Mavs Free Agency 11/12 - Page 33 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

markus1234 · 12-10-2011, 02:41 PM

Let me copy&paste this from "the other" board.

Quote:

Dwights post season average last season: 27 points, 16 rebounds.
I say 27 points is pretty damn near 30 so he's a +20 matchup advantage.

the amunt of times he scored 30-50 points last year? 16 times.

there are a lot of centers in the NBA CHandler has problems with down low:
Dwight - obvious reasons
Bogut - in theory its also him, but Chandler did well last year, maybe due to Bogut having broken arms/fingers.
Bynum - Tyson got man handled by him
Al Jefferson - Jefferson is a 30+ ppg threat against CHandler (no kidding, look it up)
Marc Gasol - too big for Chandler
Kaman - we had to put Dirk on him in our matches against the Clippers, because Kaman would just spin around CHandler at will
Gortat - he is overperforming against CHandler with 20+ ppg

and then the PFs
Gasol - who CHandler had trouble with all post season, he needed Dirk to cover Pau
Z-Bo - who neither of our frontcourt players could contain
Nene - too crafty

and many more

interestingle he also has problems with heavy non scoring centers who abuse him, like Perkins

its worth noting that we could avoid all those matchup problems by either sticking Haywood or Dirk on them.
e.g. Dirk is a better iso post defender than Chandler, hence we were able to hide Tysons weakness there.
without Haywood and Dirk, Chandler wouldn't be able to roam freely around to stop every penetration.
therefore he is a good fit with our defensivly weak backcourt (against penetrating wings) and our strong post defenders.

if he doesn't have the luxury of strong iso defenders next to him he'll be way less useful.
I already explained that Chandler always needed strong build centers next to him for his whole career (Jackson, Ely, Diop, Haywood etc) without those he was barely useful.

Spot on

Underdog · 12-10-2011, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

Someone start the Ahmad Nivens appreciation thread.

EricaLubarsky · 12-10-2011, 02:56 PM

-chandler
-butler
-barea

+carter
+dalembert (?)
+wright
+Fernandez
+rautins

? Stevenson
? janitor

Not a good net so far for 11/12 at least

FINtastic · 12-10-2011, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by markus1234

Let me copy&paste this from "the other" board.

Spot on

It's not even close to being that.

Bayliss · 12-10-2011, 02:58 PM

Quote:

-chandler
-butler
-barea

+carter
+dalembert (?)

Not a good net so far

But add Roddy to the + column. I know it is potential but he will be the Barea replacement.

FINtastic · 12-10-2011, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bayliss

But add Roddy to the + column. I know it is potential but he will be the Barea replacement.

Yeah, I'm not too concerned about Barea's loss because I think we can make it up between Roddy and Dojo.

She's also missing Brandan Wright, who I think people are going to be a lot happier with once this season actually starts.

dirno2000 · 12-10-2011, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by markus1234

Let me copy&paste this from "the other" board.

Spot on

That's actually a pretty poor analysis.

Lor20 · 12-10-2011, 03:12 PM

so we get to talk to dwight... now that would maek me forget about chandler in a minute.. but i doubt we can land him

Five-ofan · 12-10-2011, 03:14 PM

Since iv been so anti chandler ill add this, while i think hes being overvalued by others based on how well he fit here, he did fit amazing well here and there are very very few people who could do the same things.

Bayliss · 12-10-2011, 03:15 PM

Five-O, the guy in your avy could do those things.

MavsWiLLHaVeRinGs · 12-10-2011, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

-chandler
-butler
-barea

+carter
+dalembert (?)
+wright
+Fernandez
+rautins

? Stevenson
? janitor

Not a good net so far for 11/12 at least

Rautins is getting bought out, and don't forget we got a big ol' trade exception. Hopefully something good comes of it someday.

Five-ofan · 12-10-2011, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bayliss

Five-O, the guy in your avy could do those things.

The big fella couldnt come close to covering the pick and roll like chandler.

twistaeffect2004 · 12-10-2011, 03:18 PM

So with Chauncey Billups officially being amnestied, do the Mavs go after him? He's given fair warning to teams with cap space that if they claim him he will not be a happy camper and even contemplate retiring giving some the feeling that he wants to play for a contender.

In his own words: "I'm tired of being the glue guy." Story soon on Y! (From Adrian Woj Twitter)

"People take my kindness and professionalism for weakness. They think I’ll be OK with (getting claimed). I won’t be OK with this." (Adrian Woj Twitter)

So, one, do the Mavs have interest in him to form a split PG rotation between Kidd and Billups? And if they were to consider him, would Billups be interested in such a role?

jthig32 · 12-10-2011, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by twistaeffect2004

So, one, do the Mavs have interest in him to form a split PG rotation between Kidd and Billups? And if they were to consider him, would Billups be interested in such a role?

The answer to the second question is almost certainly no, so I don't think the first matters.

dirno2000 · 12-10-2011, 03:20 PM

I don't think you can place too much value on Chandler's ability to play the pick and roll. I'd take a center that's an average post defender but an elite pick and roll defender over the inverse. Not every team has a back to the basket threat down low and most of those guys are going to get theirs anyway. On the flip side every team in the league runs the high screen multiple times a game. Having a center that can switch and not embarrass himself against guards and forwards or that can show and get back to the paint before being exploited is invaluable. He's one of the more unique players in the league.

MavsWiLLHaVeRinGs · 12-10-2011, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by twistaeffect2004

So with Chauncey Billups officially being amnestied, do the Mavs go after him? He's given fair warning to teams with cap space that if they claim him he will not be a happy camper and even contemplate retiring giving some the feeling that he wants to play for a contender.

In his own words: "I'm tired of being the glue guy." Story soon on Y! (From Adrian Woj Twitter)

"People take my kindness and professionalism for weakness. They think I’ll be OK with (getting claimed). I won’t be OK with this." (Adrian Woj Twitter)

So, one, do the Mavs have interest in him to form a split PG rotation between Kidd and Billups? And if they were to consider him, would Billups be interested in such a role?

Read that he wants to go to the Heat. That would be hilarious if Cleveland claimed him just so he would retire and couldnt go to the Heat.

Bayliss · 12-10-2011, 03:27 PM

Yeah but could Chandler still the ball and go coast to coast?

(If only I can find that gif... it is somewhere out there in cyberspace. Btw, which poster was obsessed with Bradley? God... I know he was good friends with madape.)

grndmstr_c · 12-10-2011, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dirno2000

I don't think you can place too much value on Chandler's ability to play the pick and roll. I'd take a center that's an average post defender but an elite pick and roll defender over the inverse. Not every team has a back to the basket threat down low and most of those guys are going to get theirs anyway. On the flip side every team in the league runs the high screen multiple times a game. Having a center that can switch and not embarrass himself against guards and forwards or that can show and get back to the paint before being exploited is invaluable. He's one of the more unique players in the league.

I actually think a number of people around here have been placing too much value on Chandler's ability to play the pick and roll. That said, I absolutely agree with you that it's a more valuable skill than man defense in the post.

FINtastic · 12-10-2011, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bayliss

Yeah but could Chandler still the ball and go coast to coast?

(If only I can find that gif... it is somewhere out there in cyberspace. Btw, which poster was obsessed with Bradley? God... I know he was good friends with madape.)

I believe it was the lad who possessed the Skull of Tarpley:

EvilMav

Bayliss · 12-10-2011, 03:36 PM

And Dalembert has that skillset. But he doesn't have the smarts to make the best decisions on the pick and roll. Will he make the right rotation after showing? Will he say ng enugh for the guard topickupis man, etc etc. Chandler had that ability.

And yes a lot of it was his skillset combined with Stevenson/Marion/Kidd.

Bayliss · 12-10-2011, 03:37 PM

Thank you, could not remember his name since he rarely posts anymore.

I imagine he has that beautiful gif on his comp somewhere.....

sefant77 · 12-10-2011, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

-chandler
-butler
-barea

+carter
+dalembert (?)
+wright
+Fernandez
+Beaubois
+Brewer
+rautins

? Stevenson
? janitor

Not a good net so far for 11/12 at least

Fixed since Roddy and Brewer didnt play much of a role last season/playoffs.

And if you do this with the rotation that beat the Heat:
- Chandler
- Barea
- Stevenson

+Haywood
+Dalembert (If works out)
+Roddy
+Rudy
+Brewer
+Carter

sefant77 · 12-10-2011, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by twistaeffect2004

So with Chauncey Billups officially being amnestied, do the Mavs go after him? He's given fair warning to teams with cap space that if they claim him he will not be a happy camper and even contemplate retiring giving some the feeling that he wants to play for a contender.

In his own words: "I'm tired of being the glue guy." Story soon on Y! (From Adrian Woj Twitter)

"People take my kindness and professionalism for weakness. They think I’ll be OK with (getting claimed). I won’t be OK with this." (Adrian Woj Twitter)

So, one, do the Mavs have interest in him to form a split PG rotation between Kidd and Billups? And if they were to consider him, would Billups be interested in such a role?

Billups wants the starting job in Miami....

MavsWiLLHaVeRinGs · 12-10-2011, 04:04 PM

+++++++++++++++DIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIRRRRRRRRRRRKKKKK (Dirk is always a plus)

EricaLubarsky · 12-10-2011, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MavsWiLLHaVeRinGs

+++++++++++++++DIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIRRRRRRRRRRRKKKKK (Dirk is always a plus)

Not sure if understand addition.

BGMaverick9 · 12-10-2011, 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Not sure if understand addition.

You could do + Championship swag Dirk

MavsWiLLHaVeRinGs · 12-10-2011, 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Not sure if understand addition.

I said Dirk is always a plus.

j0Shi · 12-10-2011, 04:10 PM

Forget Billups. He will join the Heat. Book it.

(although I don't know if they would sign him)

CadBane · 12-10-2011, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

I absolutely love chandler for how he helped the mavs last year but you guys are delusional about him. He is incredibly limited. He is an avg rebounder for a center, he doesnt block shots and hes not all that good in man defense. He is easily the best pick and roll defensive big in the nba but other than that and finishing oops he does nothing at an elite level.

Im not trying to bury chandler but this is getting ridiculous.

Mostly, this.

Holy Shit, Tyson has truly become the most overrated player in the NBA (kind of like Pau coming into last season).

The following 5 centers are better than Tyson, and it isn't even debatable:

D12
Bynum
Bogut
Marc Gasol
Noah

Then, the following players all have a case of being better:

Lopez
Nene
Okafor
Gortat

Like some have said, I'd prefer Tyson on this team...but Lopez is a 20 PPG center who commands double-teams. That's rare.

I loved Tyson, but lets not get carried away.

dude1394 · 12-10-2011, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dirno2000

I don't think you can place too much value on Chandler's ability to play the pick and roll. I'd take a center that's an average post defender but an elite pick and roll defender over the inverse. Not every team has a back to the basket threat down low and most of those guys are going to get theirs anyway. On the flip side every team in the league runs the high screen multiple times a game. Having a center that can switch and not embarrass himself against guards and forwards or that can show and get back to the paint before being exploited is invaluable. He's one of the more unique players in the league.

Obviously not invaluable, it's not even worth 2-3 million/year over haywood. Ugh.

grndmstr_c · 12-10-2011, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

Obviously not invaluable, it's not even worth 2-3 million/year over haywood. Ugh.

Uh, if the 4/58 reports are accurate Tyson's going to be making something closer to 6 million a year more than Haywood. But don't let reality get in the way of your bitch-fest or anything.

Bayliss · 12-10-2011, 04:56 PM

7.6, 8.4, 9.1, 9.8 and ending with a team option of 10.5. That is Heywood's contract.

Chandler's blows that out of the water.

dude1394 · 12-10-2011, 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bayliss

7.6, 8.4, 9.1, 9.8 and ending with a team option of 10.5. That is Heywood's contract.

Chandler's blows that out of the water.

We have haywood for 5 more years?

dirno2000 · 12-10-2011, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

We have haywood for 5 more years?

Yes but the 5th is a team option.

dude1394 · 12-10-2011, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dirno2000

Yes but the 5th is a team option.

Holy crap..that's one long term contract. My bad I thought wood was getting about 10/year and expected the mavs to offer Tyson an extra year to get it in the 13-14/ year range.

fluid.forty.one · 12-10-2011, 08:17 PM

Howard going to the nets is worst case scenario for us right?

41creepingdeath · 12-10-2011, 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fluid.forty.one

Howard going to the nets is worst case scenario for us right?

It would most likely mean no Deron for us, yeah. On the other hand, though... CP3 plus Kobe plus Howard is bad for the whole league, so I'd rather see DH12 join forces with Williams in NJ.

OneLove22 · 12-10-2011, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINtastic

Yeah, I'm not too concerned about Barea's loss because I think we can make it up between Roddy and Dojo.

She's also missing Brandan Wright, who I think people are going to be a lot happier with once this season actually starts.

i'm much more excited about having Roddy than JJ. Not really concerned at all about losing JJ although I love his fight.

rmacomic · 12-10-2011, 10:14 PM

So let me get this straight, Dwight Howard has already been traded to New Jersey, CP3 has already been traded to LA, and DWill has already reupped with New Jersey. Well, I guess its time to blow up the team and lynch the Mavs Brain Trust.

bobatundi · 12-10-2011, 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

-chandler
-butler
-barea

+carter
+dalembert (?)
+wright
+Fernandez
+rautins

? Stevenson
? janitor

Not a good net so far for 11/12 at least

Butler didn't play after January...including the entire playoff run. Not sure I'd consider his departure a subtraction. When he was playing, he was good, not great, and certainly not elite. I liked his attitude...but not for $8MM x 3 years.