Offseason 2010 Thread - Page 11 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

Rick41 · 05-30-2010, 09:36 AM

Hedo fell off from his days with the Magic... no thank you to him.

Underdog · 05-30-2010, 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobatundi

I don't think Hedo is that good. He's a nice player, but I don't see him as a #2.

Um, yeah... Butler > Hedo.

Nowitzki4President · 05-30-2010, 10:01 AM

I just meant him as a Najera... Not a Butler or Marion.

Underdog · 05-30-2010, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nowitzki4President

I just meant him as a Najera... Not a Butler or Marion.

Hedo = $44mil

Najera = $5.4mil

We'll just end the discussion there...

Rick41 · 05-30-2010, 10:19 AM

A bit off topic but here is a remix of the Lebron song from www.lebrontothemavs.com by The Dallas String Quartet. It will be airing on the Ben and Skin show later on today... very awesome stuff. (i'm a very big fan of the violin and such related instruments)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6QTjZ...ayer_embedded#!

If this doesn't catch LeBron's attention to seriously consider Dallas then I don't know what else we can do...

Nowitzki4President · 05-30-2010, 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

Hedo = $44mil

Najera = $5.4mil

We'll just end the discussion there...

But isn't he asking for a release? Wouldn't that void his current contract?

grndmstr_c · 05-30-2010, 11:12 AM

I've been thinking about Hedo since the news broke, and the only scenario I've been able to come up with (admittedly not having tried very hard) that might have any appeal and that doesn't involve Bosh is this:

1) the Mavs keep Booby
2) they manage to work a trade involving Butler that brings them back an upgrade at SG (say JJ for argument's sake)
3) they trade JET+Carroll to Toronto for Hedo+Banks.

Then, assuming Wood re-signs, and leaving Damp, JJB and the MLE completely out of the picture to keep things simple, you'd be looking at:

Kidd/Booby
JJ/Booby
Marion/Hedo
Dirk/Hedo
Wood

as your top 7 in the rotation. Not a big talent infusion by any means, but it makes much better sense positionally than the current roster, I think, and you've still got assets available to do some more tweaking.

EricaLubarsky · 05-30-2010, 01:59 PM

Hedo is a strong Horry-type player. He may be a nice topper piece but he's not a guy you are going to pursue if you are that far from a championship team and he's definitely got a lot working against him as far as salary and position are concerned. He earns too much and plays the same positions that Dirk, Marion and Butler all play (3/4)

Dirkadirkastan · 05-30-2010, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobatundi

I don't think Hedo is that good. He's a nice player, but I don't see him as a #2.

He sounds perfect.

sefant77 · 05-30-2010, 06:36 PM

Hedo? No defense Hedo? 30 year old Hedo with 40/4 contract left?

Combine with Kidd and Barea and some Dirk? Just great....

lol

sike · 05-30-2010, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick41

If this doesn't catch LeBron's attention to seriously consider Dallas then I don't know what else we can do...

win in the playoffs?

grndmstr_c · 05-30-2010, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Hedo is a strong Horry-type player. He may be a nice topper piece but he's not a guy you are going to pursue if you are that far from a championship team and he's definitely got a lot working against him as far as salary and position are concerned. He earns too much and plays the same positions that Dirk, Marion and Butler all play (3/4)

I actually wouldn't have any problem pairing Hedo up with Dirk. If you're looking for someone to carry the scoring load when Dirk's resting Caron's probably the better choice, but as one of the few guys in the league who can boast legitimate point forward skills and instincts Hedo might provide a better overall fit playing next to Dirk (and Kidd and Marion, for that matter).

Not that I'd swap Caron straight up for him, mind you. Their respective trade values aren't close to comparable thanks to the deal Dallas helped Hedo get last summer. And I agree completely that as long as both Caron and Marion are here there's simply no room for another 3/4 in the rotation.

tcat075 · 05-30-2010, 08:34 PM

Yeah, hell no on Hedo. Don't need another perimeter jump shooter. Give me someone who'll finish strong, block some shots, play hard defense. As Dirk's backup, that's what we need.

Rick41 · 05-30-2010, 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sike

win in the playoffs?

We've done plenty of that post '06.

Thomas86 · 05-30-2010, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grndmstr_c

I've been thinking about Hedo since the news broke, and the only scenario I've been able to come up with (admittedly not having tried very hard) that might have any appeal and that doesn't involve Bosh is this:

1) the Mavs keep Booby
2) they manage to work a trade involving Butler that brings them back an upgrade at SG (say JJ for argument's sake)
3) they trade JET+Carroll to Toronto for Hedo+Banks.

Then, assuming Wood re-signs, and leaving Damp, JJB and the MLE completely out of the picture to keep things simple, you'd be looking at:

Kidd/Booby
JJ/Booby
Marion/Hedo
Dirk/Hedo
Wood

as your top 7 in the rotation. Not a big talent infusion by any means, but it makes much better sense positionally than the current roster, I think, and you've still got assets available to do some more tweaking.

I wouldn't be mad at that trade at all....Terry needs to go no matter what because I'm tired of his now show's in the playoffs plus to open more playing time for Roddy, Hedo when he WANT'S to be is almost unstoppable with his size and ability to put the ball on the floor.

nowhereman · 05-30-2010, 10:53 PM

Hedo isn't unstoppable. He's just kinda old. Trading for a 31 year old SG is a big negative in my book.

grndmstr_c · 05-30-2010, 11:07 PM

Since when is Hedo a SG? He's a SF.

And if you want to talk about SGs in their 30s, Terry will be a 33 year old shooting guard when next season starts.

Rick41 · 05-31-2010, 01:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grndmstr_c

Since when is Hedo a SG? He's a SF.

And if you want to talk about SGs in their 30s, Terry will be a 33 year old shooting guard when next season starts.

But until Terry is traded, we have no choice.

xrobx · 05-31-2010, 10:16 AM

i absolutely positively do NOT want turkey glue on the mavs, he is not the answer, he sucked last year

KINGBEEF · 05-31-2010, 12:07 PM

one month left...

i'm putting 3/4 on Lebron coming to dallas.

& the remaining 1/4 on Iggy and Dalembert coming to dallas.

which means with both of these scenarios, Damp will be gone and Carlisle will get booed opening day no matter what happens.

grndmstr_c · 05-31-2010, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick41

But until Terry is traded, we have no choice.

That's sort of the point. As long as you're not trading young for old (which JET for Turk obviously would not be), you're not making your team older - at least in the short term - regardless of how old the guy coming back is.

While I'm at it, a note on Turk's numbers last year. He dropped off in three areas that I can see: minutes, field goal attempts per minute, and free throws per field goal attempt (for context, in the latter category he ranked even with Carlos Boozer and Josh Smith this season). On the other hand, his scoring efficiency and assists-per-minute showed held steady, his rebounds-per-minute went up, and his TO-rate (both per-minute and calculated relative to his fgas and assists) went down. Put it together, and you can make the case that the decline in his productivity last year was symptomatic of something other than age-induced suckage.

Not that there aren't reasonable caveats to that suggestion. For one thing, even assuming that the dropoff was due to something other than age, that doesn't necessarily mean it should be any less concerning; and the fact that there are similarities between the reports floating around about Hedo's situation with the Raps and some things that may have gone on with JHo and the Mavs isn't exactly comforting. Another thing worth noting is that Hedo's numbers from 07/08 were even better than his numbers in his last year with the Magic, so you could argue that the fall-off of last year was a continuation of a trend towards a decline in productivity rather than an isolated blip on the radar.

For my part, as long as he doesn't get sidetracked by chemistry/integrity issues, I think we're seeing fluctation around a mean productivity level on the order of 13-14 points on 54% true shooting with 5 rebounds, 4.5 assists, and a 2:1 or better assist:TO ratio in about 32 mpg. That's not a guy I'm looking at to deliver the team a championship, but it's not somebody I have a problem acquiring as long as there's a spot in the rotation for him (which there isn't right now) and the price is fair (the JET/Carroll proposal I mentioned above strikes me as being that).

dude1394 · 05-31-2010, 01:45 PM

the raps look dysfunctional. Probably will remain so until bosh leaves and they get to start over. He's probably as much distraction as help right now. No one thinks he's there for the long haul and I expect everyone takes their cue from that.

thebesteva_22 · 05-31-2010, 07:50 PM

I Want Iggy here for the starting 2G, Terry has to GO.

Thespiralgoeson · 05-31-2010, 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thebesteva_22

I Want Iggy here for the starting 2G, Terry has to GO.

Iggy's really a 3, but I see where you're coming from. I wonder what it would take to get Iggy. If we could get him without giving up Roddy, I'd call that a home run. Throw in Dalembert and it's a grand slam.

If neither Lebron nor Wade wind up in Dallas (and I don't think they will), my ideal Plan B would be to Iggy and JJ for any combination of Damp&Butler + filler.

JKidd
JJ
Iggy
Dirk
Haywood

That starting five isn't necessarily overwhelming, but I think it would certainly be good enough to be a legit contender, especially with Roddy as our sixth man.

sefant77 · 05-31-2010, 09:09 PM

God, thats gonna be awful long 4 weeks....good luck in 2 weeks start the world cup

xrobx · 06-01-2010, 12:18 AM

i don't want iggy, he's overrated imo, never averaged over 20 ppg in a season and his scoring has decreased the last couple years and this is being the primary scorer on one of the worst teams in the nba, i'm not even sure he would be an improvement over butler

dalembert sucks too

Thespiralgoeson · 06-01-2010, 08:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xrobx

i don't want iggy, he's overrated imo, never averaged over 20 ppg in a season and his scoring has decreased the last couple years and this is being the primary scorer on one of the worst teams in the nba, i'm not even sure he would be an improvement over butler

Please tell me you're kidding. He's light years ahead of Butler in terms of passing, defense, and slashing (not to mention that he's four years younger.) He would be pretty major improvement over Butler in several areas that we are glaringly weak in(so much so that I can't believe I'm even having to make this post.)

Quote:

dalembert sucks too

xrobx · 06-01-2010, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thespiralgoeson

Please tell me you're kidding. He's light years ahead of Butler in terms of passing, defense, and slashing (not to mention that he's four years younger.) He would be pretty major improvement over Butler in several areas that we are glaringly weak in(so much so that I can't believe I'm even having to make this post.)

no, i'm not kidding, obviously you're thinking of iggy from a couple years ago and not todays iggy, he rarely slashes and cuts to the basket anymore, all he does is jack up jumpers and three pointers. look at his three point attempts compared free throw attempts and you'll see that. he led the league in minutes played last season and his numbers still weren't that good. he's a great defender.... when he feels like getting motivated to play hard. even 76ers fans know he's overrated and want him shipped out of town and know he makes WAY more money than he's worth, why should we have to take on their damaged goods?

of course i know you already have your mind made up so i'm not expecting to convince you or anything. i just hope it doesn't happen for all of our sakes.

maybe check out this recent article and the comments below and see how they feel about him over there in philly? http://www.philly.com/inquirer/sport...#axzz0pbny4lKN

Underdog · 06-01-2010, 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xrobx

no, i'm not kidding, obviously you're thinking of iggy from a couple years ago and not todays iggy, he rarely slashes and cuts to the basket anymore, all he does is jack up jumpers and three pointers. look at his three point attempts compared free throw attempts and you'll see that. he led the league in minutes played last season and his numbers still weren't that good. he's a great defender.... when he feels like getting motivated to play hard. even 76ers fans know he's overrated and want him shipped out of town and know he makes WAY more money than he's worth, why should we have to take on their damaged goods?

of course i know you already have your mind made up so i'm not expecting to convince you or anything. i just hope it doesn't happen for all of our sakes.

maybe check out this recent article and the comments below and see how they feel about him over there in philly? http://www.philly.com/inquirer/sport...#axzz0pbny4lKN

Iggy had better stats across the boards than Butler and his lack of "competitive edge" can probably be attributed to the fact that he plays for the friggin' '6ers.

The article also has this to say:

Quote:

"Iguodala plays well against Kobe Bryant, or more specifically, that young kid has a lot of talent" - Phil Jackson

Oh, but the author thinks this is a conspiracy against the 76ers head coach, so whatever...

dude1394 · 06-01-2010, 10:06 AM

Interesting places for the dirkster to go if he goes. The rest of it's sorta weird pablum that's unformed. But the rockets (with Adleman) and Miami (with Riley on board) are interesting places for me if I'm the dirkster.
http://www.onlinebasketballbetting.n...dirk-nowitzki/

Houston has the front line of Yao/Battier to really make it easier on his defensively and Adleman I think is a great coach.
Riley with diva also looks like a great spot for him.
New York is ridiculous...sure he'd like to play there if Wade/Lebron was there..

But I liked the Houston/Miami scenrio. Don't like ti at all for a fan, but for the dirkster it looks intribuing.

dude1394 · 06-01-2010, 10:09 AM

I think iggy is more suited for a 2 than caron for sure. Although I must admit to not knowing about his handles, his assists are higher than Carons and he's about 20 pounds lighter.

Underdog · 06-01-2010, 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

Interesting places for the dirkster to go if he goes. The rest of it's sorta weird pablum that's unformed. But the rockets (with Adleman) and Miami (with Riley on board) are interesting places for me if I'm the dirkster.
http://www.onlinebasketballbetting.n...dirk-nowitzki/

Houston has the front line of Yao/Battier to really make it easier on his defensively and Adleman I think is a great coach.
Riley with diva also looks like a great spot for him.
New York is ridiculous...sure he'd like to play there if Wade/Lebron was there..

But I liked the Houston/Miami scenrio. Don't like ti at all for a fan, but for the dirkster it looks intribuing.

Is Dirk so used to getting ousted in the first round that he wouldn't mind more of it in Houston?

Also, Wade joining Dallas is a much better team than Dirk joining Miami...

Rick41 · 06-01-2010, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude1394

Interesting places for the dirkster to go if he goes. The rest of it's sorta weird pablum that's unformed. But the rockets (with Adleman) and Miami (with Riley on board) are interesting places for me if I'm the dirkster.
http://www.onlinebasketballbetting.n...dirk-nowitzki/

Houston has the front line of Yao/Battier to really make it easier on his defensively and Adleman I think is a great coach.
Riley with diva also looks like a great spot for him.
New York is ridiculous...sure he'd like to play there if Wade/Lebron was there..

But I liked the Houston/Miami scenrio. Don't like ti at all for a fan, but for the dirkster it looks intribuing.

Houston is going to go hard for Bosh.

www.houston4bosh.com

SMC0007 · 06-01-2010, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick41

Houston is going to go hard for Bosh.

www.houston4bosh.com

This is proof... Because Rocket fans built a site?

Usually Lurkin · 06-01-2010, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

Is Dirk so used to getting ousted in the first round that he wouldn't mind more of it in Houston?

Also, Wade joining Dallas is a much better team than Dirk joining Miami...

Except that Wade and Dirk are 2 of the players in the league who are probably most aware of how hard it will be to win a ring on a team owned by Mark Cuban.

dude1394 · 06-01-2010, 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

Is Dirk so used to getting ousted in the first round that he wouldn't mind more of it in Houston?

Also, Wade joining Dallas is a much better team than Dirk joining Miami...

To be fair...I'm not so sure they've done more of it than Dallas has, certainly not more of it when favored.