2021-2022 Preseason and camp thread

[BPo001]

Originally Posted by Melonhead

So Noel is suing Rich Paul to the tune of 58 milly.

Interesting to see how that plays out.

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally Posted by SMC0007

Anyone want to wager that Shannon Brown gets a shot at the starting lineup at some point this season ?

Shannon or Sterling? Can’t tell if joke about washed up Lakers trash or legit discussion of new talent.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Rockets give Tyler Bey a training camp deal.

[tap2390]

Originally Posted by Melonhead

So Noel is suing Rich Paul to the tune of 58 milly.

Interesting to see how that plays out.

He actually has a really good case for breach of fiduciary duty. Allegedly, teams couldn’t get a hold of Paul to negotiate a contract prior to Noel signing with OKC.

I’m all for this. I can’t stand Rich Paul.

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Shannon or Sterling? Can’t tell if joke about washed up Lakers trash or legit discussion of new talent.

Luka needs all the help he can get

[saclare]

Originally Posted by Melonhead

So Noel is suing Rich Paul to the tune of 58 milly.

Interesting to see how that plays out.

A swift motion to dismiss, is my bet.

[saclare]

Originally Posted by SMC0007

Anyone want to wager that Shannon Brown gets a shot at the starting lineup at some point this season ?

I'll take your monies

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by saclare

I'll take your monies

Haha. But for real. I think Sterling can defend guards better than ThJ. If he keeps his 3pt % up and THJ doesn't improve defensively, it may force Kidds hand to try it out.

[rimrocker]

Originally Posted by SMC0007

Anyone want to wager that Shannon Brown gets a shot at the starting lineup at some point this season ?

Wouldn't be surprised.

S. Brown might be the best signing this season and could be our best chance to vastly improve.
Not holding my breath that happens but I hope one of the young colors (Brown, Green and Brown) on our team take a huge step to the next level.

Does anyone else see much upside to any other players on the team?

[Melonhead]

Originally Posted by tap2390

He actually has a really good case for breach of fiduciary duty. Allegedly, teams couldn’t get a hold of Paul to negotiate a contract prior to Noel signing with OKC.

I’m all for this. I can’t stand Rich Paul.

That’s assuming his side is telling the truth that Paul was ignoring phone calls. That’s pretty hard to prove if he didn’t answer a call but was still returning other phone calls. Rich Paul himself put out rumors that Noel was getting a big contract to help generate more interest. His only goal is profit I think it’ll be hard to prove he wasn’t living up to those duties.

Don’t get me wrong I’m not on Paul’s side, but Noel is suing in response to Klutch suing him

[tap2390]

Originally Posted by Melonhead

That’s assuming his side is telling the truth that Paul was ignoring phone calls. That’s pretty hard to prove if he didn’t answer a call but was still returning other phone calls. Rich Paul himself put out rumors that Noel was getting a big contract to help generate more interest. His only goal is profit I think it’ll be hard to prove he wasn’t living up to those duties.

Don’t get me wrong I’m not on Paul’s side, but Noel is suing in response to Klutch suing him

I ran through the petition, and then actually specifies that Noel heard from Brett Brown that the 76ers couldn’t get ahold of Paul to negotiate a contract. Interested to see how this unfolds.

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by rimrocker

Wouldn't be surprised.

S. Brown might be the best signing this season and could be our best chance to vastly improve.
Not holding my breath that happens but I hope one of the young colors (Brown, Green and Brown) on our team take a huge step to the next level.

Does anyone else see much upside to any other players on the team?

I think the colors have the most room for growth. A lot of untapped potential there.

The next most obvious big step potential is KP, he was a shell of himself athletically, especially on defense. His reaction time and anticipation needs to improve.

The 2 things I most look forward to seeing are:

1) What changes Kidd makes with the schemes, on both ends.

2) What Kidd values in a player. Is he going to see DP and Maxi the same way Rick does? Some of the glue guys or veterans who have little upside but make less mistakes OR does he want guys with potential who are more prone to make mistakes but he is willing to endure it to reach their potential.

This is going to be fun to watch. I'd rather see these young guys get more of a chance to grow by getting the experience. I'm just not sure how Kidd will approach it because at the same time he probably feels like he needs to prove himself as a coach. Taking losses in games because he is rolling the dice may not be received well by some of the fan base who doesn't fully comprehend why we aren't just winning at all cost.

[Zeus]

If we are done this has been a little underwhelming off season... Or did I miss something?

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Originally Posted by Zeus

If we are done this has been a little underwhelming off season... Or did I miss something?

Little tidbit rumors are popping up that the Mavs still expect to get Dragic, but I'm not really keeping hopes up for that or Markkanen.

[Zeus]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Little tidbit rumors are popping up that the Mavs still expect to get Dragic, but I'm not really keeping hopes up for that or Markkanen.

Well I guess we run it back with a Year 4 Luka and perhaps a Josh Green who has learned to dribble while not looking at the ball. I don't see a top 6 finish. I think we will be fighting for the 7/8 spot.

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by Zeus

Well I guess we run it back with a Year 4 Luka and perhaps a Josh Green who has learned to dribble while not looking at the ball. I don't see a top 6 finish. I think we will be fighting for the 7/8 spot.

Josh can dribble well. Thats not his problem. He needs to learn to shoot.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Josh needs to learn a lot of things. He's just not very good right now, and the Olympics and missing summer league didn't help his cause. I really am not seeing what makes people thing he can be an NBA player, but I'd be happy to be proven wrong.

[EricaLubarsky]

If you want to know what the Mavs think of Green...

Mavs just signed two 6'6" guys who can defend and shoot.

Says everything

[EricaLubarsky]

If you want to know what the Mavs think of Green...

Mavs just signed two 6'6" guys who can defend and shoot.

Says everything

[thewizard]

Originally Posted by SMC0007

Haha. But for real. I think Sterling can defend guards better than ThJ. If he keeps his 3pt % up and THJ doesn't improve defensively, it may force Kidds hand to try it out.

If Brown does crack the starting lineup I wouldn't expect it to be for long, especially if he's replacing THJ. One huge issue we had last year was we would constantly fall into early deficits when we started Luka/Richardson/Finney-Smith/Kleber/KP. There just wasn't enough offense between them. We finally solved that at the end of last year when we put THJ back in the starting lineup. I don't see a Luka/Brown/Bullock/Finney-Smith/KP lineup doing any better to start games. And I don't see Brown beating out Bullock, DFS, or Maxi for one of the other spots if THJ did end up starting. So yeah I'd take that bet.

[tap2390]

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

If you want to know what the Mavs think of Green...

Mavs just signed two 6'6" guys who can defend and shoot.

Says everything

Every team in the league wants 6’6” guys who can defend and hit 3s.

[Zeus]

Originally Posted by tap2390

Every team in the league wants 6’6” guys who can defend and hit 3s.

6'7" also works..

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Originally Posted by tap2390

Every team in the league wants 6’6” guys who can defend and hit 3s.

But where is Green going to realistically get minutes with THJ, DFS, Brown and Bullock? If Green doesn't hit his threes, then he won't play. Simple as that.

[NeedlesKane]

Originally Posted by tap2390

He actually has a really good case for breach of fiduciary duty. Allegedly, teams couldn’t get a hold of Paul to negotiate a contract prior to Noel signing with OKC.

I’m all for this. I can’t stand Rich Paul.

I hope Nerlens Noel wins, and then Rich Paul will be known as Less Rich Paul.

[Melonhead]

Originally Posted by tap2390

I ran through the petition, and then actually specifies that Noel heard from Brett Brown that the 76ers couldn’t get ahold of Paul to negotiate a contract. Interested to see how this unfolds.

Just now seeing some of the stuff on that now. Good maybe they can bury Rich Paul a little bit

[saclare]

Originally Posted by thewizard

If Brown does crack the starting lineup I wouldn't expect it to be for long, especially if he's replacing THJ. One huge issue we had last year was we would constantly fall into early deficits when we started Luka/Richardson/Finney-Smith/Kleber/KP. There just wasn't enough offense between them. We finally solved that at the end of last year when we put THJ back in the starting lineup. I don't see a Luka/Brown/Bullock/Finney-Smith/KP lineup doing any better to start games. And I don't see Brown beating out Bullock, DFS, or Maxi for one of the other spots if THJ did end up starting. So yeah I'd take that bet.

Was going to respond with the same sentiment. New staff, but tough to ignore the lack of offense when Richardson was starting vs. THJ. Rotations will be everything, but we've injecting better defense and shooting to the roster.

[rimrocker]

Originally Posted by thewizard

If Brown does crack the starting lineup I wouldn't expect it to be for long, especially if he's replacing THJ. One huge issue we had last year was we would constantly fall into early deficits when we started Luka/Richardson/Finney-Smith/Kleber/KP. There just wasn't enough offense between them. We finally solved that at the end of last year when we put THJ back in the starting lineup. I don't see a Luka/Brown/Bullock/Finney-Smith/KP lineup doing any better to start games. And I don't see Brown beating out Bullock, DFS, or Maxi for one of the other spots if THJ did end up starting. So yeah I'd take that bet.

Brown still has an upside that Bullock, DFS, and Maxi don't necessarily have.
Doubt that it will be enough to get him into the SL but we can certainly hope.

IMO, S. Brown is about our only hope to vastly improve this team. There isn't a lot of individual upside on this roster because most of the others are at, or very near their ceilings. I suppose we can improve collectively as a team, but I'm not sure coaching and a few minor adjustments to the middle of the roster will get us any higher than a 6th seed.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Bye bye Markkanen. Cleveland 4/67.

[rimrocker]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Bye bye Markkanen. Cleveland 4/67.

Looks like Chicago did pretty well in this deal.
Crap...at least a player that actually wanted to come here.

[BPo001]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Bye bye Markkanen. Cleveland 4/67.

trade details:

Adrian Wojnarowski: ESPN Sources: Cleveland’s acquiring Chicago’s Lauri Markkanen in three-way sign and trade with Portland. Bulls get Derrick Jones Jr., POR’s lottery protected future 1st and Cavs’ future second-rounder. POR gets Larry Nance Jr.

[Melonhead]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Bye bye Markkanen. Cleveland 4/67.

Sighhhhhhhhhhhh

[sefant77]

And some people thought its a nobrainer to give up Kleber and a FRP...

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Well I'm convinced the Mavs were more hesitant to give up Kleber than the money. Misguided, but it is what it is.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Mavs waive Nate Hinton. Never understand what they saw in him and still can't believe they didn't give Bey more of a chance.

[sefant77]

Lets see who they pick up before bitching...

[FreshJive]

Is there any reason for them to do this now, other than adding someone?

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by thewizard

If Brown does crack the starting lineup I wouldn't expect it to be for long, especially if he's replacing THJ. One huge issue we had last year was we would constantly fall into early deficits when we started Luka/Richardson/Finney-Smith/Kleber/KP. There just wasn't enough offense between them. We finally solved that at the end of last year when we put THJ back in the starting lineup. I don't see a Luka/Brown/Bullock/Finney-Smith/KP lineup doing any better to start games. And I don't see Brown beating out Bullock, DFS, or Maxi for one of the other spots if THJ did end up starting. So yeah I'd take that bet.

THJ and Brown are interchangeable. What are you losing when switching them? Tim took more shots and that's gonna happen playing next to Luka and having twice as many starts. Both 40% on 3pt. Sterling plays way better defense and has a little better handle.

It's going to be about fit and balance. The reason Tim occasionally falls out of the SLU is because he is a bad defender and there's no way Kidd is going to just settle for being poor defensively. JRich played himself out of the starting spot and at some point you just give up and go back to trying to outscore teams. He was terrible more than THJ was great. THj is the same player he was the year before, a super streaky 1 trick pony.

Not even sure why Maxi gets a mention. Kidd doesn't have the same attachments to this group that Rick did. It's a no brainer that DFS and Bullock are getting their fill of minutes, but Maxi and DP are going to have to earn theirs a bit more.

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Josh needs to learn a lot of things. He's just not very good right now, and the Olympics and missing summer league didn't help his cause. I really am not seeing what makes people thing he can be an NBA player, but I'd be happy to be proven wrong.

The Olympics was definitely better for him than summer league. Practicing vs Australia's 1s alone is better than that disorganized garbage ball at the SL. The olymic environment isn't comparable to playing with a bunch of dudes who aren't even going to ever be in the league. He didn't get a lot of mins but the experience of that environment and being on a team with Medal aspirations was more valuable.

I agree that he has a lot to prove, I just don't know where his minutes are gonna come from. The MBT 2.0 has to be at least brainstorming the idea of packaging him in a deal given the state of our team.

[SMC0007]

Originally Posted by rimrocker

Brown still has an upside that Bullock, DFS, and Maxi don't necessarily have.
Doubt that it will be enough to get him into the SL but we can certainly hope.

IMO, S. Brown is about our only hope to vastly improve this team. There isn't a lot of individual upside on this roster because most of the others are at, or very near their ceilings. I suppose we can improve collectively as a team, but I'm not sure coaching and a few minor adjustments to the middle of the roster will get us any higher than a 6th seed.

Idk about the seeding, that isn't something we have full control over. I will say that the roster is unquestionably better now. We've strengthened the wing rotation for sure. Replaced JRich with Bullock and perhaps JJReddick/Melli for Sterling. Bullock and Sterling are big upgrades defensively and better shooters in the overall scheme of things.

Moses might be our best chance to vastly improve...as far as 1 single guy that we have. It's a long shot because he's so raw and isn't a good defender yet, but he has more potential to fill one of the 2 gaps we currently have. Imagine us having 2011 Tyson Chandler. If Moses morphed into Ty, we would be in the contender conversation. Unfortunately right now he is more like WCS on Adderall.

[thewizard]

Originally Posted by SMC0007

THJ and Brown are interchangeable. What are you losing when switching them? Tim took more shots and that's gonna happen playing next to Luka and having twice as many starts. Both 40% on 3pt. Sterling plays way better defense and has a little better handle.

It's going to be about fit and balance. The reason Tim occasionally falls out of the SLU is because he is a bad defender and there's no way Kidd is going to just settle for being poor defensively. JRich played himself out of the starting spot and at some point you just give up and go back to trying to outscore teams. He was terrible more than THJ was great. THj is the same player he was the year before, a super streaky 1 trick pony.

Not even sure why Maxi gets a mention. Kidd doesn't have the same attachments to this group that Rick did. It's a no brainer that DFS and Bullock are getting their fill of minutes, but Maxi and DP are going to have to earn theirs a bit more.

I don't really see them all that interchangeable at all except that they are similar sized players. Hardaway Jr, as streaky as he is, is a bona fide scoring threat while Sterling Brown is a 3&D guy. There is a huge difference in their games. What are you losing by switching them? Quite a bit actually.

Do you remember what happened last year when we were starting Luka/JRich/DFS/Maxi/KP? There wasn't enough offense in the SL and so we started games terribly and had to claw back from 1st quarter deficits almost every game. That was solved late in the season when we put THJ back into the starting lineup. Suddenly, we could actually go into the second quarter with a lead. This helped us tremendously, despite the slight downgrade of the defense.

I think you are way underrating what THJ brings to the team and overrating what Sterling can bring. I'm just not sure that a lineup of Luka/Brown/Bullock/DFS/KP will have any more scoring or shot creation than Luka/JRich/DFS/Maxi/KP and thus would have similar problems next year.

Also, I personally think the new contract we just gave THJ signals a renewed commitment to him and I think that means he will be a full time starter from here forward. It was different the last couple years because we didn't give him the contract he was on. Re-signing a guy to a big contract like we did THJ this summer IMO indicates we view him as part of the core of the team and I believe that that commitment implies an expectation that THJ will be a starter for the foreseeable future. Sure if he regresses or trades are made, things can change, but until that happens, I believe the intention is for him to start and play big minutes.

That said, again, I just think THJ is a better fit in the starting lineup anyway. Luka/THJ/Bullock/DFS/KP seems more balanced IMO. That's a good mix of scoring and defense if KP can get back to being a decent rim protector.