Faith... Do you got it?

[mcsluggo]

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

dirkadirkistan, the creation story is central to every belief in christianity. Whether or not science conflicts with it is not a minor issue. If science disproves ANYTHING in the bible, including the creation story, then it disproves the whole thing.

BTW on evolution vs creationism, which i know is going to come up eventually, i have a theory that i havent heard from many others. I think both happened. Im not sure where along the lines of the adam and eve descendants it was but in one of them it says that their daughters went forth and married "the children of men" Where did these children of men come from? Could they not be evolved? Just a thought. not sure that i truly believe it myself but just something to think about.

Five-o,

I disagree COMPLETELY. In fact, disagreeing is the only way I can maintain faith. The bible is also the work of man. It is men trying to decipher and transmit the unknowable and the unteachable, and they are just humans trying to do this through the lens of their own lives. St. Luke may have been a very wise man, and he may have been specially touched by god, but he was also still just a man trying to write down and interpret some pretty difficult stuff. THey may have had divine guidance, but they still had human limitations as well, not to mention the fact that they were teaching to a very different audience thousands of years ago. if you were teaching ANYTHING to people back then versus now (be it philosophy, science, history, whatever...) yuo would have to take slightly different tacts.

I don't think it weakens the bible to view it as a bunch of parables, and not a bunch of formulae and fact. The bible isn't asserting that Samaratins are miserly (and so this one "good samaritin" is special, it is just playing on the sterotypes that everyone at the time lived with and knew, to get a point across. the point wouldn't be any less tru or poignant if the parable used a different person as its example... for example.

In my opinion, a "literal" interpretation of the bible isn't required for christianity or faith.

[Motofoto]

For diversity of viewpoints sake, I'm going to chime in here. The question you ask is "Faith... Do you got it?". Obviouslly faith is not a quality that christians exclusively have. Alot of people here are equating athiesm with absence of faith. I think this is incorrect. An athiest would say "there is no god". I think that requires alot of faith to make this statement. Science cannot prove that god does or does not exist. Lack of faith would probably be best attributed to agnostics (which i am).

[Nemesis]

Originally Posted by Motofoto

For diversity of viewpoints sake, I'm going to chime in here. The question you ask is "Faith... Do you got it?". Obviouslly faith is not a quality that christians exclusively have. Alot of people here are equating athiesm with absence of faith. I think this is incorrect. An athiest would say "there is no god". I think that requires alot of faith to make this statement. Science cannot prove that god does or does not exist. Lack of faith would probably be best attributed to agnostics (which i am).

Would you mind elaborating a little on your belief? We all would appreciate it. I am ignorant of agnostic belief.

[Five-ofan]

Originally Posted by Nemesis

Would you mind elaborating a little on your belief? We all would appreciate it. I am ignorant of agnostic belief.

the way i understand agnostic belief is that it is the belief that there might or might not be a god but that they are waiting for proof one way or the other. I am obviously not him and like you i would love to hear his beliefs but i was just trying to give you my very limited idea of agnostics to tide you over until he returns.

[FINtastic]

Originally Posted by mcsluggo

Five-o,

I disagree COMPLETELY. In fact, disagreeing is the only way I can maintain faith. The bible is also the work of man. It is men trying to decipher and transmit the unknowable and the unteachable, and they are just humans trying to do this through the lens of their own lives. St. Luke may have been a very wise man, and he may have been specially touched by god, but he was also still just a man trying to write down and interpret some pretty difficult stuff. THey may have had divine guidance, but they still had human limitations as well, not to mention the fact that they were teaching to a very different audience thousands of years ago. if you were teaching ANYTHING to people back then versus now (be it philosophy, science, history, whatever...) yuo would have to take slightly different tacts.

I don't think it weakens the bible to view it as a bunch of parables, and not a bunch of formulae and fact. The bible isn't asserting that Samaratins are miserly (and so this one "good samaritin" is special, it is just playing on the sterotypes that everyone at the time lived with and knew, to get a point across. the point wouldn't be any less tru or poignant if the parable used a different person as its example... for example.

In my opinion, a "literal" interpretation of the bible isn't required for christianity or faith.

That's always the way I took the bible. I've been around a lot of bible literalists, but I've never taken the bible literally. A lot of the stuff could have very well happened in the bible, but I think I've seen enough evidence to believe that the bible is probably not 100% accurate historically. I'm not sure whether it was "divinely inspired" or not, but I don't think believing that the bible isn't 100% historically even proves that it wasn't divinely inspired. Jesus loved speaking in parables, how do we know that God didn't inspire the writers of the bible to write some parables instead of true historical accounts?

[Nemesis]

Regardless of what people believe I don't really have a problem with it. I love talking to people about their beliefs. It really brings up great debates and I will be able to pass it on to my children someday to give them a broader picture of the world they live in. It is not my place to tell people what to believe. I personally can't read Genesis and even come close to believing that was how earth was created. I mean it's a great Sunday school story that can really paint a picture of the power of God. But, it is so much more complex than that, IMO. It also makes a good story for how sin entered the world. Again, great for children.

[Motofoto]

Originally Posted by Five-ofan

the way i understand agnostic belief is that it is
the belief that there might or might not be a god but that they are
waiting for proof one way or the other. I am obviously not him and
like you i would love to hear his beliefs but i was just trying to
give you my very limited idea of agnostics to tide you over until he
returns.

You kind of have it. I don't believe that we are capable of knowing whether god exists or not. I read a piece on bbc not too long ago which was well written.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/magazine/6199716.stm

Im not really waiting for proof. Ive rejected organized religion and dont believe that they are divinely inspired.

[Five-ofan]

this thread coupled with a couple of other things that have recently happened in my life has lead me to the realization that i have placed the mavs on a pedestal above god and they have become my false idol. As much as it pains me to do this when the mavs are at their absolute best, Im done with the mavs for a while. I wish you all the best but i need to get my priorities in order so Im done with this site for a while too. I may pop up every now and then but i need to spend some time in the bible as opposed to looking up stats on 82games.com or making the same arguments about steve nash not deserving the mvp.

I have loved my time on this board and there are alot of great people here. If you guys ever need anything pm because like i said i will check it every so often but for now this is my farewell.

[nashtymavsfan13]

Sorry to see you go 5-0, but those things are more important. I think you can lower the Mavs to a pedestal lower than God and still post on this site, but maybe control the time you spend on it. Anyway, I hope to see you back soon, you'll be missed.

[FishForLunch]

For a society to function smoothly we need a set of rules and directives, religion provides these rules and directives. If these rules get extreme aka Islam then trouble starts. So if you feel that you need religion to function smoothly, then good luck with it. For me I can function fine without religion so I dont see a need to have faith. I do feel that children should be bought up with some religion so that they can learn right from wrong. Just my 2 cents

[Nemesis]

Anybody else confused?