05-30-2012, 10:44 AM
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#2401
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 17,873
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I want thiggy to check in and give us the current Thiggy Deron Williams Optimism Reading after this latest news.
__________________
John Madden on Former NFL Running Back Leroy Hoard: "You want one yard, he'll get you three. You want five yards, he'll get you three."
"Your'e a low-mentality drama gay queen!!" -- She_Growls
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05-30-2012, 11:01 AM
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#2402
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
Posts: 18,721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LonghornDub
The timeline just doesn't work. It's going to be almost impossible for them to swing a trade for Dwight before Deron wants to make his decision. I guess they could promise him under the table that they're going to get Dwight right around the time Deron re-signs, though.
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If they get the #1 pick, and all Orlando cares about is getting that pick plus other future picks (and maybe unloading Hedo/Davis), then they could potentially have the framework of a trade agreed to on draft day.
But if Orlando wants Lopez, or other pieces, it's going to be very difficult.
Holy crap is tonight important.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LonghornDub
I want thiggy to check in and give us the current Thiggy Deron Williams Optimism Reading after this latest news.
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I'm pretty darn confident. Even if the Nets get the #1 pick, I think there are scenarios where another team will give Orlando a better package for Howard.
If they don't get the #1 pick, I don't see how they get Howard.
Last edited by jthig32; 05-30-2012 at 11:04 AM.
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05-30-2012, 11:09 AM
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#2403
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 17,873
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthig32
If they get the #1 pick, and all Orlando cares about is getting that pick plus other future picks (and maybe unloading Hedo/Davis), then they could potentially have the framework of a trade agreed to on draft day.
But if Orlando wants Lopez, or other pieces, it's going to be very difficult.
Holy crap is tonight important.
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And when you say "framework," that means they'd have to wait until July to actually sign the dotted line, correct? Because pre-July the Nets have to match salaries, which they can't do?
That's an awful lot to ask. You have to convince Orlando to take only picks with no contributing player, and you have to ask them to agree to do that in July despite the certainty that other tempting offers will probably start pouring in around the same time.
__________________
John Madden on Former NFL Running Back Leroy Hoard: "You want one yard, he'll get you three. You want five yards, he'll get you three."
"Your'e a low-mentality drama gay queen!!" -- She_Growls
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05-30-2012, 11:10 AM
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#2404
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Moderator
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: 41.21.1
Posts: 36,143
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LonghornDub
And when you say "framework," that means they'd have to wait until July to actually sign the dotted line, correct? Because pre-July the Nets have to match salaries, which they can't do?
That's an awful lot to ask. You have to convince Orlando to take only picks with no contributing player, and you have to ask them to agree to do that in July despite the certainty that other tempting offers will probably start pouring in around the same time.
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First the Nets have to get picks, then they can start worrying about trading them...
__________________
These days being a fan is a competition to see who can be the most upset when
your team loses. That proves you love winning more. That's how it works.
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05-30-2012, 11:18 AM
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#2405
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 17,873
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Underdog
First the Nets have to get picks, then they can start worrying about trading them...
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And that's just another layer of difficulty on top of what I already said. I just don't see how it happens unless the Magic are absolutely infatuated with gutting their roster for totally unproven players and nothing else. And they have to be more interested in that than whatever alternatives (Bynum etc.).
__________________
John Madden on Former NFL Running Back Leroy Hoard: "You want one yard, he'll get you three. You want five yards, he'll get you three."
"Your'e a low-mentality drama gay queen!!" -- She_Growls
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05-30-2012, 11:50 AM
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#2406
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Golden Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,447
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The lottery is at 7 PM CST on ESPN, correct?
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05-30-2012, 12:00 PM
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#2407
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 7,002
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Anthony davis isn't totally unproven, he showed what he can do in high school and college and the upside he has is tremondous, obviously you would rather have a superstar, but remember guys like lowry/bynum aren't going to be cheap you would have anthony davis on a rookie contract and have him cheap for 4 years, that's valuable. Let's hope this is moot and Nets don't get a top 3 pick.
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05-30-2012, 12:13 PM
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#2408
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 17,873
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mavs777
Anthony davis isn't totally unproven, he showed what he can do in high school and college and the upside he has is tremondous, obviously you would rather have a superstar, but remember guys like lowry/bynum aren't going to be cheap you would have anthony davis on a rookie contract and have him cheap for 4 years, that's valuable. Let's hope this is moot and Nets don't get a top 3 pick.
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Look, you've made clear that you love Anthony Davis, and that's fine, but just like every other player ever who's never played in the NBA, he is totally unproven at the relevant level.
Plenty of fantastic college basketball players--all positions, all varieties--have been absolute busts in the NBA. Would I bet on that from Davis? Certainly not. But until he realizes his potential in the league (and I do think he has tons of potential), he is most certainly "unproven."
__________________
John Madden on Former NFL Running Back Leroy Hoard: "You want one yard, he'll get you three. You want five yards, he'll get you three."
"Your'e a low-mentality drama gay queen!!" -- She_Growls
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05-30-2012, 12:25 PM
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#2409
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Guru
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Brasil
Posts: 15,401
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What a huge night....it will pretty much decide the future of the Nets for several years and i think ours too.
Nets losing their pick: Goodbye deron
Nets getting #2 or #3: Maybe Deron*Dwight in Brooklyn
Nets getting #1: We failed
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05-30-2012, 01:20 PM
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#2410
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
Posts: 18,721
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I just played ESPN's lottery simulator 10 times and the Nets never made it into the top 3.
So....sweet.
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05-30-2012, 01:26 PM
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#2411
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Guru
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 23,255
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthig32
I just played ESPN's lottery simulator 10 times and the Nets never made it into the top 3.
So....sweet.
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Don't jinx it!
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"Cream of the crop gon' rise to the top." -Jaden Hardy
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05-30-2012, 01:26 PM
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#2412
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,863
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mavs777
Anthony davis isn't totally unproven, he showed what he can do in high school and college and the upside he has is tremondous, obviously you would rather have a superstar, but remember guys like lowry/bynum aren't going to be cheap you would have anthony davis on a rookie contract and have him cheap for 4 years, that's valuable. Let's hope this is moot and Nets don't get a top 3 pick.
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Davis will be a good NBA player, he has the defense down. His physical attributes are off the chart, you can't coach his length. If you can get him next to a burly PF or C in which they can cross match, allowing Davis to freelance a bit like Chandler did for us, that is the perfect scenario to maximize Davis. Offensively he's raw, but get him a penetrating point guard with the ability to draw doubles it'll be Chandler-Paul revisited. Hoping Brooklyn doesn't land this pick, good replacement for Howard.
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05-30-2012, 01:30 PM
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#2413
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
Posts: 18,721
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A lot of the commentors at NetsDaily are saying no way to a Davis + Brook Lopez for Dwight trade. They'd rather have Davis and Lopez than Deron and Dwight if it means losing Lopez.
I don't really know how to respond to that, other than I hope that the Nets see it that way as well.
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05-30-2012, 01:33 PM
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#2414
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 2,973
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthig32
I just played ESPN's lottery simulator 10 times and the Nets never made it into the top 3.
So....sweet.
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Just did the same...never higher than 6.
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05-30-2012, 01:37 PM
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#2415
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,224
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My lottery winners were Detroit, Golden State, and Phoenix.
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05-30-2012, 01:39 PM
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#2416
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
Posts: 18,721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saclare
Just did the same...never higher than 6.
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Just so everyone's aware, they can't be higher than 6 unless they hit a top 3 spot.
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05-30-2012, 02:26 PM
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#2417
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 17,873
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthig32
Just so everyone's aware, they can't be higher than 6 unless they hit a top 3 spot.
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Correct. Only the top 3 spots are "lotteried." After that, it's based on order of finish, so Brooklyn's only way above #6 is if they lottery into one of the top 3.
__________________
John Madden on Former NFL Running Back Leroy Hoard: "You want one yard, he'll get you three. You want five yards, he'll get you three."
"Your'e a low-mentality drama gay queen!!" -- She_Growls
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05-30-2012, 02:31 PM
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#2418
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,224
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LonghornDub
Correct. Only the top 3 spots are "lotteried." After that, it's based on order of finish, so Brooklyn's only way above #6 is if they lottery into one of the top 3.
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And... they wouldn't even get #6.
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05-30-2012, 02:39 PM
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#2419
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,863
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If you see Brooklyn's placard pulled 6th or higher, we're in decent shape. Stern usually does it in reverse order.
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05-30-2012, 02:48 PM
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#2420
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 17,873
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I also did 10 lottery rolls and the Nets failed every time. It's a lock.
__________________
John Madden on Former NFL Running Back Leroy Hoard: "You want one yard, he'll get you three. You want five yards, he'll get you three."
"Your'e a low-mentality drama gay queen!!" -- She_Growls
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05-30-2012, 03:24 PM
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#2421
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Member
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 288
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LonghornDub
Look, you've made clear that you love Anthony Davis, and that's fine, but just like every other player ever who's never played in the NBA, he is totally unproven at the relevant level.
Plenty of fantastic college basketball players--all positions, all varieties--have been absolute busts in the NBA. Would I bet on that from Davis? Certainly not. But until he realizes his potential in the league (and I do think he has tons of potential), he is most certainly "unproven."
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So Anthony Davis is "totally unproven" because he hasn't played in the NBA yet? (your words)
I'm under the impression that Davis would be one of the top 15 most valuable players in the NBA before he plays a game. A consensus #1 super athletic possible superstar on a rookie contract for 3 years. It would take a total collapse for his value to not exceed his contract's cost. "Most likely" (not provable) he will far exceed his contract as he continues to grow into an All Star.
If I'm building for the next 4 years, I would rather pay Davis on a rookie contract than Bynum 18mill/year or possibly Dwight for 20/year.
__________________
"Ager walks up to the stage in a triple-breasted, oversized beige suit, goes to shake hands with Stern and immediately gets whistled for a foul on Dwyane Wade." (Bill Simmons)
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05-30-2012, 03:42 PM
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#2422
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 7,002
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...
Quote:
Deron Williams@DeronWilliams
I would love to know who Adrian Wojnarowski source is bc he knows more about what I'm thinking then I do maybe they can help me decide?
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05-30-2012, 04:08 PM
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#2423
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 17,873
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott McGuire
So Anthony Davis is "totally unproven" because he hasn't played in the NBA yet? (your words)
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He is totally unproven in the NBA. He hasn't played in a game, a training camp, a practice, anything.
You are talking like he'd be the first guy ever to be a "consensus" number one but not pan out. And again, I'm not saying he won't pan out. I think he'll probably be a very, very good player. The simple fact is that he's unproven until he proves himself at this level, not college, not high school. And maybe proving himself is a mere formality, but he still has to do it.
And you're absolutely right that he would be a tremendous value on his rookie contract. No doubt about that.
__________________
John Madden on Former NFL Running Back Leroy Hoard: "You want one yard, he'll get you three. You want five yards, he'll get you three."
"Your'e a low-mentality drama gay queen!!" -- She_Growls
Last edited by LonghornDub; 05-30-2012 at 04:10 PM.
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05-30-2012, 04:09 PM
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#2424
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
Posts: 18,721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott McGuire
So Anthony Davis is "totally unproven" because he hasn't played in the NBA yet? (your words)
I'm under the impression that Davis would be one of the top 15 most valuable players in the NBA before he plays a game. A consensus #1 super athletic possible superstar on a rookie contract for 3 years. It would take a total collapse for his value to not exceed his contract's cost. "Most likely" (not provable) he will far exceed his contract as he continues to grow into an All Star.
If I'm building for the next 4 years, I would rather pay Davis on a rookie contract than Bynum 18mill/year or possibly Dwight for 20/year.
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None of what you said does anything to disprove Dub's point. He's absolutely unproven, and while he's a good bet to be wildly valuable relative to his contract, his floor is still way, way, WAY, WAY lower than the players you say you would prefer him over.
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05-30-2012, 05:10 PM
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#2425
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Golden Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,447
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mavs777
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Bottom line is we need the Nets to strike out in the lottery. Only then can we be in a position to score Deron.
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05-30-2012, 05:50 PM
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#2426
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Guru
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Brasil
Posts: 15,401
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Have to admit, im kind of nervous.
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05-30-2012, 07:16 PM
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#2428
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Guru
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Brasil
Posts: 15,401
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HAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
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05-30-2012, 07:16 PM
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#2429
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 17,873
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Nets got the 6th pick, which means they lose it. Portland will pick 11th and 6th. Lol @ Brooklyn.
__________________
John Madden on Former NFL Running Back Leroy Hoard: "You want one yard, he'll get you three. You want five yards, he'll get you three."
"Your'e a low-mentality drama gay queen!!" -- She_Growls
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05-30-2012, 07:16 PM
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#2430
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Inactive.
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Posts: 43,086
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nice!
how does that work out? Nets now only have a late second rounder.
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05-30-2012, 07:17 PM
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#2431
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Golden Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,447
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Yesssssss!
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05-30-2012, 07:18 PM
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#2432
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: North Laredo
Posts: 7,995
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LOL!
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"Dirk Nowitzki is now a household name in every locker room in this world.
You say it in Brazil, you say Dirk, they know Nowitzki. You say it in China,
they know Nowitzki. Kobe, Michael, DIRK." - Jeff Van Gundy
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05-30-2012, 07:20 PM
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#2433
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 17,873
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Really good to see Rich Cho up there. That guy got such a bad deal in Portland.
__________________
John Madden on Former NFL Running Back Leroy Hoard: "You want one yard, he'll get you three. You want five yards, he'll get you three."
"Your'e a low-mentality drama gay queen!!" -- She_Growls
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05-30-2012, 07:20 PM
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#2434
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Guru
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Brasil
Posts: 15,401
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fiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiixed lololololol
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05-30-2012, 07:20 PM
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#2435
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 17,873
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Hornets win. That's a good story. Too bad they're in our damn division.
__________________
John Madden on Former NFL Running Back Leroy Hoard: "You want one yard, he'll get you three. You want five yards, he'll get you three."
"Your'e a low-mentality drama gay queen!!" -- She_Growls
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05-30-2012, 07:21 PM
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#2436
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Inactive.
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Posts: 43,086
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Enjoy your 57th overall pick, New Jersey.
Gonna make the Deron talks all the more difficult.
Instead of a 6/35 they only have a 57th overall (late second)
Last edited by EricaLubarsky; 05-30-2012 at 07:24 PM.
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05-30-2012, 07:22 PM
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#2437
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Golden Member
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Dallas
Posts: 1,006
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With my 1000th post, I'd like to welcome Deron Williams to the Mavericks organization.
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05-30-2012, 07:22 PM
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#2438
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
Posts: 18,721
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Welp, step 1 is complete. We'll see what happens from here.
I don't see how the Nets get Howard now.
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05-30-2012, 07:26 PM
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#2439
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Inactive.
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Posts: 43,086
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthig32
Welp, step 1 is complete. We'll see what happens from here.
I don't see how the Nets get Howard now.
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not only does that mean they don't have a top pick this year, it also means that if they trade a future first rounder that team won't see any benefit until at least 2014 with all likelihood. Trading a card like Drummond, Davis or Kidd-Gilchrist is very appealing. Its quick and its certain. Trading a pick that won't likely be honored for two seasons in a draft that no one knows anything about is much much worse. Maybe it'll be another 1998 draft, but to a GM its less appealing to wait 2 years for a rebuild, particularly on how unknown it is.
Now Dallas has to turn 17th and 55th pick into something more appealing than New Jersey can with its 57th and Lopez.
Last edited by EricaLubarsky; 05-30-2012 at 07:30 PM.
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05-30-2012, 07:26 PM
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#2440
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Guru
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Cowboys Country
Posts: 23,336
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Hot damn, I was sweating that!!
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awesome to think of, colonystateofmind, death knells, delusional1234, deroff, git'erdonecubes, i have a dream, markus123no, michael reddish?, my ass bleeds for tyson, never happen dumbazz, oilfieldva-jay-jay, sard's sources outta @ss, shark tank for dwight, tank for dwight |
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