PGT: We don't deserve to win - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

EricaLubarsky · 03-22-2015, 10:37 PM

Ellis was awful.

Is Dirk still on the team?

This was one of only three games left in our schedule against a non-playoff opponent and we blew it bad.

But, hey, Felton was pretty good.

Bookit · 03-22-2015, 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

Ellis was awful.

Is Dirk still on the team?

This was one of only three games left in our schedule against a non-playoff opponent and we blew it bad.

But, hey, Felton was pretty good.

Love the Pic!

yahyes · 03-22-2015, 10:43 PM

Tough

HopeIsAlwaysThere · 03-22-2015, 10:52 PM

After Liverpool lost yesterday night, this lost in morning (the time in my region) make my day worse.
But I will take it, as those are my beloved teams, onwards and upwards! GO MAVS!

Bryan_Wilson · 03-22-2015, 10:55 PM

What is it going to take for monta to grab some pine? He has been awful for a while now and I've said it before- it doesn't even matter if we have a hot hand, he just takes the ball and takes what seems like 80% of the shots in last 5mins of every game.

Tonight Ellis was, by my count, 1-14 on shots that were anything that was 10feet or further out. Including blowing a nice comeback by taking nearly every shot as soon as he got back in late in 4th going 0-7 total in 4th and 0-6 in last 5mins. Parsons got into a rhythm and then he touches the ball maybe twice after that thanks to Ellis. We may as well sub out Parsons and Dirk late in 4th if Ellis is going to play hero ball every freaking possession.

Idk if RC called ellis to continue to take those shots but he certainly didn't rip him like he ripped rondo for ignoring him he didn't bench him like he has parsons so he obviously has no issue with those shots which BLOWS MY MIND. We shot 39% and got back into the game by attacking the rim and then once again just stopped.

Aside from monta this team needs to spend so much time on everything that they clearly haven't been shooting free throws cuz it's been piss poor.

---Edit---
After seeing RC basically say monta has green light in last 5min cuz he can get good looks and this is not a "monta ellis shooting problem" I now agree he gets a big share of the blame now as well.

Melonhead · 03-22-2015, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bryan_Wilson

What is it going to take for monta to grab some pine? He has been awful for a while now and I've said it before- it doesn't even matter if we have a hot hand, he just takes the ball and takes what seems like 80% of the shots in last 5mins of every game.

Tonight Ellis was, by my count, 1-14 on shots that were anything that was 10feet or further out. Including blowing a nice comeback by taking nearly every shot as soon as he got back in late in 4th going 0-7 total in 4th and 0-6 in last 5mins. Parsons got into a rhythm and then he touches the ball maybe twice after that thanks to Ellis. We may as well sub out Parsons and Dirk late in 4th if Ellis is going to play hero ball every freaking possession.

Idk if RC called ellis to continue to take those shots but he certainly didn't rip him like he ripped rondo for ignoring him he didn't bench him like he has parsons so he obviously has no issue with those shots which BLOWS MY MIND. We shot 39% and got back into the game by attacking the rim and then once again just stopped.

Aside from monta this team needs to spend so much time on everything that they clearly haven't been shooting free throws cuz it's been piss poor.

---Edit---
After seeing RC basically say monta has green light in last 5min cuz he can get good looks and this is not a "monta ellis shooting problem" I now agree he gets a big share of the blame now as well.

I really dont want whats next. I feel like the Mavs are invested in Ellis and will resign him. But this is what happens everywhere Ellis goes. I thought coming to Dallas it would be different having so much around him, but as much as I like the guy, he can never be a top option on a team.

EricaLubarsky · 03-22-2015, 11:02 PM

86-80 at 6:22

Quote:

Ellis Free Throw Technical Missed 06:22
Ellis Pullup Jump shot: Missed 05:04
Ellis Jump Shot: Missed 04:15
Ellis Jump Shot: Missed 03:48
Ellis Jump Shot: Missed 02:33
Ellis Turnover : Lost Ball (2 TO) Steal:Tucker (3 ST) 01:41
Ellis Jump Shot: Missed 01:08
Ellis Layup Shot: Missed 00:25.9
Ellis Foul: Personal Take (3 PF) (2 FTA) 00:20.5
Ellis 3pt Shot: Missed 00:15.9

Ellis missing shots is on him. Ellis getting called to take 8 shots in 6 minutes despite being 0-7 and 0-1 on FTs? That is 100% on Rick

purplefrog · 03-22-2015, 11:02 PM

Something is going on with Monta. Not sure if opponents have figured out his tendencies or if he is just not focusing on finishing at the rim or, I guess, he could be injured.

Before he came to the Mavs he was known as being a bit temperamental, and I wonder if he just doesn't like playing with Rondo. At any rate, RC needs to think about how this team is going to move forward with Ellis playing so poorly. I wonder if coming off the bench with Devin and Amare might help to re-focus his game. I suspect you could try RJ as the starting SG and see if that brings anything interesting. Might be too late in the season to try something that drastic But the team needs something to shake them up a bit......Ellis might have played himself out of a big contract for next year.

Bryan_Wilson · 03-22-2015, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

86-80 at 6:22

Ellis missing shots is on him. Ellis getting called to take 8 shots in 6 minutes despite being 0-7 and 0-1 on FTs? That is 100% on Rick

Yeah, RC in post game was asked why he keeps putting the ball in monta's hand and he said "he's the one guy who can get clean shots". This just blows my mind... there is a reason he gets those shots... I'm pretty sure every NBA team will live with monta shooting pull up jumpers all game.

EricaLubarsky · 03-22-2015, 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bryan_Wilson

Yeah, RC in post game was asked why he keeps putting the ball in monta's hand and he said "he's the one guy who can get clean shots". This just blows my mind... there is a reason he gets those shots... I'm pretty sure every NBA team will live with monta shooting pull up jumpers all game.

5-0 will call me names, but I'm going to say that Rick is one of the worst offensive coaches in the entire game and that quote is evidence for it.

No coach with Dirk on it should say that Monta is the only option down the stretch. Period.

No other team is as poor executing offense as we are either. We can't even run a basic play which is why we go to Ellis in the first place. Rick has been beyond awful on that front this year.

FreshJive · 03-22-2015, 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

5-0 will call me names, but I'm going to say that Rick is one of the worst offensive coaches in the entire game and that quote is evidence for it.

No coach with Dirk on it should say that Monta is the only option down the stretch. Period.

No other team is as poor executing offense as we are either. We can't even run a basic play which is why we go to Ellis in the first place. Rick has been beyond awful on that front this year.

They were the best offense in the league before the Rondo trade.

Samurai · 03-22-2015, 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bryan_Wilson

After seeing RC basically say monta has green light in last 5min cuz he can get good looks and this is not a "monta ellis shooting problem" I now agree he gets a big share of the blame now as well.

The problem with Monta Ellis has always been that he has a higher opinion himself than his game merits. (And fans who feed his ego have only made things worse.) This has been a problem everywhere he's played. I imagine that Carlyle green lights Ellis because he knows that if he doesn't, Ellis is going to pout. The plan, I would imagine, is to get this out of his system during the regular season. And hope that he settles down and accepts a more complementary role come playoffs. A guy like Ellis CAN be very valuable. But he is in no way the kind of player that you can design an offense around.

Samurai · 03-22-2015, 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FreshJive

They were the best offense in the league before the Rondo trade.

And Monta had a below average TS% of .528. Basically the same inefficient scorer that he's been throughout his career.

CanadianMavsFan · 03-22-2015, 11:50 PM

This has turned into a very depressing season.

xrobx · 03-23-2015, 12:06 AM

This is a game that we had won and gave away so Monta could play hero ball

markus1234 · 03-23-2015, 12:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FreshJive

They were the best offense in the league before the Rondo trade.

Easy schedule and teams were not game planning yet.

Bryan_Wilson · 03-23-2015, 12:52 AM

Was curious about a few things regarding Monta in reference to the clutch stat, last 5min of close games.

His usage rate is 5th in the nba at 40.9% behind only 1WB, 2Kobe, 3Lebron, 4Wade(tied). The lowest ast% of those is lebron at 48% of team assists in last 5min and ellis is at 27%. Meaning he is not looking to pass, like at all, despite having a great cast around him. Dirk's usage is at 27.7% and parsons is at 12%(!!!!) basically being ignored entirely.

His % of the teams FGA's is 3rd in NBA at 41.7%. Behind only WB(mvp candidate) and kobe(chucker). Dirk is at 29.6% and parsons is at 11.6%(!!!!) Even rondo has more fga in last 5mins than Parsons. Parsons is basically being used to just stand in the corner and clear space for Ellis to shoot inefficient jump shots off screens.

And for the game as a whole he is shooting almost 11 attempts per game from 10 feet or further as opposed to just 6.5 attempts per game under 10 feet. He is below average in shooting % at every single area as well.

It's frustrating that RC considers Monta pull up jumpers good offense to close out games. Monta gets a screen and runs around it and pulls up for a "clean shot" nearly every time because teams frankly are willing to give him that shot all game long. Parsons, the few times we have seen it, gets a screen and goes all the way to the paint keeping his eye for a Tyson lob or kick out and it's in the 95th percentile in NBA in terms of efficiency according to that video a poster had linked. JJ goes all the way to the paint and always seems to have his eye out for Dirk. Whatever... I need sleep, my head has exploded.

beatLA · 03-23-2015, 01:10 AM

Stupid game!!! Ridiculously bad defense, particularly in the first half!!!

Melonhead · 03-23-2015, 01:50 AM

Wondering out loud, is it possible the team has gotten to where they are tuning out Carlisle? I really hope that isn't the case.

GermanStandard · 03-23-2015, 02:01 AM

Ellis 4-22

0-7 in the Fourth. Missed FT. Turnover in the last 1:30.

Thats the reason we lost. Simple as that.

Rest of the team played well enough to grind out a win.

Oberon · 03-23-2015, 05:21 AM

I haven't watched the second half. Probably a good thing, even though we almost made a big comeback as it seems.

The thing with Monta doesn't surprise me. He likes to play hero ball since he got here. It worked in many games, but it also lost us some games. Right now he and Carlisle should realize that his form is way too bad to be a reliable clutch player. Ellis has been sucking for about two or three months now. Time to finally change our 4th quarter strategy but Rick just doesn't seem to bother. I feel like this is Ricks worst coaching season since he became our head coach.

Thukydides · 03-23-2015, 05:52 AM

Obviously RC tries to avoid to call out Monta. I mean there´s no reason to defend a guy after a performance like that besides knowing that he couldn´t handle the criticism well.. said that I´m really shocked by those statements by Rick: Parsons and Dirk really should be pissed, if that´s RC´s honest opinion.

I don´t have any problems with Monta playing hero-ball, but he should at least mix it up and go to the rim on half of his tries. He doesn´t penetrate at all and when he tries he doesn´t get by the defender, which just never was the case until January. Monta had some decent games with Rondo on the floor and he certainly gets opportunities. So I don´t think the trade is the reason for his struggles.

He must be playing hurt, there´s just no other possible explanation.

Overall it´s just depressing that as Rondo´s playing really solid basketball right now, Monta has hit an (in Mavs uniform) unprecedented slump. Sad.

bilease · 03-23-2015, 05:59 AM

Getting really tired of Monta hero ball.

Kante · 03-23-2015, 06:09 AM

Mavs and Suns both wanted to lose the game. Suns gave the Mavs every chance they can, but they played too stupid. Went to Dirk twice in 4th quarter and scored twice.

Ellis was as horrible as it gets, wow!

rimrocker · 03-23-2015, 07:20 AM

We can make this pain go away by going 2-0 over the next 2 games.

I think RC needs to give Jefferson time at SG to play with Rondo. I'm getting tired of watching small ball and this team get manhandled at every position. Amare is the only real beast we have...Chandler seems burned out. Jefferson gives us some size, is a spot up shooter (maybe our best), and a better defender than Ellis but PT is limited at SF because of Parsons and Aminu.

In other words, unleash Rondo and surround him with the most compatible players on our team and see what happens. What do we have to lose at this point?
Bring Ellis off the bench and let him do his thing against 2nd stringers.

Twenty4sevenn · 03-23-2015, 08:00 AM

It really seems to me that if Ellis can't be the hero, he's not interested in a win. If that wasn't the case, he would have deferred when he realized he was throwing the game away. Instead, he just kept chucking. Making a play for his teammates was not even an option in his eyes. Only shooting.

Carlisle said he wants Monta to shoot because he can get open looks. Well, there's a reason that's the case. He'll always be open on that 20 footer because teams know he can't make it consistently. Why guard him? There's a lot of players on our roster who can't shoot and can also get open looks from there. Why not give them the green light too?

I'd be pissed if I was Chandler Parsons right now. It's downright insulting the way he is ignored in the majority of close games in favor of a selfish chucker. Even after he was the main reason for the comeback in the first place.

And lastly, why on earth would you keep Dirk in the game at all if you aren't going to run plays for him? Get a defender/rebounder in there. Carlisle should know his personnel better. He should know that if he calls a play for Monta that the chances of him passing up a look to get his teammate a better look are very slim.

Twenty4sevenn · 03-23-2015, 08:01 AM

double post

CanadianMavsFan · 03-23-2015, 08:19 AM

Bringing Monta off the bench is one of the only ways I could see this tea mixing it up and having any hope of "turning it on" with the season nearing its end. Offensively there is a logjam in the back court and frankly Monta and Rondo should not be playing together, particularly when Monta is in chuck mode.

Unfortunately I don't think Carlisle has the guts to make the move. This team is a first round exit and they have some serious questions to answer in the off season.

DevinHarriswillstart · 03-23-2015, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricaLubarsky

86-80 at 6:22

Ellis missing shots is on him. Ellis getting called to take 8 shots in 6 minutes despite being 0-7 and 0-1 on FTs? That is 100% on Rick

Rick is a great coach, but these last two losses are on him. It's so frustrating that he'll yank Parsons for one defensive lapse, but Ellis can shoot the team into oblivion.

AO41 · 03-23-2015, 08:59 AM

Ellis has struggled a lot lately.....but let's also remember that we have been riding him hard all year...it would not surprise me if he is actually TIRED and has a few minor naging pains.

Having said that ....he does need to find a way to push through these last games.

Dirk, Parsons, Rondo, ...have all had thwit struggles and missed games....Ellis was playing.

If Ellis doesn't get hot in time for playoffs ..let's not pretend like Dirk can carry this team with his age and the way he has playes....same for Parsons.

I believe that we will get it together and have a good playoff run ...and everyone of these guys will contribute.

AO41 · 03-23-2015, 09:01 AM

BTW as good as Parsons is with pump fakes...it's annoying as F when he over uses them and won't shoot ....makes me cringe

FreshJive · 03-23-2015, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by markus1234

Easy schedule and teams were not game planning yet.

Too large of a discrepancy for it to be SOS. It isn't as if bad teams don't play defense.

Teams of course were game planning from game one. They would have even had a better idea of what the Mavs were planning to do on offense before the Rondo trade. Monta and Dirk two man game. Barea/Devin with Wright off the bench. It wasn't a secret. Other teams just couldn't stop it.

markus1234 · 03-23-2015, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FreshJive

Too large of a discrepancy for it to be SOS. It isn't as if bad teams don't play defense.

Teams of course were game planning from game one. They would have even had a better idea of what the Mavs were planning to do on offense before the Rondo trade. Monta and Dirk two man game. Barea/Devin with Wright off the bench. It wasn't a secret. Other teams just couldn't stop it.

Look at Wrights game logs since Mon 11/24

http://espn.go.com/nba/player/gamelo...brandan-wright

Late November is usually the time when teams begin to have enough data to really game plan.

FreshJive · 03-23-2015, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by markus1234

Look at Wrights game logs since Mon 11/24

http://espn.go.com/nba/player/gamelo...brandan-wright

Late November is usually the time when teams begin to have enough data to really game plan.

I don't see a huge drop off. I see two bad games. The rest are incredibly efficient. I see a lot of 1.00 and .800 games. I do notice that after 12-17 I start seeing alot more sub 100 point games for the team.

markus1234 · 03-23-2015, 11:51 AM

November 18.9 4.3-5.9 .723 0.0-0.0 .000 1.3-1.8 .690 4.3 0.3 1.6 0.6 1.9 0.6 9.8

December 15.4 2.6-3.6 .720 0.0-0.0 .000 0.9-1.2 .765 3.1 0.5 1.1 0.5 1.1 0.6 6.1

Teams took away the Devin-Wright two man game since late NOV. Also he blocked less shots and grabbed less rebounds. Overall Wright (and the whole team) slowed down as the season progressed. It has nothing to do with Rondo or Jameer. Teams simply began to play better defense and our schedule got tougher...

Let's not create false myths about the strenght of our team. This team was always a 9-7 seed.

DavidDaMonkey · 03-23-2015, 12:37 PM

There was a timeout towards the end last night, but I believe it was well before the Mavs were out of it, that was troubling. At the end Rick stuck out his fist expecting everyone else to stick theirs in for a "1-2-3 Defense" moment or whatever to end the huddle. Everyone turned away except Tyson who half heartedly stuck his in there as he was turning away. It looked like a group of beat down guys, rather than a team.

tsar · 03-23-2015, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidDaMonkey

There was a timeout towards the end last night, but I believe it was well before the Mavs were out of it, that was troubling. At the end Rick stuck out his fist expecting everyone else to stick theirs in for a "1-2-3 Defense" moment or whatever to end the huddle. Everyone turned away except Tyson who half heartedly stuck his in there as he was turning away. It looked like a group of beat down guys, rather than a team.

Hard to play defense when you know on the other end Ellis is just going to jack up another shot.

**edit - that is concerning though :/

DevinHarriswillstart · 03-23-2015, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidDaMonkey

There was a timeout towards the end last night, but I believe it was well before the Mavs were out of it, that was troubling. At the end Rick stuck out his fist expecting everyone else to stick theirs in for a "1-2-3 Defense" moment or whatever to end the huddle. Everyone turned away except Tyson who half heartedly stuck his in there as he was turning away. It looked like a group of beat down guys, rather than a team.

Then that's either A. a team that has poor chemistry or B. a team that is mentally and physically exhausted. I actually think it's B. I just think the nagging injuries have taken their toll, and now it's too late to build chemistry. I'd just rest players that need it at this point because if you don't, then the team has 0 chance in the playoffs. Problem is that most of the team looks like they need rest.

tap2390 · 03-23-2015, 02:12 PM

This honestly isn't anyone's fault. This league is a league of superstars, and we don't have one. The last team to win the 'ship without a bonafide hall-of-famer playing at a high level was the Pistons... good luck trying to repeat that trick. Dirk IS NOT the player he was in 2011, and he's only going to get worse.

Let's see what we can do in the playoffs, but after that it's time to rebuild. Try to sign-and-trade Rondo and Monta for whatever scraps we can get. Ask Tyson if he's willing to be provide a veteran presence on a young team, if not, let him go too. Rebuild around Parsons at the 3.

EricaLubarsky · 03-23-2015, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tap2390

This honestly isn't anyone's fault. This league is a league of superstars, and we don't have one. The last team to win the 'ship without a bonafide hall-of-famer playing at a high level was the Pistons... good luck trying to repeat that trick. Dirk IS NOT the player he was in 2011, and he's only going to get worse.

Let's see what we can do in the playoffs, but after that it's time to rebuild. Try to sign-and-trade Rondo and Monta for whatever scraps we can get. Ask Tyson if he's willing to be provide a veteran presence on a young team, if not, let him go too. Rebuild around Parsons at the 3.

We aren't talking championship here. We are talking about winning this one game against a non-playoff team and looking forward to winning 1-2 games in the playoffs.

Monta 0-7 and 0-1 on FT
Dirk 1-1

Dirk may not be 2011 Dirk or 2005 Dirk, but he deserved more than one shot in the final 7 minutes.

As for a championship? I'll let Mora say it for me

"Championship? Championship? Don't talk about—a championship?! You kidding me? Championhip?! I just hope we can win a game! Another game!"