Tyson Chandler - Page 5 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

SMC0007 · 10-05-2010, 10:42 PM

Chandler is gonna make a lot of posts look stupid (or PAR for some) in here.

Usually Lurkin · 10-08-2010, 12:42 AM

Was good to see the ally oop to Chandler tonight (preseason against Bulls). And Chandler's bringing great attitude. Someone in the GDT compared Haywood's sourpuss face to Damps, and that was right on. If Chandler continues to work his way into this team without getting injured, then Haywood's going to be even more sour at the loss of starting position.

I want one game out of this year where Carlisle keeps Kidd, Chandler, and Beaubois on the floor together long enough to call it an 'oop fest.

jthig32 · 10-08-2010, 08:26 AM

Haywood's a significantly better player than Chandler. If Chandler ever moves into the starting lineup then we have a huge problem because it means Haywood is playing very poorly.

People need to settle down on Chandler. He's been fine as a backup center, and will continue to be. But let's settle down on starter talk.

I think it's the anti-Damp effect. Chandler can jump and is emotional, so people look past his faults and see more than is there. And I find it hilarious that Haywood is now being denigrated based on his emotions just like Damp was.

People are funny.

dude1394 · 10-08-2010, 08:44 AM

The one thing which you are not giving credit to chandler for is his vocal defensive intensity. Haywood is WAY too quiet out there. Chandler does seem to be out of control and someone needs to teach him how to set a pick for goodness sakes.

What I don't like about him being out there is everyone wants to throw him an alley-oop and we just don't have that many guys who are good enough passers to do it, so they are tossing it up all over the place for him. It has seemed like at least a couple of extra turnovers a game just to get one basket, not very efficient.

that being said I do like the way he rolls hard to the basket.

jthig32 · 10-08-2010, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

The one thing which you are not giving credit to chandler for is his vocal defensive intensity. Haywood is WAY too quiet out there. Chandler does seem to be out of control and someone needs to teach him how to set a pick for goodness sakes.

What I don't like about him being out there is everyone wants to throw him an alley-oop and we just don't have that many guys who are good enough passers to do it, so they are tossing it up all over the place for him. It has seemed like at least a couple of extra turnovers a game just to get one basket, not very efficient.

that being said I do like the way he rolls hard to the basket.

His vocal defensive intensity does not make up for the fact that Haywood is a better defender.

I do like his intensity. I think it's something that can be useful on a team full of veterans and low key guys. I just think it's leading people to overrate him.

dude1394 · 10-08-2010, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SMC0007

As good as Kidd can be off the ball defensively and team D, he is more of a liability guarding his man than most people around here are willing to admit. He worries me quite a bit, nearly as much as Roddys inability to grasp the pg role.

I'd have to ask if you watched roddy try to play the point in the summer league? He had a long, long way to go before he has grasped the point guard role.

I'm still in trigued with him and the way he is a different player when he's "on" than when he's not. But when he's not, he really doesn't do much else that I've seen...

I hope he breaks out and all, but I've trained a pretty critical eye on roddy at the moment.

dude1394 · 10-08-2010, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

His vocal defensive intensity does not make up for the fact that Haywood is a better defender.

I do like his intensity. I think it's something that can be useful on a team full of veterans and low key guys. I just think it's leading people to overrate him.

Not unless it makes the rest of the team better defenders. I hear what you are saying and I've read it in other places as well. But attitude is important, sometimes over talent. We'll have a lot of stats to back up their defensive presence. I think haywood is a better rebounder for sure, not so sure about a pnr coverer(sp) or not. I'll have to watch them some more..

Tyson is a very active guy in there I grant you. Mahinmi looked better than both last night to be honest. But I realize it was in garbage time.

SMC0007 · 10-08-2010, 09:03 AM

Haywood is not a significantly better player than Chandler. They are different players and it's great to have both. The difference in speed, quickness, and agility is not even comparable.

RC isn't gonna go back on his word to Haywood about being a starter unless he is just playing really poorly, which I don't think anyone expects to happen. Chandler has to prove again that he can do what he has been doing so far on a consistent basis during the regular season.

It's not that Chandler can't set picks, he just has different intentions on what comes next. He wants to make the easy play and that is roll and throw it up for him. He just needs to mix it up more because it's predictable, he's gonna slip it and roll.

dude1394 · 10-08-2010, 09:10 AM

The picks I saw him try to set were late mainly. It wasn't the movement afterwards. But 3 turnovers (at least 2 on picks) ain't gonna cut it.

SMC0007 · 10-08-2010, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

I'd have to ask if you watched roddy try to play the point in the summer league? He had a long, long way to go before he has grasped the point guard role.

I'm still in trigued with him and the way he is a different player when he's "on" than when he's not. But when he's not, he really doesn't do much else that I've seen...

I hope he breaks out and all, but I've trained a pretty critical eye on roddy at the moment.

Maybe a misunderstanding somewhere but I meant, I don't believe in Roddy at pg...yet. I did watch him in SL games and although he will probably only share teh floor with one of those players in the reg season(dojo) he still didn't show me what I wanted to see especially from a leadership aspect. He never reallied the troops and put the team on his back while making smart decisions. But it was SL after all.

Either way I think he will be a solid enough SG.

dude1394 · 10-08-2010, 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SMC0007

Maybe a misunderstanding somewhere but I meant, I don't believe in Roddy at pg...yet. I did watch him in SL games and although he will probably only share teh floor with one of those players in the reg season(dojo) he still didn't show me what I wanted to see especially from a leadership aspect. He never reallied the troops and put the team on his back while making smart decisions. But it was SL after all.

Either way I think he will be a solid enough SG.

I hope you are correct. But again he seemed to live and die with his 3pt shot. If he was hitting that he was a different player. More aggressive, more assertive, everything. When he wasn't he seemed to shrink quite a bit.

Again hope I'm wrong about it.

Underdog · 10-08-2010, 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

His vocal defensive intensity does not make up for the fact that Haywood is a better defender.

I do like his intensity. I think it's something that can be useful on a team full of veterans and low key guys. I just think it's leading people to overrate him.

Overrated compared to Haywood? Maybe.

Overrated compared to Damp? Well, there's plenty of reason to be excited about Chandler compared to what we saw out of Dampier the past few seasons... Plus, it's nice that Haywood & Chandler have totally different styles, whereas Haywood & Damp were kind of the same...

One thing that seems pretty undeniable at this point is that Haywood/Chandler/Mahinmi is definitely the strongest group of guys this team has ever had at the 5. It's nice to call that position a strength instead of a weakness (for once!)

Now if we can just sort out the SG position...

Dirkenstien · 10-08-2010, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

Now if we can just sort out the SG position...

Hopefully Roddy can fill that void. He provides that perfect dynamic we need from the two spot. The only real question is whether he'll be able to defend the bigger/stronger 2's of the league.

Kante · 10-08-2010, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dirkenstien

Hopefully Roddy can fill that void. He provides that perfect dynamic we need from the two spot. The only real question is whether he'll be able to defend the bigger/stronger 2's of the league.

If he plays with Kidd that´s not a problem...

sefant77 · 10-08-2010, 12:28 PM

And i have the hope that Jones will be soon a solid backup/ballhandler so we can match him with Roddy and him taking the SG

SMC0007 · 10-08-2010, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kante

If he plays with Kidd that´s not a problem...

I would disagree "playing with Kids" is a felony.

Dirkenstien · 10-08-2010, 01:34 PM

Back on the Chandler topic, suppose Chandler continues to impress and improve throughout the season. Do we hang on to him and keep the depth and versatility at our center position or do we look to capitalize on the stock increase and exchange him for a more dominant wing should one become available?

jthig32 · 10-08-2010, 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

Overrated compared to Haywood? Maybe.

Overrated compared to Damp? Well, there's plenty of reason to be excited about Chandler compared to what we saw out of Dampier the past few seasons... Plus, it's nice that Haywood & Chandler have totally different styles, whereas Haywood & Damp were kind of the same...

One thing that seems pretty undeniable at this point is that Haywood/Chandler/Mahinmi is definitely the strongest group of guys this team has ever had at the 5. It's nice to call that position a strength instead of a weakness (for once!)

Now if we can just sort out the SG position...

Overrated compared to what he is. He's not better than Haywood and I don't think it's particularly close. He's not nearly the man-on defender Haywood is, imo.

Definitely nice that he's provides somewhat of a different set of skills, and I do like the rotation. I was mainly just observing that his demeanor seems to encourage people to overrate his ability, while the demeanors of Haywood and Damp lead (or led) people to underrate theirs at times.

Underdog · 10-08-2010, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jthig32

I was mainly just observing that his demeanor seems to encourage people to overrate his ability, while the demeanors of Haywood and Damp lead (or led) people to underrate theirs at times.

People love charisma.

Kidd Karma · 10-08-2010, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dirkenstien

Back on the Chandler topic, suppose Chandler continues to impress and improve throughout the season. Do we hang on to him and keep the depth and versatility at our center position or do we look to capitalize on the stock increase and exchange him for a more dominant wing should one become available?

Get the wing. We went all in with the Haywood contract. Give him his 32 a night. We'll patch things with Mahinimi and Ajinca for the other 16. Or we toss JJ out there to see if we get another big body in. Chandler is a nice luxury, but if that wing, Iggy presents itself, you pounce on it. I mean with a big season, Chandler would see the same money if not more than Haywood.

DevinHarriswillstart · 10-08-2010, 02:20 PM

Fans love an energy guy....and for whatever it's worth, Chandler has better career stats than Haywood. It doesn't really matter though because I'm pretty sure you'll see the minutes pretty evenly split, give or take a few.

Dirkenstien · 10-08-2010, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kidd Karma

Get the wing. We went all in with the Haywood contract. Give him his 32 a night. We'll patch things with Mahinimi and Ajinca for the other 16. Or we toss JJ out there to see if we get another big body in. Chandler is a nice luxury, but if that wing, Iggy presents itself, you pounce on it. I mean with a big season, Chandler would see the same money if not more than Haywood.

I tend to agree with this line of thinking as well. On one hand, the Haywood / Chandler combo gives us enough front court talent to hang with a healthy Lakers team but on the other hand Bynum is appearing more and more injury prone which could slightly reduce the need to have a deep 5 rotation.

Ideally I think what I'd like to see is a Chandler + Butler trade for an All-Star caliber wing player. I imagine that talent combo plus $22 mil in expiring contracts could be enticing to some teams around the deadline. I'm curious if it would it be enough get Denver's attention in a potential Carmelo trade.

dude1394 · 10-08-2010, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

People love charisma.

And charisma has it's place. You get a guy that fires up the rest of the team versus acting like he'd rather be somewhere else (no matter his talent) it is a factor.

SMC0007 · 10-08-2010, 03:40 PM

An under rated factor!

Kidd Karma · 10-08-2010, 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dirkenstien

I tend to agree with this line of thinking as well. On one hand, the Haywood / Chandler combo gives us enough front court talent to hang with a healthy Lakers team but on the other hand Bynum is appearing more and more injury prone which could slightly reduce the need to have a deep 5 rotation.

Ideally I think what I'd like to see is a Chandler + Butler trade for an All-Star caliber wing player. I imagine that talent combo plus $22 mil in expiring contracts could be enticing to some teams around the deadline. I'm curious if it would it be enough get Denver's attention in a potential Carmelo trade.

Carmelo would be the homerun, but I see them wanting Boobs and DOJO as the enticers, along with picks. It decimates our back court to the point where we see DeShawn-Jet sharing time to the 2 spot. Maybe if we snag the pain in the ass that is JR Smith as a salary/contract dump to keep one of Boobs/DoJo. Iggy would be a cheaper, ideal fit, but with Thorn running the show there, he maybe a piece he hangs onto.

sefant77 · 10-08-2010, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kidd Karma

Carmelo would be the homerun, but I see them wanting Boobs and DOJO as the enticers, along with picks. It decimates our back court to the point where we see DeShawn-Jet sharing time to the 2 spot. Maybe if we snag the pain in the ass that is JR Smith as a salary/contract dump to keep one of Boobs/DoJo. Iggy would be a cheaper, ideal fit, but with Thorn running the show there, he maybe a piece he hangs onto.

Thats the point. In any Anthony trade we cant send both Roddy and DoJo, because it would leave us with Kidd/Terry/Barea/Stevenson if the Nuggets dont send JR with...

dude1394 · 10-08-2010, 07:57 PM

you can't be short-sighted.. Basketball is a 5 man game at the end of the day, you give up any and everyone for carmelo except for the dirkster.

SMC0007 · 10-08-2010, 09:19 PM

Man, F carmelo! Right in the corn pipe! How bout that apples? HUH did you guys ever think about that? Besides this is the Tyson thread.

dude1394 · 10-08-2010, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SMC0007

Man, F carmelo! Right in the corn pipe! How bout that apples? HUH did you guys ever think about that? Besides this is the Tyson thread.

Sounds like love to me. ;0

sefant77 · 11-08-2010, 11:13 PM

bump

Really decent pickup. Looks like he is really back to at least 80-90% of his NO prime. If Roddy comes back and delivers scoring i take Chandler over Jefferson all day long.

Butler will be the tradechip at the deadline, not Chandlers contract.

Mav Addict · 11-09-2010, 09:43 AM

The guy was beastin on both ends of the court last night....yes Butler must moved at the deadline

Rick41 · 11-09-2010, 09:47 AM

Tyson is a f'ing stud so far.

xrobx · 11-09-2010, 11:44 AM

so now what do we do? we threw all that money at haywood when it looks like tyson is our guy.

41mvp · 11-09-2010, 11:47 AM

I love Tyson Chandler.He has huge energy.Dallas Mavericks need his energy.
He played well against Boston.12 points and huge 13 reb big double-double for him.
So far Tyson is good move for the Dallas Mavericks.

muzak · 11-09-2010, 11:50 AM

It was so easy to hate this guy before. Seeing him in a different light now, you realize how much of a hard worker and great guy he is for your team. Unless this is an early season fluke, which I highly doubt, I hope we extend his contract. Best center we've ever had? I think so.

rabbitproof · 11-09-2010, 11:52 AM

Voila. The Damp Index.

Haywood is a little better than Dampier.

Chandler is 2x the center of Dampier.

Mahinimi.. is... 3/4th.. of Dampier?

dude1394 · 11-09-2010, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xrobx

so now what do we do? we threw all that money at haywood when it looks like tyson is our guy.

Not much really. Tyson will get into foul trouble, may get hurt, whatever. If a deal comes along where you can move wood, you do it (maybe...depends on where they are standing wise and the guy). I haven't seen enough of mahinmi to know if he could be the backup..but...

xrobx · 11-09-2010, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

Not much really. Tyson will get into foul trouble, may get hurt, whatever. If a deal comes along where you can move wood, you do it (maybe...depends on where they are standing wise and the guy). I haven't seen enough of mahinmi to know if he could be the backup..but...

don't forget about ajinca, lol

sike · 11-09-2010, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SMC0007

Chandler is gonna make a lot of posts look stupid (or PAR for some) in here.

We can only hope

41mvp · 11-09-2010, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rabbitproof

Voila. The Damp Index.

Haywood is a little better than Dampier.

Chandler is 2x the center of Dampier.

Mahinimi.. is... 3/4th.. of Dampier?

1.He is much better than Dampier
2.I agree with you
3.I don't think so.I must see him in action.He actually sit on the bench.Coach must give him a chance.