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Old 09-14-2022, 12:08 AM   #1481
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What if Luka and Brunson didn't get along all that well off the court? Or simply Brunson wanted his shot to run an offense as the main initiator? I don't buy into the Mavs wanting to be cheap. But I certainly can't sit here and assume stuff without also wondering those two things. There's so much that goes into a decision like this and in the end, best of luck to Brunson.
Agree. I think Brunson wanted a chance to run the show, and that was never going to happen here. People also forget his various deficiencies, mainly size. Had the Mavs kept him for maybe 4/80, I think that would have been fine. More than that, likely overpaying. I also think Dinwiddie will take up much of the production that Brunson had (and is taller and a better defender), AND we got Christian Wood too. It wasn't nearly as bad an offseason as all the pundits keep saying.
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Old 09-14-2022, 12:09 AM   #1482
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I would?ve definitely gone over the Knicks offer. Not sure I?d go all the way to 30m. The Knicks deal is descending so I guess we probably could?ve done the same, so it starts at let?s say 29.5 and becomes better as it goes on. If I?m Cuban, I do ANYTHiNG to make sure Luka doesn?t leave. If we kept Brunson with Wood and McGee added we are serious contenders if everything breaks right and we have all picks to trade again soon. Now we need to find a guy who replaces what JB brought instead of basically being a two way larger wing away from complete. Brunson AND Siakam or someone like him, though I maybe prefer a better shooter than Pascal we probably won?t be in a position to be choosy.
Have that guy on our roster already: Dinwiddie. Everyone seems to forget he made a very similar playoff run for the Knicks two years ago. He might well just be a taller, better defending Brunson.
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Old 09-14-2022, 09:35 AM   #1483
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Have that guy on our roster already: Dinwiddie. Everyone seems to forget he made a very similar playoff run for the Knicks two years ago. He might well just be a taller, better defending Brunson.
Dinwiddie is close enough to JB, but the problem I see is they've talked about SD starting alongside Luka. I'm not sure who comes off the bench in that case, we really don't have a proven reliable back up floor general. They're going to have to get tricky with rotations

With Wood not starting, it makes it even more interesting. One of those starting guards will likely come off for rest when Wood comes in. So SD runs point with Wood or Luka stays on for a few more mins. I think it's a stupid idea to bring Wood off the bench period, then adding SD to the SLU makes things even more confusing.
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Old 09-14-2022, 09:49 AM   #1484
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Have that guy on our roster already: Dinwiddie. Everyone seems to forget he made a very similar playoff run for the Knicks two years ago. He might well just be a taller, better defending Brunson.
no one forgot about him. he was great as a third ball handler. now that hes the second best ball handler on the team, whos going to fill his spot from last year off the bench?

lets not forget his limitations either. hes does not have the consistency of brunson, but hes a very solid ball handler/creator to have.
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Old 09-14-2022, 10:52 AM   #1485
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I think Schroder is playing his way into a contract the Mavs can't offer/beat, unfortunately. He'd be perfect, but I don't think we can compete with teams that have space or can offer a larger amount and/or years.
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Old 09-14-2022, 11:14 AM   #1486
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I mean, no joke, any injury to Luka/Spencer = Jaden Hardy. That's not really fair to Hardy or the team because he isn't a pg. Next option is Frank, also not a pg.
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Old 09-14-2022, 12:18 PM   #1487
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I mean, no joke, any injury to Luka/Spencer = Jaden Hardy. That's not really fair to Hardy or the team because he isn't a pg. Next option is Frank, also not a pg.
And its not far fetched at all. Even with brunson/spence, luka was still a high percentage which, I guarantee he will be gassed by the end of this season. Schroeder is our best bet. Bledsoe can be had for the vet min imo, hes coming off an achilles injury, although its not a torn achilles.

Outside of those two, I think a trade has to happen at the deadline.
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Old 09-14-2022, 12:35 PM   #1488
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Hardy fills the Trey Burke role of coming in to give you quick points when you need them. That's perfect for him.

Frank fills in the 2/3 role of playing great defense on opposing guards/forwards. Perfect role for him.

But that 3rd ball handler is totally vacant. Schroder makes the most sense, but I'd be fine with someone like Bledsoe too.
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Old 09-14-2022, 01:53 PM   #1489
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What can we realistically offer Shroder? If he's not about money, he should like the opportunity and playing time with the Mavs to set up for a longer term contract before he turns 30.
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Old 09-14-2022, 03:36 PM   #1490
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What can we realistically offer Shroder? If he's not about money, he should like the opportunity and playing time with the Mavs to set up for a longer term contract before he turns 30.
1) Money? Nope. We can only offer min unless we can arrange a SnT and we dont have much in the terms of assets. Is he worth a FRP to get a team to get him here? Powell and a FRP to get him at 10/year? Do you do that?

2) Pt? Kinda? Luka is likely to play the same MPG. Dennis can take Jalen's 16mpg, but it's also expected that SD will up his minutes by 6-10MPG a game so that's like 10mpg for Dennis. If SD and Luka keep the same MPG, then we can only offer 16mpg.

Not sure if 10-16mpg will be good for someone who averaged 27mpg last year.
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Old 09-14-2022, 03:59 PM   #1491
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It's true, and considering how we handled the Dragic situation...welp...

But Schroder is also a lot more productive and younger than Dragic at this stage. Why WOULDN'T you play him is the real question? And Kidd helped get the best Schroder on the floor with his Lakers time.
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Old 09-14-2022, 08:30 PM   #1492
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Is DJ Augustin still available? He?s a ball handler who shoots a high percentage from 3. I assume his defense is pretty shitty though.
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Old 09-15-2022, 10:51 PM   #1493
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Even if we get Schroder I just don't see any viable path to us winning a championship not just this upcoming season but period until we can totally reboot this roster. I know we made the Western Conference Finals but I honestly thought we looked like one of the worst Conference Finals teams I'd ever seen and didn't belong there. I'm not going to say we got lucky against the Suns we earned that and it was a great moment but I think it was similar to Golden State beating us in 2007 when we were the #1 seed a huge upset, problem is every year there's going to be teams like them the Warriors the Bucks the Nets the Clippers the Celtics the Sixers the Heat and you will have to knock off more than one of them to win it all probably at least two good Western Conference teams and one Eastern Conference team in the Finals and we're not really on their level it would be the biggest upset of all time and Luka would be in instant GOAT status instantly surpassing Dirk for us to even win one championship with this flawed roster. Sometimes teams make more and more progress so you might think Conference Finals was last year so Finals will be this year but you will just be disappointed. Just look at the Hawks another surprise team to make that made the Eastern Conference Finals a year ago and weren't contenders this past year and couldn't get out of the first round. Heck the Hawks got better this offseason with the acquisition of Dejounte Murray and although we added Wood we lost Brunson.

I'm sure this will just come across as negative but I just call it like I see it. It seems like every other superstar has found a way to pair up with another superstar but that's not going to happen here with Luka unless we somehow strike gold in the draft as free agency is always a disappointment and I know I've never heard of a Conference Finals team that has no real trade assets at all outside of our superstar. With Dirk we were able to build a team through trades to get several stars although past or towards the end of their prime to surround Dirk a solid roster from top to bottom with one superstar but we're really no where close to that happening here. I hope Luka doesn't leave us one day to team up with some other star but it wouldn't shock me.

I'm also a Cowboy fan but it's the same thing the fans think every year they're going to win the Super Bowl like the glory days but it's not really close to happening. I already knew better before the disaster against the Bucs. At least the Mavs can make it once to the Conference Finals unlike the Cowboys.

Not accusing anyone on this forum of saying we're going to win it all, but even MJ and Brady needed good teammates.

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Old 09-16-2022, 09:40 AM   #1494
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Yea, I have the feeling that the Mavs FO is betting on a big rebound from Dinwiddie and for Wood to take the next step. I honestly could see the latter as an All-Star, but that's a big if...

Given they have Luka locked up for a while, it's something they seem comfortable with, though not a gamble I would take with one of Luka's prime years. Weird to say prime when he's so young, but these supernova stars have a shine that lasts longer...

I still have a gut feeling they are going to ride into the season with what they have (only change would be to add a ballhandler) and be aggressive in the trade market.
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Old 09-16-2022, 09:55 AM   #1495
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I think the season could go either way, but I'm not really getting the negativity.

If we get the Wood from two seasons ago that averaged 21 ppg, then it's not only filling in for Brunson, it's exceeding it. How many bigs shoot 50% from the field whilst also shooting 39% from three? And if you can Schroder, then you are objectively better in almost every way than last year's team.

Funny because I really liked Brunson and loved his consistency, but he is officially being overrated now by too many fans.
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Old 09-16-2022, 01:50 PM   #1496
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I think the season could go either way, but I'm not really getting the negativity.

If we get the Wood from two seasons ago that averaged 21 ppg, then it's not only filling in for Brunson, it's exceeding it. How many bigs shoot 50% from the field whilst also shooting 39% from three? And if you can Schroder, then you are objectively better in almost every way than last year's team.

Funny because I really liked Brunson and loved his consistency, but he is officially being overrated now by too many fans.
Here's my less than optimistic view,,,another year of Luka's high usage will wear him down over the long run. (this year and career wise)

my biggest worry other than ballhandler is that it doesnt sound like Wood will be starting. Im hoping the staff realizes before the season starts. He's looking for one last big contract. I think he will ball out but theyve already told mcgee hes starting. It remains to be seen how that goes.
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Old 09-16-2022, 02:17 PM   #1497
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Here's my less than optimistic view,,,another year of Luka's high usage will wear him down over the long run. (this year and career wise)

my biggest worry other than ballhandler is that it doesnt sound like Wood will be starting. Im hoping the staff realizes before the season starts. He's looking for one last big contract. I think he will ball out but theyve already told mcgee hes starting. It remains to be seen how that goes.
Wood not starting would be astoundingly stupid and won't work after 20 games anyway.

And Schroder is the literal key to keeping Luka fresh later in the season. Some don't think he would make a big impact, but he surely would if Luka or Spencer went down just like what Brunson did in the first round.
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Old 09-16-2022, 05:03 PM   #1498
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Yep, called it. I said if Schroder doesn't sign with the Lakers and that's exactly what he did. Fail.
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Old 09-16-2022, 05:42 PM   #1499
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Wood not starting would be astoundingly stupid and won't work after 20 games anyway.

And Schroder is the literal key to keeping Luka fresh later in the season. Some don't think he would make a big impact, but he surely would if Luka or Spencer went down just like what Brunson did in the first round.
Yeah I was going with the now, if they picked up Dennis I would be more than satisfied regarding his usage and rest, and think they?re almost the same as previous year, maybe better.

Alas, Mavs won?t be getting Dennis. Ugh
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Old 09-16-2022, 05:45 PM   #1500
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1 year 2.6 mill?

Even on vet min, lakers will always win out on FA over other cities.
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Old 09-16-2022, 06:42 PM   #1501
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Old 09-16-2022, 08:06 PM   #1502
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Wood is possibly going to be held back by a wild ass decision to not start him. The projected rotation and SLU is the the dumbest thing imaginable for this team IMO. They are severely over thinking this. The only worse decision regarding the roster would be starting all the bench players.
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Old 09-16-2022, 08:12 PM   #1503
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So Schroder picked the Lakers over the Raptors and Suns. We weren't even in the convo.

Yikes.
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Old 09-16-2022, 08:42 PM   #1504
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So Schroder picked the Lakers over the Raptors and Suns. We weren't even in the convo.

Yikes.
Even after our FO watched him play in Eurobasket.
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Old 09-17-2022, 12:21 AM   #1505
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Luka was just picked the best player in the entire NBA under 25.

I'm pretty sure Patrick Maholmes won that honor in NFL and everybody wants to play with him, but no one seems to care less about playing with Luka. I think it's some kind of stigma with the Dallas Mavericks we won a championship no one but fans and Lebron haters cared, there's also that Luka is usually highest usage in the league stars don't want to watch someone else take over the game. We're pretty much screwed unless you're happy with 2nd round exists at best. Don't expect us back in the Conference Finals with this roster.
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Old 09-17-2022, 02:48 AM   #1506
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I?m still not so sure Dorsey can?t elevate to the next level. He has the maturity and credentials to make an impact this season.

I still think their plan is to go with what we have and see if Hardy, Dorsey, Green, and/or Frank can break the rotation and become somewhat of a factor.
Then dangle a combination of them in a package with Powell and/or THJ around the TDL to address a dire need.
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Old 09-17-2022, 12:58 PM   #1507
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Luka was just picked the best player in the entire NBA under 25.

I'm pretty sure Patrick Maholmes won that honor in NFL and everybody wants to play with him, but no one seems to care less about playing with Luka. I think it's some kind of stigma with the Dallas Mavericks we won a championship no one but fans and Lebron haters cared, there's also that Luka is usually highest usage in the league stars don't want to watch someone else take over the game. We're pretty much screwed unless you're happy with 2nd round exists at best. Don't expect us back in the Conference Finals with this roster.
That's an extremely pessimistic take. Frankly I think our roster is better than the one last year- although the rest of the West got better too, so I don't necessarily expect us to make the conference finals again either.

Personally I don't think our lack of free agent success has anything to with Luka's usage rate or a "stigma" about the Mavs. I think it's the simple fact that there are only three actual free agent destination cities in the NBA- New York, LA, and Miami. That's it. You don't see free agents lining up to go to Philly or Chicago or Houston either. Look at Cleveland. They had Lebron for 11 years and they could never attract anyone either.

And you can't compare the NFL to the NBA. You just can't. Of course everyone wants to play with a great QB. That doesn't translate in basketball. This isn't a Luka thing. It's a basketball thing. Every fan wants to think that other players are just dying to play with their superstar, but that's just not true. "Get to play with such and such" is hardly ever the motivating factor that fans seem to think it is.
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Old 09-17-2022, 01:07 PM   #1508
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That's an extremely pessimistic take. Frankly I think our roster is better than the one last year- although the rest of the West got better too, so I don't necessarily expect us to make the conference finals again either.

Personally I don't think our lack of free agent success has anything to with Luka's usage rate or a "stigma" about the Mavs. I think it's the simple fact that there are only three actual free agent destination cities in the NBA- New York, LA, and Miami. That's it. You don't see free agents lining up to go to Philly or Chicago or Houston either. Look at Cleveland. They had Lebron for 11 years and they could never attract anyone either.

And you can't compare the NFL to the NBA. You just can't. Of course everyone wants to play with a great QB. That doesn't translate in basketball. This isn't a Luka thing. It's a basketball thing. Every fan wants to think that other players are just dying to play with their superstar, but that's just not true. "Get to play with such and such" is hardly ever the motivating factor that fans seem to think it is.
Are we championship contenders yes or no? If the answer is no, you agree with me or you're just pessimistic too.
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Old 09-17-2022, 01:12 PM   #1509
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That's an extremely pessimistic take. Frankly I think our roster is better than the one last year- although the rest of the West got better too, so I don't necessarily expect us to make the conference finals again either.

Personally I don't think our lack of free agent success has anything to with Luka's usage rate or a "stigma" about the Mavs. I think it's the simple fact that there are only three actual free agent destination cities in the NBA- New York, LA, and Miami. That's it. You don't see free agents lining up to go to Philly or Chicago or Houston either. Look at Cleveland. They had Lebron for 11 years and they could never attract anyone either.
I agree his take is pessimistic, but you also can't mention Cleveland and Dallas in the same sentence like they are the same city in the same situation. DFW is the fourth largest metro area in the country now with a high profile owner. At some point you can't keep making excuses as to why players don't want to play here.

I understand Schroder wanting to play in LA, but I also wonder how interested the Mavs even were. I mean, if they gave him the "Dragic" offer, then of course he wouldn't come here.

It still comes down to a simple fact though. An injury to Luka or Dinwiddie could put us into the lottery real quick. We need an insurance guard. Period.
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Old 09-17-2022, 01:44 PM   #1510
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Nobody really can debunk what I say just call me pessimistic, yet no one is willing to say we're contenders either. So maybe some think we're slightly better than I do but ultimately the goal is winning a championship we have a 24 year old who's career will probably surpass Dirk yet no one realistically thinks we're contenders. So you may be more optimistic than me to an extent, but you know the deal we're not going to beat at least 3 great teams and win a title with this roster. You cannot win a title with one great player and a bunch of average players when there's 8-10 better teams than you that's just common sense. So congratulations for thinking we might can get back to the Conference Finals, but probably wouldn't even bet a lot of money on that either.

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Old 09-17-2022, 01:52 PM   #1511
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Because you're being too simple-minded about it. How many thought we were contenders before last season? We made it to the WCF after losing KP and Luka suffering an injury to start the Jazz series. Nobody could have predicted that.

We just don't know. Maybe we are play-in, maybe we are top 4. Could easily go either way depending on many variables.
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Old 09-17-2022, 02:40 PM   #1512
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When you tell people what they don't want to hear, they'll do anything to fight with you, that applies to anything in life.
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Old 09-17-2022, 03:35 PM   #1513
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Are we championship contenders yes or no? If the answer is no, you agree with me or you're just pessimistic too.
Yes, we are contenders until proven otherwise.

We initially didn't think we were contenders last season and then started clicking at the right time.

We aren't favorites by any means, but we are one addition away from that level of team. Obviously you have to prove it... like Phx and a few other paper contenders.
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Old 09-17-2022, 03:46 PM   #1514
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When you tell people what they don't want to hear, they'll do anything to fight with you, that applies to anything in life.
IMO, the thing people don't want to hear is a severely black and white approach when not a single game has been played. Lol. The rest is just your opinion/projection. I can go as far as agreeing that we don't look like favorites to win a championship, but last year is the lastest reminder
and proof that you need games played to understand what you're even looking at. Right now, You have zero evidence to suggest such a drastically different opinion than what we did last year.
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Old 09-17-2022, 05:49 PM   #1515
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That's what is interesting about this board is the variety of opinions.
There are pessimists and optimists and those in between.

I personally think we addressed some of our issues (rebounding and interior D) from last season and Dinwiddie could very well make up for the loss of Brunson. If Brunson was our primary playmaker, it would be one thing (like losing Nash). But we have the best playmaker in the league who is only getting better so all we need is a secondary playmaker and I'm not so sure we don't already have that in Dinwiddie. So it seems to me that we may only need a 3rd option playmaker and I'm fine with trying out some of the young guys on our current roster. I'd rather try that at first than give up assets for players that might not provide much more.

I lean more toward the optimist side because we are more balanced. The question will be if we can stay healthy and if the rest of the team can collectively step it up a bit.

We easily have the trade pieces to go out and get an adequate third option playmaker imo. That person doesn't necessarily need to be the 2nd best player on this team which is what I think some on this board are expecting. Luka is good enough to carry a very strong supporting cast and as long as the others collectively step up and at least live up to expectations, we should be a legit contender for a top 4 seed.
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Old 09-17-2022, 06:10 PM   #1516
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It still comes down to a simple fact though. An injury to Luka or Dinwiddie could put us into the lottery real quick. We need an insurance guard. Period.
I agree with this and feel Bledsoe could be that piece.
As I mentioned in another post, I'm fine with grooming a young player to fill the insurance role, but Bledsoe would be immediate insurance.

I also think we need legit traditional sized insurance at center.
Maxi and Wood (and some Bertans) are legit small ball centers so Powell is expendable imo.

Honestly, if we added Bledsoe and Dwight Howard, I think we would be set to start the season.

Luka/Bledsoe/Dorsey/Hardy
Dinwiddie/THJ/Frank/Pinson
DFS/Bullock/Green
Wood/Maxi/Bertans
McGee/Howard/Powell

Obviously, we don't have the roster spot, but I'd feel more comfortable with more veteran insurance at the 1 and 5.
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Old 09-17-2022, 11:27 PM   #1517
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When you tell people what they don't want to hear, they'll do anything to fight with you, that applies to anything in life.
Nuance is a lovely thing in life, and I mean that sincerely. Mavs started off last season as total garbage and were one of the best teams in the second half.

I think the important thing is to focus on what the FO and coaching staff are going for. Brunson will be an addition by subtraction on defense as the team will be very big now. That will almost certainly translate to better defense AND rebounding especially with the additions of Wood (his rebounding, not his D) and McGee. We do forget how bad the rebounding was. Fixing that alone would be a big step in the right direction.

So it's basically a design of Luka/Spencer running everything and a stalwart defensive surrounding them. Add in THJ and Wood for offense, and there is little to panic about. Just gotta get another handler.

I feel that this has to be their strategy because, as you said, stars/players aren't coming to play here. So you have to do something creative to make the team a contender in a different way. Worked last season. It'll just be different with a bigger lineup now and Wood's production replacing Brunson's.
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Old 09-17-2022, 11:40 PM   #1518
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I?m a little optimistic on Bertans this year.
With the addition of McGee and a training camp, he could become a useful weapon as a stretch 4.

We are stuck with him, and he can flat out shoot in the right situation, and I think being sandwiched between 2 decent defenders can let him focus on offense.

Not saying it will happen, but I think he could become much more of a factor than last season.
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Old 09-19-2022, 01:08 PM   #1519
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If the only thing that stands between Wood starting is the mavs little promise to start Mcgee, then I'd rather he not be on the team. Wood has the potential to ball the f out.

Mcgee is a solid rotational piece that would be beneficial, but not at the expense of pissing off Wood.
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Old 09-19-2022, 01:19 PM   #1520
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If the only thing that stands between Wood starting is the mavs little promise to start Mcgee, then I'd rather he not be on the team. Wood has the potential to ball the f out.

Mcgee is a solid rotational piece that would be beneficial, but not at the expense of pissing off Wood.
Well winning talks and bs walks. If Wood coming off bench doesn't equate to wins, then it won't continue.

I'm not really sure who is going to start either. Is it Luka/Spence/DFS/Kleber/Javale or Luka/Spence/Bullock/DFS/Javale?
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