The Trade Fallout --- The Aftermath

[aexchange]

By now we're already pretty familiar with who is coming and who is going in the blockbuster trade between the Warriors and the Mavs. You've got to figure that Cuban has some naked pictures of the Gary St. Jean in order to pillage GS like he did. You also have to figure that the Warriors motivation is to dump salary for the future.

Chris Mills is a certifiable goner for the most part if any team is needing to clear salary. I could even see Dallas trading him to a team and pulling a Kings type of situation just to clear his salary. With one year left on his contract, he makes the most sense to not even see the season in a Mavs uni.

Jamison is the centerpiece of this deal. While his defense is certifiably attrocious at times, I think he will be a good fit by allowing Dirk to play SF on offense and PF on defense. His salary makes you pause, but if he doesn't work out this year, I can still see him being sent to the basketball wasteland such as Utah when they come to the realization that no one wants to play there.

Danny Fortson gives you a little something different than what Najera would give. I'm not sure if he's a good fit for the Mavs system, and along with Mills I see him being traded before the season even starts.

I think the real sleeper here is Jiri Welsch. Signed for 3 more years at a very low salary, he gives us the big combo guard that we were seeking and had in mind when we signed Marquis Daniels. Combined with Daniels, the two give us very solid and young PG prospects for the future who can occasionally play some SG.

By packaging Fortson and Mills together --- it definately gives us some interesting options should we choose to persue them. Would New Jersey pull the trigger on a Walt Williams, Forston, and Chris Mills trade for Dikembe? Granted Dikembe is an old has been now, but with only two years on his contract and only really needing to be play in the post season, would Thorn be willing to deal him so he can clear salary for Kenyon Martin?

[MavsFanFinley]

Unfortunately, I think we're now stuck with Fortson. GS tried trading him every which way and couldn't do it. I know Cuban has traded other horrific contracts like Howard and Eisley, but those around the league know about Fortson's bad attitude, lack of production after signing the big contract, I just can't imagine Cuban pulls trading him off.

If anyone is traded in this group, it's Jamison, imo. What that could be or when, I don't know.

Mills fills the role of Walt Williams perfectly and I see the Mavs keeping him as an insurance of sorts.

Welsch is such a steal. I'm still figuring his situation with Howard backing Finley. And I'm not sure he and/or Daniels can handle backing Nash alone. I hate to think Welsch could get stuck on our bench like he did in Oakland. Time will tell.

[MFFL]

Mutombo is not worth trading for. The Nets had basically the same plan and Mutombo only averaged 2.3 points and 2.7 boards in the championship series (he averaged 13.7 minutes). He's not good enough to play against elite players anymore.

[Drbio]

Originally posted by: MFFL
Mutombo is not worth trading for. The Nets had basically the same plan and Mutombo only averaged 2.3 points and 2.7 boards in the championship series (he averaged 13.7 minutes). He's not good enough to play against elite players anymore.

I agree 100% But there could be a shred of possibility in AEx's idea that another trade is brewing. I just cannot speculate right now on a reasonable deal.

[Chicago JK]

Wasn't Mills the guy who almost attacked the Trailblazers team bus after a game and held them up from leaving? That was pure comedy.
I think they will keep Mills and save the money for next year. The Mavs pick up a lot of extra salary in this deal.

I doubt they could move Fortson. GS has been trying to trade him for a while. Personally I prefer Najara as a scrambler to Fortson. They have similar skills but play different games.

The Mavs hit a home run with Jamison. He took 18 shots for GS because he was their number 1 option. He did shoot 47% from the floor. Not bad. At UNC Jamison got his points without dominating the ball. I think he will do the same things in Dallas. Jamison and Dirk will be a dynamic forward combo.

Jiri may or may not be ready for back up point guard play yet, but he is an interesting prospect. He is a lot better prospect than Daniels and I would think the mavs would let him grow into the role and force feed Jiri minutes at the beginning of the season.

[XERXES]

Guys, I may be missing something, but I think Fortson is what makes this deal really incredible. The dude averaged 11+ rebounds a year ago (and was 4th in the league.) If he can be anything near that in Dallas - and bang around a little inside - then he is perfect.

[MavsFanFinley]

Fortson is going to need one hell of a turn around to get back to his rebounding glory.

I just don't see it happening with us. He didn't like playing backup to Murphy, what's he going to be like behind Dirk?

[FilthyFinMavs]

THe knock on Fortson is that he likes to pad his rebounding stats. I have no problem with that. My only concern is that he doesn't push Dirk out the way just to get a extra board.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]


I'm not sure how he is going to play this run and gun style though.

[Nash13]

The odd man out on this trade has to be Najera. Do we really need him anymore? He would be the 3rd option at both PF and SF. Also, i feel that Nelson will break the season record for most change up of the starting 5.

[FilthyFinMavs]

Originally posted by: Nash13
The odd man out on this trade has to be Najera. Do we really need him anymore? He would be the 3rd option at both PF and SF. Also, i feel that Nelson will break the season record for most change up of the starting 5.

Trust me. Nellie will have Najera at the 5 at times this season.

[Nash13]

FFM, the funny thing is is that he would be the 3 option at the center after Shawn and Raef.

[Mavs_Rule2003]

Originally posted by: MavsFanFinley
Unfortunately, I think we're now stuck with Fortson..

He used to average double figure rebound(16 RPG) few yrs back. Only this last year he falls bad, real bad. BUt hope he regains some with MAVS.

[MFFL]

Originally posted by: Mavs_Rule2003

He used to average double figure rebound(16 RPG) few yrs back. Only this last year he falls bad, real bad. BUt hope he regains some with MAVS.

The year that Fortson averaged 16 board he only played 6 games that season.

[Drbio]

Fortson's problems are mental. He comes in with a rep similar to NVE's in Denver. Hopefully he can fit in as well as NVE.

[MFFL]

Originally posted by: Drbio
Fortson's problems are mental. He comes in with a rep similar to NVE's in Denver. Hopefully he can fit in as well as NVE.

There are a lot of physical problems there too - he has only played 100 games the last three seasons combined.

[MavsFanFinley]

Fortson's problems are mental. He comes in with a rep similar to NVE's in Denver. Hopefully he can fit in as well as NVE.

I fear Fortson won't see the light like NVE did. He probably won't realize how lucky he is to be traded to our Dallas team and he won't blink twice about showing it.

[steponhens]

I have no fear of Fortson's attitude problem. The Mav's will make him feel right at home. Besides if he stays on the sideline this year at least he'll have a more comfortable seat.

[aexchange]

So I'm sitting here loving the trade, but I keep wondering to myself, with the glut of big men that Golden State has, why didn't GS include Dampier or Foyle in the trade instead of Mills?

Then Donnie says something to the effect of "We have a couple of situations moving along nicely..."

I think the chances of a trade going down Monday or Tuesday for a big man have just increased dramatically.

Mills and somebody else for Ratliff? Mills plus a pick for Camby?

[OutletPass]

AE...I think that Memphis is going after Dampier...and GS will get more there.

But I'm with you on the trade scenario...I think the chances of another move HAS become much greater.

Just pray that GS doesn't back out of this one.

Will someone please turn on ALL of the power in NYC. TODAY !!

(PS...thinking of Brother "MavsKiki" as I post this...come home soon !!)

[kg_veteran]

Where to begin on this deal? I didn't hear about this last night because I was out late, and when I awoke this morning and read the paper, I was like aex. I peed my pants. I've been tied up with "honey dos" today, but here's my belated two cents on the whole thing...

(Disclaimer: I tried to read as many of the posts about this as I could, but bear with me if I cover any of the same ground covered by others. Also, for purposes of this analysis, I'm not going to consider the very real potential that the Mavs may have other deals in store that send some of these GS acquisitions packing. I'm just going to look at the trade as if all 4 guys will be Mavericks on opening night.)

<u>Player by Player Breakdown</u>

<u>Nick Van Exel vs. Antawn Jamison</u>

We swapped a Top 10 PG for a Top 4 SF. Last year, we didn't have a true starting SF. That alone makes this trade huge.

Nick's clutch performances and attitude will be missed. Someone will have to step up and fill his shoes from a leadership standpoint. But I'm confident that they will.

We traded a luxury (a starting quality backup PG) for a necessity (a starting quality SF).

We traded a streaky, explosive PG for a pretty consistent, explosive SF. We traded 2-3 rebounds a game for 7 rebounds a game. We traded a 32 year old for a 27 year old.

In short, this is an EXCELLENT value for NVE.

Edge: Mavericks

<u>Danny Fortson vs. Evan Eschmeyer</u>

Both have bad contracts, but Fortson is quite a bit more talented. Fortson could potentially contribute 20 quality minutes a night off the bench. Eschmeyer couldn't have.

Fortson's contract has 4 more years left, but it's not the worst thing I've ever seen.

Edge: Mavericks

<u>Jiri Welsch vs. Popeye Jones</u>

Do I really need to say anything here? Jones has no future in the league, Welsch might. Welsch is a rangy, athletic PG/SG with a very nice upside. He didn't do anything last year, but he might here in Dallas. He's a very nice bonus.

Edge: Mavericks

<u>Chris Mills vs. Avery Johnson</u>

Johnson is a quality locker room presence, but really another unnecessary luxury.

Mills and Johnson are essentially valuable for the same reason: expiring salaries. Mills' salary is bigger than Johnson's, making him more valuable. Also, he plays SF and Johnson plays PG. If Mills is used as a piece in a trade, great. But if he sticks around, I think he could be a nice veteran sub at SF, at least in spot duty. He'll certainly play as much as AJ did.

Edge: Mavericks

<u>How the trade affects the Mavs:</u>

<u>Rebounding</u>

Don't look now, but Dallas just became a darn good rebounding team.

The best rebounding team in the league last year (coincidentally, the Warriors) averaged 46.7 rebounds per game. This was the best average by over 2 rebounds per game.

Here are the likely rebounding contributions from the Mavs roster next year (assuming no other changes and using a conservative estimate):

LaFrentz 5 - Bradley 6
Nowitzki 10 - Fortson 4
Jamison 7 - Najera 3
Finley 5 - Howard 3
Nash 3 - Welsch 1

Total: 47 rebounds per game

Even without any further moves, the Mavs should be MUCH improved on the glass.

<u>Starting SF</u>

This was the biggest hole in the Mavs lineup the more you looked at it, and it is filled for the foreseeable future, and filled in a big way. That's huge.

<u>Defense</u>

True, this trade didn't bring in a great post defender (although Fortson has a rep as a pretty decent one) or a great perimeter defender. What it did, though, is put everyone back in to their proper positions. Antawn Jamison playing defense at his natural position will necessarily play better defense than Nick Van Exel playing defense out of position. Also, the rebounding improvement should really help the defense. If the other team misses, hopefully they'll be much less likely to stick the ball right back in.

<u>Offense</u>

This trade definitely makes the Mavericks the most potent offensive team in the league (as if they weren't already).

When Steve, Mike, Antawn, Dirk, and Raef are on the floor, who in the world do you choose not to guard? Raef, I guess, but if that's the case, Raef should have a banner year.

Antawn brings a low post scoring element to the offense, and gives the Mavs a guy that can carry the offense at times, if necessary. Sure, he was a bit of a black hole in GS, but you have to think he can mesh in nicely in Nelson's offense.

I'm sure some are worried about shot distribution. I'm not. Jamison won't get 18 shots a game in Dallas, but I see no reason why he can't get 14-15, which should allow him to stay close to 20 ppg.

<u>Additional Moves I'd Love to See the Mavs Make:</u>

1) Sign Travis Best. The Mavs will need a veteran PG until and unless Welsch/Daniels show that they can do the job at backup PG.

2) Trade Fortson and Mills for Theo Ratliff. While this appears to be highway robbery from a talent standpoint, so does the trade the Mavs just made. It allows the Hawks to cut some salary, and it just might happen.

I'm already salivating from the GS trade, but imagine this hypothetical lineup:

Ratliff - Bradley
Nowitzki - LaFrentz
Jamison - Najera
Finley - Howard
Nash - Best - Welsch - Daniels



My two cents.

[one long blue sock]

Originally posted by: XERXES
Guys, I may be missing something, but I think Fortson is what makes this deal really incredible. The dude averaged 11+ rebounds a year ago (and was 4th in the league.) If he can be anything near that in Dallas - and bang around a little inside - then he is perfect.

I went over Fortson's stats. They are misleading because in one season he averaged 16 points and 16 rebounds. But I looked closer and he only played 6 games. So his best season in rebounding was 11.70, and rarely do players stay at their best season, unless you everyyear.

Fortson of course can not live p to his contract, but if he does turn around, then he cold be playing back p for Raef, getting about 23 minutes, and in his 11.70 season he averaged 28 points per game. So he wold probably get abot 8 to 9 rebounds backing up Raef.

So under the case that he actually goes back to his former self, the Mavs wouldn't have to sign Stepania which would leave it more open for the Mavs to sign either Best or JJ.

[Bayliss]

Guys, y'all are missing out on one important person: Jiri Welsh.

The kid is the standard of the tall point guards. He's 21-22.... and he has great vision and playmaking ability.

He will be a very good player in a year or 2.

[Mavs_Rule2003]

Jiri Welsh will be better in couple of years it seems. BUt he is not an immdiarte help. I think Mavs will probarbly play Daniels more often behind NAsh. And signing another free agent PG may not be a possibility. we have two roster open right now if i am not mistaken. One should be a BIg man whoever he is. and then we need another Swingman behind Fin/ Howard. Hoping that will be Raja.

Then Dallas preety much will have everyone who can play the ball including the bench. May be then we can say that Dallas will have the deepest bench in the league too. I am hoping that Atlanta would give up ratliff for Fortson and Mills. they would save cap room and we would get what we need.

[pokerguy]

I made this post on the "Jamison Speaks" thread, but I think it bears repeating here:

Hi guys: I've been a lurker here, but this is my first post. Love the forum, and, of course, the Mavs.
I wanted to comment about Fortson, whose career I've followed fairly closely. During that career, it has been rare for him to be both mentally and physically healthy at the same time. On those rare occasions when he is, however, he is a MONSTER. We are not talking about a throwaway, end-of-the-bench player. Nor are we talking about someone who can fill in to give the starters a break. If he is right (and that's a huge IF), there is NO WAY this guy doesn't get starter minutes (i.e., at least 28-35 mins a game). Given Nellie's propensities to use about 55 different starting lineups over the course of the 82 game season, that may or may not translate into Fortson being a "starter." And, chances are extremely high that, at least for a chunk of the season, Fortson will not be mentally, emotionally, and/or physically available. But, I just wanted you guys to know that, if and when he gets himself together, he is a MAJOR player in this team's future.

___

D.F. (when he's right) is not just a one-trick pony. He's a DOMINATING rebounder (think Charles Barkley in his prime as a rebounder), and he is also a gifted post player. He's got a soft touch from 15 feet in, and great natural post moves. Soft hands.

He has two flaws: his head and his feet. His feet b/c they tend to break. His head b/c you never know when it will leave the bldg.

My point remains this: if and when he gets his head on straight and stays physically healthy in Dallas, Nellie will have no choice but to play him major mins. LaFrentz and Bradley will be passing shadows in the box score. And no one here will complain. But I don't know if he'll get to that point or not.

[aexchange]

little whistle and cubes have managed to do the impossible.

prior to this year we had several problems with our beloved mavs.
1. no bench. incredibly thin beyond NVE.
2. old with no youth for talent infusion. where contending teams normally like to use the 12-15th spots to stash a good young player, the mavs had none.
3. terrible, almost untradeable contracts. lafrentz, eschmeyer, even NVE at one point seemed to be untradeable.

last yrs roster
nash/nve/aj
finley/bell/taw
griffin/williams
nowitzki/najera/jones
lafrentz/bradley/eschmeyer

now they've managed to get younger, bring in more manageable contracts, and increase the overall talent level.
1. with jamison, delk, best, howard, and bradley coming off the bench. we are looking at a roster that goes legitimately 10 deep. in addition, should nowitzki get hurt, we are deep enough to compensate. if nowitzki goes down, plug jamison into his role, and the mavs lose only a slight step compared to plugging walt williams in.
2. the mavs got younger. i think the thing that gets overlooked the most is the mavs managed to pick up 2 all-stars in their primes who are still several years away from 30. you can't help but think this is fantastic.
3. what were mavs fans railing away about last year? terrible, terrible contracts of esch and lafrentz. woe to us, because we wouldn't be able to trade those bloated deals. i guess we were wrong, and a sucker is born every minute. bye, bye esch. bye bye laspare. your incredible underachieving won't be missed.

this years roster
nash/best/daniels
finley/delk/abdul-wahad
walker/jamison/howard
nowitzki/najera/
fortson/bradley

obviously walker and jamison are going to see a lot of flopping between the SF and PF spots. i think the person who's minutes are going to get squeezed out of the equation is najera. i just don't see a lot of time for him on the court beyond 10 minutes. and i'm not a person who doesn't like him. jamison becomes the NVE gunner off the bench, and best/delk are gritty NVE lite type's of players. the more i think about the deals the mavs have made, the more i think little whistle is certifiably brilliant.