2021-2022 Preseason and camp thread

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by purplefrog

With all the talk of a Ben Simmons trade......

Breaking News: Sixers offer Simmons to the Mavericks in a trade that would bring back Tim Hardaway Jr., Dwight Powell, and Willie Cauley-Stein. When asked for comment, owner Mark Cuban said, "No way do I make that trade. Tim and Dwight are beloved in this organization and besides it brings us down from five centers to only three. We would be crazy to make that trade."

Sad thing is this is almost believable from CUBAN.

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally Posted by purplefrog

With all the talk of a Ben Simmons trade......

Breaking News: Sixers offer Simmons to the Mavericks in a trade that would bring back Tim Hardaway Jr., Dwight Powell, and Willie Cauley-Stein. When asked for comment, owner Mark Cuban said, "No way do I make that trade. Tim and Dwight are beloved in this organization and besides it brings us down from five centers to only three. We would be crazy to make that trade."

In before JustJay says I'm stupid for having this opinion, but...

I want no part of Simmons. I love his defense, but you have a major issue with his on-court liabilities. With how infantile he's acting, I'd avoid him for two reasons.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

So apparently on Jake Fischer's lastest greenroom podcast, welp...the Mavs are done and like their roster. He seems to be pretty plugged in from what I can tell, but it is bleacher report.

Another failed FA in the books.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

.

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Another failed FA in the books.

Cmon, even you have to admit that this is incredibly hyperbolic.

Mavs finished the season on a tear. Only Bucks had a better win-loss ratio to end the season and we finished 5th. Without Covid, we'd have had home court. We were a top 4 team in the West and Clippers were shoe-ins for the WCF if they didn't lose Kawhi.

Then we added two pieces that addressed what we needed most: defense and shooting while losing none of the impact players.

You can cry and say we should have done more, but saying we failed is ludicrous and patently hyperbolic. I wouldn't give this offseason an A, but it was a C+ or B- in my book and that ain't failure.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Cmon, even you have to admit that this is incredibly hyperbolic.

Mavs finished the season on a tear. Only Bucks had a better win-loss ratio to end the season and we finished 5th. Without Covid, we'd have had home court. We were a top 4 team in the West and Clippers were shoe-ins for the WCF if they didn't lose Kawhi.

Then we added two pieces that addressed what we needed most: defense and shooting while losing none of the impact players.

You can cry and say we should have done more, but saying we failed is ludicrous and patently hyperbolic. I wouldn't give this offseason an A, but it was a C+ or B- in my book and that ain't failure.

Ok Cuban. Whatever you say.

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Ok Cuban. Whatever you say.

I'll go cry over there with the rest of the national media that thinks we had a pretty decent season last year and a pretty decent offseason.

Sorry for being a Cuban shill despite talking @#$% about Cuban and Bob for most of the offseason.

You're absolutely right, I'm just a Cuban apologist.

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Cmon, even you have to admit that this is incredibly hyperbolic.

Mavs finished the season on a tear. Only Bucks had a better win-loss ratio to end the season and we finished 5th. Without Covid, we'd have had home court. We were a top 4 team in the West and Clippers were shoe-ins for the WCF if they didn't lose Kawhi.

Then we added two pieces that addressed what we needed most: defense and shooting while losing none of the impact players.

You can cry and say we should have done more, but saying we failed is ludicrous and patently hyperbolic. I wouldn't give this offseason an A, but it was a C+ or B- in my book and that ain't failure.

With all due respect to your opinion. No we Absolutely didn't address what we needed most.

Did we improve defense and shooting? Yup and that's honestly a real good step. Still not enough because there are no other multi-tool offensive starters so once again Luka will have to generate everything. At this point we don't even have another starter who can even bring the ball up the floor consistently to give him a tiny break.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Originally Posted by SMC0007

With all due respect to your opinion. No we Absolutely didn't address what we needed most.

Did we improve defense and shooting? Yup and that's honestly a real good step. Still not enough because there are no other multi-tool offensive starters so once again Luka will have to generate everything. At this point we don't even have another starter who can even bring the ball up the floor consistently to give him a tiny break.

And even Brunson can't fully be relied on to run the second unit. Just not a great floor general/playmaker.

They'll all be singing a different tune when Luka is run down by mid season.

[purplefrog]

Originally Posted by SMC0007

With all due respect to your opinion. No we Absolutely didn't address what we needed most.

Did we improve defense and shooting? Yup and that's honestly a real good step. Still not enough because there are no other multi-tool offensive starters so once again Luka will have to generate everything. At this point we don't even have another starter who can even bring the ball up the floor consistently to give him a tiny break.

I tend to agree. The two most glaring deficiencies needing to be addressed were/are:
1). adding a secondary ball handler + playmaker
2). rim protection

Nothing was done to fix these problems. Brown and Bullock might make significant contributions, but it seems to me the other issues remain. Maybe JKidd can coach up KP and he becomes a bigger contributor on defense (and rebounding for that matter), but Mavs still lack a second playmaker to help Luka.

[BPo001]

Yahoo sports with a positive take. One of the top 10 FA signings:

Reggie Bullock, Dallas Mavericks (3 years, $30.5 million)

Age: 30

Stats (30 MPG): 10.9 PPG (44/41/91), 3.4 RPG, 1.5 APG (0.7 TO), 1.0 S/BPG, 11.1 PER

The Mavericks whiffed on bigger-name free agents, but they needed 3-and-D wing help around rising superstar Luka Doncic, and Bullock fits that bill at a reasonable cost. Dallas ranked sixth in catch-and-shoot 3-point attempts last season and 18th in efficacy. Bullock has bounced around five different teams, but he has maintained a 40.2% clip on catch-and-shoot 3-pointers in an eight-year career, primarily playing alongside point guards Elfrid Payton, Reggie Jackson and Ish Smith — hardly Doncic-level facilitators.

Bullock is not an elite defensive player, but he is solid and was a mainstay in the best defensive lineups for the league's fourth-ranked outfit last season. You could do a lot worse at one of the league's most coveted positions. Guys like Gary Trent Jr. and Doug McDermott were paid far more to fill similar roles on balance.

[BPo001]

.

[Melonhead]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Cmon, even you have to admit that this is incredibly hyperbolic.

Mavs finished the season on a tear. Only Bucks had a better win-loss ratio to end the season and we finished 5th. Without Covid, we'd have had home court. We were a top 4 team in the West and Clippers were shoe-ins for the WCF if they didn't lose Kawhi.

Then we added two pieces that addressed what we needed most: defense and shooting while losing none of the impact players.

You can cry and say we should have done more, but saying we failed is ludicrous and patently hyperbolic. I wouldn't give this offseason an A, but it was a C+ or B- in my book and that ain't failure.

Even Cuban said the offseason priority was a second playmaker that can create and take pressure off of Luka. By his own comments, we absolutely didnt address what was needed most. Those stand on the corner 3 guys will not get you past the first round. You need ballers. Mavs have one and are gonna pray he can put the whole thing on his shoulders again. Still have zero rim protection. That would be second on the most needed list.

People are allowed to be upset with this same old shit every offseason. With or without RC, the mavs are running the same offense. Luka create all, and hope guys are hot on the outside.

[Melonhead]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

And even Brunson can't fully be relied on to run the second unit. Just not a great floor general/playmaker.

They'll all be singing a different tune when Luka is run down by mid season.

And we've all sung that tune the last two seasons. Its like they forget the melody in the offseason.

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by Melonhead

And we've all sung that tune the last two seasons. Its like they forget the melody in the offseason.

No kidding. But I don't think there are many who don't see secondary playmaker/scorer as the biggest need.

[saclare]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

1) What makes you think I'm a cheerleader or even want to be?

2) Where did I voice a week ago that I wanted Kawhi?

As I said, you are welcome to have a different opinion. You are not welcome to call me stupid, based on making @#$ up that never happened or by putting words in my mouth.

It's been a theme for ole JJ. I followed his lead and ignored him. Pretty solid experience since.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Originally Posted by Melonhead

And we've all sung that tune the last two seasons. Its like they forget the melody in the offseason.

Listen, I don't do this for my own vain selfish wants. I was driving my Saab listening to fatboy slim in the 90s to get a seat anywhere I wanted to watch Shawn Bradley shoot fts. I'll root for the team no matter how good or bad.

But this is all for Luka, and it's not fair to him. They need a secondary ball handler more than anything else, and it's not close. To not even remotely address that is terrible. I guess I have to hope it's all a smokescreen.

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Listen, I don't do this for my own vein selfish wants. I was driving my Saab listening to fatboy slim in the 90s to get a seat anywhere I wanted to watch Shawn Bradley shoot fts. I'll root for the team no matter how good or bad.

But this is all for Luka, and it's not fair to him. They need a secondary ball handler more than anything else, and it's not close. To not even remotely address that is terrible. I guess I have to hope it's all a smokescreen.

Idk who it's smokescreening. Maybe a few fans don't make the connection but the league does and I'm sure the players do too. If Cuban gets it and said it publicly, I can't imagine Kidd and Nico sat him down and changed his mind.

If it's not addressed by training camp then it gives less time to gel, especially if they push it further toward the trade deadline. The issue I have is putting it on the back burner burner and we come out hot so they decide to just run with as is. I think it would be fools gold because the teams are better and have more time to game plan in the playoffs.

They have to fill that void somehow. Fwiw, I'd be ecstatic if a guy we already have takes a major step forward in that role but better to have 1 too many than desperately needing one when it really counts.

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally Posted by Melonhead

Even Cuban said the offseason priority was a second playmaker that can create and take pressure off of Luka. By his own comments, we absolutely didnt address what was needed most. Those stand on the corner 3 guys will not get you past the first round. You need ballers. Mavs have one and are gonna pray he can put the whole thing on his shoulders again. Still have zero rim protection. That would be second on the most needed list.

People are allowed to be upset with this same old shit every offseason. With or without RC, the mavs are running the same offense. Luka create all, and hope guys are hot on the outside.

I must have missed where he said we needed another playmaker. Can you show me?

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

I must have missed where he said we needed another playmaker. Can you show me?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbs...who-he-is/amp/


https://atozsportsdallas.com/mark-cu...ts-about-time/

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally Posted by SMC0007

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbs...who-he-is/amp/


https://atozsportsdallas.com/mark-cu...ts-about-time/

First one is Cuban wanting a scorer. We have KP and retained THJ. We got two other scorers who can fill it up efficiently this offseason so check.

As for playmaker, it sounds like they're working on Dragic and I'd wager $20 we get him at the TDL or on waivers.

That's just my opinion, though

[Dallas41]

Originally Posted by SMC0007

No kidding. But I don't think there are many who don't see secondary playmaker/scorer as the biggest need.

The owner told the media what the Mavs biggest need was going into the offseason and yet the owner didn't seem to listen to himself.

We are still waiting on that secondary ball handler with size as he stated LOL

But then again we've been waiting on that type of guy to pair with Luka since he entered the league so I guess eventually we'll get their

[Dallas41]

Originally Posted by Melonhead

And we've all sung that tune the last two seasons. Its like they forget the melody in the offseason.

I think at this point we just have to trust that J.Kidd will figure something out with the roster.

I don't think there's anyone available who can really help us now.

I'm not a believer in Dragic and I think he's going to end up much like Redick injured and unplayable when it matters most.

[Dallas41]

Sums up our Mavs when it comes to FA's

https://www.mavsmoneyball.com/2021/8...on-free-agency
Bullock and Brown are savvy moves. Bullock could be a potential starter and at the very least, becomes the second or third bester shooter on the roster. Brown is more unproven but has potential to crack the rotation as another shooter on the perimeter. The problem isn’t that the Mavericks signed those two players, the problem is that they needed more. More accurately, the problem is they needed more and free agency was the only way for the Mavericks to do it. If Dallas was a team that continually grabbed useful players in the draft or used their cap space to grab picks that they could use to trade for impact players, this week wouldn’t be so disappointing. Instead it would just be another smart series of transactions.

Instead the Mavericks do not draft well, do not value draft picks in trades and tell the media/public to “watch out” or “buckle up” for free agency, when in reality there are only a handful of deals every summer that truly feel like team-altering moves and the Mavericks are just one of 30 teams to try and snag one. If the Mavericks drafted Desmond Bane and Xaiver Tillman with the 18th and 31st picks of the 2020 NBA Draft, would signing Bullock and Brown be met with such disdain? I’d think not.

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

First one is Cuban wanting a scorer. We have KP and retained THJ. We got two other scorers who can fill it up efficiently this offseason so check.

As for playmaker, it sounds like they're working on Dragic and I'd wager $20 we get him at the TDL or on waivers.

That's just my opinion, though

~We need a secondary ball-handler with some size,” Cuban said. “KP will spread the court, make threes, is a great cutter, and block shots. Luka will create. We’ve got shooters with Tim and Trey [Burke] and Maxi [Kleber] and others. But we need someone to take the pressure off of Luka, so instead of him having to have the ball in his hands for 40 minutes, it could be 32 minutes, and that’s what we need.”~



THJ can barely dribble the ball, almost everything he gets its because Luka sets it up. He doesn't help take the load off by creating anything. You can't toss him the ball and ask him to get to the bucket. He isn't gonna break any defender down and find an open man either.

Dragic can help some. I'm not counting on him for anything other than a back up role IF he can even stay healthy. If they have their feet propped up smoking a cigar thinking they nailed free agency while waiting for Dragic, it's worse than I thought.

[Kidd Karma]

Originally Posted by Dallas41

I think at this point we just have to trust that J.Kidd will figure something out with the roster.

I don't think there's anyone available who can really help us now.

I'm not a believer in Dragic and I think he's going to end up much like Redick injured and unplayable when it matters most.

Got to come up big with Terry and Green. Cubes invested some into the draft last year and these has got to pay dividends and start being part of the rotation, not they've upped the ante by placing Bullock and Brown in front of them for minutes, got to compete, be available and earn those minutes.

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by Dallas41

Sums up our Mavs when it comes to FA's

https://www.mavsmoneyball.com/2021/8...on-free-agency
Bullock and Brown are savvy moves. Bullock could be a potential starter and at the very least, becomes the second or third bester shooter on the roster. Brown is more unproven but has potential to crack the rotation as another shooter on the perimeter. The problem isn’t that the Mavericks signed those two players, the problem is that they needed more. More accurately, the problem is they needed more and free agency was the only way for the Mavericks to do it. If Dallas was a team that continually grabbed useful players in the draft or used their cap space to grab picks that they could use to trade for impact players, this week wouldn’t be so disappointing. Instead it would just be another smart series of transactions.

Instead the Mavericks do not draft well, do not value draft picks in trades and tell the media/public to “watch out” or “buckle up” for free agency, when in reality there are only a handful of deals every summer that truly feel like team-altering moves and the Mavericks are just one of 30 teams to try and snag one. If the Mavericks drafted Desmond Bane and Xaiver Tillman with the 18th and 31st picks of the 2020 NBA Draft, would signing Bullock and Brown be met with such disdain? I’d think not.

Yuuuuup

[BPo001]

Originally Posted by Kidd Karma

Got to come up big with Terry and Green. Cubes invested some into the draft last year and these has got to pay dividends and start being part of the rotation, not they've upped the ante by placing Bullock and Brown in front of them for minutes, got to compete, be available and earn those minutes.

Luckily we will get to see Terry during summer league to see what kind of progress he has made. Sounds like Green may not play though due to be in the Olympics.

[NeedlesKane]

Originally Posted by JustJay

Knicks are giving Randle 4 years 117 million. He had a great season, but I would not want to pay him that much.

How much would you want to pay him? Also while you're at it... can you pay some of us?

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by NeedlesKane

How much would you want to pay him? Also while you're at it... can you pay some of us?

I can coach and scout. My playing days may be over as I just had knee replacement surgery a cpl weeks ago. Won't have to pay me much to yell at all you clowns for a few hours a week

[Melonhead]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

First one is Cuban wanting a scorer. We have KP and retained THJ. We got two other scorers who can fill it up efficiently this offseason so check.

As for playmaker, it sounds like they're working on Dragic and I'd wager $20 we get him at the TDL or on waivers.

That's just my opinion, though

Lol you really gonna keep doubling down okay

[Bryan_Wilson]

I understand if people want to say disappointed but calling this a failure makes no sense to me. A failure was 2019 and 2020 I really don't see remotely the same comparison. We struck out on ONE guy who never even considered anyone except Miami and then we went on to sign the best we could. We didn't wait around doing nothing for 2 days, we didn't lay an egg and throw an offer at a RFA and get stuck waiting for 3 days, and we didn't go plan powder with 1 yr deals. By all appearances we got who we wanted minus Lowry who half the ppl here didn't even want anyway.

The guys we went after we went after fast so that is who Kidd and Nico wanted. This wasn't a case of being left at the alter and not getting anyone. We didn't go cheap we stayed over the cap and used every exception we had and we hold an extra 10.8 TPE to add even more salary.

I'm sure if we don't get dragic we will get some other fill in playmaker by the TDL. We have TPE and we have moveable contracts. It's just this weak ass free agency that ppl seem to be denying was weak for some reason has dried up in the playmaker category and the ones available Kidd, that hall of fame pg ppl are so happy about as HC, didn't seem to want them. I blame Cuban for a lot of shit but I find it hard to believe he's the one driving these decisions, he for sure is the one making the final ones but if we don't go after Schroder, Kidd coached him so that should be a red flag that he's not out there vouching for the guy. Reggie Jackson? Mavs love to target dudes who killed them and he's not being pursued.

I'd rather they get who they want then just make a move because we need x type player so lets settle for y, or z player. Not long ago ppl were singing the praises of Kidd and Nico and thankful as hell RC was gone and how RC used KP wrong and excited about Kidd. Now it's all Cubans fault we didn't get a star in a starless FA? And I'm not even remotely close to a Cuban fan for the record.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

But I mean, we have even less playmaking than we did last season with J-Rich gone. That's how sad our secondary playmaking really is. And with Luka playing his heart out in the Olympics, he WILL be gassed by midseason. It's not even a will he. He will be.

The only way to alleviate that is a guy who can fill in for him. I mean, if Luka gets injured (wood knocking), then the season collapses right then and there. Having a Schroder, Jackson, or Dragic at least gives a bit of hope to keep the season going versus a total collapse.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Wow, Hornets got Oubre for 2/26. That's a good deal even considering his flaws.

[Melonhead]

Originally Posted by Bryan_Wilson

I understand if people want to say disappointed but calling this a failure makes no sense to me. A failure was 2019 and 2020 I really don't see remotely the same comparison. We struck out on ONE guy who never even considered anyone except Miami and then we went on to sign the best we could. We didn't wait around doing nothing for 2 days, we didn't lay an egg and throw an offer at a RFA and get stuck waiting for 3 days, and we didn't go plan powder with 1 yr deals. By all appearances we got who we wanted minus Lowry who half the ppl here didn't even want anyway.

The guys we went after we went after fast so that is who Kidd and Nico wanted. This wasn't a case of being left at the alter and not getting anyone. We didn't go cheap we stayed over the cap and used every exception we had and we hold an extra 10.8 TPE to add even more salary.

I'm sure if we don't get dragic we will get some other fill in playmaker by the TDL. We have TPE and we have moveable contracts. It's just this weak ass free agency that ppl seem to be denying was weak for some reason has dried up in the playmaker category and the ones available Kidd, that hall of fame pg ppl are so happy about as HC, didn't seem to want them. I blame Cuban for a lot of shit but I find it hard to believe he's the one driving these decisions, he for sure is the one making the final ones but if we don't go after Schroder, Kidd coached him so that should be a red flag that he's not out there vouching for the guy. Reggie Jackson? Mavs love to target dudes who killed them and he's not being pursued.

I'd rather they get who they want then just make a move because we need x type player so lets settle for y, or z player. Not long ago ppl were singing the praises of Kidd and Nico and thankful as hell RC was gone and how RC used KP wrong and excited about Kidd. Now it's all Cubans fault we didn't get a star in a starless FA? And I'm not even remotely close to a Cuban fan for the record.

There are a lot of guys out there that would’ve helped. Asset collection is imprint we can stop acting like the FA has to be perfect in order to inquire. But we’ve seen the reports that Mavs aren’t interested. Reggie Jackson played out of his mind in other series too. It wasn’t just Dallas. Lonzo, Bjelica, Caruso, Dieng, Devonte Graham, Patty Mills, Lauri, Theis are guys that can make impacts on the court. I didn’t include guys that took pay cuts to go to LA or GS. Idk why you keep saying it’s a starless FA as if more stars would’ve been beneficial to the Mavs. Doesn’t matter who is out there. We’ve gone from Barnes to Delon to JRich to Bullock. Spin that however you want. The problems of the roster are still glaring.

[mac222b]

Both sides of this argument can be right: We added 3-D guys on fair deals. Something that was needed, especially while Green is still, well, green. We added a young big on a super value contract.

We didn’t get the secondary ball handler to help spell Luka (along with Brunson) but we have flexibility with the TPE and may add Dragic or better.

Best of all, we didn’t throw precious assets at questionable fits just in order to make a “splash”. We are getting closer to have a full stock of picks to trade for the next star(s) that come available on the market. We have some good contracts for trade matching purposes and a couple young guys to sweeten deals too.

Id grade it a B or B— , but incomplete for now until we see what happens with Dragic or even other potential moves. Not sure if we are engaged in a game of chicken with Toronto, but I like the new found tough negotiating style. I think in the past Cuban would’ve caved in this Dragic deal. For now at least, I think it signals a stylistic change that could pay dividends down the line.

[mac222b]

Both sides of this argument can be right: We added 3-D guys on fair deals. Something that was needed, especially while Green is still, well, green. We added a young big on a super value contract.

We didn’t get the secondary ball handler to help spell Luka (along with Brunson) but we have flexibility with the TPE and may add Dragic or better.

Best of all, we didn’t throw precious assets at questionable fits just in order to make a “splash”. We are getting closer to have a full stock of picks to trade for the next star(s) that come available on the market. We have some good contracts for trade matching purposes and a couple young guys to sweeten deals too.

Id grade it a B or B— , but incomplete for now until we see what happens with Dragic or even other potential moves. Not sure if we are engaged in a game of chicken with Toronto, but I like the new found tough negotiating style. I think in the past Cuban would’ve caved in this Dragic deal. For now at least, I think it signals a stylistic change that could pay dividends down the line.

[Some Guy]

Originally Posted by Bryan_Wilson

I understand if people want to say disappointed but calling this a failure makes no sense to me. A failure was 2019 and 2020

Remember how happy everyone was with the 2020 offseason?

[scrambol]

How much better would this make them? Ideal Scenario

Dragic - after buyout
Markennan - trade Kleber and Burke

Starters
PF - Markennan
SF - THJ
C - KP
BG - Dragic
PG - Luka

Bench
DFS
Bullock
S. Brown
Brunson
Powell
WCS
M. Brown
Boban
Green
Terry
Hinton

[scrambol]

How much better would this make them? Ideal Scenario

Dragic - after buyout
Markennan - trade Kleber and Burke

Starters
PF - Markennan
SF - THJ
C - KP
BG - Dragic
PG - Luka

Bench
DFS
Bullock
S. Brown
Brunson
Powell
WCS
M. Brown
Boban
Green
Terry
Hinton