2019 Mavs Free Agency - Page 12 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

Me.B · 02-26-2019, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Yeah, I should have said that he might sign elsewhere other than Orlando or Dallas.

I am excited about him and there's definitely some smoke there, but don't want to get my hopes up, particularly after the reports of the Mavs having little interest and lots of teams having huge sums of money to throw around. I think he's going to have lots of suitors and with maybe only 25-30mill to throw around, we may decide to split that money or to go after a more pressing need.

The Spurs will likely be suitors for Vucevic. They were trying to get in the market for Porzingis so it would make sense that they would make a play for Vucevic. Aldridge is free after this season so if they decide to move on from him Vuc would make a logical replacement.

Melonhead · 02-26-2019, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sefant77

Never ending rebuild in Orlando, never made the playoffs in seven years. New GM who drafted Bamba as his replacement.

Why should he stay except for the nice weather?

I mean I think Dallas is on the way up, but you could say almost the same thing for Dallas. And its in the stacked West.

Me.B · 02-26-2019, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sefant77

No one cares about the Nets, even in Brooklyn. The branding failed...the arena is a dark sad black hole.

He is going to be a hero in NY just bringing the Knicks back into the playoffs, maybe 2nd round...

They have the money to spend (he said he’s looking to get paid) and they have a young star PG already on the team in Russell. They are further along in the rebuilding process than the Knicks. I don’t see KD leaving a perennial championship favorite to sign with a rebuilding team and being the only star there. The Knicks do have room for 2 max players but there are better options out there for the legit max players like KD, Kawhi, Klay, and Kyrie.

Kawhi is destined for the Clippers, and Klay likely resigns with the Warriors. Kyrie also likely stays in Boston or heads to the Lakers with AD. That leave KD and no other max level players for the Knicks to sign. With that being the case Brooklyn is a better option for him. There is also a chance that if Golden State can find a trade for Draymond that they will resign both Klay and KD.

The most likely scenario for the Knicks is that they miss out on all the top free agents and end up maxing out Boogie and Tobias Harris.

Melonhead · 02-26-2019, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sefant77

No one cares about the Nets, even in Brooklyn. The branding failed...the arena is a dark sad black hole.

He is going to be a hero in NY just bringing the Knicks back into the playoffs, maybe 2nd round...

The nets have become a fun team to watch this season. I love D'angelo.

thewizard · 02-26-2019, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sefant77

Cant see Dragic walking away from his 19m player option...he is turning 33 in may, he wont see this money again. Either as a FA in 2020 for small money or a trade with Lee and filler if he is unhappy in Miami and they are ready to move on in the backcourt

Honestly I think most people's fascination with Dragic is mainly because he's Slovenian and close to Luka. He's 33 so doesn't fit the timeline and he isn't the bulldog defender Cuban has talked about needing.

But that said, if we strike out on our preferred targets I wouldn't mind giving him a DeAndre deal, ie have him opt out and give him the 1 year 19 million or whatever he has left on his contract.

If we can't secure any long term back court pieces I wouldn't mind gathering up the Friends Of Luka and just having a fun year and then rolling the dice again in 2020.

sefant77 · 02-26-2019, 03:13 PM

Wont work like Jordan....he isnt going to opt out without a promise (like we gave Jordan through backchannels) and we wont give him such a promise.

I think he is going to opt in and if the Heat are MAYBE looking to move on from him we trade him for Lee and some filler.

Him and Luka know how to play together, he is a friend, he is a veteran (we are going to need those if Dirk retires and Barea isnt back on the court)...pretty much the Devin Harris role.

SMC0007 · 02-26-2019, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigDog63

Still don't get the impetus to bring Dragic here.

Help me understand how he wouldn't have the exact same issues with role that DSJ had, please.

I can't justify it in the long term fit and there isn't much difference statistically I rekon. If he were available on the cheap it would bring in an experienced player who doesn't bog the game down and do boneheaded things the DSJ does. You also don't get the diva "let me run the team or I bitch my way out". You would be banking on him playing up to the level of his surrounding teammates level. It's more about intangible differences than statistical. He knows how to play offense and doesn't rely on athleticism alone.

I don't think anyone sees Dragic as a high priority must get.

Me.B · 02-26-2019, 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thewizard

Honestly I think most people's fascination with Dragic is mainly because he's Slovenian and close to Luka. He's 33 so doesn't fit the timeline and he isn't the bulldog defender Cuban has talked about needing.

But that said, if we strike out on our preferred targets I wouldn't mind giving him a DeAndre deal, ie have him opt out and give him the 1 year 19 million or whatever he has left on his contract.

If we can't secure any long term back court pieces I wouldn't mind gathering up the Friends Of Luka and just having a fun year and then rolling the dice again in 2020.

The Mavs do still have the $25 mil trade exception in their pocket. Now I’m not exactly sure how it works but I’ve heard people say that it’s only useful to the Mavs if they were working as an over the cap team.

Maybe someone can help me out with this. Can the Mavs use all their cap space on free agents (on Vucevic, Middleton, or whoever and resigning Maxi and DFS) then once Dragic opts in they use the trade exception (or part of it) to trade for him. Maybe also sending Courtney Lee to Miami.

Cuban and Donnie have made it clear that their window/timeline is now. They want to compete as soon as possible and have no interest in stacking this team with super young lottery picks. So they are going to need/want vets. I seriously doubt that JJ or Harris will be back so they are going to need a veteran PG. Dragic fits that mold (for at least 1 year). Then in the 2020 off season the Mavs will have his money, Powell’s money coming off the books.

sefant77 · 02-26-2019, 09:02 PM

The TE reduces the cap space on july 1st. So if we dont use the TE until june 30th we are going to waive the TE. Doesnt work like you wrote it

Underdog · 02-26-2019, 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sefant77

The TE reduces the cap space on july 1st. So if we dont use the TE until june 30th we are going to waive the TE. Doesnt work like you wrote it

July 1st, 2020 -- TE is good for a year.

sefant77 · 02-26-2019, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

July 1st, 2020 -- TE is good for a year.

Yes, but the TE would be part of our cap space in july. You cant spend all your cap AND keep the TE. Spending all your cap until the 109m payroll mark and then add another 20m guy via TE; that doesnt work.

So if we dont use it in june, we are going to discard the TE.

Quote:

When we get to July, in all likelihood the Mavs will discard their TPE, to have cap room instead, and that will be the end of that.

But no worries - that doesn’t end their ability to get value from that $21.3M player-obtaining slot.

At that point, the $21.3M will become part of their much bigger $30M cap room, which will be used to sign one or more players. Perhaps it will even be increased a bit via this means or that, to get to max room and to sign an elite player to go with Luka Doncic and Kristas Porzingis.

https://247sports.com/nba/mavericks/...set-129487736/

quietsavant · 02-27-2019, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SMC0007

I can't justify it in the long term fit and there isn't much difference statistically I rekon. If he were available on the cheap it would bring in an experienced player who doesn't bog the game down and do boneheaded things the DSJ does. You also don't get the diva "let me run the team or I bitch my way out". You would be banking on him playing up to the level of his surrounding teammates level. It's more about intangible differences than statistical. He knows how to play offense and doesn't rely on athleticism alone.

I don't think anyone sees Dragic as a high priority must get.

A 2nd year Point Guard doesn't play at the same level and make as an 11 year Vet. Insightful stuff.

Find your particular choices to criticize him interesting as well.

While I've touted reuniting Dragic and Doncic.. might actually have been the first to state this in the forum; I believe Dennis will rise to a new height and for the better by moving away. And I find his athleticism, combined with his growth after his 2nd and 3rd year to be his Xfactor. I applaud him for wanting to be the man.. just so happens that there was a BETTER player in doncic that also wanted to be the man and the organization chose right. But a player wanting to be the man, is something we should all applaud.

SMC0007 · 02-27-2019, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by quietsavant

A 2nd year Point Guard doesn't play at the same level and make as an 11 year Vet. Insightful stuff.

Find your particular choices to criticize him interesting as well.

While I've touted reuniting Dragic and Doncic.. might actually have been the first to state this in the forum; I believe Dennis will rise to a new height and for the better by moving away. And I find his athleticism, combined with his growth after his 2nd and 3rd year to be his Xfactor. I applaud him for wanting to be the man.. just so happens that there was a BETTER player in doncic that also wanted to be the man and the organization chose right. But a player wanting to be the man, is something we should all applaud.

Not sure if you're being passive aggressive or just straw man...or both, as if all I did was bash DSJ with the comment. It's not like it's the first time anyone has ever criticized DSJ and in my post I recognized that statistically Dragic and DSJ aren't all that different (this season). Hell my comments were minimal compared to most.

There is a difference in applauding someone wanting to be the man and what
DSJ became because Luka was just better and way ahead of the curve. Denise is a fn baby not a man. He has a long way to go and as far as on the court, he has scrubs around him so it may take even longer for his "Xfactor" to produce more than 10 attempts at a dunk with the world watching in a dunk contest. That's probably the closest he comes to an all-star game for a long time.

EricaLubarsky · 02-27-2019, 02:30 PM

Dwight Powell is 9 of 22 from beyond the arc (40.9 percent) on 2.0 attempts in his last 11 games and 36.1 percent over his last 24. Took him a while to find his stroke this season but his shooting is going up. @bobbykaralla

Powell May get that huge contract

MFFL · 02-27-2019, 07:25 PM

I heard a name on the radio that made sense to me - Patrick Beverley.

Can defend point guards at a high level and doesn't need the ball. Shoots the 3 at a good clip. Agent is Bill Duffy (Luka connection). Best news is that Beverley shouldn't need much more that a percentage of the MLE

Underdog · 02-27-2019, 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Dwight Powell is 9 of 22 from beyond the arc (40.9 percent) on 2.0 attempts in his last 11 games and 36.1 percent over his last 24. Took him a while to find his stroke this season but his shooting is going up. @bobbykaralla

Powell May get that huge contract

As long as he opts out and signs that contract elsewhere... I want the cap space.

sefant77 · 02-27-2019, 08:54 PM

I want a KP/Vuc/Kleber/Kostas frontcourt...no space or need for Powell.

You can switch Vuc with Zion, of course...

Underdog · 02-27-2019, 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MFFL

I heard a name on the radio that made sense to me - Patrick Beverley.

Can defend point guards at a high level and doesn't need the ball. Shoots the 3 at a good clip. Agent is Bill Duffy (Luka connection). Best news is that Beverley shouldn't need much more that a percentage of the MLE

I'm all about Bev -- I absolutely hate the guy when we play him, which is exactly what we need... This team could use some bastards on the perimeter, and Bev is definitely a bastard.

sefant77 · 02-27-2019, 09:40 PM

Yeah give me now Marcus Smart in a Boston trade when they sink deeper into their chaos.

Bev/Smart/Kleber/DFS would be an incredible work horse rotation

Melonhead · 02-28-2019, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sefant77

Yeah give me now Marcus Smart in a Boston trade when they sink deeper into their chaos.

Bev/Smart/Kleber/DFS would be an incredible work horse rotation

.

SMC0007 · 03-01-2019, 09:17 AM

Fwiw.. boogie looked pretty good last night vs Vuce and Magic.

sefant77 · 03-01-2019, 09:39 AM

I still take chemistry (Vuc) over a few more % of skill...both are also the same age.

EricaLubarsky · 03-01-2019, 09:46 AM

Vuc 12pts, 13reb, 6ast, 3blks last night

Orlando now 8 seed and currently in the playoff picture.

Wonder if that changes our chances at Vuc leaving.

SMC0007 · 03-01-2019, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Vuc 12pts, 13reb, 6ast, 3blks last night

Orlando now 8 seed and currently in the playoff picture.

Wonder if that changes our chances at Vuc leaving.

Would Orl pay him max when they have Bamba? That seems to be the question to answer first. As far as him wanting to stay, It's not like Orlando is better than us next year. Right now they only have two more wins and the same losses as we do AND we don't have KP. Not to mention Doncic is better than any prospect they have by far and KP is better than anyone else they have too.

DevinHarriswillstart · 03-01-2019, 11:34 AM

A big question is whether or not KP can guard the perimeter if we sign Vuc. Most 4s are mobile or SFs pretending to be 4s (Barnes etc) so he will inevitably have to move out because Vuc is too slow to do any sort of perimeter duty on a consistent basis. That actually is a pretty big issue if you think about it because KP's best attribute is shot blocking.

sefant77 · 03-01-2019, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

A big question is whether or not KP can guard the perimeter if we sign Vuc. Most 4s are mobile or SFs pretending to be 4s (Barnes etc) so he will inevitably have to move out because Vuc is too slow to do any sort of perimeter duty on a consistent basis. That actually is a pretty big issue if you think about it because KP's best attribute is shot blocking.

Yeah BUT with some easy rotation quirks Rick is able to reduce the KP/Vuc combo to 16-20 minutes a game easily. And you can also force opponent to go bigger at PF, when they are getting destroyed in terms of rebounding/2nd chance points etc.

I still dont have much worries about it. Sub out Vuc or KP early in the 1st and 3rd for Kleber and there you go....

Quote:

Originally Posted by SMC0007

Would Orl pay him max when they have Bamba? That seems to be the question to answer first. As far as him wanting to stay, It's not like Orlando is better than us next year. Right now they only have two more wins and the same losses as we do AND we don't have KP. Not to mention Doncic is better than any prospect they have by far and KP is better than anyone else they have too.

Again, tricky situation for the GM, who pretty sure didnt expect such a season from Vuc. Paying Vuc now huge money on a long contract and he basically admits that his Bamba draft was shit. I also think it wouldnt take long and Bamba demands a trade after re-signing Vuc...

And playoff race in the east still open until #11. Even the Wizards have just two losses more

SMC0007 · 03-01-2019, 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

A big question is whether or not KP can guard the perimeter if we sign Vuc. Most 4s are mobile or SFs pretending to be 4s (Barnes etc) so he will inevitably have to move out because Vuc is too slow to do any sort of perimeter duty on a consistent basis. That actually is a pretty big issue if you think about it because KP's best attribute is shot blocking.

Here is a decent breakdown about it.

https://www.postingandtoasting.com/2...-the-perimeter

Kp is so long and mobile he should be fine on the perimeter. Most teams PF dont do a ton of damage alone from the perimeter, it's the mismatch onto a guard that causes trouble for everyone. I'm not concerned, our coaching staff should be able to come up with enough schemes to maximize our bigs. If teams want to launch 3s over 7'3 KP and vuce when the game slows down go right ahead, you better make it tho because you only got one shot.

SMC0007 · 03-01-2019, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sefant77

Yeah BUT with some easy rotation quirks Rick is able to reduce the KP/Vuc combo to 16-20 minutes a game easily. And you can also force opponent to go bigger at PF, when they are getting destroyed in terms of rebounding/2nd chance points etc.

I still dont have much worries about it. Sub out Vuc or KP early in the 1st and 3rd for Kleber and there you go....

Again, tricky situation for the GM, who pretty sure didnt expect such a season from Vuc. Paying Vuc now huge money on a long contract and he basically admits that his Bamba draft was shit. I also think it wouldnt take long and Bamba demands a trade after re-signing Vuc...

And playoff race in the east still open until #11. Even the Wizards have just two losses more

Tricky indeed for them! BUT he is UFA so it's his choice if he leaves and that may take some pressure off of them in the ordeal. Orlando isn't contending without more help than what Vuce can give so just rebuild with Bamba, gordon, fultz, isaac perhaps.

EricaLubarsky · 03-01-2019, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

A big question is whether or not KP can guard the perimeter if we sign Vuc. Most 4s are mobile or SFs pretending to be 4s (Barnes etc) so he will inevitably have to move out because Vuc is too slow to do any sort of perimeter duty on a consistent basis. That actually is a pretty big issue if you think about it because KP's best attribute is shot blocking.

KP is decent. Not great foot speed, but his length (7'3" with 7'6" wingspan) can bother people which lets him recover well. His weak-side defense is underrated (2.7 blocks per 36) as well. It means if he's bullied, he still has enough length to bother the shot and if he's blown by, he can still recover if he's only a few inches or feet behind when the player releases. Last year he was in the top 15% of forwards in defensive win share. Height/length is huge.

More than anything I think if we get Vuc, it's to play them interchangeably. KP will probably only average 25-30 min a game next year and Doncic will average probably close to 35-36 mpg next year, which means Vuc and KP will probably only play about half of their minutes together. Sometimes it will be Doncic/KP and sometimes it will be Doncic/Vuc. Occasionally we'll be able to play all three players-- particularly in the final minutes. Vuc lets us reduce KP's minutes to keep him healthy and provides yet another piece that can excel in a smart flow offense.

The thing I wouldn't mind investigating, though is to get a bulky forward capable of rebounding hard and defending) as well as staying with faster forwards (Siakam/Middleton are exemplars who are immovable, but there are some cheaper options available). That way KP and Vuc can guard the slower/bigger player and we have someone who can really mix it up with forwards.

turin · 03-01-2019, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SMC0007

Here is a decent breakdown about it.

https://www.postingandtoasting.com/2...-the-perimeter

Kp is so long and mobile he should be fine on the perimeter. Most teams PF dont do a ton of damage alone from the perimeter, it's the mismatch onto a guard that causes trouble for everyone. I'm not concerned, our coaching staff should be able to come up with enough schemes to maximize our bigs. If teams want to launch 3s over 7'3 KP and vuce when the game slows down go right ahead, you better make it tho because you only got one shot.

With long guys like that, play more zone. Need to adapt play to players strengths. Vuc, KP combo would be a unique Twin Towers lineup. With something that unique, I wouldn't be so quick to shoe horn them into the conventional. Try some things out. Add Luka's height in there, and I'm really liking the size possibilities with big lineup.

sefant77 · 03-01-2019, 02:07 PM

My pipedream lineup:
Luka 6-8
DFS 6-8
Zion 6-7 but still growing and plays much bigger anyway
KP 7-3
Vuc 7-0

that would be fun

SMC0007 · 03-01-2019, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by turin

With long guys like that, play more zone. Need to adapt play to players strengths. Vuc, KP combo would be a unique Twin Towers lineup. With something that unique, I wouldn't be so quick to shoe horn them into the conventional. Try some things out. Add Luka's height in there, and I'm really liking the size possibilities with big lineup.

Yea, we should never have rebounding issues with that lineup. With a team like this, a lethal offense helps the defense. It's always adding pressure to the other to score and if you start pulling away teams are much more likely to fold and take bad shots and gamble. Similar to when GSW makes runs, it's so hard to make up that ground. Obviously, We would be doing it a little differently.

SMC0007 · 03-01-2019, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sefant77

My pipedream lineup:
Luka 6-8
DFS 6-8
Zion 6-7 but still growing and plays much bigger anyway
KP 7-3
Vuc 7-0

that would be fun

How about a very enthusiastic yet more realistic lineup?

sefant77 · 03-01-2019, 03:21 PM

Hey, that has a 4-6% of happening...thats a good number for pipedreams!

SMC0007 · 03-01-2019, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sefant77

Hey, that has a 4-6% of happening...thats a good number for pipedreams!

I get it, and don't blame you. I'm just curious about a slightly higher % lineup.

DevinHarriswillstart · 03-01-2019, 06:24 PM

You can scratch Bledsoe off the list. 4/70 extension with the Bucks.

Underdog · 03-01-2019, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

You can scratch Bledsoe off the list. 4/70 extension with the Bucks.

So that leaves either Middleton or Brogdon ripe for the taking.

EricaLubarsky · 03-01-2019, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Underdog

So that leaves either Middleton or Brogdon ripe for the taking.

Still got 26mill until they're in the tax range. That's enough for one, but not both of those guys to get a huge deal. Are they planning on just paying tax to keep them all there, or will one leak out?

SMC0007 · 03-01-2019, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Still got 26mill until they're in the tax range. That's enough for one, but not both of those guys to get a huge deal. Are they planning on just paying tax to keep them all there, or will one leak out?

May depend on how deep they run in the playoffs

sefant77 · 03-01-2019, 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Still got 26mill until they're in the tax range. That's enough for one, but not both of those guys to get a huge deal. Are they planning on just paying tax to keep them all there, or will one leak out?

Your mistake is that you are counting George Hill with 19m next season. Just one million is guaranteed, so of course they are going to waive him and take the 1m dead cap.

The Bucks are going to take advantage that Giannis is still two years dirt cheap (25 and 27 instead of 40+) under contract. They will worry about the tax after 2021. And in 2021 the 20m of Ersan/Snell are gone.

Lets assume they bring back Middleton for 30m, Brogdon for 4/70 like Bledsoe and Lopez for around 10m (found a perfect fit in Milwaukee)

Giannis 26
Bledsoe 17
Middleton 30 (balllparking)
Brogdon 17
Lopez 10
Ersan/Snell 20
and 10 more for Wilson and other low paid players

Thats around 130, so they are able to stay around or under the tax line until 2021.

And dont forget, being a contender adds an insane amount of value, often worthy to pay some tax...