Trade with Atlanta that makes since for both teams

[Walkerforthree]

Okur's rpg in his SECOND YEAR are higher then raef's near highest.

[LRB]

Okur's rpg in his SECOND YEAR are higher then raef's near highest.

And his scoring, shooting, and blocked shots are less. They're not exactly the same and each has some stats that are better than the others. But even if Okur is better than Raef, and I'm far from convinced of that, that would only mean that he's better than a player that most everyone recognizes as a spare. It would be like convincing you that I'm smarter than Charles Barkley, and then trying to say I deserve a Nobel Prize because of that.

[LRB]

Originally posted by: SeriousSummer
I agree normally you don't trade a star for potential (I reserve spare for guys, like Eddie, you know could never be stars and would never make the star for spare deal), but at some point the Mavericks (IMHO) are going to have to take a chance and trade one of their stars for a big man who only has potential.

Right now we've got one or two more stars than we need. But we don't have a solid, starting center and we need one. An established center would be better (in my terms I'd take a starter, if he is 28 or below), but we may have to take a chance on potential.

I don't know that Okur is the right guy, but we aren't getting Shaq or Duncan for anybody.

Maybe we should trade Jamison to Charlotte for the fourth pick in the draft (deal might need to be tweaked). But Shawn is all we have (unless you play Dirk there) and I think we could use some more help.

No we only need spares at center, and we don't have to trade a star to get them. We won't get a center that is going to beat Shaq or Duncan so why bother. What we have is players that can beat the Fakers and Spurs at other positons. All we need is some spares to occupy the big guys while our start take care of business. But the spares need to be the right size, meaning 6'10" + not some of the 6'8" relative midgets that we're currently using. Size does matter when playing center in the NBA.

[Dirkenstien]

Originally posted by: LRB

No we only need spares at center, and we don't have to trade a star to get them. We won't get a center that is going to beat Shaq or Duncan so why bother. What we have is players that can beat the Fakers and Spurs at other positons. All we need is some spares to occupy the big guys while our start take care of business. But the spares need to be the right size, meaning 6'10" + not some of the 6'8" relative midgets that we're currently using. Size does matter when playing center in the NBA.

I agree, all we need is some size down low that can throw their weight around, pull down some boards, provide some interior D, and atleast give the dominant big men of the league some fits. Thats all.

[Walkerforthree]

Well what do you know??? THE SPARE Okur gets a chance to start tonight, and the 1st qtr. isn't even over and this is his line:
11 points
5-6 ft's
3-3 fg
5 boards
3 blocks
1 steal

Pretty nice line for less then a qtr, by a spare [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

[LRB]

Get back to me when he scores fifty+ in a game. Wait Tony Delk did that and he's still a spare.

[Walkerforthree]

17/12/5, id take that, spare or not

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally posted by: LRB
Get back to me when he scores fifty+ in a game. Wait Tony Delk did that and he's still a spare.

hahaha LRB scores

[Walkerforthree]

Originally posted by: EricaLubarsky

hahaha LRB scores

uh, not really. I never argued a 50 point game makes you good. Hell, tracy murray has had 50, he's a spare. However, Okur does a lot of great things and will be a very good player. Of course he won't score 50. Neither has webber or dirk. Im not saying this game makes Okur great, but it shows he can score, block, board, get to the line and play d. Just watch him play a game once in awhile.

[EricaLubarsky]

I dont think the argument was about Okur being good- it was about him being a spare

[Walkerforthree]

Originally posted by: EricaLubarsky
I dont think the argument was about Okur being good- it was about him being a spare

the argument is wether he's a spare or not. Obviously we are arguing wether he's good or a spare, lol.

[jayC]

If you gave me theo and terry Id do it.
The mavs have a log jam at forward Dirk, Jamison, Walker,Najera, and know Howard.
If healthy ratliff can give what the mavs need an athletic 5 that can block shots and rebound.



As for Delk for Mihm you don't trade small for big so thats out.

[EricaLubarsky]

Originally posted by: Walkerforthree

the argument is wether he's a spare or not. Obviously we are arguing wether he's good or a spare, lol.

it must be nice to have your stats inflated by the most dominant rebounder in the league. I wonder what Raef could do there.
There has been way too much Pistons on TV and from what I have seen OKurs stats are good but his play is mediocre at best.

[LRB]

Originally posted by: Walkerforthree

the argument is wether he's a spare or not. Obviously we are arguing wether he's good or a spare, lol.

[img]i/expressions/rolleye.gif[/img]

Actually no that's not it. I've never said Okur was worthless. I've only called him a spare using the definition that if you're not a star then you're a spare. He shows promise, but he also shows some weaknesses. I'm sure that he could be a very good role playing spare. It remains to see if he can step up and be a star.

When you point out a handful of games where he has decent or even good stats that doesn't remove him from spare status. He'll need a full season of star like numbers to rid himself of the spare label. Right now he has good spare numbers, but he doesn't have star numbers.

And this all started with saying that you don't trade Jamison, who is a star, for a bunch of spares which included Okur.

If you're going to argue that's fine, but please try and keep straight what you're agruing about. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

[Walkerforthree]

lrb, you've lit a fire under Okur, another 21 so far tonight off the bench, on good shooting too.

[Nash13]

In Walkerforthree's defense, the Pistons have for centers(Wallace, Cambell, Darko, Okur). Even when they decide to play Wallace at Power Forward, they are so deep at that position, it's hard to keep quality minutes to get quality stats.

[MightyToine]

Originally posted by: SeriousSummer
Personally, I think LRB needs to break out a few more categories. So far we have three:

Star
Budding Star
Spare

I think we need at least six [examples] {definition}

Superstar [Shaq, Duncan, KG] {one of the best five or ten in the league, can take over games, can get theirs every night if they need to, Dirk is a borderline superstar, Paul Pierce is out}

Star [Ray Allen, Jamison, Allen Houston] {reliable and excellent, can start for almost any team, often good for 20 points, 10 rebounds or 8 assists, depending on their position}

Player with Potential (PP for short) [Lampe, Okur, Josh Howard] {a young player who might become a star, or who might be a spare, it's too early to tell but they show something, usually obviously neither a Superstar or Filler}

Starter [Antonio Davis, Dale Davis, PJ Brown, Juwan Howard] {a valuable player, potential is maxed out and they aren't stars, but good enough to start for most teams--but not all}

Spare [Best, Najera, Mihm] {useful, at least at times in a limited role, sometimes a "one-trick pony"--rebounder or defensive or three-point specialist, think Stacey Augmon or Steve Kerr, aspire to be a starter rather than a star, most only a starter if there are injuries or your team sucks}

Filler [Sundov, Bremer, Eschmeyer] {you gotta have 12 or 15 guys on the team, aspire to be a spare, more likely to end up in Austria or the Phillippines than the all star game}

serioussummer, What category does Walker fall into?