2017 NBA Draft - Page 8 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

saclare · 02-15-2017, 10:40 AM

Has there been any player from the 2016 draft making waves? Supremely underwhelming draft class. Simmons unknown, and should be good, but bleh from everyone else so far.

We can only hope this draft class lives up to its billing...

mac222b · 02-16-2017, 04:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saclare

Has there been any player from the 2016 draft making waves? Supremely underwhelming draft class. Simmons unknown, and should be good, but bleh from everyone else so far.

We can only hope this draft class lives up to its billing...

Chriss and Jaylen Brown have been starting at times. Sabonis is starting for OKC and is going to be a really good player for the next decade plus. Bender should be a good player down the road. Pascal Siakam has been starting for Toronto. Ingram is super young but could be an all-star level player in a few.

There may not be many stars but definitely good quality players throughout. And I'm sure I'm forgetting a few.

DevinHarriswillstart · 02-16-2017, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saclare

Has there been any player from the 2016 draft making waves? Supremely underwhelming draft class. Simmons unknown, and should be good, but bleh from everyone else so far.

We can only hope this draft class lives up to its billing...

I think Ferrell is easily a top 5 pick if it was done today. I can't believe how absolutely terrible that draft was talent-wise.

sefant77 · 02-16-2017, 06:49 PM

too early to tell

EricaLubarsky · 02-16-2017, 08:20 PM

Whoa there

DevinHarriswillstart · 02-16-2017, 09:14 PM

Top five in the 2016 draft. Tell me who stands out to you?

The two top 10 pgs Kris Dunn and perhaps Hield who is more of a SG. They really haven't done anything to impress. Those guys went 5 and 6, and I'd easily take Ferrell over them at this point.

Thebo · 02-17-2017, 08:57 AM

My god, since Fultz is off the table for Mavs...

Was checking Dirk's old plays and wanted instantly see where Markkanen is at the moment...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7s2iFo1F2M

No guarantees but still... Perhaps he is able to fall to 7th pick or something.

MavzMan · 02-17-2017, 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thebo

My god, since Fultz is off the table for Mavs...

Was checking Dirk's old plays and wanted instantly see where Markkanen is at the moment...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7s2iFo1F2M

No guarantees but still... Perhaps he is able to fall to 7th pick or something.

He is current #12 on NBADraft.net, but we very well could end up there if Team Tank continues to become Team Playoff.

Regardless though, it just sucks whoever we draft is going to be development player and not an immediate impact player like Fultz.

Thebo · 02-17-2017, 10:34 AM

It is interesting because I do not see Markkanen going outside top 10. At the same time I am really surprised they have Hartenstein projected as high as 17.

I prefer DraftRoom, which have those two at similar projections but actual Draftee + Team seem more realistic than NBADraft.net having Ntilikina (PG) going to Portland.
http://www.nbadraftroom.com/p/2017-nba-mock-draft.html

Have to say, Ntilikina does seem interesting. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pvv2cfGqioE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Vl7d9AQG4Q

He seems to have attacking mentality. Not sure of him as top10 pick and there is a valid reason why he is worst of top PG prospects. http://basketball.realgm.com/analysi...-Of-Strasbourg

Bryan_Wilson · 02-17-2017, 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Top five in the 2016 draft. Tell me who stands out to you?

The two top 10 pgs Kris Dunn and perhaps Hield who is more of a SG. They really haven't done anything to impress. Those guys went 5 and 6, and I'd easily take Ferrell over them at this point.

The class looks weak overall I agree. But Yogi's age is reason alone he'd be outside the top 10 and more than likely the top 15. I think his size plus his age would be enough to keep him out of the lotto even if you factor in how he's looked since joining the Mavs.

EricaLubarsky · 02-17-2017, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bryan_Wilson

The class looks weak overall I agree. But Yogi's age is reason alone he'd be outside the top 10 and more than likely the top 15. I think his size plus his age would be enough to keep him out of the lotto even if you factor in how he's looked since joining the Mavs.

This.

I love Yogi, but he's not the type of guy who gets drafted high. 23-year-old senior who barely breaks 6'0" and stalled out in his development his senior year?

It's not logical, but there is a reason JJB was undrafted despite his talent level and MCW was a lottery pick. It's all about size, youth, and advanced analytics (which don't measure BBIQ and internal fire so they're often wrong).

DevinHarriswillstart · 02-17-2017, 01:18 PM

Hey, good ole Shan Larkin was drafted #18 at 5'11 171 lbs.

Kemba Walker drafted number 9 is 6'1, 184.

Chris Paul is listed at 6 ft (probably shorter) 175 lbs drafted number 4.

It's kinda interesting actually looking at their (Paul, Ferrell) college stats.

Paul's sophomore year stats...15.3 ppg, 6.6 apg, 4.4 rpg, .45% fg, .474 3pt.

Yogi's senior stats...17.3 ppg, 5.6 apg, 3.8 rpg, 48% fg, 42% 3pt.

I fully understand why teams pass on shorter guys, but I still don't see any way he drops out of at least the top 10 knowing what we know now age and height be damned. The 2016 draft was that bad.

But hey, glad he wasn't drafted and luck had him falling into our laps.

rimrocker · 02-17-2017, 02:31 PM

I don't think people realize how disruptive small quick PGs can be on both sides of the ball.

It's damn near impossible to get to your spot or go where you want to go with them and if you put the ball on the floor the advantage instantly goes to them.
They can literally frustrate players and take them completely away from their game.

On the offensive end they can wear their opponents down and breakdown defenses if they have an outside shot and the ability to penetrate both of which are strong skills that both JJ and Yogi have.

But I do agree GMs won't take a chance on them high in the draft so they are the type of players who end up being great 2nd round choices or UFAs.

A player I'd love to pick in the 2nd round is undersized but could fit our system and really bring it is Devonte Graham. He's only 6'2" but has similar skills as Curry and can light it up from anywhere and has tons of confidence. If he comes out and is undrafted or we get a late 2nd rounder I'd take him in a heartbeat. Reminds me a lot of JET. One of those guys who would instantly become a crowd favorite.

EricaLubarsky · 02-17-2017, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rimrocker

I don't think people realize how disruptive small quick PGs can be on both sides of the ball.

It's damn near impossible to get to your spot or go where you want to go with them and if you put the ball on the floor the advantage instantly goes to them.
They can literally frustrate players and take them completely away from their game.

On the offensive end they can wear their opponents down and breakdown defenses if they have an outside shot and the ability to penetrate both of which are strong skills that both JJ and Yogi have.

But I do agree GMs won't take a chance on them high in the draft so they are the type of players who end up being great 2nd round choices or UFAs.

A player I'd love to pick in the 2nd round is undersized but could fit our system and really bring it is Devonte Graham. He's only 6'2" but has similar skills as Curry and can light it up from anywhere and has tons of confidence. If he comes out and is undrafted or we get a late 2nd rounder I'd take him in a heartbeat. Reminds me a lot of JET. One of those guys who would instantly become a crowd favorite.

I'm hoping that the league swings back in that direction. For a while it was all about height, but guys like Isaiah Thomas, Lowry, Mills, and Yogi may be starting to bring short back. We've seen the complete death of post play among both guards and forwards, which is a plus so it's all about driving/passing and shooting threes now. At least on offense, that gives an advantage to shorter guys. On defense the refs have basically made it impossible to draw charges and to contest threes smaller guards basically have to foul the shooter to get even close to contesting. That makes it tough for short guys, but Barea learned to stay on the floor by becoming elite at deflections, steals, and charges.

Then again, the league wants to be offense-first.

Underdog · 02-17-2017, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rimrocker

I don't think people realize how disruptive small quick PGs can be on both sides of the ball.

Some people know, they just don't like it...

rimrocker · 02-17-2017, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

Some people know, they just don't like it...

I think the general consensus of GMs is.....when in doubt go big.
Not sure that is the safest way to go anymore with the league changing the way it has.
Until GMs pick up on it we should take advantage of the opportunities of highly skilled players slipping to the 2nd round or going undrafted.

DevinHarriswillstart · 02-17-2017, 04:30 PM

I do wonder if Ferrell changes things with regards to the draft. Good news is that the PGs available at our pick will likely be either Fox or Frank...both who can play with Yogi if need be because of their size.

Interesting and rather surprising to see Robert Williams make his way up the ladder. He is definitely a raw and potential pick, but has excellent shot blocking skills. Short for center, but his wingspan seems to make up for it. Keeping on eye on him.

rimrocker · 02-18-2017, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

I do wonder if Ferrell changes things with regards to the draft. Good news is that the PGs available at our pick will likely be either Fox or Frank...both who can play with Yogi if need be because of their size.

I can't say I've seen one minute of Fox but just reading about him sounds a hell of a lot like Devin Harris when he was drafted...height, frame, speed, plays out of control at times (I remember that being a knock on Harris), great in transition, good touch on lob passes, gets where he wants off the dribble, inconsistent shooter, top notch on the ball defender, etc...
So if that is so and we draft him we'd basically have Harris (Fox), JJ (Yogi) and JET (Curry) clones

http://www.nbadraft.net/players/deaaron-fox

mac222b · 02-19-2017, 10:52 PM

Really like what I've seen of Frank Nkitilina. Smooth

MavzMan · 02-20-2017, 12:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Then again, the league wants to be offense-first.

This is true during regular season. A team can win a ton of regular season games with very good offense. But every single year, the refs choke on their whistles the farther it goes in the playoffs and teams that have top defense to go with that offense will win.

minkbarn · 02-21-2017, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mac222b

Chriss and Jaylen Brown have been starting at times. Sabonis is starting for OKC and is going to be a really good player for the next decade plus. Bender should be a good player down the road. Pascal Siakam has been starting for Toronto. Ingram is super young but could be an all-star level player in a few.

There may not be many stars but definitely good quality players throughout. And I'm sure I'm forgetting a few.

I agree with this. It's a draft class without anyone breaking out quickly but with a bunch of to-be-determined players who are either still developing their skills or still developing their physical frames. Plus Simmons hasn't played.

There will be some stars from this group but no one knows who they are yet.

Another interesting name from this class is center Ante Zizic (pick #23) who is way ahead of schedule and looking very good in the Euroleague playing for David Blatt with Darussafaka Dogus. He'll be coming over next year. According to an NBA GM interviewed in a recent Sporting News article, he'd be a lottery pick in this year's stronger draft, maybe top 10.

Underdog · 02-23-2017, 01:17 PM

@tim_cato: I'd start reading Frank Ntilikina scouting reports if you're a Mavs fan

mac222b · 02-23-2017, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

@tim_cato: I'd start reading Frank Ntilikina scouting reports if you're a Mavs fan

This is my guy. Hope he's there for us when we pick. Wouldn't be surprised if he creeps up into top 6

sefant77 · 02-23-2017, 01:57 PM

There are several teams picking ahead of us that are set at the PG position. Wouldnt be surprised if a really nice PG prospect is dropping to us.

sefant77 · 02-23-2017, 04:44 PM

http://www.tankathon.com/

5th click and we jumped to #2...that would be awesome. 6th click and we got #3

DevinHarriswillstart · 02-23-2017, 09:47 PM

Second click got number 1. Awww yeah.

3rd click number 2. 4th click number 1 again.

Fultz in the bag baby.

Thebo · 02-23-2017, 11:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Second click got number 1. Awww yeah.

3rd click number 2. 4th click number 1 again.

Fultz in the bag baby.

1st click and Dallas 1st pick.

4th click was 2nd pick. Other 3 clicks ended outside top 5.

sefant77 · 02-23-2017, 11:46 PM

Well, it would be great if we would keep the 7th worst record. The percentage getting into the top-3 jumps to 15% there...

But honestly i cant see this. At least five garbage teams in the east and two in the west.

rimrocker · 02-23-2017, 11:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mac222b

This is my guy. Hope he's there for us when we pick. Wouldn't be surprised if he creeps up into top 6

Ntilikina would probably be a nice fit in our backcourt consider we currently have 3 of them 6'1 and under (4 if Jackson is signed). He could play with another PG or at least a nice change of pace.
My only concern with him is that it could take several years to develop him into an NBA starter quality PG where a guy like Yogi looks to be NBA ready right now. Some of those other guys in the draft at other positions look ready to go right now.

MavzMan · 02-24-2017, 12:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sefant77

Well, it would be great if we would keep the 7th worst record. The percentage getting into the top-3 jumps to 15% there...

Wow, I totally didn't notice that percentage. That is huge since Boston with the first pick really does not have a need for Fultz and could use a guy like Josh Jackson more. Makes it possible to trade up from #2 or #3 to get that #1 PG pick. Only think happy thoughts up until May 16th!

Thebo · 02-26-2017, 06:05 AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jfSGg1FqseY

Really like Markkanen. I am quite sure that if Boston does not end up drafting at 1st, he is going there. Hard to imagine anyone not drafting Fultz first. Markkanen would be nice to have after Dirk retires. He would also be perfect to have in starting lineup and Dirk coming off the bench for the last years of his career. But still, I do not see him fitting well with Barnes and Noel, since Rick prefers to keep Barnes at PF.

EricaLubarsky · 02-26-2017, 11:10 AM

Would he be a guard for us? Matthews/Barnes/Noel seem to be our future front court. Don't know where he's get his minutes unless he's going to play 6th man

rimrocker · 02-26-2017, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thebo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jfSGg1FqseY

Really like Markkanen. I am quite sure that if Boston does not end up drafting at 1st, he is going there. Hard to imagine anyone not drafting Fultz first. Markkanen would be nice to have after Dirk retires. He would also be perfect to have in starting lineup and Dirk coming off the bench for the last years of his career. But still, I do not see him fitting well with Barnes and Noel, since Rick prefers to keep Barnes at PF.

Yeah, I've been very impressed with him as Dirk's possible replacement. Wasn't overly impressed with him last night against UCLA (what little I saw) but think he would be a great complement to Noel.
The problem is he plays Barnes' position so not sure how that would work out because our pick has to be starter quality at the very least.

rimrocker · 02-26-2017, 11:30 AM

Kind of interesting how these 3 mock drafts have us taking Fox....one of them over Smith.
I see Fox as a Devin Harris clone so I could be okay with a Fox/Curry/Yogi rotation for the next 6 years or so.
Fox's ability to penetrate and pass could be lethal and fun to watch with Noel.

http://www.nbadraft.net/2017mock_draft

http://www.nbadraftroom.com/p/2017-nba-mock-draft.html

http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-mock-draft/2017/

Underdog · 02-26-2017, 11:38 AM

Markkanen only makes sense if Barnes moves back to SF, or if Dirk plays exclusively as a 10-15 MPG backup center. Otherwise I see him getting lost in the shuffle a la Crowder/Anderson, especially with a "Carlisle guy" like Finney-Smith starting to step up his game.

I'd still target a PG in this draft, with Yogi taking on the Barea role off the bench... Seems like we still have way too many players at the 2-4 positions for anyone else to make sense... And no reason to go after a center with a high pick either if we can get Noel locked up on a longterm deal.

Fultz, Ball, Smith Jr, Fox, Ntilikina -- whoever is there when we pick.

rimrocker · 02-26-2017, 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

Fultz, Ball, Smith Jr, Fox, Ntilikina -- whoever is there when we pick.

That's why I hope we are picking 7 or better...almost guaranteed one of them or Jackson or Isaac.
Right now we are 8.

Underdog · 02-26-2017, 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rimrocker

That's why I hope we are picking 7 or better...almost guaranteed one of them or Jackson or Isaac.
Right now we are 8.

I think top-10 gets one of those guys... And there's always a possibility that one of them slides past that, considering the awful front offices picking ahead of us.

rimrocker · 02-26-2017, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

I think top-10 gets one of those guys... And there's always a possibility that one of them slides past that, considering the awful front offices picking ahead of us.

Yeah....Tatum, Markkanen and Monk could easily go before Fox and/or Ntilikina.
I'd be pleasantly shocked if Smith falls to us.
Fultz and Ball are too unrealistic at this point imo.

Underdog · 02-26-2017, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rimrocker

Yeah....Tatum, Markkanen and Monk could easily go before Fox and/or Ntilikina.
I'd be pleasantly shocked if Smith falls to us.
Fultz and Ball are too unrealistic at this point imo.

Yeah, probably... There's a good chance we play over/around .500 to close out the season with Noel on the roster.

Bryan_Wilson · 02-26-2017, 03:56 PM

I like how quick Fox is, but man.... 17% on 3's. There's bad... and then there's the rocky 5 sequel... and then there's fox's 3 point shooting.