Lakers vs. Phoenix Thread - Page 7 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

nashtymavsfan13 · 04-30-2006, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orangedays

BUT

Steve Nash is a Phoenix Sun.
Michael Finley is a San Antonio Spur.

The Dallas Mavericks are Good Guys.

EVERYONE ELSE is a BAD GUY.

This is the PLAYOFFS. Not the regular season. Every game counts.

I want their teams to lose, and in the playoffs, them to do bad when it helps the Mavs.

But I just don't see how, after Nash and Finley helped turn this franchise into a winning ballclub you hate them.

The way I see it, is that they were good players on the Mavs, so I continue to like them.

orangedays · 04-30-2006, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dtownsfinest

I brought up Finley because i've watched all the Spurs games. Due to my schedule I can't watch any Suns games except the one today so in all honesty i'm not sure how he's performed this round. And remember you are the one who said if Finley has a good game the Spurs win. Not me. But Finley I can account for because i've watched all his games to see how well he does. We can agree on 1 thing. If Fin puts up 20 than i'm sure the Spurs do win lol. If Diop puts up 20 I bet the Mavs win too. Not sure where you were going with that since Fin hasn't scored 20 yet this round. Looking at Nash's boxscore today would 20 and 11 result into a good game for you? With only 2 turnovers?

Perhaps those of us who are less short-sighted are referring to a larger sample size? The regular season and not just the playoffs? And my statement was not as simple as, "if Finley has a good game the Spurs win". It was that a corollary exists between Nash (and to a lesser extent, Finley) having a good game and the Suns/Spurs having a good game. Check out my previous posts if you need a reference.

And no, Steve Nash did not have a good game today. 9/22 from the field is awful for him. And need we discuss when those 2 TO came? No, I didn't think so.

Quote:

Not about being a nice guy. I'm just a fan of the NBA. Because i'm from Dallas and i'm a Mavs fan i'm not allowed to root for other players for other teams?

I see that sarcasm is lost on you.

Nobody said you're not allowed to root. Just don't get in our faces about it when we don't root. This is a what? A Mavericks board. I don't understand how you're surprised when people root for the Mavericks. Golly.

Quote:

That's fine. Like I said above, i'm not knocking your opinion of these guys. I just can't believe these guys are hated worse than the Sheed's and Kobe's in this league. But everyone has their own opinion and as a fellow Mavs fan I can respect it.

They're not. I'm pretty sure that given a choice between Rasheed Wallace, Kobe Bryant, and Steve Nash - most of us would choose Nash to be our drinking buddy. And if you want to demonstrate that you respect it, don't criticize it. That's not showing respect.

Quote:

Like I said, I do feel whoever wins this series is the best team. In a series barring injury the best team usually wins. If the Suns lose than the Lakers are the better team. But i'm not ready to say the Suns will lose this series yet. Winning 3 in a row is not out of the question for the Suns.

No it's not. But it would be fair to say that the Lakers have been the better team in this series, thus far. I would say that 3-1 is pretty good evidence to that fact. Anything can happen from here on out - but if you're serious about wanting the Mavericks to play the best possible team - right now? Between the Lakers and the Suns, you would choose the Lakers. They are on top of the mountain until Phoenix proves otherwise.

orangedays · 04-30-2006, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nashtymavsfan13

I want their teams to lose, and in the playoffs, them to do bad when it helps the Mavs.

But I just don't see how, after Nash and Finley helped turn this franchise into a winning ballclub you hate them.

The way I see it, is that they were good players on the Mavs, so I continue to like them.

Nope, don't hate them. Just don't want them to win in the playoffs.

nashtymavsfan13 · 04-30-2006, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orangedays

Nope, don't hate them. Just don't want them to win in the playoffs.

ok fair enough, and I feel the same way. I still really like Nash a lot, he's probably my favorite player, behind Dirk.

Dtownsfinest · 04-30-2006, 10:35 PM

Quote:

Perhaps those of us who are less short-sighted are referring to a larger sample size? The regular season and not just the playoffs? And my statement was not as simple as, "if Finley has a good game the Spurs win". It was that a corollary exists between Nash (and to a lesser extent, Finley) having a good game and the Suns/Spurs having a good game. Check out my previous posts if you need a reference.

My fault. I thought we were talking about the bigger picture here. I didn't think we were factoring in regular season.

Quote:

And no, Steve Nash did not have a good game today. 9/22 from the field is awful for him. And need we discuss when those 2 TO came? No, I didn't think so.

So he had a bad game today? I wish we could get that type of bad production from our 1 spot.

Quote:

Nobody said you're not allowed to root. Just don't get in our faces about it when we don't root. This is a what? A Mavericks board. I don't understand how you're surprised when people root for the Mavericks. Golly.

Wait, wait a minute. Let's get something straight. Either you missed something I said or you're just putting words in my mouth but I never criticized Mavs fans for rooting for fellow Mavs lol. What I said was i'm shocked that Mavs fans have so much hate towards EX-MAVS players. Of course we're suppose to root for the Mavs(except Stackhouse

). And I wouldn't say I got in anyone's face. I just made a comment about it.

Quote:

And if you want to demonstrate that you respect it, don't criticize it. That's not showing respect.

So criticizing or questioning someone's opinion is disrespecting someone's opinion? Well its settled. Close down D-M.com because this is what forums are all about. I respect every fellow Mav fans opinion. That doesn't mean I have to agree with it however.

Quote:

No it's not. But it would be fair to say that the Lakers have been the better team in this series, thus far. I would say that 3-1 is pretty good evidence to that fact. Anything can happen from here on out - but if you're serious about wanting the Mavericks to play the best possible team - right now? Between the Lakers and the Suns, you would choose the Lakers. They are on top of the mountain until Phoenix proves otherwise.

I'm not disagreeing. What i'm saying whoever wins this series is the best team. If the Lakers lose this series 3-4 than the Suns are the better team. Simple as that. If Lakers win the series they are the better team. No need to argue for the sake of arguing.

MFFL · 04-30-2006, 10:39 PM

Just watched the play again in super slow motion (1/15th speed). Nash crosses midcourt by 6 feet or so and stops just in front of a waiting Odom. Nash has killed his dribble so Walton runs up behind and traps Nash. Nash turns away from Odom and twists his arms past Walton looking for the back outlet but Diaw has screwed up and wasn't there. So Nash pulls his arms in and twists his body in an attempt to split the double team in the other direction. But when Nash was trying this, the ball was right in front of Walton. Walton grabbed the ball and forced the jump. Clean play.

Neither Laker player did anything other than reach for the ball. Two refs were intently watching the action.

orangedays · 04-30-2006, 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dtownsfinest

So he had a bad game today? I wish we could get that type of bad production from our 1 spot.

He, arguably, lost the game for the Suns today. And yeah, I wouldn't mind having an MVP as our PG either. But the last guy we had is a Sun now.

Quote:

Wait, wait a minute. Let's get something straight. Either you missed something I said or you're just putting words in my mouth but I never criticized Mavs fans for rooting for fellow Mavs lol. What I said was i'm shocked that Mavs fans have so much hate towards EX-MAVS players. Of course we're suppose to root for the Mavs(except Stackhouse

). And I wouldn't say I got in anyone's face. I just made a comment about it.

No no, allow me to include an addendum:

"Nobody said you're not allowed to root. Just don't get in our faces about it when we don't root for non-Mavs players. This is a what? A Mavericks board. I don't understand how you're surprised when people root for the Mavericks and against non-Mavs players. Golly."

Quote:

So criticizing or questioning someone's opinion is disrespecting someone's opinion? Well its settled. Close down D-M.com because this is what forums are all about. I respect every fellow Mav fans opinion. That doesn't mean I have to agree with it however.

No, there's nothing wrong with healthy, open debate. Your original statement was about how it was silly that the people on this board criticize Nash and Finley. I said that there's nothing wrong with that. Then you said, why can't you just respect my opinion? Isn't that an attempt on your part to stifle my ability to question your opinion?

Quote:

I'm not disagreeing. What i'm saying whoever wins this series is the best team. If the Lakers lose this series 3-4 than the Suns are the better team. Simple as that. If Lakers win the series they are the better team. No need to argue for the sake of arguing.

I understand what you're saying and I think that everyone will agree with that point. I'm not being argumentative - all I am saying is that, as things stand this minute - the Lakers have proven that they are the superior in the series by being up 3 games to 1. So if we are to use your criteria (of wanting the Mavs to beat the superior team) then we would want the Mavs to play the Lakers.

dude1394 · 04-30-2006, 11:03 PM

I don't hate ex-mavs... I just want the ones who are playing on our rivals to fail.

I still like Antoine Walker for goodness sakes. Pretty glad he's no longer a mav, but I still like him.

But with Little Stevie/Fin being on our chief rivals I cannot do anything other than heap scorn and wish them to get trounced in the playoffs.

Little Stevie unfortunately is also getting my MVP-ire as well this year.

Murphy3 · 04-30-2006, 11:14 PM

I never liked Antoine Walker... I never liked Nick Van Exel...I never liked Jerry Stackhouse...

I suppose you can see that I don't like:

1. inefficient offensive players that don't offer anything defensively.
2. Players with attitude that more often than not do not back it up
3. players that shoot the three that don't shoot it very well.

But, NVE had one hell of a playoff run...I will give him that.

rabbitproof · 04-30-2006, 11:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

I don't hate ex-mavs... I just want the ones who are playing on our rivals to fail.

I still like Antoine Walker for goodness sakes. Pretty glad he's no longer a mav, but I still like him.

But with Little Stevie/Fin being on our chief rivals I cannot do anything other than heap scorn and wish them to get trounced in the playoffs.

Little Stevie unfortunately is also getting my MVP-ire as well this year.

Sums it up!! Except the Toine part.

We root against the opposing teams and unfortunately, their teams hold ex-Mavs. I don't treat Steve Nash any differently then any other Sun. I don't treat Michael Finley any differently then any other Spur. They do nothing for the Mavericks franchise TODAY, like any other Sun or Spur, so I will not cheer them on TODAY. In the past, they did, and I was a fan then. In the meanwhile, all their work and energies go against us or, at the very least, are not for us. Thus, they do not get my support.

It is quite simple.

MFFL · 04-30-2006, 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MFFL

OH HAPPY DAYS! The Spurs and the Suns both lose playoff games in the same night.

How great is this? The Spurs and the Suns both lose AGAIN on the same night. I'm a happy camper right now.

Thespiralgoeson · 05-01-2006, 01:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

Settle down, folks. The Suns will still win this series. Settle down.

I'm not betting on it, Chum. Jackson has absolutely owned D'antoni, and Odom has owned Marion. I seriously doubt the Suns have it in them to go 3-0 and win the series.

MFFL · 05-01-2006, 01:22 AM

Jackson has never lost a 1st round series. Jackson also has never lost a series where his team has led 2-1.

chumdawg · 05-01-2006, 01:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thespiralgoeson

I'm not betting on it, Chum. Jackson has absolutely owned D'antoni, and Odom has owned Marion. I seriously doubt the Suns have it in them to go 3-0 and win the series.

On second thought, I imagine you are right.

sike · 05-01-2006, 02:02 AM

poor Nash...poor chum.

me?....oh I'm smiling.

dude1394 · 05-01-2006, 07:40 AM

Time on bench leaves Nash with stiff back

Paul Coro
The Arizona Republic
May. 1, 2006 12:00 AM

LOS ANGELES - Steve Nash could not believe it.

It wasn't that Smush Parker, saying he knows Nash's tendencies from their three weeks as teammates, poked the ball loose to set up Kobe Bryant's high floater that sent Sunday's Game 4 into overtime. And it wasn't that the officials did not give him a foul call or Boris Diaw his pleas for a timeout when Nash was trapped and then tied up by Luke Walton, who later tipped the jump-ball toss to Bryant to set up his game-winner.

It was that he made the three-point shot that put Phoenix ahead 98-95 with 49.8 seconds to go in overtime. Nash's frequently troublesome back tightened up after he sat out the final 2:34 of the third quarter and the first 2:15 of the fourth quarter with long television commercial time in between.
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"I wasn't the same after I got out at the end of the third," Nash said. "Maybe I sat out a little too long and it locked up on me.

"I couldn't move like I wanted to. Once it tightens up, it doesn't really loosen."

TripleDipping · 05-01-2006, 08:22 AM

I'm loving this.

sixeightmkw · 05-01-2006, 08:57 AM

you know, for all my hate for Kobe, and all my hate for the Lakers, and all my hate for everything they satnd for, All I could say after watching the end of that game was
WOW. WOW, WOW.

Drbio · 05-01-2006, 08:59 AM

You mean Nash is breaking down? ? ? ? ? ? ?

Who could have seen that coming?

dude1394 · 05-01-2006, 09:05 AM

You know this series is ANOTHER reason why I would never have voted for the rapist as MVP. Here he finally, finally, finally let's the rest of his team play and now they are beating the second seed.

If he hadn't been such an allan iverson ballhog this year they might have had hca and he MIGHT have been deserving.

Arne · 05-01-2006, 09:37 AM

I LOVE every bit of these playoffs.

San Antonio is about to get kicked out of the first round, Phoenix is about to get kicked out of the first round, even the Pistons lost a game in their first round series.

Miami has problems with Nocionni and Kirk Hinrich playing out of their minds.

I love it.

grndmstr_c · 05-01-2006, 09:51 AM

Just because it's so right:

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

You know this series is ANOTHER reason why I would never have voted for the rapist as MVP. Here he finally, finally, finally let's the rest of his team play and now they are beating the second seed.

If he hadn't been such an allan iverson ballhog this year they might have had hca and he MIGHT have been deserving.

Five-ofan · 05-01-2006, 09:51 AM

Phoenix IS about to be kicked out but you might want to tap the breaks on SA. I expect the mavs to beat them but i will be utterly shocked if the kings win this series.

Arne · 05-01-2006, 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

Phoenix IS about to be kicked out but you might want to tap the breaks on SA. I expect the mavs to beat them but i will be utterly shocked if the kings win this series.

If it wasn't for the league suspending Artest for game two, Sac-Town would already be ahead 3:1.

Five-ofan · 05-01-2006, 10:25 AM

I doubt that. Anyway this is the wrong thread for that. Back to this series. First I will say right now that I dont buy into the idea of a person having to play well in the playoffs to validate an mvp. Its a regular season award. That said this series presents the enigma of giving or not giving nash credit. The first thing most people would say is hey nash has been solid his team just hasnt been good. Thats fine if you want to say that BUT if you want to say that then you cant say that nash makes everyone better all year and that is why he should be the mvp. If he is the reason that marion and diaw etc all have great years than it also has to be his fault that they arent playing well now. Im not sure if this is coming across as i mean it to but basically im just saying that anything you can give him credit for when things are going well(making everyone else good) you have to be willing to blame him for when things are going poorly.

aexchange · 05-01-2006, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arne

If it wasn't for the league suspending Artest for game two, Sac-Town would already be ahead 3:1.

if it wasnt for a brent barry three hitting everything and then falling in, the queens would be up 3:1.

jthig32 · 05-01-2006, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

I doubt that. Anyway this is the wrong thread for that. Back to this series. First I will say right now that I dont buy into the idea of a person having to play well in the playoffs to validate an mvp. Its a regular season award. That said this series presents the enigma of giving or not giving nash credit. The first thing most people would say is hey nash has been solid his team just hasnt been good. Thats fine if you want to say that BUT if you want to say that then you cant say that nash makes everyone better all year and that is why he should be the mvp. If he is the reason that marion and diaw etc all have great years than it also has to be his fault that they arent playing well now. Im not sure if this is coming across as i mean it to but basically im just saying that anything you can give him credit for when things are going well(making everyone else good) you have to be willing to blame him for when things are going poorly.

Wonderful point. People claim the supporting cast isn't showing up, but wait, I though Nash was the single reason the supporting cast was so good??? So then it must be Nash's fault.

EricaLubarsky · 05-01-2006, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aexchange

if it wasnt for a brent barry three hitting everything and then falling in, the queens would be up 3:1.

Lucky bounces are still bounces, but I agree with AEX. It was Barry and not Artest on that one.

Anyway, 2-2, which gives us at least 4-5 days off to rest even if San Antone does it in 6. That's all I care about. I honestly dont care if we play the Suns, Lakers or Clippers in the WCF. The only challenge now is the Spurs and we're hopefully going to get the rest we need to prepare.

Arne · 05-01-2006, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Lucky bounces are still bounces, but I agree with AEX. It was Barry and not Artest on that one.

Anyway, 2-2, which gives us at least 4-5 days off to rest even if San Antone does it in 6. That's all I care about. I honestly dont care if we play the Suns, Lakers or Clippers in the WCF. The only challenge now is the Spurs and we're hopefully going to get the rest we need to prepare.

With Artest it wouldn't even have been close.

EricaLubarsky · 05-01-2006, 12:07 PM

Ill agree with you. Game 1 wasnt even close.

Five-ofan · 05-01-2006, 12:07 PM

Thats a fallacy. The game would have been completely different with artest and you nor I have any idea how it would have changed.

Arne · 05-01-2006, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Ill agree with you. Game 1 wasnt even close.

Your "decent" defender would have stopped Ginobilli from getting 32 points, that's for sure.

EricaLubarsky · 05-01-2006, 12:18 PM

I have an idea, let's wager 1 million fake dollars on it!

nashtymavsfan13 · 05-01-2006, 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sixeightmkw

you know, for all my hate for Kobe, and all my hate for the Lakers, and all my hate for everything they satnd for, All I could say after watching the end of that game was
WOW. WOW, WOW.

Well said. I completley agree.

Murphy3 · 05-01-2006, 10:25 PM

Yep...Kobe was very Dirk-like towards the end of the game yesterday.

WayOutWest · 05-01-2006, 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sixeightmkw

you know, for all my hate for Kobe, and all my hate for the Lakers, and all my hate for everything they satnd for, All I could say after watching the end of that game was
WOW. WOW, WOW.

No wonder my ears were burning.

Great series, I not going to say I called it but I did go as far as saying that if any 1-3 seed was going to fall it would be in the West and it would be the Suns.

The biggest reason for the Suns being down 3-1 is the coaching staff. They are not making any adjustments on defense to counter the Lakers new Kobe-lite offense. They Lakers are sending it inside to Odom and Kwame. When you can't figure out a way to stop Kwame-baby-hands-butter-fingers Brown, you've got problems. On offense the Suns are not making any adjustments either, it's give Nash the ball and play pick and roll offense. I finally saw a glimmer of conciousness when the Suns were exploiting the Nash switch and posting up Smush but they went away from it.

I really doubt the Suns can pull it out at this point, the Laker have 3 free rolls of letting Kobe go off for 50 points IF the Suns finally wake up and adjust to the Lakers balanced offense.

Murphy3 · 05-01-2006, 11:40 PM

I just couldn't imagine the Suns defense ever being this bad. I knew that it was bad, but they've been nothing short of pathetic...

Thespiralgoeson · 05-01-2006, 11:46 PM

I wonder, all of these things we're seeing, what does it all mean? Have Kobe and Odom finally found the chemistry to be a good 1-2 punch? Just how good is Smush Parker?

What's most intriguing to be about this series is Kwame. Has he finally found whatever it was he was missing to be a quality starter?

I've always hated the Lakers, but for some reason, I hate them a little less these days.

dude1394 · 05-01-2006, 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thespiralgoeson

I wonder, all of these things we're seeing, what does it all mean? Have Kobe and Odom finally found the chemistry to be a good 1-2 punch? Just how good is Smush Parker?

What's most intriguing to be about this series is Kwame. Has he finally found whatever it was he was missing to be a quality starter?

I've always hated the Lakers, but for some reason, I hate them a little less these days.

I still hate their guts, but want them to beat phoenix. I'm not sure about the new lakers style. The suns really are pathetic defensively and even less physical.

EricaLubarsky · 05-02-2006, 12:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

I still hate their guts, but want them to beat phoenix. I'm not sure about the new lakers style. The suns really are pathetic defensively and even less physical.

Just goes to show you-- Mavs are one of the best assist-defenders and the Suns are one of the worst at defending the pass. There is one more game to be played but honestly if the Lakers got back for defense, they got the stops they needed and if they made 1-2 passes, they got a layup EVERY SINGLE TIME.

Phoenix lures you into a running game where teams force shots and don't get back, but its fools gold. Charles Barkley could tell you that-- he said it a few years ago about the Mavs.