12-17-2008, 11:10 PM
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#1
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Old School Balla
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 13,097
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alby
You saying Erica has special needs? She's one of the more educated posters on this board IMHO.
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I think his sarcasm detector is malfunctioning.
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12-17-2008, 11:09 PM
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#2
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Member
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 16,054
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Quote:
Also, I know the Mavs have to make sure they get in the playoffs to begin with, but Dirk is playing wayyy too many minutes still. He must be averaging smth around 39-40 in the last 10 games. That is not good any way you see it. He needs his legs to be an effective jump shooter. I don't want him to run out of gas when he really needs it.
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I just dpon't believe that mentality. Dirk actually needs to play 38-40 minutes. Dirk is better with more minutes than with less minutes (IMO).
Look at 05-06
He averaged 38.1 minutes a night. But in the last two months of the season he averaged 39.6 minutes in 25 games. And he was outstanding in the playoffs. Dirk is a rhythm player. And lack of minutes makes him cold.
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12-17-2008, 11:13 PM
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#3
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,030
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bayliss
I just dpon't believe that mentality. Dirk actually needs to play 38-40 minutes. Dirk is better with more minutes than with less minutes (IMO).
Look at 05-06
He averaged 38.1 minutes a night. But in the last two months of the season he averaged 39.6 minutes in 25 games. And he was outstanding in the playoffs. Dirk is a rhythm player. And lack of minutes makes him cold.
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He was also 29, he will be 32 in the playoffs this year. And he is coming from a summer in which he played two olympic tournaments. Those minutes catch up sooner or later, I'd like to see his minutes handled the way the Spurs do with Duncan. And the thing is, with Bass on board for this season at least we have a player who can do a good job of covering for him for 15 minutes or so.
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12-17-2008, 11:22 PM
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#4
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Old School Balla
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 13,097
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Quote:
Originally Posted by endrity
He was also 29, he will be 32 in the playoffs this year.
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Actually, he'll be 30 until June 19. If he turns 31 and the Mavs are still playing, I don't think we'll be complaining about his minutes!
Quote:
And he is coming from a summer in which he played two olympic tournaments. Those minutes catch up sooner or later, I'd like to see his minutes handled the way the Spurs do with Duncan. And the thing is, with Bass on board for this season at least we have a player who can do a good job of covering for him for 15 minutes or so.
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I agree with Bayliss on this point. It seemed to backfire on Avery in 06-07 when he tried to rest Dirk toward the end of the season. Dirk needs his regular minutes to stay in rhythm. I think he's playing a tad bit too much right now, but I think as Josh gets healthier you'll see him drop back down into the 36-38 minute range.
I think the key for Dirk in terms of rest is that they need to get him a solid rest in the 1st half and then a short rest in the late 3rd/early 4th if they can. If they do that, he never seems to show any signs of fatigue.
i
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12-18-2008, 08:59 AM
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#5
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Close to the Arctic Circle
Posts: 6,161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bayliss
I just dpon't believe that mentality. Dirk actually needs to play 38-40 minutes. Dirk is better with more minutes than with less minutes (IMO).
Look at 05-06
He averaged 38.1 minutes a night. But in the last two months of the season he averaged 39.6 minutes in 25 games. And he was outstanding in the playoffs. Dirk is a rhythm player. And lack of minutes makes him cold.
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Fixed. He shouldn't get around 42 minutes night in night out, but 39-40 is fine for me. As you wrote, he needs to stay in his rhythm, otherwise he gets cold. Thus I don't like it to see him on the bench for more than 6 minutes like yesterday. Better two breaks of three minutes instead.
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"Vaikeneminen on kultaa puhuminen hopeaa, hiljaisuutta tahdon julistaa."
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the former." (Albert Einstein)
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12-17-2008, 11:18 PM
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#6
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Member
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 16,054
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Quote:
He was also 29, he will be 32 in the playoffs this year. And he is coming from a summer in which he played two olympic tournaments. Those minutes catch up sooner or later, I'd like to see his minutes handled the way the Spurs do with Duncan. And the thing is, with Bass on board for this season at least we have a player who can do a good job of covering for him for 15 minutes or so.
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He will be 31 at the end of June. He is not an old man. As for Duncan versus Dirk. You can handle Duncan that way because he isn't a shooter. There is nothing about his shooting that requires "rhythm"... Dirk on the other hand needs a feel for the game. Minutes and touches require that.
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12-17-2008, 11:28 PM
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#7
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Guru
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 11,806
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Hey monty55555...glad you had a blast at the game! Nice recap.
I agree with Bayliss too. Dirk has said before he hates taking substantial rests in the games or taking games off, he is totally dependent on keeping his rhythm. And I pretty much agree with KGs plan of rest. You just generally need to get him rest near the end of the first or some kind of stretch after the first break in the 2nd...then come back in to finish the half. Find a stretch somewhere in the last part of the 3rd/early 4th and then let him roll the rest of the way.
Last edited by BGMaverick9; 12-17-2008 at 11:29 PM.
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12-17-2008, 11:30 PM
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#8
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 3,687
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anybody who dresses up like a bat... clearly has issues
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12-17-2008, 11:42 PM
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#9
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Member
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 16,054
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Carlisle should take Dirk out the last minute of the 3rd quarter. Then rest him a minute or two of the 4th quarter. But during those 3 minutes it is IMPERATIVE that he have Howard/Terry/Kidd in there. You can rest the other guys some other time but in truth they might not need it.. (Especially Terry who comes off the bench anyway.)
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12-18-2008, 03:56 PM
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#10
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 19,413
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bayliss
Carlisle should take Dirk out the last minute of the 3rd quarter. Then rest him a minute or two of the 4th quarter. But during those 3 minutes it is IMPERATIVE that he have Howard/Terry/Kidd in there. You can rest the other guys some other time but in truth they might not need it.. (Especially Terry who comes off the bench anyway.)
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This is the most underrated part of having Howard healthy. Sure, the Kidd-Barea-Terry-Dirk-Whoever lineup is great, and who knows, maybe Howard wouldn't have helped us in those situations...
But having Howard out there when Dirk or Terry is resting is invaluable.
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12-18-2008, 01:56 AM
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#11
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,113
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dammit wecaoniddmab891
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12-18-2008, 02:00 AM
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#12
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 2,069
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So how does Bosh feel about joining his hometown team that he grew up cheering and loving? It might be great, if he actually grew up that way.
"I just wanted to play in the NBA," Bosh said. "Back then with the Mavericks, it wasn't like the Celtics or the Bulls, to be honest. I don't think there were a lot of kids in Dallas [saying] 'I'm going to grow up and play for the Mavericks one day.' "
Years of ineptitude tend to erode the wow factor for a young fan base.
The Mavericks will have interest in the 24-year-old Bosh if he becomes a free agent. They will have interest in all free agents in the hopes of pairing a young set of legs (or perhaps two sets) with Dirk Nowitzki, who will be 32 in 2010.
Said Bosh of someday being a Maverick: "I'm not sure, maybe when I'm real old and almost out of the league. You never know. I'm sure they're going to have people on their free-agent list. It's just something you got to pay attention to when the time comes."
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12-18-2008, 06:25 PM
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#13
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Guru
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 11,806
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dim499
Said Bosh of someday being a Maverick: "I'm not sure, maybe when I'm real old and almost out of the league. You never know. I'm sure they're going to have people on their free-agent list. It's just something you got to pay attention to when the time comes."
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Haha, at least he was honest about it.
That seemed like a polite way of saying, I doubt they can fit me in the budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by alby
If Green wants to play, he needs to change his mentality. Become a shut-down defender, and coaches will have to play you. He has the athleticism and the length, take advantage of it on the defensive side of the ball.
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I agree, but...WHAT exactly does Wright need to do to get some friggin' playing time on the court?
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12-18-2008, 06:26 PM
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#14
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,938
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BGMaverick9
Haha, at least he was honest about it.
That seemed like a polite way of saying, I doubt they can fit me in the budget.
I agree, but...WHAT exactly does Wright need to do to get some friggin' playing time on the court?
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Hit some jumpers.
__________________
"He's coming off the bench aggressive right away, looking for his shot. If he has any daylight, we need him to shoot the ball. We know it's going in."
-Dirk Nowitzki on Jason Terry, after JET's 16 point 4th quarter against the Pacers.
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12-18-2008, 06:47 PM
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#15
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Guru
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 11,806
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grndmstr_c
Hit some jumpers.
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True...but I'm usually the kind of guy who would have the philosophy to let it play out with the guy, basicall Let him work it out on the court. Now if he's just not showing anything in practice, then I understand not giving him time. But if he's holding up ok and just not getting time, that can mess with confidence and rhythm. I'd just let him learn in game situations and go through the growing pains, have a decent leash on him...but not super tight.
Yeah the 3PT % is drastically different between George and Wright but I like what versatility he can bring offensively and really not have a dramatic drop on defense.
He actually brings another facet to the Mavs offense: a guy who can attack the rim/paint with some consistency. Most people on the board get excited when Josh attacks the basket, that's because he just doesn't do it enough. Wright is athletic enough to get in there and alter his shot mid-air based on what the defender does. He's also savvy enough to dish it out if there is an open man and it's a better shot than what he has going.
Wright needs minutes, it just might need that impending George injury for it to happen.
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12-18-2008, 02:53 AM
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#16
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Guru
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Cowboys Country
Posts: 23,336
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When Bosh is "real old and almost out of the league," I'm sure he will visit several different NBA locales.
Ungrateful SOB.
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12-18-2008, 03:10 AM
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#17
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 17,873
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For what it's worth, sounds like the team thinks very highly of George's defense. Howard went to far as to specifically credit George for the win tonight:
http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont...e.3c91724.html
__________________
John Madden on Former NFL Running Back Leroy Hoard: "You want one yard, he'll get you three. You want five yards, he'll get you three."
"Your'e a low-mentality drama gay queen!!" -- She_Growls
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12-18-2008, 10:23 AM
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#18
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: North Laredo
Posts: 7,995
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LonghornDub
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George is a total beast on D.
Like i have said many times before, he is very under appreciated here.
__________________
"Dirk Nowitzki is now a household name in every locker room in this world.
You say it in Brazil, you say Dirk, they know Nowitzki. You say it in China,
they know Nowitzki. Kobe, Michael, DIRK." - Jeff Van Gundy
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12-18-2008, 12:39 PM
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#19
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Robot Hell, NJ
Posts: 9,574
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick41
George is a total beast on D.
Like i have said many times before, he is very under appreciated here.
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Coaches seem to think a lot more of George than fans do.
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12-18-2008, 01:00 PM
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#20
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: North Laredo
Posts: 7,995
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dirno2000
Coaches seem to think a lot more of George than fans do.
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I'll take the coaches opinion over the fans.
__________________
"Dirk Nowitzki is now a household name in every locker room in this world.
You say it in Brazil, you say Dirk, they know Nowitzki. You say it in China,
they know Nowitzki. Kobe, Michael, DIRK." - Jeff Van Gundy
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12-18-2008, 04:19 PM
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#21
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,214
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick41
I'll take the coaches opinion over the fans.
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"Well that's just, like, your opinion, man..."
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12-18-2008, 03:19 AM
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#22
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,938
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The compliments on DG's defense were good to see. I missed the first half of the game and only got to watch portions of the second half. I didn't really see much of the George/Bosh matchup. But as long as he's on the team I want him contributing. Even if he is irritating occasionally.
I share the longing for Wright to get back into the lineup, btw. Though it's important that he start making shots. For all the bellyaching about DG's offense, he's been more efficient than Wright, whose efg% on jumpers coming into tonight was a putrid .284. To Aontine's credit, a lot of his fga's come inside, and that's why I want him out there, but damn.
__________________
"He's coming off the bench aggressive right away, looking for his shot. If he has any daylight, we need him to shoot the ball. We know it's going in."
-Dirk Nowitzki on Jason Terry, after JET's 16 point 4th quarter against the Pacers.
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12-18-2008, 08:45 PM
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#23
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Old School Balla
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 13,097
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grndmstr_c
The compliments on DG's defense were good to see. I missed the first half of the game and only got to watch portions of the second half. I didn't really see much of the George/Bosh matchup. But as long as he's on the team I want him contributing. Even if he is irritating occasionally.
I share the longing for Wright to get back into the lineup, btw. Though it's important that he start making shots. For all the bellyaching about DG's offense, he's been more efficient than Wright, whose efg% on jumpers coming into tonight was a putrid .284. To Aontine's credit, a lot of his fga's come inside, and that's why I want him out there, but damn.
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That's the key. None of the wing players except George is shooting worth a darn.
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12-18-2008, 04:42 AM
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#24
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,113
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I like Shawne Williams. Anyone else?
He needs to develop offensive consistency though.
I like the little things he does on the glass and on D though.
Our role players seem so... "meh".
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12-18-2008, 05:15 AM
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#25
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Platinum Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,113
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I still wanna see a little more out of Dirk. JUST a little more, in particular in the FTA department.
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12-18-2008, 09:15 AM
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#26
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Golden Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Dallas
Posts: 1,118
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Did you guys notice Damp tried to hit another baseline shot from about 10 ft away from the basket? I'm sure he can hit those he just doesn't have the confidence. I never liked Damp but this season he is playing with something else. I think its called heart?
I no longer have a problem with DG anymore. he needs to keep playing like this
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12-18-2008, 10:05 AM
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#27
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,674
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YEAH!
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12-18-2008, 12:00 PM
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#28
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 5,048
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Overall it was a very good game and an amazing fourth quarter. I would still like to see us bring in an offensively capable center, though. Kaman would be the ideal candidate but I wouldn't mind seeing a Diop/Stackhouse for Brad Miller trade if we couldn't get anything better.
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''Nowitzki'' is a German word that, translated, means, ''Good Lord, doesn't this guy ever miss?''
-Miami paper on Dirk Nowitzki
Last edited by Dirkenstien; 12-18-2008 at 12:07 PM.
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12-18-2008, 12:09 PM
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#29
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Diamond Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,856
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Agree with Kidd, the slow start could be attributed to having Kidd, Damp and George all on the floor at once for the first 7-9 minutes. Kidd at least has to control the offense, set people up early on, get people gonig early. I think Kidd feels fine because the W is all that matters, but in the long run, if Jet and Dirk's pick and roll are shut down, is there a 2nd option? That's what all great teams have that 2nd option to go to, Kidd needs to working on something.
Anyone notice the box scores, says Barea got a DNP.
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/boxscore?gid=2008121728
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12-18-2008, 12:13 PM
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#30
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
Posts: 18,721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kidd Karma
Agree with Kidd, the slow start could be attributed to having Kidd, Damp and George all on the floor at once for the first 7-9 minutes. Kidd at least has to control the offense, set people up early on, get people gonig early. I think Kidd feels fine because the W is all that matters, but in the long run, if Jet and Dirk's pick and roll are shut down, is there a 2nd option? That's what all great teams have that 2nd option to go to, Kidd needs to working on something.
Anyone notice the box scores, says Barea got a DNP.
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/boxscore?gid=2008121728
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NBA.com had given Barea's minutes to Wright last night as well. Weird.
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12-18-2008, 12:15 PM
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#31
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Rooting for the laundry
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 21,342
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Ah man...so wait...what were Barea and Wright's real minutes last night?
I didn't get to see any of the game, I was busy. But I checked on my phone and saw that Wright played a bunch and that Barea had like 1:55 or something. I was pleased, but now I guess I was sadly misinformed...
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12-18-2008, 12:31 PM
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#32
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
Posts: 18,721
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Wright did not play.
Last edited by jthig32; 12-18-2008 at 12:32 PM.
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12-18-2008, 12:52 PM
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#33
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Guru
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: uranus
Posts: 13,478
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Yeah, also FSN showed C Bosh's face on the Nets logo instead of DHarris' when they did the upcoming games and featured players coming up. Wierd.
Green must be F ing up in practice or just not getting it. Sucks, all that ability.
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12-18-2008, 12:54 PM
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#34
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Guru
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 15,241
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If Green wants to play, he needs to change his mentality. Become a shut-down defender, and coaches will have to play you. He has the athleticism and the length, take advantage of it on the defensive side of the ball.
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12-18-2008, 01:09 PM
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#35
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Guru
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: uranus
Posts: 13,478
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alby
If Green wants to play, he needs to change his mentality. Become a shut-down defender, and coaches will have to play you. He has the athleticism and the length, take advantage of it on the defensive side of the ball.
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I'm not sure what his mentality is but I agree that he needs to be defensive minded to get in to the rotation. Still kinda sucks tho.
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12-18-2008, 08:52 PM
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#36
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Lazy Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lazytown
Posts: 18,721
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Wright just needs to stop shooting threes. He gets to the basket well enough that he deserves to be on the floor.
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12-18-2008, 09:22 PM
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#37
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 17,873
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I think it's funny how ultimately Rick is doing the exact same thing many chided Avery for--playing veterans like DG over young talented guys.
Not saying I don't like Rick--I do like him a lot. Just humorous.
__________________
John Madden on Former NFL Running Back Leroy Hoard: "You want one yard, he'll get you three. You want five yards, he'll get you three."
"Your'e a low-mentality drama gay queen!!" -- She_Growls
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12-18-2008, 09:34 PM
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#38
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Golden Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,546
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LonghornDub
I think it's funny how ultimately Rick is doing the exact same thing many chided Avery for--playing veterans like DG over young talented guys.
Not saying I don't like Rick--I do like him a lot. Just humorous.
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Except Devean George is actually playing well. Avery would play guys like Juwan Howard despite their crap play.
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12-18-2008, 09:52 PM
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#39
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 17,873
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Caseman
Except Devean George is actually playing well. Avery would play guys like Juwan Howard despite their crap play.
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Juwan hardly played at all last season.
But, I agree that DG is playing pretty well. I'm not saying it's a bad choice to play him.
__________________
John Madden on Former NFL Running Back Leroy Hoard: "You want one yard, he'll get you three. You want five yards, he'll get you three."
"Your'e a low-mentality drama gay queen!!" -- She_Growls
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12-19-2008, 05:23 AM
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#40
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Guru
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Denton, TX
Posts: 10,386
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LonghornDub
Juwan hardly played at all last season.
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He definitely played more than I wanted to see him. I remember seeing him on the floor with Dirk, with Damp and Diop on the bench and just hanging my head in disbelief.
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