Official GDT - Cowboys vs Steelers! - Page 9 - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

Windmill360 · 12-07-2008, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

Shouldn't he be somewhat familiar with the weather, being from Wisconsin and playing some ball in Illinois?

like someone on this board posted before: you will acclimate to weather conditions as you move around. When was the last time he played in cold weather for and extended period of time?

Windmill360 · 12-08-2008, 12:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silk Smoov

I see two bitc*** approving messages...LOL
Romo is a mental midget to the highest degree. Same people that call Howard a mental midget claim Romo is not a mental midget. Go figure. Romo cant win big games, simple as that. Not a soul on this message board can prove otherwise, no stats back up him winning big games. The Cowboys are cursed with mental midgets at qb and head coach. I hate to see the boyz come to this with so much talent.

Go ahead and keep complaining. The fact is that he's better than a lot of people out there. For every "mental midget" we have running the show here in Dallas there are probably ten more on every other team. We'll keep our "mental midget" while you go scout another QB for us. Take your time.

Windmill360 · 12-08-2008, 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dirno2000

The problem with blanket statements like this is that you define what a "big game" is. This is a big game but last years Green Bay game wasn't right?

hell you could easily say the Eagles game earlier in the year was a "big game" and the redskins game for that matter. Those were all big games at the time.

This next Giants game will be a big game. Even bigger than this one IMO. I don't think they will disappoint.

BGMaverick9 · 12-08-2008, 12:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Windmill360°

like someone on this board posted before: you will acclimate to weather conditions as you move around. When was the last time he played in cold weather for and extended period of time?

Yeah, I can see that but...shouldn't it still be in the back of your mind? I guess it's obviously different for different people but still, it was what...six years ago? Can it really slip away that quickly? And if it was apparent it was an issue, why didn't he change at halftime?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Windmill360°

Go ahead and keep complaining. The fact is that he's better than a lot of people out there. For every "mental midget" we have running the show here in Dallas there are probably ten more on every other team. We'll keep our "mental midget" while you go scout another QB for us. Take your time.

I agree, I'm interested to hear in this list.

dirno2000 · 12-08-2008, 12:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Windmill360°

hell you could easily say the Eagles game earlier in the year was a "big game" and the redskins game for that matter. Those were all big games at the time.

This next Giants game will be a big game. Even bigger than this one IMO. I don't think they will disappoint.

When you want to criticize a quarterback the "big game" is always the one they don't win

dude1394 · 12-08-2008, 01:03 AM

Really crazy that this didn't effect their playoff rankings. Atlanta's loss gets them a wildcard at the moment. Weird.

Flacolaco · 12-08-2008, 01:10 AM

Exactly. I don't see what all the bitching is about. The Saints (lack of Atlanta defense) actually improved the "Boyz" standing today. There's no way they don't make the playoffs. I have been predicting an Atlanta collapse for about 10 weeks now and I finally think it's coming. Rookie QB, rookie Coach....no way. No way a rookie qb AND a rookie head coach make the playoffs.

Dallas @ Arizona
Dallas @ Giants.

That's the way it's going to shake out.

BGMaverick9 · 12-08-2008, 01:10 AM

Surprisingly, that tie for Philly isn't look as crippling as it could've been.

Flacolaco · 12-08-2008, 01:14 AM

Take it from me, a professional pessimist: The Cowboys will make the playoffs. Stop being so pessimistic. The tie for the Eagles??? really? come on. They won't even sniff the playoffs.

BGMaverick9 · 12-08-2008, 01:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dirno2000

When you want to criticize a quarterback the "big game" is always the one they don't win

This makes me remember a post I saw earlier today on another forum. Honestly, if Silk can come up with a list that isn't Brady or Peyton, you can't legitimately say it's any better than what we've got right now in Romo.

After you get past those two as "THE" guys, you've got a major pack of 10-12 QBs who would work in certain situations, but none of them are perfect. You can go down the list: Eli, Ben, Brees, Palmer, Rivers, Hasselbeck, etc and then you have a young breed of potential superstars in Cutler, Rodgers, Ryan, Flaco. With Eli and Ben...they've got the ring, but they've shown they can clearly have their struggles. So I'm not entirely sold on if you can come up with an argument to base that any of the next tier QBs are a huge upgrade over Romo.

BGMaverick9 · 12-08-2008, 01:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flacolaco

Take it from me, a professional pessimist: The Cowboys will make the playoffs. Stop being so pessimistic. The tie for the Eagles??? really? come on. They won't even sniff the playoffs.

Come on now...

Did I ever say that the Cowboys aren't making the playoffs?? It's all up to them if they want to get in.

I'm not saying that the Eagles are going to swoop in and steal it all from everyone. I was just making a statement that with teams knocking each other out and mudding things up, a tie is clearly much better than a loss.

Silk Smoov · 12-08-2008, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BGMaverick9

This makes me remember a post I saw earlier today on another forum. Honestly, if Silk can come up with a list that isn't Brady or Peyton, you can't legitimately say it's any better than what we've got right now in Romo.

After you get past those two as "THE" guys, you've got a major pack of 10-12 QBs who would work in certain situations, but none of them are perfect. You can go down the list: Eli, Ben, Brees, Palmer, Rivers, Hasselbeck, etc and then you have a young breed of potential superstars in Cutler, Rodgers, Ryan, Flaco. With Eli and Ben...they've got the ring, but they've shown they can clearly have their struggles. So I'm not entirely sold on if you can come up with an argument to base that any of the next tier QBs are a huge upgrade over Romo.

Better yet, you come up with a list of Big Games that Romo has won? You can make up excuses all you want for Romo, but the fact remains that Romo has been playing with the most talent on a team since he has been in the NFL, so please dont give me that mess about not many other QB would do better.

With this same talented team that Romo has, I would take Favre, Ben, Rivers, Brees, Payton, Brady, McNabb,(Rodgers), Delhomme and Cutler over Romo in a heartbeat....

Lets define Big Games. How about playoffs, December and January games? Lets call that timeframe, winning time!!! Lets also go back to 2001 and start there and not only look at Romo, but our other QB's at that time. Tell me which QB has success during those times? Take your time, because I will wait as well..

Fact remains, that Romo has done NOTHING to consider him a big game player. He is NOT, and the stats prove it..He nuts up MOST of the time in Big Games...PERIOD!!! As long as the Cowboys have a QB who has a tendacy to nut up with the big games, we will not win a Superbowl. As of matter of fact, how many playoff wins do Romo have? Take your time on this as well..

Silk Smoov · 12-08-2008, 09:41 AM

Here is the "Big Game" test:

Lets consider "Big Games" as winning time for the NFL. December, Jan and the playoffs. This is the time to get into the playoffs, the time that teams take it to the next level to win a SuperBowl? Right?!

Since we had a couple of posters to call me out on Romo:
1.Already gave my list of QB's who I would take over Romo with our current talent and the talent that Romo has had since a starter.(I may would add Eli,Warner and Hasselbeck to the list)
2. Romo is 4-7 as a starter in December and January
3. During December and Jan, Romo has thrown 14int to 11 Touchdowns, 2 fumbles
4. Romo sacked 25 times during this time as well
5. Should I post his playoff record? We all know he has won ZERO games there. (0-2)
6. Cowboys last winning record in Dec/Jan is about 12 yrs ago
7. During Romo time, he has played for the "Team to Beat"

Now, I welcome the objections to what I consider as Big Games...

Flacolaco · 12-08-2008, 09:51 AM

Quote:

With this same talented team that Romo has, I would take Favre, Ben, Rivers, Brees, Payton, Brady, McNabb,(Rodgers), Delhomme and Cutler over Romo in a heartbeat....

You're just doing a bit now.

Windmill360 · 12-08-2008, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silk Smoov

Better yet, you come up with a list of Big Games that Romo has won? You can make up excuses all you want for Romo, but the fact remains that Romo has been playing with the most talent on a team since he has been in the NFL, so please dont give me that mess about not many other QB would do better.

With this same talented team that Romo has, I would take Favre, Ben, Rivers, Brees, Payton, Brady, McNabb,(Rodgers) and Cutler over Romo in a heartbeat....

Lets define Big Games. How about playoffs, December and January games? Lets call that timeframe, winning time!!! Lets also go back to 2001 and start there and not only look at Romo, but our other QB's at that time. Tell me which QB has success during those times? Take your time, because I will wait as well..

Fact remains, that Romo has done NOTHING to consider him a big game player. He is NOT, and the stats prove it..He nuts up MOST of the time in Big Games...PERIOD!!! As long as the Cowboys have a QB who has a tendacy to nut up with the big games, we will not win a Superbowl. As of matter of fact, how many playoff wins do Romo have? Take your time on this as well..

How many playoff appearances has he had? Take your time. How many playoff appearances did Peyton Manning have before he won a superbowl? Take your time.

I'll make it simple for you actually:
1999: 0-1, 2000: 0-1, 2002: 0-1, 2003: 2-1, 2004: 1-1, 2005: 0-1, 2006: 4-0, 2007: 0-1.

Rodgers and Cutler? really? under your system what big games have they won? Has Cutler even been to the playoffs?

If we threw everyone under the bus at a moment we lose a game then we'd be nowhere, ever. You're not going to win the superbowl your first year unless you are (that's funny) Ben Roethlisberger or Tom Brady. And as for playing with talent... look at our game with Brad Johnson. What was he able to do with all that talent? Now look what Romo has been able to do. I say he utilizes the talent quite nicely. When your team plays for you then you've got to be doing something right.

FINtastic · 12-08-2008, 09:55 AM

You can't honestly be mentioning Cutler and Rodgers with a straight face. Have they even played in any big games in their career?

Green Bay's big game this past week was against Houston. They had to have it or they were finished. And they couldn't even beat the freakin' Texans. We lost to the Steelers. Come on now.

Silk Smoov · 12-08-2008, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flacolaco

You're just doing a bit now.

How is that doing a bit?
Delhomme is clear cut a better QB than Romo. I can prove that with the "Big Game" test. EASILY.....Look at the QB rating of Delhomme in the playoffs, he is one of the best.

Cutler, Rodgers could be a stretch, I will admit that, but I like them alot and I think they have what it takes to win the Big Games some day.

Silk Smoov · 12-08-2008, 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Windmill360°

How many playoff appearances has he had? Take your time. How many playoff appearances did Peyton Manning have before he won a superbowl? Take your time.

I'll make it simple for you actually:
1999: 0-1, 2000: 0-1, 2002: 0-1, 2003: 2-1, 2004: 1-1, 2005: 0-1, 2006: 4-0, 2007: 0-1.

Rodgers and Cutler? really? under your system what big games have they won? Has Cutler even been to the playoffs?

If we threw everyone under the bus at a moment we lose a game then we'd be nowhere, ever. You're not going to win the superbowl your first year unless you are (that's funny) Ben Roethlisberger or Tom Brady. And as for playing with talent... look at our game with Brad Johnson. What was he able to do with all that talent? Now look what Romo has been able to do. I say he utilizes the talent quite nicely. When your team plays for you then you've got to be doing something right.

Still waiting????????????? So, I guess you did not want to answer my question. Still waiting on the stats to support Romo in the Big Games!!!!!!

Dont talk about "WHAT IF's"..Talk about facts...I could care less how long it took someone, when they get it done, that is what counts..I am waiting..

Silk Smoov · 12-08-2008, 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINtastic

You can't honestly be mentioning Cutler and Rodgers with a straight face. Have they even played in any big games in their career?

Green Bay's big game this past week was against Houston. They had to have it or they were finished. And they couldn't even beat the freakin' Texans. We lost to the Steelers. Come on now.

Still waiting on you as well to show me the Romo stats to support you arguement????? Lets take Cutler and Rodgers off the list for arguement sake..Now what you have to say about my list of QB over Romo?

jthig32 · 12-08-2008, 09:59 AM

Don't feed the troll(s).

Windmill360 · 12-08-2008, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silk Smoov

Dont talk about "WHAT IF's"..Talk about facts...I could care less how long it took someone, when they get it done, that is what counts..I am waiting..

Quote:

Originally Posted by silk smoov

Cutler, Rodgers could be a stretch, I will admit that, but I like them alot and I think they have what it takes to win the Big Games some day.

.

Silk Smoov · 12-08-2008, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Windmill360°

.

I guess you could not support your arguement with facts????? Still waiting or do you want to arguement against Cutler and Rodgers only? Go figure...Defend your boy Romo with facts...

FINtastic · 12-08-2008, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silk Smoov

Still waiting????????????? So, I guess you did not want to answer my question. Still waiting on the stats to support Romo in the Big Games!!!!!!

Dont talk about "WHAT IF's"..Talk about facts...I could care less how long it took someone, when they get it done, that is what counts..I am waiting..

Let's talk facts. You have a ridiculously small sample size. Some of your "big games" are games last December when the Cowboys (thanks to Romo's great performance all season long) were playing a fairly meaningless stretch of games. They had certainly let up their guard, and didn't "have" to really win much in December because they were so far ahead of the pack in the NFC (only the Packers were close really). As far as the playoffs is concerned, you have a ridiculously small sample size. Two games. Whoop-de-doo.

Not to mention, there are a lot of guys on a football field at the same time. The Cowboys have had a lot of problems the last couple of years. A defense that never lived up to its billing, a team known for tons of bonehead penalties, an offensive line that underperformed at a key time, and wide receivers that have been known to drop passes. To say Romo is THE reason we have been losing is overlooking a heck of a lot of things that is going on.

Flacolaco · 12-08-2008, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Cutler, Rodgers could be a stretch, I will admit that, but I like them alot and I think they have what it takes to win the Big Games some day.

Quote:

Dont talk about "WHAT IF's"..Talk about facts

oh dear.

Silk Smoov · 12-08-2008, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINtastic

Let's talk facts. You have a ridiculously small sample size. Some of your "big games" are games last December when the Cowboys (thanks to Romo's great performance all season long) were playing a fairly meaningless stretch of games. They had certainly let up their guard, and didn't "have" to really win much in December because they were so far ahead of the pack in the NFC (only the Packers were close really). As far as the playoffs is concerned, you have a ridiculously small sample size. Two games. Whoop-de-doo.

Not to mention, there are a lot of guys on a football field at the same time. The Cowboys have had a lot of problems the last couple of years. A defense that never lived up to its billing, a team known for tons of bonehead penalties, an offensive line that underperformed at a key time, and wide receivers that have been known to drop passes. To say Romo is THE reason we have been losing is overlooking a heck of a lot of things that is going on.

Excuses like As*holes!!!! Stop making excuses for that guy. Give me some facts to back up your talk. If you give me some proven data, then I can change my mind on Romo. I am hoping that I am missing something, but I just cant find it...

Please dont talk sample size, because sample size is based off of winning. Romo could be 5-1 or or 4-2 in the same number of playoffs he has been in...

Silk Smoov · 12-08-2008, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flacolaco

oh dear.

Oh dear, that is the best you can do to support Romo?????? My goodness, you are clueless, and just want to attack rather than debate...Kinda figured that..

FINtastic · 12-08-2008, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silk Smoov

Excuses like As*holes!!!! Stop making excuses for that guy. Give me some facts to back up your talk. If you give me some proven data, then I can change my mind on Romo. I am hoping that I am missing something, but I just cant find it...

Please dont talk sample size, because sample size is based off of winning. Romo could be 5-1 or or 4-2 in the same number of playoffs he has been in...

Silk you aren't really providing much in the way of facts either. You are providing your interpretations of several statistics you found. There's a distinction here, and it's one that many people miss when making arguments.

Silk Smoov · 12-08-2008, 10:15 AM

I know why certain posters have not posted a reply to me now...They are looking to find the record of the other QB that I listed to try to show they have a worst record than Romo...Guess what? Keep on looking...LMAO

Now find me those Romo stats to support Romo in this debate..It is not hard. Dont worry about me, you or any other poster, we are debating...I have given my data to support my case. I dont want to hear about the cowboy defense, coach or anything else but about Romo. Thats what I did, I looked at Romo directly to see what I could find..It is a fact, he is NOT a "Big Game" QB...PERIOD...He is a choker...Do you not see it? Take the blinders off, and look at the data facts and what it supports.

Silk Smoov · 12-08-2008, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINtastic

Silk you aren't really providing much in the way of facts either. You are providing your interpretations of several statistics you found. There's a distinction here, and it's one that many people miss when making arguments.

Think about what you just said for just a second...You said my "FACTS" are not providing much in the way of "FACTS"...Keep wasting time, because I know you are trying to dig up some facts to support Romo in this debate. No need to attack my posts, just attack it with facts. How about you posting some facts to support your arguement against mine? Or just say you cant provide them, but you just like Romo alot and want to give him the benefit of doubt to do something in the future that is special?

FINtastic · 12-08-2008, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silk Smoov

I know why certain posters have not posted a reply to me now...They are looking to find the record of the other QB that I listed to try to show they have a worst record than Romo...Guess what? Keep on looking...LMAO

Now find me those Romo stats to support Romo in this debate..It is not hard. Dont worry about me, you or any other poster, we are debating...I have given my data to support my case. I dont want to hear about the cowboy defense, coach or anything else but about Romo. Thats what I did, I looked at Romo directly to see what I could find..It is a fact, he is NOT a "Big Game" QB...PERIOD...He is a choker...Do you not see it? Take the blinders off, and look at the data facts and what it supports.

If it wasn't for the "tuck rule", I could make Brady look like a QB who wasn't a big game quarterback in his first two seasons.

What kind of big game success did Peyton Manning enjoy in his first two seasons?

Like I said silk, small sample sizes can be deceiving, especially in a game like football when there are oh-so-many other players that have a job to do.

FINtastic · 12-08-2008, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silk Smoov

Think about what you just said for just a second...You said my "FACTS" are not providing much in the way of "FACTS"...Keep wasting time, because I know you are trying to dig up some facts to support Romo in this debate. No need to attack my posts, just attack it with facts. How about you posting some facts to support your arguement against mine? Or just say you cant provide them, but you just like Romo alot and want to give him the benefit of doubt to do something in the future that is special?

Silk, there are lies, there are damned lies, and there are statistics.

FINtastic · 12-08-2008, 10:23 AM

Silk, since you are so sure that your "facts" have proven that Romo is such a bad big game quarterback, would you be willing to ban yourself from this message board if Romo ever wins a Super Bowl?

You should be willing to, I mean all the facts are clearly in your favor.

Underdog · 12-08-2008, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silk Smoov

Better yet, you come up with a list of Big Games that Romo has won? You can make up excuses all you want for Romo, but the fact remains that Romo has been playing with the most talent on a team since he has been in the NFL, so please dont give me that mess about not many other QB would do better.

With this same talented team that Romo has, I would take Favre, Ben, Rivers, Brees, Payton, Brady, McNabb,(Rodgers), Delhomme and Cutler over Romo in a heartbeat....

Umm, what "big games" have Rivers, Brees, Rodgers, Delhomme or Cutler ever won?

You'd take a declining, soon-to-be-retired (again) Favre over an up-and-coming Romo? Or Donovan "I didn't know games could end in a tie" McNabb??? Or Ben "The Bus Driver" Roethlisberger????

Seriously - why isn't MICHAEL VICK in this conversation???????

Sure, I'd take Peyton Manning or Tom Brady over Tony Romo, but that's about it (and that might be a lateral move)... I doubt you could find a single paid opinion in the sports world that would back up your feelings for Romo...

Silk Smoov · 12-08-2008, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINtastic

If it wasn't for the "tuck rule", I could make Brady look like a QB who wasn't a big game quarterback in his first two seasons.

What kind of big game success did Peyton Manning enjoy in his first two seasons?

Like I said silk, small sample sizes can be deceiving, especially in a game like football when there are oh-so-many other players that have a job to do.

Think about what you just said....Seriously, please dont talk about Brady like that. Lets talk sample size again. Lets just say Romo made it to the SuperBowl both times he made the playoffs. How many game would he had played? How about if he made it to the NFC title game both years how many games would that be? Sample size is based off of winning, UNLESS you dont make it to the playoffs. Simple as that..Whats the facts? Can you just tell me the facts on Romo to show my I am wrong? Thats all I ask, it is not that hard..

Silk Smoov · 12-08-2008, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINtastic

Silk, there are lies, there are damned lies, and there are statistics.

Ok, I will accept that as the case to NOT support Romo...So, I guess I was right. Stats cant support Romo in this case, so anything else is lies and damned lies..

FINtastic · 12-08-2008, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silk Smoov

Think about what you just said....Seriously, please dont talk about Brady like that. Lets talk sample size again. Lets just say Romo made it to the SuperBowl both times he made the playoffs. How many game would he had played? How about if he made it to the NFC title game both years how many games would that be? Sample size is based off of winning, UNLESS you dont make it to the playoffs. Simple as that..Whats the facts? Can you just tell me the facts on Romo to show my I am wrong? Thats all I ask, it is not that hard..

No, silk, you're the one that needs to think about what I just said. If it wasn't for the "tuck rule", Brady would have ended his first season on a horrible turnover. Just like Romo.

In his second season, Brady missed the playoffs because he played awful in the second half of the season.

So after two seasons, what would Brady be according to silk-logic? Not a big game quarterback, that's for sure.

But in hind-sight, it would be silly to call Brady that, now wouldn't it?

This is what I'm talking about with small sample sizes.

FINtastic · 12-08-2008, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silk Smoov

Ok, I will accept that as the case to NOT support Romo...So, I guess I was right. Stats cant support Romo in this case, so anything else is lies and damned lies..

That flew right over your head, didn't it?

Silk Smoov · 12-08-2008, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINtastic

Silk, since you are so sure that your "facts" have proven that Romo is such a bad big game quarterback, would you be willing to ban yourself from this message board if Romo ever wins a Super Bowl?

You should be willing to, I mean all the facts are clearly in your favor.

Once again, your reasoning is to attack the poster, rather than debate. Remember the lies and damed lies bit? How about you ban yourself is you can't support your arguement on Romo? How about would you be willing to ban yourself if Romo does not win the SuperBowl this year? Remember, for the last two years the Cowboys are the "Team to Beat"? That means it should be in your favor.

Silk Smoov · 12-08-2008, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FINtastic

That flew right over your head, didn't it?

Just flew over your head. I reversed it around on you, but you did not get it..All you did was assume I did not know what you were saying..

FINtastic · 12-08-2008, 10:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silk Smoov

Once again, your reasoning is to attack the poster, rather than debate. Remember the lies and damed lies bit? How about you ban yourself is you can't support your arguement on Romo? How about would you be willing to ban yourself if Romo does not win the SuperBowl this year? Remember, for the last two years the Cowboys are the "Team to Beat"? That means it should be in your favor.

It would be idiotic for me to ban myself if the Cowboys didn't win the Super Bowl. What team in Vegas has better than 50% odds at this point? Why would I make a bet that I have a less than 50% chance of winning (and let's be honest the odds are probably smaller than that)? I am by no means sure that we are going to win a Super Bowl this year

You on the on the other hand seem pretty sure of yourself. I would think you would appreciate the chance to show how sure you are of yourself by backing it up.