Small-ball era dawning in NBA - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

dirt_dobber · 05-01-2007, 01:00 PM

Small-ball era dawning in NBA
http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll...705010333/1127

Chris McCosky: Around the NBA

AUBURN HILLS -- You wonder if this is going to be the year that the transformation becomes complete. Is this year when the new era of small-ball in the NBA really commences?

It's been three years in the making. Ever since the Pistons won the title in 2004, commissioner David Stern has tweaked rules and reshaped the officials' emphases to facilitate a faster, more free-flowing game.

He has steadfastly legislated against the stingy and stodgy half-court, defense-oriented teams like the Pistons and Spurs, and to a lesser extent the Heat and the Rockets. What Stern envisions for his new NBA are teams like the Suns, the Warriors, the Nuggets, even the Bulls.

Fast, feisty, sleek, constantly running and attacking the basket and taking the scores into triple digits.

But a new era cannot commence until one of the new age teams wins a title. Is this the year?

The Suns have been the poster team of the new NBA, and with a healthy Amare Stoudemire, they are certainly looking legit. And, rising from the ashes suddenly are the Warriors, about to dispatch the 67-win Mavericks.

You think Stern is not doing a happy dance? He can barely stand the thought of a Warriors-Suns matchup in the Western Conference finals.

But, the Mavericks aren't dead yet, nor are the Spurs, and in the East, the Pistons are the last old-school team still standing.

If you ask me, I still think the old-schoolers will prevail this year. I still can't pick the Suns over the Spurs in a seven-game series (assuming the Spurs gas the Nuggets here pretty quickly), and I still say the Warriors are one Baron Davis sprained ankle away from falling back to reality.

And I truly believe these Pistons have one more title in them.

But if the revolution doesn't exactly start now, it's coming.

You know how things work in this copy-cat league. General managers are going to start looking to draft and acquire all the speed, quickness, length and athleticism they can. They are going to build their teams smaller, and they are going to build them to play fast and attack the basket.

And why not? It is almost impossible to defend dribble penetration now with the way games are being called. Why not have a bunch of slashers come off high picks with the head down and just barrel to the basket?

(The exception to this, of course, is the team that drafts Greg Oden. You can't draft him and then try to play small-ball, right? Even the Celtics wouldn't do that.)

What do you think turned the Nets' season around? It's when, almost out of desperation, they decided to scrap most of their half-court sets, put the ball in Jason Kidd's hands and told him to go to work. Look at their series with the Raptors. Once Vince Carter decided to attack the rim, the Raptors had no way to stop him.

The Warriors are taking it to the Mavericks because they have better athletes at just about every position and they are in attack-mode from first tip to final buzzer. Their superior athleticism has completely negated the consummate skill of Dirk Nowitzki.

So, teams that are in a rebuilding phase now are going to emulate that. It's a lot easier and affordable to find energetic athletes than another Nowitzki. Teams are going to pick quickness and length over size and strength. And, if the skill differential is slight, they are taking the athlete over the skill guy.

You can bet that the Heat will go that rout. They are going to unload Antoine Walker and Jason Williams. Alonzo Mourning and Gary Payton will probably retire. Then they will unload the likes of Eddie Jones and James Posey (and maybe Udonis Haslem), and surround Dwyane Wade and Shaquille O'Neal with as many athletes as they can.

But here's the key -- there still has to be a balance. You can't be one-dimensional. Sooner or later -- and it's already being done here with the Pistons -- teams are going to be able to find the right defensive scheme to counter all the dribble-driving. They are going to trap more, zone more, sag more and force you to beat them from the perimeter.

The Mavericks have tried to do that to the Warriors, but you can't just suddenly restructure your defense for one playoff series. You have to develop the zones and traps throughout the course of the season, which the Pistons have done under Flip Saunders.

Gregg Popovich has done the same in San Antonio -- with an eye on playing the Suns in the playoffs.

That's why I believe the new era's not starting just yet. I think Pistons and Spurs got one more fight left in them. Call it the rubber match.

But there is a new game on the horizon, you can feel it coming.

alexamenos · 05-01-2007, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dirt_dobber

But here's the key -- there still has to be a balance. You can't be one-dimensional. Sooner or later -- and it's already being done here with the Pistons -- teams are going to be able to find the right defensive scheme to counter all the dribble-driving. They are going to trap more, zone more, sag more and force you to beat them from the perimeter.

And they're gonna recall and re-learn that dumping the ball down low to a skilled big man is still the best offense in the game, especially when the other team doesn't have capable low post defenders....

SeattleMavsFan · 05-01-2007, 01:52 PM

good post and it's kinda sad since the Mavs created this type of game a couple years ago. Then we changed our game to be more like the Spurs or the Pistons. How ironic that Stern wants to change it now...

alexamenos · 05-01-2007, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeattleMavsFan

good post and it's kinda sad since the Mavs created this type of game a couple years ago. Then we changed our game to be more like the Spurs or the Pistons. How ironic that Stern wants to change it now...

this type of game has been around the league forever. it even had it's own league, the ABA.

there are never enough really good bigs to go around. so what you get is some teams looking for a way to speed it up while other teams try to counter them by slowing them down. meanwhile, the really good bigs keep racking up rings.

basketball is a tall man's game, everybody is out there to support the tall man.

chumdawg · 05-01-2007, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alexamenos

basketball is a tall man's game, everybody is out there to support the tall man.

The thing is, the guys people are calling "small" these days...ARE tall guys. "Small ball" is really a misnomer. What they really mean is fast and athletic.

Flacolaco · 05-01-2007, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chumdawg

The thing is, the guys people are calling "small" these days...ARE tall guys. "Small ball" is really a misnomer. What they really mean is fast and athletic.

Exactly.

Track stars

alexamenos · 05-01-2007, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flacolaco

Exactly.

Track stars

Not exactly what I was getting at -- no matter how absolutely tall the smalls may be, basketball is first and foremost a game played in the paint by the relatively tall....

Dtownsfinest · 05-01-2007, 03:08 PM

The reason small ball is having so much success now is because the teams that play small ball have a team full of athletic players who can play defense good enough to win. The Mavs team Nellie coached and Aldeman's Kings were far from athletic. They relied on jump shooting and the jump shooting was so good we nearly made it out of the WCF one year. Not to mention the Mavs never once got themselves an Amare. Not even an Amare just a guy in the paint who can score. Jamison could score at will in the paint but never was a banger.

alexamenos · 05-01-2007, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dtownsfinest

The reason small ball is having so much success now is because the teams that play small ball have a team full of athletic players who can play defense good enough to win. The Mavs team Nellie coached and Aldeman's Kings were far from athletic. They relied on jump shooting and the jump shooting was so good we nearly made it out of the WCF one year. Not to mention the Mavs never once got themselves an Amare. Not even an Amare just a guy in the paint who can score. Jamison could score at will in the paint but never was a banger.

I don't think you can really say "the reason small ball is having so much success now", emphasis on now....

some variation of small ball has always had some success....the high flying warriors in the awful thugball 90's won a few games, and the suns for that matter were very much an earlier incarnation of a team comprising a point guard and a bunch of 'tweener forwards -- they played a couple of guys (Chambers and sub) who were under 6'10 at the 5 spot and 6'5" CB at the 4 spot...that's not the world's biggest line-up.

and Paul Westphal was Mike Dan Tony long before Mike Dan Tony became the coach with three first names**....

Small ball teams aren't having more success today than ever before....they're having about the same amount of success, to wit...lot's of regular season W's, some thrilling playoff games and then a predictable dispatch from the playoffs by a quality big.

----------
as a point of fact, the '92 Phoenix Suns had a higher pace factor than the 2007 Phoenix Suns...........

rabbitproof · 05-01-2007, 03:28 PM

Make way for JJB........ your 2012 MVP.

RingTheBell · 05-01-2007, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alexamenos

----------
as a point of fact, the '92 Phoenix Suns had a higher pace factor than the 2007 Phoenix Suns...........

waiting for the "j/k'ing" before I laugh...

Gaddabout · 05-01-2007, 07:22 PM

Pace has never really been a factor in determining the success or failure of a team. Everyone ran in the 80s, including the Lakers and Celtics dynasties. The Celtics dynasties of the 60s used to run teams off the floor. Literally.

The defining factor for fast or slow pace teams has always been the boring things we tend to ignore ... fg percentage, def fg percentage, rebounding advantage, assists-to-turnovers ... winning teams tend to be efficient, especially championship teams. Strengths may vary, but these numbers tend to come together to separate the champion from the also-rans, however they may play the game.

Dirkgreatness · 05-01-2007, 08:14 PM

THE FUTURE OF THE NBA!

come_on_now · 05-02-2007, 07:05 AM

We always hear this crap in the first and second rounds. It will be forgotten after Dallas takes Game 7.

alexamenos · 05-02-2007, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RingTheBell

waiting for the "j/k'ing" before I laugh...

'92 Phoenix Suns pace factor = 99.4
'07 Phoenix Suns pace factor = 95.6

yes, the Westphal's '92 suns cranked up more shots than '07 Suns.

the league as a whole played at a faster pace back then which is part of the equation, but my general point remains -- there's absolutely nothing new about "small ball", it's been tried plenty times and it's failed just as often.

capitalcity · 05-02-2007, 10:48 AM

Gregory. Oden.

alexamenos · 05-02-2007, 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by capitalcity

Gregory. Oden.

Possibly Young Gregory Oden & Young Al Jefferson in the same front court....look out for another Bo Celts Dynasty. Bad ass front court >>>>>>> Small ball.

dalmations202 · 05-02-2007, 03:15 PM

Let me rewrite the article.

Teams are changing to a more athletic type instead of more skilled because if they can find a marketable player, then the onus is on the officials to determine the outcome of the game. If a non-athletic type player with skills takes the ball into the lane then 90-95% of the time, the more athletic defender must not have touched him and he was blocked/flopping as he goes sprawling across the floor. On the other end, from behind the play the official knows that when the athletic type player goes to the goal, that he must have been fouled by the skill player 90-95% of the time.

This way, officials can keep the games close and develop rivalry between teams by their determination of what is a foul, and when a foul is called. This way causes some players to have to become jump shooters (shooting less % shots) or they will foul out, and other players to become Superstars because they are "tough" and get to the line all the time. They can also develop marketable players, and determine who is on the front page longest. This will make more money for the league, and allow for control of the games by the commissioners office/ officials.

After all, everyone is doing it. Welcome to the NBA.

Think about it --- if player A (skill player) goes to the basket three times in a row and on play one gets an offensive foul, play two gets it stripped with no call as people slap at the ball, and on play three gets it blocked and knocked silly with no foul called --- and on the other end player B (athletic player) takes the ball to the rim three times, and gets two and 1's and a foul called on player A on the defense on the other trip, then there was a 14 point possible difference in just three possessions. **** Now player A has to start shooting jumpers or the team doesn't score and he is in foul trouble, and player B just keeps driving because he is getting the calls. When it gets to lopsided the other way, just change the calls, and call Player B for an offensive foul, and let Player A get to the rim with an And 1. Game stays close, fouls are being called basically evenly -- everyone says you shouldn't criticize the officiating because it was called both ways. Fans pay big bucks to see close games with rivals, and seats sell out. Everyone happy, until we go to international competition and get killed by teams that play team ball, and they don't have the NBA officials to "keep the games close".

Lor20 · 05-03-2007, 03:15 AM

i think its less going to smallball than to teams who have 5 players who can score. Because the game is getting more athletic every decade you need to have more than one or two options to score the big points because athletic defenders can come over to double them. The pace in general gets a bit lower because ppl get taller and stronger in the upper body and its harder to run up and down the more muscle you have to supply with oxygen.

alexamenos · 05-20-2007, 01:00 PM

bump

utah
sa
detroit
cleveland

the era of small ball

Janett_Reno · 05-20-2007, 04:59 PM

Small ball has always been around with the old Doug Moe teams and Don Nelson and yes they are excitting but in the playoffs, if they make the playoffs, they lose. The closest run and gun small ball i have seen that could almost get over the hump is Phx.

It is because Marion/Amare play much bigger than they are but in the last few mins you still have to make a stop in the paint. It will always be an embarrasing upset with a small ball team beating alot better team than they are, Dallas/GS but the next series the small ball team will lose, GS.

Phx has proved to me that they can play some defense. If they can get a stopper in the middle for the last few mins of a game, this team is the closest i have ever seen that could "maybe" get over the hump and win a title. Titles are won in the paint making layups and dunks.

alexamenos · 05-21-2007, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janett_Reno

....The closest run and gun small ball i have seen that could almost get over the hump is Phx.

It is because Marion/Amare play much bigger than they are but in the last few mins you still have to make a stop in the paint. It will always be an embarrasing upset with a small ball team beating alot better team than they are, Dallas/GS but the next series the small ball team will lose, GS.

Phx has proved to me that they can play some defense. If they can get a stopper in the middle for the last few mins of a game, this team is the closest i have ever seen that could "maybe" get over the hump and win a title. Titles are won in the paint making layups and dunks.

yeah -- the reason Phx has won a ton of games and advanced into the playoffs for the last 3 seasons isn't that they play small ball, it's that they have some incredible talent on the team. If they played a legit 5 along with Nash, Stoudemire, Marion, and Bell??? Who knows........

consider who they've beaten in the playoffs in the last three seasons--

'04
Grizz (45 w's)
Mavs (58 w's)

'05
Lakers (45 w's)
Clippers (47 w's)

'06
Lakers (42 w's)

....that's one playoff win over 50+ win team in 3 years.

If small ball doesn't work for a team this talented.....

mqywaaah · 05-21-2007, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dirkgreatness

THE FUTURE OF THE NBA!

Dude. this is just so wrong... LOL

mqywaaah · 05-21-2007, 10:34 AM

Ok... so f**k small ball!!! This isnt their year, yet. But the way I see it, their on the rise.

Henry_VIII · 05-21-2007, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mqywaaah

Ok... so f**k small ball!!! This isnt their year, yet. But the way I see it, their on the rise.

Tell that to the cat

alby · 05-21-2007, 08:03 PM

Small ball or run and gun teams are increasing but they will never amount to anything. They will be fun to watch and there will be teams that will make the playoffs every year but SA and Det are the types of teams that owners want to have but can't, so they go for the alternative.