GDT: 4-1-2010 Magic versus Mavs 7 p.m. central - Page 10 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

Windmill360 · 04-01-2010, 09:40 PM

Sorry but ths year the champ belongs to orlando or the cavs. U can tell they want it bad

CadBane · 04-01-2010, 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jleefilled

true...not sure how anyone can blame Carlisle for using JJ having seen the results. Barea has played great.

Actually no. He SHOT great, which is a rarity. He also dribbled around like a chicken with his head cut off, didn't create for anyone but himself, turned it over, and caused horrible defensive problems by putting Kidd on Carter.

He played a bad floor game, but he shot fantastic. Unfortunately the former is a constant and the latter is an outlier.

LonghornDub · 04-01-2010, 09:40 PM

Most impressive.

pkdumas · 04-01-2010, 09:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sefant77

Dwight no single foul. Other teams are smarter and take him into foultrouble...

Jump shooting team. Not athletic enough. It looks good when it works, but it doesn't work enough for the playoffs.

pkdumas · 04-01-2010, 09:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadBane

Actually no. He SHOT great, which is a rarity. He also dribbled around like a chicken with his head cut off, didn't create for anyone but himself, turned it over, and caused horrible defensive problems by putting Kidd on Carter.

He played a bad floor game, but he shot fantastic. Unfortunately the former is a constant and the latter is an outlier.

And your analysis of Beaubois?

Dirkadirkastan · 04-01-2010, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Windmill360

U can tell they want it bad

Well crap, if only we had known that's all it took.

CadBane · 04-01-2010, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pkdumas

And your analysis of Beaubois?

Oh Booby had an awful game, no question. Still, I trust him over JJB more times than not. And Roddy doesn't cause the CONSTANT defensive issues JJB causes us everytime he steps on the floor.

conjurer · 04-01-2010, 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pkdumas

Thank you for noticing.

Say hello to your lover Hollinger from me then, I'll refuse to hate.

particleman · 04-01-2010, 09:46 PM

I wish Carlisle had played Booby with Kidd a little tonight.

LonghornDub · 04-01-2010, 09:47 PM

I'll partially disagree with CB on JJB, as I thought he had a fine game. That said, I'll completely agree on the Dirk thing. An absolutely befuddling decision by Carlisle.

kg_veteran · 04-01-2010, 09:47 PM

Some nights, the other team is just hitting all their shots, and you aren't. This was one of those nights.

pkdumas · 04-01-2010, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by conjurer

Say hello to your lover Hollinger from me then, I'll refuse to hate.

Comedy attempt fail.

conjurer · 04-01-2010, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kg_veteran

Some nights, the other team is just hitting all their shots, and you aren't. This was one of those nights.

Agreed.

kg_veteran · 04-01-2010, 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

I'll partially disagree with CB on JJB, as I thought he had a fine game. That said, I'll completely agree on the Dirk thing. An absolutely befuddling decision by Carlisle.

What befuddles me is why he can't figure out a rotation with 7 games to go. I know they played last night, and it showed, but I hate the fact that he is playing Beaubois primarily in lieu of Kidd instead of with him.

conjurer · 04-01-2010, 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pkdumas

Comedy attempt fail.

Huh? I was dead-serious.

DevinHarriswillstart · 04-01-2010, 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kg_veteran

Some nights, the other team is just hitting all their shots, and you aren't. This was one of those nights.

I think it was a little more than that...Butler is not a good fit for this team so far. Awful, awful game.

Usually Lurkin · 04-01-2010, 09:50 PM

If Beaubois had gone 9 for 11 from 3, we mighta had a chance on this one.

pkdumas · 04-01-2010, 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadBane

Oh Booby had an awful game, no question. Still, I trust him over JJB more times than not. And Roddy doesn't cause the CONSTANT defensive issues JJB causes us everytime he steps on the floor.

When Kidd isn't playing, JJB > Beaubois. At least JJB at least tries to act like a PG. Don't get me wrong I'm psyched for Beaubois, but at the moment he is another undersized SG. I wouldn't expect Beaubois to turn into a great PG.. Tony Parker looked like a PG at Booby's age.

LonghornDub · 04-01-2010, 09:51 PM

Seven combined points from Marion and Butler. That is simply not going to get it done.

pkdumas · 04-01-2010, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

I think it was a little more than that...Butler is not a good fit for this team so far. Awful, awful game.

Gotta agree. Was he really that good before? Never saw him much. I thought we were getting an athletic player. He's another jump-shooter. I'll still take him for Howard though.

chumdawg · 04-01-2010, 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadBane

Actually no. He SHOT great, which is a rarity. He also dribbled around like a chicken with his head cut off, didn't create for anyone but himself, turned it over, and caused horrible defensive problems by putting Kidd on Carter.

He played a bad floor game, but he shot fantastic. Unfortunately the former is a constant and the latter is an outlier.

You are becoming a caricature of yourself. Which is certainly saying something.

FINtastic · 04-01-2010, 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pkdumas

When Kidd isn't playing, JJB > Beaubois. At least JJB at least tries to act like a PG. Don't get me wrong I'm psyched for Beaubois, but at the moment he is another undersized SG. I wouldn't expect Beaubois to turn into a great PG.. Tony Parker looked like a PG at Booby's age.

Glad someone here said what I've been thinking as of late. I don't have much hope that Roddy is going to magically morph into a great point guard. He just strikes me as an undersized shooting guard.

kg_veteran · 04-01-2010, 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

I think it was a little more than that...Butler is not a good fit for this team so far. Awful, awful game.

I think that it really was mostly just running up against a hot-shooting Magic team, and not being able to hit anything they normally make. Dwight Howard definitely impacts the game in the middle (I particularly thought he hurt Shawn Marion's game near the basket tonight), but I don't fear this Magic team at all. If the Mavs can shoot even a decent percentage, I think they beat this team in a series.

That said, I can't really disagree with you about Butler at this point. He's not really a SG -- he's a SF. He's better at pretending to be a SG than Howard was, but that doesn't make him a SG. I'd really like to see Carlisle go to a 3 forward rotation with Dirk, Marion, and Butler, because I think that would help solve most of the problems (of course, it would require a three guard rotation with Kidd/Terry/Beaubois).

kg_veteran · 04-01-2010, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

Seven combined points from Marion and Butler. That is simply not going to get it done.

On 2-13 shooting. The team shot 38%, and a bunch of the misses were shots they normally make. They just couldn't hit the broad side of the barn tonight (except for Barea, and Nowitzki and Terry soldiered through as best they could).

GermanDunk · 04-01-2010, 09:58 PM

post game thread open

kg_veteran · 04-01-2010, 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINtastic

Glad someone here said what I've been thinking as of late. I don't have much hope that Roddy is going to magically morph into a great point guard. He just strikes me as an undersized shooting guard.

Which is why it blows my mind that Carlisle will try (at this late stage in the season) to take a guy who is a pretty dynamic undersized shooting guard (at least this year) and make him into the backup PG.

Nuts. Just let him play backup SG for however many minutes you're going to play him.

jleefilled · 04-01-2010, 10:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

I think it was a little more than that...Butler is not a good fit for this team so far. Awful, awful game.

Carlisle/Kidd has got to work to get Butler more involved on the offensive end. Are there simply not enough shots to go around?

CadBane · 04-01-2010, 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

You are becoming a caricature of yourself. Which is certainly saying something.

Chum, please enlighten me.

Like I said, JJB shot GREAT. With that kind of shooting, it's a good game, regardless.

But here's the facts.

He had 2 turnovers and 1 assist. A lot of times JJB was dribbling into the lane and had absolutely no idea what he wanted to do. None. He would either dump it to Damp (who we know doesn't know what to do with it), or throw it back to the perimeter.

We had poor ball movement with JJB and no one was set-up.

Also, on defense, Kidd was forced to guard Carter. Carter just used Kidd. That's not really JJB's fault, but RC's for playing the 3 G lineup.

What do you disagree with?

JJB kept us in it with his shooting. But he isn't going to shoot that well most nights.

kg_veteran · 04-01-2010, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jleefilled

Carlisle/Kidd has got to work to get Butler more involved on the offensive end. Are there simply not enough shots to go around?

Caron looks like he doesn't want to shoot right now. He had plenty of opportunities with the ball in his hands tonight, but he either turned it over or took a tentative shot.

chumdawg · 04-01-2010, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kg_veteran

Which is why it blows my mind that Carlisle will try (at this late stage in the season) to take a guy who is a pretty dynamic undersized shooting guard (at least this year) and make him into the backup PG.

Nuts. Just let him play backup SG for however many minutes you're going to play him.

What do you mean, "make him into the backup PG"? That's certainly not what I see. Far from it, actually.

jleefilled · 04-01-2010, 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadBane

Actually no. He SHOT great, which is a rarity. He also dribbled around like a chicken with his head cut off, didn't create for anyone but himself, turned it over, and caused horrible defensive problems by putting Kidd on Carter.

He played a bad floor game, but he shot fantastic. Unfortunately the former is a constant and the latter is an outlier.

outlier or not, if bringing a team back from a 16 to 18 point deficit to striking distance isn't "played" great, I'm not sure what is.

Now, if RC played a little more Dirk in the fourth quarter maybe we wouldn't be having this conversation.

FINtastic · 04-01-2010, 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kg_veteran

Caron looks like he doesn't want to shoot right now. He had plenty of opportunities with the ball in his hands tonight, but he either turned it over or took a tentative shot.

Definitely noticed it a time or two late in the game where he passed up decent looks. He seems to be going through a bit of a mini-slump right now that he needs to break out of.

kg_veteran · 04-01-2010, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadBane

Chum, please enlighten me.

Like I said, JJB shot GREAT. With that kind of shooting, it's a good game, regardless.

But here's the facts.

He had 2 turnovers and 1 assist. A lot of times JJB was dribbling into the lane and had absolutely no idea what he wanted to do. None. He would either dump it to Damp (who we know doesn't know what to do with it), or throw it back to the perimeter.

We had poor ball movement with JJB and no one was set-up.

Also, on defense, Kidd was forced to guard Carter. Carter just used Kidd. That's not really JJB's fault, but RC's for playing the 3 G lineup.

What do you disagree with?

JJB kept us in it with his shooting. But he isn't going to shoot that well most nights.

Vince Carter is a streak shooter. Kidd and Butler defended him pretty well on just about every possession in the 4th. He just made shots.

I hate the 3 guard lineup, but Barea was one of the few guys out there making something happen. He's still Fool's Gold, but the Mavs were going down tonight. Let's not pretend like playing him hurt.

kg_veteran · 04-01-2010, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

What do you mean, "make him into the backup PG"? That's certainly not what I see. Far from it, actually.

Who did Beaubois come in for in the 1st half?

chumdawg · 04-01-2010, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadBane

Chum, please enlighten me.

Like I said, JJB shot GREAT. With that kind of shooting, it's a good game, regardless.

But here's the facts.

He had 2 turnovers and 1 assist. A lot of times JJB was dribbling into the lane and had absolutely no idea what he wanted to do. None. He would either dump it to Damp (who we know doesn't know what to do with it), or throw it back to the perimeter.

We had poor ball movement with JJB and no one was set-up.

Also, on defense, Kidd was forced to guard Carter. Carter just used Kidd. That's not really JJB's fault, but RC's for playing the 3 G lineup.

What do you disagree with?

JJB kept us in it with his shooting. But he isn't going to shoot that well most nights.

The reason you are becoming a caricature of yourself is this "chicken with its head cut off" and "no idea what to do" business. If you can't see him running our set plays, then you are just blind. If you can't see him getting penetration, then you are just blind. You can talk about his physical limitations on the defensive end all you like, and not be wrong about it, but if you see a guy on the offensive end who doesn't know what he is doing, then you are either doing a bit or you just simply don't know what's going on yourself. Barea is cashing an NBA paycheck because he's a cerebral player.

One of his turnovers should probably have been a blocking foul on Orlando, as you know. And if you will recall, that possession resulted from Barea's own steal. If he had a "bad floor game," I'd like to see a good one! Hell, he played off guard and stood around in the corner half the time anyway.

kg_veteran · 04-01-2010, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINtastic

Definitely noticed it a time or two late in the game where he passed up decent looks. He seems to be going through a bit of a mini-slump right now that he needs to break out of.

I don't think he's a very efficient offensive player even when he's playing well, but we definitely need him to be taking shots he's comfortable with and shooting with confidence. If he's not going to shoot when he's open, he's a liability on offense.

CadBane · 04-01-2010, 10:10 PM

*wrong quote*

chumdawg · 04-01-2010, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kg_veteran

Who did Beaubois come in for in the 1st half?

Not saying he isn't going to get minutes there sometimes. We've got all kinds of guys playing out of position when coach is trying to put the most effective lineup there. But clearly Carlisle doesn't like him at the backup PG. When he went off against the Dubs, he played the two exclusively, and you saw tonight just how much Carlisle liked him at the one.

CadBane · 04-01-2010, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

The reason you are becoming a caricature of yourself is this "chicken with its head cut off" and "no idea what to do" business. If you can't see him running our set plays, then you are just blind. If you can't see him getting penetration, then you are just blind. You can talk about his physical limitations on the defensive end all you like, and not be wrong about it, but if you see a guy on the offensive end who doesn't know what he is doing, then you are either doing a bit or you just simply don't know what's going on yourself. Barea is cashing an NBA paycheck because he's a cerebral player.

One of his turnovers should probably have been a blocking foul on Orlando, as you know. And if you will recall, that possession resulted from Barea's own steal. If he had a "bad floor game," I'd like to see a good one! Hell, he played off guard and stood around in the corner half the time anyway.

Chum, it was definitely a good game for JJB. I'm not questioning that. But I stand by what I said. When he wasn't shooting the ball, he didn't look like he knew what he wanted to do. Lots of time he dribbles with no purpose or penetrates with no purposes and ends up dumping it to Damp or just throwing it back to the perimeter. He looked fine when he was creating his own shot, but he looked lost trying to create for others.

chumdawg · 04-01-2010, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadBane

Chum, it was definitely a good game for JJB. I'm not questioning that. But I stand by what I said. When he wasn't shooting the ball, he didn't look like he knew what he wanted to do. Lots of time he dribbles with no purpose or penetrates with no purposes and ends up dumping it to Damp or just throwing it back to the perimeter. He looked fine when he was creating his own shot, but he looked lost trying to create for others.

Who was he going to create for, tonight? He made two or three nice passes to Damp, who if that was Nash to Amare it would have been dunked all over some Orlando pumpkin head. He can't finish for him.

Who else? Did you see a bunch of guys slashing to the basket? What, he didn't do a good enough job setting Terry up for a contested three?

He set Dirk up in the post a couple times. That's what he's supposed to do, isn't it?

I'm just trying to get a mental image of what you expect from our backup PG out there.