osteoarthrosis. Osteoarthritis is a joint disease that mostly affects the cartilage (KAR-til-uj). Cartilage is the slippery tissue that covers the ends of bones in a joint. Healthy cartilage allows bones to glide over one another. It also absorbs energy from the shock of physical movement. In osteoarthritis, the surface layer of cartilage breaks down and wears away. This allows bones under the cartilage to rub together, causing pain, swelling, and loss of motion of the joint. Over time, the joint may lose its normal shape. Also, bone spurs--small growths called osteophytes--may grow on the edges of the joint. Bits of bone or cartilage can break off and float inside the joint space. This causes more pain and damage. People with osteoarthritis usually have joint pain and limited movement. Unlike some other forms of arthritis, osteoarthritis affects only joints and not internal organs. For example, rheumatoid arthritis--the second most common form of arthritis--affects other parts of the body besides the joints. It begins at a younger age than osteoarthritis, causes swelling and redness in joints, and may make people feel sick, tired, and (uncommonly) feverish. Scientists do not know yet what causes the disease, but they suspect a combination of factors, including being overweight, the aging process, joint injury, and stresses on the joints from certain jobs and sports activities.

Treatment Approaches to Osteoarthritis (and please note: This doesn't say CURE.)

Exercise (Didn't work)
Weight control (Didn't work)
Rest and joint care (Didn't Work)
Pain relief techniques (Didn't work)
Medicines (Shaq used corticosteroids, which didn't work)
Surgery (Shaq had a cheilectomy, discussed below)


Corticosteroids, powerful anti-inflammatory hormones made naturally in the body or manmade for use as medicine. Corticosteroids may be injected into the affected joints to temporarily relieve pain. This is a short-term measure, generally not recommended for more than two or three treatments per year. Oral corticosteroids should not be used to treat osteoarthritis.

Surgery: For many people, surgery helps relieve the pain and disability of osteoarthritis. Surgery may be performed to 1) Remove pieces of bone and cartilage from the joint if they are causing mechanical symptoms of buckling or locking; 2) Resurface (smooth out) bones;3) Reposition bones; 4) Replace joints.

Surgeons may replace affected joints with artificial joints called prostheses. These joints can be made from metal alloys, high-density plastic, and ceramic material. They can be joined to bone surfaces by special cements. Artificial joints can last 10 to 15 years or longer. About 10 percent of artificial joints may need revision. Surgeons choose the design and components of prostheses according to their patient's weight, sex, age, activity level, and other medical conditions.

When nothin else worked, Shaq had a cheilectomy to TREAT the pain by removing bone spurs and inserting a metal screw.

What is cheilectomy?

Cheilectomy is a surgical procedure to remove a bony lump (made up of bone spurs) on the top of the main joint of the big toe. The bone spurs are almost always caused by degenerative arthritis of the big toe (sometimes known as "Hallux Rigidus"). Sometimes an injury to the cartilage covering the end of the big toe will set the degenerative motion in process and eventually lead to Hallux Rigidus.

Why would someone have a cheilectomy done?

This operation is performed as a treatment for degenerative arthritis, as in the case of Shaq, and when the bony spurs are pressing painfully on the shoe. Bone spurs form around the joint as part of the degenerative process. The spurs may restrict the motion in the joint, especially the ability of the toe to bend upward when the foot moves forward.

What is degenerative arthritis?

Degenerative athritis is a break down of the joints in the body, a wearing away of the joint itself and the connective tissue around the joint. While the cause of most forms of arthritis is unknown, there are three major factors that play a role: heredity, lifestyle and environmental factors such as overuse and/or a traumatic injury.

Here's what his surgeon, Dr. Mohr, said: "There is no cure for the arthritic condition -- and thus no guarantee O'Neal won't encounter similar problems in the future. Whether O'Neal, who turns 31 in March, will be able to play out his career without recurring problems in the toe is unknown. Doctors have said there is a small chance the cheilectomy could even accelerate the arthritis.

Here's what his diagnostician (Dr. Kwong) said: "Trimming the spur may facilitate the movement in some ways, but you still don't have cartilage between the bones. That's going to be an ongoing issue . "This is not a treatment that can remedy the underlying (problem). He still has an arthritic joint. ... You're trying to lengthen the longevity of what cartilage you have left. You haven't solved the biomechanical problem."

Wow, all that and you still missed the most important part; "Whether O'Neal, who turns 31 in March, will be able to play out his career without recurring problems in the toe is unknown."

I know that he can never cure his arthritic toe and I know he's had the best treatment modern medicine can provide. But yet again, you seem to miss the point; treatment is available (however limited in nature) to make playing basketball a possibly for some amount of time. Again, who knows how long, it could be next year or it could be 6 years down the road.

You even claim that exercise and medicine has failed Shaq yet provide absolutely zero proof for that claim, just your blanket statements. Pffft.

Ok, Fat Attack, do YOU GET IT, Shaq has a degenerative, chronic condition that was treated by the LAST MEANS AVAILABLE, BUT IT DIDN'T SOLVE the underlying problem.

Yikes, read over what you just cut and pasted. Shaq's toe surgery didn't fail, it simply reconstructed his toe in a few innovative ways (from what I’ve read elsewhere) to delay the possibility of serious pain/injury given his intensive bball schedle. You can't heal Shaq's toe, you can only work around it to prolong its usefulness for his bball career.

Read what Dr. Mohr and Dr. Kwong have said. Then try to understand this VERY difficult quote by Dr. Lombardo, the Laker's Team physician ""I think if he was 120 pounds, it would still be a problem."

That quote means jack. He could weight 10lbs and he'd still have the problem. Lombardo was probably answering questions about how Shaq’s weight affected his toe. Christ, not a difficult concept.

Originally posted by: Murphy3
evil, i don't extend a welcome to mavs fans that have nothing of importance to say. So, I'm not going to extend a welcome to a laker fan that has nothing of importance to say.

That’s great, I could care less. I don’t extend welcome to Mavs homers that have nothing important to say and hate Lakers fans, so I’ll just have to continue ignoring you, which could be difficult given your 17 post per day.

If I've got you pegged wrong, as Evil seems to suggest, then I apologize. But you sure sound like a guy who just came here to talk smack. I didn't like it when the Lakers tried to put an asterisk next to the first Spurs title, and I don't like this method of trying to put an asterisk by the most recent one. I'm not a Spurs fan. I just think credit should be given where it's deserved. And the Spurs deserve credit because they beat the teams in front of them. That's what they're required to do. No one puts an asterisk beside the 1989 Pistons title, and they beat a Lakers team that didn't have its starting backcourt and best player.

I’m not one of those stupid Laker homers that say “Spurs 99 title should have an asterisk because it was a shortened season”. IMO that’s foolish, everyone had to deal with the same amount of games that year and therefore it was a level playing field. I won’t put an asterisk by their 2003 title either, but I will certainly recognize the incredible luck that got them that title. However, I also recognize the Spurs incredible play and talent last year. You have to take both facts into consideration, IMO of course. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

Originally posted by: MFFL
There are certain internet boards where Shaq Attack can bring his weak ass shit and get away with it.

This ain't one of those boards.

Great job op and kg!

Meh, I could care less, you haven't even bothered to discuss anything in this thread and have been taking sides without adding substance.

[Chiwas]

Originally posted by: Murphy3
I just wanted to correctly you really quickly. Najera can't rebound on the defensive end. He can rebound on the offensive end.

Defensive rebounds. 2002-2003

1.- Dirk 8.9
2.- Finley 4.3
3.- Bradley 4
4.- LaFrentz 3
5.- Najera 2.8
6.- Griffin, NVE 2.4
8.- Williams 2.3
9.- Nash 2.1
10.- TAW 1.9

2.8 rebounds per game (23 minutes) and the 5th best Mav on defense rebounds are "can't rebound" for Murph.

Yeah, wonderful hoops. And it's the best you can throw on the table. Just figure why "movies" is your main topic.

[Evilmav2]

I’m not one of those stupid Laker homers that say “Spurs 99 title should have an asterisk because it was a shortened season”. IMO that’s foolish, everyone had to deal with the same amount of games that year and therefore it was a level playing field. I won’t put an asterisk by their 2003 title either, but I will certainly recognize the incredible luck that got them that title.

Another Asterisk championship? Maybe not...

Accidental Champs? Champs by Default? Probably yes...

Sure Tim Duncan played MVP caliber ball last year, and the Spurs did win when it counted in the playoffs, but regardless of their achievements in 02-03, I will never be convinced that the Webber/Dirk injuries, the nagging injuries of Shaq, and the the Laker's commensurate lack of depth, wasn't principally responsible for dropping the ripe cherry of an accidental championship into San Antonio's lap...

[kg_veteran]

2.8 rebounds per game (23 minutes) and the 5th best Mav on defense rebounds are "can't rebound" for Murph.

Chiwas, comments like this make you look really bad. Do you realize where 2.8 defensive rebounds per game puts Najera among NBA forwards? There are SEVENTY who average more defensive rebounds per game. And that includes small forwards. I shudder to think where he ranks vs. other power forwards in the league. It can't be pretty.

The guy is a terrible defensive rebounder. And for you to make this smug post, as if you've really shown Murph up, well, it's downright pathetic.

[Drbio]

[OutletPass]

Nonsense originally posted by FatAttack2:

You even claim that exercise and medicine has failed Shaq yet provide absolutely zero proof for that claim, just your blanket statements. Pffft.

Now that Shaq is thinner and is shooting better than he ever has from the FT line, do you really think he's not going to tear up the league this year, especially with help from Malone and Payton? Can you say unanimous MVP?

Ok...once again...neither exercise nor medicine can regenerate cartilage...he had to have the surgery to try to extend it (and to shave off the bone spurs). It was NOT a reconstruction. And, as his Doctors have said, it's going to be an ongoing issue and they don't know how long he'll be able to play. Sorry if you can't handle that emotionally, FatAttack.

Ooops...just noticed your hypocrisy and tacit admission:

treatment is available (however limited in nature) to make playing basketball a possibly for some amount of time. Again, who knows how long, it could be next year or it could be 6 years down the road.

...well there goes your unanimous MVP "guarantee".


Now I'm going to roll over and kiss MY Beautiful Doctor goodnight and be totally through with you and your pompous proclamations. And your Pffft's...whatever they may be.

[Shaq Attack2]

Originally posted by: OutletPass
Nonsense originally posted by FatAttack2:

Ok...once again...neither exercise nor medicine can regenerate cartilage...he had to have the surgery to try to extend it (and to shave off the bone spurs). It was NOT a reconstruction. And, as his Doctors have said, it's going to be an ongoing issue and they don't know how long he'll be able to play. Sorry if you can't handle that emotionally, FatAttack.

I can "handle" it just fine, but apparently you have trouble comprehending what I've said and what the facts are. No where did I say exercise or medicine can regenerate the type of cartilage Shaq is losing. Though, he can certainly delay how much cartilage he loses for the foreseeable future. Take a wild guess as to why Shaq is still doing those special exercises and taking medicine?

Ooops...just noticed your hypocrisy and tacit admission:

...well there goes your unanimous MVP "guarantee".

Apparently you fail to comprehend the difference between next year and next season. Yeah I know, it sucks when you realize your mistakes.

Now I'm going to roll over and kiss MY Beautiful Doctor goodnight and be totally through with you and your pompous proclamations. And your Pffft's...whatever they may be.

Uh, more than I needed to know, honestly.

Anyway, if you're done arguing some of the points you brought up (and that I never challenged in the first place), can we get back to talking about something else in this thread. Or perhaps letting it die, either way is good for me.

[Murphy3]

kg, if you include players that played around the same amount of games/minutes as najera (remember, he missed considerable amount of time)..well, it places najera somewhere past the 250th spot

when you're just ranking forwards like you did KG, you're just ranking guys that played in enough games to qualify...there's not that many that qualify..but, if you look at the bigger picture, you'll see how inept najera is on the defensive side when it comes to rebounding

[kg_veteran]

Originally posted by: Murphy3
kg, if you include players that played around the same amount of games/minutes as najera (remember, he missed considerable amount of time)..well, it places najera somewhere past the 250th spot

when you're just ranking forwards like you did KG, you're just ranking guys that played in enough games to qualify...there's not that many that qualify..but, if you look at the bigger picture, you'll see how inept najera is on the defensive side when it comes to rebounding

No question about it. He's a horrible defensive rebounder.

[kg_veteran]

Shaq Attack - Outlet Pass has thoroughly embarrassed you and proven you wrong. If you want to have any credibility on this site, you'll simply take the beating he's given you, and move on to another thread. On the other hand, if you want to lose any chance at having some credibility, you'll continue to be a smart ass and argue with him in the same smug fashion.

You seem like a smart guy. I'm hoping you choose the first option.

[Chiwas]

Originally posted by: kg_veteran

Chiwas, comments like this make you look really bad. Do you realize where 2.8 defensive rebounds per game puts Najera among NBA forwards? There are SEVENTY who average more defensive rebounds per game. And that includes small forwards. I shudder to think where he ranks vs. other power forwards in the league. It can't be pretty.

The guy is a terrible defensive rebounder. And for you to make this smug post, as if you've really shown Murph up, well, it's downright pathetic.

Your stupid comments make me laugh once againg. You both are the most pathetic things (don't want to compare you with persons) ever happened in D-M.

[kg_veteran]

Your stupid comments make me laugh once againg. You both are the most pathetic things (don't want to compare you with persons) ever happened in D-M.

Chiwas, thank you for the substantive reply to my rather correct criticism of your post.

What "stupid comments" would you be referring to? Please, do elaborate.

In the meantime, if you want to hang out in the Lounge and talk about bland nothingness and make a bunch of Internet pals, fine by me. But when you venture out and try and make a basketball-related comment (such as a comment implying that 2.8 defensive rebounds per game makes Najera a good defensive rebounder), I'm going to hold you accountable.

[Chiwas]

Like momma says, it bes that way sometimes!


Edit: Forgot the "[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]".

[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

[kg_veteran]

Like momma says, it bes that way sometimes!

Translation: I'm going to babble for a while, because I don't really have anything to say.

[Chiwas]

HAHAHAHAHAHA!

The KG's sign means "I'm going to babble for a while, because I don't really have anything to say."

At last he recognises his role in D-M through his signature.

[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]

(My God!, can't stop laughing, seriously)

[kg_veteran]

That was the translation of you quoting my signature rather than actually addressing my post.

But, of course, being the intellect that you are, you thought I was literally interpreting my signature.

It's just a shame you think people actually agree with you. Nothing could be further from the truth.

[Chiwas]

Whatever, KG.

You're done.

[kg_veteran]

Chiwa, let's just be brutally honest with each other. This all stems back to me laying a verbal beating on you a few months ago. You picked a fight with me when I asked you to substantiate some claims you were making. And I thoroughly embarrassed you. That's established fact. Your only response was to call me names, hurl weak insults, and troll my threads.

Your utter denial that the verbal beating occurred and your sudden "lack of respect" for me makes you look like a complete idiot.

If you want to talk about basketball, and try and support your claim that Najera is a good defensive rebounder, then do that.

However, if you want to pick another fight with me, don't waste your time and force me to embarrass you again.

[Chiwas]

You haven't embarrassed me ever, KG.

As if it was a big deal. Lol.

More yet, I've felt sorrow many times watching how a former regular poster became a Murph-level one just for a subjetive obsession. Not the Najera stats, but the Najera-Chiwas obsession.

[Murphy3]

get ready for KG to whip chiwas' @ss again....

[kg_veteran]

You haven't embarrassed me ever, KG.

As if it was a big deal. Lol.

If you didn't feel embarrassed, that doesn't mean that I didn't embarrass you.

Also, you sure have acted like it was a big deal. For not being embarrassed, you troll an awful lot of my posts and do your best (which isn't very good) to attack me and my opinions.

More yet, I've felt sorrow many times watching how a former regular poster became a Murph-level one just for a subjetive obsession. Not the Najera stats, but the Najera-Chiwas obsession.

Chiwas, the only obsession I have, if any, that's relevant to this message board is my obsession with the Dallas Mavericks and the game of basketball. I love to talk about the Mavericks. I know a hell of a lot about the Mavericks. And when someone repeatedly makes incorrect factual statements about the team or one of its players, I'm going to point it out. If you'd concede that Najera isn't a good defensive rebounder (much as you have already conceded he's not a key contributor) and stop being an ass about it, I'd probably leave you alone.

Also, please don't feel any sorrow for me. I'm still a regular poster (as opposed to a former one), and you're the only guy who doesn't "respect" me, so I'm doing okay.